AlimOzturk Posted May 12, 2020 Share Posted May 12, 2020 Rediscovered a love for running again and been putting in the miles the for the couple of months. Been slowoy regaining my fitness and ATM I am doing between 35-40 miles a week. Would love to up this to 50-60 miles a week in the coming weeks and months. I usually split my runs between 1 long run, 2 medium length runs and 2 shorter but faster paced runs. The long run is a15k, medium 10k and shorter runs 5k. Sure there will be lots of experienced long distance runners here in kickback. My goal I suppose is to start entering races but I won't do that until I am down to my ideal running weight again and at least semi competitive. My 5k is fairly respectable but I tire quickly after if I don't pace myself properly. Any hints, tips and tricks you all follow would be much appreciated. Diet, equipment, clothing essentials and stuff. Cheers. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
highlandjambo3 Posted May 12, 2020 Share Posted May 12, 2020 (edited) Just keep doing what your doing.....different distances and speed training, decent diet and plenty of sleep. Lots of different people will give you different advice but work out what’s best for you. One thing I failed in often was my water intake, drink as much as you can pre, during and post running, if your doing a longer run, if possible, pre drop water points along the route. Also, don’t chase people, stick to a pace that’s comfortable for you. Edited May 12, 2020 by highlandjambo3 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Tazio Posted May 12, 2020 Share Posted May 12, 2020 It all depends on your end goal. I know someone who is a super keen runner and by his own admission would struggle to do a marathon in under 4 hours, however his real thing is ultra running and he thinks nothing of doing over 30 miles on a Sunday or a day off. He did the West Highland Way race a few years ago, it took him 23 hours of non stop running and you need someone to run with you for the last few miles as it’s quite common for people to start hallucinating and get completely lost. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
ri Alban Posted May 12, 2020 Share Posted May 12, 2020 Fixed gaze ahead , do not lift or dip your chin even when you're tired. Keep your hands relaxed, and push with your feet, don't just lift them. These were the 3 tips that helped me improve when I started longer distance running. I was a sprinter and hated anything over 1500m. Doing middle distance and long sprints will help you with the mental aspect, as when you go slower it feels like pish case. Good luck btw. And don't run too late in day. Morning work for me on an empty stomach, but everyone no's different. I'll be joining you as soon as find my fitness mojo again. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
The Brow Posted May 12, 2020 Share Posted May 12, 2020 1 hour ago, ri Alban said: Fixed gaze ahead , do not lift or dip your chin even when you're tired. Keep your hands relaxed, and push with your feet, don't just lift them. These were the 3 tips that helped me improve when I started longer distance running. I was a sprinter and hated anything over 1500m. Doing middle distance and long sprints will help you with the mental aspect, as when you go slower it feels like pish case. Good luck btw. And don't run too late in day. Morning work for me on an empty stomach, but everyone no's different. I'll be joining you as soon as find my fitness mojo again. I'm the opposite of this. A long run done early evening once I've had food and a shite. Always get caught out if I run early doors. I tend to run about 100km a month, I like entering ultra races that encompass bikes and running, last one was Quest24 on the Western Atlantic Way in Ireland, where they filmed Luke Skywalkers house in the new Star Wars film. Took me 21 hours to do 240k & the last leg was a trail marathon that I ran in the complete dark & the second leg was over Ireland tallest mountain. Sounds horrific, and it was, but Id rather that than some boring arse city marathon where I'd lose my mind. Ultras are basically a matter of mind over your body - I'd go as far to say that anyone reading this can do a marathon tomorrow - barring injury. You just may not be that fast, which theres no shame in. Anyway, back to training. Today I done a 10k, 5 mins rest, 5k. Tomorrow I'll probably do a 3-4k 'sprint' then I'll have a day off. you sound like you're already training fine i'd just throw in some brick runs. Again, its mind over matter with the long distances. I always have to spend at least an hour psyching myself up and I have to keep running away from the house, or else I'd just find it too easy to come back. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
AlimOzturk Posted May 12, 2020 Author Share Posted May 12, 2020 2 hours ago, Tazio said: It all depends on your end goal. I know someone who is a super keen runner and by his own admission would struggle to do a marathon in under 4 hours, however his real thing is ultra running and he thinks nothing of doing over 30 miles on a Sunday or a day off. He did the West Highland Way race a few years ago, it took him 23 hours of non stop running and you need someone to run with you for the last few miles as it’s quite common for people to start hallucinating and get completely lost. I suppose a marathon under four hours would be the ultimate goal in running. Has always been a goal of mine to complete one and doing under four hours would be a good aim for me. That's west Highland way race sounds crazy haha Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
AlimOzturk Posted May 12, 2020 Author Share Posted May 12, 2020 1 hour ago, The Brow said: I'm the opposite of this. A long run done early evening once I've had food and a shite. Always get caught out if I run early doors. I tend to run about 100km a month, I like entering ultra races that encompass bikes and running, last one was Quest24 on the Western Atlantic Way in Ireland, where they filmed Luke Skywalkers house in the new Star Wars film. Took me 21 hours to do 240k & the last leg was a trail marathon that I ran in the complete dark & the second leg was over Ireland tallest mountain. Sounds horrific, and it was, but Id rather that than some boring arse city marathon where I'd lose my mind. Ultras are basically a matter of mind over your body - I'd go as far to say that anyone reading this can do a marathon tomorrow - barring injury. You just may not be that fast, which theres no shame in. Anyway, back to training. Today I done a 10k, 5 mins rest, 5k. Tomorrow I'll probably do a 3-4k 'sprint' then I'll have a day off. you sound like you're already training fine i'd just throw in some brick runs. Again, its mind over matter with the long distances. I always have to spend at least an hour psyching myself up and I have to keep running away from the house, or else I'd just find it too easy to come back. I am the exact same with the long runs. So easy to give in but the body always had that extra edge to get you through it if you can fight your own mind in it. The shorter fast runs actually take more out of me long term. Muscle aches and that. Looking to do a 20k next week. Are those energy gels worth the money? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
The Brow Posted May 12, 2020 Share Posted May 12, 2020 48 minutes ago, AlimOzturk said: I am the exact same with the long runs. So easy to give in but the body always had that extra edge to get you through it if you can fight your own mind in it. The shorter fast runs actually take more out of me long term. Muscle aches and that. Looking to do a 20k next week. Are those energy gels worth the money? I normally use some tailwind if I'm doing over 10k. Just powder in water. The gels I've used have been ok, I like Maurtens stuff but its pricey. Some gels will also give you the shits so its trial an error. For the ultras I tend to eat bakewell tarts. Fill my pockets with them, delicious. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Tazio Posted May 12, 2020 Share Posted May 12, 2020 33 minutes ago, The Brow said: I normally use some tailwind if I'm doing over 10k. Just powder in water. The gels I've used have been ok, I like Maurtens stuff but its pricey. Some gels will also give you the shits so its trial an error. For the ultras I tend to eat bakewell tarts. Fill my pockets with them, delicious. Sports nutrition is a strange one, for all the tech food wise in cycling and riders using gels most of them have their own choice of food in their bidons at the food stations. And a large percentage of them have things like ham sandwiches and cake. Basically things with a mix of carbs and full on sugars. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
The Brow Posted May 12, 2020 Share Posted May 12, 2020 1 minute ago, Tazio said: Sports nutrition is a strange one, for all the tech food wise in cycling and riders using gels most of them have their own choice of food in their bidons at the food stations. And a large percentage of them have things like ham sandwiches and cake. Basically things with a mix of carbs and full on sugars. When youre absolutely ****ed, a nice cake or a sandwich is lovely. Today I had a mini pork pie during my rest between 10k & 5k. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
AlimOzturk Posted May 12, 2020 Author Share Posted May 12, 2020 Going to invest in one of those rehydration vests in think with the pockets for water and small back pack for snacks and to keep phone and keys for the really long runs. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Tazio Posted May 12, 2020 Share Posted May 12, 2020 54 minutes ago, The Brow said: When youre absolutely ****ed, a nice cake or a sandwich is lovely. Today I had a mini pork pie during my rest between 10k & 5k. Haribo is the classic choice on long mountain bike rides. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Tazio Posted May 12, 2020 Share Posted May 12, 2020 8 minutes ago, AlimOzturk said: Going to invest in one of those rehydration vests in think with the pockets for water and small back pack for snacks and to keep phone and keys for the really long runs. Check out cycling camelbacks, I’ve got a super lightweight one that holds about 1.5l of water and enough space for keys, phone, basic tools, etc. It’s an Edinburgh Cycle Cooperative own brand and didn’t cost much, very light and could easily be used for running. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
muldoon74 Posted May 13, 2020 Share Posted May 13, 2020 To improve distance ability and fitness don't overlook sprint training, even weight training. Basically there are 2 types of muscle fibre, 1 and 2 (keeping it simple as there are two types of type 2. ) type 1 is your long/slow twitch fibres used for endurance, type 2 short/fast twitch for explosive power such as sprinting or lifting. Training type 2 increases bodys' ability to remove lactic acid from muscle groups therefore increasing ability of type 1 to do its job of endurance more comfortably and for longer. A session a week of HIIT involving power skipping, hill sprints or lamp post fartlekking will pay dividends down the line if you are looking to get back into the world of organised runs, and PBs.. Also, mix your training up every few, weeks. The body gets used to routine, you have to shock change into it. Regarding gels etc, I've never been into them. I found when I used to do a lot of hillwalking and training in the army that a big bag of wine gums, haribo, liquorice allsorts, jaffa cakes was a must. Still is, when I manage to get out! As mentioned earlier, drink loads of water. If you feel thirsty, you're already dehydrated and your performance is, suffering. I don't know about the vest you're talking about but personally I'd go for a bum bag (for goodies) with an extra water bottle and pouch and perhaps a camel back type backpack? Simple and reasonable cheap. Energy drinks aren't really worth much regarding performance enhancement. There isn't enough caffeine in them to get the desired effect of increased central nervous system activity. Sugar wise they're similar to normal cola. If you watch the tour de France when competitors come to a big hill or a, sprint, when they take a drink these days it's usually cola they're drinking. Quick sugar hit, get thrm up the hill. Fancy cocktails of sugar, caffeine and guarana etc are for sponsorship money and free badges. Hope at least some of this helps, good luck and most importantly enjoy your running, otherwise what's the point? 😉 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
The Brow Posted May 13, 2020 Share Posted May 13, 2020 7 minutes ago, muldoon74 said: Energy drinks aren't really worth much regarding performance enhancement. There isn't enough caffeine in them to get the desired effect of increased central nervous system activity. Sugar wise they're similar to normal cola. If you watch the tour de France when competitors come to a big hill or a, sprint, when they take a drink these days it's usually cola they're drinking. Quick sugar hit, get thrm up the hill. Fancy cocktails of sugar, caffeine and guarana etc are for sponsorship money and free badges. If youre cracking on for a few hours you'll be wanting something like Tailwind or Maurten. They're not sugary energy drinks, theyre about 300 cals a bottle. Ive done probably 6-7 ultras now and they are absolute lifesavers. Tour De France guys are drinking about between 500 -1000ml per hour of electrolytes, not sure the OP as meaning as a short term boost if hes want to clock up 20km+. https://www.maurten.com/products/drink-mix-320 I use this a lot, its kept me going for 5 hours + on more than one occasion. Normally try to take on couple hundred cals every hour (depending on how fast and far youre going). Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
muldoon74 Posted May 13, 2020 Share Posted May 13, 2020 The stuff your talking about appears (from quick bit googling and reading there bumph) to be more longer chain carbohydrate as opposed to purely sugar, although a big part of the maurtens is fructose, worse for the body than sucrose. (but I suspect the quantities used in a race/run will not have any adverse effects.) When I'm able to get back into doing some distance I may give them a try, although at 45euros a box it's an expensive try! I think it comes, down to if you find something that helps, stick with it. If it works for you, that's what matters. I've had it in my head to do at least the Devil o the Highlands before I'm 50. Regular marathons don't give me that feeling of wanting to accomplish although I know I have to do at least 2 I think to qualify for the DotH. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
ri Alban Posted May 13, 2020 Share Posted May 13, 2020 10 hours ago, The Brow said: I'm the opposite of this. A long run done early evening once I've had food and a shite. Always get caught out if I run early doors. I tend to run about 100km a month, I like entering ultra races that encompass bikes and running, last one was Quest24 on the Western Atlantic Way in Ireland, where they filmed Luke Skywalkers house in the new Star Wars film. Took me 21 hours to do 240k & the last leg was a trail marathon that I ran in the complete dark & the second leg was over Ireland tallest mountain. Sounds horrific, and it was, but Id rather that than some boring arse city marathon where I'd lose my mind. Ultras are basically a matter of mind over your body - I'd go as far to say that anyone reading this can do a marathon tomorrow - barring injury. You just may not be that fast, which theres no shame in. Anyway, back to training. Today I done a 10k, 5 mins rest, 5k. Tomorrow I'll probably do a 3-4k 'sprint' then I'll have a day off. you sound like you're already training fine i'd just throw in some brick runs. Again, its mind over matter with the long distances. I always have to spend at least an hour psyching myself up and I have to keep running away from the house, or else I'd just find it too easy to come back. Always after a shite is the key. As for early doors. I always feel too tired after eating and tend to lose motivation the longer the day goes. If I was Alim I'd listen to your advice, as I didn't't do nearly as much running as yourself. 👍 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
The Brow Posted May 13, 2020 Share Posted May 13, 2020 4 hours ago, muldoon74 said: I think it comes, down to if you find something that helps, stick with it. If it works for you, that's what matters. I've had it in my head to do at least the Devil o the Highlands before I'm 50. Regular marathons don't give me that feeling of wanting to accomplish although I know I have to do at least 2 I think to qualify for the DotH. I cannot agree more with this. Find what works and thats that! Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
ri Alban Posted May 13, 2020 Share Posted May 13, 2020 Amen! ^^^ Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Alan_R Posted May 13, 2020 Share Posted May 13, 2020 13 hours ago, AlimOzturk said: Looking to do a 20k next week. Are those energy gels worth the money? You may have seen me ask similiar questions on fitness thread and others. So im far from an expert but im pretty similiar situation to you in that ive been knocking out 5 and 10km fairly regular. Done my first 20km on sunday. Didnt need any gels or anything. I imagine if you intend to go further then a wee boost would be needed. Apparently dried dates also good. So far ive not needed to carry any supplies but guess everyone different. Im different from you in the sense there is very little between my jogging pace and sprinting. Im just a slow plodder but as my fitness increases i have been trying to go harder. I find longer distances at steady pace suit me. Shorter bursts at speed less so. Which is probably detrimental to my personal goal of weight loss. But im sticking with it because i enjoy running and hope speed will come as weight slowly drops. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Alan_R Posted May 13, 2020 Share Posted May 13, 2020 15 hours ago, The Brow said: I'm the opposite of this. A long run done early evening once I've had food and a shite. Always get caught out if I run early doors. I tend to run about 100km a month, I like entering ultra races that encompass bikes and running, last one was Quest24 on the Western Atlantic Way in Ireland, where they filmed Luke Skywalkers house in the new Star Wars film. Took me 21 hours to do 240k & the last leg was a trail marathon that I ran in the complete dark & the second leg was over Ireland tallest mountain. Sounds horrific, and it was, but Id rather that than some boring arse city marathon where I'd lose my mind. Ultras are basically a matter of mind over your body - I'd go as far to say that anyone reading this can do a marathon tomorrow - barring injury. You just may not be that fast, which theres no shame in. Anyway, back to training. Today I done a 10k, 5 mins rest, 5k. Tomorrow I'll probably do a 3-4k 'sprint' then I'll have a day off. you sound like you're already training fine i'd just throw in some brick runs. Again, its mind over matter with the long distances. I always have to spend at least an hour psyching myself up and I have to keep running away from the house, or else I'd just find it too easy to come back. 21 hours non stop? Or are sections spread over a few days? Sounds mental. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
The Brow Posted May 13, 2020 Share Posted May 13, 2020 4 minutes ago, Alan_R said: 21 hours non stop? Or are sections spread over a few days? Sounds mental. Non stop. You get to ride a bike as well mind, but it was hilly as ****. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
AlimOzturk Posted May 13, 2020 Author Share Posted May 13, 2020 10k in 62 mins today. First 5k in 25 mins tired for the final 5k. Annoying but steady progress all the time. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
ri Alban Posted May 13, 2020 Share Posted May 13, 2020 1 hour ago, AlimOzturk said: 10k in 62 mins today. First 5k in 25 mins tired for the final 5k. Annoying but steady progress all the time. 🎆 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Taffin Posted May 13, 2020 Share Posted May 13, 2020 (edited) 8 hours ago, AlimOzturk said: 10k in 62 mins today. First 5k in 25 mins tired for the final 5k. Annoying but steady progress all the time. Nice one 👍 If you don't mind me offering some advice, I'd suggest next time out you try and hit the 5k at 5m30 pace then drop to 6min pace until the final km and then just try and run that as fast as you can. Should get you in comfortably under the hour. I used to be decentish at 10k but stopped for ages last year and I'm trying to get back into it now but was going hell for leather in the first 5k then falling off a cliff. Consciously slowing my first 5 a bit then ease off and come in fast took me from 58ish a couple of weeks back to 53ish the next time out doing the above but using 5/530. Edited May 13, 2020 by Taffin Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
ri Alban Posted May 14, 2020 Share Posted May 14, 2020 (edited) 5 hours ago, Taffin said: Nice one 👍 If you don't mind me offering some advice, I'd suggest next time out you try and hit the 5k at 5m30 pace then drop to 6min pace until the final km and then just try and run that as fast as you can. Should get you in comfortably under the hour. I used to be decentish at 10k but stopped for ages last year and I'm trying to get back into it now but was going hell for leather in the first 5k then falling off a cliff. Consciously slowing my first 5 a bit then ease off and come in fast took me from 58ish a couple of weeks back to 53ish the next time out doing the above but using 5/530. Do the run in the other direction, just to make sure inclines aren't an issue. A wee average or comparison is good for the soul. Also gives you options and Personal bests to beat. Even throw in a wee running track now and then. Edited May 14, 2020 by ri Alban Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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