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Robbie Neilson


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3 minutes ago, ToqueJambo said:

 

How about a manager who won a league with Hibs and Rangers in it before April (condemning Hibs to 2 more seasons down there), beat Hibs in a cup semi final and took Celtic to pens in the final, beat Celtic on the first day after promotion when we were being tipped to be relegation candidates by some of our own fans, and has never had us out of the top 3 in I think 4 seasons total now (3 full and two halfs)? How about that manager?


 

Yea I agree he’s won a couple championship titles and I think thats a decent achievement.  
 

I’m not going to get excited and celebrate a manager getting beat by celtic in a penalty shootout.

 

If we can actually win a cup under him and he doesnt leave us for a loser club like McDons then I might change my opinion about him.

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davemclaren
5 minutes ago, Hmfc1965 said:

It was an example. 

Losing to Brora is a different scale.

It would be on a different scale, if we had indeed lost 2-0 at home to Dundee, which I don’t think we’ve done this century. 😵💫
 

it was the subsequent defeat at home to QoS that led me to think he should go as it looked as though he had lost the team. However, given results so far this season I have changed my mind and I’m happy for him to be here, for the present anyway.  

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Led Tasso
9 minutes ago, Shanks said:


 

He’s a manager thats overseen some of the worst results in our history and left us at the first opportunity for a fake club in milton keynes. 

 

As has been mentioned, so did McDonald.

 

As for leaving, again as has been discussed, he explicitly wanted full managerial reign, which he did not have here.

 

6 minutes ago, Hmfc1965 said:

And on your logic it won't do any harm as we never win a cup but plod along in the top half of the table?

 

Are you 12?

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Hmfc1965
Just now, davemclaren said:

It would be on a different scale, if we had indeed lost 2-0 at home to Dundee, which I don’t think we’ve done this century. 😵💫
 

it was the subsequent defeat at home to QoS that led me to think he should go as it looked as though he had lost the team. However, given results so far this season I have changed my mind and I’m happy for him to be here, for the present anyway.  

To be fair so am I for the time being  

But he's got a lot of history that won't serve him well if things go wrong  

I actually almost typed Dundee United but the principle holds.

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Hmfc1965
2 minutes ago, Led Tasso said:

 

As has been mentioned, so did McDonald.

 

As for leaving, again as has been discussed, he explicitly wanted full managerial reign, which he did not have here.

 

 

Are you 12?

It was one of MacDonald's first games as manager  

It's also still not on the same scale as Brora.

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4 minutes ago, Led Tasso said:

 

As has been mentioned, so did McDonald.

 

As for leaving, again as has been discussed, he explicitly wanted full managerial reign, which he did not have here.

 

 

Are you 12?


 

He left Hearts because he didnt have ‘full managerial reign’? :lol:

 

Did he have that when he joined us as manager originally? When did he suddenly stop getting full managerial reign? Does he have that now?  
 

I was told (on here) he left us because some Hearts fans paid for a plane to say he was shite.  When did the excuse change to not getting full managerial reign?

 

I don’t think he left us for MKDons because they gave him more managerial reign 

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Hmfc1965
4 minutes ago, Shanks said:


 

He left Hearts because he didnt have ‘full managerial reign’? :lol:

 

Did he have that when he joined us as manager originally? When did he suddenly stop getting full managerial reign? Does he have that now?  
 

I was told (on here) he left us because some Hearts fans paid for a plane to say he was shite.  When did the excuse change to not getting full managerial reign?

 

I don’t think he left us for MKDons because they gave him more managerial reign 

I think the suggestion is that Levein had too much authority. 

Which may well be true but wasn't acknowledged at the time,  or indeed by the club afterwards who proceeded to give him more.

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HeartsandonlyHearts
27 minutes ago, Hmfc1965 said:

It was national news. It was humiliating.

And yes 1965 was the year I was born.

I see what you're getting at but you're absolutely wrong. 

I agree and said it was embarrassing (humiliating) but I disagree that “serious harm” was done to our club. We never went on a bad run after, we won the league as was the goal all along, we then strengthened the team for this season and have done pretty good so far. So I see no serious harm to our club from that result.

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Hmfc1965
1 minute ago, HeartsandonlyHearts said:

I agree and said it was embarrassing (humiliating) but I disagree that “serious harm” was done to our club. We never went on a bad run after, we won the league as was the goal all along, we then strengthened the team for this season and have done pretty good so far. So I see no serious harm to our club from that result.

Okay then  we differ.

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HeartsandonlyHearts
4 minutes ago, Hmfc1965 said:

Okay then  we differ.

Yes we do.

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davemclaren
6 minutes ago, Hmfc1965 said:

Okay then  we differ.

So what long term harm was caused?

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Hmfc1965
4 minutes ago, davemclaren said:

So what long term harm was caused?

We were humiliated in a national cup competition .

 

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davemclaren
6 minutes ago, Hmfc1965 said:

We were humiliated in a national cup competition .

 

And the long term damage of that is?

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7 minutes ago, Hmfc1965 said:

We were humiliated in a national cup competition .

 

Mind when we were humiliated in the final of a national cup competition under JJ?

 

In short, Robbie's doing a great job, give him a break 

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Hmfc1965
Just now, davemclaren said:

And the long term damage of that is?

Aye okay. It's not a problem. 

 

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HeartsandonlyHearts
1 minute ago, davemclaren said:

And the long term damage of that is?

Long term humiliation?

Im just grasping.

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Hmfc1965
Just now, Smithee said:

Mind when we were humiliated in the final of a national cup competition under JJ?

 

In short, Robbie's doing a great job, give him a break 

Losing heavily to a good Rangers team is nothing like the same as Losing to Brora.

This feels like a parallel universe sometimes. 

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davemclaren
3 minutes ago, HeartsandonlyHearts said:

Long term humiliation?

Im just grasping.

It was a humiliating result but we just have to pick ourselves up and get on with it - and it looks like we have. 

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HeartsandonlyHearts
1 minute ago, Hmfc1965 said:

Aye okay. It's not a problem. 

 

It’s not a long term problem.

It sucked that night. It sucked the next week. It may have even sucked for the next month. But it doesn’t suck today and is not a long term problem. You need to just chill and get over it. Unless you bet your house on a win that night. Then it’s a long term problem.

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HeartsandonlyHearts
Just now, davemclaren said:

It was a humiliating result but we just have to pick ourselves up and get on with it - and it looks like we have. 

Well most of us have. 

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4 minutes ago, Hmfc1965 said:

Losing heavily to a good Rangers team is nothing like the same as Losing to Brora.

This feels like a parallel universe sometimes. 

I didn't say they were exactly the same, but they were both humiliations in national cup competitions from former captains who spent the majority of their career earning the right to a bit of respect around here. 

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HeartsandonlyHearts
5 minutes ago, Hmfc1965 said:

Losing heavily to a good Rangers team is nothing like the same as Losing to Brora.

This feels like a parallel universe sometimes. 

Did we beat Brora in the other universe?

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Bazzas right boot
43 minutes ago, Hmfc1965 said:

It was one of MacDonald's first games as manager  

It's also still not on the same scale as Brora.

 

Doddie never even got us promoted first time of asking, some of the rabid gang Would have wanted him sacked after that, he'd never had a chance to turn us around. 

 

That was when 2 were automatically promoted as well. 

 

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Bazzas right boot
16 minutes ago, davemclaren said:

And the long term damage of that is?

 

Grown men throwing their toys out the pram and greetin like spoilt children who can't enjoy Hearts anymore as Bob is not only our manager but doing well so all their tantrums, daft nicknames and shouting for him to be sacked was  proven to be wrong. 

They don't like that. They want to be right. 

 

 

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Guest ToqueJambo
1 hour ago, Hmfc1965 said:

It was one of MacDonald's first games as manager  

It's also still not on the same scale as Brora.


It was in the first division. Also in that division, Neilson beat Hibs and Ranger in his first two games as a manager. 

If inexperience is an excuse shouldn’t that apply to neilson in the birkirkiri result? 
 

Neilson also only had two years experience going into that season (16/17). In his second season as a manager he finished 3rd.

 

In Doddies 1st 3 seasons or so we needed pens to beat cowdenbeath in the cup after a replay and needed a replay to beat brechin in the cup.

 

And that’s before we mention the disastrous start to the 85/86 season. 
 

Point is it’s possible for teams and managers to improve and recover from bad results without chopping and changing manager every time it happens (which would mean a new manager every season). 

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Guest ToqueJambo
33 minutes ago, Hmfc1965 said:

Losing heavily to a good Rangers team is nothing like the same as Losing to Brora.

This feels like a parallel universe sometimes. 


On any other day we would have beaten brora. Most people know it was a freakish result during a freakish season.

 

Its always fine lines and luck in cup competitions. We needed pens to beat gretna in 05/06 and only just squeaked past Talbot and needed replays to beat st j and st mirren on the way to the cup in 11/12. In 97/98 we didn’t play anyone decent until the final.

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Hmfc1965
4 minutes ago, ToqueJambo said:


On any other day we would have beaten brora. Most people know it was a freakish result during a freakish season.

 

Its always fine lines and luck in cup competitions. We needed pens to beat gretna in 05/06 and only just squeaked past Talbot and needed replays to beat st j and st mirren on the way to the cup in 11/12. In 97/98 we didn’t play anyone decent until the final.

I get that. The thing is though the better team usually gets through. 

That hasn't always been the case with us recently. 

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Bazzas right boot
10 minutes ago, Hmfc1965 said:

I get that. The thing is though the better team usually gets through. 

That hasn't always been the case with us recently. 

 

 

Not been the case in the cups last season at all. 

 

St Johnstone won them. 

 

If the best team usually gets through no one outside the Of would ever win a trophy. 

With the cups it's not usually the case, that is why cups are so interesting. 

Even this season Celtic win  the 1st cup, rangers are the best team. 

 

 

 

 

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Hmfc1965
4 minutes ago, Smith's right boot said:

 

 

Not been the case in the cups last season at all. 

 

St Johnstone won them. 

 

If the best team usually gets through no one outside the Of would ever win a trophy. 

With the cups it's not usually the case, that is why cups are so interesting. 

Even this season Celtic win  the 1st cup, rangers are the best team. 

 

 

 

 

Okay but you know what I mean 

Our cup record isn't great over the last year or so.

And I know you're going to quote successive finals.

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54 minutes ago, Smith's right boot said:

 

Doddie never even got us promoted first time of asking, some of the rabid gang Would have wanted him sacked after that, he'd never had a chance to turn us around. 

 

That was when 2 were automatically promoted as well. 

 

Eh the state of hearts at that time was night and day .

If you dinnae know ye dinnae ken.

Alex Macdonald and the players brought us back from a different angle 

I'm struggling not to be abusive but will give you the benefit of the not having a fekin clue doubt.

We were on our fekin ankles ya hibs loving twit

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Guest ToqueJambo
6 minutes ago, Hmfc1965 said:

I get that. The thing is though the better team usually gets through. 

That hasn't always been the case with us recently. 

 

For perspective, we were especially good in cups under JJ and Doddie but both still got knocked out by Dundee, Dunfermline, St J, Motherwell, Killie, St Mirren, Falkirk, Montrose and Forfar. Burley's multi-milion pound team got knocked out by Livvy and Sergio got beat by Ayr Utd.

 

Neilson has not been a good cup manager, losing to Livi, Brora and Alloa and we are rarely knocked out by Hibs, made worse by them winning it. However, he's also had to play Celtic in early rounds of the cup way more than the above managers (3 times in the first round?) in a shorter timeframe and with less experience, so in that respect he's either been denied longer cup runs or other embarrassing defeats. On the credit side he's beaten Aberdeen and Hibs in cup ties and the cup final against Celtic was very creditable, certainly getting much closer to winning the thing than other losing finals against the OF, Aberdeen and St Mirren in my lifetime.

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luckydug
1 hour ago, Hmfc1965 said:

Losing heavily to a good Rangers team is nothing like the same as Losing to Brora.

This feels like a parallel universe sometimes. 

JJ had a hand in two far more damaging results in Edinburgh derbies. 

Once as a player and once as a manager. 

He guided us to a cup win though. 

Perhaps Robbie needs to do the same to get folk off his back. 

Folk need to stop being such drama queens and stop describing every surprise defeat as a disaster,humiliation etc

It's football upsets happen. 

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Hmfc1965
2 minutes ago, luckydug said:

JJ had a hand in two far more damaging results in Edinburgh derbies. 

Once as a player and once as a manager. 

He guided us to a cup win though. 

Perhaps Robbie needs to do the same to get folk off his back. 

Folk need to stop being such drama queens and stop describing every surprise defeat as a disaster,humiliation etc

It's football upsets happen. 

Yes they do.

From that perspective I saw Alloa as one of those things. 

Brora was not.

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Led Tasso
1 hour ago, Shanks said:


 

He left Hearts because he didnt have ‘full managerial reign’? :lol:

 

Did he have that when he joined us as manager originally? When did he suddenly stop getting full managerial reign? Does he have that now?  
 

I was told (on here) he left us because some Hearts fans paid for a plane to say he was shite.  When did the excuse change to not getting full managerial reign?

 

I don’t think he left us for MKDons because they gave him more managerial reign 

Seriously? When Levein was here he instituted a Director of Football/Head Coach model. This was much ballyhooed by the club and much debated on here and in the media. The grand plan was that with fewer responsibilities, head coaches could be brought along in a “boot room” model, as coaches were brought through the “Hearts way” and then move on to bigger jobs with well trained replacements behind them. Levein made a big deal about how this would solve continuity issues and attract promising young coaches.

 

It obviously didn’t go according to plan but Neilson effectively said in press conferences, politely, that he appreciated Levein but was ready to cut the apron strings.

 

None of this was remotely private or mysterious at the time.

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Guest ToqueJambo
9 minutes ago, Ked said:

Eh the state of hearts at that time was night and day .

If you dinnae know ye dinnae ken.

Alex Macdonald and the players brought us back from a different angle 

I'm struggling not to be abusive but will give you the benefit of the not having a fekin clue doubt.

We were on our fekin ankles ya hibs loving twit

 

Doddie's my favourite Hearts manager and you're right about that period in our history. On the other hand he had the best striker in our history emerging when he took over, plus two other of our best ever youngsters in Mackay and Bowman, and a pretty solid experienced squad overall the season we finished second, including one of Scotland's finest ever defenders in Jardine, a striker bought for a lot of money by those days standards in Willie Pettigrew, and himself. Although things had been tough, Mercer had invested in the squad but we still finished behind a part-time team in St J.

 

Neilson faced a different challenge in having Hibs and Rangers in the same division and a much more inexperienced squad. Always amazes me how little credit Neilson gets from some for the good things he's done yet every mistake is pounced on, while other managers get so much more leeway - even a complete disaster like Stendel.

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Guest ToqueJambo
9 minutes ago, Hmfc1965 said:

Yes they do.

From that perspective I saw Alloa as one of those things. 

Brora was not.

 

Quite why folk keep bringing Brora up is beyond me. Neilson has had some cracking results before and since then - why not reminisce about them instead of bringing up painful memories? I know when I think about JJ I think of the cup final and not getting gubbed 6-2 in the derby, a result Hibs fans still bring up.

 

Last season was a one-off bizarro season - there were weird football results all over the shop. Liverpool getting beat 7-2 by Aston Villa and Chelsea beat 5-2 at home by West Brom. Lots more. No crowds added an extra element of uncertainty to many games. I had a feeling we'd lose to Brora - our form, no travelling support, the weather and pitch, our inability to break down teams parking the bus, some of the players we had a that time like Kasteneer. It's a hard to result to come back from and Neilson should get credit for managing to do that convincingly. 

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CloustonHMFC
9 hours ago, Hmfc1965 said:

You really don't think the Brora result caused serious harm?

It seems others have already covered it but no, I don't think it caused serious harm. It was a terrible results and was humiliating at the time but in the grand scheme of things it's now pretty much irrelevant. If we go out and get beat by Auchinleck then we can revisit the conversation about Robbies ability to get past the minnows but it was an outlier of a result. It happens.

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Bazzas right boot
9 hours ago, Ked said:

Eh the state of hearts at that time was night and day .

If you dinnae know ye dinnae ken.

Alex Macdonald and the players brought us back from a different angle 

I'm struggling not to be abusive but will give you the benefit of the not having a fekin clue doubt.

We were on our fekin ankles ya hibs loving twit

 

 

You could say Doddie  brought us back from the brink. 

 

Aye, because after admin we weren't on our knees. 

After, demotion and covid and 4 seasons of decline  everything was dandy. 

 

The comparisons, although not identical are true, Robbie has outperformed Doddie, Doddie never won a cup  as manager either despite having a very  good team and a OF that was no where near as dominant. 

 

Doddie is my favourite Hearts manager as well, or tied with JJ so don't get all sanctimonious with me. 

 

The Doddie comparison does get the Bob haters back up as it blows every argument they have about Robbie put the water so I understand your frustration, it puts you between a rock and a hard place so to speak. 

 

I'll deal with facts, you get yourself into an emotional slavering mess who resorts to personal abuse. 

 

It's funny. 

 

 

 

 

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Bazzas right boot
9 hours ago, Hmfc1965 said:

Okay but you know what I mean 

Our cup record isn't great over the last year or so.

And I know you're going to quote successive finals.

 

No I agree, it needs improved. 👍

 

Sacking a manager of a  team that is coming together nicely and progressing because of a poor result won't help us win cups imo or be competitive over the long term. 

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luckydug
2 minutes ago, Smith's right boot said:

 

 

You could say Doddie  brought us back from the brink. 

 

Aye, because after admin we weren't on our knees. 

After, demotion and covid and 4 seasons of decline  everything was dandy. 

 

The comparisons, although not identical are true, Robbie has outperformed Doddie, Doddie never won a cup  as manager either despite having a very  good team and a OF that was no where near as dominant. 

 

Doddie is my favourite Hearts manager as well, or tied with JJ so don't get all sanctimonious with me. 

 

The Doddie comparison does get the Bob haters back up as it blows every argument they have about Robbie put the water so I understand your frustration, it puts you between a rock and a hard place so to speak. 

 

I'll deal with facts, you get yourself into an emotional slavering mess who resorts to personal abuse. 

 

It's funny. 

 

 

 

 

Got to disagree with you. 

I like Robbie and I think he's been mostly good for us. 

You can't compare the Hearts that Doddie came in to with Robbies Hearts. 

If Robbie ever gets us to within 7 minutes of title and a cup final in the same season then perhaps we can compare. 

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A_A wehatethehibs
12 hours ago, Shanks said:


 

Yea I agree he’s won a couple championship titles and I think thats a decent achievement.  
 

I’m not going to get excited and celebrate a manager getting beat by celtic in a penalty shootout.

 

If we can actually win a cup under him and he doesnt leave us for a loser club like McDons then I might change my opinion about him.

 

I still think Levein nudged Neilson to leave to MK because he wanted his myth Cathro installed.

 

I tend not to hold it against managers making their move when they get a chance. Because it’s cut throat for managers when the shoe is on the other foot, a few bad results and you’re sacked. So when a club wants you, go for it because you’re only a few games from the sack if you stay.

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davemclaren
1 hour ago, luckydug said:

Got to disagree with you. 

I like Robbie and I think he's been mostly good for us. 

You can't compare the Hearts that Doddie came in to with Robbies Hearts. 

If Robbie ever gets us to within 7 minutes of title and a cup final in the same season then perhaps we can compare. 

Immediately after the 1985/86 season the league changed with Rangers bringing in Sounness and the OF starting to really lmaximise their huge advantages. Hard to see anyone outside of the OF getting that close to the title again, but never say never. 

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Bazzas right boot
2 hours ago, luckydug said:

Got to disagree with you. 

I like Robbie and I think he's been mostly good for us. 

You can't compare the Hearts that Doddie came in to with Robbies Hearts. 

If Robbie ever gets us to within 7 minutes of title and a cup final in the same season then perhaps we can compare. 

 

Nah, we can Compare their first few seasons now. You can always compare but be aware of the circumstances. 

 

For example we were in financial difficulty under Doddie but had the likes of St Johnstone, Killie and Motherwell to compete with for promotion. Hardly financial giants themselves. 

Bob got to rebuild a team but had a financially doped rangers in the division and came out top. 

Doddie managed 3rd. Not good. 

 

Doddie iirc 

3rd 1st

2nd 1st

5th

7th

2nd.

 

Robbie 

1st champ

3rd 

Left us around 2nd/ 3rd

 

1st champ

Currently 3rd.

 

Both have won no cups, Bob came the closest. 

 

He's well ahead of him and we have a better financial structure in place to go forward now, so no idea why some continue to down play Bobs achievements so far and can't get behind him. 

 

No Hearts manager will Likley come as close to the title again, however you can still compare different eras as long as you provide context. 

 

 

 

 

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Bull's-eye
32 minutes ago, Smith's right boot said:

 

Nah, we can Compare their first few seasons now. You can always compare but be aware of the circumstances. 

 

For example we were in financial difficulty under Doddie but had the likes of St Johnstone, Killie and Motherwell to compete with for promotion. Hardly financial giants themselves. 

Bob got to rebuild a team but had a financially doped rangers in the division and came out top. 

Doddie managed 3rd. Not good. 

 

Doddie iirc 

3rd 1st

2nd 1st

5th

7th

2nd.

 

Robbie 

1st champ

3rd 

Left us around 2nd/ 3rd

 

1st champ

Currently 3rd.

 

Both have won no cups, Bob came the closest. 

 

He's well ahead of him and we have a better financial structure in place to go forward now, so no idea why some continue to down play Bobs achievements so far and can't get behind him. 

 

No Hearts manager will Likley come as close to the title again, however you can still compare different eras as long as you provide context. 

 

 

 

 

 

Aye but what about Brora  ? 

 

Ya . . . . . . . . . . . . . Twit ye. 

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Guest ToqueJambo
5 hours ago, luckydug said:

Got to disagree with you. 

I like Robbie and I think he's been mostly good for us. 

You can't compare the Hearts that Doddie came in to with Robbies Hearts. 

If Robbie ever gets us to within 7 minutes of title and a cup final in the same season then perhaps we can compare. 

 

I don't think this discussion is about comparing Doddie and Robbie as managers (Doddie and JJ would no doubt be every Hearts fan's choice of the best managers in the last 50 years or so and I'd have Doddie for the best as he did lay the foundations for JJ's success) or how bad a state Hearts were in, it's more about how managers got more time back in Doddie's day.

 

It took him a while to get into his stride results-wise and there's a good argument that he wouldn't have been around to make 85/86 happen if fans acted like they do today (or some of them) in terms of their impatience and expectations. With the way some act today and the way the internet or provides a platform, Doddie may not even have survived the horrendous start to 85/86, never mind finishing 7th the year before. Both Doddie and Robbie were new managers when they took over and both faced certain challenges and had certain advantages - Doddie had money from Mercer, his mates like Jardine to call on and a very good batch of youngsters. Robbie had a decent budget from Budge and a half-decent group of kids, but otherwise had to build a new team.

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Bazzas right boot
9 minutes ago, ToqueJambo said:

 

I don't think this discussion is about comparing Doddie and Robbie as managers (Doddie and JJ would no doubt be every Hearts fan's choice of the best managers in the last 50 years or so and I'd have Doddie for the best as he did lay the foundations for JJ's success) or how bad a state Hearts were in, it's more about how managers got more time back in Doddie's day.

 

It took him a while to get into his stride results-wise and there's a good argument that he wouldn't have been around to make 85/86 happen if fans acted like they do today (or some of them) in terms of their impatience and expectations. With the way some act today and the way the internet or provides a platform, Doddie may not even have survived the horrendous start to 85/86, never mind finishing 7th the year before. Both Doddie and Robbie were new managers when they took over and both faced certain challenges and had certain advantages - Doddie had money from Mercer, his mates like Jardine to call on and a very good batch of youngsters. Robbie had a decent budget from Budge and a half-decent group of kids, but otherwise had to build a new team.

 

Yip, very fair. 

 

 

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Bazzas right boot
2 hours ago, Bull's-eye said:

 

Aye but what about Brora  ? 

 

Ya . . . . . . . . . . . . . Twit ye. 

 

Did that result not end Heart of Midlothian! 

I'm suprised the club survived that horror. The bulldozers were ready to go. 

 

 

The worse thing is, I am a twit. 😢

I can't really  argue against it. 

 

 

Edited by Smith's right boot
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davemclaren
13 minutes ago, ToqueJambo said:

 

I don't think this discussion is about comparing Doddie and Robbie as managers (Doddie and JJ would no doubt be every Hearts fan's choice of the best managers in the last 50 years or so and I'd have Doddie for the best as he did lay the foundations for JJ's success) or how bad a state Hearts were in, it's more about how managers got more time back in Doddie's day.

 

It took him a while to get into his stride results-wise and there's a good argument that he wouldn't have been around to make 85/86 happen if fans acted like they do today (or some of them) in terms of their impatience and expectations. With the way some act today and the way the internet or provides a platform, Doddie may not even have survived the horrendous start to 85/86, never mind finishing 7th the year before. Both Doddie and Robbie were new managers when they took over and both faced certain challenges and had certain advantages - Doddie had money from Mercer, his mates like Jardine to call on and a very good batch of youngsters. Robbie had a decent budget from Budge and a half-decent group of kids, but otherwise had to build a new team.

Doddie had a lot to thank Bobby Moncur for as he signed Robbo, Mackay and Bowman. 

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Guest ToqueJambo
4 hours ago, A_A wehatethehibs said:

 

I still think Levein nudged Neilson to leave to MK because he wanted his myth Cathro installed.

 

I tend not to hold it against managers making their move when they get a chance. Because it’s cut throat for managers when the shoe is on the other foot, a few bad results and you’re sacked. So when a club wants you, go for it because you’re only a few games from the sack if you stay.

 

I saw a pic of Levein in the stand before Cathro was appointed but after Neilson had gone and he looked smug as ****. That convinced me he was actually quite happy with the way things were panning out as he knew Cathro was coming in, which was his original master plan, and I wondered how hard he tried to keep Neilson. Major error from Levein if he didn't and an even bigger one giving Cathro the job in January when even he admitted Cathro wasn't ready. There was a lot of budget to spend in January and there's no doubt Neilson would have used it better than Cathro did. It's likely we would have finished at least 3rd again. Mind you a mindless group of Hearts fans were also targeting Neilson in a very public way so maybe Levein thought fans were fine with it all.

 

 

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Guest ToqueJambo
5 minutes ago, davemclaren said:

Doddie had a lot to thank Bobby Moncur for as he signed Robbo, Mackay and Bowman. 

 

Definitely. Doddie did a fantastic job bringing in the right pros to guide those players and built a proper football team around them. It was a different football world then mind you. It's unlikely the likes of Robbo, Mackay, JC and Levein would have been at Hearts so long today. That was one major advantage managers then had over Hearts managers today. Also applies to Jim McLean and Fergie at Aberdeen. Most of their best players would have been picked off before a team could be built around them.

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