Jump to content

5 Subs


Sooperstar

Recommended Posts

Sooperstar

I see this morning that IFAB are looking to keep the 5 subs rule in place for next season. Which of course means that they will probably make it permanent. 

 

Absolutely no need as far as I am concerned and it can only help the bigger clubs with stronger squads.

 

Get it to ****.

Link to comment
Share on other sites

Spot on!

 

The drinks break needs to go as well. Not as if the players are playing in 40 degrees every game ffs.

Link to comment
Share on other sites

15 minutes ago, Chaps said:

Spot on!

 

The drinks break needs to go as well. Not as if the players are playing in 40 degrees every game ffs.

Matt Murray made a good point about the drinks break last night while commentating on the arsenal game. It was drop it unless the temperature was above a defined temperature, having something like that in the rules i think would work and help protect the players.

Link to comment
Share on other sites

manaliveits105

Scotland is hot on sporting integrity and fairness so SPFL will allow 5 subs for Ceptic but normal 3 for everyone else .

Link to comment
Share on other sites

Five is way OTT. 

 

A fourth if a cup tie goes into ET, perhaps, but five is ridic.

 

Started with 1 sub, then 2...by mid century it will be the entire 11.

 

Can't have the delicate, modern day player getting too fatigued, sweaty and dirty, can we?

Link to comment
Share on other sites

rudeskaboyuk

I really think its a great idea to keep this permanently . What's the point of having a squad of players if you cant play them. This would allow more of the youngster's game time by getting bled into games without as much risk.

My only concern is the time wasting factor but I am sure this could be worked out.

I would rather be able to sub off a player who is carrying a knock than continue to play them with the risk of aggravating the injury and then having an extended lay off.

Link to comment
Share on other sites

3 minutes ago, rudeskaboyuk said:

I really think its a great idea to keep this permanently . What's the point of having a squad of players if you cant play them. This would allow more of the youngster's game time by getting bled into games without as much risk.

My only concern is the time wasting factor but I am sure this could be worked out.

I would rather be able to sub off a player who is carrying a knock than continue to play them with the risk of aggravating the injury and then having an extended lay off.

 

The current set up is during play each team can only make subs 3 times. 

Edited by Mikey1874
Link to comment
Share on other sites

They should keep the 5 sub rule, but with the condition that 2 of them have to be homegrown U21 (or U20) players.

 

It would be hard to Police, but would mean that Youth players would get more game time.

Link to comment
Share on other sites

Spellczech
1 hour ago, Sooperstar said:

I see this morning that IFAB are looking to keep the 5 subs rule in place for next season. Which of course means that they will probably make it permanent. 

 

Absolutely no need as far as I am concerned and it can only help the bigger clubs with stronger squads.

 

Get it to ****.

Rugby was ruined by the possibility of replacing half the team during a game - which of course helps the countries and teams with stronger squads. Football would be stupid to make the same mistake. Tiredness and the mistakes it causes, is what opens up games in the final 30 mins...

Edited by Spellczech
Link to comment
Share on other sites

7 minutes ago, Spellczech said:

Rugby was ruined by the possibility of replacing half the team during a game - which of course helps the countries and teams with stronger squads. Football would be stupid to make the same mistake. Tiredness and the mistakes it causes, is what opens up games in the final 30 mins...

one thing i feel has happened in rugby is players seem to be conditioned to last 50-60 mins rather than a full 80 mins. We could see the same thing happening in football with this sort of change

Link to comment
Share on other sites

Spellczech
4 minutes ago, milky_26 said:

one thing i feel has happened in rugby is players seem to be conditioned to last 50-60 mins rather than a full 80 mins. We could see the same thing happening in football with this sort of change

True, I guess is was chicken and egg - They introduced subs then professionalism meant players were putting on more muscle and thus causing and receiving more injuries, which required more substitutions...But rugby is that sort of sport.

 

There are footballers who can barely last 60 mins already - Rudi Skacel was the most obvious one in our case.

 

Edited by Spellczech
Link to comment
Share on other sites

Pans Jambo

I have no problem with 5 subs however; what I do have a problem with is bloody time wasting and bringing a sub on with 3 minutes to go or even in extra time itself.

 

Blatant fecking cheating and I include us in that as well. Needs to stop!

 

Needs to be a rule change.

Unless there's a goalkeeper sent off, or an injury that means a player can no longer continue, there should be no substitutions for the final 10 minutes of normal time and any additional added time.

 

I pay to watch football not bloody chess!!! 

Link to comment
Share on other sites

Spellczech
1 minute ago, Pans Jambo said:

I have no problem with 5 subs however; what I do have a problem with is bloody time wasting and bringing a sub on with 3 minutes to go or even in extra time itself.

 

Blatant fecking cheating and I include us in that as well. Needs to stop!

 

Needs to be a rule change.

Unless there's a goalkeeper sent off, or an injury that means a player can no longer continue, there should be no substitutions for the final 10 minutes of normal time and any additional added time.

 

I pay to watch football not bloody chess!!! 

Players can fake injuries - remember rugby tried this and Leicester got caught using fake blood!

 

Would be hard to put in any kind of controls over this - ban subs after 85 mins and you'd get some dirty tackles which might only be a yellow but could cause a dead leg or player needing to go off...

 

Some things ain't broke so why try to fix them? 

Link to comment
Share on other sites

What's the rules on this? Can't a governing body adopt that as a rule anyway?

 

Italian clubs have named 12 subs per game for a good few seasons now and earlier this season decided to make 5 subs available to be fielded.

Link to comment
Share on other sites

Pans Jambo
Just now, Spellczech said:

Players can fake injuries - remember rugby tried this and Leicester got caught using fake blood!

 

Would be hard to put in any kind of controls over this - ban subs after 85 mins and you'd get some dirty tackles which might only be a yellow but could cause a dead leg or player needing to go off...

 

Some things ain't broke so why try to fix them? 

But they are broke. 

 

Time wasting is a shit!

 

Having 5 subs is OK but can you imagine some shitey wee team scoring an equaliser at Tynecastle in the 80th minute then using 5 substitutions to waste time? Needs clear and concise rules in place to stop that shite.

 

& while I am in the mood, it's supposed to be a game with fairness and sportmanship but seems that's only for TV & newspaper interviews, posters and before kick-off when they shake hands.

After that its OK for "professional fouls, diving in the box, feigning injuries, greeting to the ref about throw-ins and corners, kicking the ball away, encouraging the ref to book opposition players, adding a couple of sneaky yards at a free kick, running halfway along the touchline when performing a throw-in, keepers taking ages to take a by-kick and time wasting with subs etc.

 

Pisses me off. Like wee bairns at a school park. Man up!

 

Link to comment
Share on other sites

Ibrahim Tall
1 hour ago, Sooperstar said:

I see this morning that IFAB are looking to keep the 5 subs rule in place for next season. Which of course means that they will probably make it permanent. 

 

Absolutely no need as far as I am concerned and it can only help the bigger clubs with stronger squads.

 

Get it to ****.


Like us you mean? 😛

I don’t necessarily disagree but by Scottish standards we should benefit from it in that case.

 

I thought I would but I don’t mind the ‘breaks‘ and extra subs,  the breaks often seem to give the managers an opportunity to change the momentum in games by getting a tactical change made when they’re getting battered. Extra subs in theory should mean less stupid sending offs for 2nd yellows too.

Link to comment
Share on other sites

Spellczech
5 minutes ago, Pans Jambo said:

But they are broke. 

 

Time wasting is a shit!

 

Having 5 subs is OK but can you imagine some shitey wee team scoring an equaliser at Tynecastle in the 80th minute then using 5 substitutions to waste time? Needs clear and concise rules in place to stop that shite.

 

& while I am in the mood, it's supposed to be a game with fairness and sportmanship but seems that's only for TV & newspaper interviews, posters and before kick-off when they shake hands.

After that its OK for "professional fouls, diving in the box, feigning injuries, greeting to the ref about throw-ins and corners, kicking the ball away, encouraging the ref to book opposition players, adding a couple of sneaky yards at a free kick, running halfway along the touchline when performing a throw-in, keepers taking ages to take a by-kick and time wasting with subs etc.

 

Pisses me off. Like wee bairns at a school park. Man up!

 

You call it time-wasting but managers would call it one of their chances to influence a game...ie tactics

 

Besides it is only one method of time-wasting... Perhaps the 30 seconds that a substitution takes needs added back on as a minute, if it happens in the last 15 mins of a match? 

Link to comment
Share on other sites

Pans Jambo
3 minutes ago, Spellczech said:

You call it time-wasting but managers would call it one of their chances to influence a game...ie tactics

 

Besides it is only one method of time-wasting... Perhaps the 30 seconds that a substitution takes needs added back on as a minute, if it happens in the last 15 mins of a match? 

I hate it.

I would change a lot of football rules. 

I would have 10 minute "sin-bins" for yellow cards and time wasters, goals that are 12" wider & 6" higher (imagine the amount of shots that skim the post/bar that would be goals. I would rather see us win 5-3 than 2-1). a review on the off-side rule (I would have a margin of error at the width of a man instead of the current bawhair). Games cannot be "no-scoring" so all 0-0 games go to penalties. etc. 

Would be a better game to watch.

Link to comment
Share on other sites

Spellczech
14 minutes ago, Pans Jambo said:

I hate it.

I would change a lot of football rules. 

I would have 10 minute "sin-bins" for yellow cards and time wasters, goals that are 12" wider & 6" higher (imagine the amount of shots that skim the post/bar that would be goals. I would rather see us win 5-3 than 2-1). a review on the off-side rule (I would have a margin of error at the width of a man instead of the current bawhair). Games cannot be "no-scoring" so all 0-0 games go to penalties. etc. 

Would be a better game to watch.

Yeah there is little as unsatisfactory as a 0-0 where both teams just nullify the opposition. Strange how Scottish football used to be about winning but then became about "not losing"...3 points for a win did nothing to change this...However, I don't think allowing 3 subs instead of 2 did anything to improve the game either...

Link to comment
Share on other sites

Pasquale for King
2 hours ago, Chaps said:

Spot on!

 

The drinks break needs to go as well. Not as if the players are playing in 40 degrees every game ffs.

I think the drinks breaks will stay as it helps the players avoid injuries, maybe one around 75 minutes. 
It shouldn’t be a opportunity for coaches to change things though, the drinks should be taken the other side of the pitch from the dug outs.

Link to comment
Share on other sites

Pasquale for King

I think we will probably go to four up here first, always a bit behind. Let’s face it we could’ve made 8-9 subs in most of our games this last couple of years considering how poor the team has been. Maybe one or two of the four or five should be a player under 21.

Link to comment
Share on other sites

1 hour ago, Spellczech said:

Rugby was ruined by the possibility of replacing half the team during a game - which of course helps the countries and teams with stronger squads. Football would be stupid to make the same mistake. Tiredness and the mistakes it causes, is what opens up games in the final 30 mins...

Agree....How much more do we want to sanitise the game, refine it to the point we lose its unpredictability, become even more pretentious and less of a spectacle?  it’s just so off putting, imo.  
 

Sport was always about an element of risk and it’s part of what gives supporters excitement. 
 

There’s a line for everything of course but the over protection of players softens an already softened game. 
 

 

Link to comment
Share on other sites

BRAVEHEART1874

If it goes to 5 full time then yes I agree make 2 of them under 21's

Link to comment
Share on other sites

2 hours ago, rudeskaboyuk said:

I really think its a great idea to keep this permanently . What's the point of having a squad of players if you cant play them. This would allow more of the youngster's game time by getting bled into games without as much risk.

My only concern is the time wasting factor but I am sure this could be worked out.

I would rather be able to sub off a player who is carrying a knock than continue to play them with the risk of aggravating the injury and then having an extended lay off.

 

Think that's already taken care of as teams are only allowed to stop the game 3 times for subs, so you have make either 1,2,2 or 1,1,3 subs etc.

 

As for the drinks break, i'm all for it in all honesty, it's been used to great effect by some managers as a 'time out' to adjust tactics 

Link to comment
Share on other sites

MarkDevriesScores4

Could stop the clock on any subs made in the last ten mins. Would prevent time wasters as they would have nothing to gain 

Link to comment
Share on other sites

12 minutes ago, MarkDevriesScores4 said:

Could stop the clock on any subs made in the last ten mins. Would prevent time wasters as they would have nothing to gain 

They should stop the clock anytime the ball goes out of play, and have the time displayed where all can see it. That might put an end to the silly time added on if the likes of Celtic need a late goal.

Link to comment
Share on other sites

If this has morphed into a how do we improve football debate...here you go.

 

The game is 2 30-minute periods of action. The always-visible stadium clock stops when the ball goes out of play or for any other stoppage. Instantly puts an end to the ersehole goalkeeper running out to the edge of his box to berate his defence then sauntering back to collect the ball for a goal kick then trotting with the ball to the other side of the box as happens all too frequently now. Clock stopped - incentive to waste time eliminated, problem vanishes..

 

I'm not too fussed about a draw after 90 minutes being changed but if some sort of tie-break is needed, make it ice hockey style. A player has 10 seconds to run with the ball from the halfway line and score. The attacker may not touch the ball again after the keeper has touched it.

 

There you go FIFA. That'll be £5 million for the consultancy fees. Just give it to FoH.

Link to comment
Share on other sites

1 hour ago, Spellczech said:

Yeah there is little as unsatisfactory as a 0-0 where both teams just nullify the opposition. Strange how Scottish football used to be about winning but then became about "not losing"...3 points for a win did nothing to change this...However, I don't think allowing 3 subs instead of 2 did anything to improve the game either...

 

When it was 1 sub it was more of a big deal.

 

Subs were almost as rare as red cards. 

Link to comment
Share on other sites

Pans Jambo
28 minutes ago, Boof said:

If this has morphed into a how do we improve football debate...here you go.

 

The game is 2 30-minute periods of action. The always-visible stadium clock stops when the ball goes out of play or for any other stoppage. Instantly puts an end to the ersehole goalkeeper running out to the edge of his box to berate his defence then sauntering back to collect the ball for a goal kick then trotting with the ball to the other side of the box as happens all too frequently now. Clock stopped - incentive to waste time eliminated, problem vanishes..

 

I'm not too fussed about a draw after 90 minutes being changed but if some sort of tie-break is needed, make it ice hockey style. A player has 10 seconds to run with the ball from the halfway line and score. The attacker may not touch the ball again after the keeper has touched it.

 

There you go FIFA. That'll be £5 million for the consultancy fees. Just give it to FoH.

I would watch the shit out of that Boof!!!

 

I'm in!!!

 

(Can they use basesball bats at each other in the centre circle at FT if it's 0-0 instead though)?

Edited by Pans Jambo
Link to comment
Share on other sites

  • 1 year later...
On 08/07/2020 at 10:18, Sooperstar said:

I see this morning that IFAB are looking to keep the 5 subs rule in place for next season. Which of course means that they will probably make it permanent. 

 

Absolutely no need as far as I am concerned and it can only help the bigger clubs with stronger squads.

 

Get it to ****.

 

Just to confirm IFAB confirmed last week, 5 subs is a permanent change. Leaving each league to decide.

 

EPL have agreed it for next season. 

Link to comment
Share on other sites

On 08/07/2020 at 05:29, Pans Jambo said:

I hate it.

I would change a lot of football rules. 

I would have 10 minute "sin-bins" for yellow cards and time wasters, goals that are 12" wider & 6" higher (imagine the amount of shots that skim the post/bar that would be goals. I would rather see us win 5-3 than 2-1). a review on the off-side rule (I would have a margin of error at the width of a man instead of the current bawhair). Games cannot be "no-scoring" so all 0-0 games go to penalties. etc. 

Would be a better game to watch.

Sounds like you would enjoy watching the NHL Pans!

Some of those rules are in effect. If a game is tied after regulation they each remove two skaters so it is 3 on 3 sudden death for five minutes maximum. Fantastic action. If still tied it goes to a shootout. Winner gets two points and loser gets one point for tie in regulation time. A lot of purists do not like it but it certainly adds to the spectacle. 

Link to comment
Share on other sites

19 minutes ago, Canscot said:

Sounds like you would enjoy watching the NHL Pans!

Some of those rules are in effect. If a game is tied after regulation they each remove two skaters so it is 3 on 3 sudden death for five minutes maximum. Fantastic action. If still tied it goes to a shootout. Winner gets two points and loser gets one point for tie in regulation time. A lot of purists do not like it but it certainly adds to the spectacle. 

We all love football, but maybe a slight refresh to make it more exciting wouldn't be a bad thing. We are there to be entertained after all.

Link to comment
Share on other sites

29 minutes ago, Canscot said:

Fantastic action. If still tied it goes to a shootout. Winner gets two points and loser gets one point for tie in regulation time. A lot of purists do not like it but it certainly adds to the spectacle. 

 

That sounds like a good rule actually.  Could work in football league matches, a draw goes to a penalty shootout straight away, but they keep extra time for Cup matches.

Win: 3 Points

Draw -> Win on Penalties: 2 points

Draw -> Lose on Penalties: 1 point

Loss: 0 points

 

The only thing is, it means the reward for winning a match in 90 minutes isn't much better than the team who park the bus and fluke their way through on penalties.  Maybe they could trial actually losing points for losing games?  Currently when you lose a league match, you just don't gain any ground, and you can lose a game and stay where you are if the team 2 points behind you only draws. 

 

It would be interesting to see what happens if teams were actually penalised for losing games:

 

Win: 3 Points

Draw -> Win on Penalties: 1 point

Draw -> Lose on Penalties: 0 points

Loss: -1 points

 

We already have teams that start the season on negative points, so there can't really be any argument about teams being on less than 0 points.

Link to comment
Share on other sites

Better for player welfare, means more chances for squad/academy players & lets you manage niggly injuries/bookings more carefully. Happy to see it stay.

 

edit: what about a tweak where 2 of the subs have to be academy/home grown?

Edited by boag1874
Link to comment
Share on other sites

jamboinglasgow
21 minutes ago, boag1874 said:

Better for player welfare, means more chances for squad/academy players & lets you manage niggly injuries/bookings more carefully. Happy to see it stay.

 

edit: what about a tweak where 2 of the subs have to be academy/home grown?

 

The first part is something that seems to be ignored with the 5 subs. Players are playing more and more games, both through planinng and through unforseen circumstances. See Scotland possibly playing 6 games in 15 days in June. If we want the quality of football to stay high then you cant have players playing a crazy amount of games.

Link to comment
Share on other sites

Tom Hardy’s Dug
On 08/07/2020 at 10:18, Sooperstar said:

I see this morning that IFAB are looking to keep the 5 subs rule in place for next season. Which of course means that they will probably make it permanent. 

 

Absolutely no need as far as I am concerned and it can only help the bigger clubs with stronger squads.

 

Get it to ****.

We’ll be one of them so whilst I get your sentiment if we get a run in Europe this will help us.

Link to comment
Share on other sites

People on here saying 5 would only benefit the bigger clubs. Newsflash! We ARE one of the bigger clubs. Think back the last run of games when we have been struggling to break teams down. Our subs have been great players. They've come on and changed the games. Far more than your lower ranked team players who probably have a decent starting 11 but not much in way of subs. 

Link to comment
Share on other sites

17 minutes ago, Tom Hardy’s Dug said:

We’ll be one of them so whilst I get your sentiment if we get a run in Europe this will help us.

 

10 minutes ago, Henroddy said:

People on here saying 5 would only benefit the bigger clubs. Newsflash! We ARE one of the bigger clubs. Think back the last run of games when we have been struggling to break teams down. Our subs have been great players. They've come on and changed the games. Far more than your lower ranked team players who probably have a decent starting 11 but not much in way of subs. 

One of the main issues with football perfectly illustrated. It suits us so it's a good thing. But we'll moan like **** about unfair things which go against us.

Link to comment
Share on other sites

Join the conversation

You can post now and register later. If you have an account, sign in now to post with your account.

Guest
Reply to this topic...

×   Pasted as rich text.   Paste as plain text instead

  Only 75 emoji are allowed.

×   Your link has been automatically embedded.   Display as a link instead

×   Your previous content has been restored.   Clear editor

×   You cannot paste images directly. Upload or insert images from URL.



×
×
  • Create New...