Borchgrevink ( Merged )

[RobNox]

8 minutes ago, hereford_hearts said:

DM obviously has a core of first picks, then tweaks it around the edges. 

Alex in goal

The incredible Halk

Big Stu

Wee Cammy

Shanks

All we need is.... 

 

Kyri may also now be a first choice

Borch as well when fit. 

So that leaves 3 spaces up for grabs. 

Is Benny one, he is just now? 

Will Milne slot into the defensive left full time when the right side of midfield /defence is sorted?

 

All the problems that DM has to solve. 

I think when all fit and available it will be, if playing 442

 

Schwolow

Borch Halks Findlay Milne

Kerjota/McEntee Ague Devlin/Beni Kyzi

Shanks Braga

with Chesnokov replacing Kerjota/McEntee on the right in January

 

That gives us a very strong looking starting line up with good cover almost everywhere, RB might still be a concern in the absence of Borch, but I think McEntee or Steinwender can cover that adequately and wouldn't be surprised if that's one of our primary areas to strengthen in the next window.

 

Got to bear in mind that Rome wasn't built in a day, but the glass half empty camp on here will still rather focus on the odd area we might be vulnerable rather than the strength we've added across most other positions.  I guess some people are never happy unless they've got something to moan about.  We could win the league but they'll still criticise McInnes for not winning it as convincingly as we did in 1958.

[RobNox]

20 minutes ago, Taffin said:

The best we've played this season (as a collective and balance wise) imo was with Borch in the team.

 

He'd be straight back in for me. Milne would also be at LB. This time it's working but I'm still not a fan of playing players out of position

I agree.  I actually think the absence of Borch is the main reason we are fecking about with players out of position.  Stick McEntee in as RB, then concerned about the opponent's threat down our right side, so stick Milne in as RW to cover McEntee.  As I come to think of it, if Borch had been fit all season, then we probably wouldn't have been playing anyone out of position, it all seems to have been focused on our right side and trying to get a formation that works in the absence of Borch.

[TheBigO]

25 minutes ago, RobNox said:

I agree.  I actually think the absence of Borch is the main reason we are fecking about with players out of position.  Stick McEntee in as RB, then concerned about the opponent's threat down our right side, so stick Milne in as RW to cover McEntee.  As I come to think of it, if Borch had been fit all season, then we probably wouldn't have been playing anyone out of position, it all seems to have been focused on our right side and trying to get a formation that works in the absence of Borch.

Yes and no imo.  I think its the entire right side.  I don't think he thinks Kerjota is ready to start (especially with Kyzi on other wing), so what do we have?  Forrest really, or maybe Spittal...

 

To play a standardish 442 (albeit with inverted wingers), he's needed to think outside box.  He may well have played McEntee RM, and might now Borch is back, but needed him RB.  He could have played Steinwender RB and McEntee RM and it would have been less "out of position", but if Oisin is RM, he needs an overlapping FB, which he'll have from Borch.

 

When you tie it all in, he wanted 442, he wanted pressure high up the pitch and he wanted some size and athleticism, it all added up.

 

I'm not a big believer in "players being played out of position" and the concern it causes.  Harry Milne against Rangers and Falkirk was in no way whatsoever out of position.  He played the position he was in superbly.  He was IN position!  That position works for him when there are turnovers in midfield as he's very good at creating them, picking them up and he's very positive on the ball.  There were none against Hibs as they just punt punt punted.  Thats all it was.

 

That all said, I would think it's time to get him back to LB and give us some thrust up that line, which will help Kyzi too.  

 

I have a sneaky we'll end up with a JJ type formation with attacking FBs, 1 out and out winger and 3 CMs, one of whom plays to the right a bit and 2 of whom get forward.  2 CFs but one who plays the right channel more often.  Would suit what we have, especially until Ches is in the building.

[PapaShango]

We need to bin Milne at right wing. It worked brilliantly at Ibrox but I thought he was very poor on Saturday night. Get him back to left back and play someone else out there. Kerjota could be a shout after his cameo on Saturday. Would be good to see what he has got from the start. I noticed we have another closed door game lined up for before the Kilmarnock game which is a smart move IMO. 

[hereford_hearts]

2 minutes ago, PapaShango said:

We need to bin Milne at right wing. It worked brilliantly at Ibrox but I thought he was very poor on Saturday night. Get him back to left back and play someone else out there. Kerjota could be a shout after his cameo on Saturday. Would be good to see what he has got from the start. I noticed we have another closed door game lined up for before the Kilmarnock game which is a smart move IMO. 

Will probably be another bounce game against cannon fodder like the rangers😉😏😂

[tartofmidlothian]

10 hours ago, mitch41 said:

Has Borchgrevink proved he’s good enough, is fit enough and better than what we already have had play at right back. Is it a matter of putting him in a starting lineup and seeing how he does. True we have to trust McInnes but there has to be some doubt as to when he comes in and maybe coming on as a sub might just be the best bet for him and the team.

 

3 hours ago, RobNox said:

I agree.  I actually think the absence of Borch is the main reason we are fecking about with players out of position.  Stick McEntee in as RB, then concerned about the opponent's threat down our right side, so stick Milne in as RW to cover McEntee.  As I come to think of it, if Borch had been fit all season, then we probably wouldn't have been playing anyone out of position, it all seems to have been focused on our right side and trying to get a formation that works in the absence of Borch.

 

McInnes said in an interview a couple of weeks back that Borchgrevink when fit is our main guy at RB at least until January, he didn't try and sign another RB because he believed McEntee or Steinwender would only have to cover for a few weeks. As soon as he thinks he's up to speed, I bet he'll be back in the team to stay.

 

He looked good in our early League Cup games. You could tell Findlay and McEntee were solid, but Braga, Kyziridis and Borchgrevink were the players who seemed like they might bring something extra. He gets up and down the wing, overlaps well with the player in front of him and tries to get dangerous passes in towards the edge of the opposition's box. Not swinging crosses like Kerjota's, more like the defence-splitting pass Kerjota tried just before his assist on Saturday.

[Absolute Scenes]

One of Borchs highlighted stats from his previous club was how many assists he got. He’s our main right back, and once he’s back, we’ll see as vast improvement on the right. Milne back to left, Kerjota RM until Chezzers arrives, Dizzy Kyzi on the left. Shanks and Radio up front

[Jambof3tornado]

3 hours ago, RobNox said:

I agree.  I actually think the absence of Borch is the main reason we are fecking about with players out of position.  Stick McEntee in as RB, then concerned about the opponent's threat down our right side, so stick Milne in as RW to cover McEntee.  As I come to think of it, if Borch had been fit all season, then we probably wouldn't have been playing anyone out of position, it all seems to have been focused on our right side and trying to get a formation that works in the absence of Borch.

I'd sooner see sidewinder at RB than McEntee then you don't have to worry who is ahead of him so Milne doesn't need shoe horned in. If McEntee is so great in midfield why cant he just beni or devlin?

[Jacques de Gauthier]

35 minutes ago, tartofmidlothian said:

 

 

McInnes said in an interview a couple of weeks back that Borchgrevink when fit is our main guy at RB at least until January, he didn't try and sign another RB because he believed McEntee or Steinwender would only have to cover for a few weeks. As soon as he thinks he's up to speed, I bet he'll be back in the team to stay.

 

He looked good in our early League Cup games. You could tell Findlay and McEntee were solid, but Braga, Kyziridis and Borchgrevink were the players who seemed like they might bring something extra. He gets up and down the wing, overlaps well with the player in front of him and tries to get dangerous passes in towards the edge of the opposition's box. Not swinging crosses like Kerjota's, more like the defence-splitting pass Kerjota tried just before his assist on Saturday.

My only worry about Borch is that he's missed this great run we're on in the league, and so might find it hard to slot in immediately. If he doesn't have a great game in his first game back there'll be boo boys ready to lambast him!

[Cruyff]

4 hours ago, Paul Shark said:

Yep first straight after Shankland.

And Halks. Certainly they 3. 

[tartofmidlothian]

18 minutes ago, Jacques de Gauthier said:

My only worry about Borch is that he's missed this great run we're on in the league, and so might find it hard to slot in immediately. If he doesn't have a great game in his first game back there'll be boo boys ready to lambast him!

 

Aye, no doubt about that. I reckon that's why McInnes is wrapping him and Ageu in cotton wool on their way back, and easing in Kerjota, Magnusson and Kabore very gently. Such a luxury being able to do that rather than throw in everyone we've got, sink or swim.

[spacerjoe]

53 minutes ago, tartofmidlothian said:

 

 

McInnes said in an interview a couple of weeks back that Borchgrevink when fit is our main guy at RB at least until January, he didn't try and sign another RB because he believed McEntee or Steinwender would only have to cover for a few weeks. As soon as he thinks he's up to speed, I bet he'll be back in the team to stay.

 

He looked good in our early League Cup games. You could tell Findlay and McEntee were solid, but Braga, Kyziridis and Borchgrevink were the players who seemed like they might bring something extra. He gets up and down the wing, overlaps well with the player in front of him and tries to get dangerous passes in towards the edge of the opposition's box. Not swinging crosses like Kerjota's, more like the defence-splitting pass Kerjota tried just before his assist on Saturday.

We also have to remember (which definitely seemed to get forgotten over the summer!) that we still have a finite transfer budget. He obviously couldn't mention it at the time that we were after Ageu, but would have known it was happening.

 

And who would you rather spend money on? A backup RB, when we have guys who can do a job there when required, or a potentially unreal, box to box AM.

 

Back on Borch though, looking forward to seeing him back.

 

If he works out as well as Milne has so far, he could become a pivotal player for us.

[sac]

4 hours ago, RobNox said:

I agree.  I actually think the absence of Borch is the main reason we are fecking about with players out of position.  Stick McEntee in as RB, then concerned about the opponent's threat down our right side, so stick Milne in as RW to cover McEntee.  As I come to think of it, if Borch had been fit all season, then we probably wouldn't have been playing anyone out of position, it all seems to have been focused on our right side and trying to get a formation that works in the absence of Borch.

I’m guessing he doesn’t trust steinwender over 90 mins as RB?

[kingantti1874]

16 minutes ago, sac said:

I’m guessing he doesn’t trust steinwender over 90 mins as RB?

Dont think it’s a case of not trust.  Probably doesn’t think he can offer as much going forwards Steinwender is an excellent player

[Jacques de Gauthier]

19 minutes ago, tartofmidlothian said:

 

Aye, no doubt about that. I reckon that's why McInnes is wrapping him and Ageu in cotton wool on their way back, and easing in Kerjota, Magnusson and Kabore very gently. Such a luxury being able to do that rather than throw in everyone we've got, sink or swim.

Very true. We're in almost unchartered waters here in terms of squad depth and quality.

[sac]

31 minutes ago, kingantti1874 said:

Dont think it’s a case of not trust.  Probably doesn’t think he can offer as much going forwards Steinwender is an excellent player

It’s just I think he’d be more suited to that position than McEntee

[ScottishSandstorm]

I think we should move for Keelan Adams of Falkirk in January as direct competition for Borch. We are building a solid squad and having 2 players for every position will serve us well as we gear up for Europe next season.  

[Exile fae Main Street]

He's supposedly fit, but wasn't even on bench last Saturday, was that due to plastic pitch or what? Would've thought he was quite used to playing on plastic?

[h-e-a-r-t-s]

Dinnae change a winning team

 

i I wasn’t convinced by Mcentee at first in that position but we’ve haven’t looked like conceding for about a month now so why change

[Pingu]

2 minutes ago, Exile fae Main Street said:

He's supposedly fit, but wasn't even on bench last Saturday, was that due to plastic pitch or what? Would've thought he was quite used to playing on plastic?

 

I think he's probably either a starter or nothing. Steinwender a better bet on the bench as he can cover two positions, McCart preferred as he's left sided and we don't need / want more than two defenders.

[jamboinglasgow]

3 minutes ago, Exile fae Main Street said:

He's supposedly fit, but wasn't even on bench last Saturday, was that due to plastic pitch or what? Would've thought he was quite used to playing on plastic?

 

He may be used to playing on a plastic pitch but I suspect after a muscle injury they didn't want to risk him on a plastic pitch that is about two years past needing replaced.

 

I do want to see him play again as I thought he looked good when he has played this season, but @h-e-a-r-t-s above is right that we dont need to change a winning team at the moment, and McEntee is getting better each game there.

[RustyRightPeg]

He’s unlucky with injury. Until we have a suspension or an injury, he probably won’t get back in either. Saying that, I’d rather he was involved over Spittal / Forrest. 

[Threedoorsdown]

I've never been left with the impression that Del rates him at all.

[kingantti1874]

2 minutes ago, Threedoorsdown said:

I've never been left with the impression that Del rates him at all.

Del himself said he was first choice right back.  Hence why we didn’t sign a new one.  Just keeping continuity for now 

[Threedoorsdown]

9 minutes ago, kingantti1874 said:

Del himself said he was first choice right back.  Hence why we didn’t sign a new one.  Just keeping continuity for now 

 

I tend to look at peoples actions rather than words. Borch hasn't been in the team let alone first pick.

[kingantti1874]

4 minutes ago, Threedoorsdown said:

 

I tend to look at peoples actions rather than words. Borch hasn't been in the team let alone first pick.

Was picked when fit.  This was the first week he was fit.  Away to Killie on a plastic pitch 

[hereford_hearts]

I think Del will want to ease him back into the team during an easier game, hence I think he'll get 30 mins on Sunday 🤔

[Tynecastle Valhalla]

He is our right back or indeed right wing back when appropriate.

 

Was the captain at his last club and has a good mentality.

 

McIntee has filled in well but will eventually lose his place.

 

 

 

[Korky]

I would be very surprised if we don’t recruit in the RB/RWB position in January.

[El Prez]

3 games in under 7 days soon. If he's not playing by then...

[boag1874]

14 minutes ago, Tynecastle Valhalla said:

He is our right back or indeed right wing back when appropriate.

 

Was the captain at his last club and has a good mentality.

 

McIntee has filled in well but will eventually lose his place.

 

 

 

That's how I see it. There was no point risking him or Ageu on the junkies carpet of a pitch at Killie.

 

I don't think he'll start v Celtic because it's the safe bet to just keep the same team but we'll play 3 times in the space of 6 days starting with Sunday so opportunities will start to open back up in the St Mirren & Dundee games.

[Bungalow Bill]

My suspicion is he’ll be away in January and we’ll recruit RB with McInnes’ JTA inputs rather than Critchley’s.

[Cambo_Jambo]

20 minutes ago, Tynecastle Valhalla said:

He is our right back or indeed right wing back when appropriate.

 

Was the captain at his last club and has a good mentality.

 

McIntee has filled in well but will eventually lose his place.

 

 

 

I think we, McInnes I mean, is waiting for a fall off in performance from certain players to justify moving things around.

 

At this point, as others have said, given our light matchload meaning there's literally no chance of fatigue in our players, there's just not been a reason to change. We've gone from having 2 games this past month to 6 in a little over a month (Celtic, St Mirren, Dundee, Dundee Utd, Aberdeen and Motherwell) which means we'll need to rotate. We'll either be forced to by fatigue or injury, hopefully light ones.

 

[merseyjambo]

1 hour ago, Bungalow Bill said:

My suspicion is he’ll be away in January and we’ll recruit RB with McInnes’ JTA inputs rather than Critchley’s.

Wouldn’t surprise me if both him and Kartum head back to Norway before their season starts next year.

 

Did Critchers not say that Borch was a leader and he wanted leaders on park. 
 

I think like others Del might not think he fits in with how he sees us playing.

[kingantti1874]

5 minutes ago, merseyjambo said:

Wouldn’t surprise me if both him and Kartum head back to Norway before their season starts next year.

 

Did Critchers not say that Borch was a leader and he wanted leaders on park. 
 

I think like others Del might not think he fits in with how he sees us playing.

well he was the valerenga captain 

[MoncurMacdonaldMercer]

was picked when fit for the biggest game of the season at the time (aberdeen game) and did well in that - del obviously rates him

 

del likes mcentee better tho - theres no space in the midfield for mcentee and until he gets ripped a new one by some tricky winger mcentee is the first choice right back

 

borch is in the same boat as kabangu / kabore - probably showing up well just cant get in a team thats winning every week and is top of the league

 

 

[MoncurMacdonaldMercer]

Just now, kingantti1874 said:

well he was the valerenga captain 

 

and penalty taker

[DC_92]

5 hours ago, Pingu said:

 

I think he's probably either a starter or nothing. Steinwender a better bet on the bench as he can cover two positions, McCart preferred as he's left sided and we don't need / want more than two defenders.

 

This is it. Bench positions are limited and versatility is being prioritised. He'll get his chance again from the start. Dundee at home might be the one to bring him in.

[jr ewing]

I take it that DM doesn't fancy him?

[Jamboross]

1 minute ago, jr ewing said:

I take it that DM doesn't fancy him?

 

I think it's more a case of not changing a settled team and Steinwender making more sense on the bench. That said, I'm sure DM said something in an interview in the summer that hinted at him not being his favoured option, can't find the quote though. 

[Never Let Them Forget]

1 minute ago, jr ewing said:

I take it that DM doesn't fancy him?

To be fair Mcintee deserves to start and Steinweinder can play the 2 positions very well so you can have an extra forward thinking player on the bench. His time will come same as Kabore and Kerjota they just have to be patient.

[NottsJambo]

What on earth is going on with him? He was back fit a couple of weeks ago wasn't he?

[Jacques de Gauthier]

We’ve conceded one goal in 5 games with an unchanged team? Why on earth would we shoehorn him back in? It’s a long season. He’ll get his chance. 

[MoncurMacdonaldMercer]

the del doesnt rate borch is got be trolling now 🤷‍♂️

 

he likes mcentee and the current set up better

 

just how im sure he rates craig gordon highly but at the moment prefers schwalow

 

only 2 players that i can see have jumped the queue after injury - mccart who del described as his best defender in pre-season and ageu who del described as a rolls-royce - jumped the queue all the way to the bench

 

we are going to have to start using the squad soon so all will be revealled

 

 

[MoncurMacdonaldMercer]

Just now, Jacques de Gauthier said:

We’ve conceded one goal in 5 games with an unchanged team? Why on earth would we shoehorn him back in? It’s a long season. He’ll get his chance. 

 

i think its trolling now jack

 

[Jacques de Gauthier]

2 minutes ago, MoncurMacdonaldMercer said:

 

i think its trolling now jack

 

Much like Cammy on Lipless Cal today. 

[MoncurMacdonaldMercer]

2 minutes ago, Jacques de Gauthier said:

Much like Cammy on Lipless Cal today. 

 

a very satisfying day all round 😃👍

 

 

[Fozzyonthefence]

7 minutes ago, Jacques de Gauthier said:

We’ve conceded one goal in 5 games with an unchanged team? Why on earth would we shoehorn him back in? It’s a long season. He’ll get his chance. 

Always good to keep a settled defence that is keeping clean sheets so not really got a problem with it for the time being ……. but I thought he was our weak link in the first half and Celtic seemed to be targeting our RB position with long balls in behind and playing around him.   Thought he should have made a better attempt at closing down Tierney for their goal too  but he’s doing a decent job in an unnatural position for him.   

[Saint Jambo]

5 hours ago, jr ewing said:

I take it that DM doesn't fancy him?

 

5 hours ago, Jamboross said:

 

I think it's more a case of not changing a settled team and Steinwender making more sense on the bench. That said, I'm sure DM said something in an interview in the summer that hinted at him not being his favoured option, can't find the quote though. 

 

I think DM said something at the "90 minutes with" that suggested he might not have been 100% impressed at that stage. But I think this shifted. Towards the end of the transfer window he was clear we weren't in the transfer market for a right back because Borchgrevink had been brought in to be first choice.

[BigStein]

There’s a lot of good players in our squad knocking on the door right now. There’s nothing negative to be said about that really. As long as we keep winning and scoring for fun there’s no arguments to be had about team selection