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TYNECASTLE STADIUM UPGRADE POTENTIAL - UEFA category 4 granted ( updated/merged )


rickyjambo

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9 hours ago, Thomaso said:


Exactly Dave - some letting their imaginations run away with them.

 

Most depressing post of the year so far.

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3 hours ago, highlandjambo3 said:

Alas that would not work.
 

The only money to be made in outside catering is when one company hoovers up the whole operation.  I used to work for myself at catering events selling baked potatoes freshly cooked from an industrial/portable oven with homemade fillings, I also did stovies/pulled pork and apple rolls and, wild boar jumbo hotdogs……I can assure you all my food was the best (or almost the best) at the events I attended, which were mainly Highland games, horse shows during the summer etc……..

 

No matter the quality of my food, I had nowhere near the footfall a of basic burger van with their chips/curry sauce.  Also, a very important point is the selling “window of opportunity” at a football match, a little before the game, picking up as punters arrive just before the game, a small trickle throughout the match, a mad half time rush that would be overwhelming for a small caterer* nothing really at the end.  

Working flat out alone let’s say serving 1 punter every 30 seconds, that’s 60 punters over half time.  Let’s say we doubled that over the whole match to 120 punters each portion of food at say £6 (quite pricy I hear you say) so, over the day £720.  Hearts taking probably £200 for the stall.  Take off stock, preparation and clean down which is 1 day cooking before hand, the day setting up and working then, 1 day after cleaning down so 3 days work………did this for 7 year then quit…..received many many positive statements about the quality of my food.

 

On my journey I’ve seen loads of high end street food vendors with “something different” loads of their food was absolutely brilliant but, most fold due to the high volume, cheap food that the burger vans put out.  Ok many of them have fancy stand out graphics on their vans and works like “gourmet/prime/Aberdeen Angus/steak” appear in many parts of their menu, along with chips/cheese/curry sauce/gravy etc………

 

I’m not bitter honest 😂😂


* hire more staff to deal with a 15 minute rush?  Nah not worth the cost.

No mention of VAT ?

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10 minutes ago, Hearts_fan said:

 

Most depressing post of the year so far.


Huh?

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Bazzas right boot
12 minutes ago, sassenach said:

 

But how will I get virtual Diggers Heavy in my living room?

 

Edit - I missed the bit about a hall etc.  Still not the same though.  The actual game is only part of the day out.

 

There will Be folk in Japan enjoying the Tynecastle derby experience  experience without even  moving.

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On 11/01/2022 at 19:56, Led Tasso said:

 

By giving up nothing but some parking and part of the community pitch, there is enough room back there to, figuratively, pick up the Bill Struth stand or the Celtic Park north stand and drop it in place.

 

NBDC has consistently said that they won't stand in the way of Hearts' expansion out of spite but that they would expect us to cover their costs to ameliorate the changes (both in property value and in moving hazardous materials further away from the stand). Those costs, combined with the fact that we obviously couldn't consistently fill that stand, make this an exercise in pure fantasy.

 

However, quantity of vacant ground is not the problem.

The Wheatfield holds a bit under 6k. There's enough room between it and Wheatfield Street to allow a stand that's a bit more than double the current size. Probably about 14k at most.  And that's if planning permission could even be obtained for something that big right across the street from the housing on the other side of it!  With clever design, you could possibly have a lower tier at a less steep angle, with a top tier as steep as the current stand, overhanging the back of the lower tier a bit, which would maybe allow you to squeeze in another thousand or two. You'd get about 16k at the very maximum from that.  Moot point, obviously, as you'd never get planning permission! 

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Bazzas right boot
Just now, sassenach said:

 

I get where you're coming from, but generally speaking we become fans of our local clubs by being taken to games as kids.  If things become too virtual the local aspect disappears.  People will just want to watch the bigger teams, regardless of where they are based.

 

Agreed, it's going that way. 

Sky have been doing it for 3 decades, vr will just be an extension of that and make the experience even more real. 

 

I've seen it, it's pretty spooky Tbh. 

 

You can almost be transported right there, Vr ****s with your heed. You can get carried away even with limited technology. 

 

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12 hours ago, Wee Mikey said:

 

Well, that's precisely what I did during 'lockdown' when we had to watch streams. That plus a few bottles of 'Old Jock'. It helped make the stay-at-home matchday experience more bearable. I dunno if Bain's could up their output sufficiently, but maybe Hearts could figure out an on-site facility for them. For sure, we'd then have the bestest pies! Unlike the supposedly legendary 'Killie Pies' which, at the last two away fixtures, were gash ... all rock-hard pastry and indigestible bits of meat not fit for a dug. 🤮

IIRC, Killie changed their pie supplier (to a cheaper but inferior one) a few years ago. I'm sure there was talk of a legal battle between the club and the original supplier, as the club kept flogging the new pies under the name 'The Killie Pie' but the old supplier had actually trademarked it!  No idea how it ended up!

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2 hours ago, FarmerTweedy said:

The Wheatfield holds a bit under 6k. There's enough room between it and Wheatfield Street to allow a stand that's a bit more than double the current size. Probably about 14k at most.  And that's if planning permission could even be obtained for something that big right across the street from the housing on the other side of it!  With clever design, you could possibly have a lower tier at a less steep angle, with a top tier as steep as the current stand, overhanging the back of the lower tier a bit, which would maybe allow you to squeeze in another thousand or two. You'd get about 16k at the very maximum from that.  Moot point, obviously, as you'd never get planning permission! 

 

The last sentence being the critical one, although the housing is only across from a small section of the area that would be the stand. NBDC remains and in all likelihood will remain the limiting factor on capacity.

 

I was grandstanding (har har) about the 20k+ thing, but 16k is a fair enough estimate (I'd guess you'd get the max from a three tier design but whatever). Even so, a 16k Wheatfield would take Tynecastle to a very robust 30k seater stadium (and maybe with terracing if the UK ever revises its silly safe standing limits and adopts more continental-style limits).

 

Which just makes the point—space to build isn't the issue. It's the planning limits caused by being so close to NBDC. A fat enough check would likely solve those issues, but that check is too fat for us to consider writing any time soon.

 

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23 hours ago, stuart500 said:

Took these pictures of the escalators on my Stadium tour (you can see the under side of the one up to the second floor). I can't remember exactly where they start from at ground level but it's definitely not from the main reception area ( the lift is there). The escalators are over towards the north side of the main stand. 

 

I suppose the advantage of this will be a direct link up to the second floor without going through main reception. Handy if we are developing hotel type facilities up there. 

 

Will be interesting to see the plans. Hospitality space with bedroom facilities could be pretty effective for weddings etc. A potential nice little earner.

20200110_151943_HDR.jpg

Is that just a guess 😉🤔

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16 hours ago, FarmerTweedy said:

The Wheatfield holds a bit under 6k. There's enough room between it and Wheatfield Street to allow a stand that's a bit more than double the current size. Probably about 14k at most.  And that's if planning permission could even be obtained for something that big right across the street from the housing on the other side of it!  With clever design, you could possibly have a lower tier at a less steep angle, with a top tier as steep as the current stand, overhanging the back of the lower tier a bit, which would maybe allow you to squeeze in another thousand or two. You'd get about 16k at the very maximum from that.  Moot point, obviously, as you'd never get planning permission! 

I don't accept that we wouldn't get planning permission for a bigger Wheatfield. It could depend on the facilities contained within the stand. 

 

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The capacity is to small. As long as we continue to develop well as a football team. Getting into Europe and having a great next season will tell us a bit more.

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37 minutes ago, Libertarian said:

I don't accept that we wouldn't get planning permission for a bigger Wheatfield. It could depend on the facilities contained within the stand. 

 

I think we might get pp for a (bit) bigger one, but 16k or anything close to that would tower over the tenements across the road and I think there'd be no chance of being allowed to build something that big! I could see 9 or 10k being an outside possibility, although possibly at the cost of being significantly less steeply banked than the current one, to keep the height closer to that of the existing stand. 

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I was wondering whether there would be scope to widen the pitch 1M at each side to bring us inline with some of the other SPL teams. Aberdeen, DU both have 66M wide pitches and I don't ever consider their pitches too tight.  Obviously when the team is playing well and the other team are not sitting in then we witness some great games but I firmly believe when the opponents are intent on a defensive formation (the majority) its a hard watch sometimes. 

 

When the time comes to develop the Wheatfield I'd imagine the club will take the opportunity to widen to the standard 68M anyway. 

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8 hours ago, sassenach said:

 

My gravy-stained coat has been testimony to this.  And their paper bags aren't waxed so they disintegrate with gravy and rain 😟


Never heard of a pelican bib?

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19 minutes ago, Thomaso said:


Never heard of a pelican bib?

Get Hearts badged ones in the Hearts Superstore, but not in my size it seems. 🧐

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9 hours ago, tynietigers said:

Is that just a guess 😉🤔

Someone on here mentioned plans were being drawn up for bedrooms and more hospitality. It's my speculation of what they might be used for (if the plans ever get off the ground). 👍

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If Tynecastle got a hotel and it wasn't Rolls Royce prices, I would 100% stay there the next time through Edinburgh.

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3 hours ago, stuart500 said:

Someone on here mentioned plans were being drawn up for bedrooms and more hospitality. It's my speculation of what they might be used for (if the plans ever get off the ground). 👍


There is not sufficient space to accommodate enough bedrooms to make that economically viable as a hotel - accommodation for new players?

We also have 5 hospitality suites already so do we need more?

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1 hour ago, Thomaso said:


There is not sufficient space to accommodate enough bedrooms to make that economically viable as a hotel - accommodation for new players?

We also have 5 hospitality suites already so do we need more?

I remember chatting to a West Ham fan years ago and they had rooms in the main stand at Upton Park that fans could book for the night before games. Then you’d leave the room to go for your prematch routine and when you came back the bed etc had gone and it became your hospitality suite. I’m not sure how long they did it for but it seemed like a pretty cool idea. Waking up and opening your curtains and seeing the ground in front of you as you sat and had a cuppa. 

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6 hours ago, damo said:

I was wondering whether there would be scope to widen the pitch 1M at each side to bring us inline with some of the other SPL teams. Aberdeen, DU both have 66M wide pitches and I don't ever consider their pitches too tight.  Obviously when the team is playing well and the other team are not sitting in then we witness some great games but I firmly believe when the opponents are intent on a defensive formation (the majority) its a hard watch sometimes. 

 

When the time comes to develop the Wheatfield I'd imagine the club will take the opportunity to widen to the standard 68M anyway. 

The pitch used to be wider but it was also shorter. We had to narrow it when we lengthened it from 98 to 100 yards, otherwise the corners would have been too close to the corner towers.

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1 hour ago, Thomaso said:


There is not sufficient space to accommodate enough bedrooms to make that economically viable as a hotel - accommodation for new players?

We also have 5 hospitality suites already so do we need more?

 

Whatever our intention is we have no doubt carried out (or are carrying out) a feasibility study. Bedrooms seem a strange one as they would need windows so would need to overlook the plaza through the glass frontage? The windows would also need blinds or curtains. Doesn't sound very practical but I'm no expert in these matters. 

 

The wedding venue idea might work as brides and grooms etc usually need a room to change in. The rest of the facilities are already there and available on non match days. Having paid for 4 daughters' weddings I know how much money these events cost 😠 and clearly could be great business for the club 😄!!

 

Be interesting to see what they come up with.

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14 hours ago, stuart500 said:

Someone on here mentioned plans were being drawn up for bedrooms and more hospitality. It's my speculation of what they might be used for (if the plans ever get off the ground). 👍

As far as I know that is the plan 👍🏻 There would really good money in it to capture business people using our facilities from all over Britain and Europe.

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9 hours ago, FarmerTweedy said:

The pitch used to be wider but it was also shorter. We had to narrow it when we lengthened it from 98 to 100 yards, otherwise the corners would have been too close to the corner towers.

Spot on. Unfortunately by doing this the pitch is now smaller in square metre terms but it had to be 100 metres long minimum to have the uefa stamp. I do hope there is a way to increase it in the future as I do think the narrowness doesn't help our wide men. 

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highlandjambo3
11 hours ago, Thomaso said:


There is not sufficient space to accommodate enough bedrooms to make that economically viable as a hotel - accommodation for new players?

We also have 5 hospitality suites already so do we need more?

We do sell out hospitality quite often do we not.  Not an economics or business expert here but one thing I do know……………keeping an empty space is not a good idea.

 

What about a gym?  Infrastructure is already there, gym space, toilets, power etc…..lease in some decent kit, fit the place out, hire in a few trainers and see what happens.

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14 hours ago, Tazio said:

I remember chatting to a West Ham fan years ago and they had rooms in the main stand at Upton Park that fans could book for the night before games. Then you’d leave the room to go for your prematch routine and when you came back the bed etc had gone and it became your hospitality suite. I’m not sure how long they did it for but it seemed like a pretty cool idea. Waking up and opening your curtains and seeing the ground in front of you as you sat and had a cuppa. 


You would open up your curtains and look on to the school at Tynecastle….

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3 hours ago, highlandjambo3 said:

We do sell out hospitality quite often do we not.  Not an economics or business expert here but one thing I do know……………keeping an empty space is not a good idea.

 

What about a gym?  Infrastructure is already there, gym space, toilets, power etc…..lease in some decent kit, fit the place out, hire in a few trainers and see what happens.


I do know a gym was under consideration some time ago.

Parking is the big problem.

Edited by Thomaso
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4 minutes ago, Thomaso said:


You would open up your curtains and look on to the school at Tynecastle….

I’m totally aware of that. I was just pointing out something another club had. 

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2 minutes ago, Thomaso said:


I do know a gym was under consideration some time ago.

Parking is the big problem.

The lack of parking really limits it’s usage. 

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Just now, davemclaren said:

The lack of parking really limits it’s usage. 


Indeed including hotel bedrooms

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5 hours ago, Thomaso said:


I do know a gym was under consideration some time ago.

Parking is the big problem.

Someone said they saw it being fitted out as a shop last week, someone must know something. I don't really see the need for a venue, we have the Gorgie suite, nor suites, we have three or four already. It's not big enough for a hotel, and the parking issue comes into it, plus staffing it 24 hours. My y ide as would be so one sort of leisure tie in, 10 pin bowling, gym, fast food??

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46 minutes ago, ericb said:

Someone said they saw it being fitted out as a shop last week, someone must know something. I don't really see the need for a venue, we have the Gorgie suite, nor suites, we have three or four already. It's not big enough for a hotel, and the parking issue comes into it, plus staffing it 24 hours. My y ide as would be so one sort of leisure tie in, 10 pin bowling, gym, fast food??

I can assure you nobody was doing anything in there last week 👍🏻 Apart from putting tables away.

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Parking for the ‘Hotel Tynecastle Park’ not a problem on non match days …. park on the pitch … access through area adjacent to Section N!

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  • 3 months later...
johnking123

Have a couple of more seasons like this or better. We hopefully get the right player in and really kick on. Would be a nice problem to have!

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4 minutes ago, chrisyboy7 said:

Season tickets will be of a high demand and the club is slowly progressing....We will defo need to add seats asap.....


Just reduce away allocation for now

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1 minute ago, johnking123 said:

Have a couple of more seasons like this or better. We hopefully get the right player in and really kick on. Would be a nice problem to have!

We actually need it now.....it's currently not big enough for all the big games and thats fact so year on year we could be generation more money.

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1 minute ago, Sooks said:


Just reduce away allocation for now

This does not raise money and puts our capacity down to 19k lol....we need 25k now.  If we can generate more income it all goes into the squad. making it better. Hearts will break 20 million next season.  but we need to grow our fan base and tyncastle will hold is back in the coming years. 

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3 minutes ago, Sooks said:


Just reduce away allocation for now

Simple, it’s only a matter of time due to demand that Hibs allocation will be reduced to Old Firm levels

supply and demand will dictate that 

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The club should break the 20 million next season....WOW.....For us this is fantastic...for the rest .......They will look and weep.....I hope we can add more seats in the coming years.....we are growing win lose or draw....Fact

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jamboinglasgow
2 minutes ago, chrisyboy7 said:

We actually need it now.....it's currently not big enough for all the big games and thats fact so year on year we could be generation more money.

 

There is little point upgrading based on one season. As we could have a poor season next season and attendances go back down, and then you are left with an expensive upgrade that doesn't fill up, that means the club left paying it off with little increase in revenue.

 

If we are selling out for a few seasons in a row then you can look to upgade.

 

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been here before
1 minute ago, chrisyboy7 said:

The club should break the 20 million next season....WOW.....For us this is fantastic...for the rest .......They will look and weep.....I hope we can add more seats in the coming years.....we are growing win lose or draw....Fact

 

Thats 3 threads in about 5 minutes you've mentioned that.

 

Have you just found out what seats are?

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  • davemclaren changed the title to TYNECASTLE STADIUM UPGRADE POTENTIAL - UEFA category 4 granted ( updated/merged )

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