sadj Posted September 9, 2021 Share Posted September 9, 2021 18 minutes ago, JamesM48 said: Absolutely Ludicrous really as you can get your passport one day then the next get covid ! Probes zilch . How can they not define a “ nightclub “ my conspiracy head is on with that one ! Probably end up staying pubs open after 11 will be classed as “ nightclubs” even if they only serve until 12 or 1. Which they do with licensing or at least did been out the nightclub game a few years. So not really sure why that would be a bad way to define it. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Ray Gin Posted September 9, 2021 Share Posted September 9, 2021 1 minute ago, Beni said: Yeah, but Germany had a mandatory smallpox vaccination program shortly before Hitler's rise to power. Yeah but the nazis then went on to murder the frail, handicapped and vulnerable rather than doing everything they can to protect their lives. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
JudyJudyJudy Posted September 9, 2021 Share Posted September 9, 2021 4 minutes ago, Boab said: I may sound like a broken record here as we have been over this, but they can’t introduce a passport that only covers some events and not others. That is the perfect definition of nonsensical ! No wonder certain businesses are scratching their heads. Either bring it in across the board or not at all. Don’t encourage the SG they will have it for going into shops next ! Seriously 😂 they are geting away with anything so why not . Might see old Doris waiting outside a shop , asking me to go into the shop to get her 20 lambert and butler as she hasn’t got the latest smart phone to uploaded passport Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
JudyJudyJudy Posted September 9, 2021 Share Posted September 9, 2021 1 minute ago, Ray Gin said: Yeah but the nazis then went on to murder the frail, handicapped and vulnerable rather than doing everything they can to protect their lives. Oh so there are some historical parallels then ? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
graygo Posted September 9, 2021 Share Posted September 9, 2021 7 minutes ago, Boab said: I may sound like a broken record here as we have been over this, but they can’t introduce a passport that only covers some events and not others. That is the perfect definition of nonsensical ! No wonder certain businesses are scratching their heads. Either bring it in across the board or not at all. Not sure what you mean Boab, what events aren't covered? I thought it was to do with numbers involved and whether indoors or outdoors. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
escobri Posted September 9, 2021 Share Posted September 9, 2021 3 minutes ago, Awbdy Oot said: Like I said in my earlier post if everyone in the crowd has been vaccinated then the chances of infecting someone and them becoming ill or worse is greatly reduced. It's either this or closure according to the SG. But the stewards won't have to be vaxxed. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Ron Burgundy Posted September 9, 2021 Share Posted September 9, 2021 6 minutes ago, Awbdy Oot said: Only 1/3 of people with Covid have no symptoms. 100% of smallpox sufferers had symptoms and around 30% died from it. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
JudyJudyJudy Posted September 9, 2021 Share Posted September 9, 2021 2 minutes ago, sadj said: Which they do with licensing or at least did been out the nightclub game a few years. So not really sure why that would be a bad way to define it. Well I would assume a nightclub is a place which has a licence until 3am ? If the other definition is enacted does that mean that you would need a passport to enter those premises at 7 in the evening or earlier . They are making a balls ⚽️ up of it Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Ray Gin Posted September 9, 2021 Share Posted September 9, 2021 1 minute ago, JamesM48 said: Oh so there are some historical parallels then ? Not really a parallel given that the nazis are pretty much the opposite of what we're doing. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
sadj Posted September 9, 2021 Share Posted September 9, 2021 11 minutes ago, JamesM48 said: Yes the vaccine passport only proves your vaccine status . It does not prove that at that moment in time you are covid free . So it’s a waste of time really Its not a waste of time if you know that if you go somewhere the chances of catching or transmitting it to someone else are vastly reduced (upward of 60%) Imagine taking your old man to the footie and someone is sat next to him whos unvaxxed and has covid. They then pass it to him and he (already in poor health) passes away from it. Thats god awful but a possibility. If you can limit that possibility go for it either that or make the vulnerable and weak stay away (as discussed the other day you know my thoughts on people taking that position) Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Ray Gin Posted September 9, 2021 Share Posted September 9, 2021 13 minutes ago, JamesM48 said: Yes the vaccine passport only proves your vaccine status . It does not prove that at that moment in time you are covid free . So it’s a waste of time really A vaccine test only proves at that moment in time you are covid free. Unless you take the test on the door of the event venue you are trying to enter it's a waste of time really. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
sadj Posted September 9, 2021 Share Posted September 9, 2021 4 minutes ago, escobri said: But the stewards won't have to be vaxxed. Says whom? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
graygo Posted September 9, 2021 Share Posted September 9, 2021 3 minutes ago, Ron Burgundy said: 100% of smallpox sufferers had symptoms and around 30% died from it. What's that got to do with what I posted? I was correcting you for saying "Most people with covid need to take a test to find out they have it." Which is simply not true. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
graygo Posted September 9, 2021 Share Posted September 9, 2021 5 minutes ago, escobri said: But the stewards won't have to be vaxxed. Strange one that, probably against some employment rules or something. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Boab Posted September 9, 2021 Share Posted September 9, 2021 Just now, Awbdy Oot said: Not sure what you mean Boab, what events aren't covered? I thought it was to do with numbers involved and whether indoors or outdoors. Any club with an all seated stadium, which is every club in the Premier, have to adhere to these passports…but only if there are more than 10K. A nonsense ! As I say, we covered this. St Mirren, for example, could have full houses ( 8K ) every other week and don’t have to conform. Us, with over 10K, have to put in place infrastructure to accommodate it. It’s plain daft ! Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
escobri Posted September 9, 2021 Share Posted September 9, 2021 Exemptions will apply for workers in venues/ at events. On gov website surprisingly. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
escobri Posted September 9, 2021 Share Posted September 9, 2021 https://www.gov.scot/publications/coronavirus-covid-19-mandatory-vaccine-certification/ Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Ron Burgundy Posted September 9, 2021 Share Posted September 9, 2021 1 minute ago, Awbdy Oot said: What's that got to do with what I posted? I was correcting you for saying "Most people with covid need to take a test to find out they have it." Which is simply not true. Cos you jumped into my reply where someone compared covid vaccine programme to the smallpox one. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
sadj Posted September 9, 2021 Share Posted September 9, 2021 4 minutes ago, JamesM48 said: Well I would assume a nightclub is a place which has a licence until 3am ? If the other definition is enacted does that mean that you would need a passport to enter those premises at 7 in the evening or earlier . They are making a balls ⚽️ up of it Not really how they work although it may have changed. For instance - A nightclub by our definition would be one open until say 3/4am however a council will have restrictions operating from say 10pm. So may say if you are open after 10pm you must have doorstaff on from 9pm until close. Its no different to that. You would assume they will try to do it in line with current guidelines. You have pubs which open from say 11am until 2am you have to draw a line somewhere and say ok prior to this time its up to you if you use passports. After that time its mandatory. It will be a lot harder to implement in a pub than at football grounds though. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
graygo Posted September 9, 2021 Share Posted September 9, 2021 2 minutes ago, Boab said: Any club with an all seated stadium, which is every club in the Premier, have to adhere to these passports…but only if there are more than 10K. A nonsense ! As I say, we covered this. St Mirren, for example, could have full houses ( 8K ) every other week and don’t have to conform. Us, with over 10K, have to put in place infrastructure to accommodate it. It’s plain daft ! Ah right, yes I would agree with that. I get the fact that the more people in a venue the more the risk but sometimes it looks like they just pluck out a random number and go with it. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
sadj Posted September 9, 2021 Share Posted September 9, 2021 4 minutes ago, Boab said: Any club with an all seated stadium, which is every club in the Premier, have to adhere to these passports…but only if there are more than 10K. A nonsense ! As I say, we covered this. St Mirren, for example, could have full houses ( 8K ) every other week and don’t have to conform. Us, with over 10K, have to put in place infrastructure to accommodate it. It’s plain daft ! Im not going through this again but seriously how difficult do you think putting infrastructure in would be? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
sadj Posted September 9, 2021 Share Posted September 9, 2021 Just now, Awbdy Oot said: Ah right, yes I would agree with that. I get the fact that the more people in a venue the more the risk but sometimes it looks like they just pluck out a random number and go with it. Could be a financial decision mot so much for clubs but say a festival that may have 9k attend could be on a profit margin of tiny amounts. A festival over 10k could prob absorb the little bit required to implement any extra staff required. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
JudyJudyJudy Posted September 9, 2021 Share Posted September 9, 2021 8 minutes ago, sadj said: Its not a waste of time if you know that if you go somewhere the chances of catching or transmitting it to someone else are vastly reduced (upward of 60%) Imagine taking your old man to the footie and someone is sat next to him whos unvaxxed and has covid. They then pass it to him and he (already in poor health) passes away from it. Thats god awful but a possibility. If you can limit that possibility go for it either that or make the vulnerable and weak stay away (as discussed the other day you know my thoughts on people taking that position) I’ll probably struggle taking “my old man “ to the game post covid . He’s long gone . However probably would be classed as still vulnerable to covid ! Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Boab Posted September 9, 2021 Share Posted September 9, 2021 Just now, Awbdy Oot said: Ah right, yes I would agree with that. I get the fact that the more people in a venue the more the risk but sometimes it looks like they just pluck out a random number and go with it. Exactly. If it is required,aye, bring them in but don’t confuse things. Another example is an outdoor setting with less than 4K. No passports required. There are actually events coming up that will have maybe 2K+ coming up. Less risk at that than one with 4 ? I’d love just politician to stand up today and query the logic in the person who came up with these figures. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
sadj Posted September 9, 2021 Share Posted September 9, 2021 Just now, JamesM48 said: I’ll probably struggle taking “my old man “ to the game post covid . He’s long gone . However probably would be classed as still vulnerable to covid ! Theres times i want to throttle you 🤣 you know what i meant ya ****er 🤣 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Boab Posted September 9, 2021 Share Posted September 9, 2021 4 minutes ago, sadj said: Im not going through this again but seriously how difficult do you think putting infrastructure in would be? Not the point I’m making, mate. Probably quite easy as you have previously said. It’s the numbers nonsense which doesn’t make any sense. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
graygo Posted September 9, 2021 Share Posted September 9, 2021 7 minutes ago, Ron Burgundy said: Cos you jumped into my reply where someone compared covid vaccine programme to the smallpox one. I corrected a false statement you made, anything else you said is immaterial. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
JudyJudyJudy Posted September 9, 2021 Share Posted September 9, 2021 11 minutes ago, sadj said: Says whom? It’s online somewhere 8 minutes ago, jonesy said: So unvaxxed folk who will no longer be able to attend Tynie as a fan (like my Uncle) can just get a job as stewards at Tynie. Job's a good 'un. I know same with a few I know . 7 minutes ago, sadj said: Not really how they work although it may have changed. For instance - A nightclub by our definition would be one open until say 3/4am however a council will have restrictions operating from say 10pm. So may say if you are open after 10pm you must have doorstaff on from 9pm until close. Its no different to that. You would assume they will try to do it in line with current guidelines. You have pubs which open from say 11am until 2am you have to draw a line somewhere and say ok prior to this time its up to you if you use passports. After that time its mandatory. It will be a lot harder to implement in a pub than at football grounds though. So we might have a scenario that your in the pub all day then around 10 pm burly Stuart and burly Karen March around “ papers please “ ! Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
JudyJudyJudy Posted September 9, 2021 Share Posted September 9, 2021 3 minutes ago, sadj said: Theres times i want to throttle you 🤣 you know what i meant ya ****er 🤣 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Ron Burgundy Posted September 9, 2021 Share Posted September 9, 2021 Just now, Awbdy Oot said: I corrected a false statement you made, anything else you said is immaterial. I don't think it is incorrect. I think I am right. Now toddle off and come back with a link or STFU. I'm just kidding, I couldn't give a shit. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
graygo Posted September 9, 2021 Share Posted September 9, 2021 7 minutes ago, sadj said: Could be a financial decision mot so much for clubs but say a festival that may have 9k attend could be on a profit margin of tiny amounts. A festival over 10k could prob absorb the little bit required to implement any extra staff required. I'm sure you're right about them being able to afford the extra costs involved, I'm not sure that that would be part of the SG's logic though. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
sadj Posted September 9, 2021 Share Posted September 9, 2021 1 minute ago, Boab said: Not the point I’m making, mate. Probably quite easy as you have previously said. It’s the numbers nonsense which doesn’t make any sense. Fair enough , possibly taking guidance on the financial aspect amd saying ok anything under x number has financial implications. Maybe there is science that says large events transmission is increased when over x number are there (goes against everything so far so i doubt that one) Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
JudyJudyJudy Posted September 9, 2021 Share Posted September 9, 2021 1 minute ago, sadj said: Fair enough , possibly taking guidance on the financial aspect amd saying ok anything under x number has financial implications. Maybe there is science that says large events transmission is increased when over x number are there (goes against everything so far so i doubt that one) The thing is football is an outdoor event where transmission is greatly reduced ! Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
sadj Posted September 9, 2021 Share Posted September 9, 2021 2 minutes ago, JamesM48 said: It’s online somewhere I know same with a few I know . So we might have a scenario that your in the pub all day then around 10 pm burly Stuart and burly Karen March around “ papers please “ ! Possibly weve had that with IDs for years though so its not much different. Poor Karen though calling her burly….. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
sadj Posted September 9, 2021 Share Posted September 9, 2021 Just now, JamesM48 said: The thing is football is an outdoor event where transmission is greatly reduced ! Therein highlights a big problem , what is the correct info. Although at football you are also sat next to others in queues with others for toilets food , entering and exiting the ground so 🤷🏻♂️ Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Taffin Posted September 9, 2021 Share Posted September 9, 2021 (edited) 33 minutes ago, Awbdy Oot said: Only 1/3 of people with Covid have no symptoms. The vaccines can't work very well then can they as it was also 1/3 before they even existed. So they've made zero improvement on keeping people symptom free. Interesting Edited September 9, 2021 by Taffin Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Boab Posted September 9, 2021 Share Posted September 9, 2021 Just now, sadj said: Fair enough , possibly taking guidance on the financial aspect amd saying ok anything under x number has financial implications. Maybe there is science that says large events transmission is increased when over x number are there (goes against everything so far so i doubt that one) The figures are going up. Just look at what red has just put up on the c19 thread. They have realised they have to something, fair enough. The virus doesn’t care if there are 9K or 10K in the ground. It will do what it does. Either bring it in for events across the board or don’t. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
graygo Posted September 9, 2021 Share Posted September 9, 2021 2 minutes ago, Ron Burgundy said: I don't think it is incorrect. I think I am right. Now toddle off and come back with a link or STFU. I'm just kidding, I couldn't give a shit. I'm not going to pretend, I do give a shit. (a sentence where the punctuation is important) 😄 https://www.nhs.uk/conditions/coronavirus-covid-19/testing/get-tested-for-coronavirus/ Regular tests if you do not have symptoms Anyone can now get regular rapid lateral flow tests without having symptoms. About 1 in 3 people with COVID-19 do not have symptoms but can still infect others. You should do a rapid test twice a week (every 3 to 4 days) to check if you have the virus. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
graygo Posted September 9, 2021 Share Posted September 9, 2021 3 minutes ago, JamesM48 said: The thing is football is an outdoor event where transmission is greatly reduced ! I've never seen any numbers linking cases to the return to games and I'm pretty sure we would hear if it was substantial. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Ron Burgundy Posted September 9, 2021 Share Posted September 9, 2021 1 minute ago, Awbdy Oot said: I'm not going to pretend, I do give a shit. (a sentence where the punctuation is important) 😄 https://www.nhs.uk/conditions/coronavirus-covid-19/testing/get-tested-for-coronavirus/ Regular tests if you do not have symptoms Anyone can now get regular rapid lateral flow tests without having symptoms. About 1 in 3 people with COVID-19 do not have symptoms but can still infect others. You should do a rapid test twice a week (every 3 to 4 days) to check if you have the virus. Government propaganda. I want an independent link. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
graygo Posted September 9, 2021 Share Posted September 9, 2021 3 minutes ago, Taffin said: The vaccines can't work very well then can they are is was also 1/3 before they even existed. So they've made zero improvement on keeping people symptom free. Interesting Made up figures here but ----- Pre vaccine, 1,000,000 have Covid, 300,000 have symptoms. After vaccine, 100,000 have Covid, 30,000 have symptoms. "The vaccines can't work very well then can they are is was also 1/3 before they even existed." ©Taffin Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Taffin Posted September 9, 2021 Share Posted September 9, 2021 Just now, Awbdy Oot said: Made up figures here but ----- Pre vaccine, 1,000,000 have Covid, 300,000 have symptoms. After vaccine, 100,000 have Covid, 30,000 have symptoms. "The vaccines can't work very well then can they are is was also 1/3 before they even existed." ©Taffin One third of those who contracted covid were asymptomatic prior to the release of the vaccine. You've just said it's still 1/3. So it's not had an effect on the ratio of asymptomatic infections has it? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
graygo Posted September 9, 2021 Share Posted September 9, 2021 6 minutes ago, Boab said: The figures are going up. Just look at what red has just put up on the c19 thread. They have realised they have to something, fair enough. The virus doesn’t care if there are 9K or 10K in the ground. It will do what it does. Either bring it in for events across the board or don’t. Boab I think the choice was to make up a figure or shut it down completely. Having it in place across the board would, as sadj says have placed a huge financial burden on lots of places. How they get to the numbers is another matter. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
graygo Posted September 9, 2021 Share Posted September 9, 2021 Just now, Taffin said: One third of those who contracted covid were asymptomatic prior to the release of the vaccine. You've just said it's still 1/3. So it's not had an effect on the ratio of asymptomatic infections has it? And that justifies saying that the vaccines can't work very well? Aye ok then. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
graygo Posted September 9, 2021 Share Posted September 9, 2021 (edited) 9 minutes ago, Taffin said: One third of those who contracted covid were asymptomatic prior to the release of the vaccine. You've just said it's still 1/3. So it's not had an effect on the ratio of asymptomatic infections has it? I got that wrong. Edited September 9, 2021 by Awbdy Oot Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Nucky Thompson Posted September 9, 2021 Share Posted September 9, 2021 6 minutes ago, Awbdy Oot said: I'm not going to pretend, I do give a shit. (a sentence where the punctuation is important) 😄 https://www.nhs.uk/conditions/coronavirus-covid-19/testing/get-tested-for-coronavirus/ Regular tests if you do not have symptoms Anyone can now get regular rapid lateral flow tests without having symptoms. About 1 in 3 people with COVID-19 do not have symptoms but can still infect others. You should do a rapid test twice a week (every 3 to 4 days) to check if you have the virus. 1 in 3 won't have any symptoms at all, but there is a large number who have symptoms so minor that they won't realise that they have Covid Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Jambof3tornado Posted September 9, 2021 Share Posted September 9, 2021 28 minutes ago, jonesy said: Settings The scheme will apply only in the following higher risk settings. nightclubs and analogous venues sexual entertainment venues live events: indoors unseated 500+ in the audience live events: outdoors unseated 4,000+ in the audience all events: 10,000+ in the audience What if I find watching league 2 football highly arousing? Watching Rudi's left peg always gave me a boner!! Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Taffin Posted September 9, 2021 Share Posted September 9, 2021 1 minute ago, Awbdy Oot said: And that justifies saying that the vaccines can't work very well? Aye ok then. Well a vaccine designed to reduce people's symptoms but hasn't moved the dial on the ratio of those who catch asymptomatically doesn't sounds like it works very well. Alternatively you're wrong and it's moved that dial and is no longer 1 in 3. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
JudyJudyJudy Posted September 9, 2021 Share Posted September 9, 2021 17 minutes ago, sadj said: Possibly weve had that with IDs for years though so its not much different. Poor Karen though calling her burly….. Lol I know a burly Karen who is security , hope she is reading this 😂 12 minutes ago, Awbdy Oot said: I've never seen any numbers linking cases to the return to games and I'm pretty sure we would hear if it was substantial. Neither have i Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Taffin Posted September 9, 2021 Share Posted September 9, 2021 4 minutes ago, Awbdy Oot said: You need to look up the meaning of asymptomatic. Why is that? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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