Levein and biased Referees

[Deevers]

Wonder which one it was. My money is on McDonald
 

 

https://www.edinburghnews.scotsman.com/sport/football/hearts/ex-hearts-boss-craig-levein-says-he-was-once-told-youre-getting-nothing-today-scottish-referee-2986337

[William H. Bonney]

Probably after either the McDonald incident or his outburst post match whilst with United. 
 

[DG_HMFC]

7 minutes ago, Deevers said:

Wonder which one it was. My money is on McDonald
 

 

https://www.edinburghnews.scotsman.com/sport/football/hearts/ex-hearts-boss-craig-levein-says-he-was-once-told-youre-getting-nothing-today-scottish-referee-2986337

 

 

Could be absolutely anybody. 

 

The bias and arrogant behaviour by refs, young and old, in this country is shocking.

[John Findlay]

I dont take these articles seriously unless these referees are named. Out them and then let them defend themselves. Levein is currently unemployed, the SFA cannot charge him.

[Cruyff]

Has to be the one when he was manager at DU and they were cheated off the park at Ibrox. It was blatant cheating. 

[Chaps]

It was around the time Levein was in a court battle with the SFA refusing to pay a fine for comments he made about McDonald after he sent off 2 of our players(can remember who) away to Killie I think it was 

[WDJ87]

Posted a rant on refs on another thread some weeks ago. They get far too much protection and I quite believe what CL has claimed, although as another poster has said, he should've named and shamed the ref. Nothing will change though. Biased, cheats, incompetent whatever you call it it will remain until the day Scottish football dies

[1971fozzy]

Could be anyone as the whole lot of them are useless, bias and incompetent.

He is never naming them. Sued for libel isn’t what he would welcome.

[davie1980]

41 minutes ago, Deevers said:

Wonder which one it was. My money is on McDonald
 

 

https://www.edinburghnews.scotsman.com/sport/football/hearts/ex-hearts-boss-craig-levein-says-he-was-once-told-youre-getting-nothing-today-scottish-referee-2986337

 

What an absolutely diabolical mess that website is. Nothing loads for ads.

 

 

And they have the cheeks to tell you it's free content and try and lure you to pay to stick around. Aye that will be right.

[Deevers]

1 minute ago, davie1980 said:

 

What an absolutely diabolical mess that website is. Nothing loads for ads.

 

 

And they have the cheeks to tell you it's free content and try and lure you to pay to stick around. Aye that will be right.

Actually in line with the whole way the EN has gone - local Newspaper my arse.

Edited September 29, 2020 by Deevers

[Jamos86]

26 minutes ago, Cruyff said:

Has to be the one when he was manager at DU and they were cheated off the park at Ibrox. It was blatant cheating. 

Was that no the rangers fan Mike McCurry ? Remember that Utd got robbed that day 

[Cruyff]

1 minute ago, Jamos86 said:

Was that no the rangers fan Mike McCurry ? Remember that Utd got robbed that day 

Aye, they were cheated off the park and Levein had an epic rant afterwards while still not saying what he really thought.

[DS98]

28 minutes ago, Cruyff said:

Aye, they were cheated off the park and Levein had an epic rant afterwards while still not saying what he really thought.

Yep. To this day even though I’m a jambo it’s one of the worst case of old firm bias I’ve ever seen. The 4 sent off at ibrox and ‘honest’ linesman Andy Davis probably edge it. 
 

Usually most refs will make the meaningless fouls a 50/50 split and give the big decisions to the OF. This was a constant 90 minutes of blatant bias. Im sure Levein said something like no matter what DU did or how well they played, they were never getting anything. 

 

[alwaysthereinspirit]

2 hours ago, John Findlay said:

I dont take these articles seriously unless these referees are named. Out them and then let them defend themselves. Levein is currently unemployed, the SFA cannot charge him.

This. If Levein is telling the truth then tell us all who it was. Let the official defend himself if need be. Truth is no one would try to get his side of the story anyway media wise.

 

[Auld Reekin']

3 hours ago, Deevers said:

Actually in line with the whole way the EN has gone - local News? My arsepaper!

 

f.t.f.y.

[Beast Boy]

3 hours ago, Chaps said:

It was around the time Levein was in a court battle with the SFA refusing to pay a fine for comments he made about McDonald after he sent off 2 of our players(can remember who) away to Killie I think it was 

 

Away at Killie. Webster and Austin McCann, I think. Although as others have said, it is maybe more likely the Dundee United game v rangers. Madden more recently at Tynecastle was a bit of a shocker too though.

[Beast Boy]

2 hours ago, DS98 said:

Yep. To this day even though I’m a jambo it’s one of the worst case of old firm bias I’ve ever seen. The 4 sent off at ibrox and ‘honest’ linesman Andy Davis probably edge it. 
 

Usually most refs will make the meaningless fouls a 50/50 split and give the big decisions to the OF. This was a constant 90 minutes of blatant bias. Im sure Levein said something like no matter what DU did or how well they played, they were never getting anything. 

 

 

Which makes a mockery of the old Fergie adage about being good enough to beat the referee and the opposition. The complicit nature of the media up here make that no longer possible.

[StevenNaismith]

Craig has told this story many times, the referee in question was Mike McCurry. 

[martoon]

5 hours ago, Cruyff said:

Has to be the one when he was manager at DU and they were cheated off the park at Ibrox. It was blatant cheating. 

 

Witnessed Hearts being cheated to a standstill many times v. the OF but that game was something else entirely. 

[feedtheroman2]

It's going to be much worse when we actually get back to playing this year..... they will have been told to put us in our place!

[thee jambo]

5 hours ago, Cruyff said:

Has to be the one when he was manager at DU and they were cheated off the park at Ibrox. It was blatant cheating. 

Was this the League Cup game ?

[martoon]

5 minutes ago, thee jambo said:

Was this the League Cup game ?

 

No, it was a league game, bud. Rangers won 3-1, iirc. Levein and Thomson hijacked the camera and the interviewer on the pitch after the game. Both incensed. 

 

The LC final was around the same time. 

[John Findlay]

19 minutes ago, thee jambo said:

Was this the League Cup game ?

No was a league game that The then Rangers had to win. McCurry went out of his way to make sure they did.

[Cruyff]

35 minutes ago, thee jambo said:

Was this the League Cup game ?

This one bud. They got proper cheated off the park. 

 

 

[Maple Leaf]

7 hours ago, DG_HMFC said:

 

 

Could be absolutely anybody. 

 

The bias and arrogant behaviour by refs, young and old, in this country is shocking.

 

Spot on. 

[Perth to Paisley]

He was mostly talking about Unconscious bias.

 

The other thing he said was when two valid charges were dropped when he got the Scotland job.

Darren B went a bit quiet on that one.

[Paolo]

8 hours ago, John Findlay said:

I dont take these articles seriously unless these referees are named. Out them and then let them defend themselves. Levein is currently unemployed, the SFA cannot charge him.

Correct.  I believe it, but nothing will change if their identities are kept secret. 

[Paolo]

2 hours ago, jonesy said:

It's a beautiful conundrum. You get plenty of folk saying the refs aren't corrupt, 'just' incompetent. Anyone who is so incompetent that they come across as being corrupt means they should be nowhere near the job!

 

 

If they are that incompetent, then that is probably worse.  

[OTT]

9 hours ago, John Findlay said:

I dont take these articles seriously unless these referees are named. Out them and then let them defend themselves. Levein is currently unemployed, the SFA cannot charge him.

 

Completely agree John. IMO Levein has an obligation to name this person. What happens if this person is training future referees and is approaching it with that kind of attitude? Would never have said that to Lennon, Rodgers, Gerrard etc. There seems to be a mindset among the referees where its okay to **** over a non-OF team because their fans won't send death threats. Look at Beaton. Police had to go to his house because he didn't give Celtic a decision, can anyone honestly say that won't cloud his judgement going forward? Effectively has to ask himself if he's okay putting his family in danger whenever he gives a decision against Celtic. 

 

Another thing. How come every single 'top' referee in Scotland is from Glasgow or the towns directly next to Glasgow? Don't tell me its because they are producing better than everyone else. Even if that was the case, why hasn't there been a change in management of the various east coast refereeing associations? Surely if Glasgow is so far ahead of country the rest of us need to change to adopt such rigorously high standards?

 

[DS98]

1 hour ago, OTT said:

 

Completely agree John. IMO Levein has an obligation to name this person. What happens if this person is training future referees and is approaching it with that kind of attitude? Would never have said that to Lennon, Rodgers, Gerrard etc. There seems to be a mindset among the referees where its okay to **** over a non-OF team because their fans won't send death threats. Look at Beaton. Police had to go to his house because he didn't give Celtic a decision, can anyone honestly say that won't cloud his judgement going forward? Effectively has to ask himself if he's okay putting his family in danger whenever he gives a decision against Celtic. 

 

Another thing. How come every single 'top' referee in Scotland is from Glasgow or the towns directly next to Glasgow? Don't tell me its because they are producing better than everyone else. Even if that was the case, why hasn't there been a change in management of the various east coast refereeing associations? Surely if Glasgow is so far ahead of country the rest of us need to change to adopt such rigorously high standards?

 

Funnily enough I found out recently that Andy Davis is still employed by the SFA and coaches linesmen these days!

 

There is some ridiculous stat that on only 3 or 4 occasions in the last 140 years that an Edinburgh referee has took changed of a Scottish Cup Final. There was a whistleblower referee (Bee?) who lifted the lid on the geographical bias. 

[BEDNAR BOY]

That Bee guy was brilliant with his ref stats at Shareholders Dinner . Purely stating the stats and let us make up our own mind.

Mind boggling stuff, get him and a selection of his stats / facts on here.

[Jambo92]

I'm keen to see VAR in Scotland to see how hilarious it would be

[BEDNAR BOY]

Think I remember him as an Assistant, one of the few that wore long sleeves.

maybe covering the Jambo tattoo?

[Deevers]

13 hours ago, DS98 said:

Funnily enough I found out recently that Andy Davis is still employed by the SFA and coaches linesmen these days!

 

There is some ridiculous stat that on only 3 or 4 occasions in the last 140 years that an Edinburgh referee has took changed of a Scottish Cup Final. There was a whistleblower referee (Bee?) who lifted the lid on the geographical bias. 

So is Dougie MacDonald I believe as a referee supervisor I think.

[Harry Potter]

On 29/09/2020 at 08:44, WDJ87 said:

Posted a rant on refs on another thread some weeks ago. They get far too much protection and I quite believe what CL has claimed, although as another poster has said, he should've named and shamed the ref. Nothing will change though. Biased, cheats, incompetent whatever you call it it will remain until the day Scottish football dies

Thats the problem they never get pulled up for stupid decisions, mind you, employed by clowns.

 

[Rogue Daddy]

11 hours ago, Jambo92 said:

I'm keen to see VAR in Scotland to see how hilarious it would be

At least VAR 'may' remove some argument (or blame on the refs part.... where the orks are concerned). 

But, it is Scotland, so they'll fcuk it up somehow and use it to the benefit of the uglies. It will be a 'must' that a shellick and sevco VAR official is present at all times.

[colinmaroon]

I think it's MacDonald.  And for those saying he should name the ref, I take it that you know nothing about the defamation law in Scotland.  No witnesses!  He would leave himself wide open and would lose the case.

 

 

[Deevers]

1 hour ago, Harry Potter said:

Thats the problem they never get pulled up for stupid decisions, mind you, employed by clowns.

 

I was told an interesting story from an impeccable source - a few years ago a well known Glasgow based referee had an absolute shocker at Tynecastle (no real surprise there).  The referee supervisor who sat in the main stand submitted a report that classed the performance as “unsatisfactory”.  I’m told that the supervisor was then contacted by “someone” at Hampden and told to amend the mark and report to show it as being “satisfactory”.  This was refused.  Guess what the outcome was. Yes, the supervisor was taken off the list.  

Edited September 30, 2020 by Deevers

[Harry Potter]

1 hour ago, Deevers said:

I was told an interesting story from an impeccable source - a few years ago a well known Glasgow based referee had an absolute shocker at Tynecastle (no real surprise there).  The referee supervisor who sat in the main stand submitted a report that classed the performance as “unsatisfactory”.  I’m told that the supervisor was then contacted by “someone” at Hampden and told to amend the mark and report to show it as being “satisfactory”.  This was refused.  Guess what the outcome was. Yes, the supervisor was taken off the list.  

Thanks for that Deevers, no real surprise there to be honest, they have no shame, 

[Harry Potter]

7 minutes ago, jonnothejambo said:

 

Aye,  we may only beat teams by three most weeks....

😀

[cocobeab]

Off topic slightly but was once told by a Sky Sports employee that Levein was pretty much universally disliked by all in the Scottish media. Be interesting to see if there’s any upturn in the reporting of Hearts or whether we still get the slaggings of the last few years 

Edited September 30, 2020 by cocobeab

[Nookie Bear]

That McDonald performance at Killie was the worst and most blatantly corrupt I have ever witnessed. 
 

I’ve seen bad decisions in big games but that was 90 minutes of farce. 
 

Closely followed by his performance at Livvy where he kept lecturing Fuller for having the cheek to be kicked off the pitch.  Think Maybury got sent off that day. 
On the bright side, the Livvy drummer got his drum trashed afterwards 😁

[colinmaroon]

12 minutes ago, Nookie Bear said:

That McDonald performance at Killie was the worst and most blatantly corrupt I have ever witnessed. 
 

I’ve seen bad decisions in big games but that was 90 minutes of farce. 
 

Closely followed by his performance at Livvy where he kept lecturing Fuller for having the cheek to be kicked off the pitch.  Think Maybury got sent off that day. 
On the bright side, the Livvy drummer got his drum trashed afterwards 😁

 

 

Not forgetting his Cup Final denial of a blatant penalty on Rudi.

[colinmaroon]

56 minutes ago, jonnothejambo said:

 

I recall that McCurry became a man of the cloth when he finished giving the Hun everything for years.

 

https://www.dailyrecord.co.uk/news/scottish-news/exclusive-scandal-referee-mike-mccurry-1043504

 

As a minister myself I can hardly put into words how I feel about that.  I will say, if he's still a fulltime pastor of a church, and he's got time for his cabaret tours etc., he's not doing his job properly.  

 

No wonder the church is where it is!

[Anything2]

4 hours ago, Rogue Daddy said:

At least VAR 'may' remove some argument (or blame on the refs part.... where the orks are concerned). 

But, it is Scotland, so they'll fcuk it up somehow and use it to the benefit of the uglies. It will be a 'must' that a shellick and sevco VAR official is present at all times.

My concern with VAR in Scotland would be that they would only review incidents that favour their team of choice or if a decision in favour of the OF was shown to be wrong they would say it wasn't an obvious error and give them a penalty anyway. The media would back them, think about last year's cup final. All anyone was talking about was that Zlamal shouldn't have came out and hesitated the way he did. The fact that it was a dive didn't seem to matter. The media totally set control the narrative on these things. 

[Dusk_Till_Dawn]

Is there anyone in Scotland who does like Levein?

[John Findlay]

46 minutes ago, Nookie Bear said:

That McDonald performance at Killie was the worst and most blatantly corrupt I have ever witnessed. 
 

I’ve seen bad decisions in big games but that was 90 minutes of farce. 
 

Closely followed by his performance at Livvy where he kept lecturing Fuller for having the cheek to be kicked off the pitch.  Think Maybury got sent off that day. 
On the bright side, the Livvy drummer got his drum trashed afterwards 😁

Funnily enough I thought he was a cheating basteward in the 2006 cup final.

[Rogue Daddy]

6 minutes ago, Anything2 said:

My concern with VAR in Scotland would be that they would only review incidents that favour their team of choice or if a decision in favour of the OF was shown to be wrong they would say it wasn't an obvious error and give them a penalty anyway. The media would back them, think about last year's cup final. All anyone was talking about was that Zlamal shouldn't have came out and hesitated the way he did. The fact that it was a dive didn't seem to matter. The media totally set control the narrative on these things. 

There's definitely nothing surer than the fact it would be manipulated to suit the uglies. No question. If there's a country that requires non-national referees, it us. Just another thing in a long list that ensures an uneven playing field in favour of the arse-cheeks.

[Nookie Bear]

38 minutes ago, colinmaroon said:

 

 

Not forgetting his Cup Final denial of a blatant penalty on Rudi.

 

Of course, but the Killie and Livvy games were sustained acts of cheating.

[Nookie Bear]

1 hour ago, cocobeab said:

Off topic slightly but was once told by a Sky Sports employee that Levein was pretty much universally disliked by all in the Scottish media. Be interesting to see if there’s any upturn in the reporting of Hearts or whether we still get the slaggings of the last few years 

 

That's in Levein's favour imo because the vast majority of the Scottish media are absolute *****.

 

And the answer to your secind sentence is 'no chance', as we have already seen this summer.