All Home games to be streamed for ST Holders

[David McCaig]

4 minutes ago, Geoff Kilpatrick said:

I think if a supporter contacted Trading Standards about this, HMFC would be paying out refunds left, right and centre.

 

I'll enjoy the extra camera angles though!

A sure fire way of sending Hearts into admin!!  Presumably someone needs to be an actual Hearts ST holder to make this complaint... great opportunity for a Hibee to kill the club if not.

[Des Lynam]

6 minutes ago, Paul Shark said:

Has the club announced the cost of pay per view games ? Looks like its going to be ridiculously expensive as it's surely going to have to be more than a season ticket holder pays ?

What would you price it at? I think the chances of anyone paying £25 a game to stream Hearts games is minimal. 

[King Of The Cat Cafe]

On a technical note, I am a bit puzzled by one line in the club statement:

 

"We have no cameras within Tynecastle as we would have in the Premiership, so need to arrange and pay for the camera and production facilities in order to stream the games."

 

I always thought - perhaps mistakenly - that the club had its own cameras and operators for Hearts TV international streaming.

 

Perhaps someone more techie than me will be able to explain what is different about the set-up for streaming domestically and that for streaming internationally.

 

(And, no, this is not another of those "always look for something to blame the club for" posts.)

 

 

 

[GinRummy]

2 minutes ago, Des Lynam said:

What would you price it at? I think the chances of anyone paying £25 a game to stream Hearts games is minimal. 

I disagree. People will pay that. 

[iainmac]

Just now, GinRummy said:

I disagree. People will pay that. 

 

Some people are paying more than that........

[Bluesy1874]

Quite pleased with this. Means I don't have to sit next to the usual reprobates moaning their faces off for us to get it up the park, to then moan again because possession has been gifted back to the other team.

 

Unless ofcourse that's included in the virtual matchday experience 😂

 

[Paul Shark]

4 minutes ago, David McCaig said:

Has anyone come with a credible plan of how the club pays the players this season without Season Ticket revenue and next to no tv income?

 

Presumably everyone moaning about Hearts streaming these matches is outraged at the signing of Popescu and incandescent about the return of Craig Gordon.  I assume they would be much happier if we had filed for admin, released all senior players and been relegated to League One?

Are people really "incandescent" about things ? Having bought a season ticket for myself and an under 16 one for my son, I have to say that I would be mildly irritated if people could watch games cheaper ppv. 

[David McCaig]

3 minutes ago, King Of The Cat Cafe said:

On a technical note, I am a bit puzzled by one line in the club statement:

 

"We have no cameras within Tynecastle as we would have in the Premiership, so need to arrange and pay for the camera and production facilities in order to stream the games."

 

I always thought - perhaps mistakenly - that the club had its own cameras and operators for Hearts TV international streaming.

 

Perhaps someone more techie than me will be able to explain what is different about the set-up for streaming domestically and that for streaming internationally.

 

(And, no, this is not another of those "always look for something to blame the club for" posts.)

 

 

 

 

I think what they are saying is that the streaming being proposed has to be of professional broadcast quality.

[GinRummy]

1 minute ago, iainmac said:

 

Some people are paying more than that........

Yep. If the TV games are priced at 20-25 folk will pay it. 

[gashauskis9]

16 minutes ago, Juho_Makela_Goal_Machine said:

This, to me, is the worst thing they've done all Summer. Ripping off their own fans who have stood by them time after time. It's not on. They made a guarantee about 18 games at Tynecastle and they have to honour their side of that deal. As a season ticket holder, I would happily pay the pay-per-view cost for every game if it meant that my games at Tynecastle were not used up. Utter farce. 

Even if, by attending those 18 games next season as a credit from this season, the club goes to the wall because there’s no ticket revenue?

[Paolo]

1 minute ago, iainmac said:

 

Some people are paying more than that........

Yes.  A household could be lying upwards of £100 a game. 

[Paul Shark]

4 minutes ago, Des Lynam said:

What would you price it at? I think the chances of anyone paying £25 a game to stream Hearts games is minimal. 

More expensive than the most expensive season ticket I would expect.

[Boof]

9 minutes ago, GinRummy said:

My dad stayed in Kirkwall ...

 

Ah - a bit further north for me, though I'm sure there are still plenty of Orcadian Jambos.

[Dusk_Till_Dawn]

48 minutes ago, Bull's-eye said:

 

I really feel sorry for you.

 

I read the news yesterday that I was finally going to get to watch Hearts play football again. My skin tingled, got goosebumps, my stomach turned a little and the excitement kicked in, I planned ahead in my mind in milliseconds how I'm going to spend the day and I instantly go into happy mode knowing no matter what Shite lay's ahead over the coming days and into next week, I finally have something to look forward to. 

 

You don't, that's really sad.

That’s because you’re such a huge, massive Uber-fan and an example to us all.

 

Weirdly though, you didn’t seem to give a **** about being bottom of the league so I assume you’re not actually interested in football.

[GinRummy]

Just now, Boof said:

 

Ah - a bit further north for me, though I'm sure there are still plenty of Orcadian Jambos.

Thought you were Orkney. My mistake. Must be getting you mixed up. 👍

[iainmac]

6 minutes ago, JamboAl1965 said:

Im happy with it. Paid my money it’s gone and done. Cant wait to see the team. Onwards and upwards. 

 

I've paid my money and I won't be asking for a refund but that doesn't mean I'm happy with it, or even the way the club has handled the communication.

 

Just forget this was Hearts for a minute and transpose this Corporate behaviour to any other sector. Their customers would be outraged.

[jambocub]

Has anyone contacted the club ?

[graygo]

21 minutes ago, iainmac said:

 

I think this means that they are paying a 3rd party to bring their cameras in - this tweet might explain it.

 

 

 

Yes I get that, I meant that the 5 figure sum involved would be covered by about 100 season tickets so not a great means of justifying including it in everyone's season ticket.

[AGoodLaugh]

18 minutes ago, Paul Shark said:

Has the club announced the cost of pay per view games ? Looks like its going to be ridiculously expensive as it's surely going to have to be more than a season ticket holder pays ?

This is the thing, it surely either has to be more than a platinum season ticket which over 14 games would be more than £30 per game. Or it's less than that and platinum ticket holders are screwed even further. They've really backed themselves into a corner as it stands. 

[Nookie Bear]

25 minutes ago, davemclaren said:

They should have a camera in all three segments of each stand so you get a bronze/gold/platinum view depending on your ticket. 
 

 I should have been in marketing  😎

😂

 

 

🤔

[iainmac]

2 minutes ago, graygo said:

 

Yes I get that, I meant that the 5 figure sum involved would be covered by about 100 season tickets so not a great means of justifying including it in everyone's season ticket.

 

I know - my point was the "investment" makes it sound as if we were actually buying the equipment, therefore justifying the streaming shambles.

Edited September 17, 2020 by iainmac

[Beast Boy]

19 minutes ago, David McCaig said:

Has anyone come with a credible plan of how the club pays the players this season without Season Ticket revenue and next to no tv income?

 

Presumably everyone moaning about Hearts streaming these matches is outraged at the signing of Popescu and incandescent about the return of Craig Gordon.  I assume they would be much happier if we had filed for admin, released all senior players and been relegated to League One?

 

No, but someone said "that's for the club to figure out", so we all just moved on from that, and saw it as case closed. 🤪

 

 

Edited September 17, 2020 by Beast Boy

[tokyowalnut]

I decided on the last day to renew with the full expectation of not seeing a game 'in person' during 2020. £450 is a lot of money to me and but I bought with the knowledge that my 21/22 season ticket may be cheaper due to the guarantee on offer.

 

I'm happy with the offer yesterday. 4 games will come off the price of next seasons ticket and I am lucky enough that can stream the game at home. Win win, for me anyway! 

 

I do feel for households that have multiple tickets though, Hearts should offer something back for those in that situation. 

 

It does seem that whatever the club do people will always find a way to have a moan. How people can be bothered to be angry and negative all the time?! 

 

 

[graygo]

2 minutes ago, iainmac said:

 

I know - my point was the "investment" makes it sound as if we were actually buying the equipment, therefore justifying the streaming shambles.

 

Ah right, yes I assumed it was a capital investment as well.

[AGoodLaugh]

17 minutes ago, David McCaig said:

Has anyone come with a credible plan of how the club pays the players this season without Season Ticket revenue and next to no tv income?

 

Presumably everyone moaning about Hearts streaming these matches is outraged at the signing of Popescu and incandescent about the return of Craig Gordon.  I assume they would be much happier if we had filed for admin, released all senior players and been relegated to League One?

Don't use the season tickets for the streams, save them for when the stadium can actually open, and everyone just pays for the pay per view separately. Alternatively give season ticket holders the option of using their tickets for streams *if they want to*. There are definitely better solutions available. 

[Dusk_Till_Dawn]

1 minute ago, tokyowalnut said:

I decided on the last day to renew with the full expectation of not seeing a game 'in person' during 2020. £450 is a lot of money to me and but I bought with the knowledge that my 21/22 season ticket may be cheaper due to the guarantee on offer.

 

I'm happy with the offer yesterday. 4 games will come off the price of next seasons ticket and I am lucky enough that can stream the game at home. Win win, for me anyway! 

 

I do feel for households that have multiple tickets though, Hearts should offer something back for those in that situation. 

 

It does seem that whatever the club do people will always find a way to have a moan. How people can be bothered to be angry and negative all the time?! 

 

 

The multiple household ticket holders is the only area where I see a problem. Seemed clear to me when I bought mine that we might have to trade games for streams.

 

No-one else in my house has one so I’m not affected that way but I can’t argue with people who are a bit frustrated by that.

[Bull's-eye]

11 minutes ago, Dusk_Till_Dawn said:

That’s because you’re such a huge, massive Uber-fan and an example to us all.

 

Weirdly though, you didn’t seem to give a **** about being bottom of the league so I assume you’re not actually interested in football.

 

I didn't like being bottom of the league. 

 

Next ridiculous insinuation. 

[scotty2442]

38 minutes ago, Stone1992 said:

Sensible thing to do would surely be if you have a ST then you have 18 credits to be used against live matches at Tynie when they are back on that can be used for league games only. 
 

Then for streamed games just charge everyone per game who wants to watch with option to use a credit from your 18 if you prefer. Means houses with multiple tickets won’t be getting shafted and club still makes some income without upsetting a lot of ST holders. 
 

 

Exactly this 

 

Households with multiple season tickets have really been shafted with this and I hope the club rectify this 

 

The 18 game guarantee didn’t come with an asterisk saying some of those could be “virtual” 

 

We have 3 adult platinum 1 one child platinum season tickets in our house, at a cost of more than £1500....that means as a household to watch a stream will technically cost us around £85 per match. 

[Farmer1]

6 minutes ago, jambocub said:

Has anyone contacted the club ?

I sent an email last night, I’m not overly pleased with how they handled it so instead of moaning on JKB I emailed to see if they would re-consider their decision or at least provide some clarity. 
 

Although I’m doubtful, hopefully the message gets through to the people who made the decision and not just the customer service team etc who will receive the bulk of emails.  

[Beast Boy]

6 minutes ago, AGoodLaugh said:

Don't use the season tickets for the streams, save them for when the stadium can actually open, and everyone just pays for the pay per view separately. Alternatively give season ticket holders the option of using their tickets for streams *if they want to*. There are definitely better solutions available. 

 

I wouldn't have been happy with this suggestion. I don't want to have to pay more money on top of my season ticket and FoH subs to watch us play at home, and I don't want us to have a weaker squad this season because people only pay Hearts TV money and it doesn't cover teh wages. I also don't want us to return to teh Premiership with a massive gap in our finances, like what would happen, if people didn't have to buy season tickets for that season.

[JamboNation]

3 minutes ago, Beast Boy said:

wouldn't have been happy with this suggestion. I don't want to have to pay more money on top of my season ticket and FoH subs to watch us play at home, and I don't want us to have a weaker squad this season because people only pay Hearts TV money and it doesn't cover teh wages. I also don't want us to return to teh Premiership with a massive gap in our finances, like what would happen, if

This in spades!

[tamanov]

When I purchased my season ticket I was under no illusion that I would not see all of our home games this season and there was (and still is) a real possibility I won’t see any.

I bought my ticket to support the club. 

This pandemic is far from over and the situation seems to change daily, as does government advice and guidelines, yet people are up in arms about a statement the club made ages ago based on information available to them at the time. 

If paying my season ticket money, FOH contributions and buying products online is helping the club to put a team on the park then I will be doing the same next season and beyond. 

If the safest option available is to stream games so I can watch the team without putting myself, my family or anyone else at risk then that’s fine by me. I am counting the days till I can watch us play Partick Thistle!!

I am as desperate as any fan to get back to having a few pre match beers, then walking into Tynecastle, but these are unprecedented times.
If anyone genuinely feels that during all this turmoil the club deliberately duped them into buying a season ticket then ask for a refund, you are entitled to your opinion that is your right. 
I have much greater faith in the club than that. 

[TheOak88]

7 minutes ago, Beast Boy said:

 

I wouldn't have been happy with this suggestion. I don't want to have to pay more money on top of my season ticket and FoH subs to watch us play at home, and I don't want us to have a weaker squad this season because people only pay Hearts TV money and it doesn't cover teh wages. I also don't want us to return to teh Premiership with a massive gap in our finances, like what would happen, if people didn't have to buy season tickets for that season.

 

His suggestion was you could choose to trade game credits on your season ticket for stream games, so you would not have to pay more on top of your ST. 

[Jim Panzee]

24 minutes ago, iainmac said:

 

I've paid my money and I won't be asking for a refund but that doesn't mean I'm happy with it, or even the way the club has handled the communication.

 

Just forget this was Hearts for a minute and transpose this Corporate behaviour to any other sector. Their customers would be outraged.

 

ah - but football / sport is different?.......football supporters have an emotional tie to a club as opposed to other forms of entertainment. Agree with your point if comparing to, for example, people who visit the cinema regularly. If said cinema annoys them, they just go take their custom to another cinema. can't quite do that with footy.

[Sirudi]

17 minutes ago, jambocub said:

Has anyone contacted the club ?

I emailed the club Yesterday to inform them that I was disappointed with the lack of transparency with supporters and believed the whole episode could and should have been handled better. Nothing new there.

On a personal note, as I have no computer but I do have a guarantee of “access” to live football, both at and from Tynecastle, I asked the club to confirm if they would be supplying me with one.  Nothing top of the range required, just enough for the football.

If they were not, what were my options ?

 

No reply yet.

[Newton51]

Both home games are on premier sports if club are charging ppv.

[TheOak88]

Just now, Jim Panzee said:

 

ah - but football / sport is different?.......football supporters have an emotional tie to a club as opposed to other forms of entertainment. Agree with your point if comparing to, for example, people who visit the cinema regularly. If said cinema annoys them, they just go take their custom to another cinema. can't quite do that with footy.

 

Is it ok for club owners to exploit that emotional connection tho?

[Jim Panzee]

1 minute ago, TheOak88 said:

 

Is it ok for club owners to exploit that emotional connection tho?

in an ideal world, you wouldn't want to see any exploitation - but it happens - e.g. numerous versions of strips that are created, season ticket prices for some EPL clubs are eye watering - but make up a fraction of those club's incomes etc  

[davemclaren]

4 minutes ago, Newton51 said:

Both home games are on premier sports if club are charging ppv.

I doubt the club will stream them in the UK if Premier have the rights. 

[merseyjambo]

15 minutes ago, AGoodLaugh said:

Don't use the season tickets for the streams, save them for when the stadium can actually open, and everyone just pays for the pay per view separately. Alternatively give season ticket holders the option of using their tickets for streams *if they want to*. There are definitely better solutions available. 

 

Don’t be ridiculous. The club have zero idea how many people would go for pay per view games.

 

They have already said that realistically we need promotion this year.

 

We have a salary bill of at least 5m.

 

At £20 per game we would need a take up of at least 18000 people to break even on salary bill. Let those figures sink in. That is above our average attendance when you consider that we have OF, vermin and Aberdeen fans coming At least 5 times a season.

 

There is already a financial hole this year thanks to demotion. We got no compensation to cover it.

 

You tell me what the better solution is. Get rid of our players and not get promoted? Ask the bank for money to cover this seasons shortfall? Go into serious debt? Go into administration ? What is the best solution, because as far as I can see, those would be the only options available to us

[fbjambo]

I’m in the ‘I’ve paid my money’ camp - kinda knew it would be partly a donation when I bought it and that it the decision. I made. Will see how it all plays out - it’s says all home games - does this include cup games (already includes friendlies). 

 

 

[iainmac]

8 minutes ago, Jim Panzee said:

 

ah - but football / sport is different?.......football supporters have an emotional tie to a club as opposed to other forms of entertainment. Agree with your point if comparing to, for example, people who visit the cinema regularly. If said cinema annoys them, they just go take their custom to another cinema. can't quite do that with footy.

 

Exactly. The club are relying on that a bit too often these days - for my liking anyway.

[Greedy Jambo]

38 minutes ago, GinRummy said:

Yep. If the TV games are priced at 20-25 folk will pay it. 

 

I wouldn't pay that for a game in an empty stadium like, no danger. 

I think 12.99 per game should be the max. 

[Jambo-Fox]

2 hours ago, Paulp74 said:

I agree. There are people on here who criticise everything the club does but there are also people who can see the club do no wrong. It's a big spectrum of views with the majority somewhere in between those two extremes.

 

The point I'm making though is that the highlighted section of your post above says someone with positive views of the club are wrongly classed as "happy clappers" but you're then classing people as moaners and simplistic if they have a negative view on this decision. Yes, some of those will be the ones we all know can't wait to take a pop at the club but the majority seem to be people who purely dont agree with this move and are mainly positive about the club.

 

Just accept that people will have different views on things. Your view is as valid as someone else's so there is no need to get personal if someone has a different opinion to yours. 

Well said! Hopefully your comments are noted! Unlikely but one can but be optimistic!

[Poseidon]

29 minutes ago, AGoodLaugh said:

Don't use the season tickets for the streams, save them for when the stadium can actually open, and everyone just pays for the pay per view separately. Alternatively give season ticket holders the option of using their tickets for streams *if they want to*. There are definitely better solutions available. 

 

20 minutes ago, Beast Boy said:

 

I wouldn't have been happy with this suggestion. I don't want to have to pay more money on top of my season ticket and FoH subs to watch us play at home, and I don't want us to have a weaker squad this season because people only pay Hearts TV money and it doesn't cover teh wages. I also don't want us to return to teh Premiership with a massive gap in our finances, like what would happen, if people didn't have to buy season tickets for that season.

 

I posted this a couple of pages ago - seems to cover both your points

 

2 hours ago, Poseidon said:

Pretty crap situation all round.

 

Some suggestions how this could have been dealt with better;

 

Acknowledge change in circumstances, apologise and offer a few options;

 

ST holder agrees a couple of weeks in advance of each game whether they a) want to use 1 from their ST 'book' to watch the match online, b) Buy a stream for that game for a flat £20 say whilst deferring their ST game til next season c) defer it to next season.

 

a - gets round folk with no money just now and/or want to see the game regardless or where multiple family members have purchased (one chooses opt A, others choose C)

b - gets round folk who are upset at paying over the odds for a stream compared to others

c - for everyone else (watching with others, unable to stream etc etc)

 

once the numbers of streamers are then known, Hearts could then sell single game packages to non-ST holders for £20 (or £22 if trying to give ST holders a discount). You would hopefully get a decent number up to the max we are allowed to sell (capped as last season's ST numbers?)

 

This can obviously start to build a wee pot of money to make up for the dent in next Season's ST income but hopefully marketed correctly (no sniggering at the back) we could get a lot of single game purchasers. The only thing I can think of that might cause a problem is if this causes more tax to be paid in one financial year etc but I'm sure some creative accounting would have been able to get round this.

 

Also means that if by some miracle we get back into the grounds after say 6 of the 14 league games then it can reverts to standard ST T&Cs.

 

If club were worried too many were choosing option C then numbers could be capped, or could limit it to those who can prove multiple STs at same address for example.

 

Sure, quite tricky to administer but not impossible.

 

 

 

I'm quite lucky in that we tend to buy 2 tickets between 3 of us as we can't all attend and this will probably work out pretty well in that for the occasions we all want to watch a match one of us goes and watches it with another. 

 

 

[Jim Panzee]

1 minute ago, iainmac said:

 

Exactly. The club are relying on that a bit too often these days - for my liking anyway.

if you step back and analyse value for money, football is not good at all. Walk up dad & son (concession) to watch an average game -  around £35? cinema tickets for Dad & son -  20 quid ish? Both give 90 mins entertainment. One with a comfy seat and almost zero risk of a vein popping, spittle spraying maniac next to you

[Greedy Jambo]

Just for comparison. 

 

 

[Gorgie Boot boy]

Place is mental

[davemclaren]

Just now, Greedy Jambo said:

Just for comparison. 

 

 

You don’t get Hearts matches though. 

[Greedy Jambo]

2 minutes ago, davemclaren said:

You don’t get Hearts matches though. 

Not the point.