Gimme an H... Posted September 16, 2021 Share Posted September 16, 2021 How many times have Hearts finished above Hibs in the league since Hibs were formed? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Locky Posted September 16, 2021 Share Posted September 16, 2021 Bored at work so I've just sifted through all the league tables in Scottish football history to find your answers. Apologies if I've made a mistake however. Only counting seasons in which we've been in the same division of course, there have been 108 seasons in which we've played in the same division. 107 in the top flight, and one season in the 2nd tier. As it stands, by my count, we lead the way 63-45. Quite interesting going through the years to see how it worked out. Despite Hearts being a Scottish Cup force in the late 1890's-early 1900's, Hibs finished above us for quite a few seasons in a row. During WW1, depsite our plight, we still managed to routinely finish above them. I didn't even realise til now as well that they were missing from the top flight for a few seasons during the 1930's. One startlng statistic though, is that if we fail to finish above them this season, that is a full decade since we finished above them in a top flight season. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Mikey1874 Posted September 16, 2021 Share Posted September 16, 2021 I remember checking this previously. A sticky sub forum for these key stats would be helpful. Good reference for Hibs fans. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Gimme an H... Posted September 16, 2021 Author Share Posted September 16, 2021 8 minutes ago, Locky said: Bored at work so I've just sifted through all the league tables in Scottish football history to find your answers. Apologies if I've made a mistake however. Only counting seasons in which we've been in the same division of course, there have been 108 seasons in which we've played in the same division. 107 in the top flight, and one season in the 2nd tier. As it stands, by my count, we lead the way 63-45. Quite interesting going through the years to see how it worked out. Despite Hearts being a Scottish Cup force in the late 1890's-early 1900's, Hibs finished above us for quite a few seasons in a row. During WW1, depsite our plight, we still managed to routinely finish above them. I didn't even realise til now as well that they were missing from the top flight for a few seasons during the 1930's. One startlng statistic though, is that if we fail to finish above them this season, that is a full decade since we finished above them in a top flight season. Wow, cheers Locky. That will do nicely. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Jambo61 Posted September 16, 2021 Share Posted September 16, 2021 53 minutes ago, Gimme an H... said: How many times have Hearts finished above Hibs in the league since Hibs were formed? Best stat........which team is the only team to win a lower league 2 years in a row? After being reformed, Hibs won the inaugural Division Two championship. Bizarrely (says who?), were refused admission to Division One for the 1894–95 season and Clyde were promoted instead.[27] Hibs won the Division Two championship for a second time in 1894–95. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Boyces beard Posted September 16, 2021 Share Posted September 16, 2021 19 minutes ago, Locky said: Bored at work so I've just sifted through all the league tables in Scottish football history to find your answers. Apologies if I've made a mistake however. Only counting seasons in which we've been in the same division of course, there have been 108 seasons in which we've played in the same division. 107 in the top flight, and one season in the 2nd tier. As it stands, by my count, we lead the way 63-45. Quite interesting going through the years to see how it worked out. Despite Hearts being a Scottish Cup force in the late 1890's-early 1900's, Hibs finished above us for quite a few seasons in a row. During WW1, depsite our plight, we still managed to routinely finish above them. I didn't even realise til now as well that they were missing from the top flight for a few seasons during the 1930's. One startlng statistic though, is that if we fail to finish above them this season, that is a full decade since we finished above them in a top flight season. This must be put right this season as that's not acceptable what so ever. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Rudolf Posted September 16, 2021 Share Posted September 16, 2021 1 hour ago, Gimme an H... said: How many times have Hearts finished above Hibs in the league since Hibs were formed? Depends if you include Hibernians and the period Hibs ceased to exist. Their history is muddled but they have taken the Scottish Cup won by Hibernians. A completely different club. 🤣 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
JTJ Posted September 16, 2021 Share Posted September 16, 2021 22 minutes ago, Jambo61 said: Best stat........which team is the only team to win a lower league 2 years in a row? After being reformed, Hibs won the inaugural Division Two championship. Bizarrely (says who?), were refused admission to Division One for the 1894–95 season and Clyde were promoted instead.[27] Hibs won the Division Two championship for a second time in 1894–95. The original "Hibernians " had died when Celtic "stole" all their players in 1888 so there was no team in existence when the League started in 1891 - Hearts were the only non-Western team in the league then. A new team started up about 1892 (I read a Hibs book once!) but have nothing to do with the original team - in a local pub after training they were quized by the publican if they were anything to do with the "Irishmen" as he was due a wedge of money (along with many other local businesses). The new club replied "No, we are completely separate". They claim the 1887 Scottish Cup win but that really was a different team. When the Second Division started, Hibs joined BUT despite winning it, the Scottish League were wary about their finances so did not fully trust them - hence not promoting them. A further year later they were finally fely worthy of promotion. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Lord Beni of Gorgie Posted September 16, 2021 Share Posted September 16, 2021 With regard to not finishing above them in a top flight season in a decade, total anomaly. Why are we beating ourselves up, when we finished above them in the Championship and then they werent in the same league the following year. A very odd decade for various reasons Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Rudolf Posted September 16, 2021 Share Posted September 16, 2021 24 minutes ago, JTJ said: The original "Hibernians " had died when Celtic "stole" all their players in 1888 so there was no team in existence when the League started in 1891 - Hearts were the only non-Western team in the league then. A new team started up about 1892 (I read a Hibs book once!) but have nothing to do with the original team - in a local pub after training they were quized by the publican if they were anything to do with the "Irishmen" as he was due a wedge of money (along with many other local businesses). The new club replied "No, we are completely separate". They claim the 1887 Scottish Cup win but that really was a different team. When the Second Division started, Hibs joined BUT despite winning it, the Scottish League were wary about their finances so did not fully trust them - hence not promoting them. A further year later they were finally fely worthy of promotion. So all this ‘Since 1875’ mince is just that. Since 1892 has a much better ring to it. Even worse than Sevco. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Gorgie_Rules Posted September 16, 2021 Share Posted September 16, 2021 (edited) Not quite the same question but loosely related, we are 852 points better of than hibs in the all time premier league table. We have played 135 more games but thats mostly due to hibs being in lower league(s) more often. Points per game wise its us: 1.55, them: 1.38 https://www.worldfootball.net/alltime_table/sco-premiership/ Assuming we are both in the top flight, it would take hibs to finish 20 points ahead of us for the next 43 seasons to overtake us. Edited September 16, 2021 by Gorgie_Rules Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
db211833 Posted September 16, 2021 Share Posted September 16, 2021 6 minutes ago, Sir Gio said: With regard to not finishing above them in a top flight season in a decade, total anomaly. Why are we beating ourselves up, when we finished above them in the Championship and then they werent in the same league the following year. A very odd decade for various reasons Correct and throw in a points deduction in one of the seasons Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Saint Jambo Posted September 16, 2021 Share Posted September 16, 2021 50 minutes ago, Rudolf said: Depends if you include Hibernians and the period Hibs ceased to exist. Their history is muddled but they have taken the Scottish Cup won by Hibernians. A completely different club. 🤣 As the popular terrace chant of the late 19th, early 20th century went... "You let your club die, You let your club diiiiie, In 1891, you let your club die." Following the cup final in 1896 that chant was often followed up with... "It should have been five, It should have been fiiiive, You lucky hornswogglers, It should have been five." Both fell out of fashion sometime around WW1, but I'm always amazed how few people seen to be aware of the historic roots of today's football chants. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Silvery_Moon Posted September 16, 2021 Share Posted September 16, 2021 40 minutes ago, Sir Gio said: With regard to not finishing above them in a top flight season in a decade, total anomaly. Why are we beating ourselves up, when we finished above them in the Championship and then they werent in the same league the following year. A very odd decade for various reasons Following 2 years they were still down. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
sadj Posted September 16, 2021 Share Posted September 16, 2021 37 minutes ago, Gorgie_Rules said: Not quite the same question but loosely related, we are 852 points better of than hibs in the all time premier league table. We have played 135 more games but thats mostly due to hibs being in lower league(s) more often. Points per game wise its us: 1.55, them: 1.38 https://www.worldfootball.net/alltime_table/sco-premiership/ Assuming we are both in the top flight, it would take hibs to finish 20 points ahead of us for the next 43 seasons to overtake us. Love this 🤣🤣🤣 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
King prawn Posted September 16, 2021 Share Posted September 16, 2021 38 minutes ago, Gorgie_Rules said: Not quite the same question but loosely related, we are 852 points better of than hibs in the all time premier league table. We have played 135 more games but thats mostly due to hibs being in lower league(s) more often. Points per game wise its us: 1.55, them: 1.38 https://www.worldfootball.net/alltime_table/sco-premiership/ Assuming we are both in the top flight, it would take hibs to finish 20 points ahead of us for the next 43 seasons to overtake us. Superb Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
wentworth jambo Posted September 16, 2021 Share Posted September 16, 2021 35 minutes ago, Gorgie_Rules said: Not quite the same question but loosely related, we are 852 points better of than hibs in the all time premier league table. We have played 135 more games but thats mostly due to hibs being in lower league(s) more often. Points per game wise its us: 1.55, them: 1.38 https://www.worldfootball.net/alltime_table/sco-premiership/ Assuming we are both in the top flight, it would take hibs to finish 20 points ahead of us for the next 43 seasons to overtake us. That's a cracking table I hadn't seen before...also helps dispel the "flair" myth - despite only playing 135 less games than us in the top flight, their goal difference is 1194 worse, mainly because we've scored and averaged more goals than them over more games. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Heartsofgold Posted September 16, 2021 Share Posted September 16, 2021 To hell with the stats, we're good, they're shite. End of thread. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Lord Beni of Gorgie Posted September 16, 2021 Share Posted September 16, 2021 27 minutes ago, Silvery_Moon said: Following 2 years they were still down. Yip, not just the one, despite Rangers Hibsing it in the cup Hibs still Hibsed it in the League Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Lord Beni of Gorgie Posted September 16, 2021 Share Posted September 16, 2021 21 minutes ago, Heartsofgold said: To hell with the stats, we're good, they're shite. End of thread. The perfect summary Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Beni Posted September 16, 2021 Share Posted September 16, 2021 3 hours ago, Gorgie_Rules said: Not quite the same question but loosely related, we are 852 points better of than hibs in the all time premier league table. We have played 135 more games but thats mostly due to hibs being in lower league(s) more often. Points per game wise its us: 1.55, them: 1.38 https://www.worldfootball.net/alltime_table/sco-premiership/ Assuming we are both in the top flight, it would take hibs to finish 20 points ahead of us for the next 43 seasons to overtake us. In their entire history they've won only 9 games more than they've lost! Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Tazio Posted September 16, 2021 Share Posted September 16, 2021 Also in terms of derby results over a decade they’ve got the 1920’s and 1970’s. That's it. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
i8hibsh Posted September 16, 2021 Share Posted September 16, 2021 (edited) Stats start from 1892 when we competed for the first time in league form. Award given for the highest league placing between the 2 teams each year. Note as an example: Finishing 1st in the second tier when there were 12 teams in first is classed as 13th. Highest league placing 2021 Hibs 2020 Hibs 2019 Hibs 2018 Hibs 2017 Hearts 2016 Hearts 2015 Hearts 2014 Hibs 2013 Hibs 2012 Hearts 2011 Hearts 2010 Hibs 2009 Hearts 2008 Hibs 2007 Hearts 2006 Hearts 2005 Hibs 2004 Hearts 2003 Hearts 2002 Hearts 2001 Hibs 2000 Hearts 1999 Hearts 1998 Hearts 1997 Hearts 1996 Hearts 1995 Hibs 1994 Hibs 1993 Hearts 1992 Hearts 1991 Hearts 1990 Hearts 1989 Hibs 1988 Hearts 1987 Hearts 1986 Hearts 1985 Hearts 1984 Hearts 1983 Hibs 1982 Hibs 1981 Hearts 1980 Hibs 1979 Hibs 1978 Hibs 1977 Hibs 1976 Hibs 1975 Hibs 1974 Hibs 1973 Hibs 1972 Hibs 1971 Hearts 1970 Hibs 1969 Hearts 1968 Hibs 1967 Hibs 1966 Hibs 1965 Hearts 1964 Hearts 1963 Hearts 1962 Hearts 1961 Hearts 1960 Hearts 1959 Hearts 1958 Hearts 1957 Hearts 1956 Hearts 1955 Hearts 1954 Hearts 1953 Hibs 1952 Hibs 1951 Hibs 1950 Hibs 1949 Hibs 1948 Hibs 1947 Hibs 1946 1945 1944 1943 1942 1941 1940 1939 1938 Hearts 1937 Hearts 1936 Hearts 1935 Hearts 1934 Hearts 1933 Hearts 1932 Hearts 1931 Hearts 1930 Hearts 1929 Hearts 1928 Hearts 1927 Hibs 1926 Hearts 1925 Hibs 1924 Hibs 1923 Hibs 1922 Hibs 1921 Hearts 1920 Hearts 1919 Hearts 1918 Hearts 1917 Hearts 1916 Hearts 1915 Hearts 1914 Hearts 1913 Hearts 1912 Hearts 1911 Hibs 1910 Hibs 1909 Hibs 1908 Hibs 1907 Hearts 1906 Hearts 1905 Hibs 1904 Hearts 1903 Hibs 1902 Hearts 1901 Hibs 1900 Hibs 1899 Hearts 1898 Hibs 1897 Hearts 1896 Hibs 1895 Hearts 1894 Hearts 1893 Hearts 1892 Hearts Hearts 72 Hibs 50 Edited September 16, 2021 by i8hibsh Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
i8hibsh Posted September 16, 2021 Share Posted September 16, 2021 (edited) @Locky looks like you only included the seasons when we were both in the same top flight. My stats are more who was 'top dog' that season. So for example Hearts in 2016 as Hibs were in 2nd tier. Hibs in 1978 etc. Edited September 16, 2021 by i8hibsh Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Locky Posted September 16, 2021 Share Posted September 16, 2021 4 hours ago, i8hibsh said: @Locky looks like you only included the seasons when we were both in the same top flight. My stats are more who was 'top dog' that season. So for example Hearts in 2016 as Hibs were in 2nd tier. Hibs in 1978 etc. Yeah I just went for the years we played in the same division. Yours make even better reading. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Recommended Posts
Join the conversation
You can post now and register later. If you have an account, sign in now to post with your account.