Walter Bishop Posted June 10, 2010 Share Posted June 10, 2010 Given all the rumours about players and if hey were to come off, Do you think we have a 1st 11 capable of going all the way? Kello Thomson Barr Zaliukas Wallace Templeton Jonsson Bryson? Driver Kyle Griffiths? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest GhostHunter Posted June 10, 2010 Share Posted June 10, 2010 No Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
super_vlad Posted June 10, 2010 Share Posted June 10, 2010 Given all the rumours about players and if hey were to come off, Do you think we have a 1st 11 capable of going all the way? Kello Thomson Barr Zaliukas Wallace Templeton Jonsson Bryson? Driver Kyle Griffiths? that team if it stays fit could beat anyone in the league, but not sure it would be constent enough to go for the title! Plus as long as ***** like macdonald are around we won't be changling for anything ! Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
maroonshrew Posted June 10, 2010 Share Posted June 10, 2010 Not even close. For a team to challenge for the title, you need to ask yourself about how it compares to the current champions. How many of that startign eleven would walk into Rangers' title winning side last year. I would say an on form Driver and Wallace stand a shout but even then Papac is no mug. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Ray Gunn Posted June 10, 2010 Share Posted June 10, 2010 I think rangers will probally win again,but the whole Lennon thing will go tits up,so depending on who we sign,us and Utd might run them close for 2nd. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
johnjl Posted June 10, 2010 Share Posted June 10, 2010 Given all the rumours about players and if hey were to come off, Do you think we have a 1st 11 capable of going all the way? Kello Thomson Barr Zaliukas Wallace Templeton Jonsson Bryson? Driver Kyle Griffiths? yes i do. i think another midfielder and forward and we are pretty near the mark (bryson a good choice but maybe not griffiths). a lot depends on if we keep driver and wallace or not. i also think lennon will make a complete mess of things at darkheid and walter smith won`t get the players he needs and will field a weaker side than last year blowing the whole league wide open. my only reservation about your side is that i am not so sure about craig thomson defensively (assuming it is craig thomson you mean and not jason). i would play eggert at right back and ryan stevenson in midfield (i firmly believe ryan will make the step up next term and surprise a few people). but overall Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
We_are_the_Hearts Posted June 10, 2010 Share Posted June 10, 2010 No chance, good enough for third though. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Ron 5 Posted June 10, 2010 Share Posted June 10, 2010 No chance wont even be within 20 points Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
johnjl Posted June 10, 2010 Share Posted June 10, 2010 Not even close. For a team to challenge for the title, you need to ask yourself about how it compares to the current champions. How many of that startign eleven would walk into Rangers' title winning side last year. I would say an on form Driver and Wallace stand a shout but even then Papac is no mug. i disagree rangers will be weakened next season and hearts will be stronger (assuming we keep driver and wallace and add a couple more). if jj can instill some belief and consistency hearts could top the lot next season. rangers weren`t even that good last year the rest of the league were just p1ss poor. even the rangers fans admitted it was one of the poorest teams in memory but every other team was even worse.while rangers remained consistently ok but not great. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Auld Reekin' Posted June 10, 2010 Share Posted June 10, 2010 I think rangers will probally win again,but the whole Lennon thing will go tits up,so depending on who we sign,us and Utd might run them close for 2nd. And, even if it doesn't, it will undoubtedly be a "transitional" season for the ticks: it would be unrealistic - unless they make some absolutely exceptional signings - for a very inexperienced manager like Lennon to get it sufficiently right in his first full season to provide a genuine challenge for the league. Therefore, I agree that rangers will be very firm favourites for the title, and that Utd should be capable of giving the ticks a very good battle for second place. Don't really see us finishing above 4th, even if we do sign Bryson and Griffiths, but if JJ & team can work their magic again, you never know! Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Cut The Crap Posted June 10, 2010 Share Posted June 10, 2010 Given all the rumours about players and if hey were to come off, Do you think we have a 1st 11 capable of going all the way? Kello Thomson Barr Zaliukas Wallace Templeton Jonsson Bryson? Driver Kyle Griffiths? No. Would compete for top six though. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
colinmaroon Posted June 10, 2010 Share Posted June 10, 2010 We don't have the strength in depth - even if the team plays above itself! I do think that Rangers and Celtic may well lose more games next season than "normal" for the Bigot Brothers, but for us to win consistently would require: 1 Few injuries - particularly to key players 2 Getting the breaks 3 A seismic shift in our treatment from officialdom The first two are possible, the 3rd is improbable. PS I hate the "bugs" in this forum's posting/editing facility. It's a pain!!! ..................... Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
The Incredible Sulk Posted June 10, 2010 Share Posted June 10, 2010 Nope. Depending on who else we bring in we might be good enough for 4th or 3rd but I think we can start building towards a challenge over the next few seasons, provided JJ doesn't go the way of the others... Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest GhostHunter Posted June 10, 2010 Share Posted June 10, 2010 We could bring in Messi and Ronaldo, and still not win the league. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
We_are_the_Hearts Posted June 10, 2010 Share Posted June 10, 2010 The 3 times we have challenged for the title since the 80s we have had a settled side with good players. We also did well in 2006 but that was because we bought a high standard of player. Most fans would have agreed on the strongest 11 in those seasons and we steered clear of any major injuries. We are a long way off that just now but the hope for this season is that JJ can build a strong base for the next again season. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Charlie-Brown Posted June 10, 2010 Share Posted June 10, 2010 That team doesn't include Palazeulos, Black, Stevenson, Suso, Obua, Bouzid or younger players like McGowan & others - all of whom will probably feature regularly - especially given you could count on one hand the amount of games where we've made zero changes from week to week in the last five years. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
shaun.lawson Posted June 10, 2010 Share Posted June 10, 2010 No. It's quite impossible to challenge for the title, and I bet JJ knows that better than anyone else. 2010/11 is about him building his own team, progressing and playing much better football, with the aim of a top four finish (and hopefully 3rd rather than 4th). Rome wasn't built in a day; and any dream repeat of 1997/8 will have to wait for at least one more season. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
heartsfc_fan Posted June 10, 2010 Share Posted June 10, 2010 That team will get a top 4 finish. Let's be realistic here, Celtic are looking into the possibility of signing Robbie Keane on a longer term deal we cannot compete with the wages on offer over there. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
johnjl Posted June 10, 2010 Share Posted June 10, 2010 We don't have the strength in depth - even if the team plays above itself! I do think that Rangers and Celtic may well lose more games next season than "normal" for the Bigot Brothers, but for us to win consistently would require: 1 Few injuries - particularly to key players 2 Getting the breaks 3 A seismic shift in our treatment from officialdom The first two are possible, the 3rd is improbable. PS I hate the "bugs" in this forum's posting/editing facility. It's a pain!!! ..................... i think we will have more strength in depth the younger players all have a bit of experience under their belt now and we won`t be as unlucky with injuries next year cos jj will have them all fitter. the breaks even themselves out and we are due our turn and screw officialdom it will be a triumph over adversity. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest GhostHunter Posted June 10, 2010 Share Posted June 10, 2010 Remind me again the last time Killie, or indeed Falkirk () won the league ? Our team as the OP posted would be FAR too lightweight... Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
johnjl Posted June 10, 2010 Share Posted June 10, 2010 No. It's quite impossible to challenge for the title, and I bet JJ knows that better than anyone else. 2010/11 is about him building his own team, progressing and playing much better football, with the aim of a top four finish (and hopefully 3rd rather than 4th). Rome wasn't built in a day; and any dream repeat of 1997/8 will have to wait for at least one more season. i doubt jj is as negative as you think. he will concentrate in making us as strong as he can and focus on showing up the weejies for the average teams that they are. nobody expected us to be challenging in 86 or before the season started in 06 but we were close on both occasions. the old firm WON`T continue to win the league from now until the end of time and as the third biggest club we must BELIEVE we can make an impact or we never will. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
johnjl Posted June 10, 2010 Share Posted June 10, 2010 Remind me again the last time Killie, or indeed Falkirk () won the league ? Our team as the OP posted would be FAR too lightweight... what have killie or falkirk got to do with it? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Charlie-Brown Posted June 10, 2010 Share Posted June 10, 2010 The title is a massive ask for any non Old Firm team and requires a perfect season in terms of form, injuries, luck and refereeing decisions and requires to beat BOTH Rangers and Celtic ..... maybe a better question would be are Hearts or any of the teams good enough to challenge for SECOND place? (which is still an OVER-ACHIEVEMENT in itself given the Uglies inherent advantages) Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest GhostHunter Posted June 10, 2010 Share Posted June 10, 2010 what have killie or falkirk got to do with it? Hmmm Let me think now. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
shaun.lawson Posted June 10, 2010 Share Posted June 10, 2010 i doubt jj is as negative as you think. he will concentrate in making us as strong as he can and focus on showing up the weejies for the average teams that they are. nobody expected us to be challenging in 86 or before the season started in 06 but we were close on both occasions. the old firm WON`T continue to win the league from ow until the end of term and as the third biggest club we must BELIEVE we can make an impact or we never will. It's not about being 'negative'. It's about not running before we can walk first. Last time, it took JJ two full seasons to build a side capable of challenging - and it's no less difficult this time around, because as the OF have declined over the intervening period, so have everyone else. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
johnjl Posted June 10, 2010 Share Posted June 10, 2010 Hmmm Let me think now. ok i have clearly missed something so why not humour me by explaining your point? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Geoff Kilpatrick Posted June 10, 2010 Share Posted June 10, 2010 I have us down for 4th at the minute. That says more about the rest of the league than it does about us. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Radgeworks Posted June 10, 2010 Share Posted June 10, 2010 Absolutely nae chance at all. Nevermind how many of them would get in the current rangers team, they would all toil to get into our 06 runners up team. You get hella props for optimism though. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
johnjl Posted June 10, 2010 Share Posted June 10, 2010 It's not about being 'negative'. It's about not running before we can walk first. Last time, it took JJ two full seasons to build a side capable of challenging - and it's no less difficult this time around, because as the OF have declined over the intervening period, so have everyone else. i think it is less difficult this time we only need another two or three players to have a team capable of hurting the old firm. last time jj was here i think both O.F. teams were much stronger than they are now. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Craig Herbertson Posted June 10, 2010 Share Posted June 10, 2010 i doubt jj is as negative as you think. he will concentrate in making us as strong as he can and focus on showing up the weejies for the average teams that they are. nobody expected us to be challenging in 86 or before the season started in 06 but we were close on both occasions. the old firm WON`T continue to win the league from now until the end of time and as the third biggest club we must BELIEVE we can make an impact or we never will. I think this is the issue. We shouldn't be unrealistic but we have to get the mindset 'when' not 'if'. We've got to start believing its going to be soon. I think it also means challenging officialdom and challenging the OF economic stranglehold in as many practical ways as possible. Edinburgh is thriving city. Some kind of challenge should surely be possible Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
shaun.lawson Posted June 10, 2010 Share Posted June 10, 2010 i think it is less difficult this time we only need another two or three players to have a team capable of hurting the old firm. last time jj was here i think both O.F. teams were much stronger than they are now. Yes, and so were we. Last season, Dundee United were, over a whole season, miles ahead of us, and will be the team to beat for 3rd. How many points did they finish behind Rangers? 24. How many points did they finish behind a shocking Celtic, a team so bad it lost 4-0 at St Mirren and got papped out the Cup by Ross County? 18. That says everything as far as I'm concerned - and if we have a season as good as United enjoyed, I and every other Hearts fan will be in dreamland. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
johnjl Posted June 10, 2010 Share Posted June 10, 2010 Yes, and so were we. Last season, Dundee United were, over a whole season, miles ahead of us, and will be the team to beat for 3rd. How many points did they finish behind Rangers? 24. How many points did they finish behind a shocking Celtic, a team so bad it lost 4-0 at St Mirren and got papped out the Cup by Ross County? 18. That says everything as far as I'm concerned - and if we have a season as good as United enjoyed, I and every other Hearts fan will be in dreamland. if we win the cup then yes obviously dreamland is where i will be as well. third place however is the absolute minimum we should accept as supporters of the third biggest club with the third biggest support, budget etc. if we establish ourselves as up there beside the old firm early in the season and it becomes a threes horse race then we have every chance of winning it. rangers and celtic could end up with the same injury chaos as we had or just not get the breaks. luck plays a part and we are due a bit of that too. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest Dipped Flake Posted June 10, 2010 Share Posted June 10, 2010 what have killie or falkirk got to do with it? I presume he means because we have taken a player from Kille and one from Falkirk the best we can hope for is just escaping relegation on the last day!!! Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Snake Plissken Posted June 10, 2010 Share Posted June 10, 2010 In a word: no. Can this team finish third? Probably. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
CBjambo Posted June 10, 2010 Share Posted June 10, 2010 No. I reckon good enough for best of the rest tho. We need a top goalscorer and a leader on the pitch and tbh I don't see a great leader in that team. If we managed to sign a real top class goalscorer and a midfield powerhouse and we found ourselves a truly inspirational captain and leader (in the Pressley mould) we'd have a side worth challenging! Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
johnjl Posted June 10, 2010 Share Posted June 10, 2010 I presume he means because we have taken a player from Kille and one from Falkirk the best we can hope for is just escaping relegation on the last day!!! that is what i thought he might mean. i pressume he thinks rangers signed boyd, broadfoot and naismith from man united. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest GhostHunter Posted June 10, 2010 Share Posted June 10, 2010 that is what i thought he might mean i pressume he thinks rangers signed boyd, broadfoot and naismith from man united. Um. The difference being, those player (clubfoot aside) actually had a decent amount of talent. Boyd was top scorer in the league pretty much most seasons, and naismith ran riot against most teams. Had we signed players of that calibre, then we MAY have a chance, but to bring in Kyle (who is unproven at scoring against "top" sides, Barr and the possibility of Bryson and Leila Griffin - putting them is a side who are quite young - will not win the league. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Charlie-Brown Posted June 10, 2010 Share Posted June 10, 2010 A better question would be can we have a right good go at the BIG CUP and the wee cup - these are far more realistic and achievable ambitions in my opinion given we only finished 6th last season. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
hughesie27 Posted June 10, 2010 Share Posted June 10, 2010 Nope and I don't think that should be where we are aiming. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
DETTY29 Posted June 10, 2010 Share Posted June 10, 2010 Given all the rumours about players and if hey were to come off, Do you think we have a 1st 11 capable of going all the way? Kello Thomson Barr Zaliukas Wallace Templeton Jonsson Bryson? Driver Kyle Griffiths? No, All you have to do is start, McGregogor, Boruc, Kello Then work your way throught the rest of the 2 Old Firm teams. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Hagar the Horrible Posted June 10, 2010 Share Posted June 10, 2010 Now that Driver has been formally cleared to play for Scotland that will give him insentive to be all alround better player. I can see us splitting the OF only If the Ellis deal falls through and we keep Driver and Wallace. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Creepy Lurker Posted June 10, 2010 Share Posted June 10, 2010 if we win the cup then yes obviously dreamland is where i will be as well. third place however is the absolute minimum we should accept as supporters of the third biggest club with the third biggest support, budget etc... Always hate the lazy complacency of comments such as this. Third place the absolute minimum? How long have you been supporting Hearts for? I'm only 22, and even in my lifetime (when we've been comparatively successful) third place has never been the 'absolute minimum' to which we could aim. To answer the original question, the first point is that two of those players haven't even signed for us yet (and may well not sign at all). If they did, it'd be a good enough starting lineup to finish third and, with a bit of luck regarding injuries and the Old Firm, maybe mount some kind of challenge to finish higher than that. Any injuries, though, and we'd be goosed. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
johnjl Posted June 10, 2010 Share Posted June 10, 2010 Um. The difference being, those player (clubfoot aside) actually had a decent amount of talent. Boyd was top scorer in the league pretty much most seasons, and naismith ran riot against most teams. Had we signed players of that calibre, then we MAY have a chance, but to bring in Kyle (who is unproven at scoring against "top" sides, Barr and the possibility of Bryson and Leila Griffin - putting them is a side who are quite young - will not win the league. kyle was an absolute standout for killie the season before last and was unlucky with an injury last term but still managed to score goals in a wholly defensive set up. he is also recognised at international level so it isn`t just me that rates him. bryson clearly has leadership qualities, spl experience and jj knows all about him. griffiths is a tube and i don`t think he will sign. time will tell about the league but your point about `when did falkirk or killie win the league` is a poor one. bad players come from good teams and good players from bad. it is just a question of sorting the wheat from the chaff. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Charlie-Brown Posted June 10, 2010 Share Posted June 10, 2010 If some of the younger players can establish themselves or at least make themselves regular contributors and reproduce their abilities at first team level then that would be a real bonus and we could have a significantly better season than last season - but winning the league is a huge leap in one season - let's just try to do the very best we can and be the best we can be. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
johnjl Posted June 10, 2010 Share Posted June 10, 2010 Always hate the lazy complacency of comments such as this. Third place the absolute minimum? How long have you been supporting Hearts for? I'm only 22, and even in my lifetime (when we've been comparatively successful) third place has never been the 'absolute minimum' to which we could aim. To answer the original question, the first point is that two of those players haven't even signed for us yet (and may well not sign at all). If they did, it'd be a good enough starting lineup to finish third and, with a bit of luck regarding injuries and the Old Firm, maybe mount some kind of challenge to finish higher than that. Any injuries, though, and we'd be goosed. around 30 years is how long i have supported hearts i attended my first game when i was 7 or 8 and then started going regularly at around 12. there is absolutely nothing lazy about my opinion you may say it is wrong if you wish but not lazy. the old firm are the 2 biggest clubs in scotland and second place is the absolute minimum they will accept so as the third biggest club in scotland why on earth should anything under third be considered acceptable. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest GhostHunter Posted June 10, 2010 Share Posted June 10, 2010 kyle was an absolute standout for killie the season before last and was unlucky with an injury last term but still managed to score goals in a wholly defensive set up. he is also recognised at international level so it isn`t just me that rates him. bryson clearly has leadership qualities, spl experience and jj knows all about him. griffiths is a tube and i don`t think he will sign. time will tell about the league but your point about `when did falkirk or killie win the league` is a poor one. bad players come from good teams and good players from bad. it is just a question of sorting the wheat from the chaff. Kyle last season pretty much only scored against lowly teams in the SPL, certainly not rangers/celtic or indeed us. IMO - he is a false hope for next season, though I will stand corrected if he turns in 15+ goals next term. Oh, and IIRC, he's only played once for Scotland... Bryson may very well be a good signing, but it's still hearsay at the moment... Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
shaun.lawson Posted June 10, 2010 Share Posted June 10, 2010 Always hate the lazy complacency of comments such as this. Third place the absolute minimum? How long have you been supporting Hearts for? I'm only 22, and even in my lifetime (when we've been comparatively successful) third place has never been the 'absolute minimum' to which we could aim. To answer the original question, the first point is that two of those players haven't even signed for us yet (and may well not sign at all). If they did, it'd be a good enough starting lineup to finish third and, with a bit of luck regarding injuries and the Old Firm, maybe mount some kind of challenge to finish higher than that. Any injuries, though, and we'd be goosed. Third place isn't the absolute minimum. Barring a colossal injection of cash, it's the absolute maximum! Albeit, we should finish 3rd considerably more often than anyone else outwith the OF. That sums up what I call the "Hearts curse": 3rd place is actually very good, but because we're the third biggest club, we think we should be doing better. Yet the gap to the two above us is mighty, mighty - and always will be too. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest GhostHunter Posted June 10, 2010 Share Posted June 10, 2010 Third place isn't the absolute minimum. Barring a colossal injection of cash, it's the absolute maximum! Albeit, we should finish 3rd considerably more often than anyone else outwith the OF. That sums up what I call the "Hearts curse": 3rd place is actually very good, but because we're the third biggest club, we think we should be doing better. Yet the gap to the two above us is mighty, mighty - and always will be too. I think the Celtic/Lennon love in bubble will burst quite soon into the new season, so were we able to actually pick up points against the teams we SHOULD pick up point from, then we should be pushing for 2nd. As to 1st ? No. The SFA would have annurisms were anyone other than the OF win Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
The Merse Posted June 10, 2010 Share Posted June 10, 2010 Bit rich for us to call the Hobos delusional when threads like this appear on here. Title contenders FFS. You must be joking. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
johnjl Posted June 10, 2010 Share Posted June 10, 2010 Kyle last season pretty much only scored against lowly teams in the SPL, certainly not rangers/celtic or indeed us. IMO - he is a false hope for next season, though I will stand corrected if he turns in 15+ goals next term. Oh, and IIRC, he's only played once for Scotland... Bryson may very well be a good signing, but it's still hearsay at the moment... bear in mind it wasn`t me who posted the original team featuring bryson and griffiths. i disagree completely about kyle and think he is just what our creative wide players need. you are wrong about his cap tally he has played 10 times for scotland. checked three different sources. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Recommended Posts
Archived
This topic is now archived and is closed to further replies.