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Hearts in the NFT space


Masonic

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3 minutes ago, andyscott82 said:

NFTs are paying money for something that doesn’t exist, right? 

That's about it, but each non-existent item is unique, so no 2 people can have the same non-existent item.

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3 minutes ago, airdriejambo3 said:

I'd rather help the club by buying an actual physical item from the shop 

Yeah, but that physical item would be fungible.  Any Tom, Dick or Harry could buy an identical item, so it wouldn't be special like a NFT.

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An NFT is a receipt for a space on a global database.  

A box on a giant excel spreadsheet.

A space in a queue.

 

You do not own the database entry, you do not own the box on the spreadsheet, you do not own the space in the queue. 

All you own is a receipt saying you own it.

Whether there is anything in the database spot/spreadsheet box/space in the queue doesn't matter.

You have no control over what is there. Because you don't own it.

 

What you have bought has no inherent value.

The only value is if you can find someone else as stupid as you and to sell your receipt on to them.

 

 

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Rich folk constantly advise poor folk to get involved in NFTs.

Rich folk constantly advise poor folk to get involved in crypto. 

Rich folk constantly advise poor folk to get involved in trading.

 

And the results are always the rich stay rich and the poor stay poor.

 

 

Better odds of wealth with a bloody scratchcard 

 

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Nookie Bear
4 hours ago, Apache Mal said:

Everyone? Ok then. 
 

Mods-Can the thread be closed please, no discussion to be had as ‘everyone’ is in agreement. 


You literally just told us you “invested” £100 in something you don’t understand. 
 

However!!…I accept I don’t understand so if anyone can explain it in a logical, coherent, manner (including risks) then I’m listening. 

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Francis Albert
8 minutes ago, Nookie Bear said:


You literally just told us you “invested” £100 in something you don’t understand. 
 

However!!…I accept I don’t understand so if anyone can explain it in a logical, coherent, manner (including risks) then I’m listening. 

Maybe the OP could explain. Though maybe not in words that most of us could understand.

Answering my question of whether he has a financial interest in promoting these things should however be simple enough.

 

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I hadn't heard of NFT or Blockchain before now and haven't a clue what it's all about, but reading through the thread suggests that I'm exactly the kind of person (mug) that people who dream these things up want to sell it too, so where do I sign up?

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5 hours ago, Masonic said:

For years we have seen autographs, stickers and collectable cards too but what if Hearts minted their own version of these by using the Solana blockchain to mint NFTs?

 

Money goes directly to Hearts

Proof of authenticity and ownership stored on the blockchain

LIMITED SUPPLY in which the buyers know how rare their item is such as 1 of 10 etc

No damage can be done to the items as they are digital and dont suffer the normal wear and tear and wont be effected by printers making mistakes

 

This is just some of the benefits i can see from the club doing this..

 

Some other businesses involved in the NFT space

 

UFC ARMANI ADIDAS D&G SUPERBOWL COACHELLA TACO BELL PIZZA HUT MATTEL RAYBAN COCA COLA FUNKOPOP VISA

Serious question for the OP because I don't understand any of this. What would the club sell? How much would it cost? And what would I get for my money?

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Whilst I don't profess to be an expert in NFT's, there are some really ignorant and dismissive comments in this thread.

 

Consider NFT's as a digital piece of art. Why would anyone purchase a Picasso painting? That's one of the reasons you would buy an NFT. And if you can buy a Picasso painting and then sell it to someone else for a profit, why not?

 

Not quite sure how Hearts could take advantage of this (or how much success it would bring) but if its a market that could generate the club some money, then you would be daft to not at least consider/explore it.

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25 minutes ago, saxondale said:

Whilst I don't profess to be an expert in NFT's, there are some really ignorant and dismissive comments in this thread.

 

Consider NFT's as a digital piece of art. Why would anyone purchase a Picasso painting? That's one of the reasons you would buy an NFT. And if you can buy a Picasso painting and then sell it to someone else for a profit, why not?

 

Not quite sure how Hearts could take advantage of this (or how much success it would bring) but if its a market that could generate the club some money, then you would be daft to not at least consider/explore it.

 

Apart from you don't own the digital art with an NFT, you just own what is effectively a statement saying you own the rights to the NFT of it.  There is nothing to stop anyone distributing the digital art, because you don't own the actual piece.  

 

At least if you go out and buy a print of the Mona Lisa, you have something physical for your money. 

 

You could own a Mona Lisa NFT, but it will not stop the hundreds of thousands of images of it on Google from appearing, and it sure as hell doesn't stop me from doing Right Click > Save As.  It doesn't even stop someone else making an identical, or near identical, NFT because it is technically a different thing.  That way, 2 people could "own" the same thing. 

 

Once again, an NFT only has the value that someone selling it tries to claim it has, and after that, the only value is what you can pass it to the next person for.  There is even a company out there trying to do colour NFTs (https://www.color.museum/); that is, you "own" a specific colour.  Does that stop anyone from using that colour, or give you anything back for it?  No chance. 

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Heres Rixxy

Seems to me like a lot of people have strong opinions about something they know little to nothing about. Don't just take whatever headlines you read about NFTs as the complete NFT market.

 

NFTs as a technology are not a scam. There will be use cases for years to come. Are there scams that occur via NFTs though? Of course. But scams happen via many mediums every day. Blame the users not the technology.

 

If a football club were to do one (I imagine many have but I have no idea what they've done) you need to view it more like a community membership than a 'digital piece of art'. Imagine uses like a limited 500 token collection and holding a token allows you exclusive access to Tynecastle events, or raffles, or discounted merchandise, partnerships, etc. Or season tickets themselves could be distributed as NFTs, allowing for transferring, trading, whatever.

 

TLDR - there is more to NFTs than jpegs.

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2 hours ago, airdriejambo3 said:

I'd rather help the club by buying an actual physical item from the shop 

 

I was looking at the club shop earlier (online) and its actually looking pretty decent. Phone cases, golf stuff, drinks related stuff etc. really good spread of stuff. I think the club shop used to managed externally and was pretty shit as a result. So its good to see the club maximising that. 

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Every few years someone comes up with a bizarre and ridiculous way to try to monetise the internet, the virtual world...NFT is just another one. There are always idiots willing to pay money for nothing though...

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So many nutcase crypto ponzi cult members in here,  good to see the majority see these shysters for what they are.

 https://davidgerard.co.uk/blockchain/ is a good resource if you want to learn about this bullshit and have a laugh.

 

also should this shit not be in the shed?

 

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Unknown user
1 hour ago, saxondale said:

 

Consider NFT's as a digital piece of art. 

 

They're nothing like digital pieces of art, they're not anything.

No one sweated over them, no one realised a vision or expressed an emotion. 

 

It's the same as buying a plot on Mars, someone just took your money and wrote your name down somewhere.

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Lone Striker
26 minutes ago, Spellczech said:

Every few years someone comes up with a bizarre and ridiculous way to try to monetise the internet, the virtual world...NFT is just another one. There are always idiots willing to pay money for nothing though...

Yep.  Reading some of the attempts at explaining NFTs on this  thread, it sounds a bit like the way Government debt works.    Government creates an i.o.u (bond) out of thin air and hawks them to investment funds who then  trade them to other funds/banks etc  if they can tempt these fund/banks to pay more than the face value.   Then its a pass-the-parcel game as soon as word gets out that the Government is stone broke and won't be able to repay the i.o.u. on time.

 

Basically, governments sell their own debt to  players in a "market" who know they'll probably never get re-paid.   Counter-intuitive  ? Yes....   but somehow Governments get away with it. 

 

 

 

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13 minutes ago, Lone Striker said:

Yep.  Reading some of the attempts at explaining NFTs on this  thread, it sounds a bit like the way Government debt works.    Government creates an i.o.u (bond) out of thin air and hawks them to investment funds who then  trade them to other funds/banks etc  if they can tempt these fund/banks to pay more than the face value.   Then its a pass-the-parcel game as soon as word gets out that the Government is stone broke and won't be able to repay the i.o.u. on time.

 

Basically, governments sell their own debt to  players in a "market" who know they'll probably never get re-paid.   Counter-intuitive  ? Yes....   but somehow Governments get away with it. 

 

 

 


Not sure where you’ve learnt that but it isn’t how government debt works. Governments who issue debt in their own currency have always repaid to my knowledge. 
 

It’s a scam in the sense it gives all the private pension funds a safe investment that would otherwise not exist. 
 

And NFTs are utter shite. Good to know most see it for what it is 

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1 hour ago, Smithee said:

It's the same as buying a plot on Mars, someone just took your money and wrote your name down somewhere.

 

Spot on, that's exactly what it is. 

 

And there's nothing to stop you and I both starting our own little "company" selling the exact same plot on Mars. 

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2 hours ago, tian447 said:

 

Apart from you don't own the digital art with an NFT, you just own what is effectively a statement saying you own the rights to the NFT of it.  There is nothing to stop anyone distributing the digital art, because you don't own the actual piece.

I understand that, but from a financial point of view that's all that matters

 

At least if you go out and buy a print of the Mona Lisa, you have something physical for your money.

True. Although there is nothing stopping someone from printing off their NFT and saying 'I own the rights to this' though

 

You could own a Mona Lisa NFT, but it will not stop the hundreds of thousands of images of it on Google from appearing, and it sure as hell doesn't stop me from doing Right Click > Save As.  It doesn't even stop someone else making an identical, or near identical, NFT because it is technically a different thing.  That way, 2 people could "own" the same thing. 

of course, but the 'replica' will not be worth the same as the real/original because like you say they are still different

 

Once again, an NFT only has the value that someone selling it tries to claim it has, and after that, the only value is what you can pass it to the next person for.  There is even a company out there trying to do colour NFTs (https://www.color.museum/); that is, you "own" a specific colour.  Does that stop anyone from using that colour, or give you anything back for it?  No chance. 

yeah its only worth what you or someone else values it as, but that can apply to a number of things, including a painting or sculpture (hence the comparison to a piece by Picasso etc). I'm looking at it purely from an investment point of view

 

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1 hour ago, Smithee said:

 

They're nothing like digital pieces of art, they're not anything.

No one sweated over them, no one realised a vision or expressed an emotion. 

 

It's the same as buying a plot on Mars, someone just took your money and wrote your name down somewhere.

 

I was just trying to simplify what an NFT is a little. There is obviously nothing to stop someone else from reusing the NFT as many times as they want, but it is comparable to traditional art from an investment point of view.

 

Also, it's not true that an NFT was not 'sweated over' or contains a vision or emotion. Don't get me wrong it definitely applies to some out there but there also many NFT's that someone has worked hard on, displayed a level of skill to create, and can portray emotions and cover all sorts of themes/topics etc

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18 minutes ago, saxondale said:

of course, but the 'replica' will not be worth the same as the real/original because like you say they are still different

 

Who defines the original though?  My example from earlier, that daft Colour NFT one; they don't own any rights to anything, all you are getting by purchasing one of the NFTs is an acknowledgement from them that you own their NFT, not anyone else's, not anything of any worth, or any value.  I could go and start selling the exact same thing, what does it mean for originality then?

 

When everyone and anyone could say that theirs is the original, and multiple people are selling the same thing, the whole thing is worthless.

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Lone Striker
1 hour ago, WageThief said:


Not sure where you’ve learnt that but it isn’t how government debt works. Governments who issue debt in their own currency have always repaid to my knowledge. 
 

It’s a scam in the sense it gives all the private pension funds a safe investment that would otherwise not exist. 
 

And NFTs are utter shite. Good to know most see it for what it is 

Yes, they repay to whoever owns the bond on the repayment date(s) - but  since  governments run enormous  deficits, they generally have to use more borrowed  money from somewhere in order to do it.   The similarity with these NFT thingys is the illusion of  wealth when the reality is that it depends on something else - endless borrowing in the case of governments, and the eagerness of  greedy dafties  to  pile into the market for these NFT thingys.  

 

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Marooned In Oz
10 hours ago, Masonic said:

For years we have seen autographs, stickers and collectable cards too but what if Hearts minted their own version of these by using the Solana blockchain to mint NFTs?

 

Money goes directly to Hearts

Proof of authenticity and ownership stored on the blockchain

LIMITED SUPPLY in which the buyers know how rare their item is such as 1 of 10 etc

No damage can be done to the items as they are digital and dont suffer the normal wear and tear and wont be effected by printers making mistakes

 

This is just some of the benefits i can see from the club doing this..

 

Some other businesses involved in the NFT space

 

UFC ARMANI ADIDAS D&G SUPERBOWL COACHELLA TACO BELL PIZZA HUT MATTEL RAYBAN COCA COLA FUNKOPOP VISA

**** off with this utter pish.

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26 minutes ago, tian447 said:

 

Who defines the original though?  My example from earlier, that daft Colour NFT one; they don't own any rights to anything, all you are getting by purchasing one of the NFTs is an acknowledgement from them that you own their NFT, not anyone else's, not anything of any worth, or any value.  I could go and start selling the exact same thing, what does it mean for originality then?

 

When everyone and anyone could say that theirs is the original, and multiple people are selling the same thing, the whole thing is worthless.

 

Back to my daft Picasso analogy, how do you prove you own an original Picasso painting? There will be many many copies of the painting to look exactly like the original. But they do eventually confirm its authenticity when it's examined by experts.

 

An NFT is the proof that your digital asset is yours and is the original.

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34 minutes ago, saxondale said:

 

Back to my daft Picasso analogy, how do you prove you own an original Picasso painting? There will be many many copies of the painting to look exactly like the original. But they do eventually confirm its authenticity when it's examined by experts.

 

An NFT is the proof that your digital asset is yours and is the original.

is it ****,  anyone can create an NFT of your digital asset and then you create one after,  who owns it?  its your asset but someone created an NFT of it before you?

Its a shite digital receipt in a very inefficient distributed database that means nothing.

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Nookie Bear
4 hours ago, Heres Rixxy said:

Seems to me like a lot of people have strong opinions about something they know little to nothing about. Don't just take whatever headlines you read about NFTs as the complete NFT market.

 

NFTs as a technology are not a scam. There will be use cases for years to come. Are there scams that occur via NFTs though? Of course. But scams happen via many mediums every day. Blame the users not the technology.

 

If a football club were to do one (I imagine many have but I have no idea what they've done) you need to view it more like a community membership than a 'digital piece of art'. Imagine uses like a limited 500 token collection and holding a token allows you exclusive access to Tynecastle events, or raffles, or discounted merchandise, partnerships, etc. Or season tickets themselves could be distributed as NFTs, allowing for transferring, trading, whatever.

 

TLDR - there is more to NFTs than jpegs.


Sounds just like a Corporate Membership package. 

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38 minutes ago, saxondale said:

Back to my daft Picasso analogy, how do you prove you own an original Picasso painting? There will be many many copies of the painting to look exactly like the original. But they do eventually confirm its authenticity when it's examined by experts.

 

An NFT is the proof that your digital asset is yours and is the original.

 

Who gets the same excitement over owning an NFT as they do from owning an original Picasso painting?

 

At least with a painting you'd hang it up and get use out of it. Others may be intrigued by an original Picasso painting.

 

What do you get out of an NFT exactly? Apart from a feeling of buyer's remorse I'd guess.

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FarmerTweedy
11 hours ago, Masonic said:

For years we have seen autographs, stickers and collectable cards too but what if Hearts minted their own version of these by using the Solana blockchain to mint NFTs?

 

Money goes directly to Hearts

Proof of authenticity and ownership stored on the blockchain

LIMITED SUPPLY in which the buyers know how rare their item is such as 1 of 10 etc

No damage can be done to the items as they are digital and dont suffer the normal wear and tear and wont be effected by printers making mistakes

 

This is just some of the benefits i can see from the club doing this..

 

Some other businesses involved in the NFT space

 

UFC ARMANI ADIDAS D&G SUPERBOWL COACHELLA TACO BELL PIZZA HUT MATTEL RAYBAN COCA COLA FUNKOPOP VISA

NFTs are complete and utter nonsense. All about parting fools from their money. I really hope the club doesn't touch them with a bargepole!

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5 hours ago, been here before said:

 

 

 

Well indeed.

Dunno if you've seen this but it's perfect really.

 

 

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FarmerTweedy
4 hours ago, Lone Striker said:

Yep.  Reading some of the attempts at explaining NFTs on this  thread, it sounds a bit like the way Government debt works.    Government creates an i.o.u (bond) out of thin air and hawks them to investment funds who then  trade them to other funds/banks etc  if they can tempt these fund/banks to pay more than the face value.   Then its a pass-the-parcel game as soon as word gets out that the Government is stone broke and won't be able to repay the i.o.u. on time.

 

Basically, governments sell their own debt to  players in a "market" who know they'll probably never get re-paid.   Counter-intuitive  ? Yes....   but somehow Governments get away with it. 

 

 

 

That's actually bollocks! 

 

Government bonds have a specific term on them, and pay interest at a set rate over that term, and the government repays the initial value of the bond at the end when it matures. There are markets to trade these bonds because as economic circumstances change over the period, the interest that a particular bond pays can become more or less attractive, so the initial buyer may want to sell the bond (and the right to receive future interest payments and the final settlement amount) on to other organisations, which may find it's worth paying for that (virtually) guaranteed income. 

 

It's actually very unusual for a government to fail to pay the interest or the final settlement amount, although it does happen occasionally, when a country is in a major economic crisis.  Of course, governments usually fund the settlement payments by issuing more new bonds. Generally, the better financial health a government is perceived to be in, the lower the interest rate they have to offer on new bonds, saving them money over the term of the bond.

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1 hour ago, FarmerTweedy said:

That's actually bollocks! 

 

Government bonds have a specific term on them, and pay interest at a set rate over that term, and the government repays the initial value of the bond at the end when it matures. There are markets to trade these bonds because as economic circumstances change over the period, the interest that a particular bond pays can become more or less attractive, so the initial buyer may want to sell the bond (and the right to receive future interest payments and the final settlement amount) on to other organisations, which may find it's worth paying for that (virtually) guaranteed income. 

 

It's actually very unusual for a government to fail to pay the interest or the final settlement amount, although it does happen occasionally, when a country is in a major economic crisis.  Of course, governments usually fund the settlement payments by issuing more new bonds. Generally, the better financial health a government is perceived to be in, the lower the interest rate they have to offer on new bonds, saving them money over the term of the bond.

I was part way through thinking out a similar reply when I noticed your post, which pretty much sums up everything I was intending to relay but in a much more concise way than I would have relayed it.

👍

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2 hours ago, FarmerTweedy said:

That's actually bollocks! 

 

Government bonds have a specific term on them, and pay interest at a set rate over that term, and the government repays the initial value of the bond at the end when it matures. There are markets to trade these bonds because as economic circumstances change over the period, the interest that a particular bond pays can become more or less attractive, so the initial buyer may want to sell the bond (and the right to receive future interest payments and the final settlement amount) on to other organisations, which may find it's worth paying for that (virtually) guaranteed income. 

 

It's actually very unusual for a government to fail to pay the interest or the final settlement amount, although it does happen occasionally, when a country is in a major economic crisis.  Of course, governments usually fund the settlement payments by issuing more new bonds. Generally, the better financial health a government is perceived to be in, the lower the interest rate they have to offer on new bonds, saving them money over the term of the bond.

Its very typical of crypto people to not understand economics. 

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4 hours ago, jamboozy said:

I’ve got magic beans, anyone want to see them?

I dont have any magic beans but someone gave me a receipt that said I had a lot of 1's and 0's somewhere that said i did.

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You will all be laughing on the other side of your faces when I get to visit the plot of land that I got on the moon for my birthday when I was 21 ……………. I am hoping I can stand out there of an evening and look at the star I had named after me around about the same time

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Dennis Reynolds

Not something I'd want Hearts to get into as there's just no appetite for it, yet. Lots of people very ignorant about NFT's though. They have much more of a function than silly jpeg apes on the internet. 

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Nookie Bear
36 minutes ago, Dennis Reynolds said:

Not something I'd want Hearts to get into as there's just no appetite for it, yet. Lots of people very ignorant about NFT's though. They have much more of a function than silly jpeg apes on the internet. 

 

How would a business like Hearts get involved? What are we selling?

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Nookie Bear
2 hours ago, Sooks said:

You will all be laughing on the other side of your faces when I get to visit the plot of land that I got on the moon for my birthday when I was 21 ……………. I am hoping I can stand out there of an evening and look at the star I had named after me around about the same time

 

Guaranteed you get there and find yourself next to some tosser in a celtic top.

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11 hours ago, saxondale said:

 

Back to my daft Picasso analogy, how do you prove you own an original Picasso painting? There will be many many copies of the painting to look exactly like the original. But they do eventually confirm its authenticity when it's examined by experts.

 

An NFT is the proof that your digital asset is yours and is the original.

 

No, that's circular logic, and that seems to be the cornerstone of NFTs to get people to buy in.   

 

An original Picasso can be dated and validated, and it is easy to spot a fake.  If I started printing my own ones and claiming they were originals, I would very quickly be found out, but if I started ripping off NFTs, or making slight changes, it wouldn't matter because I have said they are original; plus, since you don't actually own the design or the art itself, only the receipt which says you own the NFT, it doesn't matter if the original artwork is hooky. 

 

I asked a straight forward question: who defines the original NFT, and you couldn't give me an answer.  Mainly because, the only person who defines it is whoever has set up the selling of that particular "asset", and again, like I said, there is nothing to stop multiple people "owning" the same asset if different people are selling it.  You will own your NFT, and someone else will own another, but it doesn't change the fact that it's a load of crap. 

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31 minutes ago, Nookie Bear said:

 

Guaranteed you get there and find yourself next to some tosser in a celtic top.

 

😄 

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You don't own the asset.  

 

All you own is a receipt that says you currently occupy that location in the blockchain. 

 

 

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Captain Lithuania

NFTs are useless without utility. Unfortunately nobody has yet to come up with something they can be used for except scamming people. 

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