Coronavirus Super Thread ( merged )

[redjambo]

Just now, Ray Gin said:

 

Masks are mostly about protecting everyone else, not the wearer. That's why it is incredibly selfish not to wear one without good medical grounds not to do so.

 

 

[Beni]

49 minutes ago, Lord BJ said:

It’s strange he always tried to portray that ‘Winston Churchill’ Type character. Great inspiring and motivating leader who could make tough decisions.  
 

He gets the modern equivalent to a war.
 

We then find out the only similarities with Churchill was their racism🤷🏻‍♂️
 

Bit shite for us tbh.

 

Don't forget the drinking. 👍

[XB52]

24 minutes ago, AlimOzturk said:

I am claustrophobic and wearing a mask does flare it up. Still think wearing a mask is pointless and have said that from the start. Even if it didn’t bother me wearing a mask I probably wouldn’t. 
 

hope that helps clear things up. 

Basically you're a dick 

[Adam_the_legend]

9 minutes ago, Ray Gin said:

 

Masks are mostly about protecting everyone else, not the wearer. That's why it is incredibly selfish not to wear one without good medical grounds not to do so.

 

Im aware that’s the argument but there is limited evidence it’s actually the case. I do still wear it though. 

[jambo89]

5 minutes ago, Adam_the_legend said:

Im aware that’s the argument but there is limited evidence it’s actually the case. I do still wear it though. 

 

Except the past 100 years or so of evidence for surgeons wearing them to prevent infection. 

[Back to 2005]

48 minutes ago, Lord BJ said:

Fans to be allowed at Scottish Golf Open as a pilot. Attendees must be from Edinburgh and Lothian as being played at Rennasiance. 
 

 

This will be cancelled. All seems to be part of the way things are being handled is to give little bits of hopes of normal life only for them to be taken away again. 

[JudyJudyJudy]

17 minutes ago, Shanks said:

 

Your first mistake was going to Cameron toll

Bloody true . It’s dire . A friend wantin. To get some stuff there 

[JudyJudyJudy]

2 minutes ago, Back to 2005 said:

This will be cancelled. All seems to be part of the way things are being handled is to give little bits of hopes of normal life only for them to be taken away again. 

It’s bordering on cruelty And abuse now 

[DB-14]

5 minutes ago, jambo89 said:

 

Except the past 100 years or so of evidence for surgeons wearing them to prevent infection. 

 

I think there is a difference between a surgical mask that's regularly changed and a £2 piece of cloth from Amazon that's repeatedly used don't you?

[jambo89]

5 minutes ago, SteauaNeedarest said:

 

I think there is a difference between a surgical mask that's regularly changed and a £2 piece of cloth from Amazon that's repeatedly used don't you?

 

I would've thought so but I'm not an expert.

 

What is the difference between the surgical masks being worn by surgeons compared to the ones commercially available on-line?

 

What is it about how surgical masks are made / the material within them that makes them so completely different in your opinion?

 

What about a virustatic snood? 

Edited September 18, 2020 by jambo89

[AlimOzturk]

26 minutes ago, XB52 said:

Basically you're a dick 

Ach well couldn’t give a **** if I am or not.

 

[Francis Albert]

4 hours ago, Ray Gin said:

No, because the inevitable happened and some of them decided to have flat parties instead.

Good for them. Unless they have serious underlying conditions they will be fine. And since they are now in halls of residence they are unlikely to infect elderly relatives with underlying conditions in the next few months. Enjoy!

Edited September 18, 2020 by Francis Albert

[AlimOzturk]

46 minutes ago, Brian Dundas said:

You did manage to wear one to go to the doctors if I remember correctly, you could then easily manage to wear one for the few moments at a time you need to in a pub.

Possibly. I won’t though. 
 

Even if I could it would make the whole experience pretty shite for me. Not what I want when going to a pub 

 

People can think what they want. I couldn’t care less if I am seen a selfish ***** or not. 
 

Just a couple of weeks ago I could float around pubs without a mask and nobody would have looked at me twice.  Now I am selfish *****

 

(you never said anything like that to me. Not aimed at you)

Edited September 18, 2020 by AlimOzturk

[Francis Albert]

4 hours ago, jambo89 said:

 

I don't think people 'have went out of their way' to scare people on this thread.  

You must have been reading a different thread from me.

[jambo89]

7 minutes ago, Francis Albert said:

You must have been reading a different thread from me.

 

If I can borrow a style of posting for a moment, 'show me where someone went out there way to scare people'.

 

 

Edited September 18, 2020 by jambo89

[Adam_the_legend]

28 minutes ago, jambo89 said:

 

Except the past 100 years or so of evidence for surgeons wearing them to prevent infection. 

Sorry, are you comparing surgery to buying milk in Sainsbury’s? Please show me the evidence conclusively showing face masks reduce the spread of respiratory illnesses? Perhaps you can quote the WHO. I will repeat though, I still wear a mask when I need to but I think it’s accurate to say their efficacy in this situation is not scientifically proven. 

[Francis Albert]

1 hour ago, JamesM48 said:

staying alive is their end game hopefully 

A rather short term aim. The end game is inevitable and I for one would rather enjoy what time I have left doing the things I want to do rather than cower at home afraid to go out.

[Adam_the_legend]

11 minutes ago, AlimOzturk said:

Possibly. I won’t though. 
 

Even if I could it would make the whole experience pretty shite for me. Not what I want when going to a pub 

 

People can think what they want. I couldn’t care less if I am seen a selfish ***** or not. 
 

Just a couple of weeks ago I could float around pubs without a mask and nobody would have looked at me twice.  Now I am selfish *****

 

(you never said anything like that to me. Not aimed at you)

to be fair you could’ve walked about without a mask at the absolute peak of this and nobody could argue, it’s only been mandatory for a couple months. 

[Unknown user]

2 hours ago, jack D and coke said:

They might have to wait I guess. You can’t lock down the world for any one particular group. 

It's not going to happen. Look through a politician's eyes - the elderly are statistically much more Conservative leaning, there's no way a tory government's going to alienate and enrage them by locking them in for everyone else's freedom.

[Unknown user]

2 hours ago, jack D and coke said:

They might have to wait I guess. You can’t lock down the world for any one particular group. 

It's not going to happen. Look through a politician's eyes - the elderly are statistically much more Conservative leaning, there's no way a tory government's going to alienate and enrage them by locking them in for everyone else's freedom.

[AlimOzturk]

Just now, Brian Dundas said:

Each to their own, but my experience would be ruined by being a bit of a dick to the guy on the door when telling him to mind his own business, I can't say that my enjoyment of the pub experience depends on my enjoyment of the trip to the toilet, I realise I'm being flippant now.

 

Anyway I don't got to pubs very often now a days and certainly can manage to avoid them easily at the moment.

The thing is I think the guy at the door is being a dick by intruding into my business. I have no problems with someone asking me to put a mask on but then once I tell them can’t wear one it is incredibly personal and revealing for them to ask someone why. It is actually covered under the equality act 2010. They aren’t medical experts who can judge whether or not my reason or anyone else’s reason for that matter is valid.  Therefore I think I am perfectly reasonable to ask them to mind their own buisness. 
 

 

[Mikey1874]

 

[Back to 2005]

https://www.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/pmc/articles/PMC4480558/

 

Worth a read for anybody that thinks a face mask will protect you from a virus and wonders why surgeons use them.

[Francis Albert]

46 minutes ago, jambo89 said:

 

Except the past 100 years or so of evidence for surgeons wearing them to prevent infection. 

There was actually a recent study that suggested surgical masks did not reduce the risk of infection in surgery.  But as we know by now  there is a "science" that supports any position you choose to take.

 

Edit. See above post which I read only after I posted!

Edited September 18, 2020 by Francis Albert

[jambo89]

8 minutes ago, Adam_the_legend said:

Sorry, are you comparing surgery to buying milk in Sainsbury’s? Please show me the evidence conclusively showing face masks reduce the spread of respiratory illnesses? Perhaps you can quote the WHO. I will repeat though, I still wear a mask when I need to but I think it’s accurate to say their efficacy in this situation is not scientifically proven. 

 

What are you on about??

 

Take a deep breath, un-tuck your willy from between your legs and read my post again.

 

At no point did I say that surgery was akin to buying milk. Nowhere. 

 

As for the rest of your post, the burden of proof is not on the me to show that masks do not prevent the spread of infection,  (a religious style argument thrown at atheists all the time). 

 

As for WHO https://www.who.int/emergencies/diseases/novel-coronavirus-2019/advice-for-public/when-and-how-to-use-masks

 

Fill your boots. It's good that you wear a mask. As do I.

[jambo89]

13 minutes ago, Francis Albert said:

There was actually a recent study that suggested surgical masks did not reduce the risk of infection in surgery.  But as we know by now  there is a "science" that supports any position you choose to take.

 

Edit. See above post which I read only after I posted!

 

A recent study? Recent aye?

 

That's the thing with science, new information comes along and or studies are conducted. They are then peer reviewed and further study is conducted until a 'new truth' is arrived at.

 

Why do surgeons still wear masks if this study 'de-bunked' all the previous studies?

 

The reason you have chosen (indirectly) to quote a 6 year old study with now follow up study is because there is no need study the efficay of face masks.

 

 

Edited September 18, 2020 by jambo89

[Unknown user]

3 minutes ago, Lord BJ said:

 

 

I agree.
 

Surprised the Scottish Govt ain’t going to do it, not same political impact and it seems a sensible approach, 

 

Alternatively, maybe the SNP are playing the long game. 
 

Let old ***** dot about, they get the virus and die. Independence becomes way more likely.  In fact COVID deaths probably cause of change in recent Indy Polls. 

 

I thought the care home fiasco was just rank incompetence. Turns out master political manoeuvring. 😂

 

(this post is tongue firmly in cheek before the fanatics get their flag in a twist, other than first sentence)

 

Say what you like about the SNP but they are a lefty force, shared burden shared gains type of thing. I don't think they'd be into that type of approach unless there were no options.

[Back to 2005]

26 minutes ago, Francis Albert said:

A rather short term aim. The end game is inevitable and I for one would rather enjoy what time I have left doing the things I want to do rather than cower at home afraid to go out.

Sturgeon loves a referendum. We could vote either Scotland or Sweden as to how we progress with this.

Nobody should have the right to tell you how many people you can have in your own house. 

[Francis Albert]

9 minutes ago, jambo89 said:

 

A recent study? Recent aye?

 

That's the thing with science, new information comes along and or studies are conducted. They are then peer reviewed and further study is conducted until a 'new truth' is arrived at.

 

Why do surgeons still wear masks if this study 'de-bunked' all the previous studies?

Aye. 5.years old. Recent in the hundred plus years of surgeons wearing masks.

Personally I'd want my surgeon to wear a mask and if I was a surgeon I would want to wear one.  

But to say that because surgeons wear masks I should wear one to go to Sainsburys is a wee bit of a leap isn't it? 

A leap unsupported by much if any real evidence.

Edited September 18, 2020 by Francis Albert

[jambo89]

9 minutes ago, Francis Albert said:

5.years old. Recent in the hundred plus years of surgeons wearing masks.

Personally I'd want my surgeon to wear a mask. 

But to say that because surgeons wear masks I should wear one to go to Sainsburys is a wee bit of a leap isn't it? 

 

So when you said recent you meant 5 years ago aye? nae bother!!! be honest and admit you haven't read it.

 

5 years and no further studies to support the claim? why do you think that is? 

 

Also noticed you used the sainsbury's line, canny even get your own patter now.

 

Funny how you've chosen to word it like that rather than:-

 

'surgeons wear masks to prevent the spread of infection'. 

 

If you had worded it like above, is it really such a leap to think that if surgeons wear masks to prevent spread of infection, the general public wearing one would have the same effect? 

 

'

Edited September 18, 2020 by jambo89

[jambo89]

26 minutes ago, Back to 2005 said:

https://www.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/pmc/articles/PMC4480558/

 

Worth a read for anybody that thinks a face mask will protect you from a virus and wonders why surgeons use them.

 

Did you read it? 

 

You know why there have been so few studies done on the efficacy of masks?

 

Thinks of it like this, a qoute I've stilen from a sceptics web-site. 

 

There is no evidence that parachutes prevent deaths from falling" - No published studies have addressed the question of whether people are more likely to die if they fall from 10,000 feet without a parachute. Certainly a gold-standard "randomized controlled trial" on parachutes seems to be missing

 

You see where I am going with this?

 

if something is so obvious, it does not require much, if any, study. You therefore have the situation whereby 1 study, from 6 years ago is held up as evidence against something by conspiracy theorists. 

 

 

[Francis Albert]

1 minute ago, jambo89 said:

 

So when you said recent you meant 5 years ago aye? nae bother!!! be honest and admit you haven't read it.

 

5 years and no further studies to support the claim? why do you think that is? 

 

Also noticed you used the sainsbury's line, canny even get your own patter now.

 

Funny how you've chosen to word it like that rather than:-

 

'surgeons wear masks to prevent the spread of infection'. 

 

If you had worded it like above, is it really such a leap to think that if surgeons wear masks to prevent spread of infection, the general public wearing one would have the same effect? 

 

'

It is a huge and very unscientific leap. Why have we not being wearing masks to prevent the spread of flu which kills thousands every year. And is currently killing more than Coronavirus is?

 

Somebody asked me above to give one example of a poster scaring people. I could have given hundreds but your post will.do. Surgeons wear masks in the operating theatre so we must wear one in Sainsburys on an empty bus and in the corner shop. 

[Back to 2005]

10 minutes ago, Brian Dundas said:

Absolute top notch baws.

 

For the protection of yourself, those who may attend your house and the general population then the appropriate authority should of course have the right to determine how many people you can have in your house. You have the right to disagree with them, but you should obey until you can convince them to change...........

 

That is just being civilised 

No we are in dangerous territory here. We are handing over our liberty bit by bit to a pandemic that is no longer a pandemic. Ten deaths in 3 months. 5 in ICU.  Average age probably 85. 

 

[Ray Gin]

55 minutes ago, Francis Albert said:

Good for them. Unless they have serious underlying conditions they will be fine. And since they are now in halls of residence they are unlikely to infect elderly relatives with underlying conditions in the next few months. Enjoy!

 

They are all now stuck in isolation for next 2 weeks, along with a load of other students they were in contact with who weren't even at the party. Brilliant! Well done them!

 

 

 

 

[jambo89]

17 minutes ago, Francis Albert said:

It is a huge and very unscientific leap. Why have we not being wearing masks to prevent the spread of flu which kills thousands every year. And is currently killing more than Coronavirus is?

 

Somebody asked me above to give one example of a poster scaring people. I could have given hundreds but your post will.do. Surgeons wear masks in the operating theatre so we must wear one in Sainsburys on an empty bus and in the corner shop. 

 

It is the very opposite of unscientific.

 

To quote another poster 'show me wear I said surgeons wear mask's so we should wear them to Sainsbury's?

 

Go on show me? 

 

I am sorry if you think scientific evidence is scary, but  to use a phrase that you will no doubt be familiar with

 

'facts don;t care about your feelings'

 

And you should absolutely wear a mask if you have the flu and are visiting people. 

 

Edited September 18, 2020 by jambo89

[Francis Albert]

4 minutes ago, Ray Gin said:

 

They are all now stuck in isolation for next 2 weeks, along with a load of other students they were in contact with who weren't even at the party. Brilliant! Well done them!

 

 

 

 

 

It is clear the virus will spread among students in halls of residences just as it did in care homes. 

Nothing will stop it but it won't do.much harm in this case.

Just as the spread in schools remaining open in Sweden didn't.

 

[ri Alban]

2 hours ago, AlimOzturk said:

I am claustrophobic and wearing a mask does flare it up. Still think wearing a mask is pointless and have said that from the start. Even if it didn’t bother me wearing a mask I probably wouldn’t. 
 

hope that helps clear things up. 

That big hat and bag pipes doesn't , tho. Don't talk keek! 

Edited September 18, 2020 by ri Alban

[Francis Albert]

2 minutes ago, jambo89 said:

 

It is the very opposite of unscientific.

 

To quote another poster 'show me wear I said surgeons wear mask's so we should wear them to Sainsbury's?

 

Go on show me? 

 

I am sorry if you think scientific evidence is scary, but  to use a phrase that you will no doubt be familiar with

 

'facts don;t care about your feelings'

 

If you answer my question I will think about answering yours.

[Back to 2005]

9 minutes ago, Brian Dundas said:

I have argued today that extra lockdown measures do not seem proportionate, however you can't say there is not longer a pandemic. Look at the rising deaths in France and Spain, for example, and then tell me we do not look to be on a similar path. They are not making regulations up just to annoy or inconvenience us, despite what you may think.

 

Do you suggest we return to how things were in January before we even knew about this? Fans back in stadiums, pubs/night clubs packed out etc etc?

What's the alternative? Lockdown after lockdown? All hospitality and sports clubs go bust while we wait on the miracle vaccine for the next ten years.

You can't just keep trying to suppress a virus. 

Protect the old and the sick and let everyone else live.

[ri Alban]

Keir Starmer's self isolation of 14 days went quick. 

[jambo89]

5 minutes ago, Francis Albert said:

If you answer my question I will think about answering yours.

 

 

Edit : In fact naw, if you're going to be a child, I asked you first.

Edited September 18, 2020 by jambo89

[jambo89]

5 minutes ago, ri Alban said:

Keir Starmer's self isolation of 14 days went quick. 

 

I thought that very thing yesterday. 

 

Probably the person living with him was tested and given the all clear. 

[Francis Albert]

3 minutes ago, jambo89 said:

 

what question?

 

 

The question I asked you a few posts ago.  

[JudyJudyJudy]

1 hour ago, Francis Albert said:

A rather short term aim. The end game is inevitable and I for one would rather enjoy what time I have left doing the things I want to do rather than cower at home afraid to go out.

Completely Agree . It wasn’t a criticism . Sone older people may prefer a quality of life ., seeing their loved ones despite on limited time . That’s a choice they should be able to make 

[jambo89]

2 minutes ago, Francis Albert said:

The question I asked you a few posts ago.  

 

See my post above.

 

I asked you first. them's the rules!

 

 

[vegas-voss]

1 minute ago, jambo89 said:

 

I thought that very thing yesterday. 

 

Probably the person living with him was tested and given the all clear. 

That's exactly what happened.He tweeted it after Rayner done PMQs

[JudyJudyJudy]

1 hour ago, jonesy said:

 

Funny you mention that. The rhetoric coming from some of the politicians (I won't mention them by name, as it seems to spark off all kinds of reactions) is almost like that of an abusive partner - "None of us want this", "It's for your own good", "If you'd listened the first time."

Good analogy 

[Governor Tarkin]

Phoned the doctor for an appointment this morning and got one for this afternoon so things are on the up at the GP.

The downside is that the immediate treatment I require isn't available at the moment due to covid, and the referal for further specialist investigation is not available any time soon due to covid.

 

Neither are life threatening, but it goes to show how much is still on hold.

[JudyJudyJudy]

1 hour ago, Mikey1874 said:

 

Awe so I wasted all my time bleaching my messages ? 😂 good Article btw ! 

[TheOak88]

2 hours ago, jambo89 said:

 

Except the past 100 years or so of evidence for surgeons wearing them to prevent infection. 

 

There is a massive difference. A surgeon is spending, often hours standing over a person who is completely cut open with a deep wound. 

 

A bit different to the situation of walking past someone in Tesco.