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davie1980

Steve Clark - Not a one season wonder after all

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Geoff Kilpatrick

Saying Steve Clarke for Hearts is all well and good. Given he turned down Sevco, WHY would he come to Tynie?

 

Killie lucked out because he is from Ayrshire. Fair play to them. 

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Skacelsid

A reasonable result last night and plenty effort from the players. But little football on show and not easy on the eye. Our players show little desire to get into forward positions, make runs into space, take on opponent's, or have a shot on goal. Crosses into the box, long throws and set pieces seems to be all we have to offer. This safe passing to stationary players that is the norm must come from the training field and has not changed post Cathro, after all the same people are still in place except IC. The Man Cities and Barcelona's of this world can pass their way through teams because of movement and the quality of players they have, but do not do it at snails pace. Of course we have been weakened by injury but the coaching, organisation and tactics have been found to be lacking. Our club is back on track but our coaching needs to take a new direction IMO, I have no problem with CL moving back upstairs but we need a head coach to get the best out of our resources, who knows if Steve Clarke could be that man. CL would have to support but not control, that may be a problem.

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queensferryjambo
4 hours ago, Bridge of Djoum said:

I see a thread about Steve Clarke turns into another CL bashing rant by the same few.

 

It's not trolling, though.

 

 

Yeah odd how Clark is a wonder manager and Levein is a dud in some peoples eyes.

 

Had it not been for 3 very poor refereeing decisions - Maclean's goal being chalked off against Killie, Rangers winner being allowed to stand and St Johnstone's ridiculous penalty we would be top of the league 5 points ahead of Kilmarnock.

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EastSideJambo
3 hours ago, magicTs said:

 

 

It damn well should be used to compare Levein to Clarke. Some people think Levein has done or is doing a great job. This shows just how staggeringly mediocre a job he’s doing in reality. A record that sees us scraping into the top 6. Talk about treading water. How many more seasons will we have to put up with this pish?!

The answer to your final question - quite a few. AB will be in no mood whatsoever to change anything 

 

Safest job in British football 

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i8hibsh
27 minutes ago, queensferryjambo said:

 

 

Yeah odd how Clark is a wonder manager and Levein is a dud in some peoples eyes.

 

Had it not been for 3 very poor refereeing decisions - Maclean's goal being chalked off against Killie, Rangers winner being allowed to stand and St Johnstone's ridiculous penalty we would be top of the league 5 points ahead of Kilmarnock.

 

 

Not a dig but this 'blame everyone and everything' has to end. 

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Mauricio Pinilla
42 minutes ago, i8hibsh said:

 

 

Not a dig but this 'blame everyone and everything' has to end. 

 

Unless it's blaming our own players and manager ofc. 

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Geoff Kilpatrick
45 minutes ago, i8hibsh said:

 

 

Not a dig but this 'blame everyone and everything' has to end. 

Look up chutzpah in the dictionary please.

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i8hibsh
3 minutes ago, Mauricio Pinilla said:

 

Unless it's blaming our own players and manager ofc. 

 

 

Well yeah, they are the ones that are kinda in the driving seat.

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Dalstonjambo
52 minutes ago, i8hibsh said:

 

 

Not a dig but this 'blame everyone and everything' has to end. 

Oh dear. 

Edited by Dalstonjambo

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i8hibsh
Just now, Dalstonjambo said:

Oh dear. 

 

 

We are a bad driver who is blaming every other driver around him.

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Dalstonjambo
2 minutes ago, i8hibsh said:

 

 

We are a bad driver who is blaming every other driver around him.

I think you are missing the irony in your post which has been pointed out a few times to you.

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i8hibsh
5 minutes ago, Dalstonjambo said:

I think you are missing the irony in your post which has been pointed out a few times to you.

 

 

No I get it. Sigh.

 

I am just looking from the inside out and not outside in.

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Dalstonjambo
1 minute ago, i8hibsh said:

 

 

No I get it. Sigh.

 

I am just looking from the inside out and not outside in.

Care to explain how I'm on the outside looking in? 

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i8hibsh
8 minutes ago, Dalstonjambo said:

Care to explain how I'm on the outside looking in? 

 

 

I never said you personally bud.

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To Be Frank
10 hours ago, magicTs said:

In the last calendar year, from the start of December 2017, Steve Clarke's Kilmarnock side have played 36 SPL games:

 

23 wins

9 draws

4 defeats 

 

78pts out of a possible 108pts.

 

In the same calendar year, since the start of December 2017, Craig Levein's Hearts side have played 39 SPL games:

 

16 wins

11 draws

12 defeats

 

59pts out of a possible 117pts.

 

So Kilmarnock despite having played 3 less league games than Hearts have taken NINETEEN points more than us. Clarke is doing an absolutely phenomenal job with a fraction of the resources, far poorer facilities and about a third of the fanbase that Levein has at his disposal. He should have been appointed Hearts manager when Cathro was given the boot, he was the very obvious choice within Scottish football and I have no doubt whatsoever we would be top of the SPL right now and not Kilmarnock. I would love to see what he would be doing with the players we have available and I'm sure he would have brought in some far better than the numerous duds we've again conspired to end up with. 

 

5 hours ago, magicTs said:

 

 

It damn well should be used to compare Levein to Clarke. Some people think Levein has done or is doing a great job. This shows just how staggeringly mediocre a job he’s doing in reality. A record that sees us scraping into the top 6. Talk about treading water. How many more seasons will we have to put up with this pish?!

 

3 hours ago, magicTs said:

 

Sorry Shaun but however eloquently you try to defend Levein I don’t and won’t buy it. He’s doing a totally mediocre job with the 3rd biggest club in Scotland. Quite what the Romanov era (during which, as usual I was proven right way more than not 😉) has to do with anything is anyone’s guess but the reality is that regardless of injuries or a few refereeing decisions Levein is only doing a very average job.

 

Shocking record in big games, appaling record away against top 6 sides, abysmal record against the Old Firm, embarrassing record in the cups etc etc. Unfortunately “perfectly fine” appears totally adequate for those who run the club and indeed some of our support.

 

What a lack of ambition when someone like Clarke was there during our pathetic managerial search last year. What a lack of accountability for sheer mediocrity. What a shame that there is an acceptance of being also rans. I know nothing will change and we’ll continue along the road to nowhere but at least am prepared to point these facts out and take whatever heat that comes with it! Unlike like your good self who changes views at the drop of a hat, I’ll state my predictions and stick with them. I’m sure you’ll carry favor with some of the halfwits on here for a while after defending our never won heehaw manager though 👍

 

:cornette:

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JamboAl
12 hours ago, davie1980 said:

Many including myself just thought he was last seasons flash in the pan one season wonder manager.

 

Appears some of us were wrong.

Top of the league with a bang average team, what's he doing right?

 

Avoiding long-term injuries to key players.

The season's not over yet but no one can deny he's doing well thus far.

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FarmerTweedy
9 hours ago, magicTs said:

 

 

Obviously chief. They don't like facts. They just like believing the totally ridiculous notion that we are in good hands on the football front. Nothing and I mean nothing suggests that Levein will ever have success at Tynecastle. Its a complete joke that we are so insular and tat people are so deluded that they think he is as good as it gets for Hearts. Its actually insulting given what the clubs fanbase have done for the club. 

We were top of the league until we lost our four most important players to injury. Kilmarnock would be completely ****ed if they were to lose their four most important players all at the same time. The only club in this league that wouldn't struggle in that scenario is celtic. Sevco might manage to get by as they'd have the refs helping them out, while we have to not only contend with serious injury problems, but bad decisions by the officials costing us several points too. . 

 

We are in good hands on the football front, despite currently being on a poor run. That is clear to anyone who bothers to look at the facts. There's no justification for changing manager at the moment, in fact we'd be utterly crazy to do so. Thankfully, the people actually running the club are far more sensible than some of our fans!

 

Clarke is doing a remarkable job at Kilmarnock just now, and if there was a guarantee that he'd do just as well at Hearts, of course it would make sense to go for him, but there is no such guarantee, and if there was, much bigger clubs than us would already have come in for him. The reason he's at Kilmarnock in the first place is that things didn't go nearly as well in his previous management jobs, although he did get off to a good start at West Brom. He's definitely done well enough at Killie to merit another chance at a bigger club, but it's far from guaranteed that he'll be successful at all elsewhere, never mind as successful as he's been at Kilmarnock. 

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FarmerTweedy
5 hours ago, shaun.lawson said:

 

Magic, we're 4th. Having had lots of injuries and plenty of awful refereeing decisions. If you could name me any other occasion in Hearts' history when a manager would've justifiably been sacked for being 4th, having had lots of injuries and plenty of awful refereeing decisions, that'd be great. But you can't, because there's never been one.

 

I don't like doing this - it's probably woefully unfair. But it seems to me, you so often blame some bogeyman or another. For many years, it was Vlad - to the point whereby you constantly defended Csaba Laszlo's appalling, eyebleeding football at a time we were flirting with the relegation zone on a massively bigger budget than we have now. Now, it's Levein. If only he'd go and we'd show some 'ambition' (read: roll the roulette wheel, before you slag off the next incumbent when he doesn't work miracles) eh?

 

Well, no. Hearts are doing perfectly fine, all things considered. Bizarrely, your on-field expectations seem to be higher now than they were under Romanov, despite us now living within our means. Clubs that live within their means will always see things go wrong when serious injuries come along. That's life. And pointing to one manager doing a freakishly brilliant job doesn't change that.

 

Good for Steve Clarke and good for Killie. But good for Craig Levein and Hearts too. At this stage of the season, at least.

Well said Shaun. 

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FarmerTweedy
4 hours ago, magicTs said:

 

Sorry Shaun but however eloquently you try to defend Levein I don’t and won’t buy it. He’s doing a totally mediocre job with the 3rd biggest club in Scotland. Quite what the Romanov era (during which, as usual I was proven right way more than not 😉) has to do with anything is anyone’s guess but the reality is that regardless of injuries or a few refereeing decisions Levein is only doing a very average job.

 

Shocking record in big games, appaling record away against top 6 sides, abysmal record against the Old Firm, embarrassing record in the cups etc etc. Unfortunately “perfectly fine” appears totally adequate for those who run the club and indeed some of our support.

 

What a lack of ambition when someone like Clarke was there during our pathetic managerial search last year. What a lack of accountability for sheer mediocrity. What a shame that there is an acceptance of being also rans. I know nothing will change and we’ll continue along the road to nowhere but at least am prepared to point these facts out and take whatever heat that comes with it! Unlike like your good self who changes views at the drop of a hat, I’ll state my predictions and stick with them. I’m sure you’ll carry favor with some of the halfwits on here for a while after defending our never won heehaw manager though 👍

On the other hand, this is a stream of utter drivel!

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WeeChuck'sHeed

Clarke has s doing a great job. 

 

Why that is relevant to us I have no idea. 

 

 

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FarmerTweedy
2 hours ago, Skacelsid said:

A reasonable result last night and plenty effort from the players. But little football on show and not easy on the eye. Our players show little desire to get into forward positions, make runs into space, take on opponent's, or have a shot on goal. Crosses into the box, long throws and set pieces seems to be all we have to offer. This safe passing to stationary players that is the norm must come from the training field and has not changed post Cathro, after all the same people are still in place except IC. The Man Cities and Barcelona's of this world can pass their way through teams because of movement and the quality of players they have, but do not do it at snails pace. Of course we have been weakened by injury but the coaching, organisation and tactics have been found to be lacking. Our club is back on track but our coaching needs to take a new direction IMO, I have no problem with CL moving back upstairs but we need a head coach to get the best out of our resources, who knows if Steve Clarke could be that man. CL would have to support but not control, that may be a problem.

It's been a while since I've seen this nonsense trotted out. CL supported but didn't control Robbie Neilson, and he supported but didn't control Cathro. If he relinquishes the manager role but continues as DoF at some point in the future, it's entirely likely that he'll support but not control whoever takes over the head coach/manager role. Of course, if he'd controlled rather than just supported Cathro, Cathro might not have got us into the state he did!

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Jingle Bells

From the TV highlights he seems to be giving his forwards alot of freedom to play,, which they are enjoying.

Sign of a good manager imho.

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Section Q

Michael Stewart tweeted this stat today.

 

"""Over the last 38 games in the Scottish Premiership Kilmarnock are 3 points behind Celtic!"""

1. Celtic 78
2. Kilmarnock 75

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TexasAndy

So far so good for Clarke at Killie.  The test will come when expectation rises.  Also it's a club with a pi$$ poor support.  Any ambitions to build on his early success will to difficult to achieve.

 

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JamboGraham

The table below is based on the '60 point formula' and adds back in some of the variations caused by the different number of matches played, different mix of opponents and home/away so far this season. All just a bit of fun of course and things can change a lot. If clubs continue with an equal mix of the ups and downs they have had so far we will not be too far away from this at the end of the season...it would be a remarkable achievement for Kilmarnock.

 

100840747_YTDProjected.jpg.3b3bc1fcc5350bdc27188ff8cb9b7e7a.jpg

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1953

Killie won't be top of the league at the end of the season or possibly even next week but they're there now so credit where it's due, Clark has done an excellent job for them.

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JamboGraham
7 hours ago, magicTs said:

He’s (Levein) doing a totally mediocre job with the 3rd biggest club in Scotland.

 

It doesn't take anything away from the current fortunes of Kilmarnock but I have noticed a growing return of this claim being made in recent weeks...how do you quantify our claim to be the 3rd biggest?

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wallace_mercer

He is doing an incredible job for them - likely poached by a big championship club soon I reckon 

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queensferryjambo
4 hours ago, i8hibsh said:

 

 

Not a dig but this 'blame everyone and everything' has to end. 

 

 

No I 'dig' that (sorry :) ) but this hasn't been a couple of throw ins or corners that haven't went our way these have been major decisions that have genuinely cost us points - 6 points IMO.

 

Either way I think Levein has done well and think when Naismith and Uche finally get back Hearts will get back on track again and we won't need excuses we will start performing again.

 

 

 

 

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Mikey1874

Never a one hit wonder

 

 

IMG_20181206_133719.jpg

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Homme
4 hours ago, i8hibsh said:

 

 

Well yeah, they are the ones that are kinda in the driving seat.

 

How dare they score perfectly good goals or correctly play the offside trap only to be undone by shite refereeing.

 

Not disputing we have been pretty shit but you can't say its all been our undoing.

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Jamhammer

Two men and a dog singing we're going to win the league at Rugby Park. Imagine if they did a Leicester. Fair play to them and Clarke. Obviously the lessons he learned at West Ham have stood him in good stead

 

:clyay:

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Glib and Shameless Crier

He’s another club’s manager, and he is doing well. Fair play to him. I’d rather we kept Levein, and I think we will finish above them this season. 

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EastSideJambo
5 minutes ago, Glib and Shameless Crier said:

He’s another club’s manager, and he is doing well. Fair play to him. I’d rather we kept Levein, and I think we will finish above them this season. 

Given respective budgets we should finish ahead of them. Just as we should have done last season 

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Glib and Shameless Crier
3 minutes ago, EastSideJambo said:

Given respective budgets we should finish ahead of them. Just as we should have done last season 

 

Until you just admit that you are Spencer, I’m not really fussy about debating anything with you fellah. 👍

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EastSideJambo
19 minutes ago, Glib and Shameless Crier said:

 

Until you just admit that you are Spencer, I’m not really fussy about debating anything with you fellah. 👍

Yet you and your Tag Team partner have an inability to desist 

 

No problem at all bud. Best we ignore on each on that basis

 

Maybe you could relay that to the other part of the duo 

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Glib and Shameless Crier
1 minute ago, EastSideJambo said:

Yet you and your Tag Team partner have an inability to desist 

 

No problem at all bud. Best we ignore on each on that basis

 

Maybe you could relay that to the other part of the duo 

 

Oh, Spencer... :facepalm:

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EastSideJambo
5 minutes ago, Glib and Shameless Crier said:

 

Oh, Spencer... :facepalm:

Look mate - you've made reference to at least 3 posters who no longer post on here today. You've been backed up by your buddy (quelle surprise) 

 

I'm not quite sure what your point is. You are way off topic though - that much is clear 

 

If you yearn the return of previous posters it perhaps says much about your eagerness for an argument more than anything else 

 

Why not create a thread whereby you reach out to those of yesteryear in the hope that they might come back 

 

It would make the tag team happy if nothing else 

Edited by EastSideJambo

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NANOJAMBO
3 hours ago, FarmerTweedy said:

We were top of the league until we lost our four most important players to injury. Kilmarnock would be completely ****ed if they were to lose their four most important players all at the same time. The only club in this league that wouldn't struggle in that scenario is celtic. Sevco might manage to get by as they'd have the refs helping them out, while we have to not only contend with serious injury problems, but bad decisions by the officials costing us several points too. . 

 

We are in good hands on the football front, despite currently being on a poor run. That is clear to anyone who bothers to look at the facts. There's no justification for changing manager at the moment, in fact we'd be utterly crazy to do so. Thankfully, the people actually running the club are far more sensible than some of our fans!

 

Clarke is doing a remarkable job at Kilmarnock just now, and if there was a guarantee that he'd do just as well at Hearts, of course it would make sense to go for him, but there is no such guarantee, and if there was, much bigger clubs than us would already have come in for him. The reason he's at Kilmarnock in the first place is that things didn't go nearly as well in his previous management jobs, although he did get off to a good start at West Brom. He's definitely done well enough at Killie to merit another chance at a bigger club, but it's far from guaranteed that he'll be successful at all elsewhere, never mind as successful as he's been at Kilmarnock. 

Here we go again. Berra & Souttar were not missed.  Like I said last night, so many seem to be resigned to the fact that Naismith is the only creative spark in the entire squad and Hearts will just be poor until he returns.  Uche is out and there is nothing remotely good enough to fill the void.  Talk about low expectations. 

No denying that refs have cost us and did again last night  but the standard of the football is abysmal and last night was no exception - as was said by many on the match thread. That was criminally poor stuff but we get posters say , aye, but they were unbeaten in 6 games,etc,etc.   So what? StJ are pish and Hearts barely laid a glove on them.  

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saxondale
16 hours ago, loveofthegame said:

 

Our managers budget is like about double killies 

 

And about half of our budget was sitting in the treatment room, before the Rangers game.

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Glib and Shameless Crier
23 minutes ago, EastSideJambo said:

Look mate - you've made reference to at least 3 posters who no longer post on here today. You've been backed up by your buddy (quelle surprise) 

 

I'm not quite sure what your point is. You are way off topic though - that much is clear 

 

If you yearn the return of previous posters it perhaps says much about your eagerness for an argument more than anything else 

 

Why not create a thread whereby you reach out to those of yesteryear in the hope that they might come back 

 

It would make the tag team happy if nothing else 

 

:lol:

 

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rudi must stay
2 hours ago, wallace_mercer said:

He is doing an incredible job for them - likely poached by a big championship club soon I reckon 

 

in the summer maybe. He wants the league, and i think they'd be a cracking bet and I mean that, this Kilmarnock team is a team the Old Firm hate, its obvious even if they wont say it. Celtic tried to weaken them bringing in Mulumbu, there was abit of nastyness in that transfer, he doesn't even play. But they have regrouped, he is doing an incredible job as you say. The next game v Celtic, is the crunch game for any potential title challenge, it's killed ours before, but i'd back them to get a result (a draw or win).

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JamboGraham
1 hour ago, NANOJAMBO said:

Berra & Souttar were not missed.

 

Incorrect.

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Jamhammer
1 hour ago, NANOJAMBO said:

Here we go again. Berra & Souttar were not missed.  Like I said last night, so many seem to be resigned to the fact that Naismith is the only creative spark in the entire squad and Hearts will just be poor until he returns.  Uche is out and there is nothing remotely good enough to fill the void.  Talk about low expectations. 

No denying that refs have cost us and did again last night  but the standard of the football is abysmal and last night was no exception - as was said by many on the match thread. That was criminally poor stuff but we get posters say , aye, but they were unbeaten in 6 games,etc,etc.   So what? StJ are pish and Hearts barely laid a glove on them.  

1. Vanaceck arriving in Jan. CL obviously aware we are short but couldn't get him in in August

2. You acknowledge that refs are costing us

3. So they're on a very good run but are pish? 6 games without conceding a goal, including beating the table topping  Kilmarnock but they're pish. We weren't scoring and scored twice against them.

 

We're not great the now but we were and we will be again. In my humble opinion of course

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Enzo Chiefo
8 hours ago, queensferryjambo said:

 

 

Yeah odd how Clark is a wonder manager and Levein is a dud in some peoples eyes.

 

Had it not been for 3 very poor refereeing decisions - Maclean's goal being chalked off against Killie, Rangers winner being allowed to stand and St Johnstone's ridiculous penalty we would be top of the league 5 points ahead of Kilmarnock.

Only if the game had stopped immediately after all these incidents.  Who is to say Rangers and St J wouldn't have gone to win these games anyway. We lack pace, creativity and width and that is costing us far more than refereeing decisions are. 

 

 

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Enzo Chiefo
6 hours ago, FarmerTweedy said:

It's been a while since I've seen this nonsense trotted out. CL supported but didn't control Robbie Neilson, and he supported but didn't control Cathro. If he relinquishes the manager role but continues as DoF at some point in the future, it's entirely likely that he'll support but not control whoever takes over the head coach/manager role. Of course, if he'd controlled rather than just supported Cathro, Cathro might not have got us into the state he did!

He got us into the terrible state of finishing 5th. He also added a lot of players who weren't good enough as has CL this season. 

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shaun.lawson
3 hours ago, JamboGraham said:

 

It doesn't take anything away from the current fortunes of Kilmarnock but I have noticed a growing return of this claim being made in recent weeks...how do you quantify our claim to be the 3rd biggest?

 

Of course we're the third biggest - but in practice, that means very little. We've been paying the fourth biggest wages: with Aberdeen spending quite a lot more, whereas our wage bill's only been a bit ahead of Hibs.

 

But in any case: finishing 3rd is not like buying a Mars bar. It's amazing how many Hearts fans haven't worked that out after 35 years of us being up and down, up and down like a yo-yo.

 

2 hours ago, NANOJAMBO said:

Here we go again. Berra & Souttar were not missed. 

 

This comment is bonkers.

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Oliver Twist

If their still top in 10 games I'll give him some credit. If he's still there.

 

 

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Glib and Shameless Crier

I can’t remember... see when we were top of the league for weeks on end? Were the posters who are fawning over Clarke just now, doing the same over Levein? 🤔

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Morgan
2 minutes ago, Glib and Shameless Crier said:

I can’t remember... see when we were top of the league for weeks on end? Were the posters who are fawning over Clarke just now, doing the same over Levein? 🤔

Fawning?  :lol: 

 

Some of them (you know who they are) weren't even logged in.  Let alone fawning.

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