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Season Ticket Sales - over 12,500 sold so far (title updated)

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davemclaren
9 minutes ago, i wish jj was my dad said:

If you think that something untoward is going on that has passed the board and shareholders by at the AGM then spit it out or it can be filed in the same place as the snide innuendo about her relationship with Levein

It was mentioned and discussed at the last agm without any dissent. 

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Enzo Chiefo
1 minute ago, graygo said:

 

We brought in 20 players? How many went the other way?

Just so we can cut through the hyperbole.

No hyperbole, just facts. I'm specifically referring to changes, whether in or out, with no, if any, improvement from the previous season. Contrast that with Killie who, since the day that Steve Clarke took over, only minimal changes have been made. Only 1 player has left the club since then, Gordon Greer, and that was a retirement.  Look at the success of both clubs over the 2 seasons and you will see which policy is more effective 

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Boab
5 minutes ago, Enzo Chiefo said:

No hyperbole, just facts. I'm specifically referring to changes, whether in or out, with no, if any, improvement from the previous season. Contrast that with Killie who, since the day that Steve Clarke took over, only minimal changes have been made. Only 1 player has left the club since then, Gordon Greer, and that was a retirement.  Look at the success of both clubs over the 2 seasons and you will see which policy is more effective 

  This is where the arguments start though, Enzo, as people disagree on the definition of success !

What is success ? What have Killie succeeded in ? Is it, for a club their size, they’re punching above their weight ? 

If we win the Cup, that success will far exceed what Killie have done, imo. 

Can we even compare the clubs to come up with an answer ?

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graygo
3 minutes ago, Enzo Chiefo said:

No hyperbole, just facts. I'm specifically referring to changes, whether in or out, with no, if any, improvement from the previous season. Contrast that with Killie who, since the day that Steve Clarke took over, only minimal changes have been made. Only 1 player has left the club since then, Gordon Greer, and that was a retirement.  Look at the success of both clubs over the 2 seasons and you will see which policy is more effective 

 

Aye we get it, Kilmarnock have had a better season than us.

I don't think anyone has said differently.

 

The bit in bold, that's just not true is it? They may not have released many players but that's what happens when you rely on loans, how many players have left because their loan deal has ended? Let me know the answer to that and then we can discuss this minimal changes thing.

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i wish jj was my dad
16 minutes ago, davemclaren said:

It was mentioned and discussed at the last agm without any dissent. 

By 'without any dissent' do you mean that there was nothing underhand suggested? 

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Enzo Chiefo
1 minute ago, graygo said:

 

Aye we get it, Kilmarnock have had a better season than us.

I don't think anyone has said differently.

 

The bit in bold, that's just not true is it? They may not have released many players but that's what happens when you rely on loans, how many players have left because their loan deal has ended? Let me know the answer to that and then we can discuss this minimal changes thing.

Maybe clumsily worded so: of the team that started in Lee McCulloch's last game, only one player is no longer at the club. That is a fact. There is nothing to debate about changes because our changes, in/out, loans, the "cold shouldered brigade" is far, far higher than Killie. That, also, is a fact. 

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davemclaren
4 minutes ago, i wish jj was my dad said:

By 'without any dissent' do you mean that there was nothing underhand suggested? 

Certainly not raised by the attending shareholders. 

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i wish jj was my dad
Just now, davemclaren said:

Certainly not raised by the attending shareholders. 

Thanks, Dave.  So that suggests  it can safely be filed under the rest of the snide innuendo unless something substantive can be put to the board. 

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graygo
3 minutes ago, Enzo Chiefo said:

Maybe clumsily worded so: of the team that started in Lee McCulloch's last game, only one player is no longer at the club. That is a fact. There is nothing to debate about changes because our changes, in/out, loans, the "cold shouldered brigade" is far, far higher than Killie. That, also, is a fact. 

 

That's not clumsily worded, it's completely wrong and you know it.

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davemclaren
Just now, i wish jj was my dad said:

Thanks, Dave.  So that suggests  it can safely be filed under the rest of the snide innuendo unless something substantive can be put to the board. 

If there was any hard evidence of anything untoward the other directors could be held liable for going along with the arrangement. 

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i wish jj was my dad
2 minutes ago, davemclaren said:

If there was any hard evidence of anything untoward the other directors could be held liable for going along with the arrangement. 

Indeed. 

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Enzo Chiefo
7 minutes ago, Boab said:

  This is where the arguments start though, Enzo, as people disagree on the definition of success !

What is success ? What have Killie succeeded in ? Is it, for a club their size, they’re punching above their weight ? 

If we win the Cup, that success will far exceed what Killie have done, imo. 

Can we even compare the clubs to come up with an answer ?

True Boab. Winning a Cup is always welcome and, for a club like ours, represents success.  But getting to the final, given the draw we had, will not represent success imo. Had we drawn Rangers at home, for example, we would have been out.Any SPL team, with the draw we had, would be in that final, apart from Livvy. Having said that, you can only deal with the draw you are given. Inverness and Ross County both won trophies in the last few years and their managers were sacked not long after.  So, real progress has to be measured through the league position, the style of play, the number of youngsters coming through etc.

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Enzo Chiefo
5 minutes ago, graygo said:

 

That's not clumsily worded, it's completely wrong and you know it.

Clumsily worded, but the fact still stands. Killie's team on Sun will not be far removed from the one he selected on Day 1. Consistency of selection, getting the best out of players and a club with very little money to aquire players. Is that clearer ?

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stan
23 hours ago, Enzo Chiefo said:

As was the case when Cathro was dismissed? If we knew we would have to endure 2 years of Levein then we would have been aswell giving Cathro more time. At least he wanted to adopt a passing game and may well have got it right after a couple of transfer windows.  

He'd maybe have got it right when we'd reached League 1, not confident of that though.

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davemclaren
6 minutes ago, Enzo Chiefo said:

True Boab. Winning a Cup is always welcome and, for a club like ours, represents success.  But getting to the final, given the draw we had, will not represent success imo. Had we drawn Rangers at home, for example, we would have been out.Any SPL team, with the draw we had, would be in that final, apart from Livvy. Having said that, you can only deal with the draw you are given. Inverness and Ross County both won trophies in the last few years and their managers were sacked not long after.  So, real progress has to be measured through the league position, the style of play, the number of youngsters coming through etc.

Why apart from Livvy, given they are better than several other spl teams? 

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Pasquale for King
4 hours ago, luckydug said:

Don't be a coward .

Say what you mean.

I already did ?

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Pasquale for King
8 minutes ago, Enzo Chiefo said:

True Boab. Winning a Cup is always welcome and, for a club like ours, represents success.  But getting to the final, given the draw we had, will not represent success imo. Had we drawn Rangers at home, for example, we would have been out.Any SPL team, with the draw we had, would be in that final, apart from Livvy. Having said that, you can only deal with the draw you are given. Inverness and Ross County both won trophies in the last few years and their managers were sacked not long after.  So, real progress has to be measured through the league position, the style of play, the number of youngsters coming through etc.

As did Sergio and Ivanauskas 

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graygo
Just now, Enzo Chiefo said:

Clumsily worded, but the fact still stands. Killie's team on Sun will not be far removed from the one he selected on Day 1. Consistency of selection, getting the best out of players and a club with very little money to aquire players. Is that clearer ?

 

"of the team that started in Lee McCulloch's last game, only one player is no longer at the club. That is a fact."

 

You mentioned Gordon Greer.

 

Lee Erwin played as the main striker in Lee McCulloch's last game, he now plays in Iran of all places.

 

That is a fact and renders anything else you claim dubious at the very least.

 

 

 

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Pasquale for King
18 hours ago, soonbe110 said:

I can’t find Burleys name on the roll of honour for Hearts cup-winning managers. 

My point was really getting at you can’t really really use a 9 game management cameo as a comparison for anything especially given we were illegally signing players that were the best quality we have had in last 30-40 years. 

It wasn’t illegal ffs 

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Pasquale for King
5 hours ago, soonbe110 said:

Was there a tendering process or did she just give him the job? Did his company do all the work? 

Yes there was and she chose his bid. All the work? It’s not finished.

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Pasquale for King
3 hours ago, Paulp74 said:

I agree with you. I had a season ticket for 10 seasons but didn't renew last season as the games have been dull for a few seasons now, and won't be getting one this season either.  However, I still probably went to around 10 home games last season. 

 

Re Ann budge, she only has one year left so will she be bothered with the hassle of making wholesale changes or stick with the easy option of keeping levein and co for another season? My guess is the latter.

I think what happens with Levein over the summer will decide whether she stays on for longer than that year.

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Pasquale for King
57 minutes ago, i wish jj was my dad said:

If you think that something untoward is going on that has passed the board and shareholders by at the AGM then spit it out or it can be filed in the same place as the snide innuendo about her relationship with Levein

I simply meant, sorry if it wasn’t clear enough for you, that on the surface it could be seen as not being the most ethical thing to do.

No innuendo, just an observation that for some reason you want to make a big deal of.  

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Pasquale for King
57 minutes ago, graygo said:

 

We brought in 20 players? How many went the other way?

Just so we can cut through the hyperbole.

10

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Debut 4
15 minutes ago, Pasquale for King said:

It wasn’t illegal ffs 

The ‘illegal’ team had 7 Scottish players (none bought that summer) start for Hearts in the first two games of that season.

 

Probably stayed similar for most part which I can’t remember off the top of my head right now. But I had a quick check of first couple of matches. 

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Pasquale for King
3 minutes ago, Debut 4 said:

The ‘illegal’ team had 7 Scottish players (none bought that summer) start for Hearts in the first two games of that season.

 

Probably stayed similar for most part which I can’t remember off the top of my head right now. But I had a quick check of first couple of matches. 

Indeed it did, it’s not illegal to pay players more than you can afford as most clubs do it. It sounded like a Hibs term to me.

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Boab
34 minutes ago, Enzo Chiefo said:

True Boab. Winning a Cup is always welcome and, for a club like ours, represents success.  But getting to the final, given the draw we had, will not represent success imo. Had we drawn Rangers at home, for example, we would have been out.Any SPL team, with the draw we had, would be in that final, apart from Livvy. Having said that, you can only deal with the draw you are given. Inverness and Ross County both won trophies in the last few years and their managers were sacked not long after.  So, real progress has to be measured through the league position, the style of play, the number of youngsters coming through etc.

 

So if Killie finish 4th this season and, say, 5th or 6th next season, with no headway in either of the cups, will Clarke’s tenure be looked at as successful ? Or if he doesn’t better 4th in the next two, should he be gone ?

Maybe we shouldn’t be comparing at all as it wasn’t that long ago that Wright at St Johnstone was the guy used as an example of good management. I feel Clarke may be the same unless he goes !

 

 

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Enzo Chiefo
9 minutes ago, Boab said:

 

So if Killie finish 4th this season and, say, 5th or 6th next season, with no headway in either of the cups, will Clarke’s tenure be looked at as successful ? Or if he doesn’t better 4th in the next two, should he be gone ?

Maybe we shouldn’t be comparing at all as it wasn’t that long ago that Wright at St Johnstone was the guy used as an example of good management. I feel Clarke may be the same unless he goes !

 

 

Given the resources...absolutely. No doubt. The Cup is a variable and is as much down to good fortune as anything. Clarke's ability to beat the OF will probably make him better placed to challenge regularly at a club like ours. You have to be able to beat the OF to win honours. 

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Enzo Chiefo
43 minutes ago, graygo said:

 

"of the team that started in Lee McCulloch's last game, only one player is no longer at the club. That is a fact."

 

You mentioned Gordon Greer.

 

Lee Erwin played as the main striker in Lee McCulloch's last game, he now plays in Iran of all places.

 

That is a fact and renders anything else you claim dubious at the very least.

 

 

 

You googled that? How pedantic. My info came from a national newspaper report -" October 14 2017, the final game before he took charge, only Gordon Greer has left the club." Away from semantics,  how about actually responding to the point I am making??

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Smith's right boot

Folk now saying we should have gave Cathro more time rather than have Craig in charge. 

 

 

 

 

 

youve-taken-that-too-far.jpg

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Byyy The Light
13 minutes ago, Enzo Chiefo said:

Given the resources...absolutely. No doubt. The Cup is a variable and is as much down to good fortune as anything. Clarke's ability to beat the OF will probably make him better placed to challenge regularly at a club like ours. You have to be able to beat the OF to win honours. 

 

Do you have stats of Clarke vs the OF? Be interested to see them. 

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Boab
18 minutes ago, Enzo Chiefo said:

Given the resources...absolutely. No doubt. The Cup is a variable and is as much down to good fortune as anything. Clarke's ability to beat the OF will probably make him better placed to challenge regularly at a club like ours. You have to be able to beat the OF to win honours. 

 

4 minutes ago, Byyy The Light said:

 

Do you have stats of Clarke vs the OF? Be interested to see them. 

 Can’t argue re. Clarke’s record against the OF as opposed to Levein;

Clarke...15 games, W5, D6, L4.

Levein...14 games, W2, D0, L12.

 

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Byyy The Light
1 minute ago, Boab said:

 

 Can’t argue re. Clarke’s record against the OF as opposed to Levein;

Clarke...15 games, W5, D6, L4.

Levein...14 games, W2, D0, L12.

 

 

Thanks. Wasn’t arguing, didn’t have a clue what the stats were.

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Boab
Just now, Byyy The Light said:

 

Thanks. Wasn’t arguing, didn’t have a clue what the stats were.

 No worries, mate.

Pretty bleak no matter anyone’s view of where we are right now.

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graygo
19 minutes ago, Enzo Chiefo said:

You googled that? How pedantic. My info came from a national newspaper report -" October 14 2017, the final game before he took charge, only Gordon Greer has left the club." Away from semantics,  how about actually responding to the point I am making??

 

FFS mate, it's not pedantic to check the facts. It's the right thing to do, you should try it sometime.

 

I've not responded to anything else you have said because I don't disagree with it.

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i wish jj was my dad
1 hour ago, Pasquale for King said:

I simply meant, sorry if it wasn’t clear enough for you, that on the surface it could be seen as not being the most ethical thing to do.

No innuendo, just an observation that for some reason you want to make a big deal of.  

You said you weren't sure it was particularly ethical. I asked you what was unethical about it. Now we have drilled under the surface a bit and know that it was openly discussed at AGM are you satisfied that there was nothing unethical about it? 

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Enzo Chiefo
16 minutes ago, Byyy The Light said:

 

Thanks. Wasn’t arguing, didn’t have a clue what the stats were.

I didn't have the stats but Boab has come up trumps.

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Enzo Chiefo
15 minutes ago, graygo said:

 

FFS mate, it's not pedantic to check the facts. It's the right thing to do, you should try it sometime.

 

I've not responded to anything else you have said because I don't disagree with it.

Fair point mate. Nothing wrong in checking facts. I just accepted the info in the article, maybe it was referring to the first game after he took charge, but which he watched from the stand. Always worth checking.

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Pasquale for King
Posted (edited)
25 minutes ago, i wish jj was my dad said:

You said you weren't sure it was particularly ethical. I asked you what was unethical about it. Now we have drilled under the surface a bit and know that it was openly discussed at AGM are you satisfied that there was nothing unethical about it? 

I didn’t say it was, I said it might look on the surface to be so. I don’t know all the facts so i couldn’t possibly agree with your last sentence.

Edited by Pasquale for King

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davemclaren
6 minutes ago, Pasquale for King said:

I didn’t say it was, I said it might look on the surface to be so. I don’t know all the facts so i couldn’t possibly agree with your last sentence.

You are right in that granting meaningful contracts to relatives has to be declared and carefully managed by the board. 

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Pasquale for King
1 minute ago, davemclaren said:

You are right in that granting meaningful contracts to relatives has to be declared and carefully managed by the board. 

Cheers Dave, I didn’t think I was saying anything that controversial that hadn’t been mentioned and discussed in detail before.

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jambonian
20 hours ago, luckydug said:

No you are not.

It's how I feel as well.

Never mind season tickets there are actually posters on here who refuse to attend the cup final because they think we will get beat.

Shouldn't even have the right to post on a Hearts fans forum feckin interlopers.

 

I love how people that don't know other individuals think that they can decide who is and who isn't Hearts fans, and also, who does and doesn't have the "right" to post on a PUBLIC forum, oh ma sides!

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Jarhead
45 minutes ago, i wish jj was my dad said:

You said you weren't sure it was particularly ethical. I asked you what was unethical about it. Now we have drilled under the surface a bit and know that it was openly discussed at AGM are you satisfied that there was nothing unethical about it? 

Some people do think nepotism is unethical. I don’t have any issues as long as everything is open and above board but it’s definitely the sort of thing that should be treated with caution as you can see how quickly it can come back on you if things go a bit tits up. 

 

However, it’s nothing new. Our last owner made his useless son the chairman ?

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jambonian
20 hours ago, soonbe110 said:

Did Craig  tell you that? 

Craig has a system, a structure that he believes in and a structure where he wants future managers to come from within the club, i.e. John Daly or McPhee etc.  He has said something along these lines himself as you'll know. A new manager would want to bring in the people he trusts, gets on with and likes to work with, people he knows and not have to worry about what's going on upstairs. Stands to reason. As an example, wasn't it Billy Davies who said he couldn't work within this structure and it would need changed completely? I'd expect others to feel the same. It would be very unusual for a manager to come in and carry on working with the same coaches and maybe people they don't know.

 

20 hours ago, soonbe110 said:

80%ish on here were happy with his appointment at the time. If you were one of the 20% I congratulate you  on your foresight. 

I remember when I heard that Neilson had moved on. I, and others said that as this was our first season back in the top League again, now would be a good time to get someone with experience in, Cathro didn't have any so yes, I was one of many that didn't think the appointment would work. Had Cathro learned his trade at a small club first and did well as a head coach or manager then maybe the appointment could've worked. It didn't. Levein himself, and others start at an Alloa or Cowdenbeath type club before moving on to better things.

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Smith's right boot
Posted (edited)

 

I heard we've sold that many season tickets that work on filling in the corners will start imminently in order to increase the capacity and accommodate the all happy clappers. 

 

19.5 k season ticket holders with away fans only in the Far right corner. 

 

One corner will be reserved for a big flag, tho. 

Apparently quite controversial, it will face the home fans in the Bottom corner of the Wheatfield. 

 

 

 

 

32834005-7B37-4E4C-B170-019C411AB333.jpeg.d72958003497b63013314acf541bfa25.jpeg

Edited by Olly Lee's left boot

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upgotheheads
2 hours ago, Boab said:

 

 Can’t argue re. Clarke’s record against the OF as opposed to Levein;

Clarke...15 games, W5, D6, L4.

Levein...14 games, W2, D0, L12.

 

 

Depressing reading that.

Tells us quite a lot about motivation of a team.

 

 

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JamboGraham
2 hours ago, Enzo Chiefo said:

Fair point mate. Nothing wrong in checking facts. I just accepted the info in the article, maybe it was referring to the first game after he took charge, but which he watched from the stand. Always worth checking.

 

Unless it's a direct quote I would treat almost anything produced by a journalist with outright scepticism. For the record since taking charge Clarke has signed 16 players and released 10. This number doesn't include players already on their books being loaned out and/or returning from loan. From the first match squad he selected to the most recent 4 players started both games, a further 4 were included in both squads. Both squads had 18 players.

 

For what its worth here is my view on Clarke. Kilmarnock have managed to sign a manager of truly exceptional quality; quality rarely seen in Scotland and almost never outside of the deep pockets of Celtic (and previously Rangers).

 

For years we have spoken about what it would require for us to make a genuine assault on the Championship. The general answer is we would need an exceptional manager, we would need a period almost entirely clear of injuries and we would need Celtic (and previously Rangers) to perform at a level well below their capability. Whilst we are all beating ourselves up about the fortunes of our own club the dream combination that we talk about has happened for Kilmarnock. (If we accept that Hearts, Hibs and Aberdeen collectively are the equivalent of Celtic for us).

 

Manager - Yes, Almost entirely free of injury - Yes, Rivals under par - Hearts, Hibs and Aberdeen, Yes. Add in the bonus of horrific injury records at Hibs and Hearts alongside a number of injuries to key players at Aberdeen and Kilmarnock have the perfect environment to take advantage and finish above all of these clubs. No question they still need to take that chance and boy have they done it...and they deserve every plaudit for doing so.

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innerjambo

Levein would do really well in Division 1, that's about his level. He would struggle big time in the Championship though.

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Kiwidoug

Still haven't heard a plausible reason why Hearts dont give us sales updates.  Are we not allowed bad or disappointing news?

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soonbe110
5 hours ago, Pasquale for King said:

It wasn’t illegal ffs 

Is fraud illegal? 

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soonbe110
5 hours ago, Pasquale for King said:

It wasn’t illegal ffs 

Is knowingly using the proceeds of fraud to your own benefit fraud? 

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