jake Posted August 22, 2020 Share Posted August 22, 2020 https://twitter.com/i/status/1296725142643539968 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
superjack Posted August 22, 2020 Share Posted August 22, 2020 3 minutes ago, jake said: https://twitter.com/i/status/1296725142643539968 I think 55 years isn't enough for him. I'm not in favour of the death penalty usually but I find it hard to argue against the use of it for this murdering *******. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
AlphonseCapone Posted August 22, 2020 Share Posted August 22, 2020 Emotionally, absolutely not. Legally, I've no idea about English law but presume the judge was within his rights or he wouldn't have sentenced him to it. Overall, lock up him up for the longest possible time legally and if that's forever then good. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Eldar Hadzimehmedovic Posted August 22, 2020 Share Posted August 22, 2020 Who is she? What's her position? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
jake Posted August 22, 2020 Author Share Posted August 22, 2020 2 minutes ago, Eldar Hadzimehmedovic said: Who is she? What's her position? I dont know . I came across this on another site . Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Governor Tarkin Posted August 22, 2020 Share Posted August 22, 2020 (edited) I'm sure there are many of us who posess the moral flexibility required to pull the trigger on the **** ourselves with barely a second thought, but the lassie might have a point. The line between justice, punishment, and retribution is blurred, so there's no harm in any objective scrutiny that her questions may encourage. He who fights monsters... Edited August 22, 2020 by Governor Tarkin Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Cade Posted August 22, 2020 Share Posted August 22, 2020 Judges are given the power to determine a range of punishments and length of any jail terms specifically so that they can hand down each sentence on a case by case basis. Since no two cases are ever the same, no two punishments are ever the same. Sometimes people think a sentence is overly harsh and others are seen as unduly lenient. This is both a strength and a weakness of our legal system. The ability for punishments to be altered to fit each case is a strength. But it's a weakness to rely on the opinions of a single human being to pass judgement and this sometimes results in either overly harsh or very light sentences. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
hughesie27 Posted August 22, 2020 Share Posted August 22, 2020 Is her angle that he was only given such a long sentence because of his race/ethnicity? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Jeff Posted August 22, 2020 Share Posted August 22, 2020 So far left she's just found a Jake Mulraney cross Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Eldar Hadzimehmedovic Posted August 22, 2020 Share Posted August 22, 2020 Here's a textbook example of mental internet behaviour. A clip is posted with not a lot of context. None of us know who the woman, who she represents, or what position she's advocating overall. Eight posts in and we're already getting close to criticising "the left". Another few posts and we'll be back and forth culture warring. All from a tiny snippet of a video none of us know anything about. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
frankblack Posted August 22, 2020 Share Posted August 22, 2020 Hopefully he gets a cell with a white supremacist that is built like a brick shithouse. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Riddley Walker Posted August 22, 2020 Share Posted August 22, 2020 76 before he's due for parole. Way worse than a death sentence. Shame. The woman is so far off with her point. The UK in general is relatively lenient with sentencing, although Scotland is considerably more lenient than England and Wales. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Weakened Offender Posted August 22, 2020 Share Posted August 22, 2020 26 minutes ago, Eldar Hadzimehmedovic said: Here's a textbook example of mental internet behaviour. A clip is posted with not a lot of context. None of us know who the woman, who she represents, or what position she's advocating overall. Eight posts in and we're already getting close to criticising "the left". Another few posts and we'll be back and forth culture warring. All from a tiny snippet of a video none of us know anything about. Perfect. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Der Kaiser Posted August 22, 2020 Share Posted August 22, 2020 As Louis CK said.... The law against murder is the number one thing preventing murder. Never understood how premeditated murder can mean 10-15 years. Take a life then your access to your own one should be taken too imho. Here's 4 walls and a toilet. They're yours until you die. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
ri Alban Posted August 22, 2020 Share Posted August 22, 2020 Kill the *****! Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
doctor jambo Posted August 22, 2020 Share Posted August 22, 2020 5 minutes ago, ri Alban said: Kill the *****! Kill the lefty? bit harsh mate Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
ri Alban Posted August 22, 2020 Share Posted August 22, 2020 46 minutes ago, doctor jambo said: Kill the lefty? bit harsh mate Kill the child killing terrorist. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Madjambo21 Posted August 22, 2020 Share Posted August 22, 2020 7 hours ago, Gone said: So far left she's just found a Jake Mulraney cross 🤣 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
The Internet Posted August 23, 2020 Share Posted August 23, 2020 17 hours ago, Eldar Hadzimehmedovic said: Here's a textbook example of mental internet behaviour. A clip is posted with not a lot of context. None of us know who the woman, who she represents, or what position she's advocating overall. Eight posts in and we're already getting close to criticising "the left". Another few posts and we'll be back and forth culture warring. All from a tiny snippet of a video none of us know anything about. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Francis Albert Posted August 23, 2020 Share Posted August 23, 2020 (edited) 18 hours ago, Eldar Hadzimehmedovic said: Here's a textbook example of mental internet behaviour. A clip is posted with not a lot of context. None of us know who the woman, who she represents, or what position she's advocating overall. Eight posts in and we're already getting close to criticising "the left". Another few posts and we'll be back and forth culture warring. All from a tiny snippet of a video none of us know anything about. There is enough context in the clip to answer the OP's question. For me the answer is No. He won't serve 55 years. He will be out in plenty of time to enjoy decades more life than most of those murdered had. If you want balanced, in depth and reasoned discussion then the internet is probably something to be avoided. Edited August 23, 2020 by Francis Albert Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Riddley Walker Posted August 23, 2020 Share Posted August 23, 2020 8 minutes ago, Francis Albert said: There is enough context in the clip to answer the OP's question. For me the answer is No. He won't serve 55 years. He will be out in plenty of time to enjoy decades more life than most of those murdered had. If you want balanced, in depth and reasoned discussion then the internet is probably something to be avoided. No, he will serve 55 years minimum. He's received a life sentence and 55 years is the earliest he will receive parole. Those on life sentences don't get out a day before their tariff, and usually stay in quite a bit longer, if not forever. Life sentences fit a different sentencing structure than other criminal sentences. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Francis Albert Posted August 23, 2020 Share Posted August 23, 2020 27 minutes ago, Riddley Walker said: No, he will serve 55 years minimum. He's received a life sentence and 55 years is the earliest he will receive parole. Those on life sentences don't get out a day before their tariff, and usually stay in quite a bit longer, if not forever. Life sentences fit a different sentencing structure than other criminal sentences. Thanks for the correction. That is comforting. Although a lot can change in 55 years. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
The Internet Posted August 23, 2020 Share Posted August 23, 2020 Muslims will have probably taken over by then and let him out early eh. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Sooperstar Posted August 23, 2020 Share Posted August 23, 2020 Francis not being able to understand what a minimum sentence is has made my morning. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Francis Albert Posted August 23, 2020 Share Posted August 23, 2020 5 minutes ago, Mauricio Pinilla said: Muslims will have probably taken over by then and let him out early eh. The race card was bound to be played. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Francis Albert Posted August 23, 2020 Share Posted August 23, 2020 1 minute ago, Sooperstar said: Francis not being able to understand what a minimum sentence is has made my morning. Sorry to hear that is the highlight of your morning. Hope the rest of your day picks up. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
JudyJudyJudy Posted August 23, 2020 Share Posted August 23, 2020 Yes he deserves that long sentence and will serve it unless he dies before that time . I can’t see anyone disagreeing with that Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Jamstomorrow Posted August 23, 2020 Share Posted August 23, 2020 If he was executed he would be seen as a martyr. He then becomes entitled to his dozens of virgins in heaven. Time he gets out of jail now, I imagine 1 virgin would likely to be remaining so! On the other hand,the price of a rope would be much, much less than the cost of keeping him in jail. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Sooperstar Posted August 23, 2020 Share Posted August 23, 2020 49 minutes ago, Francis Albert said: Sorry to hear that is the highlight of your morning. Hope the rest of your day picks up. I got to bed at half 3 and I'm only just out it. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
NANOJAMBO Posted August 23, 2020 Share Posted August 23, 2020 1 hour ago, Sooperstar said: Francis not being able to understand what a minimum sentence is has made my morning. LOL. He gets corrected and then has the bad grace to suggest he might still be right cos , y'know, 55 years is a long time. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Francis Albert Posted August 23, 2020 Share Posted August 23, 2020 16 minutes ago, NANOJAMBO said: LOL. He gets corrected and then has the bad grace to suggest he might still be right cos , y'know, 55 years is a long time. I thanked the poster who corrected me. What should I do to atone ? ... get out the ritual disembowelling sword?. Tell you what I will bet any amount you want he won't serve 55 years! Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
ri Alban Posted August 23, 2020 Share Posted August 23, 2020 9 minutes ago, Francis Albert said: I thanked the poster who corrected me. What should I do to atone ? ... get out the ritual disembowelling sword?. Tell you what I will bet any amount you want he won't serve 55 years! How will you know? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Walter Payton Posted August 23, 2020 Share Posted August 23, 2020 1 hour ago, Francis Albert said: I thanked the poster who corrected me. What should I do to atone ? ... get out the ritual disembowelling sword?. Tell you what I will bet any amount you want he won't serve 55 years! Only because you won't be around in 55 years to pay out when you're proven wrong. He'll serve 55 years if he doesn't die first. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Francis Albert Posted August 23, 2020 Share Posted August 23, 2020 (edited) 2 minutes ago, Bring on the Future said: Only because you won't be around in 55 years to pay out when you're proven wrong. He'll serve 55 years if he doesn't die first. You worked that out all by yourself? 1 hour ago, ri Alban said: How will you know? Of course I won't. It is the sort of bet I like! Edited August 23, 2020 by Francis Albert Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Walter Payton Posted August 23, 2020 Share Posted August 23, 2020 3 minutes ago, Francis Albert said: You worked that out all by yourself? I considered whether you were intelligent enough to be making a subtle joke, then I remembered you didn't understand the "minimum" part of minimum sentence. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Dawnrazor Posted August 23, 2020 Share Posted August 23, 2020 Just now, Bring on the Future said: I considered whether you were intelligent enough to be making a subtle joke, then I remembered you didn't understand the "minimum" part of minimum sentence. I suppose the "minimum sentence" will be open to an appeal? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Riddley Walker Posted August 23, 2020 Share Posted August 23, 2020 13 minutes ago, Dawnrazor said: I suppose the "minimum sentence" will be open to an appeal? Like everyone else he'll be entitled to appeal, yes. Think it's unlikely it would ever be succesful. The only reason he wasn't given a whole life tariff is because he was under 21 when he did it. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Francis Albert Posted August 23, 2020 Share Posted August 23, 2020 1 hour ago, Dawnrazor said: I suppose the "minimum sentence" will be open to an appeal? I misunderstood the difference between recommended minimum term and statutary minimum term before parole is possible. Mea culpa once again. But the new law in this respect is relatively new. Less than 20 years I think. My later point about 55 years being a long time was not about the Muslim takeover as someone suggested. In 55 years the law can and probably will change. Barely before he starts his sentence we already have human rights and civil liberties being cited to question the length of sentence. Can anyone really dismiss the possibility that a change in the law will release him before his term is up. There will be Lord Longford type figures claiming he has reformed, found God or a more moderate Allah. I am not even saying that that would be wrong. I don't know why and how he got to where he is. But for the time being and given the current laws 55 years does not seem unreasonable for the crime committed. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Dawnrazor Posted August 23, 2020 Share Posted August 23, 2020 2 minutes ago, Francis Albert said: I misunderstood the difference between recommended minimum term and statutary minimum term before parole is possible. Mea culpa once again. But the new law in this respect is relatively new. Less than 20 years I think. My later point about 55 years being a long time was not about the Muslim takeover as someone suggested. In 55 years the law can and probably will change. Barely before he starts his sentence we already have human rights and civil liberties being cited to question the length of sentence. Can anyone really dismiss the possibility that a change in the law will release him before his term is up. There will be Lord Longford type figures claiming he has reformed, found God or a more moderate Allah. I am not even saying that that would be wrong. I don't know why and how he got to where he is. But for the time being and given the current laws 55 years does not seem unreasonable for the crime committed. I agree with you about the law possibly changing, that could easily happen, as could a lawyer taking on the appeal, I hope he serves the full sentence but I can circumstances changing so he doesn't. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
frankblack Posted August 23, 2020 Share Posted August 23, 2020 (edited) 4 minutes ago, Dawnrazor said: I agree with you about the law possibly changing, that could easily happen, as could a lawyer taking on the appeal, I hope he serves the full sentence but I can circumstances changing so he doesn't. He is the type of murdering scum that politicians will never allow to be released due to the nature of the crime he helped commit. While under 21, he is classed in the same bracket as Sutcliffe and the Moors Murderers. If there were ever attempts to change the law to release the likes of him I think the public would find it unacceptable and parliament would reject it. I guess the real question is will he survive in prison long enough to meet any possible release date? Edited August 23, 2020 by frankblack Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Dawnrazor Posted August 23, 2020 Share Posted August 23, 2020 1 minute ago, frankblack said: If there were ever attempts to change the law to release the likes of him I think the public would find it unacceptable and parliament would reject it. I hooe you're right, I'd not bet on it is all I'm saying. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
frankblack Posted August 23, 2020 Share Posted August 23, 2020 6 minutes ago, Dawnrazor said: I hooe you're right, I'd not bet on it is all I'm saying. In a post-EU world that type of reform has zero chance with a Tory government. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
SpruceBringsteen Posted August 23, 2020 Share Posted August 23, 2020 This the boy that was trained by the same ISIS soldiers the UK government merrily used to overthrow Gaddafi because they can't keep their snout of the business of other countries, aye? I mean, I couldn't care less if he never sees the light of day ever again but I feel like there's far more culpable folk being let off the hook here. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Francis Albert Posted August 23, 2020 Share Posted August 23, 2020 9 minutes ago, frankblack said: In a post-EU world that type of reform has zero chance with a Tory government. You think we will have Tory government for the next 55 years? God (or Allah) help.us! Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Francis Albert Posted August 23, 2020 Share Posted August 23, 2020 (edited) The majority of the public opposed the end of capital punishment but it happened ... rightly IMO. Meant to quote frankblack on that where he said the public would oppose and stop any change in the law to commute the 55 year sentence. Edited August 23, 2020 by Francis Albert Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
frankblack Posted August 23, 2020 Share Posted August 23, 2020 6 minutes ago, Francis Albert said: You think we will have Tory government for the next 55 years? God (or Allah) help.us! You have a 50/50 chance of one being in power whenever such a reform is attempted, and even if one is successful under Labour it might be overturned by the next government. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Francis Albert Posted August 23, 2020 Share Posted August 23, 2020 32 minutes ago, frankblack said: You have a 50/50 chance of one being in power whenever such a reform is attempted, and even if one is successful under Labour it might be overturned by the next government. Maybe but abolition of hanging and the many other liberal or progressive changes of the Labour government (on homosexuality and race relations and others) of the sixties survived many subsequent Tory governments. Despite Tory voters opinions on those issues. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
frankblack Posted August 23, 2020 Share Posted August 23, 2020 1 minute ago, Francis Albert said: Maybe but abolition of hanging and the many other liberal or progressive changes of the Labour government (on homosexuality and race relations and others) of the sixties survived many subsequent Tory governments. Despite Tory voters opinions on those issues. Oh please. You can't seriously be comparing sentencing terms of mass murderers to the abolishment of capital punishment? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Francis Albert Posted August 23, 2020 Share Posted August 23, 2020 20 minutes ago, frankblack said: Oh please. You can't seriously be comparing sentencing terms of mass murderers to the abolishment of capital punishment? As precedents for laws that pass and survive and are not supported by the general public yes. In fact I doubt most Labour supporters let alone Tory supporters approved of the changes on social issues in the sixties on the things I mentioned. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Riddley Walker Posted August 23, 2020 Share Posted August 23, 2020 15 minutes ago, Francis Albert said: As precedents for laws that pass and survive and are not supported by the general public yes. In fact I doubt most Labour supporters let alone Tory supporters approved of the changes on social issues in the sixties on the things I mentioned. There will be no laws passed in the next 55 years that ensure the release of mass murderers from prison earlier than they should be. Imagine a govt signing off the release of Tobin and Sutcliffe and this boy into witness protection...Time to stop digging. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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