John mcCartney Posted March 24, 2020 Share Posted March 24, 2020 3 hours ago, Everybody Loves Baz! said: Received an email from our club captain sayin if we play alone or one other, our course will stay open as long as possible. Obviously the holes have been risen, no rakes, no ball washers etc etc. aaaaaaaaand what golf club is this chief,care to divulge ? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
merrymac Posted March 24, 2020 Share Posted March 24, 2020 19 minutes ago, John mcCartney said: aaaaaaaaand what golf club is this chief,care to divulge ? Here maybe Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
hmfc_liam06 Posted March 25, 2020 Share Posted March 25, 2020 Yep good news regarding green keepers allowed to work, if one positive to come out of it it's that the courses should be in tip top shape once we're out of this. Read an article on how catastrophic it could be if courses were left abandoned for the spring, we'd basically be looking at writing off the greens for the year. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Samuel Camazzola Posted March 25, 2020 Share Posted March 25, 2020 19 minutes ago, hmfc_liam06 said: Yep good news regarding green keepers allowed to work, if one positive to come out of it it's that the courses should be in tip top shape once we're out of this. Read an article on how catastrophic it could be if courses were left abandoned for the spring, we'd basically be looking at writing off the greens for the year. Head of Golf England was on Sky last week saying if greens were left untouched for three weeks, they could take up to three months to get back to normal. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
hmfc_liam06 Posted March 25, 2020 Share Posted March 25, 2020 1 minute ago, Samuel Camazzola said: Head of Golf England was on Sky last week saying if greens were left untouched for three weeks, they could take up to three months to get back to normal. Yep, would be a write off. There could be inches of growth and you can only cut 1/3 off at a time, can't just go out and cut greens back to normal. Plus there's then the thatching, growth of disease and other things. They'd then need cored, top dressed etc. Disaster basically. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Samuel Camazzola Posted March 25, 2020 Share Posted March 25, 2020 (edited) 2 minutes ago, hmfc_liam06 said: Yep, would be a write off. There could be inches of growth and you can only cut 1/3 off at a time, can't just go out and cut greens back to normal. Plus there's then the thatching, growth of disease and other things. They'd then need cored, top dressed etc. Disaster basically. I imagine there will have been plenty courses out of sight from the public eye which would have been getting essential maintenance carried out even if the clarity wasn't there. Edited March 25, 2020 by Samuel Camazzola Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Samuel Camazzola Posted March 25, 2020 Share Posted March 25, 2020 If anyone enjoyed The Cut podcast before the BBC bizarrely decided to pull it, Andrew Cotter has launched a new podcast with Eddie Pepperell - The Pepper Pod - which is very good. It can be found on all the usual places including Spotify. I didn't realise that Eddie has bought a place in Edinburgh and spends a lot of time in Scotland now. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
John mcCartney Posted March 25, 2020 Share Posted March 25, 2020 11 hours ago, merrymac said: Here maybe by this time next week,the Fair Isle course could be rather desirable !!!! Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Tommy Brown Posted March 25, 2020 Share Posted March 25, 2020 23 hours ago, Harry Potter said: I normally play by myself, nae mates . Not good, mate. An invite to Pumpherston awaits. Hopefully this season,🙃 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
merrymac Posted March 25, 2020 Share Posted March 25, 2020 3 hours ago, John mcCartney said: by this time next week,the Fair Isle course could be rather desirable !!!! Yep could be set for big queues at the first tee - two metres apart of course Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Victorian Posted March 25, 2020 Author Share Posted March 25, 2020 I'm resigned to no golf until the autumn. It might be temp greens for a wee mini-season and then surviving clubs can prepare for next season. God knows if clubs will survive. Member numbers for next season will probably take a battering for various reasons. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Irufushi Posted March 25, 2020 Share Posted March 25, 2020 Undecided still. I’d be renewing to keep my handicap by the looks of things. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
OBE Posted March 25, 2020 Share Posted March 25, 2020 2 hours ago, Victorian said: I'm resigned to no golf until the autumn. It might be temp greens for a wee mini-season and then surviving clubs can prepare for next season. God knows if clubs will survive. Member numbers for next season will probably take a battering for various reasons. Aye, your right, a bad winter unfortunately claims numerous seniors. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Victorian Posted March 25, 2020 Author Share Posted March 25, 2020 3 minutes ago, Old Blue Eyes said: Aye, your right, a bad winter unfortunately claims numerous seniors. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Harry Potter Posted March 25, 2020 Share Posted March 25, 2020 4 hours ago, Tommy Brown said: Not good, mate. An invite to Pumpherston awaits. Hopefully this season,🙃 Thankyou Tommy.. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
merrymac Posted March 25, 2020 Share Posted March 25, 2020 1 hour ago, Irufushi said: Undecided still. I’d be renewing to keep my handicap by the looks of things. Too late for me paid early The only consideration might be if a lot of clubs go to the wall, there may be pressure on those left for memberships? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
OBE Posted March 25, 2020 Share Posted March 25, 2020 24 minutes ago, merrymac said: Too late for me paid early The only consideration might be if a lot of clubs go to the wall, there may be pressure on those left for memberships? Do you mean pressure on punters looking for an alternative or pressure on surviving golf clubs? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
merrymac Posted March 25, 2020 Share Posted March 25, 2020 1 minute ago, Old Blue Eyes said: Do you mean pressure on punters looking for an alternative or pressure on surviving golf clubs? Both really. Might be lots of golfers and few golf clubs. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
OBE Posted March 25, 2020 Share Posted March 25, 2020 9 minutes ago, merrymac said: Both really. Might be lots of golfers and few golf clubs. Last I heard, only 5 clubs in East Lothian with a waiting list. If clubs do go under, their unfortunate members still willing to maintain a membership could transfer to a stronger surviving club that has also seen their membership decimated. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
merrymac Posted March 25, 2020 Share Posted March 25, 2020 (edited) 6 minutes ago, Old Blue Eyes said: Last I heard, only 5 clubs in East Lothian with a waiting list. If clubs do go under, their unfortunate members still willing to maintain a membership could transfer to a stronger surviving club that has also seen their membership decimated. Agreed but these stronger clubs will have a limit on the number of new members they can accommodate. Sincerely hope it wont happen but demand could exceed supply for a period on resumption depending on the scale of disruption. Edited March 25, 2020 by merrymac Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
OBE Posted March 25, 2020 Share Posted March 25, 2020 1 minute ago, merrymac said: Agreed but these stronger clubs will have a limit on the number of new members they can accommodate. Sincerely hope it wont happen but demand could exceed supply for a period on resumption depending on the scale of disruption. The opposite could happen to the supply and demand, who knows? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
merrymac Posted March 25, 2020 Share Posted March 25, 2020 9 minutes ago, Old Blue Eyes said: The opposite could happen to the supply and demand, who knows? Absolutely people might not return after a lengthy break and the demand could go through the floor. Not an easy time to be a Club Committee Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Victorian Posted March 25, 2020 Author Share Posted March 25, 2020 Membership numbers was already a problem before this. In Edinburgh, some clubs got a small boost after Torphin and Lothianburn went and members relocated. It was already a school of thought that Edinburgh and Lothians clubs would benefit from another couple going. I think it's almost certain now. Most clubs have outsourced their bar and catering to franchise holders so there might be little loss in terms of that but they do tend to rely on visitor golf fees and clubhouse event hire. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
OBE Posted March 26, 2020 Share Posted March 26, 2020 10 hours ago, Victorian said: Membership numbers was already a problem before this. In Edinburgh, some clubs got a small boost after Torphin and Lothianburn went and members relocated. It was already a school of thought that Edinburgh and Lothians clubs would benefit from another couple going. I think it's almost certain now. Most clubs have outsourced their bar and catering to franchise holders so there might be little loss in terms of that but they do tend to rely on visitor golf fees and clubhouse event hire. Our annual membership subs are determined/reduced greatly by visitor green fees. Our huge VAT return (visitor green fees/travel agents) from HMRC over the last 10 years has contributed immensely to our current club house extension and renovation programme. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
hmfc_liam06 Posted March 26, 2020 Share Posted March 26, 2020 11 hours ago, Victorian said: Membership numbers was already a problem before this. In Edinburgh, some clubs got a small boost after Torphin and Lothianburn went and members relocated. It was already a school of thought that Edinburgh and Lothians clubs would benefit from another couple going. I think it's almost certain now. Most clubs have outsourced their bar and catering to franchise holders so there might be little loss in terms of that but they do tend to rely on visitor golf fees and clubhouse event hire. Our renewals happen between Feb and March so it's a shocker for us. Although I can see where some folk are coming from re not renewing until they know what's happening it really doesn't help the clubs in their hour of need. Sadly, these actions mean they may not have a club to go back to once this is over. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
OBE Posted March 26, 2020 Share Posted March 26, 2020 (edited) 9 minutes ago, hmfc_liam06 said: Our renewals happen between Feb and March so it's a shocker for us. Although I can see where some folk are coming from re not renewing until they know what's happening it really doesn't help the clubs in their hour of need. Sadly, these actions mean they may not have a club to go back to once this is over. Maybe clubs should look at a monthly DD, instead of one big annual payment. Edited March 26, 2020 by Old Blue Eyes Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
hmfc_liam06 Posted March 26, 2020 Share Posted March 26, 2020 2 minutes ago, Old Blue Eyes said: Maybe clubs should look at a monthly DD, instead of one big annual payment. The issue then is folk will just cancel them. Even if you use a 3rd party finance company, if someone cancels it's then the club who are liable to the finance company. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Tommy Brown Posted March 26, 2020 Share Posted March 26, 2020 14 minutes ago, Old Blue Eyes said: Maybe clubs should look at a monthly DD, instead of one big annual payment. Very much, I'm going to offer £110 per month over next six months. Would hate to think the club folding and me being partly to blame. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Ray Gin Posted March 26, 2020 Share Posted March 26, 2020 16 minutes ago, Old Blue Eyes said: Maybe clubs should look at a monthly DD, instead of one big annual payment. Mine already does. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Tommy Brown Posted March 26, 2020 Share Posted March 26, 2020 13 minutes ago, hmfc_liam06 said: The issue then is folk will just cancel them. Even if you use a 3rd party finance company, if someone cancels it's then the club who are liable to the finance company. Not convinced, Liam we use Fairway Credit?? and default lies with them to recover. I'm sure I'm correct. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Tommy Brown Posted March 26, 2020 Share Posted March 26, 2020 1 minute ago, Ray Gin said: Mine already does. we do standing order, but you are in advance. So you have your full subs in the club account for start of the season. Other than that you use Fairway Credit with interest. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
hmfc_liam06 Posted March 26, 2020 Share Posted March 26, 2020 41 minutes ago, Tommy Brown said: Not convinced, Liam we use Fairway Credit?? and default lies with them to recover. I'm sure I'm correct. Nope, if someone cancels their DD at the bank, Fairway Credit will chase the club for the money. I looked into this earlier on in the year for our club. One of our members is also a member at another club and they had 2 members cancel, Fairway Credit then took the money back from the club and they are now left chasing the ex-members through small claims court. The power is always with the 3rd party. They pay the club the money upfront, they certainly aren't taking a hit or going to the hassle of chasing/court action if someone defaults. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
OBE Posted March 26, 2020 Share Posted March 26, 2020 54 minutes ago, hmfc_liam06 said: The issue then is folk will just cancel them. Even if you use a 3rd party finance company, if someone cancels it's then the club who are liable to the finance company. I'm sure the vulnerable clubs would welcome the initial uptake of DD payments, thus enhancing confidence. If individuals financial commitments change going forward, then the club may have a few payments banked, which they wouldn't have if they stick with one lump sum. 40 minutes ago, Tommy Brown said: Very much, I'm going to offer £110 per month over next six months. Would hate to think the club folding and me being partly to blame. Fantastic gesture Tommy, spread the word and only the word, nothing else... 39 minutes ago, Ray Gin said: Mine already does. Maybe one day at mine...🤞 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
hmfc_liam06 Posted March 26, 2020 Share Posted March 26, 2020 Just now, Old Blue Eyes said: I'm sure the vulnerable clubs would welcome the initial uptake of DD payments, thus enhancing confidence. If individuals financial commitments change going forward, then the club may have a few payments banked, which they wouldn't have if they stick with one lump sum. Yeah we do offer payment schemes, we just don't use a 3rd party due to liabilities 👍 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Tommy Brown Posted March 26, 2020 Share Posted March 26, 2020 46 minutes ago, hmfc_liam06 said: Nope, if someone cancels their DD at the bank, Fairway Credit will chase the club for the money. I looked into this earlier on in the year for our club. One of our members is also a member at another club and they had 2 members cancel, Fairway Credit then took the money back from the club and they are now left chasing the ex-members through small claims court. The power is always with the 3rd party. They pay the club the money upfront, they certainly aren't taking a hit or going to the hassle of chasing/court action if someone defaults. Thanks for correcting me. Certainly not what I believed was the script. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
SectionG Posted March 26, 2020 Share Posted March 26, 2020 I received an email saying my April DD Payment has already been processed so will be taken but all future D’s will not be taken till a month after the course has opened again due to them taking April and we can’t play. Anyone who has paid for the year will have the number of months the course is shut removed from their fees for next year. Was very surprised by this, but a great gesture by the club. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
hmfc_liam06 Posted March 26, 2020 Share Posted March 26, 2020 12 minutes ago, SectionG said: I received an email saying my April DD Payment has already been processed so will be taken but all future D’s will not be taken till a month after the course has opened again due to them taking April and we can’t play. Anyone who has paid for the year will have the number of months the course is shut removed from their fees for next year. Was very surprised by this, but a great gesture by the club. Great if you can afford it. I doubt many can. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
hmfc_liam06 Posted March 26, 2020 Share Posted March 26, 2020 21 minutes ago, Tommy Brown said: Thanks for correcting me. Certainly not what I believed was the script. No problem. It was discussed at length at our AGM in January with us opting not to use a 3rd party purely because of liabilities. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Tommy Brown Posted March 26, 2020 Share Posted March 26, 2020 17 minutes ago, hmfc_liam06 said: No problem. It was discussed at length at our AGM in January with us opting not to use a 3rd party purely because of liabilities. Ive been on their site looking for t&c, but their link isnt working. Getting ratty to be honest. I fail to see the benefit in using them. I think you get commission. I would rather let people pay in full directly over a 6month max period. I'm making enquiries. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
hmfc_liam06 Posted March 26, 2020 Share Posted March 26, 2020 2 hours ago, Tommy Brown said: Ive been on their site looking for t&c, but their link isnt working. Getting ratty to be honest. I fail to see the benefit in using them. I think you get commission. I would rather let people pay in full directly over a 6month max period. I'm making enquiries. If you unearth info then pass it on, I may be totally wrong but our club captain as well as a few other members have spoken to them before and all said the same thing. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Tommy Brown Posted March 26, 2020 Share Posted March 26, 2020 14 minutes ago, hmfc_liam06 said: If you unearth info then pass it on, I may be totally wrong but our club captain as well as a few other members have spoken to them before and all said the same thing. Nah your correct text ex captain Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
merrymac Posted March 26, 2020 Share Posted March 26, 2020 2 hours ago, Tommy Brown said: Ive been on their site looking for t&c, but their link isnt working. Getting ratty to be honest. I fail to see the benefit in using them. I think you get commission. I would rather let people pay in full directly over a 6month max period. I'm making enquiries. Tommy, The main benefit for the Club is that they receive all monies upfront (usually at the start of the season) when costs are at their highest,and the member gets the benefit of paying over 10 months at a reasonable interest rate. Drawback for the club is they are responsible for any defaulters, which usually is a fairly small number, therefore making it worth the risk. Has been operating for many years at lots of clubs (including mine), and presume pretty successfully as it is still popular. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Tommy Brown Posted March 26, 2020 Share Posted March 26, 2020 1 minute ago, merrymac said: Tommy, The main benefit for the Club is that they receive all monies upfront (usually at the start of the season) when costs are at their highest,and the member gets the benefit of paying over 10 months at a reasonable interest rate. Drawback for the club is they are responsible for any defaulters, which usually is a fairly small number, therefore making it worth the risk. Has been operating for many years at lots of clubs (including mine), and presume pretty successfully as it is still popular. If I remember, I think they pay up full monies May. "Start of the season when costs are at their highest" - not disputing, but why? Greenstaff are always there over the year, bar turnover is at it's highest early then tails off. I imagine a large % pay in full by bank transfer/credit card (I generally have), so most money is already up front at the start. Not looking for an argument. not been to the last couple of agm's. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
merrymac Posted March 26, 2020 Share Posted March 26, 2020 1 minute ago, Tommy Brown said: If I remember, I think they pay up full monies May. "Start of the season when costs are at their highest" - not disputing, but why? Greenstaff are always there over the year, bar turnover is at it's highest early then tails off. I imagine a large % pay in full by bank transfer/credit card (I generally have), so most money is already up front at the start. Not looking for an argument. not been to the last couple of agm's. No worries Tommy, Basically high costs over winter - increased heating lighting etc Also most feeding, coring seeding happens early in season.(might include hiring in machinery) Fewer visitors over winter period means that a big cash injection is usually required, around March/April I am Ex Captain/committee member at my club and this was very much the issue most years Fairway credit allows the club to receive a lump sum, usually followed by a second payment around July I think) Might not work for every club, but a lot do use it. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
joondalupjambo Posted March 26, 2020 Share Posted March 26, 2020 (edited) 59 minutes ago, merrymac said: Drawback for the club is they are responsible for any defaulters, which usually is a fairly small number, therefore making it worth the risk. When you say defaulters what happens when folk die? Our club's average age is about 100 and each winter about 10 drop off the edge. Are the club liable under this type of scheme for these types of "defaulters" or are deaths treated differently by the finance company? No idea but was just thinking about it. Edited March 26, 2020 by joondalupjambo Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Tommy Brown Posted March 26, 2020 Share Posted March 26, 2020 1 minute ago, joondalupjambo said: When you say defaultets what happens when folk die? Our club's average age is about 100 and each winter about 10 drop off the edge. Are the club liable under this type of scheme for these types of "defaultets" or are deaths treated differently by the finance company? No idea but was just thinking about it. A charming use of dialogue Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
merrymac Posted March 26, 2020 Share Posted March 26, 2020 22 minutes ago, joondalupjambo said: When you say defaulters what happens when folk die? Our club's average age is about 100 and each winter about 10 drop off the edge. Are the club liable under this type of scheme for these types of "defaulters" or are deaths treated differently by the finance company? No idea but was just thinking about it. Interesting angle😄 I have to admit defeat on that particular subject 😂 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
hmfc_liam06 Posted March 26, 2020 Share Posted March 26, 2020 1 hour ago, Tommy Brown said: Nah your correct text ex captain Cheers, I thought so There's also the initial set up cost to factor in as well. Re deaths, I'd imagine that may be a totally different scenario. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Irufushi Posted March 26, 2020 Share Posted March 26, 2020 Bit the bullet and paid my membership. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
hmfc_liam06 Posted March 26, 2020 Share Posted March 26, 2020 1 minute ago, Irufushi said: Bit the bullet and paid my membership. I'm sure the club will appreciate the £££. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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