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#1 Mr Romanov Saviour of HMFC

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Posted 12 March 2010 - 11:41 AM

Just watching This Morning and they are interviewing two gay guys who have a family of 5 children (4 boys, 1 girl).

Call me old fashioned but something really doesn't sit right with me watching this. Very uncomfortable. Now I've got nothing against homosexuals but I'm a believer in functionalism and how important the traditional family is to society.

One of them is talking about how parents at the school complained when he volunteered to play the fairy God mother in a play. I mean ffs you couldn't make that up. The kids look happy enough but they aren't at the age where it will start to bother them yet.

Not right, imo.

#2 BigMDV

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Posted 12 March 2010 - 11:46 AM

Its just wrong on so many levels

#3 speedbump

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Posted 12 March 2010 - 11:47 AM

Posted Image

#4 P-Dizzle

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Posted 12 March 2010 - 11:49 AM

If the parents can provide a good upbringing, and give their children a good life. Then I have no problem with it.

Having gay parents is no more dysfunctional to a child than living with one parent who's brought their boyfriend/girlfriend into the family home.

Gay couples do far less damage to children than some people who have children and don't have them taken off them, despite substance abuse and no ability to look after a child.

That thing about the fairy godmother is obviously an isolated issue, but as long as they raise the children with care and affection I have no problem with it.

I also approve of the name change. :thumbsup:

Edited by LPjambo91, 12 March 2010 - 11:50 AM.


#5 jambojackbilly

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Posted 12 March 2010 - 11:53 AM

They opted out from having children narturarly so why allow them to be parents now

Not right :down:

#6 Prince Buaben

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Posted 12 March 2010 - 11:55 AM

Just watching This Morning and they are interviewing two gay guys who have a family of 5 children (4 boys, 1 girl).

Call me old fashioned but something really doesn't sit right with me watching this. Very uncomfortable. Now I've got nothing against homosexuals but I'm a believer in functionalism and how important the traditional family is to society.

One of them is talking about how parents at the school complained when he volunteered to play the fairy God mother in a play. I mean ffs you couldn't make that up. The kids look happy enough but they aren't at the age where it will start to bother them yet.

Not right, imo.


Posted Image that made me laugh.


In all seriousness i agree with the OP. Not seen the bit on this morning but id imagine that the kids havent started secondry school yet. Imagine when they go to secondry school. Teenage children can not be pleasent to say the least and those children could have there lives made hell.
Although this puts me in mind of the frankie boyle joke

Child 1: My dads bigger than your dad
Child 2: My dad S*****d your dad... ...and he liked it.

#7 speedbump

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Posted 12 March 2010 - 11:55 AM

They opted out from having children narturarly so why allow them to be parents now

Not right :down:


They might be the kids natural parents from previous hetro-sexual relationships.

#8 jambojackbilly

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Posted 12 March 2010 - 11:56 AM

They might be the kids natural parents from previous hetro-sexual relationships.



Wouldnt surprise me when yer Ma's yer Da

#9 speedbump

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Posted 12 March 2010 - 11:59 AM

Wouldnt surprise me when yer Ma's yer Da


Grow up, eh.

#10 jambojackbilly

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Posted 12 March 2010 - 12:04 PM

Grow up, eh.


:woot: i have thanks, made it all the way to 6ft 2 :thumbsup:

#11 P-Dizzle

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Posted 12 March 2010 - 12:04 PM

They opted out from having children narturarly so why allow them to be parents now

Not right :down:


Much like women who need IVF.

Nature gave them cancer, therefore they shouldn't have kids.

It's not about the opinions of some self-righteous arseholes, it's about these kids. If two people can provide a child in need with a good life. Food, clothes and love. Then what is the problem?

#12 jambojackbilly

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Posted 12 March 2010 - 12:06 PM

Much like women who need IVF.

Nature gave them cancer, therefore they shouldn't have kids.

It's not about the opinions of some self-righteous arseholes, it's about these kids. If two people can provide a child in need with a good life. Food, clothes and love. Then what is the problem?

***


It's not about the opinions of some self-righteous arseholes

_________________

How apt

Edited by jambojackbilly, 12 March 2010 - 12:07 PM.


#13 Kyle

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Posted 12 March 2010 - 12:09 PM

They opted out from having children narturarly so why allow them to be parents now

Not right :down:

Don't know the situation in the UK, but here Stateside, most parents looking to adopt choose infants and there are large numbers of children in foster care. If similar conditions exist, I would assume those children would be better off adopted by a set of gay parents than left in a group home as wards of the state.

#14 Mr Romanov Saviour of HMFC

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Posted 12 March 2010 - 12:10 PM

If the parents can provide a good upbringing, and give their children a good life. Then I have no problem with it.

Having gay parents is no more dysfunctional to a child than living with one parent who's brought their boyfriend/girlfriend into the family home.

Gay couples do far less damage to children than some people who have children and don't have them taken off them, despite substance abuse and no ability to look after a child.

That thing about the fairy godmother is obviously an isolated issue, but as long as they raise the children with care and affection I have no problem with it.

I also approve of the name change. :thumbsup:


That's fair enough. That argument about a gay family being better than a bunch of junkies always seems to pop up in these sorts of debates. I don't really get that, gay families are just as likely to be into substance abuse as a normal family. The best, and fairest, way to think of this is two fairly normal families without addictions are anything like that.

I don't really agree that gay parents are no more dysfunctional than a child living with a parent and a girlfriend/boyfriend. Like it or not, gender roles still play a big part in the upbringing of a kid so I think the lack of female presence in the house does more harm than good, especially at a young age.

#15 The Treasurer

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Posted 12 March 2010 - 12:13 PM

It's not about the opinions of some self-righteous arseholes, it's about these kids. If two people can provide a child in need with a good life. Food, clothes and love. Then what is the problem?



I think the problem lies with how they'll be treated by the rest of society.
As another poster said they could be an easy target for bullies at school.

#16 Moriarty

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Posted 12 March 2010 - 12:13 PM

frankly I think a gay couple are just as likely to give a child a loving upbringing as a hetero couple, probably more so considering the amount of jakeys having kids when they are 16 and bringing them up on monster munch and rustlers.

Would a gay couple give any less of a balanced upbringing than a single parent? should single parents not be allowed kids unless they can find a partner?


I thought better of some of the people in this thread. (not you LP, we a'ight)

#17 Feeno

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Posted 12 March 2010 - 12:15 PM

Does a gay couple shun their kid and disown them if they grow up and turn out to be straight? Posted Image


I have no qualms about gay couples raising kids. More power to them, shits isnt easy regardless.



#18 Moriarty

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Posted 12 March 2010 - 12:16 PM

I think the problem lies with how they'll be treated by the rest of society.
As another poster said they could be an easy target for bullies at school.


that is societies fault and in no way the fault of the parents.

If your folks are fat, thus have made you fat, should you be taken into care because you might get bullied for being a tubster?

#19 Mr Romanov Saviour of HMFC

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Posted 12 March 2010 - 12:19 PM

frankly I think a gay couple are just as likely to give a child a loving upbringing as a hetero couple, probably more so considering the amount of jakeys having kids when they are 16 and bringing them up on monster munch and rustlers.

Would a gay couple give any less of a balanced upbringing than a single parent? should single parents not be allowed kids unless they can find a partner?


I thought better of some of the people in this thread. (not you LP, we a'ight)


Interesting question that. I've been brought up in a single parent family but I've never considered it anything other than normal. Probably because it's almost the norm these days for parents to split up.

If you're part of a single parent gay family then you're really f***ed, I suppose. :D

Again, you've used the argument that normal families are terrible junkie tralier trash etc. Can gay families not be like that?

#20 The Treasurer

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Posted 12 March 2010 - 12:20 PM

that is societies fault and in no way the fault of the parents.

If your folks are fat, thus have made you fat, should you be taken into care because you might get bullied for being a tubster?



Eh where did I say it was the parents fault. Posted Image

You're arguement about a fat kid is irrelevant in this debate btw

#21 Say What Again

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Posted 12 March 2010 - 12:20 PM

They might be the kids natural parents from previous hetro-sexual relationships.

I don't think that was the case, I'm sure there's a surrogate Mum

#22 BUG

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Posted 12 March 2010 - 12:22 PM

Much like women who need IVF.

Nature gave them cancer, therefore they shouldn't have kids.






It's not about the opinions of some self-righteous arseholes, it's about these kids. If two people can provide a child in need with a good life. Food, clothes and love. Then what is the problem?


Much like women who need IVF ....what a [email protected] prat you are ?



#23 Guest_King_*

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Posted 12 March 2010 - 12:23 PM

The children are going to be bullied which is a shame IMO.

And what if they become sexually attracted to one of their sons in the future Posted Image




#24 Tiberius Stinkfinger

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Posted 12 March 2010 - 12:29 PM

The children are going to be bullied which is a shame IMO.

And what if they become sexually attracted to one of their sons in the future Posted Image




Why would you think that ??

I tend to run in the opposite direction from them myself......:lol: Joke.


As long as the kids are happy and brought up well then I see no problem.

#25 speedbump

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Posted 12 March 2010 - 12:31 PM

The children are going to be bullied which is a shame IMO.

And what if they become sexually attracted to one of their sons in the future Posted Image


FFS

I can't believe I am reading this.

#26 Feeno

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Posted 12 March 2010 - 12:37 PM

The children are going to be bullied which is a shame IMO.

And what if they become sexually attracted to one of their sons in the future Posted Image





Like me father said when I were a bairn, "lets get crackin wi the knacking", pet! Posted Image

#27 P-Dizzle

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Posted 12 March 2010 - 12:37 PM

BUG.

Not only did you fail to quote me, you failed to understand what I'm saying. That's quite poor.

I was pointing out the fallacy in saying that gay people shouldn't have kids because they gave up that right when nature made them gay. Which is like saying women shouldn't have the right to have children if they have a premature menopause, cancer etc.



As for the other people. I do understand that people have quite strong objections to this, my point is that a gay couple can be just as good parents as straight parents. I do see the point about bullying, but that's because it's such a bad thing to be gay. Equality has improved over the years, but there's still a stigma around this. If it was seen as being more acceptable, it might stop this cruelty. It's parents like that who are so against things that they perceive as perverted and wrong, that are setting this country back. Not the gay couples who want to have a family.

#28 Moriarty

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Posted 12 March 2010 - 12:39 PM

Eh where did I say it was the parents fault. Posted Image

You're arguement about a fat kid is irrelevant in this debate btw


you are using the fact that they might get bullied as some sort of reason to not allow gay couples to keep children.

but is a fat lad not as likely to get abuse at school?

#29 Moriarty

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Posted 12 March 2010 - 12:40 PM

The children are going to be bullied which is a shame IMO.

And what if they become sexually attracted to one of their sons in the future Posted Image



:lol: feck sake.

Edited by Picard's forehead, 12 March 2010 - 12:40 PM.


#30 The Merse

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Posted 12 March 2010 - 12:41 PM

Interesting question that. I've been brought up in a single parent family but I've never considered it anything other than normal. Probably because it's almost the norm these days for parents to split up.

If you're part of a single parent gay family then you're really f***ed, I suppose. :D

Again, you've used the argument that normal families are terrible junkie tralier trash etc. Can gay families not be like that?


Unlikely I'd say as there are fairly rigorous checks into any family who is looking to adopt.

#31 The People's Chimp

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Posted 12 March 2010 - 12:50 PM

I'm more alarmed by the fact that this family have seen it a good idea to go on this morning. Desperate for their own 15 minutes of fame, it would appear...and crying out about not being allowed the dubious distinction of playing the fairy godmother is hardly helping the situation.

At the end of the day a person's suitability to raise kids is down to the abilities of the person, not who they sleep with. If these kids are well brought up, then there isn't, and shouldn't be, a problem.

#32 Chris Benoit

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Posted 12 March 2010 - 12:53 PM

Unlikely I'd say as there are fairly rigorous checks into any family who is looking to adopt.


not in this case as they used surrogates

#33 P-Dizzle

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Posted 12 March 2010 - 12:55 PM

not in this case as they used surrogates


Posted Image


Posted Image

#34 mrmarkus1981

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Posted 12 March 2010 - 12:58 PM

Question?

Most people are brought up with a mother and a father. If they split up, there is still a mother and father.

Now, i work with 2 gay chaps (there is only 3 of us in the office) and the thought of being with a woman gives them the boke. If these 2 gay men have the same attitude towards sleeping with a woman, do you think that the kids will grow up to be gay themselves?

Edited by mrmarkus1981, 12 March 2010 - 01:00 PM.


#35 Moriarty

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Posted 12 March 2010 - 01:01 PM

Question?

Most people are brought up with a mother and a father. If they split up, there is still a mother and father.

Now, i work with 2 gay chaps (there is only 3 of us in the office) and the thought of being with a woman gives them the boke. If these 2 gay men have the same attitude towards sleeping with a woman, do you think that the kids will grow and be gay themselves?


Depends on the person. In my experience parents just want what will make their child happiest. now some gay people might push their beliefs on a child, most won't. That is IMO no worse than pushing a religious view on a child (both are wrong btw)

#36 Boris

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Posted 12 March 2010 - 01:05 PM

Question?

Most people are brought up with a mother and a father. If they split up, there is still a mother and father.

Now, i work with 2 gay chaps (there is only 3 of us in the office) and the thought of being with a woman gives them the boke. If these 2 gay men have the same attitude towards sleeping with a woman, do you think that the kids will grow up to be gay themselves?



No.

I don't believe that you can "turn" gay. You either are or aren't, imo.

#37 mrmarkus1981

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Posted 12 March 2010 - 01:07 PM

I totally agree, pushing your kids into something like this is wrong.

I dont want to even think about what the percentages are but if 80% of children grow up with a mother and father turn out to be hetrosexual and 20% turn out homosexual.

Would it be the opposite if your parents were gay (80% homosexual and 20% hetro)

HYPOTHETICALLY

Edited by mrmarkus1981, 12 March 2010 - 01:07 PM.


#38 Gorgiewave

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Posted 12 March 2010 - 01:09 PM

It shouldn't be allowed because the children are likely to lack a role model from one or other sex, which is really important.

My illegal thougts are that I don't mind gay couples as long as they keep shtum and I generally can't stand Romanians.

#39 Moriarty

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Posted 12 March 2010 - 01:10 PM

I totally agree, pushing your kids into something like this is wrong.

I dont want to even think about what the percentages are but if 80% of children grow up with a mother and father turn out to be hetrosexual and 20% turn out homosexual.

Would it be the opposite if your parents were gay (80% homosexual and 20% hetro)

HYPOTHETICALLY


No.

I hope this helps.

#40 Moriarty

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Posted 12 March 2010 - 01:10 PM

It shouldn't be allowed because the children are likely to lack a role model from one or other sex, which is really important.

My illegal thougts are that I don't mind gay couples as long as they keep shtum and I generally can't stand Romanians.


what about single parents then? They are still lacking a role model.

#41 mrmarkus1981

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Posted 12 March 2010 - 01:13 PM

My mum brought up 4 kids on her own, we are all grown up now and all have partners, jobs, houses and generally do ok.

This thread is starting to make me feel like a big girls blouse!!!

I LIKE BEER AND BOXING AND OTHER MANLY THINGS Posted Image

#42 redm

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Posted 12 March 2010 - 01:16 PM

My mum brought up 4 kids on her own, we are all grown up now and all have partners, jobs, houses and generally do ok.

This thread is starting to make me feel like a big girls blouse!!!

I LIKE BEER AND BOXING AND OTHER MANLY THINGS Posted Image


:biggrin:

My gay chums really really like manly things too.






#43 Moriarty

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Posted 12 March 2010 - 01:16 PM

So many gay couples today have kids that it has become a cultural phenomenon – there's even a new TV show about a modern family that includes a gay couple with an adopted baby.

One in five male couples and one in three lesbian couples were raising children as of the 2000 Census. That's way up from 1990, when one in 20 male couples and one in five lesbian couples had kids.

But Census numbers are just part of a new comprehensive analysis of research on gay parenting since the 1970s in new book Lesbian and Gay Parents and Their Children: Research on the Family Life Cycle, by Abbie Goldberg, an assistant professor of psychology at Clark University in Worcester, Mass.

Gay households have more in common than not with their heterosexual counterparts who are also raising kids, the research shows. "The sexual orientation of a parent has really little to do with their parenting," Goldberg says.

That idea comes through loud and clear in pop culture, in TV shows such as Modern Family, in which two gay men adopt a Vietnamese infant, and among celebrities as gay stars are increasingly having or adopting children.

Demographer Gary Gates of the Williams Institute at the University of California-Los Angeles also has studied same-sex families. His new analysis of the 2008 American Community Survey showed that 31% of same-sex couples who identify themselves as spouses are raising kids compared with 43% of heterosexual couples. That survey marked the first available Census data about same-sex spouses and gay U.S. families. Gates says same-sex couples who identify as married are similar to heterosexual couples in many ways, including the fact that almost one-third are raising children.

Among findings outlined in Goldberg's book:

•The transition to parenthood is similar for both homosexual couples and heterosexual couples.

•Children of gay couples don't differ from their peers raised by heterosexual couples in terms of their mental health, self-esteem, life satisfaction, social skills or number of friends.

•Children in gay families are teased more about their families and their sexuality but are not teased more overall.

Stephanie Woolley-Larrea, 36, of Miami says she and her partner, Mary Larrea, 49, have tried to prepare their 7-year-old triplets (two girls and a boy) to face such ridicule, but "it's been a non-issue."

Her kids know "their family is not like everybody else's" but "think it is much more unusual that they are triplets than that they have gay moms."

Goldberg's analysis also included phone interviews that began in 2005 with adoptive parents in 30 states, including 30 to 35 male couples, 40 lesbian couples and 50 to 60 heterosexual couples. They were interviewed before adoption and three months after, with two annual follow-ups so far.

"Gay men are just as likely to want to parent as straight men, but are less likely to parent because of all the barriers in their way," Goldberg says.

Her analysis also suggests that children of gay parents are no more likely to identify as gay themselves.

Sociologist Tim Biblarz of the University of Southern California-Los Angeles says too little long-term, large-scale research exists to conclude that being raised by same-sex couples doesn't affect sexual identity.

"That's an area that the next decade of research might really be able to pioneer."


http://www.usatoday....ents05_ST_N.htm

#44 Gorgiewave

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Posted 12 March 2010 - 01:16 PM

My mum brought up 4 kids on her own, we are all grown up now and all have partners, jobs, houses and generally do ok.

This thread is starting to make me feel like a big girls blouse!!!

I LIKE BEER AND BOXING AND OTHER MANLY THINGS Posted Image

What about Hearts? Careful now.

#45 Victorian

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Posted 12 March 2010 - 01:17 PM

i think there's a significant section of the gay & lesbian community that are very politically active and quite militant when it comes to pressing home their case for rights and equality.

with same sex couples adopting children, i would always hol the suspicion that they aren't taking on a huge responsibility for the correct reasons. not because of their need to be parents... more thought placed on pressing home their right to be parents.

#46 Boris

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Posted 12 March 2010 - 01:17 PM

The levels of homophobia amongst some on this thread are startling.

I never knew so many people lived in fear of being bummed. Posted Image

Yet, I guess it's hardly surprising given the view that proximity to gay people will make you turn out gay therefore best not have any gays about just in case their gayness spreads to a heterosexual person.

Was the Enlightenment so long ago that its legacy has been totally forgotten in 21st Century Britain?

#47 Mr Romanov Saviour of HMFC

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Posted 12 March 2010 - 01:18 PM

Quite a lot of compelling arguments against gay families.

  • Possible father - son sexual relationships
  • 80% of gay family children turn gay = end of the human race
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#48 Chester™

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Posted 12 March 2010 - 01:21 PM

Like it or not, gender roles still play a big part in the upbringing of a kid so I think the lack of female presence in the house does more harm than good, especially at a young age.


Yes they do. Research into this suggests that as long as there is some kind of female (or male in the case of two females) role model for the children, the lack of the opposite sex in the house is pretty irrelevant. This role model can be anyone such as a Gran, Aunt, Teacher etc. Its having someone to look up to rather than the presence in the house which is vitally important (and this can apply for 'traditional' families too).

#49 Gorgiewave

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Posted 12 March 2010 - 01:21 PM

The levels of homophobia amongst some on this thread are startling.

I never knew so many people lived in fear of being bummed. Posted Image

Yet, I guess it's hardly surprising given the view that proximity to gay people will make you turn out gay therefore best not have any gays about just in case their gayness spreads to a heterosexual person.

Was the Enlightenment so long ago that its legacy has been totally forgotten in 21st Century Britain?



It's actually effeminacy I dislike, not homosexuality. I have one or two seconds of wanting to punch a lisping, mincing poof, then I desist.

#50 Moriarty

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Posted 12 March 2010 - 01:21 PM

Quite a lot of compelling arguments against gay families.

  • Possible father - son sexual relationships
  • 80% of gay family children turn gay = end of the human race
  • John Barrowman



best post on this thread.

btw, I have just been playing devils advocate up until now. I ******* hate gays and their gay kids. :teehee: :ninja:

Edited by Picard's forehead, 12 March 2010 - 01:22 PM.