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Are our coaches improving our team?


5-1Jambo

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We keep playing the same patterns every week and losing goals to teams on the break. I can't see how our coaches are improving/changing things. I do wear glasses so maybe I have missed something?? 

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I’d love to watch the practice sessions for corners and free kicks just for starters. Must be like the benny hill show.

in all seriousness it’s deeply concerning the amount of players that have regressed, but neither wonder watching the way they are set up and play

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AlphonseCapone
11 minutes ago, David Black said:

Only 2 players have not got worse under our coaching, Gordon and Boyce, every other player has regressed.

 

Don't think Boyce looks like he's really enjoying playing. He's scoring thankfully but reckon he's capable of more in a better playing team. 

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No. Our shape, whatever that is, is non existent, the players don't ever give 100% effort until a goal down or in the last 10 mins or so.

 

Massive attitude problem and a lack of motivation from the management.

 

Massive changes needed AGAIN.

 

We really are a mess of a football team just now.

 

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2 minutes ago, AlphonseCapone said:

 

Don't think Boyce looks like he's really enjoying playing. He's scoring thankfully but reckon he's capable of more in a better playing team. 

No player looks like they enjoy it out on the park.

 

This should have been a very enjoyable season getting ready for next season.

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No.

 

Good coaches make bad players better, see Stendel with Moore. 

 

We seriously need to be looking at a new coaching team asap. I do not believe Robbie adds any value to the club. We need to be developing young talent, he's shown zero interest in doing that, his signings have almost exclusively been middling journeymen who will not net us any sort of fee long term nor can they be improved much further. What's on display currently isn't something I think you can justify charging for, no discernible tactics, no style to our play, no drive forward, there isn't anything on offer right now that I'm thinking 'we have foundation blocks to build on', frankly watching paint dry is more interesting than the pish we are being subjected to. This squad will be looking at yet another squad overhaul in the summer and that to me is wholly unacceptable, how many times do we need a 'do over' ? They are supposed to know what they are doing.  

 

We need to be looking at a manager within Scotland/UK that can work with young players and has a track record in developing them whilst remaining competitive. I'm loathing the idea of giving Robbie another season, although I suspect we've got a while yet to endure of this shite. Its making me wonder if Neil McCann might not have been that bad an idea after all... 

 

 

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You can only go on what you see, and it is bland to say the least. We changed formation 3 times and against ICT in the same game - this is causing real issues with our play imo - this combined with being too slow in thought process, and at feet from front to back. Much more movement and interchanging required (from our players) and especially to draw the opposition out 

 

If the opposition park the bus, that’s the only way to get in behind, and we just don’t do it at all - haven’t done it for years 

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Just now, Bongo 1874 said:

Erm. 

Bongo, as the weeks go by I’m coming across to your side mate. This is Craig Levein MKII.

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14 minutes ago, OTT said:

No.

 

Good coaches make bad players better, see Stendel with Moore. 

 

We seriously need to be looking at a new coaching team asap. I do not believe Robbie adds any value to the club. We need to be developing young talent, he's shown zero interest in doing that, his signings have almost exclusively been middling journeymen who will not net us any sort of fee long term nor can they be improved much further. What's on display currently isn't something I think you can justify charging for, no discernible tactics, no style to our play, no drive forward, there isn't anything on offer right now that I'm thinking 'we have foundation blocks to build on', frankly watching paint dry is more interesting than the pish we are being subjected to. This squad will be looking at yet another squad overhaul in the summer and that to me is wholly unacceptable, how many times do we need a 'do over' ? They are supposed to know what they are doing.  

 

We need to be looking at a manager within Scotland/UK that can work with young players and has a track record in developing them whilst remaining competitive. I'm loathing the idea of giving Robbie another season, although I suspect we've got a while yet to endure of this shite. Its making me wonder if Neil McCann might not have been that bad an idea after all... 

 

 

Gary naysmith, Stephen naismith, robbo, Neil McCann, put these guys in Wed do ok any 3out 4, or all, even micky Cameron, guys that all know and like the club....

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37 minutes ago, David Black said:

Only 2 players have not got worse under our coaching, Gordon and Boyce, every other player has regressed.

Sorry mate but you ignore Gordon's flaps, poor distribution and Boyce's glaring lack of control and pace! It is a shit team, shit manager, shit board, shit tactics and shit ambition. I'll leave you to think what I think of Budge and FoH!

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Nope, not one player looks like they are improving at the moment imo, tbh most of them look like they couldn't give a toss to play for our club, It's 100% down to the coaching for me, the players just dont look motivated, the facts are that we have good players at the club, however they are not showing up at the moment for some reason, put it this way, how many other teams in scotland would take Gordon, Smith, Kingsley, Haring, Mceneff, Gms, Boyce, Walker and maybe Naismith. I think they would walk into pretty much any side outside of the Old firm/Aberdeen tbh, It seems like the players are not being coached/set up properly before games. Somethings gotta give at some point as we as a team are dreadful to watch.

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Just now, Hectormasson said:

Gary naysmith, Stephen naismith, robbo, Neil McCann, put these guys in Wed do ok any 3out 4, or all, even micky Cameron, guys that all know and like the club....

 

Honestly, my first thought was Robbo, his ICT team is very young, which would certainly tick boxes, I just don't see him being able to push us as high up the table as we'd like. Someone mentioned Billy Reid before, which is interesting because he's been Potters assistant for a good few years now, and I think he might be the sort to bring a different sort of perspective to the club. I'd certainly like to find out more about how his team would play. 

 

Style of play is secondary to doing whatever we're trying to do well though. Like, I'd be quite happy watching JJ/ Big Sam style hoofball if we were effective in what we were doing. I genuinely don't know what way Robbie is trying to play. It looks like he's wanting to dominate possession but we don't seem to have a clear plan to create chances with all this possession which begs the question what the **** they're practising in training because at present it just looks like they listen to stone roses and grind out shite results against teams we dwarf financially. We could probably get a sunday league manager to do that for free... we're not even the fittest team in the league given how half arsed our senior players seem to be playing. 

 

When you compare this to Robbies team last time its polar opposites. Hard working with a clear game plan versus a team with virtually no identity or plan. Its ****ing depressing. Just like Levein for the last 3 years.

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30 minutes ago, jambopilms said:

Clearly no, 4232 hasn't worked at all. Some of the players are too old, slow and uninterested to be better though.

4231. But, yes, the system does not suit the players he has. How he cannot see this is frankly extraordinary.

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13 minutes ago, Riccarton3 said:

4231. But, yes, the system does not suit the players he has. How he cannot see this is frankly extraordinary.

He cannot think it has been a successful system. It probably doesn't matter what system you choose when your squad is too old and tired.

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2 minutes ago, jambopilms said:

He cannot think it has been a successful system. It probably doesn't matter what system you choose when your squad is too old and tired.

You don't choose the system with the least likely chance of success. You pragmatically strengthen your mid with bodies, improve your attack with another body and use one wide player to move around from left to right. Maybe one for 60 giving it everything then 30 for replacement.

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9 hours ago, 5-1Jambo said:

We keep playing the same patterns every week and losing goals to teams on the break. I can't see how our coaches are improving/changing things. I do wear glasses so maybe I have missed something?? 

And the answer is.... NO.      As you say, it's the same slow sideways stuff every week.   Even several forward passes last night resulted in the receiving player passing it straight back to the guy who made the pass in the first place  - is this a sign of very low  self-confidence on the part of most of the players  ?   I used to think it was just Clare & Wighton who suffered from that, but it seems several others are now too.

 

We're top of the league and playing against teams who'll probably never ever get to the Premiership.  We should be trying to batter the Mortons and Alloas right from the kick off.  

 

 If the 3 coaches just self-isolated at home for 10 days, would we notice any difference in the team's next  performance  ?     

 

:wallbash:

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BRING_BACK_MO_BERTHA

The answer to the thread title question is clearly NO. 
We have bought ready-made older players that won’t be being coached into being “better players” (Gordon, GMS, Kingsley etc are not going to change/learn/hugely improve as players at their stage...ditto Naismith, Boyce, Walker, Berra, Smith, White who were already here when they took over).

The players they could have improved (Wighton, Irving, Cochrane, Hendo, Moore etc) haven’t really had a look in and even Roberts and Frear we might have expected a coaching team to have “made better” but no.

If you buy ready made the way to “improve the team” is to gel them as a unit, find a perfect formation or manage their workload to get best from them...this has not happened either. Loaning virtually every youth player is showing they are not trying to coach them into being better, rather hoping others will or just via game time...but if they can’t prove it with us in Championship then why bother!!!

Covid issues aside, which is difficult tbf, this coaching team must be having the easiest time ever in terms of player development and their workload (not even any youth teams playing to occupy them or loads of games to attend in person).

in fact, if fans were in grounds, they’d be doing more for this team than the coaching staff as they would be giving the likes of Halliday, Popescu, GMS and others pelters during matches for how they are playing which might invoke a reaction/performance more than their weekday training sessions.

 

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I thought Lee McCulloch was going to be the one to give the lazy ones a kick up the arse and demand better but seems not.

That's Naismith, Halliday, McCulloch 3 people we were told are born winners and leaders. Seems winning with Rangers doesn't actually make you a born winner. Leaders like Glenn Whelan was rather than Steven Presley. All mouth no action.

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4 minutes ago, BRING_BACK_MO_BERTHA said:

The answer to the thread title question is clearly NO. 
We have bought ready-made older players that won’t be being coached into being “better players” (Gordon, GMS, Kingsley etc are not going to change/learn/hugely improve as players at their stage...ditto Naismith, Boyce, Walker, Berra, Smith, White who were already here when they took over).

The players they could have improved (Wighton, Irving, Cochrane, Hendo, Moore etc) haven’t really had a look in and even Roberts and Frear we might have expected a coaching team to have “made better” but no.

If you buy ready made the way to “improve the team” is to gel them as a unit, find a perfect formation or manage their workload to get best from them...this has not happened either. Loaning virtually every youth player is showing they are not trying to coach them into being better, rather hoping others will or just via game time...but if they can’t prove it with us in Championship then why bother!!!

Covid issues aside, which is difficult tbf, this coaching team must be having the easiest time ever in terms of player development and their workload (not even any youth teams playing to occupy them or loads of games to attend in person).

in fact, if fans were in grounds, they’d be doing more for this team than the coaching staff as they would be giving the likes of Halliday, Popescu, GMS and others pelters during matches for how they are playing which might invoke a reaction/performance more than their weekday training sessions.

 

Good post. Unfortunately bringing in the old players has made us too old, slow and lack energy. We must be the oldest squad in the league and it shows.

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No, when you think about three of our academy rejects Doig, Gordon and Paton all looking great for their respective clubs and all 3 would walk into our team, there is a major problem.

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Ex member of the SaS
9 hours ago, Jambo61 said:

Sorry mate but you ignore Gordon's flaps, poor distribution and Boyce's glaring lack of control and pace! It is a shit team, shit manager, shit board, shit tactics and shit ambition. I'll leave you to think what I think of Budge and FoH!

I have been saying this of Boyce for weeks and get shot down, YES he scores goals ( like last night ) But he is murder when trying to control the ball, he can't trap an incoming ball and trips over his own feet too often.

He is a preditor striker but insists on playing deep, whether that is due to tactic or what I can't tell.

We will struggle to score with the defense being closed down and only one in the box with three defenders. Unless the mids move forward and the wingers get up the wings this will be our game plan for next season too.

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How many corners has the likes if Halkett scored from since this team of coaches came in? Definitely less than prior.

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Seymour M Hersh
51 minutes ago, TypoonJambo said:

How many corners has the likes if Halkett scored from since this team of coaches came in? Definitely less than prior.

 

Actually I don't think a lack of scoring from corners is just a Hearts thing. Research has concluded that goals are scored from only 3% of corners across the top 5 European leagues. 

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3 hours ago, Selkirkhmfc1874 said:

No ! Michael Smith and Stephen Kingsley look totally different players since first few games of the season

What the hell has happened to those two. 

 

They both started the season really well now they are both unrecognisable and severely lacking in confidence. 

 

Have they been gradually dragged down to the shit levels of the players round about them. 

 

Very worrying to see tbh. 

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Kidd’s Boots

Like most posters on this thread, I agree that the coaching staff have not improved this current group of players, and I'd go as far to say that they can't get them fit enough to play anything other than 4231.

 

I've felt for weeks now that we lack the lift of energy needed for a second 10,15,20 spell particularly in the first half to get on top of teams the way we did at the start of the season, and the best we can muster is a 5 minute final roll of the dice when games should have been put to bed. I have no idea how long the players are in each day, but in my opinion it isn't enough. If the coaching staff can only focus on one thing for the remainder of our games this season, it should be fitness.  

 

We are far from comfortable despite a 12 point advantage in this league, and the remaining weeks of this season will certainly take better efforts than we have seen recently. Last night may mean enforced changes with Naismith and Smith picking up injuries out of nowhere. McEneff hadn't played competitively since December and looked fitter than many others, but too often others aren't where they should be to support him, not good enough imo and this is becoming the elephant in the room. 

 

Improving the team team starts with improving the current fitness levels.

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9 minutes ago, Robbo-Jambo said:

What the hell has happened to those two. 

 

They both started the season really well now they are both unrecognisable and severely lacking in confidence. 

 

Have they been gradually dragged down to the shit levels of the players round about them. 

 

Very worrying to see tbh. 

A change of system that doesn't suit either of them. 2 poor centre backs and having to try to link with Haliday, Naismith, Kastaneer etc is bound to have an effect on anybody.

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Bazzas right boot

No reserve league. 

Manny new players 

Restricted contact and training 

Ne dof and my team. 

Weren't allowed to train wen we wanted. 

Many players from last seasons failings. 

 

 

Aye, coaches oot. They're aw shite 

 

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1 hour ago, TypoonJambo said:

How many corners has the likes if Halkett scored from since this team of coaches came in? Definitely less than prior.

Halketts half the player and twice the size he was last season. 

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The only coach that could improve us is one of Charlie Irons taking most of this squad on a one way trip to a land far far away.

 

With Neilson driving.

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We’ve been regressing on the pitch for years regardless of who’s in charge of training, team selection, tactics and recruitment. We’ve changed manager a few times and had a massive number of incomings and outgoings and nothing seems to improve. For me the buck has to stop with the people right at the top of the club as they are the one constant in this shambles. 

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6 minutes ago, Gambo said:

Rn has coached this squad to the position where we are now competitive with Alloa, Ayr, Morton QotS and sounds extremely proud of it.

His interview after the game last night done my head in. He should have been calling the players out for the first half hour performance but came across like he was pretty happy with the result and performance. 

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28 minutes ago, Smith's right boot said:

No reserve league. 

Manny new players 

Restricted contact and training 

Ne dof and my team. 

Weren't allowed to train wen we wanted. 

Many players from last seasons failings. 

 

 

Aye, coaches oot. They're aw shite 

 

The opposition teams had this and more to handle.
We have world class facilities to train and develop 

we have international players and new signings on massive wages 

Yet our team looks lost, uninterested and getting worse against teams that are virtually amateur or at best SpFL cast offs 

Do you believe in what you are typing’ as it’s just nonsense 

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Scottie Wanshot.

How can something so simple as putting in decent crosses into the box  Most of the time especially corners, we can't get it past the first post. School boy stuff.

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A_A wehatethehibs
23 minutes ago, Smith's right boot said:

No reserve league. 

Manny new players 

Restricted contact and training 

Ne dof and my team. 

Weren't allowed to train wen we wanted. 

Many players from last seasons failings. 

 

 

Aye, coaches oot. They're aw shite 

 

 

Know you’re trying to keep a level head, but is there one player you can say is improving as the games go by this season? Nobody has had a good season IMO. Even Boyce. Yes his goals, particularly penalties have put us on this points tally so for that reason he is probably player of the year. But really has anyone looked an improved player who’s making progress and growing in confidence? Seems the opposite to me.

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