SPFL and Covid ( Leagues 1 and 2 to restart )

[Last Laff]

14 minutes ago, Newton51 said:

 

This is getting pretty desperate now. United pay compensation for a manager but also begging other clubs to pay for legal fees

Nothing wrong with trying to keep football and legal matters separate. If they are desperate then tough cookies. 

[eyesandears]

20 minutes ago, cjambo1993 said:

 

https://www.bbc.co.uk/sport/football/53346709

On the day that Dundee United's new manager is in the papers saying he's been give the green light to make signings if he wants to strengthen the squad by both Ogren and Asghar. Shameless.

[Australis]

13 minutes ago, dazinho88 said:

 

Surely this lot are giving us so much ammunition for the arbitration??

Yep, it's like an open goal after what they did to us.

[NANOJAMBO]

3 minutes ago, neilnunb said:

 

 

Absolutely embarrassing behaviour.

This.

They'd rather go begging than support a recon resolution (twice) even though AB warned them, all of them,  what would happen.

[Jambo66]

1 minute ago, Ethan Hunt said:

Can you post the relevant section? 

You're stretching my IT abilities with that request 😂😂

It's the clause relating to acting in utmost good faith. There is no commonality of cause between the CE and the rest of the SPFL, so the C3 and any club providing funding is failing to act with the utmost good faith towards us and Partick Thistle.

[heartandsoul]

1 hour ago, Rick Sanchez said:

 

I hope it drags out so long that the season starts, it's taken back to Lord Clark who takes a dim view of it and awards the full 10m.

 

I'm starting not to bother about being in the championship. It's not going to be a normal season anyway. So 8m and a few clubs bust is a result for me.

This

[Spellczech]

26 minutes ago, cjambo1993 said:

 

https://www.bbc.co.uk/sport/football/53346709

I wonder if their talkative QC is phoning each club individually each day rather than boring them on a Zoom call? He'll be costing a small fortune...

[Dusk_Till_Dawn]

1 hour ago, AllyjamboDerbyshire said:

Feeble? Do you not think justifying your post by saying 'that's my opinion', is not feeble? And I'm not saying 'only hand out things which are positive' either. I am comparing the two actions, one does no harm to others, while the other does great harm when not justified with a points total over a full season.

 

You in your original post stated, quite categorically, but without any attempt to support or justify saying it, that you can't award the title without relegation. You stated it in a way that suggested it was not possible, under any circumstances, to have champions without a club being relegated. That is distinctly not the case, and there are a great many examples in Scottish senior football alone that show it not to be the case. If you don't like the fact that Celtic have been crowned champions (and I'm certain a great many are of the same opinion) then say that, but don't tie it in with (our) relegation, or suggest that our reinstatement (no relegation) might lead to Celtic losing their title, because it's just not the case. 

 

Giving opinions here is fine, but it would be helpful if you are only giving an opinion with no available argument to support it, that you make it clear you are only stating your opinion and not pontificating like someone considered of such a high station that his word is beyond reproach.

Given some of what’s been posted on this thread (uniformed opinion masquerading as informed opinion or fact) you’ve got a ****ing nerve digging me out for that. But that’s by the byes. 
 

Out of interest, could you list the countries which have awarded titles but not imposed promotion/relegation? Since it’s clearly such an obvious route to take.

[Bickfest]

51 minutes ago, graygo said:

For reference here's the bit in Lord Clark's report about the make up of the panel.

 

[20] In terms of the Article 99.19 of the SFA’s articles of association, the arbitral tribunal (“the Tribunal”) may consist of three arbitrators. One of the provisions states that, if so, each party shall nominate an individual from the Tribunal Candidate List as its arbitrator, and the two arbitrators so appointed shall appoint a third arbitrator who shall be or has been a solicitor or advocate or member of the judiciary (Sheriff Court or Court of Session) of not less than 10 years’ standing (including cumulatively in a combination of the said functions) 
and who shall act as chairman of the Tribunal (“the Tribunal Chairman”). Accordingly, theSFA will not judge the issue in the arbitration. The independent arbitral tribunal will be presided over by an experienced lawyer or member of the judiciary. The arbitral tribunal is able to require evidence from witnesses and if required, in terms of rule 45 of the Scottish Arbitration Rules, the court can make appropriate orders in that regard.

You are right, of course. Apologies for suggesting otherwise. He did add "I do not regard Mr Moynihan’s submission that persons with an interest in football are better placed than the court to deal with this issue as well-founded. The case involves allegations of unfair prejudice. It is a matter of company law, upon which there is substantial authority in the case law, and it will require appropriate legal expertise in the arbitration tribunal." That is a clear warning to ensure that the tribunal is able to properly assess the materials and law at issue.

[Don Dan]

So the Clubs will be paying for the SPFL arbitration costs and the Calpol3 are now asking the clubs to help foot their bill. 
So it will be the clubs footing the bill thus
SPFL costs X + Calpol3 costs Y = Nae Chance. 

[Jambo-Jimbo]

15 minutes ago, Diadora Van Basten said:

The way I see it the SPFL is representing the clubs. The Calpol 3 are representing themselves and suspect the ruling is going to go against them.

 

I suspect this is the SPFL trying to gain leverage by saying its all the other clubs apart from Inverness who have their own view of the world (the correct view in my opinion) v Hearts and Partick Thistle. It wouldn’t surprise me if the Raith chairman even asked Stranraer to contribute.

 

There is no reason for any club to get involved unless the Calpol 3 don’t trust the SPFL to represent their interests.

 

Would love to be a fly on the wall if Raith phoned Falkirk to ask them to contribute, *&%$£@@*&*^^%  would be the reply I'd think.

[kila]

7 minutes ago, Jambo66 said:

You're stretching my IT abilities with that request 😂😂

It's the clause relating to acting in utmost good faith. There is no commonality of cause between the CE and the rest of the SPFL, so the C3 and any club providing funding is failing to act with the utmost good faith towards us and Partick Thistle.

 

So any clubs that donate money to the Capol 3's legal fees have to donate the same towards Hearts/Partick too?

 

[Boof]

13 minutes ago, Jambo66 said:

I've said it before and I'll say it again. Any club that contributes to the legal fees of the C3 is in breach of SPFL rules. Not only that, by asking for financial support, the C3 are also in breach of the rules.

 

Being a bit devil's advocatey here but unless they've made the request in such a way that there might be some ambiguity as to what it's for and it's only the press reporting it as such?

 

For the record I do believe that the press are capable of misreporting even the simplest of facts but also twisting things to suit whatever agenda they wish to peddle.

 

[Ribble]

1 minute ago, Dannie Boy said:

So the Clubs will be paying for the SPFL arbitration costs and the Calpol3 are now asking the clubs to help foot their bill. 
So it will be the clubs footing the bill thus
SPFL costs X + Calpol3 costs Y = Nae Chance. 

 

Yeah, it's basically a followup to the failed SPFL 'pay to see' blackmail trying to force clubs to join the calpol 3 last week.

[Cruyff]

9 minutes ago, Jambo66 said:

You're stretching my IT abilities with that request 😂😂

It's the clause relating to acting in utmost good faith. There is no commonality of cause between the CE and the rest of the SPFL, so the C3 and any club providing funding is failing to act with the utmost good faith towards us and Partick Thistle.

I'm sure Hearts views on this will be, 

 

"Never interrupt when your enemy is making a mistake." - Napoleon 

[Ethan Hunt]

11 minutes ago, Jambo66 said:

You're stretching my IT abilities with that request 😂😂

It's the clause relating to acting in utmost good faith. There is no commonality of cause between the CE and the rest of the SPFL, so the C3 and any club providing funding is failing to act with the utmost good faith towards us and Partick Thistle.

Time to start compiling a list of those who have breached rule B2.

Edited July 9, 2020 by Ethan Hunt

[Spellczech]

18 minutes ago, SuperstarSteve said:

Could be wrong but didn’t nelms mention the friendly games after stating the big hitters are now calling. 
I’m sure I also heard Peter Martin on PLZ confirm nelms made those comments but had no authority to do so and should’ve kept his mouth shut. 
Not looked back over his comments just being lazy and hoping to be corrected if that isn’t the case. 

Yeah I was wrong in the first sentence - Someone posted the Rangers dossier extract in last couple of pages and it shows that friendlies were mentioned by Nelms to Partick...

 

 

[Last Laff]

14 minutes ago, Mundaydog said:

I think you have to mind that this discussion was around the good Friday weekend, no decisions had been made then regarding length of time before folk could be back at the football.

Nelms was potentially promised a friendly against Celtic around this time. (mind Betfred games should be on at moment)

 

Like Donald Trump I wonder if those in charge back in March/ April time thought covid would just 'disappear' and life would all be back to normal by now.. clowns 

Possibly I suppose but very far fetched.  

[Don Dan]

To the SPFL clubs.

 

 "if you find yourself in a hole, stop digging"

[Spellczech]

2 minutes ago, Ethan Hunt said:

Time to start compiling a list of those who have breached rule B2.

Well Ross County are on it from the "take your medicine" comment. Not sure any others have done so publicly, just via journos

[Trained One]

6 minutes ago, Ribble said:

 

Yeah, it's basically a followup to the failed SPFL 'pay to see' blackmail trying to force clubs to join the calpol 3 last week.

 

That's how I see it...another call for a pile on.

[manaliveits105]

22 minutes ago, Jambo66 said:

I've said it before and I'll say it again. Any club that contributes to the legal fees of the C3 is in breach of SPFL rules. Not only that, by asking for financial support, the C3 are also in breach of the rules.

Lets hope so - another own goal perhaps ! 

 

FDU FRR FCR

[Riccarton3]

Just now, Trained One said:

 

That's how I see it...another call for a pile on.

Yes. Organised by the SPFL Board but disguised that it is an initiative of these three clubs.

[Paris 1984]

I’d love to hear the conversation between the Raith Rovers Chairman and the Falkirk Chairman when he phones him asking for some money to offset their legal fees. 
 

Raith Rovers have to be the most shameless club in Scotland. 
 

[Ribble]

7 minutes ago, Ethan Hunt said:

Time to start compiling a list of those who have breached rule B2.

 

SPFL would probably rule that none of the comments were unfair and that Hearts deserved it

[August Landmesser]

1 hour ago, I.T.K said:

 

People will argue that league could not be finished before the start of the new season. However the solution to that would be finish last season, then delay and cut short next season with agreement with all teams.   

 

1000 times this. The priority should always be the season already underway rather than the season yet to start, but this whole boondoggle was always mostly driven by Celtic and their Euro qualifying.

 

Hopefully Arbitration will confirm that they're only Champions Until Next Tuesday (s)...

[Ethan Hunt]

21 minutes ago, NANOJAMBO said:

It absolutely was - their legal advice shows that to be the case.

The Board look at every excuse for not carrying on , piled the excuses high, even told the Scottish govt they'd need 6 weeks training before they could restart , effectively blackmailed the clubs , asked UEFA if it was OK to end the season  and as soon as UEFA said "yes" they voted . Job done.

 

Nothing was going to be allowed to compromise the £32M that is due to roll in to the SPFL coffers. Especially not the idea that you could potentially still have season 19/20 games playing when the 20/21 league cup was supposed to have started. 

And it would appear Doncaster didn’t even approach Sky to gain their thoughts on the matter, and whether they would even seek to implement any penalty clause should the season fail to start over on the agreed date. That will not help the SPFL case at all. A decision made which punished three clubs in particular, without even knowing if the main reason for making the decision was even going to be enforced.

[jackal]

Is this whole thing just about ND getting his 90k bonus at the expense of almost every club.

[manaliveits105]

Celtic tainted title and Donkeys bonus and our thick lemming chairmen all went along with it 

[Turkishcap]

12 minutes ago, Dannie Boy said:

To the SPFL clubs.

 

 "if you find yourself in a hole, stop digging"

Or well you have started may as well carry on.

[Hagar the Horrible]

So to be clear

 

Celtic might but have their own court case  so unlikely

Rangers  NO

Aberdeen Broke NO

Hibs Broke NO

Hamilton NO

ICT NO

Falkirk NO

Edinburgh City NO

Dundee Skint NO

Stranraer NO

 

So the rest are asking to pay for a legal case thats more likey to lose as they have just made our point?

 

Clubs now been asked to pay twice?  Just wait until it has to be paid.....what us naw sorry you are on your own.  Would you trust any of these self serving asswipes.  But if there is such a swell of that amount of sheer hatred towards us and partick, then we have done something in 150 years is to bring the clubs together

[neilnunb]

https://www.dundeeunitedfc.co.uk/news/6507/GOFUNDME-CAMPAIGN-ENDORSED-BY-UNITED.html

 

🤣

[Hackney Hearts]

4 hours ago, henryheart said:

This guy Clark from Raith does not get it. There is no suggestion that all votes were placed to prejudice Hearts. He is right that in most cases the votes were placed for self interest ; in his case promotion but he fails to understand that he still has an obligation to vote taking into account the full consequences of doing so.  

 

He simply doesn't understand the use of the term prejudice in this case. He thinks (understandably this being Scotland I guess) that it's to do with bias & bigotry. That it's about motivation. Whereas in fact it means 'causing harm to' (regardless of the reason).

[Pans Jambo]

57 minutes ago, cjambo1993 said:

 

https://www.bbc.co.uk/sport/football/53346709

I think fair's fair....after all, we will be asking them for £200,000 each if/when we win 

[Newton51]

4 minutes ago, Hagar the Horrible said:

So to be clear

 

Celtic might but have their own court case  so unlikely

Rangers  NO

Aberdeen Broke NO

Hibs Broke NO

Hamilton NO

ICT NO

Falkirk NO

Edinburgh City NO

Dundee Skint NO

Stranraer NO

 

So the rest are asking to pay for a legal case thats more likey to lose as they have just made our point?

 

Clubs now been asked to pay twice?  Just wait until it has to be paid.....what us naw sorry you are on your own.  Would you trust any of these self serving asswipes.  But if there is such a swell of that amount of sheer hatred towards us and partick, then we have done something in 150 years is to bring the clubs together

 

The calpol 3 might be wanting to challenge arbitration but having the money to do it is another thing!

[Zico]

“Oh hi Rangers, Falkirk, Inverness and Edinburgh, it’s the thoroughly deserved title winners here. Would you mind awfully chucking ten grand into our begging bowl?Big bad Hearts (let’s continue to ignore Partick as that doesn’t suit our narrative) are being big and bad, talking about unfairness, morality, legality, due care, minimising harm and other shit we neither understand or care about. You can write the cheques out to ‘the shameless *******s triumvirate plc’. Thank you please.”
 

And I thought Albion Rovers voting against reconstruction because they couldn’t afford petrol and sandwiches was as ****ing tinpot as it got. 

[AndrewB]

4 minutes ago, Hagar the Horrible said:

So to be clear

 

Celtic might but have their own court case  so unlikely

Rangers  NO

Aberdeen Broke NO

Hibs Broke NO

Hamilton NO

ICT NO

Falkirk NO

Edinburgh City NO

Dundee Skint NO

Stranraer NO

 

So the rest are asking to pay for a legal case thats more likey to lose as they have just made our point?

 

Clubs now been asked to pay twice?  Just wait until it has to be paid.....what us naw sorry you are on your own.  Would you trust any of these self serving asswipes.  But if there is such a swell of that amount of sheer hatred towards us and partick, then we have done something in 150 years is to bring the clubs together

Not sure why Clyde, Dumbarton, Annan, Morton etc who don't have a horse running would be up for contributing.

Scottish clubs showed they only care about themselves.  Why change now?

[Jambo Mac]

2 hours ago, Clerry Jambo said:

Jim Spence Retweeted

 

 

 

Dave Cormack

 

@CormackDavie

·

12h

 

Next week we’ll update Dons fans on the Club’s cashflow projections for Season 20/21. An example of the reality we face is an income loss of £400,000 with the Rangers game being played behind closed doors. Determined to avoid staff redundancies and entertain our fans! Stand Free!

Wonder if he has noticed that they have Celtic at home on 24th October(1st game of second round of fixtures).If not BCD. then certainly with a vastly reduced crowd

[Rogue Daddy]

Apologies for asking (as I don’t doubt the answer has been offered somewhere) but - clubs financing a legal dispute against another club is surely illegal? I’m sure someone on here quoted something to that effect from the SPFLs ‘rules’?

Also, the C3 obviously don’t fancy their chances, asking for donations for their fees payable when they lose?

Lastly, if the C3 are given funds, surely this would constitute ‘unfair prejudice’?

Desperate. Just desperate. How have things got to this stage? The SPFL board and CEO are clearly not for for purpose. 

 

[gjcc]

Anyone fancy doing their walk in reverse with all funds to Big Hearts or the like. 🤔

[Hagar the Horrible]

We could offer £50k for Shankland that will cover the costs.....

[HMFC01]

5 minutes ago, neilnunb said:

https://www.dundeeunitedfc.co.uk/news/6507/GOFUNDME-CAMPAIGN-ENDORSED-BY-UNITED.html

 

🤣

 

Just read it.  That is highly inappropriate to be anywhere near Tynecastle during an arbitration, especially during a pandemic event.  It shouldn't be allowed.

[neilnunb]

1 minute ago, HMFC01 said:

 

Just read it.  That is highly inappropriate to be anywhere near Tynecastle during an arbitration, especially during a pandemic event.  It shouldn't be allowed.

 

Exactly. Especially now it has been endorsed by the club.

 

Hope our lawyers will be firing off a wee letter telling them to GTF.

 

🤣

[EIEIO]

2 minutes ago, HMFC01 said:

 

Just read it.  That is highly inappropriate to be anywhere near Tynecastle during an arbitration, especially during a pandemic event.  It shouldn't be allowed.

They should be walking to Hampden not Tynecastle, if anywhere.

[graygo]

52 minutes ago, Jambo66 said:

I've said it before and I'll say it again. Any club that contributes to the legal fees of the C3 is in breach of SPFL rules. Not only that, by asking for financial support, the C3 are also in breach of the rules.

 

Got a link to those rules? I so hope that's true.

[manaliveits105]

I take it Dundee United endorse Fatty's foul mouthed tirade on social media too 

[Hungry hippo]

7 minutes ago, Rogue Daddy said:

Apologies for asking (as I don’t doubt the answer has been offered somewhere) but - clubs financing a legal dispute against another club is surely illegal? I’m sure someone on here quoted something to that effect from the SPFLs ‘rules’?

Also, the C3 obviously don’t fancy their chances, asking for donations for their fees payable when they lose?

Lastly, if the C3 are given funds, surely this would constitute ‘unfair prejudice’?

Desperate. Just desperate. How have things got to this stage? The SPFL board and CEO are clearly not for for purpose. 

 

 

It doesn't seem to be specifically illegal although adds to our case on issues such as upmost good faith and prejudice.

[Gordon Ramsay]

14 minutes ago, neilnunb said:

https://www.dundeeunitedfc.co.uk/news/6507/GOFUNDME-CAMPAIGN-ENDORSED-BY-UNITED.html

 

🤣

 

Total embarrassment. 

 

Not even got the brains to set up their own funding campaign and have to jump on the back of Laurel and Hardys walk. 

[Radio Ga Ga]

29 minutes ago, August Landmesser said:

1000 times this. The priority should always be the season already underway rather than the season yet to start, but this whole boondoggle was always mostly driven by Celtic and their Euro qualifying.

 

Hopefully Arbitration will confirm that they're only Champions Until Next Tuesday (s)...

I see what you did there

[niblick1874]

5 hours ago, Floridajambo said:

There is one point here that concerns me about the entire case. If we do "win" the arbitration and they conclude the SPFL vote was irregular and the league relegations were unlawful, what is to prevent the SPFL just saying mea culpa and having exactly the same vote again? Rightly or wrongly, I suspect the result this time would be even more than 81% in favor as the other clubs would just want to really slam Hearts & Partick Thistle.

 

Having that vote again would be asking clubs to vote harm on other clubs and that is not allowed. The SPFL asked clubs to vote to harm other clubs right at the beginning and just as it would not be allowed now, it was not allowed then. Surely because of this we win right of the bat.  Am I missing something?