John souttar

[Jim Panzee]

3 minutes ago, kingantti1874 said:

then we will never be able to retain players or grow the club, will occasionally be great then we will get cherry picked to death. We should be looking at ways to increase our maximum wage.

yeap - much better approach - and something Ann has done already with the main stand - creating facilities that generate income on non match days.

[Italian Lambretta]

People suggesting we should just pay Souttar 10k a week. So we then have to pay Craig Gordon 10k a week because he's the club captain and probably more important to the playing side than John Souttar.

Where will it end we cant afford those type of wages at the moment.

[tian447]

1 minute ago, kingantti1874 said:

then we will never be able to retain players or grow the club, will occasionally be great then we will get cherry picked to death. We should be looking at ways to increase our maximum wage.

 

Right, which is exactly what we are doing at the minute, bringing in players of great quality with potential to grow, but not on outrageous money or long contracts.   Look at some of the disasters we had with contracts, handing out 4 year deals to absolute shite who stuck around bleeding wages.  That was just a couple of years ago!  We have tried it all before, and it didn't work.  We cannot go back.

 

We need to build the club up slowly, and sustainably.  We cannot go throwing it out the window for one player, because it will just spiral out of control.  As soon as we start throwing money around, other players will want the same sort of deal, players won't come to the club for less than X amount, and we just end up back where we started.  Shite players getting paid lots of money on long contracts.  We have to start slow and build up, instead of jumping in at the deep end and hoping that someone will come in with a higher offer.

 

We will offer what we can afford, or are willing to pay, and it is up to the player to decide.

[Beni]

7 minutes ago, AndyNic said:

Looks like Robbie sending a wee message to the board to splash the cash and get him secured.

 

Or maybe Robbie knows there's a final increase in terms to be offered to Soapy and 'calling' for the board to go the extra mile is all part of the choreography. Makes Souttar feel he's really wanted by the manager.

A wee message about playing first team football and a subtle reminder that he was well supported during his injury thrown in for good measure.

 

Some great mind games from Robbie.

Or maybe I'm reading too much into it. 

[Des Lynam]

I must admit I’ve got a sneaky feeling he might just stay…..

[The Treasurer]

11 minutes ago, jonnothejambo said:

 

A footballer's loyalty is to his bank balance.

No different from the majority of employees. 

[Bazzas right boot]

50 minutes ago, tian447 said:

 

Secure a big fee?

 

Just because a player is on a large contract, doesn't mean we'll get top money for them, otherwise the Vlad years would have had us rolling in multi-million pound player sales.  This is not football manager, and unfortunately, players come toward the end of their contracts without settling on a contract renewal.  It's the way it's been for a long time now.

 

****ing up the entire wage structure led to us ending up in all kinds of bother and nearly losing the club entirely.  A strict budget plan is exactly what we should be aiming for, and it can bend and stretch on the back of success but we shouldn't be remortgaging the house on a "what if".  Too many clubs go all out chasing a dream that will never be reached and end up ****ed.  I'd be keen not to repeat that any time soon.

[Bazzas right boot]

18 minutes ago, The Treasurer said:

No different from the majority of employees. 

 

 

Almost every study has finances  2nd to job satisfaction when it comes to why folk stay in jobs or move.

 

Quite a common misconception, although there is obviously a tipping point and a balance to be found.

 

[EIEIO]

1 hour ago, AndyNic said:

Looks like Robbie sending a wee message to the board to splash the cash and get him secured.

https://twitter.com/STVSport/status/1461360541193027597?t=xcv2wRcLubvgRTFUP5mYkw&s=19

STV version differs slightly in tone from the BBC article you posted the link to earlier.

 

[Rick Sanchez]

It would be strange for Robbie to send a message to the board if he already knows the answer.

 

Soapy is getting us European football or Joe Savage will accept the very best deal he can get. Either way I'm happy.

 

 

[Tom Hardy’s Dug]

2 hours ago, AndyNic said:

https://www.bbc.co.uk/sport/football/59337275

 

 

ooh - “Robbie sends board Souttar ultimatum”

 

23 minutes ago, Rick Sanchez said:

It would be strange for Robbie to send a message to the board if he already knows the answer.

 

Soapy is getting us European football or Joe Savage will accept the very best deal he can get. Either way I'm happy.

 

 

Yep. Interesting.

 

The main thing at the moment seems to be to convince Souttar he will get an EPL move if he stays here for at least another year. Whereas at the moment he could get bogged down in an EFL move which would be of little career benefit to him.

Short term finances yet but it’s a swamp.

[kingantti1874]

1 hour ago, tian447 said:

 

Right, which is exactly what we are doing at the minute, bringing in players of great quality with potential to grow, but not on outrageous money or long contracts.   Look at some of the disasters we had with contracts, handing out 4 year deals to absolute shite who stuck around bleeding wages.  That was just a couple of years ago!  We have tried it all before, and it didn't work.  We cannot go back.

 

We need to build the club up slowly, and sustainably.  We cannot go throwing it out the window for one player, because it will just spiral out of control.  As soon as we start throwing money around, other players will want the same sort of deal, players won't come to the club for less than X amount, and we just end up back where we started.  Shite players getting paid lots of money on long contracts.  We have to start slow and build up, instead of jumping in at the deep end and hoping that someone will come in with a higher offer.

 

We will offer what we can afford, or are willing to pay, and it is up to the player to decide.

but unless we pay what they are worth we will lose them and be back to square one. 
 

I don’t support jumping in at the deep end , I do want controller investment.. 

[Bazzas right boot]

56 minutes ago, EIEIO said:

https://twitter.com/STVSport/status/1461360541193027597?t=xcv2wRcLubvgRTFUP5mYkw&s=19

STV version differs slightly in tone from the BBC article you posted the link to earlier.

 

 

 

There is still hope!!!!

 

 

[Bazzas right boot]

20 minutes ago, kingantti1874 said:

but unless we pay what they are worth we will lose them and be back to square one. 
 

I don’t support jumping in at the deep end , I do want controller investment.. 

 

Is he rich?

 

[The White Cockade]

Funny one this as surely the player, management and Board have been talking together for a while about his future 

Does Robbie just want the fans to know it’s not his fault if we don’t keep Soapy or is it all just part of playing the game?

I suppose we’ll find out fairly soon

[dazajmbo]

The John Souttar owe's Hearts chat is absolutely chronic. The contract is he is currently on was signed at a time JS was injured. Indeed he went on to say this will hopefully make up for all Hearts had done for him and sticking with him during his injury. 

 

I'd like us to offer him the best possible option and secure him long term. I'd probably be just as happy to see him finish his career with us without us gaining any transfer fee. The reality is that he is streets ahead of us and anywhere else in Scotland. 

 

Factor in the way injuries already suffered are normally early retirement ones. The most significant worry is he has already had 3 once in a life time career threatening injuries.  The 4th unfortunately will be a major worry and will we be able to make his life after football easier with money in the bank? Or a couple years down south on 5-20 times his current wage would be a safer bet. 

 

I am hopeful for a new deal. If he moves elsewhere he will go with my best wishes and thanks.  Will be disappointed if he does end up at either of the ugly sisters,  but that will only happen because they blew us out of the water in wages.  

[kingantti1874]

2 minutes ago, dazajmbo said:

The John Souttar owe's Hearts chat is absolutely chronic. The contract is he is currently on was signed at a time JS was injured. Indeed he went on to say this will hopefully make up for all Hearts had done for him and sticking with him during his injury. 

 

I'd like us to offer him the best possible option and secure him long term. I'd probably be just as happy to see him finish his career with us without us gaining any transfer fee. The reality is that he is streets ahead of us and anywhere else in Scotland. 

 

Factor in the way injuries already suffered are normally early retirement ones. The most significant worry is he has already had 3 once in a life time career threatening injuries.  The 4th unfortunately will be a major worry and will we be able to make his life after football easier with money in the bank? Or a couple years down south on 5-20 times his current wage would be a safer bet. 

 

I am hopeful for a new deal. If he moves elsewhere he will go with my best wishes and thanks.  Will be disappointed if he does end up at either of the ugly sisters,  but that will only happen because they blew us out of the water in wages.  

agree 100%. 

[luckydug]

I'm sure JS will be keen to keep his place in a world cup squad should we qualify. 

Just my opinion but with that in mind mind is he not better to be playing for Hearts where every game is going to be like a cup final in our push for European football. 

If he was to go to a mid table championship club in England where games towards the end of the season may be nothing at stake affairs he risks losing his focus. 

A PC with one of the OF is the very worst scenario for us although I'm sure Soapy would still give his best for us. 

Another thing some of these Championship teams are no better than Hearts the only thing they have over us is money. 

All imo of course🤔

[Watt-Zeefuik]

4 hours ago, AndyNic said:

https://www.bbc.co.uk/sport/football/59337275

 

 

 

Robbie talking to the board and also to Souttar there. "What's key for John is playing week in and week out." In other words, don't take a contract somewhere you might be sitting on the bench for a few years.

[Bongo 1874]

4 hours ago, Jim Panzee said:

how do you manage Gordon, Beni, Devlin, Boyce, Kingsley subsequently knocking on the door asking for more cash?

 

I'd imagine the board have a wage structure which we work within which will not be broken for any player or circumstance. 

How many of them are playing at international level and attracting interest from clubs? 

 

 

[TNCASTLE]

4 hours ago, dazajmbo said:

The John Souttar owe's Hearts chat is absolutely chronic. The contract is he is currently on was signed at a time JS was injured. Indeed he went on to say this will hopefully make up for all Hearts had done for him and sticking with him during his injury. 

 

I'd like us to offer him the best possible option and secure him long term. I'd probably be just as happy to see him finish his career with us without us gaining any transfer fee. The reality is that he is streets ahead of us and anywhere else in Scotland. 

 

Factor in the way injuries already suffered are normally early retirement ones. The most significant worry is he has already had 3 once in a life time career threatening injuries.  The 4th unfortunately will be a major worry and will we be able to make his life after football easier with money in the bank? Or a couple years down south on 5-20 times his current wage would be a safer bet. 

 

I am hopeful for a new deal. If he moves elsewhere he will go with my best wishes and thanks.  Will be disappointed if he does end up at either of the ugly sisters,  but that will only happen because they blew us out of the water in wages.  

He’s here now!!

[Unknown user]

I saw this photo on Facebook today. He's a decent lad, we've given each other plenty, and when he goes I wish him well. I just hope it's not soon.

 

[Thomaso]

7 hours ago, Smith's right boot said:

 

 

Almost every study has finances  2nd to job satisfaction when it comes to why folk stay in jobs or move.

 

Quite a common misconception, although there is obviously a tipping point and a balance to be found.

 

The difference is most employees don’t have a greedy agent nipping their ear! 

[daavojaay]

8 hours ago, Beni said:

 

Or maybe Robbie knows there's a final increase in terms to be offered to Soapy and 'calling' for the board to go the extra mile is all part of the choreography. Makes Souttar feel he's really wanted by the manager.

A wee message about playing first team football and a subtle reminder that he was well supported during his injury thrown in for good measure.

 

Some great mind games from Robbie.

Or maybe I'm reading too much into it. 

It's just the truth

[daavojaay]

8 hours ago, Des Lynam said:

I must admit I’ve got a sneaky feeling he might just stay…..

Not a chance he's got clubs all over the place that are gonna offer him 4 times what we can absolutely no chance he will be away in jan

[Bainy]

Hes got his head screwed on so I don't think he'll jump to OF. He'd be better signing for us and having a great season then he'll get his bit move next year. 

[Jim Panzee]

11 hours ago, Bongo 1874 said:

How many of them are playing at international level and attracting interest from clubs? 

 

 

Craig Gordon. the rest no.

 

in terms of interest from other clubs? no one knows the answer to that.

 

but they could all stake a claim to being integral to us being at the top of the SPFL. 

[Bongo 1874]

Just now, Jim Panzee said:

Craig Gordon. the rest no.

 

in terms of interest from other clubs? no one knows the answer to that.

 

but they could all stake a claim to being integral to us being at the top of the SPFL. 

I don't always agree with Robbie but he's spot on with Souttar, that's the board's decision. 

 

 

https://www.google.com/url?sa=t&source=web&rct=j&url=https://www.footballscotland.co.uk/spfl/scottish-premiership/robbie-neilson-makes-hearts-board-22206763.amp&ved=2ahUKEwjOsNTCiqT0AhXJgVwKHQdQCrAQ0PADKAB6BAgFEAE&usg=AOvVaw1PDFiCOUxgTLvbknH6R0D-

 

Like it or not if we want to challenge for leagues, and play in europa leagues the wages will need to go up, to keep are already talented players we have, and to attract new talent to the club. 

 

I'm sure the board are fully aware of this, exciting times ahead don't stand still Hearts let's take it too these ^^^^ts. 

 

There is only one team in Edinburgh 🇱🇻 Rudi Skacel. 

 

Dave Mackay: all I wanted all my life was to play for Hearts 🇱🇻 And Scotland. 

[Jim Panzee]

4 minutes ago, Bongo 1874 said:

I don't always agree with Robbie but he's spot on with Souttar, that's the board's decision. 

 

 

https://www.google.com/url?sa=t&source=web&rct=j&url=https://www.footballscotland.co.uk/spfl/scottish-premiership/robbie-neilson-makes-hearts-board-22206763.amp&ved=2ahUKEwjOsNTCiqT0AhXJgVwKHQdQCrAQ0PADKAB6BAgFEAE&usg=AOvVaw1PDFiCOUxgTLvbknH6R0D-

 

Like it or not if we want to challenge for leagues, and play in europa leagues the wages will need to go up, to keep are already talented players we have, and to attract new talent to the club. 

 

I'm sure the board are fully aware of this, exciting times ahead don't stand still Hearts let's take it too these ^^^^ts. 

 

There is only one team in Edinburgh 🇱🇻 Rudi Skacel. 

 

Dave Mackay: all I wanted all my life was to play for Hearts 🇱🇻 And Scotland. 

yeap - think we all agree generally. and we're lucky to have a board that will explore all options but within a sensible financial framework. The board are also looking ahead to increase off the field income - so our playing budget should increase over time to support the desire for european football and domestic success.

[Hector Riva]

Song for John 

 

 

[TexasAndy]

The worst thing about the Souttar situation is the disruption it has on this season.  We are going well so far and he is a large part of that.   This COULD be a trophy season which would be enhanced if we knew we had Souttar until next summer.    On current form he will be in the play offs squad with a very good chance of playing.  A move in january or a fall out with the club towards end of season is not going to help Hearts, Scotland or indeed Souttar himself.  

[Ainsley Harriott]

23 hours ago, Bongo 1874 said:

How many of them are playing at international level and attracting interest from clubs? 

 

 

3 out the five are internationalists and I would be amazed if 4 out of the 5 aren't being monitored by other clubs

[cb1874]

I noticed in Robbies pre-match press conference the other day that the to and fro between club and player/representative are still ongoing. So clearly the club haven't given up on keeping him here, and they've not been told by him or his agent that it's dead in the water.

 

Clearly we can't afford 10-15k a week, which it has been speculated that he could earn down south...I've no reason to doubt either point.

However...there are other ways to structure deals. A colleague has pointed out that 10k/wk equates to 500k per year, so why not offer him 5k per week salary + 500k signing fee? Or even £500k for each year he stays and continues to extend. That gives him his 15k equivalent salary and protects the club. The more he extends the more we can command in transfer fee. The signing fee would be recouped many many times over with a significant transfer fee which we could expect if he was tied down longer. Even more if he helped us qualify for the Europa Conference. Then there is the possibility of a sell on, further repaying our outlay.

 

If my mate can invent such a scenario, I'm sure Joe Savage will too. These deals can often be very complex, probably more so than any of us on here will ever know.

I remain hopeful.

Edited November 20, 2021 by cb1874

[Bazzas right boot]

20 hours ago, TexasAndy said:

The worst thing about the Souttar situation is the disruption it has on this season.  We are going well so far and he is a large part of that.   This COULD be a trophy season which would be enhanced if we knew we had Souttar until next summer.    On current form he will be in the play offs squad with a very good chance of playing.  A move in january or a fall out with the club towards end of season is not going to help Hearts, Scotland or indeed Souttar himself.  

 

Part of the reason I wanted it sorted either way in January. 

 

This is a distraction and will become a bigger one if he's still here past January. 

As welll as  disrupting team morale, the fand could also turn ( especially if rumours about the of are strong) 

 

Needs sorted by January. 

Sign an extension or leave. 

 

Hearts can then move on without the media circus and speculation 

 

I'm sure the player and the club think the same. 

 

 

[Bazzas right boot]

1 hour ago, cb1874 said:

I noticed in Robbies pre-match press conference the other day that the to and fro between club and player/representative are still ongoing. So clearly the club haven't given up on keeping him here, and they've not been told by him or his agent that it's dead in the water.

 

Clearly we can't afford 10-15k a week, which it has been speculated that he could earn down south...I've no reason to doubt either point.

However...there are other ways to structure deals. A colleague has pointed out that 10k/wk equates to 500k per year, so why not offer him 5k per week salary + 500k signing fee? Or even £500k for each year he stays and continues to extend. That gives him his 15k equivalent salary and protects the club. The more he extends the more we can command in transfer fee. The signing fee would be recouped many many times over with a significant transfer fee which we could expect if he was tied down longer. Even more if he helped us qualify for the Europa Conference. Then there is the possibility of a sell on, further repaying our outlay.

 

If my mate can invent such a scenario, I'm sure Joe Savage will too. These deals can often be very complex, probably more so than any of us on here will ever know.

I remain hopeful.

 

Yip, many ways to skin a cat. 

 

There is maybe more hope than there was last week. 

 

 

[Bazzas right boot]

14 hours ago, Ainsley Harriott said:

3 out the five are internationalists and I would be amazed if 4 out of the 5 aren't being monitored by other clubs

 

 

Yip, he really never thought that one through. 

 

 

[Bazzas right boot]

Gordon hasn't signed either..... 

 

On one hand it's got me nervous. On the other I'm waiting for a double extension announcement! 

[Vlad Magic]

4 minutes ago, Smith's right boot said:

Gordon hasn't signed either..... 

 

On one hand it's got me nervous. On the other I'm waiting for a double extension announcement! 

[Boyces beard]

1 hour ago, cb1874 said:

I noticed in Robbies pre-match press conference the other day that the to and fro between club and player/representative are still ongoing. So clearly the club haven't given up on keeping him here, and they've not been told by him or his agent that it's dead in the water.

 

Clearly we can't afford 10-15k a week, which it has been speculated that he could earn down south...I've no reason to doubt either point.

However...there are other ways to structure deals. A colleague has pointed out that 10k/wk equates to 500k per year, so why not offer him 5k per week salary + 500k signing fee? Or even £500k for each year he stays and continues to extend. That gives him his 15k equivalent salary and protects the club. The more he extends the more we can command in transfer fee. The signing fee would be recouped many many times over with a significant transfer fee which we could expect if he was tied down longer. Even more if he helped us qualify for the Europa Conference. Then there is the possibility of a sell on, further repaying our outlay.

 

If my mate can invent such a scenario, I'm sure Joe Savage will too. These deals can often be very complex, probably more so than any of us on here will ever know.

I remain hopeful.

I hear what your mate is saying but in most cases (not all) a players wage has a lot to do with the transfer fee other clubs will offer. When we sold CG to Sunderland we gave him a bumper deal on big wages and recieved a record fee for a UK goalkeeper at the time. Obviously the longer the contact a player is on the more teams will pay but wages also play a big part in how much other teams will offer.

[Bongo 1874]

14 hours ago, Ainsley Harriott said:

3 out the five are internationalists and I would be amazed if 4 out of the 5 aren't being monitored by other clubs

Who are the clubs interested in the others? 

[Nookie Bear]

36 minutes ago, Bongo 1874 said:

Who are the clubs interested in the others? 

Is he not saying he would be surprised if they were not being monitored?

 

Which any half decent player will be anyway. 

[Bongo 1874]

Just now, Nookie Bear said:

Is he not saying he would be surprised if they were not being monitored?

 

Which any half decent player will be anyway. 

Maybe he is i don't know tbh, what i do know is Souttar is definitely attracting interest and my opinion is regardless of what happens in today's result, that he should be offered 10k a week if he turns that down, then try move him on in January. 

 

 

Edited November 20, 2021 by Bongo 1874

[SMJ_1874]

I’d give soapy a £1M signing on fee plus £15k per week under the proviso that he can leave if another  club come in for him and offer us £10M. Win win situation for us.
 

£15k also beats our highest paid player by £3k per week 

[Rick Sanchez]

30 minutes ago, SMJ_1874 said:

I’d give soapy a £1M signing on fee plus £15k per week under the proviso that he can leave if another  club come in for him and offer us £10M. Win win situation for us.
 

£15k also beats our highest paid player by £3k per week 

 

Oh ffs.

[a11ank]

A slightly different suggestion.

 

I was really critical of Kieran Tierney when he signed an extension with Celtic, suggesting he was a shite bag and was going to waste his career at Celtic, just like wee Broon!

 

It looks like there was a really good set up there, as Celtic knew they were going to lose him and he signed 'to enhance the fee' to the club.

 

He went for £25m instead of probably £5 or £6m

 

Surely Hearts can look at this and sort something out similar to the Celtic deal.

 

I'm not suggesting we will get £25m, but I hate that we could lose him for £500k

 

I hate Celtic, but this was a great move by them!

 

Come on Soapy😍

[tian447]

3 hours ago, Smith's right boot said:

Gordon hasn't signed either..... 

 

On one hand it's got me nervous. On the other I'm waiting for a double extension announcement! 

 

I can assure you, there will be more than 2 extensions if that happens 

 

 

Edited November 20, 2021 by tian447

[Italian Lambretta]

23 minutes ago, a11ank said:

A slightly different suggestion.

 

I was really critical of Kieran Tierney when he signed an extension with Celtic, suggesting he was a shite bag and was going to waste his career at Celtic, just like wee Broon!

 

It looks like there was a really good set up there, as Celtic knew they were going to lose him and he signed 'to enhance the fee' to the club.

 

He went for £25m instead of probably £5 or £6m

 

Surely Hearts can look at this and sort something out similar to the Celtic deal.

 

I'm not suggesting we will get £25m, but I hate that we could lose him for £500k

 

I hate Celtic, but this was a great move by them!

 

Come on Soapy😍

The reason he signed because he didn't want to upset his pals in the Goon Brigade.

[Taffin]

If Souttar had been on 10k per week since he joined us we'd have paid out around £20k per appearance. That's a lot of money for a club our size.

Edited November 20, 2021 by Taffin

[Bongo 1874]

54 minutes ago, SMJ_1874 said:

I’d give soapy a £1M signing on fee plus £15k per week under the proviso that he can leave if another  club come in for him and offer us £10M. Win win situation for us.
 

£15k also beats our highest paid player by £3k per week 

£15k also beats our highest paid player by £3k per week are you saying that our highest paid player is on £3k a week, apologies if I've picked you up wrong. 

[Bazzas right boot]

3 hours ago, Vlad Magic said:

 

If it happens there would, be a third extension joining them from my y fronts.