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Wage cut for players and staff (Statement on 24/4)

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Lord BJ

It’s not surprising in the slightest. Businesses across the country are facing similar issues. It’s not rocket science, we have no income yet the same outgoings. That’s not sustainable unless your are massively cash rich and we are not that. 

 

Hopefully this clears up quickly and we’re back to discussing football. 
 

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Sir Gio
Just now, hmfc_liam06 said:

 

I'd rather there was no redundancies at any level at the club than getting £50 back from missed season ticket games.

I was being facetious  :)

 

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Irufushi

Clever move by the club, best doing it now than in a few months. 

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Legend Claws
31 minutes ago, Jamie86 said:

I'm surprised that they had to be asked. Surely some of the higher earners could have got together and came to a decision about this. Yea they might not be on hundreds of thousands a week but I'm sure someone of 5k could survive dropping to 3k a week. And let's not turn this into a "some business woman she is". Every club will be feeling the strain from no income for months on end whilst still having overheads to pay. No one saw this coming and we won't be the first club to do this

Have you ever gone to a boss and said 'pay me half please?'

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Last Laff
3 minutes ago, Barack said:

There's only Celtic realistically who can cope with an extended break, due to cash reserves.

 

Dundee United fans can't be confident. They've massively overspent, for example. St. Johnstone have admitted they've overstretched this year too, and were happy to limp on to the end of the year, and re-evaluate the squad.

 

That was before Coronavirus. They've no money.


For Celtic at the top of the ladder I can’t see us being anywhere but near the bottom considering the benefactors ploughing money in previously and we most budget a lot on match day and other corporate events.  Nobody can be blamed for this though, we’ve obviously budgeted to the season end and beyond before this.  With no income and a huge spend on wages this is seriously but not through negligence.

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Holyrood_Hearts
6 minutes ago, lsimp77 said:

Ann Budge, her family and her helpers have slowly, little by little, ruined our club. We have become a national laughing stock. She will forever be known as the woman who killed Heart Of Midlothian. This is just the beginning unfortunately. 

**** off. That’s absolute rubbish 

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Paolo
Posted (edited)
5 minutes ago, Last Laff said:


Players won’t have to do anything, they could accept a cut or agree to leave.  If they don’t you can’t just sack them in contract. 

That is a good point.  They could decline both options.  As could all staff. We can’t sack them for doing so.   Without admin, even redundancy may not be an option, as you can’t make a person redundant, just the role, and now this request has been made, it is hard to say you are making the role redundant.  An employment lawyer would be delighted to take the case on. 

Edited by Paolo

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OTT
Just now, Bongo 1874 said:

Wouldn't be a bad time for the likes of Levein and Macphee, to waive the rest of their contracts away for the good of this club. 

 

Exactly. 

 

Feel for the office staff though, after Vlad this was probably the last thing they expected to experience again. 

 

If a few of the wasters in the first team felt so aggrieved then I'd totally understand if they wanted to leave. Added bonus is that saving 100% on their wage would mean the burden on the other staff might be reduced a bit.

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Gambo

There will be many clubs who will struggle to pay 50% imo.

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Sir Gio
1 minute ago, Lord BJ said:

It’s not surprising in the slightest. Businesses across the country are facing similar issues. It’s not rocket science, we have no income yet the same outgoings. That’s not sustainable unless your are massively cash rich and we are not that. 

 

Hopefully this clears up quickly and we’re back to discussing football. 
 

Instead of blaming her for business mismanagement,  blame her for throwing money at the players without reward except in cup competitions 

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Mikey1874
38 minutes ago, Famous 1874 said:

If only we didn’t overspent on the new stand by about 12 million

 

We'd have players on higher wages

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The Old Tolbooth
15 minutes ago, kila said:

Desperate times.

 

Budge also said fan ownership likely to be delayed so FoH money will help running costs. I am OK with that, especially if high earning players are on a reduced salary. I do not want the lower end employees to get their salary reduced though.

 

Will we see Levein give up his remaining salary being one of the highest earners?

 


Absolutely agree with you about the lower end employees not having to suffer a wage cut unless they absolutely have to, surely the players taking a 50% wage cut will account for around 95% of the wage cuts. 

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Dannie Boy
Posted (edited)

There is no mismanagement.
We have people employed with no guarantee of income to meet the wage demands for the foreseeable future. Anyone with a business brain would know we need react now to ensure as far as possible that we can survive for as long as possible. 

This step is the best way forward. 
 

Here’s a question for FoH pledgers.

If you lose your job or business or the money coming in drys up will you or can you continue to pledge every month? 
Give it a month and watch out for pledges being cancelled as the finances dry up. 
it’s not what I want but it’s a reality. 

Edited by Dannie Boy

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HeartOfWestLothian

Worrying. Very worrying. 

 

Sadly most of our fans have been more concerned about the finances of the rangers to realise where we are.

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Apache Mal

The club makes money from match day revenue and generates a lot of income from hospitality and events. This is a sound plan in normal circumstances. These aren’t normal circumstances so I think Budge deserves a bit of a break here. 

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Jamboelite
1 minute ago, Paolo said:

That is a good point.  They could decline both options.  As could all staff. We can’t sack them for doing so.  

Then redundancy follows.

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Jamie86
2 minutes ago, Legend Claws said:

Have you ever gone to a boss and said 'pay me half please?'

Have I ever been on 5k a week, saw the business getting zero income, probably won't get any for 5 month's and go to sleep easy? No I haven't but if they had any balls about them then they would go off their own back. It might buy them some credit with the fans. 

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Paolo
Just now, Jamboelite said:

Then redundancy follows.

I have since edited my post.  That could be disputed. 

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Jamboelite
1 minute ago, HeartOfWestLothian said:

Worrying. Very worrying. 

 

Sadly most of our fans have been more concerned about the finances of the rangers to realise where we are.

They all come out the woodwork....

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Sir Gio
Just now, Dannie Boy said:

There is no mismanagement.
We have people employed with guarantee of income to meet the wage demands for the foreseeable future. Anyone with a business brain would know we need react now to ensure as far as possible that we can survive for as long as possible. 

This step is the best way forward. 
 

Here’s a question for FoH pledgers.

If you lose your job or business or the money coming in drys up will you or can you continue to pledge every month? 
Give it a month and watch out for pledges being cancelled as the finances dry up. 
it’s not what I want but it’s a reality. 

This is it Dannie.

 

Chap at work his brother has been told to go home indefinitely on no pay.

 

Cancelled everything he could 

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Stendelsarmy
3 minutes ago, HeartOfWestLothian said:

Worrying. Very worrying. 

 

Sadly most of our fans have been more concerned about the finances of the rangers to realise where we are.

Imagine the embarrassment if they outlive us

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Mister Dee

I’m hoping everyone understands how serious the health situation is. 
 

I work in the NHS, & was at a very somber meeting today, hearing harrowing accounts of the lockdown in Italy. 
Until an effective anti viral medication can be found and distributed, or a vaccine created, it’s hard to see how life can go back to normal anytime soon. 

Personally, I’d be surprised if we get sport going safely again this year, which means professional sport could well be finished in it’s current form.  

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Sir Gio
Just now, Paolo said:

I have since edited my post.  That could be disputed. 

No football to play before August,  quite a saving to be made zero risk on 13 out of contract players some of whom thankfully will never play for Hearts again 

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kila

Need the government to sort out universal basic income.

 

I really disagree with splitting the salary of the lowest earners while the highest earners will still enjoy a reasonable pay packet at 50%.

 

If FoH money is going to help plug the hole, I'd rather it helped the most needy at the club.

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hmfc_liam06

I'm really struggling what folk are failing to grasp here.

 

We have next to no income over the short term, possibly til the end of the summer.

 

There isn't a club in Scotland, outwith Celtic, who can afford to pay potentially millions in wages while receiving no income.

 

All AB is doing is ensuring we don't run into any difficulties over this period. 

 

She should be commended for looking after the club but no, the usual are out in force, getting their pants wet again and blaming everything on big bad Budge and Levein.

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Holyrood_Hearts
1 minute ago, Jamie86 said:

Have I ever been on 5k a week, saw the business getting zero income, probably won't get any for 5 month's and go to sleep easy? No I haven't but if they had any balls about them then they would go off their own back. It might buy them some credit with the fans. 

Im sorry but as they are employees of the club they wouldn’t voluntarily offer a wage reduction. 
 

We all have a cost of living based on our income & if that reduces it can have a big impact. 

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Paolo
Just now, Sir Gio said:

No football to play before August,  quite a saving to be made zero risk on 13 out of contract players some of whom thankfully will never play for Hearts again 

Quite a saving indeed, but only if they take the cut option, or the termination one. 

 

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Shanks

So if someone like Hickey doesn't accept a 50% wage reduction then we are going to let him just walk away from his contract at the club? 

 

****.

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Slim1874

Don't if this has been mentioned but other clubs will be in the same position and will not be wanting addition overheads/wages for new players, so would the players not be better with 50% of their wages rather than 0%

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NB GIN

9 million raised by Us and we are the first club in financial turmoil, how badly are we run !!

Craig levein And  budge have simply been a disaster for this club 


Honestly can’t believe this 

 

 

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Koolkeith
15 minutes ago, Sir Gio said:

Really?

 

500k lost, temporarily from Scottish Cup ACHIEVEMENT 

We should have plenty money in reserve but she’s spunked it all on one stand and a shite playing squad.

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Morph
39 minutes ago, Sertse said:

https://www.heartsfc.co.uk/news/article/club-statement-1-2-3-4-5-6

 

Guess we'll see who actually cares for the club and who's after their pay packet!

It’s an absolute disgrace that our club is asking staff to take a wage cut regardless of what level they’re at. 

 

Anyone slating staff for not taking a cut needs to have a long look at themselves. 

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hmfc_liam06
Just now, Slim1874 said:

Don't if this has been mentioned but other clubs will be in the same position and will not be wanting addition overheads/wages for new players, so would the players not be better with 50% of their wages rather than 0%

 

No one is going to be signing players just now so they either accept 50% or take 0.

 

It's not like we have Messi on our books and would be snapped up :lol:

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lsimp77

Folk trusting a woman who overspent £12million on the main stand that still hasn’t been competed 3 years after it was opened and has royally ****ed up on all football based decisions in the last 4 years? 

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Legend Claws

This is called making moves in order to survive. I'm doing it right now with my businesses. I've had to permanently shut one down today. If Hearts don't this then they worst scenario could easily happen.

 

This isn't down to Anne Budge, it's down to a situation none of us have any control over and the likes of which we've never seen. I applaud her for getting this done early. The majority of clubs will follow, and may not even be offering 50%. We are financially strong in comparison to many. 

 

How else can you handle the simple equation of plenty of outgoings Vs next to zero income. Anyone who can't get their head round that must struggle to get through a day. 

 

Instead of being brutally negative, why not be realistic?

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Lord BJ
5 minutes ago, Sir Gio said:

Instead of blaming her for business mismanagement,  blame her for throwing money at the players without reward except in cup competitions 


I’m not blaming her for anything, well not on this thread. Not sure why you think I am. 🤷🏻‍♂️
 

Albeit, I do wonder if hearts are maybe hit a bit harder as we employ a lot of staff directly. Other clubs may contract a lot of their services, making it easy to reduce costs. 
 

We won’t be the only club/business facing these issues because of Coronavirus, 

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Austin MacGlee
49 minutes ago, robbo1874 said:

Don't know if it's us just taking a sensible approach or if it's a bit worrying. We can't be the only ones with cash flow problems surely

This is where I am...

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Koolkeith
3 minutes ago, hmfc_liam06 said:

I'm really struggling what folk are failing to grasp here.

 

We have next to no income over the short term, possibly til the end of the summer.

 

There isn't a club in Scotland, outwith Celtic, who can afford to pay potentially millions in wages while receiving no income.

 

All AB is doing is ensuring we don't run into any difficulties over this period. 

 

She should be commended for looking after the club but no, the usual are out in force, getting their pants wet again and blaming everything on big bad Budge and Levein.

It’s a bit of both in my opinion.

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1971fozzy

We’re no different than any other business.  No income means big trouble. Look at restaurants, cinemas, pubs etc etc.

fully expect many clubs to follow suit

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soonbe110
56 minutes ago, Barack said:

Admin mark 2 will make it easier for the Spfl to make a decision.

 

If we are doing this. What position are other's in too...?

 

Some must be worse.

Indeed. It’s season ticket time for every club and all of them plan for a large intake of money during the March-June timeframe. Not going to happen. On top of that no further income from last two months of this season.  Tough situation and no-one could have seen it coming tbh. 

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Last Laff
2 minutes ago, Slim1874 said:

Don't if this has been mentioned but other clubs will be in the same position and will not be wanting addition overheads/wages for new players, so would the players not be better with 50% of their wages rather than 0%


Other clubs don’t have the same expenditure so it probably won’t be as extreme.  Wonder if Aberdeen’s investors might be feeling the pinch? 

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Holyrood_Hearts
29 minutes ago, Martin_T said:

It's simple, insolvency occurs when costs exceed income, not necessarily debt in itself.

 

Hearts probably budget for season ticket income in late March/ early April. With uncertainty about income, the choice becomes either take out credit or reduce costs.

 

The players have no where to go at the moment as no other club will recruit them as they are in the same circumstances.

Spot on, it’s a simple concept that’s been missed by so many on this thread. The club has bills to pay in times when it’s not got a regular natural income & no timescale as too when it will. With the UK on the brink of a possible lockdown, what do people suggest the club does in such times? If these measures are taken to help insure we’re fine long-term then so be it

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Kalamazoo Jambo

Do people really think that other clubs aren't going to be doing similar things in the coming days and weeks? We're just the first out of the gate.

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soonbe110
44 minutes ago, Baxfee said:

Arseholes on this thread. 

Sadly, lots of them 

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Last Laff
1 minute ago, hmfc_liam06 said:

 

No one is going to be signing players just now so they either accept 50% or take 0.

 

It's not like we have Messi on our books and would be snapped up :lol:


Or they can simply say no thanks and not moving and still get 100% of wages?
It’s not one or the other. 

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Footballfirst

The club budgeted £9m for wages in the current financial year.  That is £750k a month or £173k a week, so you can see the level of cuts being proposed.

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Sir Gio
6 minutes ago, Mister Dee said:

I’m hoping everyone understands how serious the health situation is. 
 

I work in the NHS, & was at a very somber meeting today, hearing harrowing accounts of the lockdown in Italy. 
Until an effective anti viral medication can be found and distributed, or a vaccine created, it’s hard to see how life can go back to normal anytime soon. 

Personally, I’d be surprised if we get sport going safely again this year, which means professional sport could well be finished in it’s current form.  

I think everyone gets it we really do.

 

The by product of protecting the Health Services is going to break and likely kill many people too.

 

Rock and a hard place humanitarian catastrophe 

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Legend Claws
9 minutes ago, Jamie86 said:

Have I ever been on 5k a week, saw the business getting zero income, probably won't get any for 5 month's and go to sleep easy? No I haven't but if they had any balls about them then they would go off their own back. It might buy them some credit with the fans. 

 

People tend to live by their means. If you earn 5k a week, your financial commitments likely reflect that. It's all relative. Yes, if they care, they should accept the 50%, but volunteering to do it en-masse? No.

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soonbe110
42 minutes ago, busby1985 said:

I did say we should stop laughing at possible points deductions for clubs going into admin. I was told to I was over thinking it. We seem to be in big trouble. 

No more than any other club. Just that we are first to go public re the implications of what’s happening. Wouldn’t be surprised if we are in much better shape than most. 

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Stone1992
2 minutes ago, Morph said:

It’s an absolute disgrace that our club is asking staff to take a wage cut regardless of what level they’re at. 

 

Anyone slating staff for not taking a cut needs to have a long look at themselves. 

Aye a disgrace a business is trying to cut costs to survive due to a global pandemic. 

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