U19s

[1874robbo]

Is his name a secret?

Yes ?

Moffat is his surname

[Fermit the Krog]

Poorest I've seen them in a while. Hibs had the best two chances in the opening exchanges but Hearts grew into the game and finished the half well on top. We managed to get the goal then stopped playing, shocking definding for the first and not much better at the second.

 

Tapping was disappointing for Hearts, he's better than he showed today but Holt again was our best player.

 

As for Ross Caldwell of Hibs, two good finishes after the poor defending but he's no the brightest, is he?

[Ecce Romanov]

We seemed to change tactics after going 1 up. Going for long balls rather than the passing game that suited us better. Hibs probably edged it in the end

[Fermit the Krog]

Nice to see PS there though.

[Ford Prentice]

Nice to see PS there though.

 

PS was sitting a couple of seats along from me for second half. I did a classic comedy double take when I noticed him. He left after 90 minutes. Told someone he was going to Fife.

[Pistol1874]

PS was sitting a couple of seats along from me for second half. I did a classic comedy double take when I noticed him. He left after 90 minutes. Told someone he was going to Fife.

Or to speak to Fyffe? Paulo to Hibs?

[fabienleclerq]

I'll throw my thoughts in, first time ive watched the 19s.

 

I thought Hearts completely dominated the first half, passing and pressing hibs to death.It was so one sided with hibs looking to feed off lumped balls.

I though we were unlucky to be level half way in.Our rb (mullen?) got booked for a great tackle and to me looked like the most capable of stepping up a level IMO.Holt was the same as pre season buzzing all over the place,holds the ball like iniesta!! and rarely wastes a pass.

Second half we scored but after that seemed to stop playing and movin as much and sloppy defending cost us the same goes for the second in Extra time.

Rm(walker?) tricky player but tried to do too much and end product wasn't there today.Tapping played a DM role as far as i could see and tidied up very well with simple passing to keep play moving,his good positiong allowed holt to roam.As the game wore on our Lb(mchattie?)came on to a game and impressed second half.

 

Hibs:

No 9 seems a good striker, physical presence and reminds me of o'conner.The rest i wouldn't take over any of our lads.They kicked us off the park with holt getting some harsh treatment.And i seen the worst tackle ive seen in a while recieve a yellow! two footed lunge the linesman hasn't done the ref any favours but poor decision in any case.

 

Overall good performance from our boys undone by two hoofs, stick on we will have more of our lot in the first team than they will.

 

P.s the comedy celebrations from their fans

[Footballfirst]

I don't know what it is in youth cup ties, but we keep on screwing it up ourselves. Hearts deserved to go in front and seemed content at 1-0 to see out the game, but as ever paid the penalty late on. Their equaliser was a punt up the park that McHattie should have dealt with and their winner was a punt from their keeper following a corner for Hearts. Caldwell held off Holt and fired a shot past Hamilton. I don't know how Sam Nicholson managed hit the bar from two yards out shortly afterwards.

 

Technically, the best players on the park were Holt and Stanton. Caldwell is always a handful. Walker showed all the skills but tried to do it all himself, but I'd give MOTM to Fraser Mullen who never stopped trying to get forward and passed the ball well.

 

What was shameful was the Hibs fans booing Mullen every time he touched the ball which is ridiculous in a youth game. It might have had something to do with him celebrating his goal in front of the massed ranks of 10,000 500 hobos though. .

[Le Chat]

 

What was shameful was the Hibs fans booing Mullen every time he touched the ball which is ridiculous in a youth game. It might have had something to do with him celebrating his goal in front of the massed ranks of 10,000 500 hobos though. .

 

The vermin proving they're vermin once again.

 

Cocks to a man.

[Footie mad]

was a very tight game, as a neutral evens.....best for hearts 2, 10 (very good first half but fell out 2nd), No 9 good shift but needed a hand, goalie is dodgy....

hobbo 9 very good and strong (but is he a player) ability v limited.

CK tackle...should have seen Red, but hey ho....

lots of prospects but can they reach the next level, time will tell.....Gary Mackay and Stephen Fail at the end of the game, Jim Macarthur says no chance DR will return to Hibs, no way.

great stuff

[Ross21]

The boy on that twitter feed isnt much better at times.

 

 

Thought it was an excellent feed myself

[Footballfirst]

Thought it was an excellent feed myself

 

I didn't think he was paying much attention to the game. Too busy tapping away on his phone.

[Fermit the Krog]

 

What was shameful was the Hibs fans booing Mullen every time he touched the ball which is ridiculous in a youth game. It might have had something to do with him celebrating his goal in front of the massed ranks of 10,000 500 hobos though. .

 

 

Seen a few of them applauding the Hibs players potential leg braker on Holt. (how was that not a red card btw)

 

Not nice but not entirely surprising.

 

[Enzo Chiefo]

Grainger will be quite safe for a while yet then!!

 

No - although Grainger is one of the more accomplished players in our first team, he and his colleagues have made numerous mistakes this season. St Johnstone away should have seen a few weeks hiatus for a few of the first team regulars. Today, Kevin McHattie was outstanding and the misunderstanding at the goal was his only mistake. Jason Holt, Calum Topping, Christopher Kane, no relation to Paul...I trust, and Ryan Stewart were equally impressive. What struck me was how, as a team, we were composed on the ball and shifted the ball about comfortably and at a good tempo. Holt and McHattie could quite easily step into the first team, along with Scott Robinson, and we would see a marked improvement. I understand, however, that Jason Holt is currently on an under -19 contract and is unwilling to commit to a new deal on offer, because of the whole uncertainty surrounding the club and the crisis with last months wages.

[Fermit the Krog]

I heard today Holt signed a 3 year deal yesterday?

[Enzo Chiefo]

I heard today Holt signed a 3 year deal yesterday?

 

Have not heard that MJ - but I certainly hope you're right

[portobellojambo1]

It is the first time I have taken in the U19's in a long time, maybe too long a time. I thought technically we were very good, but the most obvious weakness was so similar to the first 11 it was quite frightening, a severe lack of end product. We were so far on top in the first half the game should have been over by half time, but despite all the control we had of the game we had nobody to actually stick the ball in the back of the net. Hibs on the other hand were far less technical, but had a centre forward who did little but convert the two chances that came his way, all you need from and hope for from a centre forward, they are employed to put the ball in the back of the net.

 

Difficult to really take much more from the game, because my interpretation of football has always been that the most important aspect is to win, and winning involves scoring goals rather than looking pretty.

[Alan_R]

First time taking in the youth team in quite a while. Maybe harsh to base it on one performance but while I was impressed with some of the players on the ball, I think there wasn't a player on the park (Hearts or Hibs) that was anywhere ready for first team football. Just reinforces the need for a reserve league.

 

Thought Hearts were hard done by. Hearts were the better team. Also thought other than taking his two goals the hibs number 9 was truely horrific.

 

Lastly Mullen is decent but someone needs a word to lay off the fake tan, I assume he is not naturally bright orange.

[Disser Pointon]

It is the first time I have taken in the U19's in a long time, maybe too long a time. I thought technically we were very good, but the most obvious weakness was so similar to the first 11 it was quite frightening, a severe lack of end product. We were so far on top in the first half the game should have been over by half time, but despite all the control we had of the game we had nobody to actually stick the ball in the back of the net. Hibs on the other hand were far less technical, but had a centre forward who did little but convert the two chances that came his way, all you need from and hope for from a centre forward, they are employed to put the ball in the back of the net.

 

Difficult to really take much more from the game, because my interpretation of football has always been that the most important aspect is to win, and winning involves scoring goals rather than looking pretty.

 

Hit the nail on the head for me.

[jamboinglasgow]

It is the first time I have taken in the U19's in a long time, maybe too long a time. I thought technically we were very good, but the most obvious weakness was so similar to the first 11 it was quite frightening, a severe lack of end product. We were so far on top in the first half the game should have been over by half time, but despite all the control we had of the game we had nobody to actually stick the ball in the back of the net. Hibs on the other hand were far less technical, but had a centre forward who did little but convert the two chances that came his way, all you need from and hope for from a centre forward, they are employed to put the ball in the back of the net.

 

Difficult to really take much more from the game, because my interpretation of football has always been that the most important aspect is to win, and winning involves scoring goals rather than looking pretty.

 

No offense but with that attitude I am glad you dont watch more youth football. I do understand your view we are missing the striker who can finish the chances we create, we had that last year in Ogleby and before that we had Smith, we are lacking that striker this year with D. Smith, Carrick and Stewart all filling in. But while you want to win in youth football, the biggest aim is to develop these players. Hibs will bring through one or two of that team but as someone says we will bring through more. If you want to bring players through into the first team which plays a similar way and formation, the way our under 19s play is ideal.

 

As an aside, to claim we are not scoring enough goals is nonsense, so far this season (at least before this match) we have a goal/game average of 2.25 and have had only 1 game where we haven't scored (against Celtic.)

[portobellojambo1]

No offense but with that attitude I am glad you dont watch more youth football. I do understand your view we are missing the striker who can finish the chances we create, we had that last year in Ogleby and before that we had Smith, we are lacking that striker this year with D. Smith, Carrick and Stewart all filling in. But while you want to win in youth football, the biggest aim is to develop these players. Hibs will bring through one or two of that team but as someone says we will bring through more. If you want to bring players through into the first team which plays a similar way and formation, the way our under 19s play is ideal.

 

As an aside, to claim we are not scoring enough goals is nonsense, so far this season (at least before this match) we have a goal/game average of 2.25 and have had only 1 game where we haven't scored (against Celtic.)

 

I'm sorry, but I state an opinion having watched today's game, which you agree with and you then say I am stating nonsense. I based my opinion on today's game alone, as I don't get along to watch the youths, i was able to get along today as there was no first team fixture.

 

And you'll have to forgive me, but in terms of football the most successful teams are those who win regularly, surely by logic the idea is to develop players to become winners, no, or do you just want to see us just develop players for the sake of it. It is one of the areas of youth development that I struggle with, this idea that it is more important that people participate rather than more important that people participate with the intention of becoming winners. It might help explain why we, Scotland, struggle in football terms if participating is more important than winning.

 

I gave an account of what I witnessed today, a team that had no striker in it, playing against a team that did, and we lost. If all our U19 players progress to the first team, and we continue to play without striker, chances are we will be no further forward, it ain't rocket science to me, but if what I witnessed today contravenes some ideal you have we'll just have to agree to differ. They were technically very good, but having all the technical ability in the world counts for nothing if there is no end product, and today our only goal came from our right full back.

 

Football isn't won based on statistics, something that has been trotted out in relation to the first team in respect of the last two home games. I've read on here that we looked prettier than, got more corners than, had more shots on target than both Rangers and Kilmarnock, but come the final whistle in the games the real statistic showed points won nil, points lost six.

 

Pretty = pretty, winning = success.

[fabienleclerq]

No offense but with that attitude I am glad you dont watch more youth football. I do understand your view we are missing the striker who can finish the chances we create, we had that last year in Ogleby and before that we had Smith, we are lacking that striker this year with D. Smith, Carrick and Stewart all filling in. But while you want to win in youth football, the biggest aim is to develop these players. Hibs will bring through one or two of that team but as someone says we will bring through more. If you want to bring players through into the first team which plays a similar way and formation, the way our under 19s play is ideal.

 

As an aside, to claim we are not scoring enough goals is nonsense, so far this season (at least before this match) we have a goal/game average of 2.25 and have had only 1 game where we haven't scored (against Celtic.)

Bingo.

[captain]

Given the stuff I heard about some of these young guys I went along expecting big things. I won't make that mistake again!

 

Started poorly, got back on top, scored a goal then stopped. Lost a goal from a horrendous mistake then a huge punt from the goalie. Then spent the last few minutes passing the ball about like Paulo was still there despite him having left as bored as the rest of us.

 

Holt was good, Walker was good, McHattie was good but no striker whatsoever and defensively not the best.

 

Darren Murray keeps telling me that we have better youngsters at all levels than Hibs yet when it comes to cup ties I can't remember the last time we beat them?

 

Such is the modern game, we'll see these laddies on twitter sooner than we will anywhere near the first team.

[bighusref]

1 each.holler from the left back.

 

I'd like to see it again, but I don't think it was the left back's fault.

 

We have a far better side than Hibs, the technical difference is huge. Tapping, Holt, Smith & Walker were the best footballers on the pitch. Mullen was also excellent.

 

Anybody like to explain to me why the Hibs No 7 wasn't sent off for an utterly shameful tackle?

 

btw, on the negative, our 'keeper is shite (second viewing) and the two centre backs are ball players but not defenders (again, second viewing) I will be astonished if these three make it as professional football players in those positions*.

 

*Kane played really well against St Mirren when moved into midfield, the other centre back may benefit from the same.

[Notorious BIG]

I'm sorry, but I state an opinion having watched today's game, which you agree with and you then say I am stating nonsense. I based my opinion on today's game alone, as I don't get along to watch the youths, i was able to get along today as there was no first team fixture.

 

And you'll have to forgive me, but in terms of football the most successful teams are those who win regularly, surely by logic the idea is to develop players to become winners, no, or do you just want to see us just develop players for the sake of it. It is one of the areas of youth development that I struggle with, this idea that it is more important that people participate rather than more important that people participate with the intention of becoming winners. It might help explain why we, Scotland, struggle in football terms if participating is more important than winning.

 

I gave an account of what I witnessed today, a team that had no striker in it, playing against a team that did, and we lost. If all our U19 players progress to the first team, and we continue to play without striker, chances are we will be no further forward, it ain't rocket science to me, but if what I witnessed today contravenes some ideal you have we'll just have to agree to differ. They were technically very good, but having all the technical ability in the world counts for nothing if there is no end product, and today our only goal came from our right full back.

 

Football isn't won based on statistics, something that has been trotted out in relation to the first team in respect of the last two home games. I've read on here that we looked prettier than, got more corners than, had more shots on target than both Rangers and Kilmarnock, but come the final whistle in the games the real statistic showed points won nil, points lost six.

 

Pretty = pretty, winning = success.

 

Spot on! playing pretty football and not winning will get you no where, whether it be first team or under 12's, that was my second under 19 game and imo the players from hearts side looked very good, mackay looks good in the air and compossed on the ball, both full backs looks strong in the tackle and good getting forward, two great CM in tapping (breaking up the play) and holt, who is very tidy on the ball, but i do think with not playing with a recognised striker is not good for the teams development, losing todays game may be good for them, a kick up the arse if u will, but winning is the basics of football

[Fermit the Krog]

I'd like to see it again, but I don't think it was the left back's fault.

 

We have a far better side than Hibs, the technical difference is huge. Tapping, Holt, Smith & Walker were the best footballers on the pitch. Mullen was also excellent.

 

Anybody like to explain to me why the Hibs No 7 wasn't sent off for an utterly shameful tackle?

 

btw, on the negative, our 'keeper is shite (second viewing) and the two centre backs are ball players but not defenders (again, second viewing) I will be astonished if these three make it as professional football players in those positions*.

 

*Kane played really well against St Mirren when moved into midfield, the other centre back may benefit from the same.

 

Hard to argue with any of that.

[jamboinglasgow]

I'd like to see it again, but I don't think it was the left back's fault.

 

We have a far better side than Hibs, the technical difference is huge. Tapping, Holt, Smith & Walker were the best footballers on the pitch. Mullen was also excellent.

 

Anybody like to explain to me why the Hibs No 7 wasn't sent off for an utterly shameful tackle?

 

btw, on the negative, our 'keeper is shite (second viewing) and the two centre backs are ball players but not defenders (again, second viewing) I will be astonished if these three make it as professional football players in those positions*.

 

*Kane played really well against St Mirren when moved into midfield, the other centre back may benefit from the same.

 

To be fair to Kane, he is actually a holding midfielder not a centre back. Jack Hamilton has actually been a decent goalkeeper this season, but last year in the cup against Hibs he had a horror show (where he handled outside the box, had Fairley not been sent off for the same offence earlier in the match Jack would have been off.) I thought he was nervous today and hopefully with another year and a half in the 19s he can hopefully sort that problem out.

[Footballfirst]

Football isn't won based on statistics, something that has been trotted out in relation to the first team in respect of the last two home games. I've read on here that we looked prettier than, got more corners than, had more shots on target than both Rangers and Kilmarnock, but come the final whistle in the games the real statistic showed points won nil, points lost six.

 

Pretty = pretty, winning = success.

I understand where you are coming from but you have just undermined your own argument, by confirming that our first team aren't winners either. Do we persevere with what we've got, players with a "winning mentality", but limited technical ability who don't win as often as you would expect given the wage bill, or do we try to introduce two or three of the youngsters with the technical skills and develop their winning mentality. I'd suggest that it will be easier to develop a winning mentality than it is to improve the technique of a player with limited ability.

[Fermit the Krog]

To be fair to Kane, he is actually a holding midfielder not a centre back. Jack Hamilton has actually been a decent goalkeeper this season, but last year in the cup against Hibs he had a horror show (where he handled outside the box, had Fairley not been sent off for the same offence earlier in the match Jack would have been off.) I thought he was nervous today and hopefully with another year and a half in the 19s he can hopefully sort that problem out.

 

Hopefully but i have my doubts.

 

There are very basic elements of goalkeeping missing from his game.

[Stanley_]

First time taking in the youth team in quite a while. Maybe harsh to base it on one performance but while I was impressed with some of the players on the ball, I think there wasn't a player on the park (Hearts or Hibs) that was anywhere ready for first team football. Just reinforces the need for a reserve league.

 

Thought Hearts were hard done by. Hearts were the better team. Also thought other than taking his two goals the hibs number 9 was truely horrific.

 

Lastly Mullen is decent but someone needs a word to lay off the fake tan, I assume he is not naturally bright orange.

 

You could say that about some of the first team players in some of our performances this season.

[bighusref]

To be fair to Kane, he is actually a holding midfielder not a centre back. Jack Hamilton has actually been a decent goalkeeper this season, but last year in the cup against Hibs he had a horror show (where he handled outside the box, had Fairley not been sent off for the same offence earlier in the match Jack would have been off.) I thought he was nervous today and hopefully with another year and a half in the 19s he can hopefully sort that problem out.

 

Kane - I believe you. He looked good there in the second half against St Mirren, neither he nor McKay look like centre backs.

 

Hamilton - I'd give you that he is a decent shot stopper, but being a goalkeeper is more than that. He's shite.

 

 

[jamboinglasgow]

Kane - I believe you. He looked good there in the second half against St Mirren, neither he nor McKay look like centre backs.

 

Hamilton - I'd give you that he is a decent shot stopper, but being a goalkeeper is more than that. He's shite.

 

Fair enough, there are weaknesses in his game. But I am still giving Jack hope that with his time left with the U19s he can try and sort out these problems.

 

Brad McKay is a funny one, and the start of the season he looked on top form, he was very effective with cutting out opposition runs and using the ball well when he won it, but his form has dipped over the last month or so. I do wonder if part of that comes with not having a settled center back partner.

[portobellojambo1]

I understand where you are coming from but you have just undermined your own argument, by confirming that our first team aren't winners either. Do we persevere with what we've got, players with a "winning mentality", but limited technical ability who don't win as often as you would expect given the wage bill, or do we try to introduce two or three of the youngsters with the technical skills and develop their winning mentality. I'd suggest that it will be easier to develop a winning mentality than it is to improve the technique of a player with limited ability.

 

In terms of what I watched today FF I was impressed by some of our play, I think there are some good kids there. The point I was trying to get across was that even if the basic play is good rather than ordinary it can all be wasted if there is no end product, goals. As at least one other has said the Hibs number 9 never offered much in the game (he was actually very ordinary for 99% of the game), apart from two goals (both very well taken goals, as was ours, even if he got a bit of assistance from our defenders on both occasions) and I think if we had had someone up front like him we would have won that game very comfortably. No matter how the teams play in any games the winners are always the team who scores most goals.

 

My thoughts are that if you have all the technical ability in the world in all or most positions other than in front of goal that technical ability can end up being wasted. My comments about how the players are being developed was more in line with something JiG said, he said it is all about developing players, I was trying to indicate I feel winning should be a fundamental ingredient of that development, I rightly or wrongly took his comments to suggest that he felt participating was more important than winning.

 

Maybe what we need the youth coaches to do is go out and find a young(ish) goalscorer, surround him with the talent some of these younger players have and our future would then probably be much rosier. Maybe my worry from watching today is that the youth team are being set out in a manner to mirror what the first team is producing, and at the younger level what we are missing is the same as at senior level, end product. Scoring goals has to be part of the development as well I think, otherwise the development period will be wasted. I don't think it is just the players that have to be developed it is a playing style or styles which can form our basis going forward that has to be developed.

 

I accept my opinion is based on limited data, because that is the first I have seen the U19 side this season, therefore I could only comment on what I witnessed today, and comment on why I thought we lost today (I do agree with a recent comment by bighusref as well, we could also do with a replacement keeper at that level, I wasn't overly impressed with his display today. I don't know if he was suffering from nerves or something today, or of it was reflective of his performances to date this season).

 

One of the main topics of discussion we had both during and after the match was whether or not any of today's team would make it at first team level and the general conclusion was don't know. Although the SPL is nothing special I do think even it is a huge step up from that level, and many of the players playing today may end up following another career eventually.

 

I think the re-establishment of a reserve league is something very important and necessary, as a further step up.

[Fermit the Krog]

I'd suggest that by being 7 points clear at the top of the u19 league, winning isn't something that is alien to this talented bunch of boys.

 

We never performed as well as we can today, in fact nowhere near it, and I find it quite disheartening that people who haven't seen much of the boys are taking today as our 'standard'.

 

We're better than that. Football wise and result wise.

 

That's life though, people become experts on the game after 90 mins.

[Gambo]

I thought a lot of our play was excellent today with Holt, Walker and Mullen as stand outs, streets ahead of anything else on the park. McHattie, first goal aside, No9 and Smith also played well. Tapping was composed without shining in holding role.

 

We lost it through two defensive ****** ups. Cant remeber a Hibs player taking the ball past a Hearts man.

 

How our sub never scored from 2yrds i will never know, i hope this was an off day for the goalie as he was really poor.

 

Good to see some close control football from those in maroon today..........................first i have seen that from u19 teams in a while. They were comfortable (like foreign teams) to take a quick pass whilst tightly marked, Holt can work himself out of any situation with the ball.

 

We did play a striker (no9) but lacked support to him at times.

 

Mullens goal celebration (and the teams ) was brilliant.

 

There no9, couldnt really miss the two chances we handed on a plate to him, was the worst player on the park today.

 

Ref bottled sending their boy off for a shocking tackle on Holt.

 

Came away with an upbeat feeling about our future players after that showing today.

 

On todays showing Holt desreves a place in first team squad.

 

ps They were surely having a laugh asking the large Hearts support to donate to the hibs youth development.

[Fermit the Krog]

 

ps They were surely having a laugh asking the large Hearts support to donate to the hibs youth development.

 

 

They were politely told to **** off from myself and my party.

[fabienleclerq]

PJ1,

 

I get your point r.e winning but this team is top of their league,they do win!

They got beat today and in a game that should've been sewn up at half time, they seem a good team just without that cutting edge today.

 

How old is Gordon smith?Could he have played today?

[jamboinglasgow]

PJ1,

 

I get your point r.e winning but this team is top of their league,they do win!

They got beat today and in a game that should've been sewn up at half time, they seem a good team just without that cutting edge today.

 

How old is Gordon smith?Could he have played today?

 

Thats my view, to suggest this team doesn't have a winning attitude is wrong, if you look at some of the games they have won, it came after going a goal or two down and fighting back to win the game, fighting the full 90 mins (a key reason why the old firm win so much is that they dont accept losing, they fight the whole time available to get that winning goal.)

 

Our formation and style is also key to winning, it utilises our strengths, it is highly technical, quick passing looking to overpower the opposition midfield and allow us to have a possession to allow us to hit the opposition with a quick change of tempo, for the wingers to get the ball and use it to get the ball into the box. While we need to get a striker into the right position it also requires a midfielder to get into the box as well. We need a striker to play two roles really, one is the supporting role by holding the ball up and moving it round to the wingers or midfielders to get into a better position, second is getting into position and finishing chances. We have David Smith, Ryan Stewart, Billy King and Callum Patterson who have played this role so far this season. Stewart has really impressed me in the last two games with his ability to hold up the ball. While Billy King and Callum Patterson have each scored 6 goals this season, so there are goal scorers there. Point being our style creates chances, and we have actually a good rate of goals per game, before this match it is 2.25 goals a game and we have had only 1 game where goals have not been scored all season.

 

We were just lacking today, that is simply it, on another day we could of taken the chances and been 2 up at half time. Its a pain, I think he have to do better in the cup competition but I still think there are positives to take from this match, a match where we looked the better side and had the better players in most areas, Hibs have some good players and I think for the future of Scottish football that is a good thing. Just dont base your view of the under 19s on one match.

 

Gordon Smith is too old, he has been for the last year and a half, still think that season he was taken away from the under 19s for too much of the season when he was just sitting on the bench not playing.

[jambosdad]

Today we looked just like the first team under PS and CL

the gap between midfield and solo striker was huge.

We did not look at all threatening at set pieces.

For a big guy Callum Paterson did not win any ball at all in the air.

Hibs outmuscled us latter part of game and looked fitter. Their subs had more impact.

Hibs also tactically were superior. Jamie Walker was well marshalled

for large parts of game but should have scored late on.

McHattie was poor early on and their no 11 basically outplayed him.

he came onto a game after no 11 went off.

Jason Holt does look a player but I have yet to see him shoot even when he makes good space.

Ref did bottle it with their No7. Dave Smith was best player and with a proper striker

supporting his runs we would have won at a canter

Why did Nicholson miss late on, the ball bobbled up.

[fabienleclerq]

Thats my view, to suggest this team doesn't have a winning attitude is wrong, if you look at some of the games they have won, it came after going a goal or two down and fighting back to win the game, fighting the full 90 mins (a key reason why the old firm win so much is that they dont accept losing, they fight the whole time available to get that winning goal.)

 

Our formation and style is also key to winning, it utilises our strengths, it is highly technical, quick passing looking to overpower the opposition midfield and allow us to have a possession to allow us to hit the opposition with a quick change of tempo, for the wingers to get the ball and use it to get the ball into the box. While we need to get a striker into the right position it also requires a midfielder to get into the box as well. We need a striker to play two roles really, one is the supporting role by holding the ball up and moving it round to the wingers or midfielders to get into a better position, second is getting into position and finishing chances. We have David Smith, Ryan Stewart, Billy King and Callum Patterson who have played this role so far this season. Stewart has really impressed me in the last two games with his ability to hold up the ball. While Billy King and Callum Patterson have each scored 6 goals this season, so there are goal scorers there. Point being our style creates chances, and we have actually a good rate of goals per game, before this match it is 2.25 goals a game and we have had only 1 game where goals have not been scored all season.

 

We were just lacking today, that is simply it, on another day we could of taken the chances and been 2 up at half time. Its a pain, I think he have to do better in the cup competition but I still think there are positives to take from this match, a match where we looked the better side and had the better players in most areas, Hibs have some good players and I think for the future of Scottish football that is a good thing. Just dont base your view of the under 19s on one match.

 

Gordon Smith is too old, he has been for the last year and a half, still think that season he was taken away from the under 19s for too much of the season when he was just sitting on the bench not playing.

I agree with you about the Hearts team regarding the way they play,id much rather they played this way than the way Hibs played today.Any chance of nicking their no9?!! We could do with a big CH as well.

 

I wont base my view on one game and will probably try get to a few more of their games i enjoyed that today,and i left feeling pretty pleased tbh. We are producing technically good footballers and hopefully they will help drag scottish football into the modern game.

[Francis Albert]

Given the stuff I heard about some of these young guys I went along expecting big things. I won't make that mistake again!

 

Started poorly, got back on top, scored a goal then stopped. Lost a goal from a horrendous mistake then a huge punt from the goalie. Then spent the last few minutes passing the ball about like Paulo was still there despite him having left as bored as the rest of us.

 

Holt was good, Walker was good, McHattie was good but no striker whatsoever and defensively not the best.

 

Darren Murray keeps telling me that we have better youngsters at all levels than Hibs yet when it comes to cup ties I can't remember the last time we beat them?

 

Such is the modern game, we'll see these laddies on twitter sooner than we will anywhere near the first team.

 

 

This is based on seeing the U-19s how often?

[Fermit the Krog]

This is based on seeing the U-19s how often?

 

 

[portobellojambo1]

PJ1,

 

I get your point r.e winning but this team is top of their league,they do win!

They got beat today and in a game that should've been sewn up at half time, they seem a good team just without that cutting edge today.

How old is Gordon smith?Could he have played today?

 

And as I clearly stated, my whole opinion was based on today's game and how I thought we played today and why I thought we lost it. I then commented that I felt it was similar to many end results for the first eleven, where end product has cost us dearly. I made no mention of any other fixtures they have played as I haven't seen them playing therefore am in no position to comment on how they have played in those other games.

 

My general comments about winning were, as I have said, in response to something JiG had posted, which I interpreted as him stating he felt developing was more important than winning. Never at any point have I criticised the performance today, all i have stated is that in my opinion we lost out today through no end product. And as far as I can tell everyone that appears to be disagreeing with me also seems to agree with me at the same time. I initially said I felt we lost the game through a lack of end product, and some have then read more into it than that.

 

I tried to respond to what I thought JiG was trying to say, and everything has gone off from there, and it appears people now think what I said was the team were poor today, which they weren't. With a decent striker or strikers we would have won the game easily.

[fabienleclerq]

And as I clearly stated, my whole opinion was based on today's game and how I thought we played today and why I thought we lost it. I then commented that I felt it was similar to many end results for the first eleven, where end product has cost us dearly. I made no mention of any other fixtures they have played as I haven't seen them playing therefore am in no position to comment on how they have played in those other games.

 

My general comments about winning were, as I have said, in response to something JiG had posted, which I interpreted as him stating he felt developing was more important than winning. Never at any point have I criticised the performance today, all i have stated is that in my opinion we lost out today through no end product. And as far as I can tell everyone that appears to be disagreeing with me also seems to agree with me at the same time. I initially said I felt we lost the game through a lack of end product, and some have then read more into it than that.

 

I tried to respond to what I thought JiG was trying to say, and everything has gone off from there, and it appears people now think what I said was the team were poor today, which they weren't. With a decent striker or strikers we would have won the game easily.

I wasn't implying that you said the team was poor bud.

 

You wrote something along the lines of,we should be putting winning before development.I was pointing out we are doing both as this 19s team are flying in the leaue.Ive only seen them once myself so cant judge the rest of the performances either but was impressed with them today and like you say given a good striker we would have been comfortable.

[Hugh Watt]

I can't believe the negativity on this thread. If we'd won the game (as we 100% should have) there would have been a huge list of people singing the praises of how well we'd done and what a great squad we have. But instead, a handful of mistakes (other than the goals hibs missed an open goal and hit the bar in the first half against the run of play and then missed a horrendous triple sitter at 0-1) seems to have turned this into a witch hunt.

 

The football on display from Hearts was at times a joy to watch, our confidence on the ball was very impressive - the willingness to take people on was fantastic, not just the forwards but you had Mullen, Kane, Mackay and McHattie all comfortable taking an extra step inside or outside to beat their opponent before sending the ball on. OK it doesn't win you medals, but when you see some of the 'Tekkers' on show in such a big game it makes you realise that they have got something in their locker eg the nutmeg on their hopeless no.9 by Mullen and the sublime 'zidane turn' by McHattie to me made the difference of watching the U19s to the mundane routines that we get each week with the first team.

 

Walker was ready to take anyone on at any time (and was generally successful), while on the other side Paterson's pace was incredible - not short of skill either, and as mentioned Jason holt ran the midfield. The glaring problem was that (like the first team) we had no-one to stick the ball in the net because quite simply we were streets ahead of them. Can't believe also that someone said Kane and Mackay had a poor game????

 

Aside from their two goals (hoofball to the extreme + one horrendous mistake by McHattie), Hearts showed today that there is a huge amount of talent in the U19s and in my view 80% of them could walk into the first team as we stand at the moment.

 

As FF says, the youth cup does seem to be the achilles heel these days, as certainly our league results more than prove that we have got a decent U19 crop that are more than capable of getting results against any of the other big guns in the league at the moment and I for one will continue to follow them whenever I can without shooting them down on the back of one fluke result by the wee team.

 

If you've not done it already, get along and watch them and take the blinkers off before you go and I guarantee you will not fail to be impressed.

[Footballfirst]

PJ1 - Good post at 22:24

 

Re the winning mentality, the two recent late wins against Hibs and Rangers in the league suggests that the U19s are not short on desire or that "winning mentality". I can't recall us having lost to Hibs in the U19 league in the last 4 seasons either, which makes the cup situation all the more frustrating. Along with the recent youth cup losses, I think Hibs have won the last 7 EoS shields.

 

What I would like to add is that the U19 are likely to finish in the top two again for the third time in the last four seasons. That is to the credit of Darren Murrray and the players themselves. However, out of those groups we have only had Temps and Craig Thomson who have effectively "made it" with Hearts. We have had a few bit players in Robinson, Smith, McGowan and Novikovas. We have also had a few that appear capable of playing at a lower level in the SFL, which just tells me that we are failing in our coaching and development post U19s.

 

I watched Hamilton U19s beat Motherwell U19s in the cup on Friday. That was Hamilton's first game together this season as U19s. The core of their side have been playing SFL Reserve football, thus have been paying against adults which looked like it had been to their advantage. I recognised a few that had played with Hamilton's U19s in the last couple of seasons and while they are decent players, they are not as good technically as our current U19s. I also listened to Mark Wotte talking last week about the lack of tecnical ability of Scotland's youth players and lamenting the fact that the best U19 in the country wasn't playing first team football (Jason Holt).

 

There are many posters on here that have said the Csaba or JJ knew best, but I just wonder. To those that say that no-one has gone elsewhere and proved a success, I would just suggest that a year or two of just training or sitting on the bench is more likely to kill off the ambition of young players more than anything else, so much so that they become disillusioned with the game.

[harvey05]

I can't believe the negativity on this thread. If we'd won the game (as we 100% should have) there would have been a huge list of people singing the praises of how well we'd done and what a great squad we have. But instead, a handful of mistakes (other than the goals hibs missed an open goal and hit the bar in the first half against the run of play and then missed a horrendous triple sitter at 0-1) seems to have turned this into a witch hunt.

 

The football on display from Hearts was at times a joy to watch, our confidence on the ball was very impressive - the willingness to take people on was fantastic, not just the forwards but you had Mullen, Kane, Mackay and McHattie all comfortable taking an extra step inside or outside to beat their opponent before sending the ball on. OK it doesn't win you medals, but when you see some of the 'Tekkers' on show in such a big game it makes you realise that they have got something in their locker eg the nutmeg on their hopeless no.9 by Mullen and the sublime 'zidane turn' by McHattie to me made the difference of watching the U19s to the mundane routines that we get each week with the first team.

 

Walker was ready to take anyone on at any time (and was generally successful), while on the other side Paterson's pace was incredible - not short of skill either, and as mentioned Jason holt ran the midfield. The glaring problem was that (like the first team) we had no-one to stick the ball in the net because quite simply we were streets ahead of them. Can't believe also that someone said Kane and Mackay had a poor game????

 

Aside from their two goals (hoofball to the extreme + one horrendous mistake by McHattie), Hearts showed today that there is a huge amount of talent in the U19s and in my view 80% of them could walk into the first team as we stand at the moment.

 

As FF says, the youth cup does seem to be the achilles heel these days, as certainly our league results more than prove that we have got a decent U19 crop that are more than capable of getting results against any of the other big guns in the league at the moment and I for one will continue to follow them whenever I can without shooting them down on the back of one fluke result by the wee team.

 

If you've not done it already, get along and watch them and take the blinkers off before you go and I guarantee you will not fail to be impressed.

 

 

I went along to see them against Celtic. I was hoping to see an open game with a lot of skill on display.

 

Whilst there was some ability shown(at times) i left with the feeling that football doesn't really have a future.

 

Disappointed to the extreme.

[big yin65]

Thats my view, to suggest this team doesn't have a winning attitude is wrong, if you look at some of the games they have won, it came after going a goal or two down and fighting back to win the game, fighting the full 90 mins (a key reason why the old firm win so much is that they dont accept losing, they fight the whole time available to get that winning goal.)

 

Our formation and style is also key to winning, it utilises our strengths, it is highly technical, quick passing looking to overpower the opposition midfield and allow us to have a possession to allow us to hit the opposition with a quick change of tempo, for the wingers to get the ball and use it to get the ball into the box. While we need to get a striker into the right position it also requires a midfielder to get into the box as well. We need a striker to play two roles really, one is the supporting role by holding the ball up and moving it round to the wingers or midfielders to get into a better position, second is getting into position and finishing chances. We have David Smith, Ryan Stewart, Billy King and Callum Patterson who have played this role so far this season. Stewart has really impressed me in the last two games with his ability to hold up the ball.m While Billy King and Callum Patterson have each scored 6 goals this season, so there are goal scorers there. Point being our style creates chances, and we have actually a good rate of goals per game, before this match it is 2.25 goals a gae and we have had only 1 game where goals have not been scored all season.

 

We were just lacking today, that is simply it, on another day we could of taken the chances and been 2 up at half time. Its a pain, I think he have to do better in the cup competition but I still think there are positives to take from this match, a match where we looked the better side and had the better players in most areas, Hibs have some good players and I think for the future of Scottish football that is a good thing. Just dont base your view of the under 19s on one match.

 

Gordon Smith is too old, he has been for the last year and a half, still think that season he was taken away from the under 19s for too much of the season when he was just sitting on the bench not playing.

[big yin65]

Thats my view, to suggest this team doesn't have a winning attitude is wrong, if you look at some of the games they have won, it came after going a goal or two down and fighting back to win the game, fighting the full 90 mins (a key reason why the old firm win so much is that they dont accept losing, they fight the whole time available to get that winning goal.)

 

Our formation and style is also key to winning, it utilises our strengths, it is highly technical, quick passing looking to overpower the opposition midfield and allow us to have a possession to allow us to hit the opposition with a quick change of tempo, for the wingers to get the ball and use it to get the ball into the box. While we need to get a striker into the right position it also requires a midfielder to get into the box as well. We need a striker to play two roles really, one is the supporting role by holding the ball up and moving it round to the wingers or midfielders to get into a better position, second is getting into position and finishing chances. We have David Smith, Ryan Stewart, Billy King and Callum Patterson who have played this role so far this season. Stewart has really impressed me in the last two games with his ability to hold up the ball. While Billy King and Callum Patterson have each scored 6 goals this season, so there are goal scorers there. Point being our style creates chances, and we have actually a good rate of goals per game, before this match it is 2.25 goals a game and we have had only 1 game where goals have not been scored all season.

 

We were just lacking today, that is simply it, on another day we could of taken the chances and been 2 up at half time. Its a pain, I think he have to do better in the cup competition but I still think there are positives to take from this match, a match where we looked the better side and had the better players in most areas, Hibs have some good players and I think for the future of Scottish football that is a good thing. Just dont base your view of the under 19s on one match.

 

Gordon Smith is too old, he has been for the last year and a half, still think that season he was taken away from the under 19s for too much of the season when he was just sitting on the bench not playing.

 

 

we were streets ahead of them - should have been 3 or 4 up at half time. Fraser Mullen and jason holt were outstanding. Yes, King and paterson have each scored 6 goals this season, but King on bench for best part of game - came on near end of normal time? plenty positives to take from this game tho.

[TommyC]

This is a big debate over very little. The team usually play better, don't judge on one days performance.

 

I think the criticism of the CB's is harsh. Kane had a good game, communicated well as a captain, organised his team well and didnt make any mistakes. McKay usually plays better but hard luck to him eh?

 

One-time viewers should not be providing big opinions here.