Irving - signs for SK Austria Klagenfurt ( updated )

[Bongo 1874]

12 minutes ago, 19/05/2012 said:

 

Liam Gordon was poor at Hearts i dont think anyone would have predicted his career would turn out the way it has

 

14 minutes ago, davemclaren said:

The good thing for them then is they are now being allowed to fly free to their true destiny…elsewhere. 

I want us to receive the big fees for them so it can set us up as a club, I don't want the club buying players then other teams having a percentage on transfers, I don't want us giving players away for free, only for them to shine elsewhere and have clubs that took them off us, demand 5mil for them, I want what's best for Hearts dave I ain't no hobo? Wtf I care about this club. 

 

And only want it to be the best for it's supporters we deserve that dave, the club is take, take, take all the time, we have showed our worth now give us something back to look forward too, reward the fans that stuck by when times were bad, there isn't a support like us, so the club shouldn't take us for granted. 

[JamboAl]

1 hour ago, Broxburn Jambo said:

Don't be facetious, coaching can only go so far, what I am saying is that he hasn't improved his own basic skills in the recent passed, is he a top player, not yet, so why should we pay him top money.

 

Is anybody else willing to pay it?

I think it's high time more people cottoned on to this.  Coaches can only do so much for you.

I quite like Irving who has shown a fair bit of promise but it could still go either way with him.

He has many assets but is unlikely to hit the high spots because of 2 main weaknesses.

Firstly a lack of pace which even Usain Bolt can't teach him.  It can  be masked up to a point with astute reading of the game which again no one can really teach you.  For one so young I think he just about gets by with this and further match experience will help.

However he is also wan fittit.  He himself can practise, practise and do more practice with his weaker foot and get to an acceptable standard at whatever level he aims for.  A coach will only be of limited help.  It is up to him, and his level of commitment will determine his future, wherever he goes.

[ri Alban]

16 hours ago, sadj said:

Utter bollocks , you need a degree of ability on your poor foot. No one is saying he needs two feet like messi as you infer though

Davie Cooper used his right foot to stand on. Didn't make him a bad player. As the poster said, most players couldn't use their weaker foot to save their lives. Especially bang  average players who play in Scotland. Otherwise they'd be offski. 

 

 

Edited June 13, 2021 by ri Alban

[Mr Brightside]

9 hours ago, Bongo 1874 said:

Berra and Halkett better than Gordon? They certainly don't have the silverware to prove that, I disagree big time, I understand that some players get let go etc that's football, but the guy has had a tremendous season.

 

And at worst would be backup at Hearts. 

Berra was better than Gordon when he was released. When we signed Halkett pretty much everyone thought he would be a good signing and nobody has suggested we should have signed Gordon back instead.

 

Berra has as many Scottish Cup winner’s medals than Gordon and a much better career profile.

 

I can’t see Gordon moving for a few, however Halkett still has a higher profile and could do if he plays well next year.

 

 

[sadj]

9 hours ago, ri Alban said:

Davie Cooper used his right foot to stand on. Didn't make him a bad player. As the poster said, most players couldn't use their weaker foot to save their lives. Especially bang  average players who play in Scotland. Otherwise they'd be offski. 

 

 

The game is very different now Ri , you need to be able to at least do the basics with your wrong foot. There is a difference between being one footed and being “one footed”. As has been explained and examples given its a major con to his game. Plenty of pros and massive potential but I think thats something that holds him back.  

[sadj]

15 hours ago, JamboAl said:

I think it's high time more people cottoned on to this.  Coaches can only do so much for you.

I quite like Irving who has shown a fair bit of promise but it could still go either way with him.

He has many assets but is unlikely to hit the high spots because of 2 main weaknesses.

Firstly a lack of pace which even Usain Bolt can't teach him.  It can  be masked up to a point with astute reading of the game which again no one can really teach you.  For one so young I think he just about gets by with this and further match experience will help.

However he is also wan fittit.  He himself can practise, practise and do more practice with his weaker foot and get to an acceptable standard at whatever level he aims for.  A coach will only be of limited help.  It is up to him, and his level of commitment will determine his future, wherever he goes.

this

[mitch41]

On 12/06/2021 at 14:15, colinmaroon said:

Always left footed and my right was only for standing on.  However, practice makes perfect - well, better - and I mean hours of it, not just a few shots and then off to the Bookies.

 

Best goal I ever scored was with my right!

 

 

 

14 minutes ago, sadj said:

this

A very famous manager had a player who only ever used his right foot so he made it mandatory that every time the player trained he was only to use his left. The player later said it was the best thing to happen to him to make him a complete footballer. His left was great for passing and shooting and he went on to win many trophies and caps for his country.

[sadj]

Just now, mitch41 said:

 

A very famous manager had a player who only ever used his right foot so he made it mandatory that every time the player trained he was only to use his left. The player later said it was the best thing to happen to him to make him a complete footballer. His left was great for passing and shooting and he went on to win many trophies and caps for his country.

👍🏻🤘🏻👌🏻
 

Hope you are keeping well Mitch and ready for the coming season. Hopefully be a good one. 

 

 

[lost in space]

3 minutes ago, mitch41 said:

 

A very famous manager had a player who only ever used his right foot so he made it mandatory that every time the player trained he was only to use his left. The player later said it was the best thing to happen to him to make him a complete footballer. His left was great for passing and shooting and he went on to win many trophies and caps for his country.

Hearts coaching staff should have required this when he first jolined as a boy.

The most one-footed player I remember is Robbie Neilson- it was painful watching him contort his body shape and position to get the ball on to his right foot.

I remember laughing when he was given the job of coaching the youth team - saying how ridiculous it was for such a one-sided pllayer to be a coach.

I am not laughing now!!

[stevie1874]

11 minutes ago, lost in space said:

Hearts coaching staff should have required this when he first jolined as a boy.

The most one-footed player I remember is Robbie Neilson- it was painful watching him contort his body shape and position to get the ball on to his right foot.

I remember laughing when he was given the job of coaching the youth team - saying how ridiculous it was for such a one-sided pllayer to be a coach.

I am not laughing now!!

You must be to young to remember Tosh Mckinlay? So left footed he’d do a full 360 turn to get it onto his left foot on the touchline. Good player for Hearts though but as others have stated the games changed over the years and players should be comfortable on the weaker side

[JamboAl]

2 hours ago, lost in space said:

Hearts coaching staff should have required this when he first jolined as a boy.

The most one-footed player I remember is Robbie Neilson- it was painful watching him contort his body shape and position to get the ball on to his right foot.

I remember laughing when he was given the job of coaching the youth team - saying how ridiculous it was for such a one-sided pllayer to be a coach.

I am not laughing now!!

You may be right but ultimately it needs commitment (to practise) from within the individual.

There may be youths currently at Riccarton wirh a similar weakness (or other shortcomings) and I would hope our coaches are encouraging them to do something about it themselves and not hang about with their mouths open waiting to be spoon fed.  They should maximise the opportunities they have for a good career and life style.

Edited June 13, 2021 by JamboAl

[sadj]

2 hours ago, stevie1874 said:

You must be to young to remember Tosh Mckinlay? So left footed he’d do a full 360 turn to get it onto his left foot on the touchline. Good player for Hearts though but as others have stated the games changed over the years and players should be comfortable on the weaker side

Thats a very good way to put it comfortable on the weaker side. 

[lost in space]

41 minutes ago, JamboAl said:

You may be right but ultimately it needs commitment (to practise) from within the individual.

There may be youths currently at Riccarton wirh a similar weakness (or other shortcomings) and I would hope our coaches are encouraging them to do something about it themselves and not hang about with their mouths open waiting to be spoon fed.  They should maximise the opportunities they have for a good career and life style.

Commitment would certainly help - however the coach only needs a ball and a wall - getting the boy to kick the ball against wall with the weak foot, then control returned ball with same foot -and repeat for 15 minutes a day, changing method of control, pace of ball, distance from wall.

It works.

[lost in space]

2 hours ago, stevie1874 said:

You must be to young to remember Tosh Mckinlay? So left footed he’d do a full 360 turn to get it onto his left foot on the touchline. Good player for Hearts though but as others have stated the games changed over the years and players should be comfortable on the weaker side

I remember Tosh. Unfortunately first seeing him for Dundee in 86 at Dens.

Great player for us.

Went on to play for the mhanks.

Won some Scotland caps.

He was one-footed but pacey and committed.

Another player who could have been so much better if able to do the basics with weak foot.

 

[JamboAl]

38 minutes ago, lost in space said:

Commitment would certainly help - however the coach only needs a ball and a wall - getting the boy to kick the ball against wall with the weak foot, then control returned ball with same foot -and repeat for 15 minutes a day, changing method of control, pace of ball, distance from wall.

It works.

Do you mean?

The player only needs a ball and a wall.

Surely no player is so uncommitted that he needs a coach to find him a ball and a wall or "force" him to do it!

[lost in space]

17 minutes ago, JamboAl said:

Do you mean?

The player only needs a ball and a wall.

Surely no player is so uncommitted that he needs a coach to find him a ball and a wall or "force" him to do it!

Better if player accepts weakness - and has the commitment to change. But some young players won't see the need to change - believing their natural ability is enough.

Player will improve - even if "forced" though.  Coach should not take it too far. 

[JamboAl]

1 hour ago, lost in space said:

Better if player accepts weakness - and has the commitment to change. But some young players won't see the need to change - believing their natural ability is enough.

Player will improve - even if "forced" though.  Coach should not take it too far. 

If he doesn't know by now that he is weak on his right foot and practice might help, then you've got to wonder for his future.

[Kiwidoug]

I think that if we want our best young prospects to sign extended contracts, we have to make those contracts enticing.  If £1,000 per week for us is the going rate, I suspect we will lose them for a development fee.

 

Speculate to accumulate is my view.

[sadj]

1 hour ago, lost in space said:

Better if player accepts weakness - and has the commitment to change. But some young players won't see the need to change - believing their natural ability is enough.

Player will improve - even if "forced" though.  Coach should not take it too far. 

Electroshock therapy every time he uses his good foot 🤔

[tynietigers]

Was told today he has a few offers on the table and the Hearts one money wise isn’t the best one 🤔 so it’s really up to him, football in a first team or money 💰 but that’s the way football has become grab it while you can ☹️

[jr ewing]

6 hours ago, stevie1874 said:

You must be to young to remember Tosh Mckinlay? So left footed he’d do a full 360 turn to get it onto his left foot on the touchline. Good player for Hearts though but as others have stated the games changed over the years and players should be comfortable on the weaker side

Kenny Black. 

[BackOfTheNet]

Am i right in thinking Irving’s contract expired May 31st but he had 14 day’s to decide whether or not to accept our contract offer before he officially leaves? Which means tomorrow, so we should expect some announcement either way?

[Batistuta87]

3 minutes ago, BackOfTheNet said:

Am i right in thinking Irving’s contract expired May 31st but he had 14 day’s to decide whether or not to accept our contract offer before he officially leaves? Which means tomorrow, so we should expect some announcement either way?

Yeah that was my understanding of the situation 👍🏻

[BackOfTheNet]

1 minute ago, Batistuta87 said:

Yeah that was my understanding of the situation 👍🏻

Hmmm. If that’s the case I wouldn’t expect a signing announcement tomorrow then. They wouldn’t want folk being annoyed he’s leaving and then a signing announced shortly after as if it’s someone not known to the fans would have some derision. Might just announce his departure when the Scotland game is on.

[Batistuta87]

5 minutes ago, BackOfTheNet said:

Hmmm. If that’s the case I wouldn’t expect a signing announcement tomorrow then. They wouldn’t want folk being annoyed he’s leaving and then a signing announced shortly after as if it’s someone not known to the fans would have some derision. Might just announce his departure when the Scotland game is on.

Might announce someone to calm the slight unrest I think will happen if/when we confirm he's away. I reckon he'll have a few offers within Scotland, but will be trying to sort out a move abroad. Just a guess of course. 

 

[Geoff Kilpatrick]

5 minutes ago, Batistuta87 said:

Might announce someone to calm the slight unrest I think will happen if/when we confirm he's away. I reckon he'll have a few offers within Scotland, but will be trying to sort out a move abroad. Just a guess of course. 

 

I'd love to know why there would be "slight unrest". Hearts are the biggest club he'll ever play for. He's pish.

[BackOfTheNet]

4 minutes ago, Batistuta87 said:

Might announce someone to calm the slight unrest I think will happen if/when we confirm he's away. I reckon he'll have a few offers within Scotland, but will be trying to sort out a move abroad. Just a guess of course. 

 

I can see that being the case, but it would depend who it is. For instance, if they announce Irving leaves but then Campbell signs (don’t think it will be that) then fans would be appeased. But if they announce he leaves and say, Polwarth is announced, then don’t think that one would go down as well. So it would be striking the right balance.

[Dunks]

35 minutes ago, Batistuta87 said:

Might announce someone to calm the slight unrest I think will happen if/when we confirm he's away.

 

 

[JamboAl]

1 hour ago, Kiwidoug said:

I think that if we want our best young prospects to sign extended contracts, we have to make those contracts enticing.  If £1,000 per week for us is the going rate, I suspect we will lose them for a development fee.

 

Speculate to accumulate is my view.

From where did you pluck that figure?

Are you privy to the negotiations or are you deliberately trying to make a negative case?

How much debt are you prepared to go into for your "speculate to accumulate" view?

Maybe you could back this up with examples and estimated costs of players we might think about signing for the coming season.

[Unknown user]

1 hour ago, BackOfTheNet said:

Am i right in thinking Irving’s contract expired May 31st but he had 14 day’s to decide whether or not to accept our contract offer before he officially leaves? Which means tomorrow, so we should expect some announcement either way?

I had in mind it was until the 16th but I can't remember why

Edited June 13, 2021 by Smithee

[BackOfTheNet]

7 hours ago, Smithee said:

I had in mind it was until the 16th but I can't remember why

Definitely seem to be complex, these expiring compensation due contracts

[Batistuta87]

9 hours ago, Geoff Kilpatrick said:

I'd love to know why there would be "slight unrest". Hearts are the biggest club he'll ever play for. He's pish.

Because some folk seem to believe this Porty Pirlo nickname that he has and think he's amazing. There will be people unhappy with him leaving. I'm not fussed either way what he does, but agree that currently he's not good enough to be a first team player. 

 

[Nookie Bear]

11 minutes ago, Batistuta87 said:

Because some folk seem to believe this Porty Pirlo nickname that he has and think he's amazing. There will be people unhappy with him leaving. I'm not fussed either way what he does, but agree that currently he's not good enough to be a first team player. 

 

 

It really comes down to who we replace him with. Two from Irving, Lee & Damour should have been good for us but we now need to replace them all.

[Batistuta87]

25 minutes ago, Nookie Bear said:

 

It really comes down to who we replace him with. Two from Irving, Lee & Damour should have been good for us but we now need to replace them all.

 

Personally think we'll just promote from within so to speak and will replace Irving with McGill and Finlay-Pollock; and we'll replace Lee and Damour with a single first team regular playmaker type of player who will probably push Halliday into a reduced role. That's kinda what I'm hoping for at least. 

 

[Saint Jambo]

11 hours ago, Batistuta87 said:

Might announce someone to calm the slight unrest I think will happen if/when we confirm he's away. I reckon he'll have a few offers within Scotland, but will be trying to sort out a move abroad. Just a guess of course. 

 

He might have offers in Scotland, but I'll be very surprised if he goes to another Scottish club. I'd be quite surprised if anyone in Scotland is willing to pay significantly more in wages than Hearts are willing to offer. When you consider that they would also be due Hearts a fee of several hundred thousand pounds on top of that and I'm not sure he represents value for money to anyone else in Scotland. The only realistic options for clubs in Scotland willing to both pay a fee and go above us on wages feel like Aberdeen or Hibs. I just don't see it and expect that their fans would be pretty underwhelmed by his signing. I can't imagine there are many calls for his signature on their message boards.

 

Today is the last day for him to accept the contract on offer from Hearts. After that we can announce his departure and still receive a fee when he signs for someone else. I expect to see that announcement in the next few days, followed by him signing for a lower league German team in a few weeks.

[jambocub]

11 hours ago, Geoff Kilpatrick said:

I'd love to know why there would be "slight unrest". Hearts are the biggest club he'll ever play for. He's pish.

Pretty much where I am at with irving

[Batistuta87]

44 minutes ago, Saint Jambo said:

 

He might have offers in Scotland, but I'll be very surprised if he goes to another Scottish club. I'd be quite surprised if anyone in Scotland is willing to pay significantly more in wages than Hearts are willing to offer. When you consider that they would also be due Hearts a fee of several hundred thousand pounds on top of that and I'm not sure he represents value for money to anyone else in Scotland. The only realistic options for clubs in Scotland willing to both pay a fee and go above us on wages feel like Aberdeen or Hibs. I just don't see it and expect that their fans would be pretty underwhelmed by his signing. I can't imagine there are many calls for his signature on their message boards.

 

Today is the last day for him to accept the contract on offer from Hearts. After that we can announce his departure and still receive a fee when he signs for someone else. I expect to see that announcement in the next few days, followed by him signing for a lower league German team in a few weeks.

All good points but if what another poster said is true, we're not offering him much of a wage increase on his youth salary, so other Scottish teams could probably quite easily afford to pay him more than we're offering. I'm struggling to believe that any non-Scottish sides would take a chance on him at all to be honest since he's completely unproven at any real level. An ideal scenario would be for us to sign Alan Campbell (lets say his dev fee is £500k), Irving to sign for Motherwell (lets say his dev fee is £200k), and for us to owe them the balance.

 

Edited June 14, 2021 by Batistuta87

[JamboAl]

7 minutes ago, Batistuta87 said:

All good points but if what another poster said is true, we're not offering him much of a wage increase on his youth salary, so other Scottish teams could probably quite easily afford to pay him more than we're offering. I'm struggling to believe that any non-Scottish sides would take a chance on him at all to be honest since he's completely unproven at any real level. An ideal scenario would be for us to sign Alan Campbell (lets say his dev fee is £500k), Irving to sign for Motherwell (lets say his dev fee is £200k), and for us to owe them the balance.

 

Or give them Roberts.

[John Findlay]

I wonder how many other young men in Scotland Irving's age are likely to earn £1,000pw?

We moan about how guys that age earn far to much, far to early.

Then we moan that we are not offering a very young man more than £1,000pw.

 

I wish I earned £1,000pw aged 58.

[john thomas]

1 hour ago, Saint Jambo said:

 

He might have offers in Scotland, but I'll be very surprised if he goes to another Scottish club. I'd be quite surprised if anyone in Scotland is willing to pay significantly more in wages than Hearts are willing to offer. When you consider that they would also be due Hearts a fee of several hundred thousand pounds on top of that and I'm not sure he represents value for money to anyone else in Scotland. The only realistic options for clubs in Scotland willing to both pay a fee and go above us on wages feel like Aberdeen or Hibs. I just don't see it and expect that their fans would be pretty underwhelmed by his signing. I can't imagine there are many calls for his signature on their message boards.

 

Today is the last day for him to accept the contract on offer from Hearts. After that we can announce his departure and still receive a fee when he signs for someone else. I expect to see that announcement in the next few days, followed by him signing for a lower league German team in a few weeks.

All very logical , so may well be true , or do you have information to back it up ?

[Harry Potter]

6 minutes ago, John Findlay said:

I wonder how many other young men in Scotland Irving's age are likely to earn £1,000pw?

We moan about how guys that age earn far to much, far to early.

Then we moan that we are not offering a very young man more than £1,000pw.

 

I wish I earned £1,000pw aged 58.

I had actually forgotten about him, will he stay, will he go, find out soon.

[Saint Jambo]

Just now, john thomas said:

All very logical , so may well be true , or do you have information to back it up ?

 

Nothing to back it up. Just my conjecture based on the club statement and the fact that he is registered with an agency that seems to specialise in placing Brits into German football (as mentioned by others on here). I could turn out to be totally wide of the mark.

[Japan Jambo]

has the saga ended?

[Zen Jambo]

5 minutes ago, Japan Jambo said:

has the saga ended?

It will be in 3 hours. 

[davemclaren]

32 minutes ago, Zen Jambo said:

It will be in 3 hours. 

What happens then? Is the club offer then off the table, if we want, but we have protected our compensation position?

[Zen Jambo]

5 minutes ago, davemclaren said:

What happens then? Is the club offer then off the table, if we want, but we have protected our compensation position?

Think so. This is what the club said:“Whilst Andy Irving’s contract expires today, under SPFL rules in relation to training compensation, a player has until June 14th to accept the contract offer made to him.”

 

 

[mhall37]

Andy is going to Germany.

[jr ewing]

45 minutes ago, mhall37 said:

Andy is going to Germany.

Good luck to him. Will follow with interest. 

[Kiwidoug]

2 hours ago, jr ewing said:

Good luck to him. Will follow with interest. 

You going to Germany as well then.

 

I'm much keener to see Souttar extend his contract.

[adam1998]

Cya Andy, good luck abroad - sure we’ll see you back over here soon in the future at a lesser club like the many that have left before.

 

we can now close this thread and get players that actually want to be here 

 

At least doing what we’ve done is ensure we get our development fee 👏