David McCaig Posted February 20 Posted February 20 1 minute ago, SIWYPod said: I just think currently a 433 is our best chance to see Altena actually play and develop at right back (an area we need a resolution to asap) He seems tidy on the ball and can drift in to midfield, which in a 433 shape he has the freedom to do as there is space he can move into Imo a 442 requires more positional discipline as each player (again in theory) doesn't have as much space to play themselves. In short, you need your full backs to predominantly defend and overlap the winger when going forward - Altena is good at the later but not so much the former imo. McInnes seems to like his defenders to defend first, which imo is why Altena despite being fit and available - isn't seeing the minutes from the start and comes on when a system is changed to suit his strengths. 433 next season - could be the tactical improvement switch up we need... who knows, it's all guesswork at this point 433 is the tactical switch we need now to be honest. We are at the stage of the season where draws become killers, so setting the team up not to lose can't be an option and even if we win, the league is so tight that goal difference could be a factor. We have to be on the front foot from this point onwards. If we win our 9 non-OF games between now and the end of the season we almost certainly win the League that has to be the goal.
Jambo dans les Pyrenees Posted February 20 Posted February 20 Out - Gordon, Clark, Borch, Forrester, Neilson, Kent, Devlin, Beni, Dhanda, Tait, Kartum, Pollock, Wilson, Kabangu, Leonard, Forrest, Braga, Kyzi plus maybe Steinwender and the Hoff. That’s between 18-20 players. Wow. We might get money for Clark, Wilson, Kabangu, Braga and Kyzi (and Steinwender if he goes),. 19 left. Christ, we have 39 players right now, albeit some on loan. GK - Shwolow, Fulton, Stone, McFarlane RB - Altena CH - Halkett, Findlay, McCart LB - Milne, Kingsley MF - Spittal, Magnusson, McEntee, Ageu Wingers - Chesnokov, Kerjota, Mato and the incoming McPake (to make 20) FW - Shanks, Kabore I think we might sign 5 or 6 players of real high quality with priorities on the centre halves (2?), strikers (2) and centre of midfield (2?) and then a few for the longer term. Think / hope we might make Leonard permanent too.
SIWYPod Posted February 20 Posted February 20 The caveat to all this is the wage structure also, as despite being (likely) in Europe next season - we'll still be playing "Hearts" level wages at this stage of the project you would assume. McInnes mentioned the striker search in January fell flat because one party of interest moved the goalposts as they felt because of our position we'd pay more - but it seems we are not ready to scale up the wage structure as of yet. Alternatively, we reduce the wage total due to the outgoings, and use the money saved from say 10 outgoings to bring in perhaps 6-7 players of upgraded quality to be immediate starters? It'll be interesting to see what sort of fees we pay in the summer as that'll likely give and indication of what our financial muscle looks like.
gorgieheart Posted February 20 Posted February 20 19 minutes ago, Jambo dans les Pyrenees said: Out - Gordon, Clark, Borch, Forrester, Neilson, Kent, Devlin, Beni, Dhanda, Tait, Kartum, Pollock, Wilson, Kabangu, Leonard, Forrest, Braga, Kyzi plus maybe Steinwender and the Hoff. That’s between 18-20 players. Wow. We might get money for Clark, Wilson, Kabangu, Braga and Kyzi (and Steinwender if he goes),. 19 left. Christ, we have 39 players right now, albeit some on loan. GK - Shwolow, Fulton, Stone, McFarlane RB - Altena CH - Halkett, Findlay, McCart LB - Milne, Kingsley MF - Spittal, Magnusson, McEntee, Ageu Wingers - Chesnokov, Kerjota, Mato and the incoming McPake (to make 20) FW - Shanks, Kabore I think we might sign 5 or 6 players of real high quality with priorities on the centre halves (2?), strikers (2) and centre of midfield (2?) and then a few for the longer term. Think / hope we might make Leonard permanent too. Leonard is contracted to Birmingham City till 2028, we wont break the bank to buy him for what they will want , nor will we match/better his wages.
Tour22 Posted February 20 Posted February 20 13 minutes ago, gorgieheart said: Leonard is contracted to Birmingham City till 2028, we wont break the bank to buy him for what they will want , nor will we match/better his wages. Another year on loan.
Ribble Posted February 20 Posted February 20 1 hour ago, Jambo dans les Pyrenees said: Out - Gordon, Clark, Borch, Forrester, Neilson, Kent, Devlin, Beni, Dhanda, Tait, Kartum, Pollock, Wilson, Kabangu, Leonard, Forrest, Braga, Kyzi plus maybe Steinwender and the Hoff. That’s between 18-20 players. Wow. We might get money for Clark, Wilson, Kabangu, Braga and Kyzi (and Steinwender if he goes),. 19 left. Christ, we have 39 players right now, albeit some on loan. GK - Shwolow, Fulton, Stone, McFarlane RB - Altena CH - Halkett, Findlay, McCart LB - Milne, Kingsley MF - Spittal, Magnusson, McEntee, Ageu Wingers - Chesnokov, Kerjota, Mato and the incoming McPake (to make 20) FW - Shanks, Kabore I think we might sign 5 or 6 players of real high quality with priorities on the centre halves (2?), strikers (2) and centre of midfield (2?) and then a few for the longer term. Think / hope we might make Leonard permanent too. Stone is out of contract this summer too
Chillidigits Posted February 20 Posted February 20 4 hours ago, Ribble said: yeah that was my thinking, Tzolis first choice left winger with 32yr old Masouras as back up who seems to be very much on the decline and now plying his trade in the Saudi league, with no world cup for them I wouldn't be surprised to see their manager taking a look at several new faces in the march friendlies with a view to freshening up the squad for the Autumn qualifiers, whether that means a place for Kizi is another thing but going by Transfermarkt he is the 2nd highest rated Greek left winger at the moment Normally I'd be fine with international call-ups but this season I don't want any Hearts player in the current squad playing anywhere else except for Hearts between now and season end. Additional injury risks are something we cannot afford.
Hømme Posted February 20 Posted February 20 Perhaps we will be advised that summer isn't the time to cash in on Braga or Kyzi. Maybe their ceiling is is predicted to be even higher at us. We just don't know.
Ribble Posted February 20 Posted February 20 1 minute ago, Hømme said: Perhaps we will be advised that summer isn't the time to cash in on Braga or Kyzi. Maybe their ceiling is is predicted to be even higher at us. We just don't know. here's hoping that they are here until summer 2027 before being sold for even more money because they have Champions League experience!
Drylaw Hearts Posted February 20 Posted February 20 (edited) I think the signing of Mato and McPake make it almost certain that Kyzi is going to be made available for transfer in the summer window. Edited February 20 by Drylaw Hearts
Ricardo Quaresma Posted February 20 Posted February 20 2 minutes ago, Hømme said: Perhaps we will be advised that summer isn't the time to cash in on Braga or Kyzi. Maybe their ceiling is is predicted to be even higher at us. We just don't know. They need to complete 1 or 2 ticks in boxes to fully boost their value before we should sell Although, if we have data that strongly suggests they have the required potential, we might not need to wait on proof The buying clubs might well be content that the minima and maxima that is estimated may be enough
Agentjambo Posted February 20 Posted February 20 1 hour ago, Jambo dans les Pyrenees said: Out - Gordon, Clark, Borch, Forrester, Neilson, Kent, Devlin, Beni, Dhanda, Tait, Kartum, Pollock, Wilson, Kabangu, Leonard, Forrest, Braga, Kyzi plus maybe Steinwender and the Hoff. That’s between 18-20 players. Wow. We might get money for Clark, Wilson, Kabangu, Braga and Kyzi (and Steinwender if he goes),. 19 left. Christ, we have 39 players right now, albeit some on loan. GK - Shwolow, Fulton, Stone, McFarlane RB - Altena CH - Halkett, Findlay, McCart LB - Milne, Kingsley MF - Spittal, Magnusson, McEntee, Ageu Wingers - Chesnokov, Kerjota, Mato and the incoming McPake (to make 20) FW - Shanks, Kabore I think we might sign 5 or 6 players of real high quality with priorities on the centre halves (2?), strikers (2) and centre of midfield (2?) and then a few for the longer term. Think / hope we might make Leonard permanent too. It’s alright saying that 18-20 could leave,however some might still be under contract and happy to see it out,others may not get offers.So not guaranteed that these guys will leave.
SIWYPod Posted February 20 Posted February 20 Reality is, every player will be available for the right price. With JTA input, interested parties will know that they'll need to pay the premium going rate though, what a position for us to be in.
Cameronstheman Posted February 20 Posted February 20 9 minutes ago, Agentjambo said: It’s alright saying that 18-20 could leave,however some might still be under contract and happy to see it out,others may not get offers.So not guaranteed that these guys will leave. Correct but that not how it works on here !!
Jambo dans les Pyrenees Posted February 20 Posted February 20 29 minutes ago, Agentjambo said: It’s alright saying that 18-20 could leave,however some might still be under contract and happy to see it out,others may not get offers.So not guaranteed that these guys will leave. Yes, that’s fair. Out of the 18, 8 are out of contract/loan ends (Gordon, Forrester, Neilson, Kent, Devlin, Beni, Leonard, Forrest), and 5 are sort of taking their future in their own hands / carving out their next moves (Wilson, Tait, Kartum, Clark, Dhanda) and if he had been fit, likely Pollock would have been included in that. Of the 4 remaining; Kyzi and Braga likely to be sold and I think Kabangu will find someone to take a chance of him. Borch could sit; and we don’t really know what’s going on long term fitness wise. So I think it might happen more easily than it might seem on the surface.
soonbe110 Posted February 20 Posted February 20 6 hours ago, Babertonhearts said: Rubbish. Which games recently did he play at the same level as his pre-Xmas form? Last goal from open play was in October, that’s four months and 17 games ago.
siegementality Posted February 20 Posted February 20 2 hours ago, Agentjambo said: We are trying to reduce squad numbers,if we loose 10 we aren’t replacing them with another 10. This season has shown we will need a squad of 30 if we are to compete and do well in Europe. Bearing in mind that some of those players will not be ‘ready to go’ so 30 to cover options, injuries and suspensions is about the right number.
Agentjambo Posted February 20 Posted February 20 24 minutes ago, siegementality said: This season has shown we will need a squad of 30 if we are to compete and do well in Europe. Bearing in mind that some of those players will not be ‘ready to go’ so 30 to cover options, injuries and suspensions is about the right number. We have a squad of around 38 including those out on loan at present.We need to get rid of these 8 before thinking of bringing any others in.
Babertonhearts Posted February 20 Posted February 20 39 minutes ago, soonbe110 said: Which games recently did he play at the same level as his pre-Xmas form? Last goal from open play was in October, that’s four months and 17 games ago. Away and watch Airdrie FFS.
Cruyff Posted February 20 Posted February 20 37 minutes ago, siegementality said: This season has shown we will need a squad of 30 if we are to compete and do well in Europe. Bearing in mind that some of those players will not be ‘ready to go’ so 30 to cover options, injuries and suspensions is about the right number. Agree. Modern day football needs big squads. 28-30 is probably about right.
Agentjambo Posted February 20 Posted February 20 2 minutes ago, Cruyff said: Agree. Modern day football needs big squads. 28-30 is probably about right. We have 38
Babertonhearts Posted February 20 Posted February 20 12 minutes ago, Agentjambo said: We have a squad of around 38 including those out on loan at present.We need to get rid of these 8 before thinking of bringing any others in. I agree, also what happens with b team players (some will be surplus and freed or found new clubs) and whats the point if nobody from academy ever gets a game, there has to be a "pathway" which looks closed, despite what Shelly etc preach to the disciples on here.
GinRummy Posted February 20 Posted February 20 3 minutes ago, Babertonhearts said: I agree, also what happens with b team players (some will be surplus and freed or found new clubs) and whats the point if nobody from academy ever gets a game, there has to be a "pathway" which looks closed, despite what Shelly etc preach to the disciples on here. Yeah all that the Hearts Way stuff sounds like a load of shite to me. If you look at bigger clubs than us (which we are aspiring to be), all this pathway to the first team chat is a bit of a myth.
Babertonhearts Posted February 20 Posted February 20 1 minute ago, GinRummy said: Yeah all that the Hearts Way stuff sounds like a load of shite to me. If you look at bigger clubs than us (which we are aspiring to be), all this pathway to the first team chat is a bit of a myth. Am pleased someone on here agrees coz generally I get short shrift! It is shite and Shellys job is in effect redundant as no end product in my opinion.
GinRummy Posted February 20 Posted February 20 4 minutes ago, Babertonhearts said: Am pleased someone on here agrees coz generally I get short shrift! It is shite and Shellys job is in effect redundant as no end product in my opinion. I think there’s a lot of things to it. I want youth teams, women’s teams etc etc and I guess they need to keep trying but the bigger we get and the more money we generate through sales the further away the youth players will be to getting in the first team. Just how it’ll go.
Agentjambo Posted February 20 Posted February 20 8 hours ago, Jambof3tornado said: We'll bring in at least 9 players. Deadwood and many out of contracts move on,a few sold etc. We wont cope with europe and a league challenge without a shake up. We currently have a squad of 38,I’m guessing we will be reducing that to around 29/30. We have 8 to get rid of who we might not receive offers for.Some we do. IMO we will only replace players who are sold/leave from the starting lineup. 5 or 6 at max,talk of more than 9 or 10 are farcical.
GinRummy Posted February 20 Posted February 20 Just now, Agentjambo said: We currently have a squad of 38,I’m guessing we will be reducing that to around 29/30. We have 8 to get rid of who we might not receive offers for.Some we do. IMO we will only replace players who are sold/leave from the starting lineup. 5 or 6 at max,talk of more than 9 or 10 are farcical. Whats the rules and squad size for Europe again? Whatever that is will play a part in it.
Agentjambo Posted February 20 Posted February 20 2 minutes ago, GinRummy said: Whats the rules and squad size for Europe again? Whatever that is will play a part in it. I know it’s a squad of 25 for the champions league.
BIG ECK Posted February 20 Posted February 20 7 minutes ago, Agentjambo said: I know it’s a squad of 25 for the champions league. Well on that basis “we’ll be needing a squad of at least 25😎
GinRummy Posted February 20 Posted February 20 19 minutes ago, Agentjambo said: I know it’s a squad of 25 for the champions league. Ah is it. Thought it was more than that. Do some of them need to be homegrown or club grown as well. Might make a difference to where we sign players from.
hearts00 Posted February 20 Posted February 20 1 hour ago, soonbe110 said: Which games recently did he play at the same level as his pre-Xmas form? Last goal from open play was in October, that’s four months and 17 games ago. He was excellent at Easter Road at Christmas time. Single handedly dragged us back into the game. I agree though no where near enough end product for a while now with a few glaring misses as well.
GinRummy Posted February 20 Posted February 20 Does anyone know how Zander has been doing down at Doncaster?
GavK1012 Posted February 20 Posted February 20 Nobody is paying 5M for Kyzi, he ain't getting called up to the Greece squad anytime soon, talk about maroon tinted specs! Likely 2M max in the summer unless we do the unthinkable and a League winners tax is applied...awful for months, after a strong 3 months at the start for the season. Time will tell, he works hard, so fair play, but real lack of consistency and quality for so long now...
Threedoorsdown Posted February 20 Posted February 20 6 hours ago, Takeshi kovac said: I hope we are keeping an eye on Congreve at Dundee. Has looked really dangerous every time I've watched him. Not sure how much his parent club would want though We are literally watching every player from every league worth watching. We signed a player from the Italian 3rd division.
So Funkin Kyzi Posted February 20 Posted February 20 12 minutes ago, GinRummy said: Ah is it. Thought it was more than that. Do some of them need to be homegrown or club grown as well. Might make a difference to where we sign players from. Squad of 25 with a minimum of 8 players trained in Scotland for 3 years before the age of 21 and of which 4 must be trained by the club.
OTT Posted February 20 Posted February 20 2 minutes ago, GavK1012 said: Nobody is paying 5M for Kyzi, he ain't getting called up to the Greece squad anytime soon, talk about maroon tinted specs! Likely 2M max in the summer unless we do the unthinkable and a League winners tax is applied...awful for months, after a strong 3 months at the start for the season. Time will tell, he works hard, so fair play, but real lack of consistency and quality for so long now... £2m would be great business tbh. Worth remembering, if we ignore Gordon, Berra is our highest transfer received at like £2.5m. If we could beat that with Kyzi, I'd be buzzing, all about continuous growth. Anyway, its a bit of a stark reminder about how poor our transfer business (sales) has been for a long time. JTA will hopefully see us progressively beat that figure, and bring some much needed fees into the club that can be sensibly reinvested. The whole JTA plan will take time to fully come to fruition, but getting these sorts of fees in to hopefully allow us to more quickly take the next step in terms of quality additions will be huge. Quite excited for it, going to be a superb journey
Le Chat Posted February 20 Posted February 20 5 minutes ago, GavK1012 said: Nobody is paying 5M for Kyzi, he ain't getting called up to the Greece squad anytime soon, talk about maroon tinted specs! Likely 2M max in the summer unless we do the unthinkable and a League winners tax is applied...awful for months, after a strong 3 months at the start for the season. Time will tell, he works hard, so fair play, but real lack of consistency and quality for so long now... I'm with you. I don't see us getting more than £2.5M for Kyzi and £3.5-£4M for Braga. Some of the figures I've seen bandied about are beyond belief.
Threedoorsdown Posted February 20 Posted February 20 (edited) 7 minutes ago, GavK1012 said: Nobody is paying 5M for Kyzi, he ain't getting called up to the Greece squad anytime soon, talk about maroon tinted specs! Likely 2M max in the summer unless we do the unthinkable and a League winners tax is applied...awful for months, after a strong 3 months at the start for the season. Time will tell, he works hard, so fair play, but real lack of consistency and quality for so long now... £2m for Kizi? We got similar for Penrice and we are a year further down the path. £4-5m for Kizi is reasonable. Edited February 20 by Threedoorsdown
Drylaw Hearts Posted February 20 Posted February 20 2 minutes ago, Threedoorsdown said: £2m for Kizi? We got similar for Penrice and we are a year further down the path. £4-5m for Kizi is reasonable. It’s also completely unrealistic imo. He had a fabulous first few months of the season but since the opposition have figured him out…..he’s not been anywhere near as productive. He’ll need to really go some the last 11 games or so to ensure we get a fee anywhere near half your estimate.
Pingu Posted February 20 Posted February 20 24 minutes ago, GinRummy said: Ah is it. Thought it was more than that. Do some of them need to be homegrown or club grown as well. Might make a difference to where we sign players from. To cut a very long story short, country trained almost certainly won't be a problem, club trained will. Not much we can do about it, though, other than extending Gordon for another year, hoping Adam Forrester and Finlay Pollock come good or signing Andy Irving! Worst case scenario we won't be able to fill all 25 places.
OTT Posted February 20 Posted February 20 10 minutes ago, Pingu said: To cut a very long story short, country trained almost certainly won't be a problem, club trained will. Not much we can do about it, though, other than extending Gordon for another year, hoping Adam Forrester and Finlay Pollock come good or signing Andy Irving! Worst case scenario we won't be able to fill all 25 places. Irving might be difficult with him signing for Sparta Prague - I want to see that lad back in maroon again. Maybe give it a year or two and see if he fancies it. Getting enough youngsters to meet the quota will be tough, Obviously keeperwise, Gordon (if he extends), Stone & McFarlane would all be good back up choices, think Stone & McFarlane are both doing really well on loan too. Tait I assume is coming back too and is top flight ready - per transfermarkt, he's been in the starting 11 81% of the time, which even though they're struggling is still good experience for him. Alfie Osborne could be an interesting option, although he's been linked with a move to Newcastle & Brightons academy IIRC ? - In any case, he's like 6"5 and a midfielder, could be a very good option to back up Magnusson & McEntee with his height.
GinRummy Posted February 20 Posted February 20 36 minutes ago, So Funkin Kyzi said: Squad of 25 with a minimum of 8 players trained in Scotland for 3 years before the age of 21 and of which 4 must be trained by the club. 23 minutes ago, Pingu said: To cut a very long story short, country trained almost certainly won't be a problem, club trained will. Not much we can do about it, though, other than extending Gordon for another year, hoping Adam Forrester and Finlay Pollock come good or signing Andy Irving! Worst case scenario we won't be able to fill all 25 places. Cheers lads.
amadjambo Posted February 20 Posted February 20 2 hours ago, Agentjambo said: We have a squad of around 38 including those out on loan at present.We need to get rid of these 8 before thinking of bringing any others in. Yet I would bet that the club have already been thinking about and planning on bringing new players in.
Threedoorsdown Posted February 20 Posted February 20 (edited) 57 minutes ago, Drylaw Hearts said: It’s also completely unrealistic imo. He had a fabulous first few months of the season but since the opposition have figured him out…..he’s not been anywhere near as productive. He’ll need to really go some the last 11 games or so to ensure we get a fee anywhere near half your estimate. I guess time will tell. As a side note, it seems to me that people fail to take into account the incredible inflation we have had in the last decade when they form an opinion on player valuation. A £3.5m player today would have cost only £2.5m ish five years ago and inflation in football transfer fees typically outpaces general cumulative inflation, averaging 9% year on year for the past 15 years. Edited February 20 by Threedoorsdown
BIG ECK Posted February 20 Posted February 20 1 hour ago, Le Chat said: I'm with you. I don't see us getting more than £2.5M for Kyzi and £3.5-£4M for Braga. Some of the figures I've seen bandied about are beyond belief. I don’t disagree but BUT £6 million for Bowie?
jr ewing Posted February 20 Posted February 20 3 hours ago, Drylaw Hearts said: I think the signing of Mato and McPake make it almost certain that Kyzi is going to be made available for transfer in the summer window. Would make sense.
jamboinglasgow Posted February 20 Posted February 20 11 minutes ago, BIG ECK said: I don’t disagree but BUT £6 million for Bowie? Exactly, I feel people underestimate how much that helps Scottish clubs to point to that figure and demand similar. To be honest though, no one knows how much we will get for Kyzi and the figures banded out seem to be an indicator if your optimistic or pessimistic. I also think some Hearts fans can be the opposite of Hibs fans in looking to minimise the value of our players. Hibs and their fans will way overvalue their players and its good to hype up the fee, as Bowie showed you may get a club thats daft or desperate enough to pay it.
Babertonhearts Posted February 20 Posted February 20 1 hour ago, OTT said: Irving might be difficult with him signing for Sparta Prague - I want to see that lad back in maroon again. Maybe give it a year or two and see if he fancies it. Getting enough youngsters to meet the quota will be tough, Obviously keeperwise, Gordon (if he extends), Stone & McFarlane would all be good back up choices, think Stone & McFarlane are both doing really well on loan too. Tait I assume is coming back too and is top flight ready - per transfermarkt, he's been in the starting 11 81% of the time, which even though they're struggling is still good experience for him. Alfie Osborne could be an interesting option, although he's been linked with a move to Newcastle & Brightons academy IIRC ? - In any case, he's like 6"5 and a midfielder, could be a very good option to back up Magnusson & McEntee with his height. He is not a midfielder.
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