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The rise and fall of The SNP.


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2 hours ago, Alex Kintner said:


Couldn’t disagree more and if you think things like free school meals, 1140 hours of free childcare and no tuition fees won’t “really make a difference” to the prospects of Scottish children then, with respect, you don’t have a clue. 👍🏻

 

Free school meals - these have always been available to those in need, and for those with cash have little impact. Why do so many children spend their time hanging round corner shops stuffing their faces with carry outs? Free child care has always, once again, been available to the less well off. Working parents have to put their children somewhere and always recognised it as a cost. I wonder how much of the saving goes to enriching the child rather than funding a luxury for the parents? No tuition fees - it certainly gives greater access to further education, but I'm far from convinced that the benefits are worth it. Too many children, who are not aided by the failing educational standards of Scottish schools and are not geared up academically, flood the college system when they would be better learning on the job. One of my ex colleagues thought going to college would be a good idea and found the class full of teenagers who did no work at all, behaved disgracefully and saw it as an extension to school, which they had never been interested in anyway.  

 

I for one would see a better legacy being an education system that educates and a health service that increases life expectancy. Sorry to say that the Scottish Government has failed in delivering either.  

 

  

Edited by henryheart
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3 hours ago, pablo said:

 

I don't think you understand. I'm talking about her legacy, not some random routine stuff you would expect from any administration managing a budget.

 

So if the Smoking ban is recognised as devolution's greatest achievement. Or up there. What's Sturgeon's one big ticket item of similar stature? Just say it and we'll compare.

Independence 

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6 hours ago, Smithee said:

 

Mother of the People's Republic of Scotland.

All hail the Eternal Empress!

 

Shouldn't this be on the 'older women you have a crush on' thread Smithee? 😉

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3 hours ago, henryheart said:

 

Free school meals - these have always been available to those in need, and for those with cash have little impact. Why do so many children spend their time hanging round corner shops stuffing their faces with carry outs? Free child care has always, once again, been available to the less well off. Working parents have to put their children somewhere and always recognised it as a cost. I wonder how much of the saving goes to enriching the child rather than funding a luxury for the parents? No tuition fees - it certainly gives greater access to further education, but I'm far from convinced that the benefits are worth it. Too many children, who are not aided by the failing educational standards of Scottish schools and are not geared up academically, flood the college system when they would be better learning on the job. One of my ex colleagues thought going to college would be a good idea and found the class full of teenagers who did no work at all, behaved disgracefully and saw it as an extension to school, which they had never been interested in anyway.  

 

I for one would see a better legacy being an education system that educates and a health service that increases life expectancy. Sorry to say that the Scottish Government has failed in delivering either.  

 

  


😂 Suggest you do some reading up about the 1140 hours policy as you clearly have no idea what it is.

 

Have a wee think about the free schools meals as well while you’re at it and see if you can puzzle out why it’s a good thing that every p1-3 is guaranteed at least one hot meal a day, regardless of whether they’re working class or upper class…

Edited by Alex Kintner
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6 hours ago, pablo said:

 

Now that would be an achievement and a legacy worth discussing.

 

Don't you think the FM should get some credit for our internationally recognised and statistically proven efficient rollout of the vaccine which has led to 86% of expected deaths being avoided?

 

 Nicola was FM in acountry that managed to do this despite initially being led down the wrong path by UKgov that cost Scotland about 2,000 lives. Did she not show real leadership and understanding of the issues involved despite being under constant presure from a hostile media and UK gov? The Scottish government has delivered when it mattered and saved hundreds lives that would not have been saved if we had taken the same approach as Westminster.

 The legacy will be that Scotland under the SNP has outperformed the UK gov in almost every area of government for almost the entire time it has been in power.

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1 hour ago, Japan Jambo said:

 

Shouldn't this be on the 'older women you have a crush on' thread Smithee? 😉

 

If you prick us, do we not bleed?

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48 minutes ago, Alex Kintner said:


😂 Suggest you do some reading up about the 1140 hours policy as you clearly have no idea what it is.

 

Have a wee think about the free schools meals as well while you’re at it and see if you can puzzle out why it’s a good thing that every p1-3 is guaranteed at least one hot meal a day, regardless of whether they’re working class or upper class…

 

I appreciate your kind advice and am so glad that I gave you the opportunity to patronise me and have a good laugh/cry at my ignorance. You are obviously an expert. There is, however, really no need for me to go away and have a 'wee think' about the reality of free school meals or read up about the 1140 hours policy as you call it; I know a good bit about how early years learning/education works and how it is used as I'm continually told about it by my wife who works in the sector. Obviously you find my comments unacceptable, but that is inevitable as I've simply drawn different conclusions than you have.  

 

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6 minutes ago, henryheart said:

 

I appreciate your kind advice and am so glad that I gave you the opportunity to patronise me and have a good laugh/cry at my ignorance. You are obviously an expert. There is, however, really no need for me to go away and have a 'wee think' about the reality of free school meals or read up about the 1140 hours policy as you call it; I know a good bit about how early years learning/education works and how it is used as I'm continually told about it by my wife who works in the sector. Obviously you find my comments unacceptable, but that is inevitable as I've simply drawn different conclusions than you have.  

 


Nah, you’ve actually shown you don’t actually understand it. I suggest you ask your wife 😉

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20 hours ago, Alex Kintner said:

If you’re absolutely insistent one headline-grabbing policy then it would be the Domestic Abuse bill which was the first of its kind in the world to formally recognise emotional abuse and coercive control and children as victims and not witnesses.


An example in the news today of the kind of cases that can now be prosecuted thanks to this Bill 👇🏻
https://www.dailyrecord.co.uk/news/scottish-news/jealous-boyfriend-controlled-partners-social-25546939?fbclid=IwAR3EFzpm1RnPx3T5qSiC8x1dG1BwQtRdCbQP-0EzutAhR7sKqiu_3W62o2g

 

Edited by Alex Kintner
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Yes many of the SNP polices appear brilliant on the surface but many create a culture of dependency on the state providing everything. Best way out of poverty is work. Its as simple as that. Working also proves a sense of achievement and self esteem instead of sitting at home maxed out on benefits.  Where is the incentive or motivation to work ? 

 

Yes minimal wage etc needs increased to reflect rising prices and costs   and i Know that many on benefits are working too but there are some people who have become dependant on the state and have no motivation to work as it doesn't " pay".  I have no issue with the financial costs of those projects to help parents as I would rather it was spent on this than nuclear submarines , Its the principle of trying to motivate and encourage people that there is a better life out as a working person.  There really is. However some get caught in the culture of dependency. I know there are numerous barriers which can  impede peoples  access to  work or further education.  Tackle them.  

 

Their polices regarding family life have always been intrusive , Their failed " Named  Person" policy was the perfect example of the state overreaching into family life. Thank god it got binned.  It made the assumption that the state has the child's best interests and safety  at heart and not the parents. There is already adequate protections and safeguards from children from birth from  hospital staff to mid wives to health visitors then nursery then school. They can all monitor any child and if concerned raise it with the relevant authorities. 

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Francis Albert
59 minutes ago, Savage Vince said:

The only party in Scotland is calling a vote of no confidence in the fat clown this week. Interesting. 

I wonder what the outcome will be?

The tension might be too much for me. 

Blackford's speech a masterpiece of arse licking to the FM.

 

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2 minutes ago, Francis Albert said:

I wonder what the outcome will be?

The tension might be too much for me. 

Blackford's speech a masterpiece of arse licking to the FM.

 

 

Snivel off please. 

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1 hour ago, Francis Albert said:

I wonder what the outcome will be?

The tension might be too much for me. 

Blackford's speech a masterpiece of arse licking to the FM.

 

 

'no confidence in the fat clown' - talking about Blackford I presume?

 

 

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3 hours ago, Savage Vince said:

The only party in Scotland is calling a vote of no confidence in the fat clown this week. Interesting. 


Which fat clown are we talking about? 

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Francis Albert
14 minutes ago, Japan Jambo said:

 

'no confidence in the fat clown' - talking about Blackford I presume?

 

 

Yes a bit of an own goal there. 

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5 hours ago, JamesM48 said:

Yes many of the SNP polices appear brilliant on the surface but many create a culture of dependency on the state providing everything. Best way out of poverty is work. Its as simple as that. Working also proves a sense of achievement and self esteem instead of sitting at home maxed out on benefits.  Where is the incentive or motivation to work ? 

 

Yes minimal wage etc needs increased to reflect rising prices and costs   and i Know that many on benefits are working too but there are some people who have become dependant on the state and have no motivation to work as it doesn't " pay".  I have no issue with the financial costs of those projects to help parents as I would rather it was spent on this than nuclear submarines , Its the principle of trying to motivate and encourage people that there is a better life out as a working person.  There really is. However some get caught in the culture of dependency. I know there are numerous barriers which can  impede peoples  access to  work or further education.  Tackle them.  

 

Their polices regarding family life have always been intrusive , Their failed " Named  Person" policy was the perfect example of the state overreaching into family life. Thank god it got binned.  It made the assumption that the state has the child's best interests and safety  at heart and not the parents. There is already adequate protections and safeguards from children from birth from  hospital staff to mid wives to health visitors then nursery then school. They can all monitor any child and if concerned raise it with the relevant authorities. 

The worst thing about this government is that they bang on about powers reserved to Westminster but their own policies centralise everything in Holyrood.

This despite no record of success in running anything other than election campaigns. 

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30 minutes ago, Hmfc1965 said:

The worst thing about this government is that they bang on about powers reserved to Westminster but their own policies centralise everything in Holyrood.

This despite no record of success in running anything other than election campaigns. 

 

Not sure that's the worst thing about them tbh.

 

 

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Francis Albert

This is an extract from the other fat clown's conference speech.

 

" we all know it was our First Minister who led the way at COP 26. From passionately promoting a just transition to championing climate justice she worked tirelessly for a green future at home and abroad. Mature, measured and thoughtful leadership - the leadership we need now and exactly the kind of leadership that will win our freedom. Just imagine what she will do as our first democratically elected leader of an independent Scotland"

 

There can't have been many more sycophantic speeches in the Great hall of the people in Beijing or its equivalent in Pyongyang.

 

Edited by Francis Albert
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The hurt that wee Nicola causes you lot makes me happy inside. You must hate her so much!! 😂

 

what must be so sore is that she isn’t going anywhere!!! 

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Francis Albert
9 minutes ago, jamboy1982 said:

The hurt that wee Nicola causes you lot makes me happy inside. You must hate her so much!! 😂

 

what must be so sore is that she isn’t going anywhere!!! 

The last few posts haven't really been about "wee" Nicola. Unless she encourages or approves of Blackford's sycophancy.

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40 minutes ago, Francis Albert said:

This is an extract from the other fat clown's conference speech.

 

" we all know it was our First Minister who led the way at COP 26. From passionately promoting a just transition to championing climate justice she worked tirelessly for a green future at home and abroad. Mature, measured and thoughtful leadership - the leadership we need now and exactly the kind of leadership that will win our freedom. Just imagine what she will do as our first democratically elected leader of an independent Scotland"

 

There can't have been many more sycophantic speeches in the Great hall of the people in Beijing or its equivalent in Pyongyang.

 

Oh my ! 😂😂 he’s so far up her bottom  his tongue is coming out her mouth 👄 !  He’s right they can “ just imagine” what she might do as it ain’t gonna happen . 
 

Article now saying that Indy campaign should start in earnest after Westminster ejections !! 2024 ?   
 

 

https://www.heraldscotland.com/politics/19747369.snp-veterans-criticise-partys-lack-progress-independence/?fbclid=IwAR20EQP-BOYSKlxLUIUgnCsN7EO-QsZkCSrtNhxfzNJmTfTQUmrOBwo5_d8

Edited by JamesM48
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6 hours ago, JamesM48 said:

Yes many of the SNP polices appear brilliant on the surface but many create a culture of dependency on the state providing everything. Best way out of poverty is work. Its as simple as that.


Which specific policies do you feel do this? 

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10 minutes ago, JamesM48 said:

Oh my ! 😂😂 he’s so far up her arse his tongue is coming out her mouth 👄 !  He’s right they can “ just imagine” what she might do as it ain’t gonna happen . 
 

Article now saying that Indy campaign should start in earnest after Westminster ejections !! 2024 ?   
 

 

https://www.heraldscotland.com/politics/19747369.snp-veterans-criticise-partys-lack-progress-independence/?fbclid=IwAR20EQP-BOYSKlxLUIUgnCsN7EO-QsZkCSrtNhxfzNJmTfTQUmrOBwo5_d8

 

A FORMER Cabinet Secretary and a former SNP deputy leader have launched a withering attack on their party for a lack of progress and fresh thinking on independence.

Alex Neil and Jim Sillars weighed in after deputy First Minister John Swinney admitted in his speech to the SNP’s online conference that party members were “impatient”.

Mr Neil, a former health secretary, said his party showed “no sign” of original thought or hard work to achieve Scottish independence, and must now “put flesh on the bones”.

He told Scotland on Sunday the SNP must do more than “shout” about independence.

With Boris Johnson blocking Indyref2, Mr Neil suggested an “alternative strategy” was the way ahead.

He said that if the SNP won a majority of votes and seats  in the next Westminster election it could be used as a “mandate for independence”.

He said: “It’s not enough just to shout, ‘independence, independence, independence’, we’ve got to put flesh on the bones of the argument.

“That means spelling out in detail the answers to questions on currency, economic policy, the oil and gas industry, and our trading relationships.

“It’s not just a case of updating the White Paper [of 2013]. It needs to be completely rewritten.

“My concern at the moment is that there is no sign of that hard work and original thinking being done, despite the fact we need to do that to have any chance of success next time round.”

Mr Sillars, who like Mr Neil backed Brexit, said “nothing of substance” on Scottish independence was being done by the SNP, and it was merely repeating its old lines.

After Mr Swinney used his speech to say Scots must “stand up and be counted” to protect devolution from a corrupt Westminster Government, Mr Sillars said: “John could not set the political heather on fire with a can of petrol and a lighted torch.”

 

Looks like there is a wee bit of work to be done then.

 

 

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6 hours ago, JamesM48 said:

Their polices regarding family life have always been intrusive , Their failed " Named  Person" policy was the perfect example of the state overreaching into family life. Thank god it got binned.  It made the assumption that the state has the child's best interests and safety  at heart and not the parents. There is already adequate protections and safeguards from children from birth from  hospital staff to mid wives to health visitors then nursery then school. They can all monitor any child and if concerned raise it with the relevant authorities. 


From a Child Protection angle I was very disappointed when Named Person wasn’t fully implemented. It had the potential to remove so many of the bureaucratic barriers which can get in the way of safeguarding and monitoring wellbeing.

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1 hour ago, Hmfc1965 said:

The worst thing about this government is that they bang on about powers reserved to Westminster but their own policies centralise everything in Holyrood.

This despite no record of success in running anything other than election campaigns. 


Recent changes in Education in last few years have been all about de-centralising decision making and giving greater power to local authorities and in turn schools.

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21 minutes ago, Alex Kintner said:


From a Child Protection angle I was very disappointed when Named Person wasn’t fully implemented. It had the potential to remove so many of the bureaucratic barriers which can get in the way of safeguarding and monitoring wellbeing.

There Are no “bureaucratic barriers “ in child protection in Scotland hence the named person scheme was not needed . Children who are viewed as vulnerable are well monitored . It is not necessary to monitor every single child . Now that would be a bureaucratic nightmare as well as a gross infringement of parents rights . 

Edited by JamesM48
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31 minutes ago, Alex Kintner said:


Recent changes in Education in last few years have been all about de-centralising decision making and giving greater power to local authorities and in turn schools.

No they haven't. 

They've given money to local authorities and told them how to spend it.

What do you think about the "consultation " on a National Care Service?

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13 minutes ago, JamesM48 said:

There Are no “bureaucratic barriers “ in child protection in Scotland hence the named person scheme was not needed . Children who are viewed as vulnerable are well monitored . It is not necessary to monitor every single child . Now that would be a bureaucratic nightmare as well as a gross infringement of parents rights . 


There are many bureaucratic barriers in Child Protection, especially when it comes to information sharing. I’ve been involved in Serious Case Reviews where it’s been a factor.

 

The tabloid headlines about Named Person being “big brother watching” was hyperbolic nonsense. Anyone involved in the actual implementing of it before it was pulled would also know that it was designed to empower and involve parents more and not to remove any of their rights.

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3 minutes ago, Hmfc1965 said:

No they haven't. 

They've given money to local authorities and told them how to spend it.

 

That’s not true at all, certainly not in the local authority I work in.

 

3 minutes ago, Hmfc1965 said:

What do you think about the "consultation " on a National Care Service?


I think it’s a huge mistake to now try and include children’s services as part of the planned NCS.
 

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Just now, Alex Kintner said:

 

That’s not true at all, certainly not in the local authority I work in.

 


I think it’s a huge mistake to now try and include children’s services as part of the planned NCS.
 

I'm maybe being a bit flippant about the early years funding,  but the pattern of this and previous SNP governments is they announce "increased funding" but it all has to be spent on specific projects. 

 

I also work for a local authority. 

I'm amazed anyone is surprised children's services are now in scope for the NCS.

It fits the above pattern. 

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Francis Albert
1 hour ago, JamesM48 said:

Oh my ! 😂😂 he’s so far up her bottom  his tongue is coming out her mouth 👄 !  He’s right they can “ just imagine” what she might do as it ain’t gonna happen

She " led the way " at COP by running around  the SECC getting Selfies with whoever of importance did not recognise her. 

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20 minutes ago, Alex Kintner said:


There are many bureaucratic barriers in Child Protection, especially when it comes to information sharing. I’ve been involved in Serious Case Reviews where it’s been a factor.

 

The tabloid headlines about Named Person being “big brother watching” was hyperbolic nonsense. Anyone involved in the actual implementing of it before it was pulled would also know that it was designed to empower and involve parents more and not to remove any of their rights.

Child protection concerns should and do over ride information sharing . 

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Love all our resident snp haters  getting their knickers in a twist because our FM made a mockery of BJs vow for her not to be seen anywhere near cop26. Came out of it as a real statesperson while BJ ran off back to London 

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15 minutes ago, Hmfc1965 said:

I'm maybe being a bit flippant about the early years funding,  but the pattern of this and previous SNP governments is they announce "increased funding" but it all has to be spent on specific projects. 

 

I also work for a local authority. 

I'm amazed anyone is surprised children's services are now in scope for the NCS.

It fits the above pattern. 


I’m not surprised, just disappointed and think it’s the wrong move.

 

2 minutes ago, Francis Albert said:

She " led the way " at COP by running around  the SECC getting Selfies with whoever of importance did not recognise her. 


Weren’t there quite a few leaders praising her and thanking her for her leadership on climate change? Did they form that opinion based on a photo opp?

 

2 minutes ago, JamesM48 said:

Child protection concerns should and do over ride information sharing . 


Once they reach that level they do. Unfortunately by the time that threshold is reached it can be too late for some children. The vital bigger picture that comes from multi-agency information sharing and that can be problematic at the wellbeing level. Named Person would have removed those issues in the most part imo.

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Konrad von Carstein
16 minutes ago, Francis Albert said:

She " led the way " at COP by running around  the SECC getting Selfies with whoever of importance did not recognise her. 

If only the over privileged, spoilt sociopath had run around networking and talking to people and taking the responsibility of the UK hosting the COP seriously.

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The Mighty Thor
2 minutes ago, Konrad von Carstein said:

If only the over privileged, spoilt sociopath had run around networking and talking to people and taking the responsibility of the UK hosting the COP seriously.

He was too busy taking a flight back to London to have dinner with his climate change denying sponsors 

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14 minutes ago, The Mighty Thor said:

He was too busy taking a flight back to London to have dinner with his climate change denying sponsors 

 

 

 

996a8f1f2acf16d6188ad650637f4e7f.gif

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45 minutes ago, Francis Albert said:

She " led the way " at COP by running around  the SECC getting Selfies with whoever of importance did not recognise her. 

 

As usual your interpretation of what actually happens/happened is poisoned by what your daft wee brain wants to happen/have happened. 

 

Silly man. 😊

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Francis Albert
1 minute ago, Savage Vince said:

 

As usual your interpretation of what actually happens/happened is poisoned by what your daft wee brain wants to happen/have happened. 

 

Silly man. 😊

Be serious now. What significant part did our FM play in COP?

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The Mighty Thor
2 minutes ago, Francis Albert said:

Be serious now. What significant part did our FM play in COP?

It was hosted by the UK government. What role was she allowed to play? It was Spaffer's gig.

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5 minutes ago, Francis Albert said:

Be serious now. What significant part did our FM play in COP?

 

Well she never fell asleep during it. Is that serious enough for you? 😊

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8 minutes ago, Francis Albert said:

Be serious now. What significant part did our FM play in COP?


She significantly managed to significantly rustle the jimmies of all her significant haters.

 👍🏻

Edited by Alex Kintner
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The Real Maroonblood
25 minutes ago, Alex Kintner said:


She significantly managed to significantly rustle the jimmies of all her significant haters.

 👍🏻

:jj:

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10 hours ago, The Mighty Thor said:

It was hosted by the UK government. What role was she allowed to play? It was Spaffer's gig.

 

10 hours ago, Savage Vince said:

 

Well she never fell asleep during it. Is that serious enough for you? 😊

 

10 hours ago, Alex Kintner said:


She significantly managed to significantly rustle the jimmies of all her significant haters.

 👍🏻


 

Nowt then. :pleasing:

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The Mighty Thor
26 minutes ago, Dazo said:

 

 


 

Nowt then. :pleasing:

Woman takes no part in something she wasn't invited to?

 

Nobody does straw clutching like the Unionists do straw clutching.

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11 hours ago, Alex Kintner said:


She significantly managed to significantly rustle the jimmies of all her significant haters.

 👍🏻

That's the problem. She did absolutely nothing but her fan boys think that's ok.

 

Like a 10 year old autograph hunter at Live Aid.

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7 minutes ago, The Mighty Thor said:

Woman takes no part in something she wasn't invited to?

 

Nobody does straw clutching like the Unionists do straw clutching.


Very clever from NS. Use COP26 to schmooze key leaders, gather some positive headlines from leaders’ comments about her but not actually be tied to the disastrous policy making. 👍🏻

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