Russia Invades Ukraine

[Mikey1874]

5 minutes ago, Robbies right hand man said:

I don't agree with it. Made that quite clear

 

You stated the reasons Russia says it has invaded. Attacking Dombas, neo-nazis in army. 

 

So what should Russia have done?

[Robbies right hand man]

33 minutes ago, Mikey1874 said:

 

You stated the reasons Russia says it has invaded. Attacking Dombas, neo-nazis in army. 

 

So what should Russia have done?

I don't have the answers my friend. I was just stating that the mess isn't one sided.

[Mikey1874]

Just now, Robbies right hand man said:

I don't have the answers my friend. I was just stating that the mess isn't one sided.

 

So you justify the invasion if you say it's not one sided.

 

Maybe research Russia a bit more. 

[Robbies right hand man]

Just now, Mikey1874 said:

 

So you justify the invasion if you say it's not one sided.

 

Maybe research Russia a bit more. 

 

I didn't justify it at all.

 

Maybe you should do your own research. 

[Mikey1874]

 

[Mikey1874]

 

[Mikey1874]

 

 

[Mikey1874]

 

[Mikey1874]

 

[Sharpie]

Just heard a report that there could be as many as 10,000 dead bodies in a building that the Russians have been bombing and shelling for a considerable time. Thats one building 10,000. I have attended incidents where there have been multiple deaths even under ten bodies and that is horrific to see, I am not sure how the people dealing with multiplesloke 10,000 handle their PTSD.

The Russians have done exactly what Germany did to Poland leading to WW2, in my humble opinion if nuclear weapons had not been discovered, and we were still in an age of bombs, large military, we could be in WW3 right now. My immediate family are now all too old or already gone so I have no cards in this game, I feel sorry for those of you who no doubt will have to live through the terrors of and results of a short bloody forever radiation infected world war. There will be no recovery from that the after effects and the sights of other humans affected by the horrific weapons will be traumatic to live with. If I was religious I would ask God help them, but I am not sure about that divine help.

[Jambo-Jimbo]

2 hours ago, Jeffros Furios said:

A lots changed in 4 yrs and it you knew anything about it you wouldn't of quoted that article .

Check out Wagner Group and thier close ties to Putin and openly nazi symbols and tattoos. 

See what they've done in Syria and Central African Republic .

 

 

They got caught red handed on film killing and burying villagers in Mali, then tried to blame it on the French.

 

2 hours ago, Sawdust Caesar said:

And at the foot of that Guardian article there are stories about the far-right in Sweden, Germany, Spain, Hungary and France, maybe Putin should invade them as well seen as he's so concerned about the far-right. 

 

Putin should start in the Kremlin, I'm sure there will be plenty of neo-nazi's in there.

[Sawdust Caesar]

14 minutes ago, Jambo-Jimbo said:

 

They got caught red handed on film killing and burying villagers in Mali, then tried to blame it on the French.

 

 

Putin should start in the Kremlin, I'm sure there will be plenty of neo-nazi's in there.

Indeed, and I'll wager there are more nazis in Russia than Ukraine. Maybe Russia should invade itself.

[Maple Leaf]

Apparently the Ukrainians are using so-called Kamikaze drones supplied by the Americans.  These little charmers cruise around looking for a military target.  When they see something interesting like a tank or another armoured vehicle, they simply dive straight into it.

 

I've no idea how large their warhead is, but they are quite lethal.  Humans are ingenious when it comes to devising new ways to kill other humans.

[Jambo-Jimbo]

1 hour ago, Sawdust Caesar said:

Indeed, and I'll wager there are more nazis in Russia than Ukraine. Maybe Russia should invade itself.

 

Just cast your mind back to the 2018 World Cup in Russia, for months and months before hand there were serious warnings all over the media of potential major trouble by far right neo-nazi Russian hooligans, thousands of them.  In the end the threat was so great that the Russians didn't want the whole World to see that they have a serious neo-nazi problem, that the Russian authorities rounded up hundreds maybe thousands of them and locked them up for the duration of the tournament. 

 

So, yes, Russia has a major neo-nazi problem, one which usually get's a quick sweep sweep sweep, move along nothing to see here.

[Jeffros Furios]

15 minutes ago, Maple Leaf said:

Apparently the Ukrainians are using so-called Kamikaze drones supplied by the Americans.  These little charmers cruise around looking for a military target.  When they see something interesting like a tank or another armoured vehicle, they simply dive straight into it.

 

I've no idea how large their warhead is, but they are quite lethal.  Humans are ingenious when it comes to devising new ways to kill other humans.

That will be the Switchblade drones . 

2 different models but so fast they can't be shot down .

Hopefully kill as many Russians as possible. 

[Mister T]

On 23/05/2022 at 18:39, thewiseone said:

People choosing to support Ukraine, driven by the media story, the same media who convinced the population at large about the scamdemic of covid, the need to wear masks, isolate etc.

Its time to start thinking for yourself.

 

No mask ever, no vaccine nor booster, never isolated, no social distancing, in fact have done everything in opposition to the rules as layed down by government etc.

 

Still waiting for my dose of Covid, never felt better, anyone know how that works?

 

Coupled with this back to watching the famous ,, but so disappointed in Saturdays lack of fitness after the 90 mins.

I wonder what part the vaccines had in negating our players energy levels, after all ours in charge at the club got fully behind the covid vaccination policy, i suspect most of the first team will have been done , I suppose we can be thank ful none of them toppled due to myocarditis enduced by the vaccination.

Glad to be back 

 

[Howdy Doody Jambo]

1 hour ago, Mister T said:

 

 

[JFK-1]

11 hours ago, Maple Leaf said:

Apparently the Ukrainians are using so-called Kamikaze drones supplied by the Americans.  These little charmers cruise around looking for a military target.  When they see something interesting like a tank or another armoured vehicle, they simply dive straight into it.

 

I've no idea how large their warhead is, but they are quite lethal.  Humans are ingenious when it comes to devising new ways to kill other humans.

 

This phase of the war is going to be won by whoever best utilises surveillance drones. Ukraine is now beginning to field US howitzers which have a 50% greater range than their current artillery. It can accurately take out a target from 15 miles.

 

The howitzers fire smart shells which guarantees a strike within 2 metres of the intended target. Send your drones up to sniff out their artillery and it's scrap.

 

Russia's biggest advantage on the ground in this war has been artillery. Now we may see it being picked off. If they lose their artillery they will retreat.

[AlphonseCapone]

On 23/05/2022 at 18:39, thewiseone said:

People choosing to support Ukraine, driven by the media story, the same media who convinced the population at large about the scamdemic of covid, the need to wear masks, isolate etc.

Its time to start thinking for yourself.

 

No mask ever, no vaccine nor booster, never isolated, no social distancing, in fact have done everything in opposition to the rules as layed down by government etc.

 

Still waiting for my dose of Covid, never felt better, anyone know how that works?

 

Coupled with this back to watching the famous ,, but so disappointed in Saturdays lack of fitness after the 90 mins.

I wonder what part the vaccines had in negating our players energy levels, after all ours in charge at the club got fully behind the covid vaccination policy, i suspect most of the first team will have been done , I suppose we can be thank ful none of them toppled due to myocarditis enduced by the vaccination.

Glad to be back 

 

My favourite post and username combo on JKB ever. 

[Unknown user]

15 minutes ago, AlphonseCapone said:

 

My favourite post and username combo on JKB ever. 

It's like a big mental hug from that ginger frizzy haired bird you know eh?

[highlandjambo3]

20 hours ago, Maple Leaf said:

Apparently the Ukrainians are using so-called Kamikaze drones supplied by the Americans.  These little charmers cruise around looking for a military target.  When they see something interesting like a tank or another armoured vehicle, they simply dive straight into it.

 

I've no idea how large their warhead is, but they are quite lethal.  Humans are ingenious when it comes to devising new ways to kill other humans.

A 1Kg shaped charge would be more than enough to deal with any top attack target.

[Maple Leaf]

4 minutes ago, highlandjambo3 said:

A 1Kg shaped charge would be more than enough to deal with any top attack target.

 

Thanks.  It doesn't sound like much, but it's working.

[highlandjambo3]

1 hour ago, Maple Leaf said:

 

Thanks.  It doesn't sound like much, but it's working.

It’s the ”shape” thing that’s the clever bit…..an inverted copper cone with the nose part (pointy bit) at one end and the explosives at the other end……when the nose strikes the target the explosives behind the cone detonates and pushes the inverted cone forward literally turning it inside out and the copper becomes a molten slug which cuts through armour like a knife through butter…..all happens very quickly and, it’s actually very old technology……………………I can make improvised (home made) ones…..not that you’d be interested like 😏

[trotter]

1 hour ago, highlandjambo3 said:

It’s the ”shape” thing that’s the clever bit…..an inverted copper cone with the nose part (pointy bit) at one end and the explosives at the other end……when the nose strikes the target the explosives behind the cone detonates and pushes the inverted cone forward literally turning it inside out and the copper becomes a molten slug which cuts through armour like a knife through butter…..all happens very quickly and, it’s actually very old technology……………………I can make improvised (home made) ones…..not that you’d be interested like 😏

I've always quite liked HESH warheads. Rather than penetrating the target, they 'squash' on impact before detonating. This then causes chunks of shrapnel to be blown off from the other side of the armor plate, thus reducing the contents of said armour to a soup-like homogenate...

[highlandjambo3]

13 minutes ago, trotter said:

I've always quite liked HESH warheads. Rather than penetrating the target, they 'squash' on impact before detonating. This then causes chunks of shrapnel to be blown off from the other side of the armor plate, thus reducing the contents of said armour to a soup-like homogenate...

That’s old school stuff though……most modern armour will withstand High Explosive Squash Head (HESH)

[ScotsAndy]

The Russian Federation was absolutely in the wrong to undertake the attempted 'Regime Change' strike and annexation of the Donbass plus corridor across the Black Sea Coast. In addition Russian violations of the 'Rules of War' and associated Human Rights attrocities are also abhorrent and should be condemned and investigated and punished.

 

However it would be extremely naive to ignore the behaviour of a minority of so called Ukrainian Nationalists/Right wing fanatics several years ago who also committed attrocities.  Plus it could be reasonably argued that a legitimate Ukrainain Government was toppled illegitimately with the tacit support of the West.

 

There are as some people have pointed out faults on all sides and it worth understanding these to get some perspective and understanding of all sides views 

[Mikey1874]

14 minutes ago, ScotsAndy said:

However it would be extremely naive to ignore the behaviour of a minority of so called Ukrainian Nationalists/Right wing fanatics several years ago who also committed attrocities.  Plus it could be reasonably argued that a legitimate Ukrainain Government was toppled illegitimately with the tacit support of the West.

 

There are as some people have pointed out faults on all sides and it worth understanding these to get some perspective and understanding of all sides views 

 

Well that is the Russian view. 

 

The main parts of their justification for invading. 

Edited May 25, 2022 by Mikey1874

[Jeffros Furios]

****in BOT"s 

[Unknown user]

5 hours ago, ScotsAndy said:

The Russian Federation was absolutely in the wrong to undertake the attempted 'Regime Change' strike and annexation of the Donbass plus corridor across the Black Sea Coast. In addition Russian violations of the 'Rules of War' and associated Human Rights attrocities are also abhorrent and should be condemned and investigated and punished.

 

However it would be extremely naive to ignore the behaviour of a minority of so called Ukrainian Nationalists/Right wing fanatics several years ago who also committed attrocities.  Plus it could be reasonably argued that a legitimate Ukrainain Government was toppled illegitimately with the tacit support of the West.

 

There are as some people have pointed out faults on all sides and it worth understanding these to get some perspective and understanding of all sides views 

 

Who else's fault is it that Russia invaded Ukraine tovarich?

[JFK-1]

11 hours ago, ScotsAndy said:

The Russian Federation was absolutely in the wrong to undertake the attempted 'Regime Change' strike and annexation of the Donbass plus corridor across the Black Sea Coast. In addition Russian violations of the 'Rules of War' and associated Human Rights attrocities are also abhorrent and should be condemned and investigated and punished.

 

However it would be extremely naive to ignore the behaviour of a minority of so called Ukrainian Nationalists/Right wing fanatics several years ago who also committed attrocities.  Plus it could be reasonably argued that a legitimate Ukrainain Government was toppled illegitimately with the tacit support of the West.

 

There are as some people have pointed out faults on all sides and it worth understanding these to get some perspective and understanding of all sides views 

 

You're saying nothing of any direct relevance to this conflict. This is a geo political upheaval and all that matters is the outcome. As for all this stuff about nazis etc they may have a right wing element as many countries do. I don't know and I don't care.

And neither does Putin which is exactly what makes it irrelevant.  He invaded to take the country under his thumb. Absolutely sweet FA to do with anything else. That's all that matters here. Nothing else.

 

In the circumstances you look pretty much like a Putin bot btw. Of which I have seen many across more topics than this. What they do is try to distract from the actual issue by muddying it with irrelevant shite.

[Boab]

I am puzzled reading the replies to ScotsAndy. 
A pile on, in JKB parlance !

Can someone tell me what’s wrong with paragraph one ? 
Two and Three can be debated but is that not the point of the thread ?

 

Edited May 26, 2022 by Boab

[il Duce McTarkin]

8 minutes ago, Boab said:

I am puzzled reading the replies to ScotsAndy. 
A pile on, in JKB parlance !

Can someone tell me what’s wrong with paragraph one ? 
Two and Three can be debated but is that not the point of the thread ?

 

 

A basic unwillingness to accept that others may view an identical set of circumstances somewhat differently, and that those viewpoints may not be entirely without merit.

 

I mean, nobody's going to disagree that if you want to understand the political situation in Ireland you need a basic grasp of the actors and influences (both domestic and iternational), which have driven the historical process to date.

 

 

Edited May 26, 2022 by Dirk McClaymore

[Boab]

35 minutes ago, Dirk McClaymore said:

 

A basic unwillingness to accept that others may view an identical set of circumstances somewhat differently, and that those viewpoints may not be entirely without merit.

 

I mean, nobody's going to disagree that if you want to understand the political situation in Ireland you need a basic grasp of the actors and influences (both domestic and iternational), which have driven the historical process to date.

 

 

Agree.

 

[JFK-1]

I see nothing wrong with questioning a viewpoint Putin himself would fully endorse. And a Putin bot would raise. 

[il Duce McTarkin]

3 minutes ago, JFK-1 said:

I see nothing wrong with questioning a viewpoint Putin himself would fully endorse. And a Putin bot would raise. 

 

Of course you don't.

[Boab]

4 minutes ago, JFK-1 said:

I see nothing wrong with questioning a viewpoint Putin himself would fully endorse. And a Putin bot would raise. 

I see nothing wrong with questioning any viewpoint. 
I disagree that Putin would endorse Andy’s post as it would mean he would be investigated and punished…as Andy said.

🤷‍♂️

[il Duce McTarkin]

7 minutes ago, Boab said:

I see nothing wrong with questioning any viewpoint. 
I disagree that Putin would endorse Andy’s post as it would mean he would be investigated and punished…as Andy said.

🤷‍♂️

 

There's questioning Andy's viewpoint, and there's disparagingly dismissing it out of hand.

[John Findlay]

37 minutes ago, JFK-1 said:

I see nothing wrong with questioning a viewpoint Putin himself would fully endorse. And a Putin bot would raise. 

If only the world was as Black and White, as you would like it to be.

[Mikey1874]

We don't have the true situation on the ground. 

 

But Russia does seem to be making progress in the East /Dombas. 

 

Ukraine is suffering losses. But the indications are they are still hoping to make counter attacks. Its unclear how much of the Western equipment is still to be deployed. I saw it being said the US howitzers for example, mentioned above are yet to be deployed. 

 

Lots uncertain just now. 

[il Duce McTarkin]

11 minutes ago, Mikey1874 said:

We don't have the true situation on the ground. 

 

But Russia does seem to be making progress in the East /Dombas. 

 

Ukraine is suffering losses. But the indications are they are still hoping to make counter attacks. Its unclear how much of the Western equipment is still to be deployed. I saw it being said the US howitzers for example, mentioned above are yet to be deployed. 

 

Lots uncertain just now. 

 

I'll make 4 predictions based on absolutely **** all more than anyone else on here knows.

 

The Russians absolutely will not give up without making some sort of gain in terms of territory and political influence.

The west will continue to support Ukraine via the back door, but this support will drop off at a similar rate as Russia's short-term capabilities and ambitions.

The Chinese will continue to support Russia, but will make their own moves to recover outer Manchuria and the vast hydrocarbon reserves off the coast of Sakhalin.

Putin will be removed internally.

 

 

 

Edited May 26, 2022 by Dirk McClaymore

[Boab]

15 minutes ago, Dirk McClaymore said:

 

I'll make 4 predictions based on absolutely **** all more than anyone else on here knows.

 

The Russians absolutely will not give up without making some sort of gain in terms of territory and political influence.

The west will continue to support Ukraine via the back door, but this support will drop off at a similar rate as Russia's short-term capabilities and ambitions.

The Chinese will continue to support Russia, but will make their own moves to recover outer Manchuria and the vast hydrocarbon reserves off the coast of Sakhalin.

Putin will be removed internally.

 

 

 

I agree with all of that with a caveat attached onto the last prediction. He will announce that he will go on his own volition, regardless of any internal chicanery.

[il Duce McTarkin]

16 minutes ago, Boab said:

I agree with all of that with a caveat attached onto the last prediction. He will announce that he will go on his own volition, regardless of any internal chicanery.

 

In terms of a (relatively) peaceful transition you would like to think so, but I'm not so sure. He has a lot of enemies, and knows that without the protection afforded by his office he'd already be a dead man. Now that he's increasingly becoming an internal liability, I 100% would not be surprised if he was offed.

Edited May 26, 2022 by Dirk McClaymore

[Mikey1874]

Russia is strengthening defences in occupied areas. I presume because it fears Ukraine counter attacks and western weapons. 

 

So what could happen is Russia effectively wins in Dombas. But then faces counter attacks in its occupied areas. 

 

Russia having gained its stretch of land East and South (though not Odesa) does then have the option to negotiate a settlement. Negotiations stopped after the atrocities came to light about 6 weeks ago. 

 

But Ukraine might still prefer to fight on. And then its equipment from West is crucial. The West also has a choice whether to force negotiations or maintain the US led position that Putin must lose. 

[il Duce McTarkin]

6 minutes ago, Mikey1874 said:

But Ukraine might still prefer to fight on. And then its equipment from West is crucial. The West also has a choice whether to force negotiations or maintain the US led position that Putin must lose. 

 

The West (U.S.) will ultimately decide when, not if, Ukraine negotiate a settlement. I'd imagine that this will be when Putin is either gone, or intelligence confirms that his position has become untenable. The U.S. will not seek to weaken Russia to the point where it is no longer a bulwark to further Chinese ambitions in the far east.

[ri Alban]

Personally, I do think Russia will stop now, until they take the whole Ukraine.

[il Duce McTarkin]

23 minutes ago, ri Alban said:

Personally, I do think Russia will stop now, until they take the whole Ukraine.

 

Even if they managed to take the whole of Ukraine, Russian military capacity will be greatly reduced in the short-medium term, and the manpower and resources required to hold it would be enormous.

A population upon which such recent and ongoing atrocities have been commited is unlikely to become, or remain, subservient.

 

 

[ScotsAndy]

9 hours ago, JFK-1 said:

 

You're saying nothing of any direct relevance to this conflict. This is a geo political upheaval and all that matters is the outcome. As for all this stuff about nazis etc they may have a right wing element as many countries do. I don't know and I don't care.

And neither does Putin which is exactly what makes it irrelevant.  He invaded to take the country under his thumb. Absolutely sweet FA to do with anything else. That's all that matters here. Nothing else.

 

In the circumstances you look pretty much like a Putin bot btw. Of which I have seen many across more topics than this. What they do is try to distract from the actual issue by muddying it with irrelevant shite.

Thanks to the guys that actually read what I wrote down - which was pretty categorical in my expression of disgust with the Russian Federation actions  - as they all spotted I was offering up a considered view from both sides.  I believe very relevant as were the points made by others including yourself (JFK) - i am not so arrogant as to believe I am the only person with a true perspective.  If you research Putin a  little more you would also know that he considers Ukraine to be a manufactured identity (something I totally reject) and that possibly also provides some insight to his mind set.  As I am both Scottish and a Jambo I find your insinuation that I am some kind of Russian 'BOT' mildly offensive and in the context of what I stated basically a bit stupid - but you are entitled to your opinion.  As for the other Poster who found it intellectually stimulating to lable me in Pigeon English as 'Comrade' - I speak very basic Russian so feel free to send me any further insults in the Cyrillic style rather than your school boy attempts picked up from the Daily Mail.  PS  - if you are actually really interested in ordinary Russians views and reactions visit YouTube channel 1420  - a young lad there doing some really insightful interviews with ordinary Russians and for you 'Smithee' there are even subtitles in English !

[Boab]

16 minutes ago, ScotsAndy said:

Thanks to the guys that actually read what I wrote down - which was pretty categorical in my expression of disgust with the Russian Federation actions  - as they all spotted I was offering up a considered view from both sides.  I believe very relevant as were the points made by others including yourself (JFK) - i am not so arrogant as to believe I am the only person with a true perspective.  If you research Putin a  little more you would also know that he considers Ukraine to be a manufactured identity (something I totally reject) and that possibly also provides some insight to his mind set.  As I am both Scottish and a Jambo I find your insinuation that I am some kind of Russian 'BOT' mildly offensive and in the context of what I stated basically a bit stupid - but you are entitled to your opinion.  As for the other Poster who found it intellectually stimulating to lable me in Pigeon English as 'Comrade' - I speak very basic Russian so feel free to send me any further insults in the Cyrillic style rather than your school boy attempts picked up from the Daily Mail.  PS  - if you are actually really interested in ordinary Russians views and reactions visit YouTube channel 1420  - a young lad there doing some really insightful interviews with ordinary Russians and for you 'Smithee' there are even subtitles in English !

Yea, I think ordinary Russians’ views would differ quite markedly, in many ways, with Putin’s view of things. A bit like many people here who found Blair’s rush to side with Bush abhorrent. 
A great many ordinary people don’t want invasions, regardless of who carries them out, as ordinary people die, in huge numbers.

 

[JFK-1]

On 26/05/2022 at 10:08, ScotsAndy said:

Thanks to the guys that actually read what I wrote down - which was pretty categorical in my expression of disgust with the Russian Federation actions  - as they all spotted I was offering up a considered view from both sides.  I believe very relevant as were the points made by others including yourself (JFK) - i am not so arrogant as to believe I am the only person with a true perspective.  If you research Putin a  little more you would also know that he considers Ukraine to be a manufactured identity (something I totally reject) and that possibly also provides some insight to his mind set.  As I am both Scottish and a Jambo I find your insinuation that I am some kind of Russian 'BOT' mildly offensive and in the context of what I stated basically a bit stupid - but you are entitled to your opinion.  As for the other Poster who found it intellectually stimulating to lable me in Pigeon English as 'Comrade' - I speak very basic Russian so feel free to send me any further insults in the Cyrillic style rather than your school boy attempts picked up from the Daily Mail.  PS  - if you are actually really interested in ordinary Russians views and reactions visit YouTube channel 1420  - a young lad there doing some really insightful interviews with ordinary Russians and for you 'Smithee' there are even subtitles in English !

 

If you interpreted what I said as saying you are a Putin bot that wasn't the intention. I specifically said like a Putin bot. And that's a fact, there are Putin bots out there doing pretty much the same thing.

I know all about Putin's views of Ukraine and I have been watching the 1420 site since this began. And in my opinion this is a critical situation in which the end result is all that matters. I couldn't care less about Putin's views and again I do know them.

It muddies the waters at this stage in his favour to even acknowledge any grievances he may be presenting. There is zero excuse for this atrocity. The West is looking to take him down now. Not be concerned about his grievances.

[ri Alban]

1 hour ago, JFK-1 said:

 

If you interpreted what I said as saying you are a Putin bot that wasn't the intention. I specifically said like a Putin bot. And that's a fact, there are Putin bots out there doing pretty much the same thing.

I know all about Putin's views of Ukraine and I have been watching the 1420 site since this began. And in my opinion this is a critical situation in which the end result is all that matters. I couldn't care less about Putin's views and again I do know them.

It muddies the waters at this stage in his favour to even acknowledge any grievances he may be presenting. There is zero excuse for this atrocity. The West is looking to take him down now. Not be concerned about his grievances.

Can I ask, were there any excuses for the atrocities if Iraq and Afghanistan? WMD remember that, or the Taliban being blamed for 9/11. The West really need to stop throwing stones.

 

Personally, I hope Ukraine come through this, but Russian grievances must be addressed, like NATO pitching up camp on Russia's border, or we can't moan when Russia or China do the same. Mind Cuba?