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Irving - signs for SK Austria Klagenfurt ( updated )


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Decent talent and a good build on him unlike a lot of our previous "decent talent". 

He's progressing well and showing glimpses he wants to take his game to the next level. 

I'd say he's better staying with us for another season or two as the signs are there that we're going to start behaving like a proper football team off the park.

 

If his attitude is similar to any of the other "decent talent" we've had over the years,  I doubt he'll last long and might as well move on and end up at East Fife for example in a few years. 

 

Hope he stays a bit longer. 

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16 minutes ago, wavydavy said:

 

How many teams will guarantee a player game time?

Guaranteed game time is a misnomer really.  Its the term used.  You'd think it FIFA parlance he wants that step up from "prospect" to "important player".  If that is given - yep you're an important player in our first 18, he needs a contract which matches that

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A_A wehatethehibs


 

16 minutes ago, TheBigO said:

Guaranteed game time is a misnomer really.  Its the term used.  You'd think it FIFA parlance he wants that step up from "prospect" to "important player".  If that is given - yep you're an important player in our first 18, he needs a contract which matches that


What’s half way between “prospect” and “important player”? Because that’s where he is imo 

 

He is an important player in the context of the championship which is an absolute tin pot joke of a division. He is a prospect in the context of the upper echelons of the Premiership which is where Hearts real expectations lie. 

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2 hours ago, Mikey1874 said:

 

Not seen that said so confidently since Jordan McGhee.


I never rated Jordan McGhee. I thought he was rash and lacked composure - unlike Irving.

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1 hour ago, sac said:

If he’s after an extra £250 a week that’s £13k a year, however if he’s after say a grand a week it’s £52k. No idea what the young boy is on wage wise, but I’d imagine we’d have to pay more to replace him with someone older and less sell on value.


Sorry how do we know what he’s after?

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Boys got a bit of class about him, even in his early appearances you could see he was always looking to get the ball on the deck when other midfielders in the spfl were running around him just trying to get a touch on the ball in any direction. Think we would be wise to stick with him as a starter

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It's probably in Irving's interest to sign on with us.  I'd say we've developed him really well up to now, building him up to first team football but also protecting him, and he's getting deserved recognition as a result.  He's shown glimpses of quality in the top league, but hasn't ever established himself as a starter at CM for a good run of games - obviously not helped by us being pish for years.

 

No point speculating on the contract negotiations.  Pretty sure it'll all be arranged - Robbie seems keen and the players seems to respect him.  If not, no sleep will be lost by me.  Players that have left for bigger things before actually being established as a key player for us haven't been that successful from what I remember.

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Bazzas right boot
1 hour ago, Dazo said:


Football fans are hypocrites so absolutely he’s being treated differently, I’m ok with that. I’d hazard a guess he has been ****ed about previously so it’s fair enough he had a look to see what’s out there. Maybe some of those who ****ed him about are no longer here so I’d imagine he is happier at the club. He is entitled to be happy at his work regardless of being a hearts supporter. 

 

 

If been giving your chance with Hearts is being ****ed about then fair enough. 

How was he ****ed about? 

 

If he's had a look "what's out there" and he's only signing because he has no other options or a better option fell through he can do one Tbh or sign what he is given. 

 

If he signs good, if he doesn't we move on. 

 

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3 hours ago, Smith's right boot said:

 

If this was a random signing then I would be telling  him to bolt soon. 

Not a fan  of players who join us and are already looking at thier next move. 

Every player will have ambition but Irving to me just simply isn't good enough to be demanding anything from the team who has given him his break through and Tbh a team he's yet to establish himself at. 

 

Irving gets a lot of slack on here, if this was someone like Djoum folk on here would be going tonto calling him billy big bawz and all sorts. 

 

Irving has already waited imo for something better to come up, that hasn't happened and we are obviously his best offer. 

It feels like he's been forced to stay with us. 

Seems more and more like the sort that if the OF flash their knickers he'd be off quicker than Lafferty. 

Many will disagree because it's Irving and folk think he's a proper Hearts laddie etc. 

 

 

 

:rofl:You post some shit.

 

Its almost like you're bored and looking for a stupid argument.

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Bazzas right boot
1 hour ago, Gimme an H... said:

As I mentioned above, the difference is that Djoum made no secret of the fact he wanted away and seen himself as bigger and better than Hearts. He was in the paper a few times saying as much. There was a distinct change in tune from him after the AFCON win. 

 

So being open and honest is bad? 

 

 

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If I had the choice this window between resigning Andy Irving on a 3 year+ contract or signing a new striker then it would be Andy without question.

Obviously wouldn't say no to doing both. 

Edited by HoGwash
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2 minutes ago, Smith's right boot said:

 

So being open and honest is bad? 

 

 

Do you have to have a say on everything it's unbelievable that you spend so long on here, get a life.

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iwasthere1954
4 minutes ago, Smith's right boot said:

 

 

If been giving your chance with Hearts is being ****ed about then fair enough. 

How was he ****ed about? 

 

If he's had a look "what's out there" and he's only signing because he has no other options or a better option fell through he can do one Tbh or sign what he is given. 

 

If he signs good, if he doesn't we move on. 

 

That's fine, however don't come back in six months complaining about another young talent gone for nothing. 

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Bazzas right boot
1 hour ago, TheBigO said:

I don't really see your point though, Tosh.  You're probably right but what point are you making?

 

We should be having a go at the laddie?

 

I'm guessing you are neither his agent nor involved in the negotiations from Hearts' side.  So you don't know what is happening.  The dude wants the best deal he can get (look at Jamie Brandon, look at Soapy - you don't know what's round the corner).

 

Yeah people do moan about the likes of Djoum or whatever. Making that point makes it very much look like you are now having a go at Andy!  You see that right?

 

Making out he's only speaking to us because no-one else has come in for him....!  Really.  You know it works the other way, most of the time, right?  If he wanted away, his agent would be bringing in offers.  Obviously I don't know if that's been looked at on his behalf, but it certainly doesn't feel like that.  Hearts have history of not offering our own laddies their worth as compared to outside signings.  If Andy is trying to buck that trend a wee bit, fair play.

 

 

Fair points. 

 

I guess, for me with it almost being February and guys like Smith and Kingsley committing it's a bit frustrating on two fronts 

 

We haven't got him tied down. 

He thinks he's good enough to be "countering" our offers despite him being far from the Finished article and being part of a shit Hearts team last season. 

 

Just frustration on that front and astonishment that many posters who get angry with players for less giving Irving such Leeway, with him being  A phm and a young laddie. 

 

 

Hope he signs, but players shouldn't be holding us to ransom, especially young, unproven ones. 

 

 

 

 

 

 

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3 hours ago, Smith's right boot said:

 

If this was a random signing then I would be telling  him to bolt soon. 

Not a fan  of players who join us and are already looking at thier next move. 

Every player will have ambition but Irving to me just simply isn't good enough to be demanding anything from the team who has given him his break through and Tbh a team he's yet to establish himself at. 

 

Irving gets a lot of slack on here, if this was someone like Djoum folk on here would be going tonto calling him billy big bawz and all sorts. 

 

Irving has already waited imo for something better to come up, that hasn't happened and we are obviously his best offer. 

It feels like he's been forced to stay with us. 

Seems more and more like the sort that if the OF flash their knickers he'd be off quicker than Lafferty. 

Many will disagree because it's Irving and folk think he's a proper Hearts laddie etc. 

 

 

I think you're slavering here, tbh. We've made him a contract offer and because he hasn't accepted it but has proposed an alternative deal, it means he's looking for the next move, and really wants to leave but can't get a deal elsewhere?  For all you or anyone on here knows, he might just have said he'd like a wee bit more money but would be happy to commit to a longer deal!

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Bazzas right boot
3 minutes ago, Lfhearts said:

Do you have to have a say on everything it's unbelievable that you spend so long on here, get a life.

 

No. 

 

What type of life do you recommend? 

 

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Bazzas right boot
1 minute ago, FarmerTweedy said:

I think you're slavering here, tbh. We've made him a contract offer and because he hasn't accepted it but has proposed an alternative deal, it means he's looking for the next move, and really wants to leave but can't get a deal elsewhere?  For all you or anyone on here knows, he might just have said he'd like a wee bit more money but would be happy to commit to a longer deal!

 

 

Hopefully your last statement is true. 

 

 

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Bazzas right boot
6 minutes ago, iwasthere1954 said:

That's fine, however don't come back in six months complaining about another young talent gone for nothing. 

 

I never have Tbh. 

It's expected. 

 

If they are young and play well, they won't sign an extension ( Patterson and Hickey). 

 

If they are OK, they might stay on but not have much of an impact. 

 

It's a bit shit Tbh. 

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3 hours ago, A_A wehatethehibs said:


What SRB is saying is, how would the fans be reacting if this was Djoum turning down contract offers and “making us a counter offer” ? Remember when Djoum did exactly the same thing, fobbed off a load of offers, delayed talks but spun us along and then left on a free. 
 

Yet Irving gets a free pass with it and he’s within his rights? And the club is the one that’s in the wrong? 
 

Fact is he’d be getting absolute pelters for it and called a mercenary if he wasn’t a guid Hearts laddie.  Folk would be probably calling for him to be transfer listed and sold right now for whatever we can get as we’ve only got 8 days left to recoup any fee for him. 

Jings, you're slavering even more than SRB!

 

Irving hasn't done any of what you described, and nobody's saying the club's in the wrong, because there's nothing for anyone to accuse the club of being in the wrong about!

 

The club have offered him a deal, he's gone back with the terms he's hoping for, and they'll either find an agreement that both parties are happy with, or not. Yet SRB has him down as only even considering a deal as he's found no other club in the world would have him, and you've painted him as having already strung the club along for months then left, with everyone blaming the club!

 

What a load of utter garbage, from both of you. 

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3 minutes ago, Smith's right boot said:

 

I never have Tbh. 

It's expected. 

 

If they are young and play well, they won't sign an extension ( Patterson and Hickey). 

 

If they are OK, they might stay on but not have much of an impact. 

 

It's a bit shit Tbh. 

We should probably stop trying to keep young players who are seen as potentially very good players on cheaper wages than other mediocre first team players with no potential. 

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Hackney Hearts
1 hour ago, A_A wehatethehibs said:

What’s half way between “prospect” and “important player”? Because that’s where he is imo 

 

I think prosportant is the term you're looking for.

 

And clearly there should be a going rate for prosportant players.

I'm sure it'll be sorted soon. 👍

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2 hours ago, Smith's right boot said:

 

Not saying he should be lambasted either, just pointing out the difference that some take. 

 

Djoum, a proven international, far better player than what Irving currently is with no ties to us takes his time - abuse, gtf etc. 

 

Irving, a phm, a decent lad with potential does the same, everyone wants to give him a cuddle. 

 

If I was being cynical, I'd say he had sniff of a bigger move but it hasn't materialised and now he's stuck with us. 

 

Djoum kept us waiting for months on a decision on the offer he was made. Irving has come straight back with his response. The circumstances are so different it's unbelievable you're even trying to draw parallels. 

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28 minutes ago, Smith's right boot said:

 

 

Fair points. 

 

I guess, for me with it almost being February and guys like Smith and Kingsley committing it's a bit frustrating on two fronts 

 

We haven't got him tied down. 

He thinks he's good enough to be "countering" our offers despite him being far from the Finished article and being part of a shit Hearts team last season. 

 

Just frustration on that front and astonishment that many posters who get angry with players for less giving Irving such Leeway, with him being  A phm and a young laddie. 

 

 

Hope he signs, but players shouldn't be holding us to ransom, especially young, unproven ones. 

 

 

 

 

 

 

It’s a normal negotiation. His representatives are trying to secure a good deal for him. Nothing wrong with that.

 

Surprised that Robbie even mentioned a counter-offer to be honest, he should have said that contact negotiations are continuing and he is hopeful of a positive outcome, as I am.

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Gimme an H...
40 minutes ago, Smith's right boot said:

 

So being open and honest is bad? 

 

 

🤣 No and that's not what I said. 

 

 

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Bazzas right boot
21 minutes ago, Ari Gold said:

We should probably stop trying to keep young players who are seen as potentially very good players on cheaper wages than other mediocre first team players with no potential. 

 

Makes no sense. 

You'd need to see into the future, maybe 2/3 years to do that. 

 

It depends a lot on the personality of the individual in these cases, McKenna!/ McGinn being good examples, signing an extension in the full knowledge they will leave soon, so the club benefits. 

Massive exception rather than the rule tho. 

 

 

 

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Bazzas right boot
4 minutes ago, Pilmuir said:

It’s a normal negotiation. His representatives are trying to secure a good deal for him. Nothing wrong with that.

 

Surprised that Robbie even mentioned a counter-offer to be honest, he should have said that contact negotiations are continuing and he is hopeful of a positive outcome, as I am.

 

 

Yeah, fair point. 

No need to be so specific. 

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Bazzas right boot
6 minutes ago, FarmerTweedy said:

Djoum kept us waiting for months on a decision on the offer he was made. Irving has come straight back with his response. The circumstances are so different it's unbelievable you're even trying to draw parallels. 

 

The reaction of posters is a fair comparison. 

 

 

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Bazzas right boot
24 minutes ago, Hackney Hearts said:

 

I think prosportant is the term you're looking for.

 

And clearly there should be a going rate for prosportant players.

I'm sure it'll be sorted soon. 👍

 

 

😂😂

👏

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Got absolutely no issue with the laddie trying to get the best deal for himself. It happens all the time in every job in every walk of life. If you think you’re worth more to the company than you’re being paid then you say so. 
 

We’re all just guessing at the moment but we have no idea if Irving will go in to have any sell-on value  in the future nor if he has got it in him to make an impact in the top league. Can’t see him going to a bigger or better club at this moment in his career. Here’s hoping a reasonable request can be met. And soon.

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9 minutes ago, Smith's right boot said:

 

Makes no sense. 

You'd need to see into the future, maybe 2/3 years to do that. 

 

It depends a lot on the personality of the individual in these cases, McKenna!/ McGinn being good examples, signing an extension in the full knowledge they will leave soon, so the club benefits. 

Massive exception rather than the rule tho. 

 

 

 

It makes no sense? Its literally the job of the sporting director/director of football whatever title they want to ensure good young players are signed up to either play in the first team for numerous years or we sell on for good money. 

 

Hopefully Joe Savage is better at it than previous. 

 

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1 hour ago, Smith's right boot said:

 

So being open and honest is bad? 

 

 

It's now clear you're just trolling here. I'll leave you to it!

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18Jambo_dave74

Sounds like a perfectly normal contract negotiation. Hopefully we can get it tied up and the lad can kick on.


Neilson using the phrase “counter offer” seems to have caused some bizarre issue with some folk. 

 

 

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The amount of pish being spewed on this thread is hilarious. No one knows what has or hasn't been discussed in terms of contract. The delays could simply be he wanted to know if we brought in another 14 CM's in this window and he wouldn't be getting a game, we just don't know. Someone asking for more money is not unusual. Our opening offer might have been poor

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1 hour ago, Pilmuir said:

It’s a normal negotiation. His representatives are trying to secure a good deal for him. Nothing wrong with that.

 

Surprised that Robbie even mentioned a counter-offer to be honest, he should have said that contact negotiations are continuing and he is hopeful of a positive outcome, as I am.

He probably assumed that most people would know that making offers and counter offers is the same thing as contract negotiations are continuing.

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Bazzas right boot
38 minutes ago, FarmerTweedy said:

It's now clear you're just trolling here. I'll leave you to it!

 

 

You clearly can't debate a difference of opinion without being arsey, so yes- best leave me to it. 

 

 

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Bazzas right boot
50 minutes ago, Ari Gold said:

It makes no sense? Its literally the job of the sporting director/director of football whatever title they want to ensure good young players are signed up to either play in the first team for numerous years or we sell on for good money. 

 

Hopefully Joe Savage is better at it than previous. 

 

 

You don't know a young player is good until years later. 

 

Giving all youngsters lucrative, long contracts isn't an option. 

 

We could give Irving a long, lucrative contract and he could be a big waste of money. 

 

 

 

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21 minutes ago, Smith's right boot said:

 

 

You clearly can't debate a difference of opinion without being arsey, so yes- best leave me to it. 

 

 

 

Making shit up and arguing till the cows come home is not debating a difference of opinion I'm afraid.

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Bazzas right boot
5 minutes ago, Bad Religion said:

 

Making shit up and arguing till the cows come home is not debating a difference of opinion I'm afraid.

 

 

Not making shit up. 

 

I gave an opinion. 

You have yours. 

 

We did offer him a contract tho, and he's refused that and went back with his demands, according to Robbie anyway. 

 

If that had been a player such as Djoum the reaction would ( and was) much different on here. 

 

 

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16 minutes ago, Smith's right boot said:

 

You don't know a young player is good until years later. 

 

Giving all youngsters lucrative, long contracts isn't an option. 

 

We could give Irving a long, lucrative contract and he could be a big waste of money. 

 

 

 

I never said we should give every young player a lucrative contract. It's up to the club to identify which players they feel are going to be good enough long term and convince them the best place to get better is at Hearts and pay them accordingly. 

 

If this is part of the long term plan for the club then it's important we get it right. 

 

It's about having the right people within the academy and dealing with contracts. Not every judgement will be correct but there's more skill to getting it right than by pure guess work which you seem to allude to. 

 

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Guest ToqueJambo
1 hour ago, 18Jambo_dave74 said:

Sounds like a perfectly normal contract negotiation. Hopefully we can get it tied up and the lad can kick on.


Neilson using the phrase “counter offer” seems to have caused some bizarre issue with some folk. 

 

 

 

This. I always assumed this is how all contracts are agreed, otherwise where does the negotiation part come in?

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Bazzas right boot
5 minutes ago, Ari Gold said:

I never said we should give every young player a lucrative contract. It's up to the club to identify which players they feel are going to be good enough long term and convince them the best place to get better is at Hearts and pay them accordingly. 

 

If this is part of the long term plan for the club then it's important we get it right. 

 

It's about having the right people within the academy and dealing with contracts. Not every judgement will be correct but there's more skill to getting it right than by pure guess work which you seem to allude to. 

 

 

 

Ofc, but nothing is guaranteed. 

 

I alluded to the personality of the players, using McGinn as an example. 

 

He signed an extension knowing full well he would be leaving. 

Patterson and Hickey never for example. 

 

Players doing what McGinn and McKenna at Aberdeen done are the exception tho. 

 

It's difficult. 

 

 

Edited by Smith's right boot
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18Jambo_dave74
5 minutes ago, ToqueJambo said:

 

This. I always assumed this is how all contracts are agreed, otherwise where does the negotiation part come in?

 

Indeed. It is probably the same scenario that happened with Smith, Kingsley and is happening with Ginnelly. 

 

As I say, I can only assume the use of the phrase "counter offer" has led people to draw some odd conclusions about Irving's "demands" and attitude. Quite bizarre really. 

 

Fair enough if Neilson has said that talks had stalled or that there was a big difference between what was being asked for and what was being offered but that clearly doesn't seem to be the case. 

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24 minutes ago, Smith's right boot said:

 

 

Not making shit up. 

 

I gave an opinion. 

You have yours. 

 

We did offer him a contract tho, and he's refused that and went back with his demands, according to Robbie anyway. 

 

If that had been a player such as Djoum the reaction would ( and was) much different on here. 

 

 

 

 

'Irving has already waited imo for something better to come up, that hasn't happened and we are obviously his best offer'
'It feels like he's been forced to stay with us'
'Seems more and more like the sort that if the OF flash their knickers he'd be off quicker than Lafferty'
'I'd say he had sniff of a bigger move but it hasn't materialised and now he's stuck with us'
'holding us to ransom'

 

Do you have any evidence to back up any of the above? Just shit stirring?

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15 minutes ago, 18Jambo_dave74 said:

 

Indeed. It is probably the same scenario that happened with Smith, Kingsley and is happening with Ginnelly. 

 

As I say, I can only assume the use of the phrase "counter offer" has led people to draw some odd conclusions about Irving's "demands" and attitude. Quite bizarre really. 

 

Fair enough if Neilson has said that talks had stalled or that there was a big difference between what was being asked for and what was being offered but that clearly doesn't seem to be the case. 

 

 

Your post got me thinking that issue is it just takes time to get people together and get everything done. 

 

Savage need to get himself, the player, the agent, maybe Robbie, maybe someone else all in same meeting. The player and Robbie are probably in training part of the day, the agent is dealing with multiple players, Savage, I hope, is working with other deals too.  

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3 hours ago, Bad Religion said:

 

:rofl:You post some shit.

 

Its almost like you're bored and looking for a stupid argument.


Our Tosh??? Never!!  😂

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colinmorewasgash
Just now, Thomaso said:


Our Tosh??? Never!!  😂

Maybe like some of our youngsters he'll end up at Hibs or maybe Ross has tapped him up. He's promising  makes a difference but still needs to improve so I hope not. Wouldn't be first jambo to join dark side for footballing reasons.

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1 hour ago, Smith's right boot said:

 

 

You clearly can't debate a difference of opinion without being arsey, so yes- best leave me to it. 

 

 


Yes Tosh we’ll leave you to get on with being “arsey”.........as usual. 😉

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colinmorewasgash
Just now, colinmorewasgash said:

Maybe like some of our youngsters he'll end up at Hibs or maybe Ross has tapped him up. He's promising  makes a difference but still needs to improve so I hope not. Wouldn't be first jambo to join dark side for footballing reasons.

I don't think Robbie rates him long term he hasn't been a regular every week.

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1 minute ago, colinmorewasgash said:

Maybe like some of our youngsters he'll end up at Hibs or maybe Ross has tapped him up. He's promising  makes a difference but still needs to improve so I hope not. Wouldn't be first jambo to join dark side for footballing reasons.


What promising first team young player ended up at Hibs?

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  • Kalamazoo Jambo changed the title to Irving - signs for SK Austria Klagenfurt ( updated )

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