Vaccine Certificates - Motherwell (update - vaccine proof not required)

[Taffin]

3 minutes ago, Rogue Daddy said:

I think, if it goes ahead, this is exactly what will happen. The club will announce random checks and if you cant provide proof, you'll be asked to leave/not allowed in.

 

Problem with that is people can just say they forgot it and will go away and get it and then try again and hope they're not caught out 2nd time around.

 

Spot checks would probably work if vaccination uptake was low but given the vast majority have the passport then chances of a spot check finding one of the few without a passport is slim I imagine.

 

If they're going to insist on this then everyone needs to be checked imo. People greeted their eyes out about the idea of sitting next to a filthy unvaccinated person on the other thread, I'm assuming they'll continue this if they think the unvaccinated may slip through the spot checks.

Edited September 21, 2021 by Taffin

[Mars plastic]

3 hours ago, The Treasurer said:

I don't see the problem.

Everyone who has an ST is on the clubs database.

The club contacts all ST holders, the ST holder gives the club proof of double jabs, then your ST remains active.

Those that can't prove this have their ST's suspended.

Same can happen when buying a match ticket.

 

Provide the club with your medical record or have your ST suspended. What planet are you wired up to?

[Lord Beni of Gorgie]

11 days to go and no plan of action, maybe an app before the end of the month, maybe. With only one week of fixtures to execute, perhaps a deferral until October 16th would buy some time to implement a system, but then again, maybe just another 2 weeks haggling time

[Rudolf]

48 minutes ago, Mars plastic said:

Provide the club with your medical record or have your ST suspended. What planet are you wired up to?

Same planet as the Scottish Government by the sound of it🤣

[Rogue Daddy]

54 minutes ago, Taffin said:

 

Problem with that is people can just say they forgot it and will go away and get it and then try again and hope they're not caught out 2nd time around.

 

Spot checks would probably work if vaccination uptake was low but given the vast majority have the passport then chances of a spot check finding one of the few without a passport is slim I imagine.

 

If they're going to insist on this then everyone needs to be checked imo. People greeted their eyes out about the idea of sitting next to a filthy unvaccinated person on the other thread, I'm assuming they'll continue this if they think the unvaccinated may slip through the spot checks.

🤣 I hear what you're saying... just can't see, logistically, how it would be carried out seamlessly, especially after the queues of late, just to get in. I'd imagine there would have to be some sort of barrier(s) erected (prior to getting into the turnstiles) so that everybody could be individually checked. Nightmare!

[maroonlegions]

17 hours ago, Hectormasson said:

I had my 2 jags way back but I've no proof? How do I get a ticket as I was hoping  to pay it at office, ? 

I got a paper confirmation from the NHS proving that i have had my two jags.

 

Time, place, day,date and even the makes of the two jags i got. 

[Taffin]

1 hour ago, Rogue Daddy said:

🤣 I hear what you're saying... just can't see, logistically, how it would be carried out seamlessly, especially after the queues of late, just to get in. I'd imagine there would have to be some sort of barrier(s) erected (prior to getting into the turnstiles) so that everybody could be individually checked. Nightmare!

 

Oh, I know. I think it's an idiotic idea...but if they want to implement an idiotic idea they'd better make sure they actually are delivering on their idea (which imo spot checks fails to do) otherwise I'd question whether it's even worth doing it.

[Newton51]

Nicola sturgeon says at large events operators will be expected to carry out “a reasonable number of checks”, but not necessarily every attendee.

[Boab]

26 minutes ago, Taffin said:

 

Oh, I know. I think it's an idiotic idea...but if they want to implement an idiotic idea they'd better make sure they actually are delivering on their idea (which imo spot checks fails to do) otherwise I'd question whether it's even worth doing it.

FM has just said organisers of larger events, football obviously, will be expected to carry out a reasonable amount of checks.

Then went on to say that they are still working to sort out the levels of checks.

 

It’s spot checks !

As expected.

Get the tickets on sale, Hearts.

[Taffin]

1 minute ago, Boab said:

FM has just said organisers of larger events, football obviously, will be expected to carry out a reasonable amount of checks.

Then went on to say that they are still working to sort out the levels of checks.

 

It’s spot checks !

As expected.

Get the tickets on sale, Hearts.

 

Good news!

 

Maybe border control will see the brilliance of this operation and introduce spot checks on passports at borders too 😂😂

 

Piss up and brewery. 

 

I am pleased though as I was against vaccine passports anyway so glad they've crumbled before even getting started.

[Pasquale for King]

Still going to download the App as I’m guaranteed to be asked 😆

[maroonlegions]

41 minutes ago, jonnothejambo said:

 

Those details are on the copy you can download too.

Correct. All you need is your COVID reference  number on the first COVID vaccination letter sent.

[The Treasurer]

I've had a few responses to my post, so I'll just reply once. 

Most have missed my point completely. 

No checks would be needed at the turnstiles as previously notified verification would allow the club to active or deactivate any ST. 

No one is asking for your full medical history, just a simple yes or no to one question. 

The only sticking point would be the question of compensation for any unvaxxed ST holders. 

[Boab]

12 minutes ago, Taffin said:

 

Good news!

 

Maybe border control will see the brilliance of this operation and introduce spot checks on passports at borders too 😂😂

 

Piss up and brewery. 

 

I am pleased though as I was against vaccine passports anyway so glad they've crumbled before even getting started.

Was always going to be spot checks for football matches. Probably going to be a sting in the tail as, even at this stage, they don’t know what levels are going to be req.

Football is, by far, the largest gathering of people in Scotland on a weekly basis. The fact they are still finalising details is a disgrace.

As I keep saying, get the tickets on sale and then argue late what constitutes “ reasonable amount. “

At least we know what a feckin nightclub is now. Hurray !

[jr ewing]

5 minutes ago, maroonlegions said:

Correct. All you need is your COVID reference  number on the first COVID vaccination letter sent.

Simples.

[john thomas]

8 minutes ago, The Treasurer said:

I've had a few responses to my post, so I'll just reply once. 

Most have missed my point completely. 

No checks would be needed at the turnstiles as previously notified verification would allow the club to active or deactivate any ST. 

No one is asking for your full medical history, just a simple yes or no to one question. 

The only sticking point would be the question of compensation for any unvaxxed ST holders. 

Legally maybe a bit like turning up

steaming ?

If you are breaking the law you can't get in .

Nae compy

[Nelly Terraces]

4 hours ago, Boab said:

I agree that the SG might not take any notice, Nelly, but I’m happy that they have issued a statement.

That said, I would have started selling tickets for the Well game. If the SG do proceed with this, there should be no detriment to us, something that could potentially happen when this rumbles on to next week.

Yeah mate, I do agree with you there, and lets hope I'm being a bit too pessimistic & sense prevails as this could end up costing us thousands in lost revenue, at a time we can least afford it & denies people the opportunity of going to a game. 

[Boab]

17 minutes ago, Nelly Terraces said:

Yeah mate, I do agree with you there, and lets hope I'm being a bit too pessimistic & sense prevails as this could end up costing us thousands in lost revenue, at a time we can least afford it & denies people the opportunity of going to a game. 

Sure the clubs will claim they are taking all reasonable steps, Nelly.

Job done.

👍

[Boab]

32 minutes ago, john thomas said:

Legally maybe a bit like turning up

steaming ?

If you are breaking the law you can't get in .

Nae compy

It wasn’t a law when they bought their ST. Therein lies the problem !

[Newton51]

1 minute ago, Boab said:

It wasn’t a law when they bought their ST. Therein lies the problem !

Thing is they weren’t guaranteed entry due to the ballots so it’s the same principle that down to Covid they can’t attend

[john thomas]

Just now, Boab said:

It wasn’t a law when they bought their ST. Therein lies the problem !

No idea to be honest . But once a law is brought in it then becomes an offence to break it ?

All speculation anyway . There , naturally , have been lots of anomalies/minor(mostly) problems with covid rules and regs but basically things have worked out .

Don't see this becoming a major problem 

[Boab]

1 minute ago, Newton51 said:

Thing is they weren’t guaranteed entry due to the ballots so it’s the same principle that down to Covid they can’t attend

Aye, I’m sure there’s some chicanery in the terms and conditions in the sale of tickets that would cover this.

 

They’re only doing this to push up vaccination numbers, that was from the horse’s mouth today.

Fair enough some would say.

[Boab]

1 minute ago, john thomas said:

No idea to be honest . But once a law is brought in it then becomes an offence to break it ?

All speculation anyway . There , naturally , have been lots of anomalies/minor(mostly) problems with covid rules and regs but basically things have worked out .

Don't see this becoming a major problem 

Me neither, mate.

X amount of checks on match day and I don’t think the SG will be scrutinising it too much.

[CJGJ]

While clubs and smaller events will be expected to inspect the certificates of all customers, the organisers of larger events will have to carry out a "reasonable number" of checks.

Football chiefs had said spot-checks would be "the only practical reality" when dealing with matches involving tens of thousands of fans, warning of lengthy queues and potential for disorder if every attendee was checked.

Certificates will be displayed via an app, which will be available for download from 30 September, while venue staff will either scan this using another app or visually check the QR code shown,

[The Treasurer]

48 minutes ago, john thomas said:

Legally maybe a bit like turning up

steaming ?

If you are breaking the law you can't get in .

Nae compy

The problem with that is when you buy a ticket the t&c's state that you would be refused entry if pissed, but there is nothing about being unvaxxed 

[luckydug]

17 hours ago, sadj said:

No im just dont need to find difficulties in something that can be made very simple. 
 

so no iphone , printer or access to the internet in 2021 is not many people. Access to the internet esp , go to the club and utilise theirs. Not hard to set that up for people. Inconvenience 10mins once then not again. Go to the ticket office for your ticket. No problem take your id , database has your qr code checks the name entered against the database if it doesnt match it doesnt work. 

Simples 👍

[Mars plastic]

Having to show a certificate to get into the fitba. What a tragic wee place Scotland is.

[CJGJ]

One small point which I think will happen is if people cannot get through a check they will just find somewhere else/another Q for access and hope they don't get asked there

 

Imagine it's just before 3pm and the pressure for access builds up.....hard to think the same standard of checks will apply as they would have done at 2.15/2.30pm

 

 

With large crowds expected at Hampden 9th October then Murrayfield's Autumn international Rugby series from the end of October into November it was never going to be a 100% check

[Mikey1874]

Spot checks mean if you get stopped from entry then just try again.

[jr ewing]

14 minutes ago, Mikey1874 said:

Spot checks mean if you get stopped from entry then just try again.

They'll have to check everyone. Otherwise it's pointless. 

[CJGJ]

I'd take this part time job and we might see something similar...of course this is about tickets but you get the point

 

 

There is a new match day entry system in operation at Stark’s Park, with match tickets being sold online and supporters gaining entry by having their barcode scanned at the turnstiles.

Raith Rovers FC are looking to recruit Rovers supporters to assist with scanning their fellow supporters in to the stadium on match days.

These are paid positions, with the successful candidate receiving:

• Complimentary Match entry
• £20 cash payment per match

Hours of work are from 90 minutes before kick-off on home matchdays until just after kick-off.

Applicants must be over 21 years of age and be able to commit to working at 2 home matches between now and December. Full training on the use of the hand-scanners will be given.

[davemclaren]

8 minutes ago, CJGJ said:

I'd take this part time job and we might see something similar...of course this is about tickets but you get the point

 

 

There is a new match day entry system in operation at Stark’s Park, with match tickets being sold online and supporters gaining entry by having their barcode scanned at the turnstiles.

Raith Rovers FC are looking to recruit Rovers supporters to assist with scanning their fellow supporters in to the stadium on match days.

These are paid positions, with the successful candidate receiving:

• Complimentary Match entry
• £20 cash payment per match

Hours of work are from 90 minutes before kick-off on home matchdays until just after kick-off.

Applicants must be over 21 years of age and be able to commit to working at 2 home matches between now and December. Full training on the use of the hand-scanners will be given.

You miss the pub pre match and the first 10 minutes though. 😄

[CJGJ]

2 minutes ago, davemclaren said:

You miss the pub pre match and the first 10 minutes though. 😄

I've got money for the pub post match...............and we never, scrub that hardly ever score in the first 10 minutes 😄

[davemclaren]

Just now, CJGJ said:

I've got money for the pub post match...............and we never, scrub that hardly ever score in the first 10 minutes 😄

🤣🤣

[john thomas]

1 hour ago, jr ewing said:

They'll have to check everyone. Otherwise it's pointless. 

It really isn't .

All the restrictions and checks that have been introduced during the pandemic are designed to lessen the odds of spreading infection .

Any decrease in numbers of possible infectors helps . Basically simple arithmetic .

[jr ewing]

8 minutes ago, john thomas said:

It really isn't .

All the restrictions and checks that have been introduced during the pandemic are designed to lessen the odds of spreading infection .

Any decrease in numbers of possible infectors helps . Basically simple arithmetic .

So everyone should provide vaccination proof and a lf test within 24 hours of the match. No problem. 

[john thomas]

1 minute ago, jr ewing said:

So everyone should provide vaccination proof and a lf test within 24 hours of the match. No problem. 

Reread my post several times but unable to find where I said any of that

[Wee Mikey]

8 hours ago, scott herbertson said:

 

 

Looks as if it should be easy

 

If only I didn't have my cunning plan to avoid senility by cluttering up my memory  keeping details like when I had my jabs !

If you can't find either of your letters with the info required then simply phone the Covid 'hot-line'. They'll keep you right.

[jr ewing]

10 minutes ago, john thomas said:

Reread my post several times but unable to find where I said any of that

I take it that you're in agreement?

[Taffin]

41 minutes ago, john thomas said:

It really isn't .

All the restrictions and checks that have been introduced during the pandemic are designed to lessen the odds of spreading infection .

Any decrease in numbers of possible infectors helps . Basically simple arithmetic .

 

Will this decrease the numbers of possible infectors? It removes the requirement for any testing and spot checks will fail to ensure everyone in the ground is vaccinated so I'm sceptical.

 

Genuine question, happy to be shown the data.

Edited September 21, 2021 by Taffin

[Doctor FinnBarr]

39 minutes ago, john thomas said:

It really isn't .

All the restrictions and checks that have been introduced during the pandemic are designed to lessen the odds of spreading infection .

Any decrease in numbers of possible infectors helps . Basically simple arithmetic .

 

28 minutes ago, jr ewing said:

So everyone should provide vaccination proof and a lf test within 24 hours of the match. No problem. 

 

25 minutes ago, john thomas said:

Reread my post several times but unable to find where I said any of that

 

14 minutes ago, jr ewing said:

I take it that you're in agreement?

 

Read all these posts and I'm going to side with john thomas here.

jr ewing is spouting made up shit.

[Bull's-eye]

I'm not going to bother going, can't be doing with the fuss and happy to watch it on tv.

 

Simple solutions are the best.

[the general]

Was at the Community Shield and Spurs stadium and it really wasn't a big deal 

[JimmyCant]

6 hours ago, Mars plastic said:

Having to show a certificate to get into the fitba. What a tragic wee place Scotland is.

Just about every major footballing country in mainland Europe must also be tragic. They all have some form of restriction. In Germany for example you apply to the club for a ‘Covid wristband’ proving your status just the once. Wear the wristband when you go. Some spot checks. No problem IMO. What’s tragic about Scotland is how anti-everything we’re becoming as a nation. We used to be a country that just got on with it.

Edited September 21, 2021 by JimmyCant

[Saint Jambo]

8 hours ago, Taffin said:

 

Good news!

 

Maybe border control will see the brilliance of this operation and introduce spot checks on passports at borders too 😂😂

 

Piss up and brewery. 

 

I am pleased though as I was against vaccine passports anyway so glad they've crumbled before even getting started.

 

Border control certainly haven't been checking every international arrivals vaccine status or covid tests in recent months, so maybe not the best analogy to iillustrate your point. As with the major events, border control know that the point of these measures isn't to elminate all risk, it is primarily to reduce risk by driving up compliance with guidelines on testing or vaccinating. Or to take another related example, customs don't stop and search everyone entering the country. They apply a spot check approach. That is enough to put most people off breaking the customs rules but doesn't stop all smuggling into the UK.

 

This measure for events will nudge some people to get the vaccine (or the second dose of the vaccine) and persuade some people who aren't vaccinated not to go and join large crowds. Both reduce overall health risk at minimal social or economic cost, which is the aim of public health policy.

Edited September 21, 2021 by Saint Jambo

[davemclaren]

I imagine tickets will be on sale soon. 
 

Vaccine passport plans 'warmly welcomed' by SFA & SPFL https://www.bbc.co.uk/sport/football/58643727

[scott herbertson]

5 hours ago, Wee Mikey said:

If you can't find either of your letters with the info required then simply phone the Covid 'hot-line'. They'll keep you right.

Thanks Mike - yes I did that for my daughter. I'm just a lazy s+d though and will wait and see if I have to!

[Taffin]

9 hours ago, Saint Jambo said:

 

Border control certainly haven't been checking every international arrivals vaccine status or covid tests in recent months, so maybe not the best analogy to iillustrate your point. 

 

They are however checking everyone's passport though...

 

It was a throwaway line, but I do believe if you think it's worth doing something, it's worth doing it right.

 

9 hours ago, Saint Jambo said:

 

 

As with the major events, border control know that the point of these measures isn't to elminate all risk, it is primarily to reduce risk by driving up compliance with guidelines on testing or vaccinating. Or to take another related example, customs don't stop and search everyone entering the country. They apply a spot check approach. That is enough to put most people off breaking the customs rules but doesn't stop all smuggling into the UK.

 

This measure for events will nudge some people to get the vaccine (or the second dose of the vaccine) and persuade some people who aren't vaccinated not to go and join large crowds. Both reduce overall health risk at minimal social or economic cost, which is the aim of public health policy.

 

 

Does is reduce the overall health risk vs keeping LFTs as a means of obtaining a passport as per the trial events? Or does it just save cost. I'm feeling it's the latter but happy to be shown otherwise.

[Stu_HMFC]

Open goal live at hydro on 3/10 no talk of passports for that ? The Motherwell match should be fine .

[William H. Bonney]