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SPFL and Covid ( Leagues 1 and 2 to restart )


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28 minutes ago, Forever Hearts said:

Absolutely no need to scrap this season's Scottish Cup, it's only three games and could be played within seven days. It would also be a nice gesture to give all the gate receipts from the three games to NHS Scotland. 

NHS is not a charity , we pay taxes for a health service 

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32 minutes ago, TheOak88 said:

 

The cup will be scrapped. 

No chance. Dungcaster is so far up Lawells hoop that peer pressure will give way to their quadruple treble and they’ll find a way to play this out at all costs 

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annushorribilis III
2 hours ago, David McCaig said:

The 14 team league has no impact on the OF whatsoever. Other than everyone including TV knows their fixture list for the rest of the season from game 23 onwards as opposed to game 33. It also guarantees a balanced home and away fixture list.

 

TV money is allocated on league positions 1-42, so no reason why that needs to change either.

A 14 team top division can't be split 50-50 (IMO) because you'd have 2 teams not playing every week. 

 

In addition , if you split it 6-8 or 8-6 to get around this problem there will be advantage to some teams who will have more fixtures (hence potentially more income). 

 

In the scheme of things though I don't see why this should be insurmountable but then we know it's every man for himself out there so the likelihood of finding a solution that everyone will accept is very small. 

 

Whatever restructure solution we get (assuming Hearts are not expelled from the SPFL) has to be better than the current scenario. It would give fairness throughout the football pyramid.

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If cash is the big issue, why can't they just pay out everyone the prize money amount of the team in last position of each respective league for now? Then have more time to come up with a better solution? Would still be a decent chunk of cash, which would be topped up at a later date. 

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husref musemic
18 minutes ago, Siphiwe Tshabalala said:

Why not just pay the money out?

 

Then wait until it’s safe to finish the season?

 

I don’t understand how you can give titles and relegations out when the season is not complete.

it's the lever to make Celtic champions and expel hearts.

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Forever Hearts
3 minutes ago, johnthomas said:

NHS is not a charity , we pay taxes for a health service 

I'm fully aware it's not a charity. I'm also fully aware we are in the grip of a worldwide pandemic and thousands of people are dying, including many NHS workers who are overworked and working without the proper PPE. They need every bit of help they can get. 

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Saint Jambo
4 minutes ago, Geoff Kilpatrick said:

Point 2 already has a valid reason, viz. the reveal of the other votes. We would surely have grounds to say that no action can be taken at all until 27 days had passed and all other clubs can choose to change votes.

 

3 minutes ago, TypoonJambo said:

Does this also mean all other teams, irrespective of how they originally voted, can change their minds? 

 

Revealing the votes before the result is known seems unfair and stupid but isn't necessarily against the rules. If the vote is a mechanism for executing a written resolution of members, it wouldn't be unusual for members to know who had already signed the resolution before deciding to do so themselves. There might be a company rule setting out the process of the vote and stating that a partial result can't be announced but that seems unlikely given they are taking legal advice on the process.

 

On the changing their minds point, my reading (based on not having access to all the facts) is that it is quite possible that clubs would be able to change their mind, but only up to the point that the resolution gets enough support to pass. As things stand, if Dundee vote in favour today it will immediately pass. As I understand it, the 28day deadline in company law is a deadline at which a written resolution falls if it has not achieved enough support, so a maximum not minimum time for the process to run.

 

This assumes that the reporting that the vote is a process for executing a written resolution is correct and even then there may be additional company (SPFL) rules around the process that we do not have access to that would change this. My main point is that we don't have access to information that confirms the process is flawed. It might be but working on the basis that the SPFL have lawyers working with them on this, I'm tempted to work from the starting point that they are a bunch of *******s but they are a well advised bunch of *******s.

 

I should say that while I've spent a fair amount of time working around corporate governance of membership organisations, I'm not a lawyer so someone with greater expertise may correct my interpretation.

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annushorribilis III
14 minutes ago, hughesie27 said:

You'd have a point if the final SPL vote actually mattered. There's no point chasing it up if the result is the same. And On the cha going mind point. If Dundee have submitted a No vote that is not received yet that vote should count. If they have officially said they are abstaining and abstaining is allowed then that should count.

If they have not submitted a vote yet then and vote they do submit would officially not be a change of mind any more so than what Aberdeen seemingly done.

 

That's not to say that the whole thing isn't now open to corruption and ridicule thanks to hem releasing the voting info so far.

If Dundee have cast their vote (the SPFL mentioned some kind  of technicality that invalidated the vote ?) then all Dundee should be asked to do is make it technically fit for purpose , either now (if they prefer) or within the 28 day time limit under company law.

 

They cannot be allowed to change the their vote - assuming it has already been cast. 

 

Edit I've just seen StJambos last post - it might be that  company law allows for the Dundee  scenario ( ie vote, vote not accepted, so vote again). 

Edited by annushorribilis III
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jack D and coke
1 hour ago, TheBigO said:

Right here is everything wrong with the Scottish game.

 

If Celtic were second, they wouldn't vote for this. If Rangers were first, they would. If we'd beaten St Mirrens and they were bottom, they wouldn't be voting for this. Chances are (as much as I'd love to think otherwise), we would.

 

The member clubs shouldn't be deciding this. Basically it doesn't effect 90% of the teams in the system so they're voting for easiest way for themselves. I'm all right Jack.

 

Our governing bodies should be saying they're going to protect ALL our clubs. Missing out on promotion is a very different thing to being relegated. Top of the agenda should be how we avoid that. And if we can do so whilst allowing promotion, all the better. Some clubs would miss out, but only that, miss out.

 

Belgium did it without all this crap and backstabbing. Strong leadership to look after their members.

 

Our game, its governors, its clubs, all its stakeholders, is nothing short of depressing.

Yeah sadly all this is true. I’d honestly love to turn my back on Scottish football it’s drained the life out of me so many times. 
 

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Kirky Jambo


 

SPFL Twitter now posting about Dundee’s first derby victory in 10 years. “Please please change your vote”

 

image.png

Edited by everton_jambo
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4 minutes ago, Forever Hearts said:

I'm fully aware it's not a charity. I'm also fully aware we are in the grip of a worldwide pandemic and thousands of people are dying, including many NHS workers who are overworked and working without the proper PPE. They need every bit of help they can get. 

This should come from the government . They managed to bail out the banks .

Don't want to get too political but charities should not be subsidising NHS 

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43 minutes ago, Rannoch said:

I like Anne Budge. I honestly believe her to be a principled and ethical woman and when she took the moral high ground to have the shirt sponsor name: Save the Children,  rather than a betting company like the rest, she had me onside. She has made her money in a business environment, where ethical and legal standards prevail and she obviously feels uncomfortable dealing with the mafiosi in the SPFL and having to hold her nose. All this gerrymandering and slippery behaviour by the SPFL is to award Celtic the title at any cost. When Lennon was wheeled out in such a distasteful way to call for the league , as people were dying  (“one eyed view” -Tom English) in contrast to Klopp at Liverpool , who was most dignified, it was clear where this was going.
No stone will be un turned until Celtic get awarded the title and Hearts are mere collateral damage in this project. Will Anne Budge accept going down? Well that’s her decision but under absolutely no circumstances should the fans. We should fight to our last breath but it needs to be organised. We should let Rangers fight on one flank and us on the other and come together when required. I’ve little faith in the FoH , their latest email offered me a free toy because I had reached a new level of donation. As a Tesco loyalty card holder I probably have more influence over the Tesco CEO than my pledges have on anything Hearts do.  I do however have faith in the fans and would  contemplate anything as would rather , to quote a well worn phrase: “ die in a ditch” that let that corrupt cabal humiliate HMFC. 

 

 

This seems to change by the day. In her first statement she was going to fight it all the way in a later one she seems to be accepting the decision.

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10 minutes ago, Forever Hearts said:

I'm fully aware it's not a charity. I'm also fully aware we are in the grip of a worldwide pandemic and thousands of people are dying, including many NHS workers who are overworked and working without the proper PPE. They need every bit of help they can get. 

By all accounts invite them to games for free, but we shouldn’t be covering for the governments mistakes.

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Forever Hearts
3 minutes ago, johnthomas said:

This should come from the government . They managed to bail out the banks .

Don't want to get too political but charities should not be subsidising NHS 

We're not subsidising them. We're helping them do their job in unprecedented circumstances. 

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5 minutes ago, jack D and coke said:

Yeah sadly all this is true. I’d honestly love to turn my back on Scottish football it’s drained the life out of me so many times. 
 

 

Stick with it Mate. Don't let the *******s win, we'll have to defend ourselves against everyone and we need all of us to have a chance. 

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34 minutes ago, Smithee said:

The premier league pot is meant to be much bigger next season because of the new deal with Sky, the old figures cant really be used for comparison. 

Yep,

 

And depends how distributed.  If mainly to top league then the impact of bringing two clubs up with minimal prize money, also makes the gap bigger from what clubs could have received.

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Finish the season, complete the fixtures when we are able to. If we finish bottom, we go down and will deserve to. Make next season a temporary reduced fixture one with simple home and away, playing each team twice and shelve the split.

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Pasquale for King
34 minutes ago, Perth to Paisley said:

As this season is still 'live' if one club in the bottom 6 went into Admin they would incur a15 point penalty.

(Not ourselves obviously)

#JustSaying

Unfortunately not, if they went bust though they might need to reconstruct the leagues anyway.

E3C587E7-7569-4FC8-A8DF-56FA81B9D9CF.png

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41 minutes ago, gjcc said:


Exactly. We will have an entirely different team next season whether we are relegated or not. 

12.5- When a Match which is postponed, drawn, or abandoned is played or replayed, only those Players who were eligible, by means of their registration, to be listed on the Official Team Line for a Club at the date fixed for originally playing the Match, are eligible to be listed on the Official Team Line for that Club for the rescheduled Match.

 

Well done 

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6 minutes ago, Forever Hearts said:

We're not subsidising them. We're helping them do their job in unprecedented circumstances. 

Of course it is a subsidy ?

It is the government's job to provide the finance even in unprecedented (how sick are people of hearing that word?) circumstances .

The financial crisis was (in recent history) unfeckinprecedented yet the government , using our money , managed to bail them out 

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Stranraer chairman just made a good point on Off the Ball.

 

Patrick's game in hand which if they win they are not bottom. Due to playing in SPFL's Betred Cup. 

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2 minutes ago, Mikey1874 said:

Stranraer chairman just made a good point on Off the Ball.

 

Patrick's game in hand which if they win they are not bottom. Due to playing in SPFL's Betred Cup. 

It's absolutely scandalous

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46 minutes ago, Perth to Paisley said:

As this season is still 'live' if one club in the bottom 6 went into Admin they would incur a15 point penalty.

(Not ourselves obviously)

#JustSaying

And that’s what it’s all about, well said, this is the reason right here.

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Siphiwe Tshabalala
47 minutes ago, Saint Jambo said:

 

Because there is a new TV deal starting and prolonging the season might lead to that deal being voided and a new deal needing to be negotiated. The SPFL are a sporting body that has been asked to choose between prioritising sport or finance. They've chosen finance and that stinks.


That makes sense, thanks.

 

I ain’t surprised, they are a horrible organisation. 

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Hagar the Horrible
3 minutes ago, jamboozy said:

And that’s what it’s all about, well said, this is the reason right here.

As P to P states, if the season is called now, then there Will be one or more clubs hitting admin now and getting the penalty now..this season.  but if they call it then 1 or more will get the penalty next year, and as a collective is no punishment?  We should go mental if the call the league now and some go into admin 5 mins later

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11 minutes ago, Mikey1874 said:

Stranraer chairman just made a good point on Off the Ball.

 

Patrick's game in hand which if they win they are not bottom. Due to playing in SPFL's Betred Cup. 

No offence intended here but reading trough your posts on this thread you seem to be about 5 steps behind the rest of everyone else 😀.

 

 

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3 minutes ago, hughesie27 said:

No offence intended here but reading trough your posts on this thread you seem to be about 5 steps behind the rest of everyone else 😀.

 

 

 

No offence taken.

 

Busy working providing essential services. Great to have this inbetween. 

 

Don't always see every post.

Edited by Mikey1874
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3 minutes ago, Hagar the Horrible said:

As P to P states, if the season is called now, then there Will be one or more clubs hitting admin now and getting the penalty now..this season.  but if they call it then 1 or more will get the penalty next year, and as a collective is no punishment?  We should go mental if the call the league now and some go into admin 5 mins later

You know this is what’s going to happen Haggar, the more I think about this the more angrier I’m getting, we are being thrown out the door so these pissant clubs can stay afloat. 
There is no way that any of these clubs would be able to do what the proud & passionate Fans of Heart of Midlothian did for their beautiful club. Fek them all.

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1 minute ago, Mikey1874 said:

 

No offence taken.

 

Busy working providing essential services.

 

Don't always see every post. 

Well done mate.👍

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Dagger Is Back
10 minutes ago, Forever Hearts said:

I'm fully aware it's not a charity. I'm also fully aware we are in the grip of a worldwide pandemic and thousands of people are dying, including many NHS workers who are overworked and working without the proper PPE. They need every bit of help they can get. 


To be honest I’m with JT. It’s a nice gesture but pay it to the NHS? To be used for what? By bureaucrats?

 

I’ve got total respect and admiration for everyone who has put themselves in the firing line. What about care home workers, some of whom have left their families behind and moved in with the people they care for

 

It’s such a mess. Using the funds to help the families who have lost loved ones from the front line might be a better shout?

 

It’s only a matter of time before stories emerge about how our heroes and heroines families have been abandoned by the state

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5 minutes ago, Mikey1874 said:

 

No offence taken.

 

Busy working providing essential services. Great to have this inbetween. 

 

Don't always see every post.

Brilliant stuff. Keep up the great work sir.

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9 minutes ago, Mikey1874 said:

 

No offence taken.

 

Busy working providing essential services. Great to have this inbetween. 

 

Don't always see every post.

👍

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Forever Hearts
27 minutes ago, johnthomas said:

Of course it is a subsidy ?

It is the government's job to provide the finance even in unprecedented (how sick are people of hearing that word?) circumstances .

The financial crisis was (in recent history) unfeckinprecedented yet the government , using our money , managed to bail them out 

Aye, stuff it. Just let people keep dying. 

I really hope none of your relatives fall ill with this virus and can't get the medical help they need. 

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1 hour ago, frankblack said:

 

You have to think Hearts and Partick must be building up a dossier of evidence for their lawyers.

I think we’ll certainly have spoken to lawyers and I’m going to imagine that the advice given back wasn’t very hopeful, hence why Ms Budge’s language changed and in fact she said we may accept it having said something different two weeks ago.

 

if the SPFL have abided by their own rules when holding this ballot, and those rules are approved by UEFA and/or FIFA and more importantly, the member clubs, then there is no possible legal challenge to a decision arrived at after the ballot IMHO

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Thunderstruck
34 minutes ago, Skacelsid said:

Finish the season, complete the fixtures when we are able to. If we finish bottom, we go down and will deserve to. Make next season a temporary reduced fixture one with simple home and away, playing each team twice and shelve the split.


I had originally thought that “play to a finish” would be best but this is Scotland where we can guarantee that all levels of officialdom would conspire to ensure their desired outcome. I am now in the “null and void” camp. 

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2 hours ago, davemclaren said:

She said she would take legal action if she thought She had a chance of winning. 

Does anyone know for sure if Hearts actually voted ? 

I believe that is the key to legal action from Hearts. 

Not so sure about The Rangers though. 

Apparently their was one Premier team abstained. 

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Tom Hardy’s Dug

Money is the leverage here - if teams are really that desperate for cash now - the whole premise of this shitshow - then reconstruction would get through of it was the only option available.

Edited by Tom Hardy’s Dug
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1 hour ago, Geoff Kilpatrick said:

Like losing a couple of million quid? Aye, great idea! :cornette:


Geoff

 

We’ve been bottom for 4 months. You seem confident that we would get ourselves out of this.

 

Not seen anything to justify that tbh but heh ho

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Fozzyonthefence

I’m looking forward to Rangers’ next statement more than AB’s to be honest.  I think they’re going to come out with both barrels.  Will they wait until Dundee have been coerced into changing their minds or get in before it’s too late?

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tolcross lad
1 hour ago, PTBCAL said:

What’s the worst that could happen? We go down for a year? Get back to getting things right on the pitch. Transfer ownership off the pitch. 
 

Clubs voted for self preservation and I have no issue with this. I have an issue with the SPFL forcing the majority of clubs to accept this by with holding much needed funds.

 

Regardless when the dust is settled we should use this as an opportunity to galvanise the club and bring us all together which is much needed.

I feel very let down by the current Hearts Board .We need a change of ownership and above all a hardness and drive.

I dont think this current Hearts leadership could fight their way out of a paper bag and this weakness stemming from the top was reflected in our team performances.

We need a CEO and a manager who will galvanise the club.There will be a sense of grievance and certainly my family will not be walking away.

Our income will be drastically reduced but cut our cloth.

One thing for sure is that nothing is certain for football in the next year.

Unity will see us through

 

 

 

 

.

 

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Thunderstruck
19 minutes ago, jonnothejambo said:

 

That just sums it up. A Mickey Mouse cup potentially prevents a team from a Mickey Mouse league staying up, all governed by Mickey Mouse organisations. 

 

It just Disney add up !

 

:vrface:


Does Disney+ add up

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12 hours ago, Geoff Kilpatrick said:

My honest answer is to declare things null and void. This shitshow shouldn't be happening in the first place.


Fair enough 👍

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Pasquale for King
4 minutes ago, luckydug said:

Does anyone know for sure if Hearts actually voted ? 

I believe that is the key to legal action from Hearts. 

Not so sure about The Rangers though. 

Apparently their was one Premier team abstained. 

It appears we did but it was late, or after that ***** Doncaster told everyone the results.

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1 hour ago, Perth to Paisley said:

As this season is still 'live' if one club in the bottom 6 went into Admin they would incur a15 point penalty.

(Not ourselves obviously)

#JustSaying

They wouldnt as the cause would the the force majeur. Nice try !!

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Bazzas right boot
2 hours ago, TheBigO said:

Right here is everything wrong with the Scottish game.

 

If Celtic were second, they wouldn't vote for this. If Rangers were first, they would. If we'd beaten St Mirrens and they were bottom, they wouldn't be voting for this. Chances are (as much as I'd love to think otherwise), we would.

 

The member clubs shouldn't be deciding this. Basically it doesn't effect 90% of the teams in the system so they're voting for easiest way for themselves. I'm all right Jack.

 

Our governing bodies should be saying they're going to protect ALL our clubs. Missing out on promotion is a very different thing to being relegated. Top of the agenda should be how we avoid that. And if we can do so whilst allowing promotion, all the better. Some clubs would miss out, but only that, miss out.

 

Belgium did it without all this crap and backstabbing. Strong leadership to look after their members.

 

Our game, its governors, its clubs, all its stakeholders, is nothing short of depressing.

 

 

And this is why if we are relegated I'll bin Scottish football. 

 

Absolute shite house of an organisation. 

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Bazzas right boot
24 minutes ago, jonnothejambo said:

 

That just sums it up. A Mickey Mouse cup potentially prevents a team from a Mickey Mouse league staying up, all governed by Mickey Mouse organisations. 

 

It just Disney add up !

 

:vrface:

 

What a Marvel-ous post. 

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1 hour ago, Geoff Kilpatrick said:

Feck that! Imagine they relegated us. What team would we put out in the semi by the time it is played in October? Plus we should send a message to the arseholes in charge of the game as well.


Hearts could play our youths and beat Hibs in the semi final.  I prefer that outcome to giving them a bye and losing out on £1m tbh. 
 

 

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Geoff Kilpatrick
10 minutes ago, PTBCAL said:


Geoff

 

We’ve been bottom for 4 months. You seem confident that we would get ourselves out of this.

 

Not seen anything to justify that tbh but heh ho

I'm confident we will never know as the game is goosed for months. Thinking we should accept relegation on that basis is a joke.

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  • jkbmod 9 changed the title to SPFL declare league (2019/20) due to Covid (Arbitration panel upholds SPFL decision )
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