Magic Numbers Posted January 21, 2012 Share Posted January 21, 2012 Hi guys/gals. Need some help. Well, my wife does. That's her in my wee avatar by the way. She has worked with her company for years, and now works part-time for a few days a week. She has been with the company for maybe 11 or 12 years. She is a valued member of staff & gets on well with most of her workmates. It is a fairly small company maybe about 20 employees, most of them have been with the company for a long time. Recently one of the guys who has also been there for quite a while has been coming on to her. Now she has given him no encouragement, she does not find him attractive in the least & has told him so on numerous occasions, he is older & defo not her type. He started a few months ago with compliments & general flirting, but over the last couple of months has been gradually getting worse. It began with him complementing her style of dress and general comments about her appearance. He started to become more pushy just before Christmas, a couple of weeks before their works night out. Kept saying how he couldn't wait to see her out of work, and teasing her about how he was going to have mistletoe with him so he could claim a kiss. She was very worried about going to the night out so spoke to a couple of her colleagues - one male, one female, and they promised to look out for her. The night out actually passed off ok, as the guy was actualy summoned by the owner of the company who asked him to nip out with him for some reason, think it was something to do with visiting a customer or similar, so he had to leave early before anything kicked off. Since then he has been insisting that she gives him a kiss & has been keeping up with the compliments etc. More recently though he has been starting to get physical. He has 2 or 3 times crept into her (carpeted) office, and kissed her neck from the back, or blindfolded her, or putting his hands down the back of her top. I was worried about his behaviour as I think he is continually pushing her boundaries, and I don't think he will stop. This has now escalated. Today she texted me to let me know that he had approached her in the corridor, insisted on the kiss again, when she said no started complementing her body, and squeezed her breasts. She was scared & he knew it, said "what are you going to do ? Report me ?". She gave him a telling off in no uncertain terms & told him no again. Later however she was alone in a store room when he appeared again, asked for a kiss again, she again told him to get lost, so he pulled her towards him, hands on her ass & then chest again, kissed her anyway, neck & lips, despite her trying to get away. Again gave it the "What are you going to do?" & then left her alone. He is a general handyman who doesn't really have a fixed job to do, and he seems to be hanging around whenever she is alone. He is such a pain that she is even getting scared to go to her car after work as 9 times out of 10 he is hanging around. Her colleague (the girl) has taken to going out to the car park with her just in case, but although she knows some of the stuff, my wife hasn't said how bad it has become. I want to hurt this joker as I hate seeing my wife being scared to go to a job which she otherwise likes, but I know that would do no good. She is reluctant to go to management as the guy in question has been a good family friend of her boss' for years and she doesn't know how they will react. I reckon that without evidence of some sort they may not believe her, as the guy displays NONE of these things with anyone else, only her, and no-one has witnessed it yet. I am hoping that once the usual laughing/nonsense/trolling etc has finished, I may get one or 2 sensible replies that may help to put this person in his place. I have to say she is fantastically patient & even though he is doing this, she would prefer him to just get a telling off rather than major disciplinary etc & move on with her life without this unwelcome attention. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Peebo Posted January 21, 2012 Share Posted January 21, 2012 If I read this correctly, he assaulted her, right? Go to the ******* police! Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
JP1874 Posted January 21, 2012 Share Posted January 21, 2012 There are already 2 members of staff who are aware of this problem (pre xmas party). Simple solution is go direct to management! This has escalated from some "flirting" to much more serious matter!! However if it was me then I would wait on my mrs after her work get her 2 point out the guy & see his reaction!! Try not get physically or verbally involved as he could turn the tables very quickly. But 1st line of defence is see her boss as this guy could try push his luck further. Technically is a police matter as stated above so nowt stopping you going to them although some proof might be needed as its he says - she says. I do wonder why you've waited - to let this guy go this far & just started worrying about it now. This should have delt with before the party. P.S. It is irrelevant who is it is on your avatar, but now you have mentioned it expect a few remarks Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Magic Numbers Posted January 21, 2012 Author Share Posted January 21, 2012 If I read this correctly, he assaulted her, right? Go to the ******* police! That's kind of what I was saying to her tonight, but she doesn't want the hassle. She says he hasn't hurt her & doesn't think he is likely to. I on the other hand think she's playing with fire by not acting decisively now. This has been escalating for a while & I don't think he is finished with this yet. I have to respect her wishes on this too. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest C00l K1d Posted January 21, 2012 Share Posted January 21, 2012 She does have a pretty nice arse tbf Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Magic Numbers Posted January 21, 2012 Author Share Posted January 21, 2012 There are already 2 members of staff who are aware of this problem (pre xmas party). Simple solution is go direct to management! This has escalated from some "flirting" to much more serious matter!! However if it was me then I would wait on my mrs after her work get her 2 point out the guy & see his reaction!! Try not get physically or verbally involved as he could turn the tables very quickly. But 1st line of defence is see her boss as this guy could try push his luck further. Technically is a police matter as stated above so nowt stopping you going to them although some proof might be needed as its he says - she says. I do wonder why you've waited - to let this guy go this far & just started worrying about it now. This should have delt with before the party. P.S. It is irrelevant who is it is on your avatar, but now you have mentioned it expect a few remarks I have been worrying about this for a while, but she has passed it off as harmless flirting/office nonsense, and has kind of been describing him as a bit of a joke figure, not a threat. Recently though he has obviously been getting much worse with this. Might see if I can edit the avatar bit though JP!! You have a point! Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Magic Numbers Posted January 21, 2012 Author Share Posted January 21, 2012 She does have a pretty nice arse tbf I will say thank you on her behalf! It is too. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Peebo Posted January 21, 2012 Share Posted January 21, 2012 That's kind of what I was saying to her tonight, but she doesn't want the hassle. She says he hasn't hurt her & doesn't think he is likely to. I on the other hand think she's playing with fire by not acting decisively now. This has been escalating for a while & I don't think he is finished with this yet. I have to respect her wishes on this too. If she does not report it, she's leaving this alleged pest free to go and assault someone else. They way you tell it, this guy is making her working life hell and has assaulted her, yet she can't be arsed reporting it to the only authority who can really do anything about it??? If she was my wife, I'd report it. Or ensure the guys hands weren't operational enought to sexually assault her again. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest C00l K1d Posted January 21, 2012 Share Posted January 21, 2012 I will say thank you on her behalf! It is too. Na but if he's started getting physical, i'd definitely report it to someone or he'll just keep getting more confident. Either that or maybe you could have a non violent word with him. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
southside1874 Posted January 21, 2012 Share Posted January 21, 2012 That's kind of what I was saying to her tonight, but she doesn't want the hassle. She says he hasn't hurt her & doesn't think he is likely to. I on the other hand think she's playing with fire by not acting decisively now. This has been escalating for a while & I don't think he is finished with this yet. I have to respect her wishes on this too. Sorry mate but if she doesn't want to deal with it then what is the point in giving you a reply? Having a flirt at work is not going to have the courts gunning for anyone... Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Juan Rom?n Riquelme Posted January 21, 2012 Share Posted January 21, 2012 Call the old bill. The boy sounds like a ******* fruitcake. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest C00l K1d Posted January 21, 2012 Share Posted January 21, 2012 Sorry mate but if she doesn't want to deal with it then what is the point in giving you a reply? Having a flirt at work is not going to have the courts gunning for anyone... Difference between flirting and feeling her up though. He sounds creepy as feck. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Rand Paul's Ray Bans Posted January 21, 2012 Share Posted January 21, 2012 He may be a family friend of the management, but they still have the requirement of acting upon complaints. I'd urge her to complain to management. The ***** deserves to have many heavy books thrown at him. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
southside1874 Posted January 21, 2012 Share Posted January 21, 2012 Difference between flirting and feeling her up though. He sounds creepy as feck. He is creepy as feck but if said woman doesn't complain about it then what is the point. If that much detail was afforded to Southside regarding the creepy feck then I would not post on said website regards the outcome. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
southside1874 Posted January 21, 2012 Share Posted January 21, 2012 He may be a family friend of the management, but they still have the requirement of acting upon complaints. I'd urge her to complain to management. The ***** deserves to have many heavy books thrown at him. The guy deserves to have as many punches thrown at him. Its not up for discussion really. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
JP1874 Posted January 21, 2012 Share Posted January 21, 2012 I have been worrying about this for a while, but she has passed it off as harmless flirting/office nonsense, and has kind of been describing him as a bit of a joke figure, not a threat. Recently though he has obviously been getting much worse with this. Might see if I can edit the avatar bit though JP!! You have a point! This is NOT harmless!! The guy touched your wife up FFS! This will escalate unless she does something. Fair enough not wanting to go the police but she MUST report it to a manager as it doesnt sound big enough company to have HR. He is getting more confident (dangerous) so must be stopped! Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
ToadKiller Dog Posted January 21, 2012 Share Posted January 21, 2012 She needs to speak to her manager asap ,write down all the events and dates if she can and she should start keeping a diary . The guy needs to stop if he thinks its ok to start feeling her up you dont need me to tell you where he could go next . Its gone way beyond the level of harmless office flirting . I think the fac that she has told you says she does want to deal with it but is nervous to do so as reporting such an event is a hard step to take but sound like it is needed to be made . Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
jamboz Posted January 21, 2012 Share Posted January 21, 2012 Bullying and harassment can be fairly difficult to prove but the one thing that you can do to bolster your case is to document everything that happens. Your wife needs to keep a diary that accurately records dates and times of any harassment including location and what was said and what was done by the harassor, what her response was and if there was any witnesses. Faced with a list of dates and times and incidents the accused will be hard pressed to be able to deny everything and offer acceptable alibis for what he was doing at the documented dates and times. This evidence can be presented to the employer and or police because sexual harassment is a criminal offense. She could try confidentially contacting any HR person at her work but this might not be the answer if it is such a small workplace. The citizens advice bureau are usually pretty helpful in these situations as well. Good luck Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
sdoffstl Posted January 21, 2012 Share Posted January 21, 2012 Your wife says she doesn't think he's dangerous but the situation is escalating. If nothing is done then twisted brains is going to think it's ok to go on so it has to be stopped. Not everyone is up for fights etc but at the very least if you believe what your wife has said then you have to support her 100%. As a minimum I think you should take the time to go to meet her from work and if the creeps anywhere near tell him that you know what's been happening and that you have informed a lawyer of your concerns for her welfare. Any more from him and you will take out an injunction to ensure he stays away from her and that you will leave it to him to tell his "friend" of a boss why he can't be at work. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
stevie Posted January 21, 2012 Share Posted January 21, 2012 Have a word with the guy yourself mate.Its what id do. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Homme Posted January 21, 2012 Share Posted January 21, 2012 I don't like this story at all. As said above the ***** is taking liberties and as so long it goes unreported or dealt with, these are going to gradually get worse as they already have been doing. I don't want to sound sensationalist but creeps like these do not know when to stop once they have a hold over someone - its scary to think what else this guy might be capable of. Get it reported NOW. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Johanes de Silentio Posted January 21, 2012 Share Posted January 21, 2012 The boy's a menace - he's probably done it before, and will keep doing it if he gets away with it - go to the cops. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Tiberius Stinkfinger Posted January 21, 2012 Share Posted January 21, 2012 Is this the excuse she trots out when she is late home from work ? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Floyd Posted January 21, 2012 Share Posted January 21, 2012 Bullying and harassment can be fairly difficult to prove but the one thing that you can do to bolster your case is to document everything that happens. Your wife needs to keep a diary that accurately records dates and times of any harassment including location and what was said and what was done by the harassor, what her response was and if there was any witnesses. Faced with a list of dates and times and incidents the accused will be hard pressed to be able to deny everything and offer acceptable alibis for what he was doing at the documented dates and times. This evidence can be presented to the employer and or police because sexual harassment is a criminal offense. She could try confidentially contacting any HR person at her work but this might not be the answer if it is such a small workplace. The citizens advice bureau are usually pretty helpful in these situations as well. Good luck I work in HR and am also a trained Bullying & Harassment investigator, the poster I have quoted above is 100% right in that it's very difficult to prove when there is one complainant vs one respondent, however having an accurate detailed record of events, including dates, times, what happenede, who witnessed it and most importantly how she felt at the time of the incident. She needs to approach management with this as I'm assuming they are too small a company to have an HR department. Once they are presented with the information they need to investigate this, I would also suggest that she drops into the conversation that her husband wants her to go to the police but she wanted to speak to them first. This will hopefully show them that she is serious about it, but if they don't take it seriously then it's the cops who will be involved next. Her next steps if nothing is done to resolve the situation is going to the cops or resigning from her job and then going to an employment tribunal. A boy I worked with before went through a similar scenario with his wife, it tore him apart knowing that the only thing he could do was support her as the harasser was too high profile for him to go and give him a tanking. His wife went to a tribunal and won her case, although it put a tremendous strain on their marriage. I will post a link to it, if I can find it. - found the link. http://m.scotsman.com/news/uk/163_300_000_pay_out_the_beginning_of_gmb_s_troubles_1_491098 Don't let it carry on like this, your wife needs to make sure that she gets this sorted out. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
redm Posted January 21, 2012 Share Posted January 21, 2012 I don't like the sound of this story at all. Regardless of who she reports it to I think it's safe to assume that it'll get unpleasant when he simply responds by saying that his advances were welcome and then it's his word against her's. You can understand why people feel reluctant to say anything but she just has to. He's getting worse and that in itself is worrying. If she thinks there might be a problem with the boss, is there an HR Manager or Head of HR? Something like that? I'd maybe ask for an appointment (or meeting outside the office if it really is that small) and ask for assurances that it's completely confidential. They won't be able to hide it from the boss in the end if a complaint is progressed but at least your wife will have some assurance that only the people who absolutely need to know will be informed and management might be more careful because they know she made a point of insisting on absolute discretion. I can understand why husbands and partners might be tempted to get in there and have a go at him but you can't do that. He sounds like a horrible slippery weasel and next thing you know, she'll be accusing him of things she actually 'wanted' him to do and got worried so told fibs to her hubby who turned up and 'threatened' him. Keep yourself cleaner than clean and don't give him any ammo. Oh, and I'd change your avatar too by the way....given the subject matter it may not be helpful... Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Tams bird Posted January 21, 2012 Share Posted January 21, 2012 Similar thing happened to my cousin ( tho must be blind). She complained and she got shifted to another dept).Tho I said should have been him. Tell your wife to knee him the nuts.. Or carry an attack alarm if he touches or comes near heragain .. He must have wee ^^^^ syndrome, Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
H J Simpson Posted January 21, 2012 Share Posted January 21, 2012 Tell her to scream really loud in the office next time he does it and see what he says when all the office come running to see what's happend Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Johanes de Silentio Posted January 21, 2012 Share Posted January 21, 2012 Even if sexual harrassment really is so hard to prove, your Mrs still needs to report it - it will have some effect on this creep. If he continues to harrass your Mrs after that, then you need to go in and have a word with the boy - no violence, though - well, not the first time. [mod edit] And I'll leave you with one final word... mace. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Grumpy Posted January 21, 2012 Share Posted January 21, 2012 She's got to report this but don't expect too much as it'll be one persons word against another at the moment i.e. no one will be able to do much unless there's an admission, a witness or a possibly a security video. Without evidence the guy won't get sacked or even charged by the police. The company is still expected to act reasonably though - maybe putting procedures in place to prevent them ever being alone / something along those lines. Even if he's aware he's being watched it might be enough. Depends whats reasonable for the company though. If the official approach gets no where, remember the need for evidence works both ways (not that I'd condone anything illegal), but if you were to have a quiet word yourself, it might have an effect. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Tiberius Stinkfinger Posted January 21, 2012 Share Posted January 21, 2012 In all seriousness, if I was ever in the situation of the Op, I would be having a wee word with the predator. If this is not the way the Op wants to deal with it then I think you should be informing the Old Bill as soon as possible. A little stat for you "97% of callers to Rape Crisis Lines knew their assailant prior to the assault". This is serious shite and should be dealt with now. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
The Gasman Posted January 21, 2012 Share Posted January 21, 2012 You and your Mrs need to get your heads round a couple of things here. 1) What you are describing is not just sexual harassment, it is assault. 2) Your Mrs has done nothing to encourage this, she is the victim. 3) If it does get messy, your Mrs has done nothing wrong, it's the result of the other person's actions. 4) By your own admission the guys waits till there's no witnesses, so your Mrs may not be the only victim. These attacks on your wife (because that's what they are) seem to be increasing in both frequency and severity, which setts alarms ringing for me. It seems extremely unlikely this twisted individual is now going to stop of their own accord. As a matter of urgency, and for her own safety, your wife must speak to someone to get action taken about this. If she cannot face speaking to one of her bosses face to face, then put it all in an email to them. If not contact the police, they have specialist female officers trained specifically to be able to help people in your wife's situation. Make sure you support your wife, and make very sure that she understands she has done nothing wrong. She needs to stop feeling sorry for him, and realise that there can be no excuses, no one should ever have to put up with what she is. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest GhostHunter Posted January 21, 2012 Share Posted January 21, 2012 This (if I'm reading it correctly) is sexual assault. She should go directly to the police. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Angry Haggis Posted January 21, 2012 Share Posted January 21, 2012 Wait a minute - am I missing something here? If this happened outside of the workplace it would be a sexual assault. Get management told and make a complaint to the police, you can instruct the police not to take action if you like but it will go down on paper for any future reference. There is harmless flirting and there's crossing the line - this instance has gone way beyond harmless and its utterly unacceptable behaviour Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Moderators JKBMod 7 Posted January 21, 2012 Moderators Share Posted January 21, 2012 Some posts have been removed or edited already, so a quick reminder of one of our rules: 13. Do not encourage or condone criminal activity and do not encourage or condone violence. Keep the advice constructive and within the rules please. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
cosanostra Posted January 21, 2012 Share Posted January 21, 2012 I would be straight in there personally, with her in the managers office first thing on Monday morning. Tell the boss that your wife has kept a diary of all of his antics including several incidences of sexual assault and that unless this is dealt with immediately, you'll both be going straight to the police and consulting a lawyer. Tell him that your wife is afraid to go to work and she's suffering horribly from stress because of this guy. To the OP, what on earth are you waiting for? Man up and deal with this. Your wife clearly needs your help so go and help her. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Godfather Posted January 21, 2012 Share Posted January 21, 2012 You need to get this reported straight away mate, the next time he does something like that he might not stop. Then you and your partner have even worse consequences to live with. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Jezza Posted January 21, 2012 Share Posted January 21, 2012 Oh aye as for evidence. Tape recorder in her pocket next time she's at work, keep it on when alone until the weirdo appears and catch what he's saying then go to police. If they hear gives a kiss and what you going to do he's done. Who the hell does that shit? Creepy wee pat mcginley. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Currahee! Posted January 21, 2012 Share Posted January 21, 2012 She needs to go to the police. Its sexual assault. Going to her boss isn't enough. The little creep will shit his pants when they arrive. Even if it comes to nothing it'll stop it happening again. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
kingantti1874 Posted January 21, 2012 Share Posted January 21, 2012 I'll be honest, I'm surprised advice is needed here... Get it sorted out now Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest GhostHunter Posted January 21, 2012 Share Posted January 21, 2012 She needs to go to the police. Its sexual assault. Going to her boss isn't enough. The little creep will shit his pants when they arrive. Even if it comes to nothing it'll stop it happening again. This. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Sterling Archer Posted January 21, 2012 Share Posted January 21, 2012 The worrying thing here is the escalation and how quick it's happened. People in offices flirt all the time but the fact that he's moved on from that so quickly is a huge red flag. The truth is that shit sticks and by reporting him you plant the idea in people's heads. This means that if something happens to someone else the boss is far more likely to take action. You need to sell hard on the "you'd be stopping it happen to others" line as well. Hope this works out for you. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Ryan McGowan Posted January 21, 2012 Share Posted January 21, 2012 The "what are you going to do" line suggests he's confident at getting away with it. This must be reported as a matter of urgency. If someone walked up to your wife in the street and grabbed her like that, there would be no hesitation in saying that it was completely unacceptable and a criminal act. If it is someone she knows at work doing it, that does not make it acceptable, no matter what connections he has with the boss. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Midloth_Iain Posted January 21, 2012 Share Posted January 21, 2012 Discreet web-cam. Audio recording of next incident. Police. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
kingantti1874 Posted January 21, 2012 Share Posted January 21, 2012 I'm afraid if someone kissed my wife's neck... Once never mind more than once her opinion on the matter would be superceeded... May be wrong but it would be as natural as drawing breath or blinking... That said - the more sensible approach is the police... But sometimes sensible is not what is called for... Maybe in this instance a not so friendly warning would be appropriate. Doing nothing is not an option... You shouldn't tolerate this for 1 more day.. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest GhostHunter Posted January 21, 2012 Share Posted January 21, 2012 Members are reminded of Mod7's post in this thread. One member banned from the thread - the next less than helpful and rule breaking post will get the same treatment as well as an infraction. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Sharky999 Posted January 21, 2012 Share Posted January 21, 2012 tell us who he is and where he lives, The JKB boys will sort him out. In all seriousness tho mate the guy who works in HR and posted on page 1 is spot on, got to management or HR, and make them aware that if its not sorted you are going to the police. We had someone in our work who was harrassing women and he got emptied. Good luck Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Jambothump Posted January 21, 2012 Share Posted January 21, 2012 Get your wife to write him a letter, detailing all the instances that assault has taken place, dates, time and detail. Hand it to him the next time she sees him. The closing paragraph should state that she will be taking this no further, but two colleagues are aware of the problems he is causing her, and also have copies of said letter. Should another incidence take place, this will be forwarded to the company boss and the police. The down side being he could escalate to management that she is defaming/slandering him to colleagues. Unless some positive action is taken though, her situation will get worse from this creep. Not a very satisfying conclusion, but enough to stop his reprehensible behaviour, without direct confrontation. I do get the impression that fear of confrontation from your wife, is what encourages him. This method keeps that out the way, but hopefully is enough to scare him off. jt Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest GhostHunter Posted January 21, 2012 Share Posted January 21, 2012 Ok. The inability to read earlier warnings has led to this thread being closed. Dexter. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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