*** Scotland Euro 2020 (2021) Thread ( merged) ***

[Cruyff]

2 hours ago, Malinga the Swinga said:

He hasn't turned us around. We have won one competitive game out of our last 8 in 90 minutes, drawn 4 and lost 3. Two wins on penalties are papering over cracks.

We have better players being held back by managers insistence on playing his favourites, even when they're shit.

I think you're being a bit harsh. We were getting stuffed by Kazakhstan before Clarke came in and players like Lewis Stevenson and Dylan McGeough were receiving caps.

 

Since then we have competed well against the likes of Serbia, Austria, the Czechs and the Netherlands who are decent sides. I'd suggest that's a fair change over a short period of time in International Football terms. 

 

Nevertheless, I agree with you and Kingantti and others who suggest we should be kicking on a bit from just competing well to actually beating these teams. That can only happen if he's a bit more ballsy and he picks the best attacking players available to him. 

 

It may well be that he has taken us to the limit of his coaching abilities. 

[Doc Rob]

1 hour ago, Cruyff said:

I think you're being a bit harsh. We were getting stuffed by Kazakhstan before Clarke came in and players like Lewis Stevenson and Dylan McGeough were receiving caps.

 

Since then we have competed well against the likes of Serbia, Austria, the Czechs and the Netherlands who are decent sides. I'd suggest that's a fair change over a short period of time in International Football terms. 

 

Nevertheless, I agree with you and Kingantti and others who suggest we should be kicking on a bit from just competing well to actually beating these teams. That can only happen if he's a bit more ballsy and he picks the best attacking players available to him. 

 

It may well be that he has taken us to the limit of his coaching abilities. 

The problem is that the Scotland job is no longer a prestigious appointment. Nobody wants it. Clarke was easily the best we could attract at the time.

 

It’s depressing the hell out of me that Wales can win games at this level and for some reason we can’t. Aside from Bale and Ramsey they are no better than we are, quite probably worse in fact. But Wales know what their best team is. Clarke clearly doesn’t, given he started Dykes ahead of Adams and the keeper struggling for form. You only get three group games, and if you lose the first then you are gazing elimination in the face. Loyalty to the players who got you there is a luxury we simply couldn’t afford.

 

I’m praying we can get a point v England. If we do, we’re still in it and it’s all to play for v Croatia. I don’t want to be slinking home in disgrace after two straight losses.

[Jambo92]

23 minutes ago, Doc Rob said:

The problem is that the Scotland job is no longer a prestigious appointment. Nobody wants it. Clarke was easily the best we could attract at the time.

 

It’s depressing the hell out of me that Wales can win games at this level and for some reason we can’t. Aside from Bale and Ramsey they are no better than we are, quite probably worse in fact. But Wales know what their best team is. Clarke clearly doesn’t, given he started Dykes ahead of Adams and the keeper struggling for form. You only get three group games, and if you lose the first then you are gazing elimination in the face. Loyalty to the players who got you there is a luxury we simply couldn’t afford.

 

I’m praying we can get a point v England. If we do, we’re still in it and it’s all to play for v Croatia. I don’t want to be slinking home in disgrace after two straight losses.

 

Too much money in club football now for international jobs to be sought after, even saw it in Scotland ironically when Walter Smith jumped ship to go to Ibrox.

 

Agree with all your points, Wales seem to play to the strengths of their star players. We seem to chop and change every international window how we are going to line up.

[Horatio Caine]

Well, I don't know what to think going in to this match.  It has the potential to be a horror show, but sometimes, surprises do happen.

 

However - one thing I'm sure of is that there's far too much hype around this team.  The media should be taking a much lower profile approach and let the team play their game without the pressure of expectation.  And for God's sake let's get rid of the feckin' `Yes Sir I can boogie` - if I hear it once more I'll be .....very cross.

[Fozzyonthefence]

5 hours ago, Taffin said:

Maybe controversial but is Clarke actually a good manager?

 

We've got the best individuals for a long time and across the pitch I'd say we're every bit as good as a Wales for example yet they'll get out their group against similar level teams despite having an interim manager. I can't help but feel that rather than overachieving to qualify were actually underachieving given the quality we've got available and often choose not to use.

This is maybe the best squad we have had in a few years but it’s still the weakest one we’ve ever taken to a World Cup or Euros finals.

 

Wales have 2 world class attacking midfielders - a position that can decide outcomes of games.   If we have 2 world class players they’re both left backs, with one playing as a centre back - it’s much harder to influence games in terms of scoring goals from these positions.  Ironically, midfield is undoubtedly our strongest area (mainly because we’re pish up front and at the back) yet it’s not in the same class as the Welsh midfield.

[Maroon Sailor]

11 hours ago, Doc Rob said:

The problem is that the Scotland job is no longer a prestigious appointment. Nobody wants it. Clarke was easily the best we could attract at the time.

 

It’s depressing the hell out of me that Wales can win games at this level and for some reason we can’t. Aside from Bale and Ramsey they are no better than we are, quite probably worse in fact. But Wales know what their best team is. Clarke clearly doesn’t, given he started Dykes ahead of Adams and the keeper struggling for form. You only get three group games, and if you lose the first then you are gazing elimination in the face. Loyalty to the players who got you there is a luxury we simply couldn’t afford.

 

I’m praying we can get a point v England. If we do, we’re still in it and it’s all to play for v Croatia. I don’t want to be slinking home in disgrace after two straight losses.

 

It's annoying - just to get to a knock out match would be great.

 

It would end in glorious failure or heartache but at least the monkey would be off.

[Maroon Sailor]

Roy Keane sums it up. Scotland have quality players but in the wrong areas of the pitch.

 

To quote a phrase - no kid growing up wants to be a Gary Neville

 

 

Edited June 17, 2021 by Maroon Sailor

[jbee647]

And to think two of our group games will be at Hampden, truth is we are the poorest team in the tournament.

I predict by next Tuesday we will demanding a rethink and another master plan from the SFA (version # 10)

Wales will qualify from the group stage again, as Northern Ireland did in the last Euros, Scotland have never ever got out the group stages at any tournament we have qualified for. 
We convince ourselves we are a big football nation, truth is we are only slightly better than San Marino and the Faroe Islands

 

 

 

 

[Debut 4]

As an aside and touching on the past managers who didn’t focus on the future and give younger players a chance, there’s a piece in the papers today about the Euro 96 Auld Enemy game.

 

8 of the Scots starting 11 were aged 30 or over.  In comparison, England had 3. 

[JudyJudyJudy]

Saw on the news the tartan army in full force down in London . Hope they have a good time , but that hasn’t prevented England’s number one party pooper Khan to basically say your not welcome down here .  Absolute cretin 

[Spellczech]

16 hours ago, Cruyff said:

I think you're being a bit harsh. We were getting stuffed by Kazakhstan before Clarke came in and players like Lewis Stevenson and Dylan McGeough were receiving caps.

 

Since then we have competed well against the likes of Serbia, Austria, the Czechs and the Netherlands who are decent sides. I'd suggest that's a fair change over a short period of time in International Football terms. 

 

Nevertheless, I agree with you and Kingantti and others who suggest we should be kicking on a bit from just competing well to actually beating these teams. That can only happen if he's a bit more ballsy and he picks the best attacking players available to him. 

 

It may well be that he has taken us to the limit of his coaching abilities. 

You know, I'm starting to think ex-midfielders make the best coaches. Defenders are naturally defensive and strikers are naturally gung-ho. I know this is a gross generalisation but there is a pattern there I reckon... I see the pattern in punditry too.

Edited June 17, 2021 by Spellczech

[August Landmesser]

29 minutes ago, JamesM48 said:

Saw on the news the tartan army in full force down in London . Hope they have a good time , but that hasn’t prevented England’s number one party pooper Khan to basically say your not welcome down here .  Absolute cretin 

of course they're not welcome - travelling without tickets in the middle of a pandemic, and after multiple warnings not to travel unless you have tickets, is utterly daft.

[JudyJudyJudy]

1 minute ago, August Landmesser said:

of course they're not welcome - travelling without tickets in the middle of a pandemic, and after multiple warnings not to travel unless you have tickets, is utterly daft.

“ middle of a pandemic “ 4 deaths in the whole of U.K. yesterday from CV ? Get a grip 

[Boab]

40 minutes ago, JamesM48 said:

“ middle of a pandemic “ 4 deaths in the whole of U.K. yesterday from CV ? Get a grip 

Think there is more football related reasons for this actually.

Anyone can travel to London right now. So, in theory, thousands of Scots could go there for a weekend.

Maybe worried it might kick off but using C19 as a cover ?

[Heres Rixxy]

On the Welsh comparison, they have Bale, Ramsey and James who are streets ahead of anyone we have in an attacking position.

 

Defence and strikers is probably even. We've got a couple of better players, but also starting O'Donnell and Hanley...

[Tasavallan]

12 minutes ago, BarneyBattles said:

 

Tend to agree. Anyone would have turned us around to a certain extent now we have McTominay, Adams, Robertson, Tierney, McGinn, Robertson all playing well in the EPL. But he should have been braver in his team selection against the Czechs.

 

We just need to keep the players coming through and we'll hopefully start to qualify regularly again. 

My only difference would be to drop O'Donnell and play Gilmour.  Oh! and Gordon in goals for Insane Bolt.

Edited June 17, 2021 by Tasavallan

[JudyJudyJudy]

2 hours ago, Boab said:

Think there is more football related reasons for this actually.

Anyone can travel to London right now. So, in theory, thousands of Scots could go there for a weekend.

Maybe worried it might kick off but using C19 as a cover ?

Exactly . 

[Doc Rob]

2 hours ago, jonnothejambo said:

 

Aye. Sitting on their arses on the Judy Dench.

 

If O'Donnell plays tomorrow it could be carnage....

O’Donnell isn’t a bad defender. He’s a limited player who offers nothing going forward.

It’s like when we were so short of centre backs that we picked Considine. Nobody would say the guy is a class act, but he actually strengthened the defence, because he’s a centre back who has a career’s worth of being a centre back, knows how to be a centre back and doesn’t pretend to be anything else.

[south morocco]

Hopefully see Adams, Forrest and Gilmour involved tomorrow night. Nothing really to lose now. If we sit in they’ll destroy us anyway so hopefully we have a go at them

[Kiwidoug]

As I asked before the first game, what do people think the odds are of Gordon playing?  Surely they must have shortened. 

[Riccarton3]

1 hour ago, south morocco said:

Hopefully see Adams, Forrest and Gilmour involved tomorrow night. Nothing really to lose now. If we sit in they’ll destroy us anyway so hopefully we have a go at them

Agree with those 3. Don't you think though Clarke will park the bus? Also, anyone worked out the likelihood of going through with 3 points

[milky_26]

7 minutes ago, Riccarton3 said:

Agree with those 3. Don't you think though Clarke will park the bus? Also, anyone worked out the likelihood of going through with 3 points

realistically i think we would need to have a GD around 0 maybe survive if it was -1 so a thumping tomorrow would mean we need to beat croatia by a big margin.

 

That is unless croatia beat the czechs and we do enough to have a better GD than both czechs and croatia we would finish 2nd

[stirlo]

9 hours ago, Maroon Sailor said:

Roy Keane sums it up. Scotland have quality players but in the wrong areas of the pitch.

 

To quote a phrase - no kid growing up wants to be a Gary Neville

 

 

The hard reality is that over the last 30 years we've really struggled to produce top quality attacking players. McCoist and McFadden were both good but not top drawer. Adams and Dykes are actually the best strikers we've had in a good while but they're hardly world class. 

[south morocco]

10 minutes ago, Riccarton3 said:

Agree with those 3. Don't you think though Clarke will park the bus? Also, anyone worked out the likelihood of going through with 3 points

Not sure he’ll PTB completely. I do hope he has a go from the off but not sure he will

[Sooperstar]

59 minutes ago, Riccarton3 said:

Agree with those 3. Don't you think though Clarke will park the bus? Also, anyone worked out the likelihood of going through with 3 points

Looking at the other groups I think 4 points will be needed. If 3 was somehow enough then a GD of 0 or above would be required. We need 4 points to have any chance. We'll probably get none.

[Italian Lambretta]

6 hours ago, August Landmesser said:

of course they're not welcome - travelling without tickets in the middle of a pandemic, and after multiple warnings not to travel unless you have tickets, is utterly daft.

The Indian virus will be rife in Scotland when they all return from their Jolly but Wee Krankie will sweep it under the carpet. 

 

 

[Maroon Sailor]

4 minutes ago, Sooperstar said:

Looking at the other groups I think 4 points will be needed. If 3 was somehow enough then a GD of 0 or above would be required. We need 4 points to have any chance. We'll probably get none.

 

3 points and out of goals scored knowing how it goes for Scotland

[Riccarton3]

The obsession about that 96 game is extraordinary. I realise it was a derby but ffs talk about milking something dry. I guess that is what happens when u win **** all

[TyphoonJambo]

2 minutes ago, Riccarton3 said:

The obsession about that 96 game is extraordinary. I realise it was a derby but ffs talk about milking something dry. I guess that is what happens when u win **** all

For the record,one of the best days of my life. Travelled from Cardiff, carry out bigger than me,great atmosphere at Wembley but massive,scary run back to the train. Then a brilliant night in Wales.

[Boab]

1 hour ago, Barack said:

Anyone put money on England...?

Looking at it but not sure yet.

Correct score odds show you all you need to know. More or less the same odds for England winning 6-0 as Scotland winning 2-0.

 

Bet with your head. 
2-0 England, 4/1. Will pay for my beer if it comes in.

[Newton51]

Wonder when Craig Gordon returns as sure will have a break post euros. Maybe Stewart on goals for the league cup 

[Boab]

1 minute ago, Barack said:

I did, as it goes. England -1. Won't make me a millionaire, but pays for a pizza & some refreshments if it comes in.

 

Would ultimately like to be proved wrong. But I think I'll be enjoying my Friday night, courtesy of SkyBet's generosity. 

Yip. If we’re to be pumped, it might as well be free !

[Riccarton3]

13 minutes ago, TypoonJambo said:

For the record,one of the best days of my life. Travelled from Cardiff, carry out bigger than me,great atmosphere at Wembley but massive,scary run back to the train. Then a brilliant night in Wales.

Nice one. No issue with Scotland's part. England SHOULD win. It just tells you how little achieved if this is still the main highlight. I'd be playing it down by now

[All roads lead to Gorgie]

A mate of mine said to me after the Czech match to put money on us going out the competition with zero points and no goals scored. That would be the ultimate humiliation, worse than anything we have been subjected to before, please don't let that happen Scotland! 

[Kiwidoug]

We'll get tore in.  3-1 Scotland.  Nae Bother.

[portobellojambo1]

Someone above said they are hoping we can get a draw at Wembley and then leave it to the last game as a shoot out against Croatia. My main worry with that is that if we go into the game hoping to get no more than a point then the tendency will be to once again sacrifice two strikers, play no one wide on the right and be totally depending on Andy Robertson providing any ammunition for goals. And in the opening game only Sterling really functioned up front for them, and if we sit off and defend, hoping for a draw, chances are the likes of Foden and Kane will also shine in this game. Defending for a draw that turns into a loss and we are effectively out of the competition. I'd much prefer to see us approach these two games taking an approach that we are already out, and need to play our way back into things by looking to win both the remaining games. If we are going to go out it is better to do so while trying to stay in, rather than just surrendering timidly. Scoring more goals than the opposition will win both games, line up looking to win both rather than line up trying not to lose one of them and then hoping to win the other.

[Unknown user]

1 hour ago, portobellojambo1 said:

Someone above said they are hoping we can get a draw at Wembley and then leave it to the last game as a shoot out against Croatia. My main worry with that is that if we go into the game hoping to get no more than a point then the tendency will be to once again sacrifice two strikers, play no one wide on the right and be totally depending on Andy Robertson providing any ammunition for goals. And in the opening game only Sterling really functioned up front for them, and if we sit off and defend, hoping for a draw, chances are the likes of Foden and Kane will also shine in this game. Defending for a draw that turns into a loss and we are effectively out of the competition. I'd much prefer to see us approach these two games taking an approach that we are already out, and need to play our way back into things by looking to win both the remaining games. If we are going to go out it is better to do so while trying to stay in, rather than just surrendering timidly. Scoring more goals than the opposition will win both games, line up looking to win both rather than line up trying not to lose one of them and then hoping to win the other.

I hope we humiliate them with Gordon scoring a hat trick

[ri Alban]

Who's the guy playing left back for England? If we played Patterson or Forrest, we can get some reward down the right. Play O'Donnell, forget it. 

Hopefully Robertson and Tierney have some fun tonight and Adams scores a few. 

 

C'mon Scotland. Intae this mob. 

[ri Alban]

Will Marshall be in goal or Midfield? 

[Uncle Buck]

52 minutes ago, ri Alban said:

Who's the guy playing left back for England? If we played Patterson or Forrest, we can get some reward down the right. Play O'Donnell, forget it. 

Hopefully Robertson and Tierney have some fun tonight and Adams scores a few. 

 

C'mon Scotland. Intae this mob. 

It was Trippier in the first game but imagine it’ll be Shaw or Chilwell this time around.

[ri Alban]

Just now, Uncle Buck said:

It was Trippier in the first game but imagine it’ll be Shaw or Chilwell this time around.

👍 Cheers. 

 

Is Walker still a good player? Can our 2 left wingbacks cause him sleepless nights. 

I'm hoping Sterling and Maguire play, and Kane doesn't. 

[Kiwidoug]

32 minutes ago, ri Alban said:

Will Marshall be in goal or Midfield? 

😂

 

That's actually why I don't think he can play.  Over here, while I'm sure the sports media had sympathy for him, he was basically treated as a figure of fun.  Even a minor blunder would turn him and Scotland into a fair target for ridicule.

 

Tough maybe but life is tough.

[Taffin]

39 minutes ago, ri Alban said:

👍 Cheers. 

 

Is Walker still a good player? Can our 2 left wingbacks cause him sleepless nights. 

I'm hoping Sterling and Maguire play, and Kane doesn't. 

 

He is a good player but he's also where I think we could get some joy. He's more than capable of a cock up and poor positioning. 

 

I wouldn't be shocked to see a change at right back for them tonight to combat our only real threat.

 

[ri Alban]

👍

[ri Alban]

BBC breakfast :Have you a message for the Scotland team!? "

Young Team" GET FECKING INTAE THIM"

 

You would ask. 

Edited June 18, 2021 by ri Alban

[portobellojambo1]

8 hours ago, Smithee said:

I hope we humiliate them with Gordon scoring a hat trick

I'm not discounting a Scotland win, but I think looking for a Craig Gordon hat trick is maybe stretching things a wee bit too far

[Unknown user]

Just now, portobellojambo1 said:

I'm not discounting a Scotland win, but I think looking for a Craig Gordon hat trick is maybe stretching things a wee bit too far

Diving headers, each more spectacular than the last

[milky_26]

23 minutes ago, portobellojambo1 said:

I'm not discounting a Scotland win, but I think looking for a Craig Gordon hat trick is maybe stretching things a wee bit too far

yep a brace at most

[milky_26]

9 hours ago, portobellojambo1 said:

Someone above said they are hoping we can get a draw at Wembley and then leave it to the last game as a shoot out against Croatia. My main worry with that is that if we go into the game hoping to get no more than a point then the tendency will be to once again sacrifice two strikers, play no one wide on the right and be totally depending on Andy Robertson providing any ammunition for goals. And in the opening game only Sterling really functioned up front for them, and if we sit off and defend, hoping for a draw, chances are the likes of Foden and Kane will also shine in this game. Defending for a draw that turns into a loss and we are effectively out of the competition. I'd much prefer to see us approach these two games taking an approach that we are already out, and need to play our way back into things by looking to win both the remaining games. If we are going to go out it is better to do so while trying to stay in, rather than just surrendering timidly. Scoring more goals than the opposition will win both games, line up looking to win both rather than line up trying not to lose one of them and then hoping to win the other.

my worry is we will get a result today (draw or win) then mess it up v croatia

[Dazo]

8 minutes ago, milky_26 said:

my worry is we will get a result today (draw or win) then mess it up v croatia

More of a certainty than a worry when it involves Scotland. Saying that can’t see us getting anything tonight.