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An alternative take......unexpected +++ feelings for Robbie


Luckies1874

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FarmerTweedy
13 hours ago, 151 said:

I like Robbie. I love having staff at the club who actually love Hearts and 'get it'.

 

I wanted us to have a go yesterday and that lasted 45 mins like you say.

 

To not have 1 shot on target in a cup final (i know, Simms technically is on target) is pretty embarrasing for us on national TV - regardless of how much we support Neilson and the players. If you take Gordon's superb saves away and their misses from point blank headers we were crucified without having a go anyway so that's the part I disagree with. I would have preffered to get skelpt and have a go and be brave. Standing watching their keeper with the ball under his foot at 2-0 down in extra time isn't good enough.

 

If it was fitness that was an issue he shouldn't have chose that team - when I looked at the team sheet I said that was the best 11 we have and was the team everyone would have wanted (maybe minus Beni). However if they can't last we should have just sacrificed it for others. 

 

But listen, had we nicked it 1-0 it would have been a masterclass of tactics and a fantastic performance.

 

That's football. 

 

My only worry is we have lost 3 out the last 4 Scottish cup finals.

One other thing I should have said is re your last sentence.  From the early sixties to the mid nineties, we made only two Scottish Cup finals, losing to rangers and an Aberdeen that had been the dominant team over the previous few years. Only making two finals in 30 or so years was worrying!  Then, in 96, we started getting to finals again, losing two (one of them the league cup!) in a year before we went on to win one in 98. Since winning in 2012, we've lost a league cup final to St Mirren while in complete turmoil and heading for administration, and had a few years of no finals (rarely getting close) before making three of the last four Scottish Cup finals. We've been a little unlucky IMO to find ourselves facing an arsecheek in each of those, but at least we've started getting there regularly again, and if we keep doing that, wins will come eventually.  As I said, it's when we're not making finals that's worrying, as we obviously can't win one if we're never reaching them.  Realistically, whether we like it or not, when the arsecheeks have budgets several times the size of ours, they're going to beat us the majority of times we play them. Of course it's disappointing each time it happens, but grounds for worrying would have been if we'd followed up last season's Brora debacle with another early exit. Instead, we made the final again and while it was a disappointing performance and result, for most of our players I think it would have been their first experience of a cup final in front of a 50k crowd, and hopefully that experience will help the ones that are still with us for next season's final (might as well be positive and think we'll get there again)!

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FarmerTweedy
2 hours ago, jam doughnut said:

Indeed. It will be interesting to see how risk averse Hearts are regarding the quantity and quality of player brought in, length and contract terms offered and a higher level of supporting infrastructure. If third place and further European football secured is not consolidated at the end of next season with the significant additional funds available, the club including Neilson and Savage will be privy to dereliction of duty.
 

Though better quality players, back room coaches, superior infrastructure et al incurs commitment to significant funds beyond one or two seasons and if, for whatever reason, third place and European football consolidation doesn’t materialise, will lead to financial challenges ahead.

 

Hearts are now entering a totally new ballgame. We can’t stick but how far will we twist?


 

 

I've said on other threads before, and will say again here, that I think between the guaranteed (or almost guaranteed, if we assume big crowds for next season's European games) income from Europe, our 3rd place finish and the cup run, we've got a "windfall" of somewhere in the region of £5-6m on top of predicted income (with maybe more to come from a Hickey sell-on), and that we'll be slightly cautious with that extra money, in that we'll look to spread it over probably about three years, so next season's budget will probably "only" be a couple of million or so higher than it would have been if we'd finished 4th or 5th and seen another club get the guaranteed group stage football.  That couple of million should be enough to bring in a few more good quality players, but should also ensure that if we don't get group stage European football the following season, another good cup run, etc, we'll still have money in the bank to pay the contracts of those players over the following season's.  So I don't think we'll get into any trouble financially, although it might be that we make some ambitious signings this summer then if we have a less successful season, have to dial things back a little the following summer! 

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8 hours ago, FarmerTweedy said:

One other thing I should have said is re your last sentence.  From the early sixties to the mid nineties, we made only two Scottish Cup finals, losing to rangers and an Aberdeen that had been the dominant team over the previous few years. Only making two finals in 30 or so years was worrying!  Then, in 96, we started getting to finals again, losing two (one of them the league cup!) in a year before we went on to win one in 98. Since winning in 2012, we've lost a league cup final to St Mirren while in complete turmoil and heading for administration, and had a few years of no finals (rarely getting close) before making three of the last four Scottish Cup finals. We've been a little unlucky IMO to find ourselves facing an arsecheek in each of those, but at least we've started getting there regularly again, and if we keep doing that, wins will come eventually.  As I said, it's when we're not making finals that's worrying, as we obviously can't win one if we're never reaching them.  Realistically, whether we like it or not, when the arsecheeks have budgets several times the size of ours, they're going to beat us the majority of times we play them. Of course it's disappointing each time it happens, but grounds for worrying would have been if we'd followed up last season's Brora debacle with another early exit. Instead, we made the final again and while it was a disappointing performance and result, for most of our players I think it would have been their first experience of a cup final in front of a 50k crowd, and hopefully that experience will help the ones that are still with us for next season's final (might as well be positive and think we'll get there again)!

 

Agree with all of this mate. It is gutting to lose but you are right, we are doing the right things to get there. 

 

It would be nice to get lucky with the team we face in the final every now and again.

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As a manager surely you have got to get your team to stay in the game. 

Have a go tactics would have seen us three down at half time. 

Rangers had lots of possession but it was only in the later stages CG got busy. 

Nobody got any praise for a great 90 minute defensive performance ? 🤔 

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I've deliberately stayed away from threads since Saturday.  My initial emotional reaction at full time was disappointment and a bit of frustration.  After calming down and accepting that we were not able to field 11 fully fit players, I'm a bit more philosophical about the outcome, though still have that sense of disappointment that we weren't able to get something on the day.

 

I'm not going to comment on tactics; I just am not qualified (I know it doesn't stop others, but that's their right).  

 

I'm sure that, as a club, we will build on this season.  But being in Europe adds a further challenge in terms of squad quantity and quality.  

 

Overall, proud of what the team has achieved this season.  Again, others will bang their drum on that one, and again that's their right.

 

 

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gowestjambo
12 minutes ago, luckydug said:

As a manager surely you have got to get your team to stay in the game. 

Have a go tactics would have seen us three down at half time. 

Rangers had lots of possession but it was only in the later stages CG got busy. 

Nobody got any praise for a great 90 minute defensive performance ? 🤔 

 

Lets arrange a parade for having a great defensive performance, I am surprised no one else has thought of this.......

 

This was a One off Cup Final -  not a backs to the wall to try and win a point at Ibrox or Parkhead.

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3 minutes ago, gowestjambo said:

 

Lets arrange a parade for having a great defensive performance, I am surprised no one else has thought of this.......

 

This was a One off Cup Final -  not a backs to the wall to try and win a point at Ibrox or Parkhead.

🤡

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Rocky jamboa
35 minutes ago, luckydug said:

As a manager surely you have got to get your team to stay in the game. 

Have a go tactics would have seen us three down at half time. 

Rangers had lots of possession but it was only in the later stages CG got busy. 

Nobody got any praise for a great 90 minute defensive performance ? 🤔 

Maybe if it had been for 60 or 70 minutes then had a go for the last 20 mins but the full 90 minutes?? Why?

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Rogue Daddy
On 22/05/2022 at 01:08, Luckies1874 said:

 

Full disclosure: I've never been a massive Robbie Neilson fan, as a player or as our manager. Over the years I've regularly questioned why; he's been in the side, why we didn't find and sign better, why numerous managers continued to pick him, once a coach why he appeared extremely risk averse, cautious, defensive even and I had (still have) a chip on my shoulder about is influence on Hibs winning the Cup in 2016. So I'm a sceptic, a naysayer and someone he has needed to get back on his side and support his Hearts teams.

 

Which brings me to today, I'm genuinely stunned at the reaction of a significant % of Hearts fans to our approach, our performance and the end result. I hope that the comments and the attitudes are some what influenced by disappointment and drink but I am genuinely surprised by the animosity and rhetoric. For me, a confirmed Neilson doubter, today is actually a day to give him some support and praise. Sorry for this thought and notion but I think he squeezed every ounce out of a very limited Hearts side today and kept us in a game against a talented Rangers team, who correct me if I'm wrong have this season beaten Dortmund, Leipzig, Braga and indeed Celtic in knock out ties. What the hell were people anticipating today????????????? Go at that them and get crucified?

 

I'm reading that tactics were wrong, personnel used incorrectly and subs dubious but seriously folks, we had little chance of success today. This is not the Hearts of 98 (developed magnificently over a couple of seasons by JJ), this was not the electric Hearts of 06 (please wiki the team that faced Gretna, ffs) and this was not the Hearts of 2012 with a talismanic Hearts legend and superstar leading us against garbage opposition. We were huge underdogs today and yet still competed manfully, with 3 or 4 players back from significant injuries and with a weak bench lacking any attacking options (Ginelly, c'mon tae ****). I have wanted a more progressive and positive approach in Glasgow for decades but it is totally wrong to believe today was the time to wish for that, we would have been lambs to the slaughter had we exposed ourselves like that and we gave Rangers as good a game as we can at this time. 

 

When we lost 1-5 and 6 months later 3-4 to Rangers back in the 90's we were building, giving experience and laying foundations and there is reason to be believe similar things are happening just now. Our recruitment is night and day better than in recent seasons, the feel good factor (other than for some tonight, has been returning), we have pull, are an attractive big city club and some finance to back it up with increased salaries and European football, so we have plenty going for us. This is a time to very much stick together. Of course we all want to topple the duopoly, win games like today but we have an enormous opportunity to create a gulf between us in 3rd and the rest. I doubt that has ever existed in Scottish football like it does right now for our club. The financial benefits of groups stage European football and the coefficient over the coming seasons, meaning this should not be a one oft opportunity are immense and can move us well away from your Hibs and Aberdeen's. And that is on top of season ticket sales I predict will be over 15K, European football, Hickey monies etc etc.

 

This is a golden chance for our club and today should be seen as a further catalyst and impetus not something to diminish the place we find ourselves. Rangers were better than us today but we gave everything, lets retain perspective and look forward to a summer of positive and targeted recruitment and an exciting 2022-23 season. Being in that crowd today with 3 generations of my Hearts supporting family was special and there will be days ahead of us that see us come out on top. As I said to my teary nephew this afternoon, I saw us lose 3 Cup Finals before the never to be forgotten win in May 1998 (not to mention semis to Rangers, Celtic, St Mirren, Airdrie x2) so nothing comes easy, it just makes it all the sweeter when we can celebrate. 

 

We'll support you evermore, 

We'll support you evermore,

Heart of Midlothian,

**** off Hibernian

We'll support you evermore.....

 

Excellent post mate! 👍

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7 minutes ago, Rocky jamboa said:

Maybe if it had been for 60 or 70 minutes then had a go for the last 20 mins but the full 90 minutes?? Why?

Like we had a choice in the matter 😏

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Heartsofgold
On 22/05/2022 at 01:08, Luckies1874 said:

 

Full disclosure: I've never been a massive Robbie Neilson fan, as a player or as our manager. Over the years I've regularly questioned why; he's been in the side, why we didn't find and sign better, why numerous managers continued to pick him, once a coach why he appeared extremely risk averse, cautious, defensive even and I had (still have) a chip on my shoulder about is influence on Hibs winning the Cup in 2016. So I'm a sceptic, a naysayer and someone he has needed to get back on his side and support his Hearts teams.

 

Which brings me to today, I'm genuinely stunned at the reaction of a significant % of Hearts fans to our approach, our performance and the end result. I hope that the comments and the attitudes are some what influenced by disappointment and drink but I am genuinely surprised by the animosity and rhetoric. For me, a confirmed Neilson doubter, today is actually a day to give him some support and praise. Sorry for this thought and notion but I think he squeezed every ounce out of a very limited Hearts side today and kept us in a game against a talented Rangers team, who correct me if I'm wrong have this season beaten Dortmund, Leipzig, Braga and indeed Celtic in knock out ties. What the hell were people anticipating today????????????? Go at that them and get crucified?

 

I'm reading that tactics were wrong, personnel used incorrectly and subs dubious but seriously folks, we had little chance of success today. This is not the Hearts of 98 (developed magnificently over a couple of seasons by JJ), this was not the electric Hearts of 06 (please wiki the team that faced Gretna, ffs) and this was not the Hearts of 2012 with a talismanic Hearts legend and superstar leading us against garbage opposition. We were huge underdogs today and yet still competed manfully, with 3 or 4 players back from significant injuries and with a weak bench lacking any attacking options (Ginelly, c'mon tae ****). I have wanted a more progressive and positive approach in Glasgow for decades but it is totally wrong to believe today was the time to wish for that, we would have been lambs to the slaughter had we exposed ourselves like that and we gave Rangers as good a game as we can at this time. 

 

When we lost 1-5 and 6 months later 3-4 to Rangers back in the 90's we were building, giving experience and laying foundations and there is reason to be believe similar things are happening just now. Our recruitment is night and day better than in recent seasons, the feel good factor (other than for some tonight, has been returning), we have pull, are an attractive big city club and some finance to back it up with increased salaries and European football, so we have plenty going for us. This is a time to very much stick together. Of course we all want to topple the duopoly, win games like today but we have an enormous opportunity to create a gulf between us in 3rd and the rest. I doubt that has ever existed in Scottish football like it does right now for our club. The financial benefits of groups stage European football and the coefficient over the coming seasons, meaning this should not be a one oft opportunity are immense and can move us well away from your Hibs and Aberdeen's. And that is on top of season ticket sales I predict will be over 15K, European football, Hickey monies etc etc.

 

This is a golden chance for our club and today should be seen as a further catalyst and impetus not something to diminish the place we find ourselves. Rangers were better than us today but we gave everything, lets retain perspective and look forward to a summer of positive and targeted recruitment and an exciting 2022-23 season. Being in that crowd today with 3 generations of my Hearts supporting family was special and there will be days ahead of us that see us come out on top. As I said to my teary nephew this afternoon, I saw us lose 3 Cup Finals before the never to be forgotten win in May 1998 (not to mention semis to Rangers, Celtic, St Mirren, Airdrie x2) so nothing comes easy, it just makes it all the sweeter when we can celebrate. 

 

We'll support you evermore, 

We'll support you evermore,

Heart of Midlothian,

**** off Hibernian

We'll support you evermore.....

 

Post of the year IMHO.  Nice one!!

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Rocky jamboa
1 hour ago, luckydug said:

Like we had a choice in the matter 😏

Who else's choice was it whether we attacked more???

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25 minutes ago, Rocky jamboa said:

Who else's choice was it whether we attacked more???

I think The Rangers and their quality of players had a big say on that. 

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gowestjambo
28 minutes ago, AlimOzturk said:

People thinking we wanted to be pegged back and defend the whole game 😂 

 

When you string Five along the 18 yard box, with Haring making it Six, you are inviting the oppossition to attack!

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Lord Beni of Gorgie

The only quibble I have with Neilson, is eventually just like players, management and coaching could be upgraded. Meantime, its not a bad foundation being laid

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Francis Albert
3 hours ago, gowestjambo said:

 

When you string Five along the 18 yard box, with Haring making it Six, you are inviting the oppossition to attack!

And not one shot on target in over 120 minutes suggests a certain lack of ambition and adventure.

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I’m sure so called fans were calling for JJ’s head after getting beat by Rangers in the 96 final. Thank god no one listened to them.

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4 hours ago, AlimOzturk said:

People thinking we wanted to be pegged back and defend the whole game 😂 

It's easy all you have to do is have a go. The Rangers would shit themselves. 😂

Or maybe not and we would be four down by HT. 

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gowestjambo
1 hour ago, Francis Albert said:

And not one shot on target in over 120 minutes suggests a certain lack of ambition and adventure.

 

It shows a complete lack of ambition to actually achieve the main objective - of trying to win the Cup!

 

Not only that it let 25,000 Fans down who hade made their way to Hampden, to at least see us make an attempt to win the game. (apart from certain fans who appear happy with our defensive performance!)

 

The one thing that would have upset Rangers early in the game was to get in their faces imo. Instead we allowed them to take control and eventually dominate.

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Naisys Tackle
2 minutes ago, gowestjambo said:

 

It shows a complete lack of ambition to actually achieve the main objective - of trying to win the Cup!

 

Not only that it let 25,000 Fans down who hade made their way to Hampden, to at least see us make an attempt to win the game. (apart from certain fans who appear happy with our defensive performance!)

 

The one thing that would have upset Rangers early in the game was to get in their faces imo. Instead we allowed them to take control and eventually dominate.

 

We done exactly that for the first 25 mins? 

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Naisys Tackle
1 hour ago, GBJambo said:

I’m sure so called fans were calling for JJ’s head after getting beat by Rangers in the 96 final. Thank god no one listened to them.

 

We gave it a better go in 96 (in both finals).  I don't see many people calling for Robbies head either. 

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Unknown user
Just now, Robbies Tackle said:

 

We gave it a better go in 96 (in both finals).  I don't see many people calling for Robbies head either. 

And we lost both. We played a defensive, backs to the wall game in 98 and won.

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Naisys Tackle
1 minute ago, Smithee said:

And we lost both. We played a defensive, backs to the wall game in 98 and won.

 

The early goal was the difference in 98.  We took it to them first 20 on Saturday and had we scored early (a post away from doing so) we would have won the cup.

 

I'm not critisising btw. 

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4 minutes ago, Smithee said:

And we lost both. We played a defensive, backs to the wall game in 98 and won.

 

People have to remember that on Saturday we competed with a team that came within a penalty kick of winning the Europa League. The 1996 SC final was the first final I attended and I remember the feeling of dread as Laudrup scored their second fairly early on in the game (I was right behind the goal). We were absolutely miles off Rangers that day. To be fair, the performance in the league cup final that year was excellent - but as you say we still lost. When you play a team with better players than you you're unlikely to beat them by just playing your normal game. You've got to employ intelligent tactics. On Saturday the tactics were pretty much spot on IMO. We just lacked that bit of quality to create a big chance in the last 15-20 minutes.

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Unknown user
21 minutes ago, Robbies Tackle said:

 

The early goal was the difference in 98.  We took it to them first 20 on Saturday and had we scored early (a post away from doing so) we would have won the cup.

 

I'm not critisising btw. 

 

It was, but we set up defensively before that, JJ and others have talked about it. We'd opened up against rangers and got pummeled during the league season.

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Unknown user
11 minutes ago, stirlo said:

 

People have to remember that on Saturday we competed with a team that came within a penalty kick of winning the Europa League. The 1996 SC final was the first final I attended and I remember the feeling of dread as Laudrup scored their second fairly early on in the game (I was right behind the goal). We were absolutely miles off Rangers that day. To be fair, the performance in the league cup final that year was excellent - but as you say we still lost. When you play a team with better players than you you're unlikely to beat them by just playing your normal game. You've got to employ intelligent tactics. On Saturday the tactics were pretty much spot on IMO. We just lacked that bit of quality to create a big chance in the last 15-20 minutes.

Aye, so near...

But you've got to be in it to win it, if we keep making finals we'll have another one soon.

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Naisys Tackle
1 minute ago, Smithee said:

 

It was, but we set up defensively before that, JJ and others have talked about it. We'd opened up against rangers and got pummeled during the league season.

 

To be be fair to JJ it was magic at Ibrox a couple months before the 96 final :)

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24 minutes ago, Robbies Tackle said:

 

The early goal was the difference in 98.  We took it to them first 20 on Saturday and had we scored early (a post away from doing so) we would have won the cup.

 

I'm not critisising btw. 

The goal helped. But fundamentally the 98 team were a class apart from the current team. The current team are a good team. The 98 team were one of our best in living memory.

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Naisys Tackle
Just now, stirlo said:

The goal helped. But fundamentally the 98 team were a class apart from the current team. The current team are a good team. The 98 team were one of our best in living memory.

 

They gave me the best day of my life.  I would never argue otherwise. 

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Unknown user
1 minute ago, Robbies Tackle said:

 

To be be fair to JJ it was magic at Ibrox a couple months before the 96 final :)

:laugh2: that was a mental one, but also set up defensively, hitting on the counter

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Luckies1874
30 minutes ago, gowestjambo said:

 

It shows a complete lack of ambition to actually achieve the main objective - of trying to win the Cup!

 

Not only that it let 25,000 Fans down who hade made their way to Hampden, to at least see us make an attempt to win the game. (apart from certain fans who appear happy with our defensive performance!)

 

The one thing that would have upset Rangers early in the game was to get in their faces imo. Instead we allowed them to take control and eventually dominate.

 

Speak for yourself. They certainly didn't let me down on Saturday and I don't believe it was a deliberately defensive performance. You would have been on here greeting and criticising a 4 or 5 zip pumping if they'd run rings round an exposed back line as would almost certainly have happened if we had played in the way you seem to have wanted. We had absolutely no chance of winning on Saturday playing basketball with Rangers. None. They only way we might have brought the cup back along Gorgie was to be pragmatic, competitive, take a chance when it came along (and we created a couple in the first half), get lucky and see Craig Gordon produce when required. For 90 minutes lots of those boxes were ticked, we just ran out of steam, out of luck and we had nothing and nobody to create us a chance or score us a goal. We deservedly came away defeated but it had noting to do with your perceived defensive approach and everything to do with us being simply outmatched by far better players. 

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Naisys Tackle
Just now, Smithee said:

:laugh2: that was a mental one, but also set up defensively, hitting on the counter

 

****in' great times mate.  My first watching us home and away. 

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I get we played with a few injuries but sorry we’ve been shit for the last 5 games regardless of personnel. 
 

We look tired, zero game plan and Robbie coming out with gems like ‘not bothered’ after losing games. 
 

That would have been fine if we genuinely were saving ourselves to have a right go in  the final but we obviously weren’t as we were awful and had no energy nor any ideas. 
 

As soon as Boyce went off, Simms was isolated and we were ****ed. 
 

We hugely mismanaged the last 4/5 weeks of the season IMO and Robbie is to blame for that. 

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Great post.

 

I tend to ignore posts which are full of phrases such as "Pathetic performance"  "Non triers"  "They were there for the taking"  

 

Phrases along these lines suggest to me that the person writing them fails to understand that there are two teams on the pitch and the other one does not just lie down and let us do as we wish. It also suggests that they do not really appreciate what it takes to be a professional player. 

 

The Rangers had a hard 120 mins in midweek but how many of our players were just back from or were recently carrying an injury.

Halkett, Souttar, Kingsley, Simms, Halliday, Atkinson, Boyce and Devlin that I can think of immediately.  Not really a surprise that we ran out of steam as we did.

 

It will obviously depend to a large extent on how we manage the recruitment over the summer, but I, like the OP can see signs that we are in a good place. We do need to avoid complacency and be aware that teams like Aberdeen, Hibs and Dundee United will be raising their game to get into that good  place themselves. 

 

I am quietly optimistic we can improve

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i wish jj was my dad
9 hours ago, Rocky jamboa said:

Maybe if it had been for 60 or 70 minutes then had a go for the last 20 mins but the full 90 minutes?? Why?

Because 4/5 players were well short of fitness and our bench wasn't strong enough. It's shite but there it is. I wanted them to go for it but once I sobered up I realised why we didn't. 

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i wish jj was my dad
42 minutes ago, PaddysBar said:

I get we played with a few injuries but sorry we’ve been shit for the last 5 games regardless of personnel. 
 

We look tired, zero game plan and Robbie coming out with gems like ‘not bothered’ after losing games. 
 

That would have been fine if we genuinely were saving ourselves to have a right go in  the final but we obviously weren’t as we were awful and had no energy nor any ideas. 
 

As soon as Boyce went off, Simms was isolated and we were ****ed. 
 

We hugely mismanaged the last 4/5 weeks of the season IMO and Robbie is to blame for that. 

What could we have done differently. Played inferior but fitter players? 

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gowestjambo
1 hour ago, Robbies Tackle said:

 

We done exactly that for the first 25 mins? 

 

I believe it was closer to 10 -15 minutes max.

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gowestjambo
1 hour ago, Luckies1874 said:

 

Speak for yourself. They certainly didn't let me down on Saturday and I don't believe it was a deliberately defensive performance. You would have been on here greeting and criticising a 4 or 5 zip pumping if they'd run rings round an exposed back line as would almost certainly have happened if we had played in the way you seem to have wanted. We had absolutely no chance of winning on Saturday playing basketball with Rangers. None. They only way we might have brought the cup back along Gorgie was to be pragmatic, competitive, take a chance when it came along (and we created a couple in the first half), get lucky and see Craig Gordon produce when required. For 90 minutes lots of those boxes were ticked, we just ran out of steam, out of luck and we had nothing and nobody to create us a chance or score us a goal. We deservedly came away defeated but it had noting to do with your perceived defensive approach and everything to do with us being simply outmatched by far better players. 

 

I only ever speak for myself. We had 5/6 Defenders accross the 18 yard line which not only invited them to attack, it meant we had no out ball. If you are happy with a meek attempt with no shots on target, who am I to criticise?

 

The fact that Robbie's sit back and defend tactics have never worked, were unlikely to produce a different result. You are speculating that getting in their faces early on to disrupt them wouldnt have worked, no more than that.

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FarmerTweedy
8 hours ago, Rocky jamboa said:

Who else's choice was it whether we attacked more???

It's a little tricky to attack when you don't have the ball!

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22 minutes ago, i wish jj was my dad said:

What could we have done differently. Played inferior but fitter players? 


Our midfield could have tried to go forward and break the lines. Our midfield could have not left Simms completely isolated after Boyce went off. Our midfield could have not let Rangers advance right up to our box for both goals. 
 

I know there’s a gulf in budgets but we were ****ing awful mate. First time in our history we didn’t have a shot on target in a final. 
 

Rangers looked tired and there for the taking after an hour and we never laid a glove on them. 

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i wish jj was my dad
5 minutes ago, PaddysBar said:


Our midfield could have tried to go forward and break the lines. Our midfield could have not left Simms completely isolated after Boyce went off. Our midfield could have not let Rangers advance right up to our box for both goals. 
 

I know there’s a gulf in budgets but we were ****ing awful mate. First time in our history we didn’t have a shot on target in a final. 
 

Rangers looked tired and there for the taking after an hour and we never laid a glove on them. 

Cammy was dead on his feet in the second half and McAneff isn't good enough to run a game against them. We also had two half fit centre halfs who although played very well were nowhere near fit so very vulnerable.

I'm disappointed and at the time I wanted us to go for it too but I'm not sure we could do much more without risking a skelping. 

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Luckies1874
5 minutes ago, gowestjambo said:

 

I only ever speak for myself. We had 5/6 Defenders accross the 18 yard line which not only invited them to attack, it meant we had no out ball. If you are happy with a meek attempt with no shots on target, who am I to criticise?

 

The fact that Robbie's sit back and defend tactics have never worked, were unlikely to produce a different result. You are speculating that getting in their faces early on to disrupt them wouldnt have worked, no more than that.

 

"Not only that it let 25,000 Fans down who hade made their way to Hampden", were your words. They didn't let me down and it's pretty clear even from this thread plenty felt likewise. 

 

We did get in their faces throughout the first half. The tactics most definitely worked during that period of the game in fact it could be argued we came closer to scoring than they did in the first 45 minutes. 

 

As I said in my original post I have had my doubts about Neilson and indeed still do but the reaction from some, such as yourself, to the defeat on Saturday shows an unrealistic expectation as to our chances of victory. 

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2 minutes ago, i wish jj was my dad said:

Cammy was dead on his feet in the second half and McAneff isn't good enough to run a game against them. We also had two half fit centre halfs who although played very well were nowhere near fit so very vulnerable.

I'm disappointed and at the time I wanted us to go for it too but I'm not sure we could do much more without risking a skelping. 


All fair points mate but I’d rather we went for it and risked a skelping to be honest. 
 

Rangers looked dead on their feet before finishing strongly. We had a 10-20 minute spell around 60 mins and they looked knackered. That was when the management team should have tried something different. 
 

But a good season overall and lots to look forward to, just a bit gutted injuries and what I think was poor management meant a poor end to the season. 

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Rocky jamboa
1 hour ago, FarmerTweedy said:

It's a little tricky to attack when you don't have the ball!

You're not going to have the ball if you sit deep for 120 minutes. You're going to give the ball away every time.

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Rocky jamboa
2 hours ago, i wish jj was my dad said:

Because 4/5 players were well short of fitness and our bench wasn't strong enough. It's shite but there it is. I wanted them to go for it but once I sobered up I realised why we didn't. 

I don't understand why he didn't give souttar and halkett more game time before the final. He gave halkett and souttar 20 mins v rangers in the league game. Then risked Kingsley, Simms, haring, Boyce and mckay in the same meaningless game. Boyce and Haring picking up injuries.

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i wish jj was my dad
4 minutes ago, Rocky jamboa said:

I don't understand why he didn't give souttar and halkett more game time before the final. He gave halkett and souttar 20 mins v rangers in the league game. Then risked Kingsley, Simms, haring, Boyce and mckay in the same meaningless game. Boyce and Haring picking up injuries.

Me neither but you have to trust the club that they had optimised the minutes on the park for the players. 

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Francis Albert
4 hours ago, Smithee said:

And we lost both. We played a defensive, backs to the wall game in 98 and won.

Nonsense. We were competitive  in the game until Rangers goal and certainly were backs to the wall then but only for the last ten minutes. But before that we were never solely defensive and if Flogel had scored with his chance we would have won more comfortably.

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Unknown user
2 minutes ago, Francis Albert said:

Nonsense. We were competitive  in the game until Rangers goal and certainly were backs to the wall then but only for the last ten minutes. But before that we were never solely defensive and if Flogel had scored with his chance we would have won more comfortably.

I'm going with what JJ said on this one, we weren't set up to have a go, we were set up to defend.

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Francis Albert
1 minute ago, Smithee said:

I'm going with what JJ said on this one, we weren't set up to have a go, we were set up to defend.

I am going with what I saw. As I remember we had more than one shot on target.

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