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4 minutes ago, Jambo-Jimbo said:

 

Yes, so what would you do different?

It's not my job to work that out. I do think fresh thinking across the political spectrum is needed and heads should now roll. A government of national unity may be required if this is going to last indefinitely.  

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1 minute ago, Lord Inglis said:

It's not my job to work that out. I do think fresh thinking across the political spectrum is needed and heads should now roll. A government of national unity may be required if this is going to last indefinitely.  

 

That ship sailed back in March, there is no chance of that happening now, besides I'm still confident that once the vaccines get rolled out we'll turn the tide on this fecker.

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Dagger Is Back

Not a good news day. If it's full lockdown again in light of these variants, then we'll just have to dig deep and get on with it. The scientific experts tell us that variants are a common feature of these viruses so I'm struggling a bit to understand again, some of the decisions taken

 

- why were we planning on a 5 day Xmas 'break'

- why are we not restricting entry to the country and forcing those entrants into 14 day quarantine, as they've done in say Singapore

- why did we launch the eat out scheme

- why have we had fans, albeit limited in numbers, at football matches

- why is the whole country not in T5 now

 

Looks like we're back to where we started and in fact in a worse position with these new variants

 

Hancock looked like he'd @@@@ himself (even more so than usual)

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6 minutes ago, Lord BJ said:

 

I was told by someone the NHS before the new variant lockdown was planned until end of Feb, with the new strain who knows.

 

If this new variant is a contagious as they suspect and doesn’t become less lethal. I think we will be locked down until we’re vaccinated.

 

One of the issues this new variant presents for vaccine, is under 18 were not anticipated to require a vaccine, due to to that group being largely unaffected. If this new variant impacts under 18, thats another bunch of vaccines to get and probably approvals for under 18 use. Together with  another bunch of problems.

 

 

This. 

 

Has there been any vaccine trials on this age group, if there hasn't been, then they'll have to go through all that before vaccinating the under 18's, and that would take months to do the trials.

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Dennis Reynolds

There are dozens (probably more) of variants floating about. This has been going on all year. It's spreading more because of the piss poor leadership straight from the top. They've made mistakes at every single turn and are now hiding behind this new 'more contagious' strain shtick. It's ridiculous. We're a ******* island and they're moaning about new strains coming on from abroad. Unbelievable. 

 

They've spent the year pissing about with half arsed lockdowns, then getting people out as much as possible, then more half arsed lockdowns bit only for some areas, whilst still trying to get some people back in the office/in pubs/shops/football stadiums. They then decided to let everyone do what they want and mix for five days before deciding that it's really not a good idea and completely flipping that on its head and blaming the upturn in cases that they've not handled correctly on new variants.

 

A shambles of an initial pandemic response, a barely functional contact tracing system in place but no, it Joe public spreading this new variant that's the problem.

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3 hours ago, redjambo said:

 

I'm not sure it will impact compliance at all. We've been in this thing for several months now and our behaviour should be fairly well fixed as regards how well we all as individuals comply with the rules. I don't think someone who complies with the rules as much as they can do is suddenly going to turn around and throw caution to the wind because of this. After all, those who comply with the rules will almost all be doing it for their own safety and the safety of others - I don't think that attitude is going to change overnight.

 

The figures do appear to show an increase in cases however and I personally reckon that the news of the vaccine has led to people letting their guards down as they see the light at the end of the tunnel. Understandably so.

Compliance went down significantly following Cummings going for his eye test; from about 90% UK wide to below 60% IIRC (source: The Economist). Clearly, this is nowhere near the same but when politicians, CMOs and others who’ve been preaching at us all to follow the rules (in Sturgeon’s case, daily) don’t do the same themselves, people will understandably question why they should continue making sacrifices and obeying rules. 

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Toxteth O'Grady
23 minutes ago, Governor Tarkin said:

 

They won't do it if they don't believe that they should.

I would hope not. I'm sure it will be scrutinised round the clock.

 

Jean Freeman was on about rolling it out from 11 January if it is approved.

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Maroon Sailor
1 hour ago, King prawn said:

what’s more concerning is her thoughts on going back into another March style lockdown. 

 

She'll probably build a wall from Gretna to Berwick

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Dagger Is Back
3 minutes ago, LMc said:

There are dozens (probably more) of variants floating about. This has been going on all year. It's spreading more because of the piss poor leadership straight from the top. They've made mistakes at every single turn and are now hiding behind this new 'more contagious' strain shtick. It's ridiculous. We're a ******* island and they're moaning about new strains coming on from abroad. Unbelievable. 

 

They've spent the year pissing about with half arsed lockdowns, then getting people out as much as possible, then more half arsed lockdowns bit only for some areas, whilst still trying to get some people back in the office/in pubs/shops/football stadiums. They then decided to let everyone do what they want and mix for five days before deciding that it's really not a good idea and completely flipping that on its head and blaming the upturn in cases that they've not handled correctly on new variants.

 

A shambles of an initial pandemic response, a barely functional contact tracing system in place but no, it Joe public spreading this new variant that's the problem.

 

This is exactly where I am. It's been a rollercoaster and you'd have to wonder if we all had to get on it in the first place. It's been shambolic right from the off when we had Madrid fans coming to Liverpool (Christ they were banned from attending matches in their own city due to Covid!) and German fans going to Glasgow. I wrote to Joanna Cherry about flights continuing to arrive from Northern Italy in March into Edinburgh and the reply just beggars belief

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11 minutes ago, Jambo-Jimbo said:

 

That ship sailed back in March, there is no chance of that happening now, besides I'm still confident that once the vaccines get rolled out we'll turn the tide on this fecker.

Fingers crossed mate. If this Oxford vaccine is approved everyone no matter which political affiliation needs to hold their leaders to account and demand the swiftest possible rollout

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2 minutes ago, Lord Inglis said:

Fingers crossed mate. If this Oxford vaccine is approved everyone no matter which political affiliation needs to hold their leaders to account and demand the swiftest possible rollout

 

Get the Army to do the logistics.

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2 hours ago, Enzo Chiefo said:

Yes and many foreign virologists are also "scoffing " at the hysterical, British response to this new strain. One Dutch expert ssid he was taken aback by the "drastic" measures we imposed. Sturgeon said today that we are in "the most dangerous part of this pandemic since February". Probably the most ridiculous comment I have heard this year.

 

It's good to see your new found confidence in the opinions of scientists. Drastic measures are not required claims the Dutch expert. It's clear to me now that Taiwan, Korea, New Zealand, Singapore etc must have over reacted hysterically first time around.

 

As for Sturgeon's comment being the most ridiculous you have heard this year she nevertheless has manged to convince Prof Andrew Hayward, a professor of infectious disease epidemiology at University College London.  When asked if we should be worried about the strain he said “I think we already have enough information to know that this variant has the potential to cause a major further epidemic, worse than we had previously predicted,” Several other top scientists agree and also share the view that going in quickly with social restrictions will save lives. https://www.theguardian.com/world/2020/dec/20/fast-spreading-covid-variant-in-england-uk  You'd think all these scientists would come up with some ideas of their own rather than just blindly parroting the FM.

 

  You seem to be telling us that this variant offers no additional threat to lives and the NHS. How do you know this? Don't you believe the government when they say there has been a 56% increase in cases in a week? Did we ever have this rate of increase in cases in the first wave?

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3 minutes ago, Lord BJ said:

 

Thats not inconceivable as most the approvals are done.

 

It was a pivot from another vaccine so there is a fair amount of info already in place, they and the regulators have worked in parallel to speed up the approval process and the data today was additional info to close of a few issues (around dosing and age I think). If thats put a tick in the box, approval around turn of year is possible and there is 4M doses sitting there good to go.

 

🤞

 

Seemingly the regulators have been reviewing the data since June on a regular basis, as and when new data is released by the pharma companies.

This means that they have already reviewed 90+% before the final data dump is released.

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1 minute ago, Boy Daniel said:

COVID-19: UK records 744 deaths - highest daily rise since end of April

 

FFS, 691 yesterday, 744 today, going in the wrong direction.

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Toxteth O'Grady
13 minutes ago, Lord BJ said:

 

Thats not inconceivable as most the approvals are done.

 

It was a pivot from another vaccine so there is a fair amount of info already in place, they and the regulators have worked in parallel to speed up the approval process and the data today was additional info to close of a few issues (around dosing and age I think). If thats put a tick in the box, approval around turn of year is possible and there is 4M doses sitting there good to go.

 

🤞

It will be a massive game changer stopping in terms of drastically reducing deaths the over 70's and then working down the age groups

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Today's 7-day per-capita rates around the councils:

 

    7-day per-100,000 cases              
Council Area Tier Today Yesterday       21 Dec 20 Dec 19 Dec 18 Dec 17 Dec
Scotland   130 121 +9     112 98 96 105 111
North Ayrshire 3 203 193 +10     189 175 160 174 194
Aberdeen City 3 189 176 +13     162 163 150 162 166
East Ayrshire 3 178 168 +10     154 153 160 159 171
Glasgow City 3 167 153 +14     135 129 122 140 143
East Renfrewshire 3 164 147 +17     129 101 91 109 109
East Lothian 3 163 172 -9     174 148 146 147 148
Renfrewshire 3 159 147 +12     122 116 106 121 141
South Lanarkshire 3 158 133 +25     129 120 119 122 133
West Dunbartonshire 3 150 145 +5     126 120 102 99 105
Dundee City 3 149 129 +20     119 113 125 146 149
Clackmannanshire 3 146 144 +2     150 148 138 173 167
North Lanarkshire 3 143 131 +12     131 119 129 133 141
Perth and Kinross 3 143 144 -1     139 126 116 143 124
Edinburgh City 3 135 129 +6     122 109 106 112 113
Midlothian 3 133 139 -6     136 136 142 151 176
Aberdeenshire 3 127 118 +9     106 88 79 82 84
Fife 3 117 111 +6     107 97 100 118 128
Stirling 3 110 91 +19     94 70 62 67 67
East Dunbartonshire 3 108 102 +6     91 70 67 78 86
Inverclyde 2 107 86 +21     73 59 54 64 66
Scottish Borders 1 105 106 -1     100 85 87 100 92
South Ayrshire 3 104 95 +9     97 98 96 99 118
West Lothian 3 103 103 0     97 83 87 89 92
Falkirk 2 93 84 +9     80 60 64 65 70
Angus 2 71 64 +7     52 37 37 45 47
Dumfries & Galloway 1 58 54 +4     40 32 26 29 24
Moray 1 53 41 +12     26 13 17 19 21
Argyll and Bute 2 43 41 +2     38 29 28 33 37
Highland 1 31 28 +3     24 17 17 18 17
Shetland Islands 1 9 4 +5     4 0 0 0 0
Na h-Eileanan Siar 1 7 11 -4     15 22 19 15 15
Orkney Islands 1 0 0 0     0 0 0 0 0
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20 minutes ago, Jambo-Jimbo said:

 

Get the Army to do the logistics.

The army and anyone with a 1st aid qualification upwards should be conscripted to help 

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36 minutes ago, LMc said:

There are dozens (probably more) of variants floating about. This has been going on all year. It's spreading more because of the piss poor leadership straight from the top. They've made mistakes at every single turn and are now hiding behind this new 'more contagious' strain shtick. It's ridiculous. We're a ******* island and they're moaning about new strains coming on from abroad. Unbelievable. 

 

They've spent the year pissing about with half arsed lockdowns, then getting people out as much as possible, then more half arsed lockdowns bit only for some areas, whilst still trying to get some people back in the office/in pubs/shops/football stadiums. They then decided to let everyone do what they want and mix for five days before deciding that it's really not a good idea and completely flipping that on its head and blaming the upturn in cases that they've not handled correctly on new variants.

 

A shambles of an initial pandemic response, a barely functional contact tracing system in place but no, it Joe public spreading this new variant that's the problem.

Correct , the irony is as an island we should’ve shut up shop , instead the bloody french did it to us in reverse . 

Not one politician comes out of this with any positivity regardless of party , a complete and utter shit show 

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1 hour ago, ecjambo said:

Our response to this pandemic has been diabolical. One bit of terrible news to the next. Yet still no resignations or people held accountable for their continual bad decisions.

Who do you think should resign over a new variant to the virus ? 🤔 

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5 hours ago, Harry Potter said:

Think we can put it down to tiredness, the poor woman has not had a break for months, and ftr im not SNP.  

Not to mention all the cooking she will be doing on xmas day😮.

Her girlfriend will be doing the cooking. 

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2 hours ago, GinRummy said:

You’re the figures guy. Putting you on the spot and asking how many areas, and which ones, would be in level 4 if it weren’t for Xmas and/or the new Covid strain. 

 

An epithet I roundly reject. :D

 

I have no idea, GR, because I don't have access to all the indicators that they use to determine the tiers.

 

However, as a *very rough* guide, taking as our measure the 7-day per-100,000 levels when the 11 Tier 4's were first implemented, everyone from Perth and Kinross upwards on the graph I just posted would be in Tier 4. Edinburgh City would have been fairly bang in between Tier 3 and Tier 4.

 

That really is back of the envelope stuff though and I don't quite see where you want to go with this.

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The Real Maroonblood
25 minutes ago, redjambo said:

Today's 7-day per-capita rates around the councils:

 

    7-day per-100,000 cases              
Council Area Tier Today Yesterday       21 Dec 20 Dec 19 Dec 18 Dec 17 Dec
Scotland   130 121 +9     112 98 96 105 111
North Ayrshire 3 203 193 +10     189 175 160 174 194
Aberdeen City 3 189 176 +13     162 163 150 162 166
East Ayrshire 3 178 168 +10     154 153 160 159 171
Glasgow City 3 167 153 +14     135 129 122 140 143
East Renfrewshire 3 164 147 +17     129 101 91 109 109
East Lothian 3 163 172 -9     174 148 146 147 148
Renfrewshire 3 159 147 +12     122 116 106 121 141
South Lanarkshire 3 158 133 +25     129 120 119 122 133
West Dunbartonshire 3 150 145 +5     126 120 102 99 105
Dundee City 3 149 129 +20     119 113 125 146 149
Clackmannanshire 3 146 144 +2     150 148 138 173 167
North Lanarkshire 3 143 131 +12     131 119 129 133 141
Perth and Kinross 3 143 144 -1     139 126 116 143 124
Edinburgh City 3 135 129 +6     122 109 106 112 113
Midlothian 3 133 139 -6     136 136 142 151 176
Aberdeenshire 3 127 118 +9     106 88 79 82 84
Fife 3 117 111 +6     107 97 100 118 128
Stirling 3 110 91 +19     94 70 62 67 67
East Dunbartonshire 3 108 102 +6     91 70 67 78 86
Inverclyde 2 107 86 +21     73 59 54 64 66
Scottish Borders 1 105 106 -1     100 85 87 100 92
South Ayrshire 3 104 95 +9     97 98 96 99 118
West Lothian 3 103 103 0     97 83 87 89 92
Falkirk 2 93 84 +9     80 60 64 65 70
Angus 2 71 64 +7     52 37 37 45 47
Dumfries & Galloway 1 58 54 +4     40 32 26 29 24
Moray 1 53 41 +12     26 13 17 19 21
Argyll and Bute 2 43 41 +2     38 29 28 33 37
Highland 1 31 28 +3     24 17 17 18 17
Shetland Islands 1 9 4 +5     4 0 0 0 0
Na h-Eileanan Siar 1 7 11 -4     15 22 19 15 15
Orkney Islands 1 0 0 0     0 0 0 0 0

👍

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16 minutes ago, 3fingersreid said:

Correct , the irony is as an island we should’ve shut up shop , instead the bloody french did it to us in reverse . 

Not one politician comes out of this with any positivity regardless of party , a complete and utter shit show 

 

This in as many gardening digging implements as you can muster. Not shut up shop entirely, but test and/or isolate everyone coming in to the country.

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3 minutes ago, redjambo said:

 

An epithet I roundly reject. :D

 

I have no idea, GR, because I don't have access to all the indicators that they use to determine the tiers.

 

However, as a *very rough* guide, taking as our measure the 7-day per-100,000 levels when the 11 Tier 4's were first implemented, everyone from Perth and Kinross upwards on the graph I just posted would be in Tier 4. Edinburgh City would have been fairly bang in between Tier 3 and Tier 4.

 

That really is back of the envelope stuff though and I don't quite see where you want to go with this.

Thanks very much. Was just a rough idea I was looking for 👍

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Weakened Offender
1 hour ago, LMc said:

There are dozens (probably more) of variants floating about. This has been going on all year. It's spreading more because of the piss poor leadership straight from the top. They've made mistakes at every single turn and are now hiding behind this new 'more contagious' strain shtick. It's ridiculous. We're a ******* island and they're moaning about new strains coming on from abroad. Unbelievable. 

 

They've spent the year pissing about with half arsed lockdowns, then getting people out as much as possible, then more half arsed lockdowns bit only for some areas, whilst still trying to get some people back in the office/in pubs/shops/football stadiums. They then decided to let everyone do what they want and mix for five days before deciding that it's really not a good idea and completely flipping that on its head and blaming the upturn in cases that they've not handled correctly on new variants.

 

A shambles of an initial pandemic response, a barely functional contact tracing system in place but no, it Joe public spreading this new variant that's the problem.

 

Nailed it. 

 

A small island that had a pretty generous heads up in terms of time and notice and we end up with a horrific death toll. 

 

Fast forward 9 months and we are making the exact same mistakes, leaving the rest of the world self-islolating from US. Utterly shambolic and incompetent. Criminal in fact. 

 

Anyone who believes the UK government is going to do anything remotely sensible in terms of Brexit deserves a ****ing scudding. 

Edited by Weakened Offender
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Governor Tarkin
1 hour ago, Lord BJ said:

I think we will see curfews introduced in this country

 

Ear to the ground or just a feeling?

 

 

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Seymour M Hersh
4 hours ago, Enzo Chiefo said:

Yes and many foreign virologists are also "scoffing " at the hysterical, British response to this new strain. One Dutch expert ssid he was taken aback by the "drastic" measures we imposed. Sturgeon said today that we are in "the most dangerous part of this pandemic since February". Probably the most ridiculous comment I have heard this year.

 

And there's been thousands of them. 

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Seymour M Hersh
2 hours ago, Candy said:

FFS a new variant from South Africa is even more transmissible according  to hat mancock

 

That's the last thing that ****ing tosser has. 

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Seymour M Hersh
2 hours ago, OmiyaHearts said:

I've heard from two different sources today that the Lockdown could last until March / April. Wondering if anyone else has heard similar?

 

My wife has a customer who's an NHS manager and he told her this morning it will likely last until March. So, I thought I would message my mate, who works at Vicky Infirmary and he messaged me this:

Screenshot_20201223-112815_WhatsApp.thumb.jpg.5e75814d04d504c7b32e9a3688ec5c3c.jpg

 

 

Buzzing at this prospect.

 

My wife, who works for the NHS, has heard nothing like that. 

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Pasquale for King
2 hours ago, jonesy said:

Yep*. That's why I said she's now gone up in my estimation :) (was last night on this thread, so you may have missed it!). 

 

* I reserve the right to be a hypocrite and absolute slaver.

I wasn’t having a go at you, only realised today you don’t wear one and have a good reason not to. Was more the loonies screaming for her to resign because of this indiscretion. 

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3 minutes ago, Barack said:

Got my Covid-19 test back. I'm negative.

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

She's not though. Oh, well. Merry Christmas. :lol:

 

 

Jesus dude😧

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2 hours ago, Lord BJ said:

I think we will see curfews introduced in this country

 

Curfews for what? The only place you can go is the supermarket. 

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1 minute ago, TheOak88 said:

 

Curfews for what? The only place you can go is the supermarket. 

 

I think he means a curfew in the literal sense.  People not permitted to be out in the street at all without a permitted reason.  Presumably to reduce the amount of indoor meet-ups that go on,  whatever that level is.

 

 

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1 minute ago, Barack said:

Ach, it is what it is bud. 

 

Just get 2020 over and done with.


Hopefully it passes for her with less hassle than the flying off her bike incident. ❤️

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2 minutes ago, Victorian said:

 

I think he means a curfew in the literal sense.  People not permitted to be out in the street at all without a permitted reason.  Presumably to reduce the amount of indoor meet-ups that go on,  whatever that level is.

 

 

 

Proper authoritarian stuff that. Wouldn’t put it past Sturgeon though. 

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2 minutes ago, TheOak88 said:

 

Proper authoritarian stuff that. Wouldn’t put it past Sturgeon though. 

 

It really isn't.  It could be a neccesary escalation if things get rough.  It would never be a measure conceived by a politician anyway.  It would be something requested from within the body of advisors and instigated by politicians.

 

 

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