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Scotland's Hate Crime Bill, March 2021


Zlatanable

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Zlatanable

I had a look if this issue had a thread of it's own already, I don't think it has had. Apologies if I am wrong. 

 

https://www.bbc.co.uk/news/uk-scotland-scotland-politics-56341882

 

The vote was due on Wed 10/3/21, but the parliamentary debate about it, has caused the vote to probably occur on Thursday 11/3/21.

 

It seems like an appropriate subject to have a thread about. 

 

Does it seem like a healthy thing? How might it affect you, maybe on here? 

Edited by Zlatanable
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JackLadd

Dear horrible Scottish white men, just don't mention or joke about race, sexuality, religion or difference of any kind in any way or we'll have you cancelled and locked up.  Love Nicola. Xx.

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Zlatanable
Posted (edited)
14 minutes ago, No Idle Talk said:

It is the absolute opposite of a healthy thing. 

It seems a bit like the Named Person Act situation to me.

At it's heart, it comes from a good place. But for reasons, it is allowed to grow and exist as a monstrously stupid and inept thing, that can't possibly become a law.  

I cannot imagine The SNP will actually put this into law. 

Edited by Zlatanable
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Zlatanable
Posted (edited)
6 minutes ago, Governor Tarkin said:

We need more hate crimes imo.

You seemed at your happiest when the Alderaan incident occurred.  

Edited by Zlatanable
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Governor Tarkin
9 minutes ago, Zlatanable said:

You seemed at your happiest when the Alderaan incident occurred.  

 

What are you meant to do? 🤷‍♂️

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ri Alban

Like most laws. If you don't break them, you'll be fine. 

 

 

 

Is there a get out clause for hating political parties. :yadayada:

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Seymour M Hersh

It's a dangerous piece of legislation from an utterly useless and dangerous politician. 

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Lord BJ

 

5 hours ago, Governor Tarkin said:

We need more hate crimes imo.


Can someone let me know what abuse I’m allowed to shout at the OF fans, hibs, Robbie Neilson, Steven Naismith Ann Budge and any referee? 

 

Just want to make sure my diatribes are within permitted bounds of abuse. 
 

Whilst, Edinburgh Festival is going to be a bit more limited. 
 

It’s a bit thought police to me to ensure no ones is triggered, intentionally or not. 
 

Anyway real reason quoting you. You manage to get on your ship and sail the seven seas or at least the Atlantic Ocean? 

Edited by Lord BJ
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Governor Tarkin
1 minute ago, Lord BJ said:

 



 

Anyway real reason quoting you. You manage to get on your ship and sail the seven seas or at least the Atlantic Ocean? 

 

Blasting shite out of dolphins and turtles in search of the West African black gold as we speak, LBJ.

 

Greenpeace GTF. 

 

tumblr_mmvgbynhWM1qf224yo1_500.gif

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Lord BJ
Just now, Governor Tarkin said:

 

Blasting shite out of dolphins and turtles in search of the West African black gold as we speak, LBJ.

 

Greenpeace GTF. 

 

tumblr_mmvgbynhWM1qf224yo1_500.gif

:pleasing:

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highlandjambo3

Not read it......can’t be arsed.

 

First breach will be the next cheek match......sweep, sweep.....nothing to see etc.

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16 minutes ago, Cruyff said:

It's awful. It totally infringes free speech imo. 

It does. It’s also in keeping with the similarly awful attempt by Jeanne Freeman to ban freedom of information requests. 

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3 minutes ago, Zico said:

It does. It’s also in keeping with the similarly awful attempt by Jeanne Freeman to ban freedom of information requests. 

👍

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ri Alban

There is no such thing as freedom of speech. You cannot say whatever you want, when you want. End of and this just rubber stamps it. 

And Now maybe we can actually become the civilised country that we like to kid ourselves on about. 

 

Hopefully this will start to stamp out sectarianism, as well. 

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Maroon Sailor
8 hours ago, JackLadd said:

Dear horrible Scottish white men, just don't mention or joke about race, sexuality, religion or difference of any kind in any way or we'll have you cancelled and locked up.  Love Nicola. Xx.

 

See a lot of comedians being put out of work

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highlandjambo3
59 minutes ago, ri Alban said:

There is no such thing as freedom of speech. You cannot say whatever you want, when you want. End of and this just rubber stamps it. 

And Now maybe we can actually become the civilised country that we like to kid ourselves on about. 

 

Hopefully this will start to stamp out sectarianism, as well. 

🤣🤣🤣.....you were doing fine up till this point imo.

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JamesM48

It’s a well meaning bill but is full of issues related to freedom of speech in particular in a persons own house . It’s quite concerning that a person could be prosecuted for supposedly “ hate speech  “ in their own house . It’s thought control and a dangerous road to go down . 
 

It would be also hard to prove the “ stirring up hatred “ concept too . Johan Lamont is really trying to challenge the women’s based sex rights issue. She is wanting the bill to acknowledge that there are two sexes and is alarmed that if people disagree with that they may get prosecuted for a hate crime . There are various issues about this related to people’s views about trans identity snd people’s opinions about this which is may be based on science and biology and not something as esoteric as someone believing that they are  male of female but in another sex . It’s a blurring of sex and gender which Johan is trying to clarify .  The bill needs various clear amendments in regard to this 

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Ron Burgundy
1 hour ago, ri Alban said:

There is no such thing as freedom of speech. You cannot say whatever you want, when you want. End of and this just rubber stamps it. 

And Now maybe we can actually become the civilised country that we like to kid ourselves on about. 

 

Hopefully this will start to stamp out sectarianism, as well. 

Would calling someone a traitor due to a political difference of opinion be construed as stirring up hatred?

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Bigots, racists and homophobes are moaning about free speech.

Civil rights groups are moaning that it doesn't go far enough.

 

So it probably means the Bill is hitting just about the right spot.

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48 minutes ago, JamesM48 said:

It’s a well meaning bill but is full of issues related to freedom of speech in particular in a persons own house . It’s quite concerning that a person could be prosecuted for supposedly “ hate speech  “ in their own house . It’s thought control and a dangerous road to go down . 
 

It would be also hard to prove the “ stirring up hatred “ concept too . Johan Lamont is really trying to challenge the women’s based sex rights issue. She is wanting the bill to acknowledge that there are two sexes and is alarmed that if people disagree with that they may get prosecuted for a hate crime . There are various issues about this related to people’s views about trans identity snd people’s opinions about this which is may be based on science and biology and not something as esoteric as someone believing that they are  male of female but in another sex . It’s a blurring of sex and gender which Johan is trying to clarify .  The bill needs various clear amendments in regard to this 

I think Cade’s accusing you of homophobia, James! 😉 

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JamesM48
10 minutes ago, Zico said:

I think Cade’s accusing you of homophobia, James! 😉 

I didn’t read that as accusing me of being homophobic , ? Jezz me of all people ! 

EAB4EE42-B17C-40E5-886B-CEBC8CB27514.jpeg

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53 minutes ago, JamesM48 said:

I didn’t read that as accusing me of being homophobic , ? Jezz me of all people ! 

EAB4EE42-B17C-40E5-886B-CEBC8CB27514.jpeg

Jokes baby! Instead, I could’ve used renowned homophobe Peter Tatchell as an example, when he was no-platformed for standing up for free speech. 

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JamesM48
8 minutes ago, Zico said:

Jokes baby! Instead, I could’ve used renowned homophobe Peter Tatchell as an example, when he was no-platformed for standing up for free speech. 

It’s hard to tell who is joking on this to be honest ! I’m hardly homophobic either . Far from it . Tatchell has been a tireless campaigner for LGBT fir decades I believe . 

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20 minutes ago, JamesM48 said:

It’s hard to tell who is joking on this to be honest ! I’m hardly homophobic either . Far from it . Tatchell has been a tireless campaigner for LGBT fir decades I believe . 

Of course he has! Which makes the irony of him getting no platformed, irony squared. It’s only ‘bigots, racists and homophobes’ that care about free speech tho!

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JamesM48
50 minutes ago, Zico said:

Jokes baby! Instead, I could’ve used renowned homophobe Peter Tatchell as an example, when he was no-platformed for standing up for free speech. 

Ps I’m no body’s “Baby !”!  😂

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JamesM48
51 minutes ago, Zico said:

Jokes baby! Instead, I could’ve used renowned homophobe Peter Tatchell as an example, when he was no-platformed for standing up for free speech. 

Ps I’m no body’s “Baby !”!  😂

621FEF70-A845-4B91-B848-B3454BB359E7.jpeg

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I did not say that everybody moaning about free speech was a bigot, racist or homophobe.

 

Just that bigots, racists and homophobes are making their usual noises about free speech.

 

And as I said, as people on both extremes of the issue are unhappy, it probably means the Bill is just about spot on.

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niblick1874

I was brought up by those that went through the second world war. They had been brought up by those that went through the first world war. I paid attention to what they said and from an early age was reading everything I could get my hands on about what happened to the German people to turn Germany into what it became. I don't need to read the book below, however, I suggest everyone should, and then keep looking. 

The Fourth Turning - What the Cycles of History Tell Us About America's Next Rendezvous with Destiny ebook by William Strauss,Neil Howe

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Are you seriously, seriously actually trying to draw any sort of comparison between Scotland in 2021 and Germany in 1933?

 

:cornette:

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niblick1874
19 minutes ago, Cade said:

Are you seriously, seriously actually trying to draw any sort of comparison between Scotland in 2021 and Germany in 1933?

 

:cornette:

 

Yes, when it comes to what those in power are doing.

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5 minutes ago, niblick1874 said:

 

Yes, when it comes to what those in power are doing.

So the SNP want to ban hate crime. The Nazis encouraged and promoted it. Exactly the same then. 

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coconut doug
27 minutes ago, Cade said:

Are you seriously, seriously actually trying to draw any sort of comparison between Scotland in 2021 and Germany in 1933?

 

:cornette:

 

 

Its a pretty valid point when you can become a transphobic criminal for stating that you cannot change sex. Something that used to be a biological fact.

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niblick1874
1 minute ago, Tazio said:

So the SNP want to ban hate crime. The Nazis encouraged and promoted it. Exactly the same then. 

 

The nazis dressed it up in the same way they are while calling free speech hate speech.

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niblick1874
5 minutes ago, Cade said:

You're a fud

 

In the beginning, that was the kind of reply from brown shirts when told that what they were doing was wrong, by other Germans.

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Mikey1874
1 hour ago, Cade said:

I did not say that everybody moaning about free speech was a bigot, racist or homophobe.

 

Just that bigots, racists and homophobes are making their usual noises about free speech.

 

And as I said, as people on both extremes of the issue are unhappy, it probably means the Bill is just about spot on.

 

Complaints are pretty mainstream. To say people making concerns are bigots is pretty ignorant. Very ignorant. 0 in 0-100 scale of ignorance. So very stupid actually. 

 

Scottish Government and its institutions have failed when it needs new laws to cover things already covered by existing laws. 

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niblick1874

Coming to your living room shortly.

 

This clip from Casablanca was shown by CNN. They then went to a talking head that they clamed to be some kind of expert. He put forward that this was the way to go where not taking the vaccine is concerned. I kid you not

 

What color will the star be this time.  

 

 

The Nazis said that those that were telling the truth were spreading hate speech. This time they are calling those that tell the truth Nazis and that they are spreading hate speech. 

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Ainsley Harriott
6 hours ago, ri Alban said:

There is no such thing as freedom of speech. You cannot say whatever you want, when you want. End of and this just rubber stamps it. 

And Now maybe we can actually become the civilised country that we like to kid ourselves on about. 

 

Hopefully this will start to stamp out sectarianism, as well. 

I agree about there not really being free speech however this new law risks removing the right to opinions or debate. Not healthy

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Ainsley Harriott
2 hours ago, Cade said:

Are you seriously, seriously actually trying to draw any sort of comparison between Scotland in 2021 and Germany in 1933?

 

:cornette:

Nationalists be Nationalists homie 

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So basically, Religious folks are protected by the bill but also outlawed at the same time. Preaching religious beliefs that homosexuality and same sex marriage are a sin amount to hatred. Yet anyone telling religious folk that their beliefs are horseshit falls foul of the bill due to bigotry and sectarianism. :rolleyes:  

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John Findlay

Passing a law, enforcing a law, then successfully prosecuting someone for breaking said law are three very different things. The first two maybe easy to achieve, however the last one I think will be very difficult in alot of cases once QCs get their teeth into it in both the Sheriff and high courts.

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JamesM48
6 minutes ago, John Findlay said:

Passing a law, enforcing a law, then successfully prosecuting someone for breaking said law are three very different things. The first two maybe easy to achieve, however the last one I think will be very difficult in alot of cases once QCs get their teeth into it in both the Sheriff and high courts.

Exactly.  This law will fall done once there is test case in court i think .. I do not agree with someones views or opinions about various issues but I believe they have the right to express it.  However i do not feel they have the right to incite others in their views if those views are defined as hate speech. I think that comes under the " stirring hatred " part of the bill. But how do you prove that? Unless someone murders a gay / black / asian / disabled person directly as a result of listening or reading a persons hatred of those said peoples?  Again how would you prove it?  The key to it appears to be the " encouragement " of hatred or violence in speech really.  

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JamesM48
40 minutes ago, Cruyff said:

So basically, Religious folks are protected by the bill but also outlawed at the same time. Preaching religious beliefs that homosexuality and same sex marriage are a sin amount to hatred. Yet anyone telling religious folk that their beliefs are horseshit falls foul of the bill due to bigotry and sectarianism. :rolleyes:  

I think you can still say " all religions are s&&&&" well i hope so as all religions are sh%%%

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@ri Alban - still churning out the 'Hoose Jock' line against folk who don't fancy making themselves and their kids poorer, aye? 

 

😛 

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ri Alban

giphy.gif

 

 

Why am I not surprised that the tea towel bridage are raging. 

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