Wage cut for players and staff (Statement on 24/4)

[Gizmo]

20 minutes ago, i8hibsh said:

 

We were not even a week out of admin before she started on her 'luxury' spends which have as much place at our club as the Green Brigade. She just can't help herself. All community, charity and diversity projects must be put on hold with immediate effect. No digital innovation centres, no under 16's girls team, no concerts, no save the children donations, it all must stop right now. We have one priority and that is survival. That is to survive relegation and survive this economic drowning.

The Save The Children donations aren't made by us and result in both a large sponsorship deal financed, again, by benefactors who buy into the ethics of the club anddonations to Save The Children: https://www.theguardian.com/football/2015/apr/01/hearts-feature-save-the-children-shirts

The girls team is pennies to run overall - and another thing, along with us paying the living wage, that has attracted the benefactor payments. So, a massive net gain.

Our turnover was massively improved, I suppose she should have not bothered growing the business either?

Outwith Celtic, every team in Scotland lives annually on season ticket income topped up with gate receipts, tv money, prize money, hospitality, corporate and merchandise money. 

This is an unprecedented crisis that we are being proactive about, given we could be without income for the rest of the year. With FoH we are better placed than most clubs so don't for a second think we have done something wrong here - if there was money in the bank, you would have been screaming blue murder at us not spending it on the squad. 

But don't let that get in the way of you blaming Budge. Pesky bloody woman that she is. 


 

[Footballfirst]

1 minute ago, DETTY29 said:

2.5m to purchase club as per CVA and Bidco agreement (paid back)

2.8m 2 year working capital (per CVA  and BidCo agreement (paid)

3m stand funding as voted on by FOH members (paid)

 

So there is £8.3m.

 

Football fans generally dont want rainy day money kept aside.  Celtic have loads of money and their fans 

The £2.8m working capital ended up as £3.05m.

 

There was also £1m up front, that covered Bidco's professional fees and paid the "football creditors"

[Malinga the Swinga]

3 minutes ago, Prof said:

So was I. So which end?

I was only two at the time and wasn't there. My dad was though and he told me, many many times before he died, all about that game. Even I know the answer so what exactly are you trying to prove. You are a self confessed troll who has been caught out. Just give up.

[Prof]

1 minute ago, Vlad Magic said:

So you are admitting to being OzyHibby and you post under that username on .net as a windup?

Get a grip. I’m not going to tell you my Hibsnet user name as I’ve been banned for life once with an older user name and called out as Hearts troll with my current name, so I’m keeping low at the moment.

[The Real Maroonblood]

17 minutes ago, Prof said:

Ok answer this, which end did Gordon eff up against Kilmarnock in 1965. Being a Jambo you’ll know.

 

which end? And where were you that effing day?

Is there a prize?

[Section Q]

3 hours ago, Gashauskis9 said:

Other clubs will hit the wall before we do.  I’d rather we went down this route than raiding FOH to be honest.

Could be a smart way of getting rid of the dead wood...........

[Vlad Magic]

[FarmerTweedy]

2 hours ago, Paolo said:

That is a good point.  They could decline both options.  As could all staff. We can’t sack them for doing so.   Without admin, even redundancy may not be an option, as you can’t make a person redundant, just the role, and now this request has been made, it is hard to say you are making the role redundant.  An employment lawyer would be delighted to take the case on. 

The club could easily make staff redundant. Not so clear cut with players due to football rules around registrations, contracts, etc, but non-playing staff can absolutely be made redundant if the club can't afford them anymore. No employment lawyer would touch it with a barge pole, as long as the club followed rules on consultation periods, notice periods, etc.

[DETTY29]

4 minutes ago, Footballfirst said:

The £2.8m working capital ended up as £3.05m.

 

There was also £1m up front, that covered Bidco's professional fees and paid the "football creditors"

Thanks, which brings us closer to the £9.8m raised by FOH.

Edited March 18, 2020 by DETTY29

[Fozzyonthefence]

13 minutes ago, soonbe110 said:

Raith and Partick beat her to it 

Thought they were asking fans to contribute more, not cut wages by 50%?

[Malinga the Swinga]

2 minutes ago, The Real Maroonblood said:

Is there a prize?

Yep, and to make it easier, you are allowed two guesses.

[Prof]

Just now, Malinga the Swinga said:

I was only two at the time and wasn't there. My dad was though and he told me, many many times before he died, all about that game. Even I know the answer so what exactly are you trying to prove. You are a self confessed troll who has been caught out. Just give up.

A Hibs troll yes but somebody who loves Hearts so any comment I make is because Hearts are part of my life. For the record, Gordon was about 10:yards out , hit the ball well and the Killie goalie made a good save at the Gorgie end. The site of Killie players celebrating a league title at Tynecastle sickened us all that day.

[Malinga the Swinga]

1 minute ago, Prof said:

A Hibs troll yes 

Caught by your own carelessness.

[The Real Maroonblood]

4 minutes ago, Malinga the Swinga said:

Yep, and to make it easier, you are allowed two guesses.

[Beast Boy]

1 hour ago, Holyrood_Hearts said:

I know, imagine the first thing you do is have a look at a rivals website for a reaction to your club’s story....

[Prof]

4 minutes ago, Malinga the Swinga said:

Caught by your own carelessness.

 As opposed to be being caught through stupidity or being one of the “I love hearts “ but was in primary school when the Great Wallace Mercer saves the club.

[heartsfc_fan]

24 minutes ago, Jambos4life said:

Surly hibs will be in the exact same situation, I didn’t believe there finances were much different from ours

They've already started selling season tickets.

We haven't.

[Gordon Ramsay]

2 minutes ago, BarneyBattles said:

The third best supported team in the country, 13,000-odd season ticket holders, 7,500 ish paying in to FOH, decent to very good cup runs in the last year or so. Very generous benefactors and we’re the first club to say 50% cuts are necessary, less than a week after fixtures were suspended. 
 

Sorry, that can’t be dressed up. 

 

Have to agree. 

 

We are being grossly mismanaged from the top. How she ever made any from business is absolutely baffling. 

[Gambo]

7 minutes ago, heartsfc_fan said:

They've already started selling season tickets.

We haven't.

Have they?

[b-reed]

Just now, heartsfc_fan said:

They've already started selling season tickets.

We haven't.

  think it was planned for April...

 

[Malinga the Swinga]

5 minutes ago, Prof said:

 As opposed to be being caught through stupidity or being one of the “I love hearts “ but was in primary school when the Great Wallace Mercer saves the club.

What does the Wallace Mercer comment mean? Already said I was 2 in 1965 so pretty obvious  I wasn't in primary in 1981. In fact, I started work about a month after he came onto scene. 

 

Doesnt matter anyway, in your own words, you are a Hibs troll.

[Francis Albert]

16 minutes ago, Fozzyonthefence said:

Thought they were asking fans to contribute more, not cut wages by 50%?

 

I am a bit surprised that wasn't at least part of our plan. Many of us have budgeted for STs in the next month or so. And maybe Ann foregoing say 50% of her accimulated interest on her loan would have been a nice gesture. 

 

 

[heartsfc_fan]

5 minutes ago, Gambo said:

Have they?

Apologies 🤣 somebody told me at work they had. Just checked...they haven't.

 

He was a Celtic fan evidently.

Edited March 18, 2020 by heartsfc_fan

[OTT]

6 minutes ago, BarneyBattles said:

The third best supported team in the country, 13,000-odd season ticket holders, 7,500 ish paying in to FOH, decent to very good cup runs in the last year or so. Very generous benefactors and we’re the first club to say 50% cuts are necessary, less than a week after fixtures were suspended. 
 

Sorry, that can’t be dressed up. 

 

I think we're doing the right thing doing it now before we're up against it. If we wait then it could be a disaster. Doing it now ensures everything else can run as normally as possible and ensures there is cashflow and hopefully flexibility to get us through to when the new season starts. 

 

Hopefully the players realise that there are a lot of people at the club on a hell of a lot less than them and taking the cut ensures these people can continue to pay their own bills and support their families. Any player that refuses isn't really a player I want at the club tbh. This is unprecedented times and requires everyone to pull together, I hate to say it but hopefully they realise collectively how much they've let everyone down this season and do right by the club and its employees. Admin assistants, shop staff etc. aren't clearing a couple grand a week so if the players can step up here, I'm sure everyone would appreciate them for doing that. 

 

 

[132goals1958]

34 minutes ago, jock _turd said:

 

 

There is some shit yes I will grant you that. There is no way anybody could have seen this coming. But as I have already said while what AB is doing makes total sense, I find it very strange that we are the first out of the blocks to make the announcement that frankly I would be expecting from other teams who are said to be struggling financially. So what I am saying is no I am not going to slag off AB for doing this it is a very sensible move, it just surprises me that we are the first club doing it... or at least saying what we are doing up front.

 

I think she is being proactive as we are no different from businesses across the globe who are caught up in what is financial turmoil. Cash flow projections / sensitivity analysis  covering as many different scenarios in terms of funding requirements will be key in financial planning which at least give an indication of how long we can ride the storm. A 50 percent cut is realistic particularly when so many will be trying to get bye on sickness pay.  I would have been surprised had Anne not addressed the situation as a matter of absolute urgency. It is inevitable that every other club will have to reduce their operating costs imminently possibly more acutely than us.

 

[TyphoonJambo]

Just now, OTT said:

 

I think we're doing the right thing doing it now before we're up against it. If we wait then it could be a disaster. Doing it now ensures everything else can run as normally as possible and ensures there is cashflow and hopefully flexibility to get us through to when the new season starts. 

 

Hopefully the players realise that there are a lot of people at the club on a hell of a lot less than them and taking the cut ensures these people can continue to pay their own bills and support their families. Any player that refuses isn't really a player I want at the club tbh. This is unprecedented times and requires everyone to pull together, I hate to say it but hopefully they realise collectively how much they've let everyone down this season and do right by the club and its employees. Admin assistants, shop staff etc. aren't clearing a couple grand a week so if the players can step up here, I'm sure everyone would appreciate them for doing that. 

 

 

1000% this

[Cade]

Bloody Ann Budge causing a global health scare

 

Get her oooooooot

 

 

*meanwhile, back in the real world......the club has been starved of almost all income other than FOH contribution and donations from others.

With no date set for the resumption of income, it makes perfect sense to make wage cuts, just like any other business.

Edited March 18, 2020 by Cade

[trotter]

15 minutes ago, BarneyBattles said:

The third best supported team in the country, 13,000-odd season ticket holders, 7,500 ish paying in to FOH, decent to very good cup runs in the last year or so. Very generous benefactors and we’re the first club to say 50% cuts are necessary, less than a week after fixtures were suspended. 
 

Sorry, that can’t be dressed up. 

As I replied to Prof earlier, consider this point of view:

We don't actually NEED to do this right now from a financial perspective, but we ARE doing it because right now nobody knows when this will end to the point we can continue as normal. So by reducing wages immediately, we can keep people actually employed for longer. The alternative being we keep paying full wages for the time being, but then run out before this ends and have no choice but to let people go. 

Two sides, same coin. 

[trotter]

4 minutes ago, OTT said:

 

I think we're doing the right thing doing it now before we're up against it. If we wait then it could be a disaster. Doing it now ensures everything else can run as normally as possible and ensures there is cashflow and hopefully flexibility to get us through to when the new season starts. 

 

Hopefully the players realise that there are a lot of people at the club on a hell of a lot less than them and taking the cut ensures these people can continue to pay their own bills and support their families. Any player that refuses isn't really a player I want at the club tbh. This is unprecedented times and requires everyone to pull together, I hate to say it but hopefully they realise collectively how much they've let everyone down this season and do right by the club and its employees. Admin assistants, shop staff etc. aren't clearing a couple grand a week so if the players can step up here, I'm sure everyone would appreciate them for doing that. 

 

 

This. Also, congrats on the 10k  

[soonbe110]

36 minutes ago, Fozzyonthefence said:

Thought they were asking fans to contribute more, not cut wages by 50%?

Asking for help was what I meant. I’m sure they will be cutting wages and players. 

[bean counter]

 

My thoughts on this are that we have made this decision early other clubs are considering what action they need to take to get them through to Aug\Sept

 

The first season after Admin the club asked for season tickets to be paid in cash whereever possible this was because the credit card companies were only releasing monies to the club as each match was played. I don't know what the current situation is.

 

Season ticket monies cover 12 months not just 38 games so this years seasons ticket money was to get us the start of June last yaer to the end of May this year. June wages and expenses would be expected to come from next years monies, ( this cash would normally be coming in in the next few weeks it will not now happen).

 

Usually your non match day income is used to support payment of costs, because of the this virus that has also dried up.

 

Ann and the board now have to work out how to make two months monies ( April & May ) stretch to cover 4/5 months expenditure. With salary costs being the biggest single expenditure item it makes sense to try and make savings there first.

 

I believe we are only the first to announce our plans but will by no means be the last. The SFA early payment monies will not solve the problems, In the next couple of weeks I expect at least 3 other clubs to make public what they plan to do to get them through to Aug\Sept as they are all faced with the same problem.

Edited March 18, 2020 by bean counter

[hearts00]

18 minutes ago, Gordon Ramsay said:

 

Have to agree. 

 

We are being grossly mismanaged from the top. How she ever made any from business is absolutely baffling. 

It is bad no doubt. 
 

Agree with many on here though, I expect virtually every other club to follow suit. 
 

we know the budget was stretched in the summer to give Levein an even higher budget. We obviously stretched the budget even further to get Stendel in and then the likes of Boyce. So we lost discipline clearly with the finances because of the poor output from the footballing department.  
 

However, I do feel Budge is grandstanding a little here. She is virtually the only Chairperson of a football club to speak publicly and now the first to announce this. Does suggest she is trying to apply pressure so that a decision is reached quickly to ensure we are not relegated. 

[Stuart McNeill]

39 minutes ago, Gizmo said:

The Save The Children donations aren't made by us and result in both a large sponsorship deal financed, again, by benefactors who buy into the ethics of the club anddonations to Save The Children: https://www.theguardian.com/football/2015/apr/01/hearts-feature-save-the-children-shirts

The girls team is pennies to run overall - and another thing, along with us paying the living wage, that has attracted the benefactor payments. So, a massive net gain.

Our turnover was massively improved, I suppose she should have not bothered growing the business either?

Outwith Celtic, every team in Scotland lives annually on season ticket income topped up with gate receipts, tv money, prize money, hospitality, corporate and merchandise money. 

This is an unprecedented crisis that we are being proactive about, given we could be without income for the rest of the year. With FoH we are better placed than most clubs so don't for a second think we have done something wrong here - if there was money in the bank, you would have been screaming blue murder at us not spending it on the squad. 

But don't let that get in the way of you blaming Budge. Pesky bloody woman that she is. 


 

 

Your bang on here.

 

The amount of one upmanship in this thread is unbearable. People continuing to drive the dagger into AB and Hearts back due a worldwide event that no one expected to happen.

 

Larger and more successful companies are doing the same, reducing staff costs and making staff redundant, that would be another situation these fans would moan about as well if she was to make the staff redundant.

 

Not only that, everyone knows we will not have football till atleast May/June, why would Budge not try stop limit the most expensive aspect of the clubs expenditure now, rather than waiting for a couple weeks down the line when we would be in even more trouble?

 

Also, why shouldn't the FoH help out?

 

People need to calm down and wait a week or so, and no doubt other clubs - like Raith etc will either be slashing costs or getting the begging bowl out.

 

[blairdin]

There is not a chance in hell of the remaining league fixtures being completed by 30 June 2020. The silence from the SFA and SPFL is deafening. 

 

My take on today is we're acting like any newly relegated club, and cutting our cloth accordingly. Preparing for the worst. Best case scenario is we keep our place in the Premier league, and this little exercise will weed out who really wants to play for our badge from the mercenaries at the end of this season and into next... 

 

 

 

[Fozzyonthefence]

2 hours ago, MrBones said:

So will Stendel stay?

I’m surprised the usual suspects haven’t blamed him for Coronavirus and the wage cuts.

[Randy Marsh]

I would like to see Levein lead by example and agree to have his contract terminated first.  Come on Craig step up to the plate.......

[Jason Dufner]

32 minutes ago, BarneyBattles said:

The third best supported team in the country, 13,000-odd season ticket holders, 7,500 ish paying in to FOH, decent to very good cup runs in the last year or so. Very generous benefactors and we’re the first club to say 50% cuts are necessary, less than a week after fixtures were suspended. 
 

Sorry, that can’t be dressed up. 

Absolutely spot on.

 

The blindness some have when it comes to Budge is incredible 

[centraljambo]

Although a regular reader of this forum, I rarely post. However, I would like to commend Ann Budge for being decisive and taking very sensible and positive action, given the current unprecedented circumstances.

 

I'm retired now but ran my own company for over 30 years. My most difficult management decision was during the recession of 2008/9 when my choices were: putting the company into administration; making more than half of my 40 staff redundant; or negotiating a 50% reduction in staff wages in an attempt to keep the business viable and afloat.

 

I chose the latter option and through hard work by everyone and some good fortune, we weathered the storm and came out the other end in a stronger position. The staff understood the gravity of the situation and everyone pulled together.

 

Very few businesses could stand a period of several months with no income. Mrs Budge's prompt actions are entirely appropriate at this time and I fear that several full-time Scottish football clubs will not survive this crisis without taking drastic measures.

[Phage]

3 hours ago, Mister Dee said:

I’m hoping everyone understands how serious the health situation is. 
 

I work in the NHS, & was at a very somber meeting today, hearing harrowing accounts of the lockdown in Italy. 
Until an effective anti viral medication can be found and distributed, or a vaccine created, it’s hard to see how life can go back to normal anytime soon. 

Personally, I’d be surprised if we get sport going safely again this year, which means professional sport could well be finished in it’s current form.  

 

This. We are not looking at weeks or a month here. 

[Effervesance]

1 minute ago, centraljambo said:

Although a regular reader of this forum, I rarely post. However, I would like to commend Ann Budge for being decisive and taking very sensible and positive action, given the current unprecedented circumstances.

 

I'm retired now but ran my own company for over 30 years. My most difficult management decision was during the recession of 2008/9 when my choices were: putting the company into administration; making more than half of my 40 staff redundant; or negotiating a 50% reduction in staff wages in an attempt to keep the business viable and afloat.

 

I chose the latter option and through hard work by everyone and some good fortune, we weathered the storm and came out the other end in a stronger position. The staff understood the gravity of the situation and everyone pulled together.

 

Very few businesses could stand a period of several months with no income. Mrs Budge's prompt actions are entirely appropriate at this time and I fear that several full-time Scottish football clubs will not survive this crisis without taking drastic measures.

Post of the thread.

 

I’m also self employed and 2008/9 were horrendous. Huge recession, cheap labour from the Poles and lucky to get 2 jobs a week. I literally went without food to pay bills. Had to get the bus to jobs as I never had a tenner to put diesel in the van. This virus is likely to cause a similar set of circumstances.

 

AB has made a difficult but correct call. It would be simple to hope things pan out but if it never? We don’t know when this pandemic will be under control so cut our cloth early and make sure we come out the other side relatively unscathed.

If players can’t accept a pay cut for whatever reason they shouldn’t be hounded. If one of the young lads has a £1000 mortgage based on £4000 minimum income can we chastise them for seeking a better deal elsewhere? It’s not all about loyalty and playing for the shirt as much as we’d like it to be. Players have bills just like the rest of us.

[jimbo99]

4 hours ago, Baxfee said:

Arseholes on this thread. 

[gowestjambo]

1 hour ago, Prof said:

A Hibs troll yes but somebody who loves Hearts so any comment I make is because Hearts are part of my life. For the record, Gordon was about 10:yards out , hit the ball well and the Killie goalie made a good save at the Gorgie end. The site of Killie players celebrating a league title at Tynecastle sickened us all that day.

 

I can assure you until my dying day, the last thing Alan Gordon did was hit it well. He prodded at the ball instead of blasting it into the net.

[J.T.F.Robertson]

4 minutes ago, gowestjambo said:

 

I can assure you until my dying day, the last thing Alan Gordon did was hit it well. He prodded at the ball instead of blasting it into the net.

 

Didn't he actually hit it into the ground? Was donkeys ago but that's my recollection.

[bigsuperslim1874]

4 hours ago, Mikey1874 said:

Sorry state of affairs. Repeated everywhere in one way or another. 

 

Will be some casualties. Might be a need for SFA to implement some amnesty, special measures or something. Say a dozen clubs can't continue. 

 

Or its a big restructure with new clubs coming in. 

Controversial comment but there are too many clubs in Scotland as it is - long term less professional clubs would be a positive thing (I do realise supporters of the smaller clubs would be impacted). Many of the smaller semi-professional clubs would be more suited to Junior level anyway.

[Toxteth O'Grady]

Queen Ann has presided over an absolute shitstorm.

 

This all feels like an admission of failure and a cheapskate way to get rid of all the shite players we've accumulated in a similar way to Motherwell in 2002.

[It should have been ten]

1 minute ago, Toxteth O'Grady said:

Queen Ann has presided over an absolute shitstorm.

 

This all feels like an admission of failure and a cheapskate way to get rid of all the shite players we've accumulated in a similar way to Motherwell in 2002.

It’s not though but don’t let that get in the way of your pish. 

[indianajones]

Other clubs fans laughing at us. 

 

Truth is we are in probably better shape than they are to deal with this pish. Their owners will be following our statements shortly. 

[It should have been ten]

7 minutes ago, indianajones said:

Other clubs fans laughing at us. 

 

Truth is we are in probably better shape than they are to deal with this pish. Their owners will be following our statements shortly. 

Exactly this.

[Diego10]

There is no club in world football immune to having zero income.   Some will last a bit longer due to cash reserves (Celtic), ability of owners to inject capital or ability to load debt.

 

But unless football is back up and running soon, this will be the first action of many.

[SectionDJambo]

It’s not an ideal situation for Hearts to be in, as is the same for many other Scottish clubs.

The government has said that mortgage holidays will be available for any workers who’s financial circumstances are changed by the economic damage from this virus. Surely football players will be entitled to this, in the same way as any other worker in the UK. This, you would imagine, would be the biggest outlay that most people would have in their domestic life. Others in various jobs, outside football, will be relieved to have this opportunity 
It seems completely unrealistic of any worker in the UK to expect their employer to be able to take all of the hit, by continuing to pay 100% of wages, whilst no work is being done to bring income into the club’s business. The kind of step taken by Hearts, will very likely be replicated by other clubs, at best. It’s more important that the football club community survives over this, than buries it’s collective heads in the sand, and hoping they’ll be generating income any time soon.

Some of the comments, of the opinion that Hearts should have sufficient cash reserves to carry on paying out full wages for no work, seem to me to be either an indication of people taking the opportunity to criticise for the hell of it, or just trolls from other clubs’ people.