Russia Invades Ukraine

[Dirty Deeds]

4 hours ago, Craig_ said:

Putin doing a Rangers now - https://www.independent.co.uk/news/world/europe/ukraine-russia-war-live-trump-zelensky-putin-oligarchs-economy-b2945082.html

Sounds like an offer that should not be refused ☠️

[Cade]

[Pap]

Ukraine and Saudia Arabia sign a deal on defense.

 

 

Zelenskyy, was seeming well received.

[biglaff]

In the next couple of days Russian killed and badly injured will hit 1.3 million.  

[Cade]

Ukraine takes down a military transport plane in Crimea which was full of Russian soldiers, killing around 30.

Hit it with an FP-2 drone.
Russia claimed "technical difficulties" caused the crash, so Ukraine published the on-board camera shots from the drone.

 

In the south (the so-called Tokmak sector), Russia launched another offensive, which got destroyed completely.

 

In the north east, Kupiansk has finally been fully liberated after the few remaining Russians who were hiding in bombed-out ruined basements were eliminated.

 

In Hungary, the panicking Orban has claimed that the Hungarian-speaking minority in western Ukraine are being persecuted and are in need of "rescue". State media is pushing this narrative and suggesting that the region(s) should be annexed by Hungary.
At least the silly cant has been told by the EU to shut up about the oil pipeline issues as they've got engineers working in Ukraine to fix the breaches caused by his pal Putin.
Orban then switched to pishing his breeks about the gas pipeline under the Black Sea, coming up with various conspiracy theories and threats about Ukraine planning to blow it up.
Ukraine has published records of phone calls between the Hungarian Foreign Minister and the Russian Foreign Minister, with the Hungarians promising to put spanners in the works of EU deals and to loosen sanctions on Russia. Hungary is now also crying about espionage due to this leak.
BUT Hungary has now withdrawn its veto of the EU's €90 billion Ukraine loan, so the first payments will be made by the end of this week.
The Orban clown show continues.

 

Ukraine has also signed a new defence deal with the Saudis, offering their drone schematics and training.

 

Edited April 1 by Cade

[lost in space]

4 hours ago, Cade said:

Ukraine takes down a military transport plane in Crimea which was full of Russian soldiers, killing around 30.

Hit it with an FP-2 drone.
Russia claimed "technical difficulties" caused the crash, so Ukraine published the on-board camera shots from the drone.

 

In the south (the so-called Tokmak sector), Russia launched another offensive, which got destroyed completely.

 

In the north east, Kupiansk has finally been fully liberated after the few remaining Russians who were hiding in bombed-out ruined basements were eliminated.

 

In Hungary, the panicking Orban has claimed that the Hungarian-speaking minority in western Ukraine are being persecuted and are in need of "rescue". State media is pushing this narrative and suggesting that the region(s) should be annexed by Hungary.
At least the silly cant has been told by the EU to shut up about the oil pipeline issues as they've got engineers working in Ukraine to fix the breaches caused by his pal Putin.
Orban then switched to pishing his breeks about the gas pipeline under the Black Sea, coming up with various conspiracy theories and threats about Ukraine planning to blow it up.
Ukraine has published records of phone calls between the Hungarian Foreign Minister and the Russian Foreign Minister, with the Hungarians promising to put spanners in the works of EU deals and to loosen sanctions on Russia. Hungary is now also crying about espionage due to this leak.
BUT Hungary has now withdrawn its veto of the EU's €90 billion Ukraine loan, so the first payments will be made by the end of this week.
The Orban clown show continues.

 

Ukraine has also signed a new defence deal with the Saudis, offering their drone schematics and training.

 

Why do you think Hungary withdrew the veto. I presume they were under pressure from the other EU members. I wonder what the EU threatened. Expulsion?

Must have been a serious threat.

[Dirty Deeds]

4 minutes ago, lost in space said:

Why do you think Hungary withdrew the veto. I presume they were under pressure from the other EU members. I wonder what the EU threatened. Expulsion?

Must have been a serious threat.

They've an election in a couple of weeks time and Orban's party are trailing in the polls.

[lost in space]

3 minutes ago, Dirty Deeds said:

They've an election in a couple of weeks time and Orban's party are trailing in the polls.

Ah, I see. Thanks.

[Cade]

41 minutes ago, lost in space said:

Why do you think Hungary withdrew the veto. I presume they were under pressure from the other EU members. I wonder what the EU threatened. Expulsion?

Must have been a serious threat.

 

EU pressure and Ukraine leaking the Foreign Minister phone calls.

Orban's pretty much running his entire election campaign on "Ukraine is the enemy, Putin is our only hope"

But each time he oversteps the mark, the adults in the EU slap him down hard and he backs down. Every single time.

 

[lost in space]

1 minute ago, Cade said:

 

EU pressure and Ukraine leaking the Foreign Minister phone calls.

Orban's pretty much running his entire election campaign on "Ukraine is the enemy, Putin is our only hope"

But each time he oversteps the mark, the adults in the EU slap him down hard and he backs down. Every single time.

 

Very good news.

Also, as @Dirty Deeds says, election upcoming.

Maybe the Hungarian voters are becoming more aware of Orban's lies.

[Pap]

Last week, Orban got booed at his own rally

[Cade]

Slovakia's Robert Fico has called for the ending of Russian oil and gas sanctions (after a phone call with Hugnary's panicking Orban)

 

And in Serbia, that other hotbed of Russian interference in Europe, Orban claims that Serbian authorities have found a truck bomb near the main gas pipeline which runs through the country en route to Hungary and Slovakia.

Convenient.

 

Looks like the "arsehole spine" of Slovakia, Hungary and Serbia are working together to spread absolute pish and frame Ukraine as the enemy.

We'll see how much noise they make after the Hungarian election in a few day's time.

OR this blatant false-flag will be used as the justification of the cancelling of the elections....

 

Edited April 5 by Cade

[Cade]

The AN-26 military transport plane which was downed by a Ukrainian drone over Crimea had been carrying Alexander Otroshchenko, senior commander of the 45th Army of the Northern Fleet's Air Force and Air Defence.

He was one of those who was killed.

Another high ranking commander to add to the (long) list of eliminations.

 

In Russia, the Novorossiysk naval base was hit once again by a massive swarm of Ukrainian drones and the oil terminal is once again on fire. This is a repeating motif in recent months. Ukraine blows it up, Russians repair it, Ukraine blows it up again.

Russian military bloggers are complaining about a lack of air defence, especially shortages of ammunition for their SAMs. 

 

Up in the north, Russia's stagnant Vovchansk offensive (been over a year with essentially no movement) has apparently suffered a major reversal, with Ukrainian forces driving a wedge into the town and taking many Russian prisoners.

 

 

[Cade]

Ukraine uses a fleet of UK-made heavy lift drones to deliver 1.5 tons of explosives underneath a bridge in the Kherson region, which was then destroyed.

Putin threatens to blow up Westminster Bridge in London in retaliation.

 

Edited April 8 by Cade

[Mikey1874]

President Zelensky says the future can be a military alliance of Britain, Norway, Turkey and Ukraine. 

[milky_26]

2 hours ago, Mikey1874 said:

President Zelensky says the future can be a military alliance of Britain, Norway, Turkey and Ukraine. 

BUNT

[Tommy Brown]

4 hours ago, milky_26 said:

BUNT

Or UKUNT

[lost in space]

Or - No BrUT.

[redjambo]

5 hours ago, milky_26 said:

BUNT

 

Canada are standing by if the UK don't want to take part in the alliance.

[The Real Maroonblood]

2 minutes ago, redjambo said:

 

Canada are standing by if the UK don't want to take part in the alliance.

[Tommy Brown]

36 minutes ago, redjambo said:

 

Canada are standing by if the UK don't want to take part in the alliance.

I thought my UKUNT was not bad 

[Pap]

The cracks in Russia are spreading all over. 

 

Russian propagandists -

 

 

Edited April 12 by Pap

[Pap]

I would absolutely LOVE @Libertarian's thoughts on this

 

[Hagar the Horrible]

CNN reporting that pressure on students to sign up is massive. Its a one year deal eith ghe spin on becoming drone pilots and playing xbox not being wasted.  However it front line and an open contract,  you are unlikely to come out alive. Some are saying even the poorer students are NOT falling for this. Putin must be desperate 

[Cade]

Life expectancy for Russian soldiers in Ukraine is somewhere around 60 days.

[Horatio Caine]

4 hours ago, Cade said:

Life expectancy for Russian soldiers in Ukraine is somewhere around 60 days.

As much as that? Ukrainians need to smarten up their act.

[Hagar the Horrible]

4 hours ago, Cade said:

Life expectancy for Russian soldiers in Ukraine is somewhere around 60 days.

does that include the 2 weeks training? and the time to get to the front line???

[Cade]

That 60 days is from the time they sign the contract to them being listed as "missing"

So yes, this includes basic training.

Edited Tuesday at 16:02 by Cade

[Dirty Deeds]

3 minutes ago, Cade said:

That 60 days is from the time they sign the contract to them being listed as "missing"

So yes, this includes basic training.

Hibs title challenge lasted longer 

[Dirty Deeds]

It's insane though, in a free country, there would have been protests and widespread civil disobedience. The of the American Vietnam protests multiplied by a thousand 

 

In Russia, speak up and you'll be on the front line quicker than you can say Enough Of This Now

[All roads lead to Gorgie]

17 minutes ago, Dirty Deeds said:

It's insane though, in a free country, there would have been protests and widespread civil disobedience. The of the American Vietnam protests multiplied by a thousand 

 

In Russia, speak up and you'll be on the front line quicker than you can say Enough Of This Now

If it wasn't for Trump Russia would have been driven out of the areas it occupies by now and Putin would have his head on a stick !

[Dido of Consequence]

17 hours ago, Hagar the Horrible said:

does that include the 2 weeks training? and the time to get to the front line???

I remember a few years back there was a lot of chat about Ukraine providing pathways which allowed Russian soldiers to safely surrender.

 

Don't really hear about that anymore, and perhaps as the fighting has gone on for so long, and the bitterness has increased, there isn't the same desire to preserve the life of an enemy.

 

If there are a lot of reluctant Russian soldiers in the ranks, that would be an ideal way to reduce unnecessary loss of life while depleting them at the same time.

 

Maybe a 3rd party could step in and provide a safe passage for surrendering Russians. 

 

 

[Hagar the Horrible]

Just now, Dido of Consequence said:

I remember a few years back there was a lot of chat about Ukraine providing pathways which allowed Russian soldiers to safely surrender.

 

Don't really hear about that anymore, and perhaps as the fighting has gone on for so long, and the bitterness has increased, there isn't the same desire to preserve the life of an enemy.

 

If there are a lot of reluctant Russian soldiers in the ranks, that would be an ideal way to reduce unnecessary loss of life while depleting them at the same time.

 

Maybe a 3rd party could step in and provide a safe passage for surrendering Russians. 

 

 

They have more mobile crematoriums than tanks, and they don't want so many walking wounded returning home as that is not a good look, read that in whatever way?

 

Safe surrender might still cause issues with their families. We could have localised safe zones. But can you trust the Russians?

[highlandjambo3]

1 hour ago, Dido of Consequence said:

I remember a few years back there was a lot of chat about Ukraine providing pathways which allowed Russian soldiers to safely surrender.

 

Don't really hear about that anymore, and perhaps as the fighting has gone on for so long, and the bitterness has increased there isn't the same desire to preserve the life of an enemy.

Not an easy one tbh, I’ve been in a few situations which were close but, not close enough to see a  bunch of my friends taken down, your comrades can also be your neighbours, families you know, wife’s and children you’ve had round for a bbq etc….. I’ve lost plenty of people I know but none in any sort of aggressive close combat scenarios.  So the people that did this 30 seconds previous now want to surrender, *I know what I should do but I don’t know what I would do.  We all have a lust for revenge and thankfully I’ll not be tested.

 

* I was questioned by the SIB about war crimes after the first gulf war (calm yer beans now 😁) but so were many others, nowt to see or say that I was aware of.

[Dido of Consequence]

4 hours ago, highlandjambo3 said:

Not an easy one tbh, I’ve been in a few situations which were close but, not close enough to see a  bunch of my friends taken down, your comrades can also be your neighbours, families you know, wife’s and children you’ve had round for a bbq etc….. I’ve lost plenty of people I know but none in any sort of aggressive close combat scenarios.  So the people that did this 30 seconds previous now want to surrender, *I know what I should do but I don’t know what I would do.  We all have a lust for revenge and thankfully I’ll not be tested.

 

* I was questioned by the SIB about war crimes after the first gulf war (calm yer beans now 😁) but so were many others, nowt to see or say that I was aware of.

Totally respect that point of view, mate. Easy for me to spout hippy dippy shit when I've never been faced with that situation before.

 

I guess, in a war situation, soldiers are trained to kill or be killed. Hard to switch that off and be all singing Kumbaya holding hands round a camp fire.

 

That's why I was saying about a 3rd party country, that isn't in direct conflict with Russia, offering a way for surrendering 

[highlandjambo3]

21 minutes ago, Dido of Consequence said:

 

That's why I was saying about a 3rd party country, that isn't in direct conflict with Russia, offering a way for surrendering 

There’s probably a lot more to that tbh…..it’s very easy to chuck your cards in and split when a front line is more fluid and not so well defined but, if we’re talking about Russia, who’s MO is (still) to charge at an enemy head on, the Russian powers to be have probably made it quite clear what will happen to family members if you turn and run.

[Cade]

Punishment for retreating is far more immediate.

Retreating Russians are shot be other Russian units.

When you go on the attack, you either die by Ukrainian drone, get captured or are killed by your own side.

 

[redjambo]

The actual logistics of taking prisoners on the front line in the heat of battle are, I imagine, complex and could become messy. What if the prisoner has been wired up with explosives or viral pathogens, or if they've been GPS'd to broadcast their position back so that the enemy can build a picture of the behind-lines structure? Also, do the front-line troops actually want to divert crucial resources into getting the prisoner to a place securely behind the lines? etc.

 

On the other hand, prisoners are useful for prisoner swaps, propaganda purposes, and gaining intel on enemy movements and organisation.

 

As far I am aware, the Ukrainians have been encouraging Russians to get in touch with them beforehand and arrange to give themselves up so that they can organise the procedure on the battlefield in a way in which it can be more controlled without distracting from the fighting. Perhaps with dedicated extraction teams. That way the intel folk might also be able to do some recon on the subjects themselves before they hand themselves over to determine what use they could be and whether or not they sound legit.

[FWJ]

Possibility of a Trojan Horse thing going on too?  Thousands of Russian troops saying that they’re surrendering and being taken behind Ukrainian lines.

 

(Just as an aside, I sometimes think people need to remember we’re talking about hundreds of thousands of young men’s lives.  People like most of the posters on this site.)

[highlandjambo3]

1 hour ago, redjambo said:

 

1 hour ago, redjambo said:

Edited Wednesday at 20:19 by highlandjambo3

[Cade]

If you've seen the state of the Russian POWs you'd know that they are not highly trained special forces operatives pretending to surrender to cause havoc behind the lines.

They're a total shambles.
Malnourished, barely armed, most of them high as a kite or pished out of their nut.

[redjambo]

9 minutes ago, highlandjambo3 said:

 

 

Please feel free to PM me and offer criticism of my posts directly if you're worried I would be upset at you ripping my posts apart in public (if that was the reason for your deletion edit).

[highlandjambo3]

1 hour ago, redjambo said:

The actual logistics of taking prisoners on the front line in the heat of battle are, I imagine, complex and could become messy.

 

There is logistical support immediately just behind front line troops, they will resupply ammunition, food and water at very short notice, they will also extract injured personnel and prisoners (although they could be overwhelmed by the volume of POW).  Using things like quad bikes and trailers has greatly enhanced this capability.  The POW thing is discussed but tbh in my experience it’s never actually practiced in any scale.….any yes it could get messy.

What if the prisoner has been wired up with explosives or viral pathogens, or if they've been GPS'd to broadcast their position back so that the enemy can build a picture of the behind-lines structure?
 

Not taking the piss but 😁….sounds more like a Hollywood blockbuster staring Brad Pitt.  This is not an issue as far as I’m aware (I left the military like 20 years ago 😳)

 

Also, do the front-line troops actually want to divert crucial resources into getting the prisoner to a place securely behind the lines? etc.  

 

Resources are already in place…..see above.

 

1 hour ago, redjambo said:

 

On the other hand, prisoners are useful for prisoner swaps, propaganda purposes, and gaining intel on enemy movements and organisation. 

 

That is not supposed to happen.

 

Edited Wednesday at 20:32 by highlandjambo3

[highlandjambo3]

6 minutes ago, redjambo said:

 

Please feel free to PM me and offer criticism of my posts directly if you're worried I would be upset at you ripping my posts apart in public (if that was the reason for your deletion edit).

Sorry….typo which I didn’t know how to correct 🤣🤣🤣🤣……I just ended up posting empty boxes with no text…..I also don’t criticise, it’s constructive dialogue I prefer 😁.

Edited Wednesday at 20:34 by highlandjambo3

[redjambo]

Just now, highlandjambo3 said:

Sorry….typo which I didn’t know how to correct 🤣🤣🤣🤣……I just ended up posting empty boxes with no text.

 

 No worries. I misinterpreted it (no new thing for me) and thought you had posted an evisceration and thought twice about it.

 

Is it the post-capture intel extraction that's not supposed to happen (I was genuinely unaware if this is the case), and is this no longer the case if someone contacts the Ukrainians beforehand and arranges to hand themselves over? There are certainly cases of Russian soldiers having willingly provided such intel.

[highlandjambo3]

1 minute ago, redjambo said:

 

 No worries. I misinterpreted it (no new thing for me) and thought you had posted an 1. evisceration and thought twice about it.

 

Is it the 2.post-capture intel extraction that's not supposed to happen (I was genuinely unaware if this is the case), and is this no longer the case if someone contacts the Ukrainians beforehand and arranges to hand themselves over? There are certainly cases of Russian soldiers having willingly provided such intel.

1 don’t know what that means 🤷‍♂️

 

2. Intel gathering is allowed, particularly at tactical level when it’s hot off the press, I.e a new marked minefield 1k away that our troops are heading towards is a definite need to know at local level, pointless trying to send this up as it will get caught up in the fog.  I was more meaning bargaining chips or parading captures POW’s on news for propaganda.

[redjambo]

5 minutes ago, highlandjambo3 said:

1 don’t know what that means 🤷‍♂️

 

2. Intel gathering is allowed, particularly at tactical level when it’s hot off the press, I.e a new marked minefield 1k away that our troops are heading towards is a definite need to know at local level, pointless trying to send this up as it will get caught up in the fog.  I was more meaning bargaining chips or parading captures POW’s on news for propaganda.

 

1. Tearing my arguments apart with glee.

 

2. Ah, good, that's what I thought. The Russians and Ukrainians often exchange prisoners. It's actually good, imo, because it provides further reason on the battlefield to take prisoners. As for parading captured POW's, I had no idea that was against the Geneva Convention. You live and learn. I assume that this does not apply to voluntary defectors as long as they are not treated as prisoners?

[highlandjambo3]

6 minutes ago, redjambo said:

I assume that this does not apply to voluntary defectors as long as they are not treated as prisoners?

I ken what I ken and I dinny ken that one…….i could look it up but I can’t be arsed 😁

[redjambo]

2 minutes ago, highlandjambo3 said:

I ken what I ken and I dinny ken that one…….i could look it up but I can’t be arsed 😁

 

 No worries. I've just checked and as far as I can see they're covered by the Fourth Convention (the one protecting civilians).

 

Anyway, thanks for the info about the logistical support team doubling as a prisoner processing team. I hadn't considered that, assuming that there would be a completely separate prisoner team.

[highlandjambo3]

5 minutes ago, redjambo said:

Anyway, thanks for the info about the logistical support team doubling as a prisoner processing team. I hadn't considered that, 1.  assuming that there would be a completely separate prisoner team.

1.  No enough sojerz to do all that.

 

The interrogation team from military int….thats a different game altogether 😏