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Is playing for Hearts too much pressure for some ?


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ToqueJambo
9 minutes ago, Lone Striker said:

I'd like to know what this "mentality to play for Hearts" thing actually is.  Is there a similar mental toughness  required to play for Aberdeen or Hibs or Kilmarnock or Livi ?      If our coaches/manager are "warning" every new player that Hearts fans have high expectations (top 4 place in the Premiership every year and a good cup run), maybe it's causing some of them to hide a bit on the pitch - just do the simple sideways stuff and hope someone else takes responsibility for creating and scoring ?     Sean Clare springs to mind, Wighton too.    

 

Anyone able to add some detail to this mentality thing ?

 

It's common knowledge that the players who make it are the mentally tough and confident ones no matter the club. We're talking about Hearts because we're Hearts fans but it'll be the same at every club. Plenty very talented players fall by the wayside because they don't have that extra something that is usually in their head. The truly great coaches - McLean, Ferguson, Clough, Klopp, Guardiola, etc - are the ones able to get that something extra out of players time after time. 

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Dusk_Till_Dawn

This Hearts regime have no standards or ambition, therefore players realise they can come here and coast. Just pick up your money, phone it in and no-one will say a word.

 

 

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Too much pressure........a bigger load of nonsense has rarely been posted

 

When is it fans will realise that on the whole the quality of the player you have determines your performance

 

Of course there will be other factors from time to time like injuries to key players/management decisions but the quality of player you have will mostly determine success or failure (with a nod to what level you are playing at )

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9 hours ago, rmreido said:

Some are just not good enough to play for Hearts, there lies the problem. imo

Bang on the money.

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9 hours ago, davemclaren said:

The list of imposters changes from month to month though as Jamie was a leader in that list, for some, not so long ago. 

Agree. We're a fickle lot.

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2 hours ago, ToqueJambo said:

 

It's common knowledge that the players who make it are the mentally tough and confident ones no matter the club. We're talking about Hearts because we're Hearts fans but it'll be the same at every club. Plenty very talented players fall by the wayside because they don't have that extra something that is usually in their head. The truly great coaches - McLean, Ferguson, Clough, Klopp, Guardiola, etc - are the ones able to get that something extra out of players time after time. 

Does that say something about our management team?

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10 hours ago, Des Lynam said:

I’d be questioning their mentality if they are feeling any pressure winning the league. 


If they are feeling the pressure with no fans and playing in the Championship, god help them/us when they have to play at a full Tynecastle in the top league!

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There’s no way anyone should be feeling pressure playing for Hearts. Your in the Championship, no fans and the manager and his staff are the players best pal. Hi I’m Robbie don’t call me boss or gaffer.

Edited by mitch41
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ToqueJambo
3 hours ago, chrystaf said:

Does that say something about our management team?

 

It maybe says they're not McLean, Ferguson, Clough, Klopp, Guardiola, etc 🤣

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Quite the reverse. I think having no pressure from the fans is what is lacking. 

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merseyjambo

I don’t know if it’s pressure or something else but there are a lot examples of players who haven’t shone at Tynecastle but did in other places. It does work the other way as well.

 

Best examples I can think of are John Sutton and Rudi Skacel. 
 

When Sutton signed, we were all delighted that he had joined us as he been regularly putting the ball in the net at Motherwell. Turns up at Tynecastle and didn’t set the heather alight, leaves and then scored on a regular basis for Motherwell and St Mirren. Connor Sammon and Dennis Wyness are others who could maybe be put in this category. Damon at Killie and Wyness at Inverness.

 

With Rudi, it’s the other way. Scored for fun when he was here. Left, barely scored elsewhere then returns to Tynecastle and all of a sudden finds Billy’s Boots again and can’t stop scoring.

 

I don’t know if it’s pressure or where a player is just happy.

 

As for Wighton, he was a mediocre signing at best. His stats were poor at Dundee and looking at them at the time, the only place he had scored regularly was Scotland Schoolboys or something like that. His stats never suggested he was going to be a regular goalscorer 

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The Grim Reaper
17 hours ago, Lone Striker said:

Maybe the Hearts website page with the 1st team squad gives us a clue  to the mentality our coaches have -  GMS, Gino, Frear, Kastaneer  and Roberts are all included under "Midfield".    :tlj:

 

 


What position are they if they’re not midfielders?

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Bull's-eye

Playing in front of a crowd is the ultimate sporting experience and it doesn't surprise me one jot that all football players currently look disinterested on occasion. 

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JimmyCant
19 hours ago, Robbo-Jambo said:

If they are on edge now god help them when the fans are back. 

Precisely. They are playing behind closed doors in a league that shouldn’t trouble them football wise. If they’re not coping with that pressure imagine them going to Ibrox or Celtic Park next season and imagine if they produce a ‘Morton’ type performance in front of 16000 at Tynecastle ?

 

I actually think some of them will benefit from a crowd and a bit of tasty atmosphere

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21 hours ago, Hesh said:


i wonder how many of the posters here would be able to perform to their full potential in their job of someone was dishing out abuse at them like you see on this site.

I actually had a conversation with someone about that...imagine walking into your office and getting booed by your customers or fellow staff members, who then stood around having a go at you all day 😆 You then go home switch on the TV and read reviews telling you how sh!te you are at your job, folk having a go at your family etc. Even though you maybe only started your job a couple of weeks ago, have maybe moved here from another country, are living in rented accommodation, on your own, with your family elsewhere.

 

But hey, the customers spent their money in your shop, so it’s their right to hurl abuse at you 🙄

 

 

 

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Marooned Abroad
22 hours ago, davemclaren said:

I think following Hearts is too much pressure for some. 😄

Couldn’t agree more! 

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When you play for Hearts you're expected to beat lesser opposition at home. That expectation may be too much for some. 

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JimmyCant
39 minutes ago, combo74 said:

I actually had a conversation with someone about that...imagine walking into your office and getting booed by your customers or fellow staff members, who then stood around having a go at you all day 😆 You then go home switch on the TV and read reviews telling you how sh!te you are at your job, folk having a go at your family etc. Even though you maybe only started your job a couple of weeks ago, have maybe moved here from another country, are living in rented accommodation, on your own, with your family elsewhere.

 

But hey, the customers spent their money in your shop, so it’s their right to hurl abuse at you 🙄

 

 

 

Doesn’t make it right but there are plenty of people working in more abusive environments for a lot less money than these guys and they mostly manage. You get immune to it pretty quickly, especially on 20k a month as opposed  to 1.7k a month

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jambonian
1 hour ago, Bull's-eye said:

Playing in front of a crowd is the ultimate sporting experience and it doesn't surprise me one jot that all football players currently look disinterested on occasion. 

 

Not nesscessarily. 

It hasn't stopped Rangers 2012's players who would normally play in front of two, even three times the amount of supporters that we do. Hibs are sitting in third with no fans, something their fans if they were there wouldn't be used to. Livingston going on a 14 game unbeaten run. It's all about the mentality and professionalism of the players you have. Some think they can just turn up and everything will be alright. That's not how any professional sportsman should behave. Maybe they should realise that they are free transfers for a reason. They are lucky to be able to get a wage that barely any of us could get a week, and all for kicking a ball about. And under-performing at a lower level ain't going to get them any big moves in their careers either. Fight, talent, ambition, improving skill etc will attract a club, settling for what you have, lack any of the above won't attract many, if any suitors. Then you find you're on your way down the Leagues until the day arrives to hang the boots up.

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Robbo-Jambo
1 hour ago, JimmyCant said:

Precisely. They are playing behind closed doors in a league that shouldn’t trouble them football wise. If they’re not coping with that pressure imagine them going to Ibrox or Celtic Park next season and imagine if they produce a ‘Morton’ type performance in front of 16000 at Tynecastle ?

 

I actually think some of them will benefit from a crowd and a bit of tasty atmosphere

Might actually force players like GMS and Halliday to come out of their slumber 🙄

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Robbo-Jambo
13 hours ago, Dusk_Till_Dawn said:

This Hearts regime have no standards or ambition, therefore players realise they can come here and coast. Just pick up your money, phone it in and no-one will say a word.

 

 

Hate to say it, but this is probably very close to the truth. 🙁

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Lone Striker
4 hours ago, The Grim Reaper said:


What position are they if they’re not midfielders?

Forwards  (or wing forwards as number 7 and 11  were once called).    Worrying the sh1t out the  opposition fullbacks ....... getting to the byline to cross or deliver a cutback ..... cutting inside and shooting..... etc etc.

 

I'm probably just being picky and old-fashioned, but surely we want these guys to use speed and ball trickery to attack and score goals ?   GMS used to be good at doing that for his previous clubs.  As others have mentioned in various threads, our midfield is congested because everyone apart from Boyce, Halkett & Popescu seems to be in that area when we're in possession.

 

 

  

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Bull's-eye
2 hours ago, jambonian said:

 

Not nesscessarily. 

It hasn't stopped Rangers 2012's players who would normally play in front of two, even three times the amount of supporters that we do. Hibs are sitting in third with no fans, something their fans if they were there wouldn't be used to. Livingston going on a 14 game unbeaten run. It's all about the mentality and professionalism of the players you have. Some think they can just turn up and everything will be alright. That's not how any professional sportsman should behave. Maybe they should realise that they are free transfers for a reason. They are lucky to be able to get a wage that barely any of us could get a week, and all for kicking a ball about. And under-performing at a lower level ain't going to get them any big moves in their careers either. Fight, talent, ambition, improving skill etc will attract a club, settling for what you have, lack any of the above won't attract many, if any suitors. Then you find you're on your way down the Leagues until the day arrives to hang the boots up.

 

Which is all well and good but we're top of the league. 

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jambonian
2 minutes ago, Bull's-eye said:

 

Which is all well and good but we're top of the league. 

Yep. Because everyone else in the League is shitter.

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Bull's-eye
1 minute ago, jambonian said:

Yep. Because everyone else in the League is shitter.

 

That's generally how the league format works.

 

Thanks for clarifying. 

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The Grim Reaper
3 minutes ago, Bull's-eye said:

 

That's generally how the league format works.

 

Thanks for clarifying. 


It would be preferable to be good rather than the least shit. 

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Bull's-eye
11 minutes ago, The Grim Reaper said:


It would be preferable to be good rather than the least shit. 

 

 

A statement that sums you up perfectly.

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The Grim Reaper
10 minutes ago, Bull's-eye said:

 

 

A statement that sums you up perfectly.


Should I take that as a compliment?

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20 hours ago, ToqueJambo said:

 

It's common knowledge that the players who make it are the mentally tough and confident ones no matter the club. We're talking about Hearts because we're Hearts fans but it'll be the same at every club. Plenty very talented players fall by the wayside because they don't have that extra something that is usually in their head. The truly great coaches - McLean, Ferguson, Clough, Klopp, Guardiola, etc - are the ones able to get that something extra out of players time after time. 


Good post 👍

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3 hours ago, The Grim Reaper said:


It would be preferable to be good rather than the least shit. 


Indeed! 👍

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ToqueJambo
3 hours ago, The Grim Reaper said:


It would be preferable to be good rather than the least shit. 

 

Indeed, but in what world does this happen in Scotland? Being good means being better than everyone else. Maybe your definition of "good" involves sparkling football. Again, when does this ever happen in Scotland on a consistent basis? Too many folk on here watch the EPL and think that's what football is.

 

Celtic have not been an especially good football team in recent seasons despite their domination. If they were they'd have done something in Europe like other genuinely good teams. They basically always win the league by being the least shit. No-one reminisces about great Celtic players or brilliant performances when discussing the quality of Scottish football recently. I can barely remember who's in their team, even in their unbeaten season. Rangers are currently winning the league by being least shit but we can say they definitely have a good manager and a decent team because of their efforts in Europe. Even then, who is a standout in their team entertainment wise?

Edited by ToqueJambo
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7 hours ago, combo74 said:

I actually had a conversation with someone about that...imagine walking into your office and getting booed by your customers or fellow staff members, who then stood around having a go at you all day 😆 You then go home switch on the TV and read reviews telling you how sh!te you are at your job, folk having a go at your family etc. Even though you maybe only started your job a couple of weeks ago, have maybe moved here from another country, are living in rented accommodation, on your own, with your family elsewhere.

 

But hey, the customers spent their money in your shop, so it’s their right to hurl abuse at you 🙄

 

 

 


To be fair my comment was a little tongue in cheek but you’ve given a decent example, there would be scrapping at work all day. 
 

you could argue it comes with the territory 

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ToqueJambo

 

8 hours ago, Bull's-eye said:

Playing in front of a crowd is the ultimate sporting experience and it doesn't surprise me one jot that all football players currently look disinterested on occasion. 

 

 

Exactly. It's like playing a gig in an empty venue. What's the point? Of course they deliver a different and possibly less dynamic performance. Technically they can go through the motions, but for players - like most of our team - who are used to playing in front of big crowds it must be a strange experience. Many of the other teams around us are used to it.

Edited by ToqueJambo
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On 22/02/2021 at 12:07, Ma Roon said:

Would it be fair to presume that playing for Hearts is a step too much for some of the players to cope with? The standards, demands expectations and size of the club that they do not perform at their natural levels of which the club signed them. 

As we have recently seen with Craig Wighton who mostly looked like a fish out of water while playing for us then on Saturday scoring 2 on his debut for Dunfermline. 

Is  the added pressure of fans expectations of scoring goals, winning games proving too much as they look as though they are not taking sole responsibility for performances and full of excuses 

 

 

FFS, they're playing in the championship with no fans breathing down their necks, if they can't handle that then they shouldn't be posing as professional footballers anywhere.

Imagine asking them to play in a packed Ibrox or Parkhead (or Hampden) in a crucial game. Jeezo! 🥴

 

:clyay:

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9 hours ago, combo74 said:

I actually had a conversation with someone about that...imagine walking into your office and getting booed by your customers or fellow staff members, who then stood around having a go at you all day 😆 You then go home switch on the TV and read reviews telling you how sh!te you are at your job, folk having a go at your family etc. Even though you maybe only started your job a couple of weeks ago, have maybe moved here from another country, are living in rented accommodation, on your own, with your family elsewhere.

 

But hey, the customers spent their money in your shop, so it’s their right to hurl abuse at you 🙄

 

 

 

 

Hey, if they paid me the dosh that's consistently been thrown at some of the absolute dross I've watched over the years they could drag my granny into the centre-circle at half-time and bitch slap her in front of me. 

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1 hour ago, JDK2020 said:

 

FFS, they're playing in the championship with no fans breathing down their necks, if they can't handle that then they shouldn't be posing as professional footballers anywhere.

Imagine asking them to play in a packed Ibrox or Parkhead (or Hampden) in a crucial game. Jeezo! 🥴

 

:clyay:

If you look over some performances this season, it's crystal clear that some players haven't reached the standards expected from which the club signed them, we should be much further ahead in the league and not drawing with Morton at home 

Fitbaw is all about opinions I suppose 

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25 minutes ago, Ma Roon said:

If you look over some performances this season, it's crystal clear that some players haven't reached the standards expected from which the club signed them, we should be much further ahead in the league and not drawing with Morton at home 

Fitbaw is all about opinions I suppose 

 

Lol, you don't say? 

 

It's my opinion that professional footballers worthy of the name should, if anything, find it easier to show their credentials under present circumstances.

If Hearts were promoted right now with the same squad as present then mid table is the best you can hope for IMO.

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Fozzyonthefence
4 hours ago, ToqueJambo said:

 

 

 

Exactly. It's like playing a gig in an empty venue. What's the point? Of course they deliver a different and possibly less dynamic performance. Technically they can go through the motions, but for players - like most of our team - who are used to playing in front of big crowds it must be a strange experience. Many of the other teams around us are used to it.


That could be a good excuse for them.....

 

if only they weren’t also so poor when playing in front of crowds!  

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20 hours ago, Fozzyonthefence said:


That could be a good excuse for them.....

 

if only they weren’t also so poor when playing in front of crowds!  

This team has never played in front of a crowd though.

 

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I don't honestly think that most of them care enough to feel pressure. We have an incredibly high number of players who have drifted from club to club on one or two year contracts and/or who spend their time doing the rounds on loan. They will no doubt all have agents who will help them find somewhere else to play if they either don't like where they are or they don't cut it, and we are just one of a whole host of careless clubs that are happy to try out these characters on the basis that it might work out. 

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Fozzyonthefence
5 hours ago, ToqueJambo said:

This team has never played in front of a crowd though.

 


Pedant!  Most of the team that so spectacularly let us down last season is still here is it not?  Of the new players, Gordon, Ginelly and Kingsley (more so offensively than defensively to be fair) have done ok without crowds so seems the same payers from last season continue to let us down, along with some of the new signings that haven’t hit the ground running.  
 

Looking at the QOTS team last week (arguably our worst performance of the season), 5 of the starting 11 were here last season along with another 4 or 5 on the bench (not sure about Stewart?), so we’ve hardly ripped the team up and started again. 

Edited by Fozzyonthefence
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