Coronavirus Super Thread ( merged )

[Malinga the Swinga]

6 minutes ago, Victorian said:

We could always future proof against future warnings about the NHS being overwhelmed by raising the basic rate and higher rate tax rates by 10p and invest long term in a massive expansion of NHS resources.  Let's see how Tory MPs like that.

All for investment in NHS. Health is devolved, and it is up to Sturgeon and her government to spend money as she sees fit. Nothing stopping Scottish government making NHS spending her priority. We already pay higher tax, on upper rate.

She can start by reducing benefits, charging for prescriptions and further education, stop spending on green vanity projects and there you have extra money.

Let's see how SNP MP's and voters like that.

[Victorian]

4 minutes ago, Malinga the Swinga said:

All for investment in NHS. Health is devolved, and it is up to Sturgeon and her government to spend money as she sees fit. Nothing stopping Scottish government making NHS spending her priority. We already pay higher tax, on upper rate.

She can start by reducing benefits, charging for prescriptions and further education, stop spending on green vanity projects and there you have extra money.

Let's see how SNP MP's and voters like that.

 

Tinkering at the margins that wouldn't yield much to invest in the NHS.  I was talking in a UK wide context anyway.  

 

We could go some way towards insuring against the NHS being threatened with being overwhelmed with sufficient investment in it.  Insurance against any future lockdowns or reduction in economic activity.  It would need to be very large sums though and the difference in the level of taxation required to fund it would necessitate it being UK wide.  There's a small difference in the relative tax burdens each side of the border but there's a limit to it.  A devolved nation could never go it alone to do it well.  The difference in the tax settlement would be too great.

 

All hypothetical because there will never be a will to do it,  politically and in the electorate.

[hunts]

Just been out to Ingliston for my booster (Moderna).  Had about a 30 minute wait.  All ran very efficiently.  Must have been about 150 people waiting in the seats at same time as me.

 

No side effects yet, but early days…

[Enzo Chiefo]

44 minutes ago, Victorian said:

We could always future proof against future warnings about the NHS being overwhelmed by raising the basic rate and higher rate tax rates by 10p and invest long term in a massive expansion of NHS resources.  Let's see how Tory MPs like that.

Or we could rip up the 1940s NHS model, the national religion that has dulled the brains of the population for so long, and design an efficient,  hybrid system that provides free essential care for those who cannot afford to pay and allows those who can ,to choose a different service, should they wish.

[Hmfc1965]

25 minutes ago, Victorian said:

 

Tinkering at the margins that wouldn't yield much to invest in the NHS.  I was talking in a UK wide context anyway.  

 

We could go some way towards insuring against the NHS being threatened with being overwhelmed with sufficient investment in it.  Insurance against any future lockdowns or reduction in economic activity.  It would need to be very large sums though and the difference in the level of taxation required to fund it would necessitate it being UK wide.  There's a small difference in the relative tax burdens each side of the border but there's a limit to it.  A devolved nation could never go it alone to do it well.  The difference in the tax settlement would be too great.

 

All hypothetical because there will never be a will to do it,  politically and in the electorate.

No  You can imagine the media reports if the NHS was perpetually geared up to deal with a pandemic. 

[MoncurMacdonaldMercer]

1 hour ago, jonesy said:

Those making the decision have very little skin in the game, other than their ability to shift investments in a timely manner prior to announcements.

 

 

 

[MoncurMacdonaldMercer]

1 hour ago, Enzo Chiefo said:

Let's just accept that the NHS has complained about being busy/under pressure/overwhelmed every Winter for as long as I can remember. 

The notion that you link hospital admissions to the basic rights and liberties of the population is an insidious and dangerous creep towards a public health socialist state. Thankfully,  the Tory backbenchers have stalled Boris from being bounced by the "scientific modellers" into more restrictive measures.  

Yeah I said later on I’m not that bothered either way other than I wish the least amount of harm on whoever

 

was just a mention that if anyone’s particularly concerned with pressure on the nhs / people dying / figures being reported etc it’s probably going to be quite a tough gig until the back of feb even if this variant flatters to deceive on the negative impact front

Edited December 18, 2021 by MoncurMacdonaldMercer

[Malinga the Swinga]

16 minutes ago, Enzo Chiefo said:

Or we could rip up the 1940s NHS model, the national religion that has dulled the brains of the population for so long, and design an efficient,  hybrid system that provides free essential care for those who cannot afford to pay and allows those who can ,to choose a different service, should they wish.

You get a load of criticism on here, but couldn't disagree with anything you say above.

Be a brave politician who suggests it and I'm afraid we don't have a brave politician between any of the parties.

[The Mighty Thor]

2 hours ago, Victorian said:

 

He means irrelevant in the context of the two countries not being that comparable

He does indeed 👍

2 hours ago, Nucky Thompson said:

We can't just dismiss South Africa as irrelevant though, just because of the demographics

Yes we can because everything is different over there. Literally everything. 

[Gizmo]

24 minutes ago, Enzo Chiefo said:

Or we could rip up the 1940s NHS model, the national religion that has dulled the brains of the population for so long, and design an efficient,  hybrid system that provides free essential care for those who cannot afford to pay and allows those who can ,to choose a different service, should they wish.

Knowing this government and previous Tory governments they would do the following, probably bringing back Jeremy "sell the NHS" Hunt to oversee it.

1) Underfund the "pleb" class until it's basically useless
2) Take massive backhanders to allow more of the US Health Insurance companies into the mix. 

If we are capable of setting up an efficient system, why don't we just do that with the NHS, which we all fund, instead. 

[Enzo Chiefo]

11 minutes ago, The Mighty Thor said:

He does indeed 👍

Yes we can because everything is different over there. Literally everything. 

Including the fact hardly anyone has been vaccinated. If there are 11 times fewer people over there hospitalised with Omicron compared with Delta,  the decrease will be even higher here.

[The Mighty Thor]

Just now, Enzo Chiefo said:

Including the fact hardly anyone has been vaccinated. If there are 11 times fewer people over there hospitalised with Omicron compared with Delta,  the decrease will be even higher here.

I'm sure that's the conclusion from 'your analysis of the data from both countries'

IMHO you're comparing apples and oranges. 

[The Mighty Thor]

1 minute ago, jonesy said:

Destroying our language, one hyperbolic statement at a time.

Thanks.

 

I'm also not giving one single shiny shite at this time. 😘

[The Mighty Thor]

In the spirit of balance and seeing as it's Christmas, here's one for the boys who've been getting all het up the last few days.

 

You're most welcome 👍 

 

 

[MoncurMacdonaldMercer]

13 minutes ago, Gizmo said:

Knowing this government and previous Tory governments they would do the following, probably bringing back Jeremy "sell the NHS" Hunt to oversee it.

1) Underfund the "pleb" class until it's basically useless
2) Take massive backhanders to allow more of the US Health Insurance companies into the mix. 

If we are capable of setting up an efficient system, why don't we just do that with the NHS, which we all fund, instead. 

some fund it more than others mate

 

should be a sliding scale on care based on your financial contribution with adjustments for being unvaccinated / fat / on the drink etc - if for no other reason than to help Granville get over his deep bitter resentment towards those unvaccinated

 

equitable system based on contribution less expected stress applied = 😃 posters and gives the unvaccinated a fair outcome too✅🦄

 

 

[Malinga the Swinga]

25 minutes ago, Gizmo said:

Knowing this government and previous Tory governments they would do the following, probably bringing back Jeremy "sell the NHS" Hunt to oversee it.

1) Underfund the "pleb" class until it's basically useless
2) Take massive backhanders to allow more of the US Health Insurance companies into the mix. 

If we are capable of setting up an efficient system, why don't we just do that with the NHS, which we all fund, instead. 

Because the NHS is incapable of being restructured. It would be kinder and cheaper to kill it and bring in model that is fit for future. It has fractured management, old buildings, wastes billions each year and is held together by sticky tape.

Now to save us from what you describe and fear, and as it is an absolutely critical and huge, unbelievably huge, project, let's have it run by non political people, people who have experience of health care in 21st century. Personally, I would look to the people who built health system in Middle East countries as they have modern facilities and no political affiliations to UK.

In addition, you need to persuade surgeons, doctors, nurses and administrators that it is worthwhile. If you don't, they'll just work in private sector. They aren't all in it for love of job.

It could be done, if everyone pulled together, it could be done, but if politicians get involved, it will fail.

Edited December 18, 2021 by Malinga the Swinga

[Victorian]

10 minutes ago, The Mighty Thor said:

In the spirit of balance and seeing as it's Christmas, here's one for the boys who've been getting all het up the last few days.

 

You're most welcome 👍 

 

 

 

If that's genuine then surely he's about to experience a different lockdown.  

[Adam_the_legend]

Fascinating insight into the mindset and remit of the modellers. These are the models SAGE are using to push for more restrctions 😬🙄

 

https://www.spectator.co.uk/article/my-twitter-conversation-with-the-chairman-of-the-sage-covid-modelling-committee

[Lone Striker]

5 minutes ago, Malinga the Swinga said:

Because the NHS is incapable of being restructured. It would be kinder and cheaper to kill it and bring in model that is fit for future. It has fractured management, old buildings, wastes billions each year and is held together by sticky tape.

Now to save us from what you describe and fear, and as it is an absolutely critical and huge, unbelievably huge, project, let's have it run by non political people, people who have experience of health care in 21st century. Personally, I would look to the people who built health system in Middle East countries as they have modern facilities and no political affiliations to UK.

It could be done, if everyone pulled together, it could be done, but if politicians get involved, it will fail.

Any particular Middle East country in  mind ?

[Malinga the Swinga]

11 minutes ago, The Mighty Thor said:

In the spirit of balance and seeing as it's Christmas, here's one for the boys who've been getting all het up the last few days.

 

You're most welcome 👍 

 

 

That man is deranged, just deranged. I'm not overly happy about lockdowns and restrictions but to describe it as facism, well it's just stupid.

People like him just stir up bother before retreating to his comfortable home.

Also is climate change denier, claims to be able to forecast weather and says he can predict earthquakes.

Does have some good policies, he wants to be Mayor of London, such as ending homelessness and spending more in cancer research as well as other serious illnesses.

 

[Lone Striker]

1 hour ago, Enzo Chiefo said:

Or we could rip up the 1940s NHS model, the national religion that has dulled the brains of the population for so long, and design an efficient,  hybrid system that provides free essential care for those who cannot afford to pay and allows those who can ,to choose a different service, should they wish.

   Your idea sounds remarkably like what we already have in the UK.    

[Malinga the Swinga]

5 minutes ago, Lone Striker said:

Any particular Middle East country in  mind ?

I'd aim for Qatar, Dubai, Abu Dhabi or any of the Emirates. They're the only ones from region I have seen. Singapore is supposed to be pretty good as well.

I'm not in any way expert though, it may be someone from elsewhere would be best.

Just the usual new I mentioned are pretty new and they will have gone for best money can buy.

 

[Costanza]

The number one ranked healthcare system in the world is South Korea which is public and private. The next 3, Denmark, Taiwan and Austria are all free universal healthcare systems, so there's absolutely no reason why we need to move away from the current model, guess it comes down to your ideology.

[Footballfirst]

42 minutes ago, Malinga the Swinga said:

You get a load of criticism on here, but couldn't disagree with anything you say above.

Be a brave politician who suggests it and I'm afraid we don't have a brave politician between any of the parties.

I've had a discussion with Enzo before on this topic, but he was unable to offer any insight into the funding model required.

 

I suggested a model such as the German taxation model which involves a progressive income tax system, but with ring fenced addons to pay for health insurance, pensions, unemployment insurance and care needs.  Enzo seemed reluctant to meet the additional tax burden required by that model, although it is one that I would be content to pay. 

[Malinga the Swinga]

In addition, health service is not a hotel. If people are healthy, they shouldn't be taking up resources that others need.

I believe that is part of problem we currently have.

For a country, in the 21st century, to be unable to house people after they've been in hospital is an embarrassment.

[Nucky Thompson]

Another group of mad scientists are demanding more restrictions. SPI-MO-O are modelling 2,000,000 daily cases, 10,000 daily hospitalisations and 6.000 daily deaths in worst case scenario.

I'm sure they try to outdo each other

[Costanza]

8 minutes ago, Malinga the Swinga said:

That man is deranged, just deranged. I'm not overly happy about lockdowns and restrictions but to describe it as facism, well it's just stupid.

People like him just stir up bother before retreating to his comfortable home.

Also is climate change denier, claims to be able to forecast weather and says he can predict earthquakes.

Does have some good policies, he wants to be Mayor of London, such as ending homelessness and spending more in cancer research as well as other serious illnesses.

 

He is a wonderful singer though.

Ahem, apologies for any cringe inducing injuries that ensue, albeit they can be treated free at the point of care.

 

 

[Enzo Chiefo]

39 minutes ago, The Mighty Thor said:

I'm sure that's the conclusion from 'your analysis of the data from both countries'

IMHO you're comparing apples and oranges. 

Much as you appear to want to pedal the myths of the FM and assorted chinless wonders in the scientific community, the data from SA is compelling.

Unfortunately,  only the negative data is being presented to the uneducated classes. One wonders again: why?

 

[Malinga the Swinga]

3 minutes ago, Footballfirst said:

I've had a discussion with Enzo before on this topic, but he was unable to offer any insight into the funding model required.

 

I suggested a model such as the German taxation model which involves a progressive income tax system, but with ring fenced addons to pay for health insurance, pensions, unemployment insurance and care needs.  Enzo seemed reluctant to meet the additional tax burden required by that model, although it is one that I would be content to pay. 

If you eliminate waste spending, then the tax burden will not be as great as perhaps people believe.

I would like it to be done by a non partisan group though, all parties being represented, or else all we will get is sniping from those on outside.

No problem with this though.

[Enzo Chiefo]

2 minutes ago, Nucky Thompson said:

Another group of mad scientists are demanding more restrictions. SPI-MO-O are modelling 2,000,000 daily cases, 10,000 daily hospitalisations and 6.000 daily deaths in worst case scenario.

I'm sure they try to outdo each other

They want to throw these clowns in the Tower of London.  Seriously,  why do these no-marks get air time?

[Malinga the Swinga]

9 minutes ago, Costanza said:

The number one ranked healthcare system in the world is South Korea which is public and private. The next 3, Denmark, Taiwan and Austria are all free universal healthcare systems, so there's absolutely no reason why we need to move away from the current model, guess it comes down to your ideology.

Well, the current model we have is basically ****ed. If we throw more money at it, it will still be ****ed, just those who currently cream money out of it will make more.

It's not corruption, it's just waste built into the system and that won't change.

[Rupert Pupkin]

35 minutes ago, The Mighty Thor said:

In the spirit of balance and seeing as it's Christmas, here's one for the boys who've been getting all het up the last few days.

 

You're most welcome 👍 

 

 

“Het” isn’t a word according to my wife... You have no idea how pleased I am to see someone else using it... ❤️😂😂

[The Real Maroonblood]

6 minutes ago, Nucky Thompson said:

Another group of mad scientists are demanding more restrictions. SPI-MO-O are modelling 2,000,000 daily cases, 10,000 daily hospitalisations and 6.000 daily deaths in worst case scenario.

I'm sure they try to outdo each other

Pass the gun.

[Costanza]

3 minutes ago, Malinga the Swinga said:

Well, the current model we have is basically ****ed. If we throw more money at it, it will still be ****ed, just those who currently cream money out of it will make more.

It's not corruption, it's just waste built into the system and that won't change.

I was meaning the funding model but yeah, don't disagree that the organisation and infrastructure can't be looked at.

[The Mighty Thor]

9 minutes ago, Enzo Chiefo said:

Much as you appear to want to pedal the myths of the FM and assorted chinless wonders in the scientific community, the data from SA is compelling.

Unfortunately,  only the negative data is being presented to the uneducated classes. One wonders again: why?

 

The data from SA is compelling if you live in Cape Town or Johannesburg but not if you live in Edinburgh or London. 

 

[Footballfirst]

7 minutes ago, Malinga the Swinga said:

If you eliminate waste spending, then the tax burden will not be as great as perhaps people believe.

I would like it to be done by a non partisan group though, all parties being represented, or else all we will get is sniping from those on outside.

No problem with this though.

I'm always intrigued by the "waste spending" in the NHS money tree that is just waiting to be harvested.

 

I'm sure that there are some low hanging fruits like the profits reaped in the "cronyvirus" contracts.  Any others?  

[Malinga the Swinga]

7 minutes ago, Nucky Thompson said:

Another group of mad scientists are demanding more restrictions. SPI-MO-O are modelling 2,000,000 daily cases, 10,000 daily hospitalisations and 6.000 daily deaths in worst case scenario.

I'm sure they try to outdo each other

It's what modellers do. Quote really low for best case figure and impossibly high for worst case. That way, anywhere in between proves them right, they become 'experts in the field' and get air time.

They never, never ever, quote a single figure.

They also never reveal their modelling algorithms or techniques as these are patented and their livelihood. Also means they can't be questioned.

These experts will also be work colleagues of Sage advisers, either in universities or other committees. 

Amazing how those who criticise the government, rightly so, for handing out contracts to their associates, have no problem accepting scientists doing the exact same.

[The Mighty Thor]

10 minutes ago, Rupert Pupkin said:

“Het” isn’t a word according to my wife... You have no idea how pleased I am to see someone else using it... ❤️😂😂

Destroying our language one hyperbolic statement at a time 

 

And

 

Promoting spousal one-upmanship 

 

I'm here all week* 😎

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

*unless there is moderator intervention ☹

[Malinga the Swinga]

Just now, Footballfirst said:

I'm always intrigued by the "waste spending" in the NHS money tree that is just waiting to be harvested.

 

I'm sure that there are some low hanging fruits like the profits reaped in the "cronyvirus" contracts.  Any others?  

I don't work in health service so can't comment on what waste exists.

I do work for large company though that spends billions on computer systems and employs thousands of people.

The money spent on systems that don't work, or don't work as designed or are scrapped halfway through build is huge.

The amount of contractors employed because they know the right person is unreal. They spend more time justifying their employment than actually contributing to work.

The amount of money spent to third parties is huge and they get away with murder, compared to in-house staff. 

I can only imagine it's the same in NHS.

 

[Adam_the_legend]

12 minutes ago, Malinga the Swinga said:

It's what modellers do. Quote really low for best case figure and impossibly high for worst case. That way, anywhere in between proves them right, they become 'experts in the field' and get air time.

They never, never ever, quote a single figure.

They also never reveal their modelling algorithms or techniques as these are patented and their livelihood. Also means they can't be questioned.

These experts will also be work colleagues of Sage advisers, either in universities or other committees. 

Amazing how those who criticise the government, rightly so, for handing out contracts to their associates, have no problem accepting scientists doing the exact same.

 

27 minutes ago, Nucky Thompson said:

Another group of mad scientists are demanding more restrictions. SPI-MO-O are modelling 2,000,000 daily cases, 10,000 daily hospitalisations and 6.000 daily deaths in worst case scenario.

I'm sure they try to outdo each other

Read this: https://www.spectator.co.uk/article/my-twitter-conversation-with-the-chairman-of-the-sage-covid-modelling-committee

[Footballfirst]

5 minutes ago, Malinga the Swinga said:

I don't work in health service so can't comment on what waste exists.

I do work for large company though that spends billions on computer systems and employs thousands of people.

The money spent on systems that don't work, or don't work as designed or are scrapped halfway through build is huge.

The amount of contractors employed because they know the right person is unreal. They spend more time justifying their employment than actually contributing to work.

The amount of money spent to third parties is huge and they get away with murder, compared to in-house staff. 

I can only imagine it's the same in NHS.

 

I'm sure that the bosses of your large company would appreciate your thoughts on how large sums of money can be saved in their business model. If such a major exercise was undertaken, with a successful outcome, then I'm sure that the NHS bosses (and other large business operations) would be interested in establishing how a similar process could be applied to their business models.  

[Malinga the Swinga]

3 minutes ago, Adam_the_legend said:

 

Read this: https://www.spectator.co.uk/article/my-twitter-conversation-with-the-chairman-of-the-sage-covid-modelling-committee

It isn't a surprise. The advisers want a particular outcome and the evidence that supports this outcome is published whilst the evidence that goes against it is ignored and swept away.

To be honest, I would do the same at my work if I wanted one outcome to win over another. It's called using your influencing skills.

[Malinga the Swinga]

4 minutes ago, Footballfirst said:

I'm sure that the bosses of your large company would appreciate your thoughts on how large sums of money can be saved in their business model. If such a major exercise was undertaken, with a successful outcome, then I'm sure that the NHS bosses (and other large business operations) would be interested in establishing how a similar process could be applied to their business models.  

I'm afraid that would need to be coming from someone way higher than me. I would be crushed before it got anywhere.

I need my job, and am not ashamed to say learning when to talk and when to keep quiet is a pre requisite for a long career.

They know it happens, they just put up with it. I'm sure you know that though.

Edited December 18, 2021 by Malinga the Swinga

[MoncurMacdonaldMercer]

20 minutes ago, Malinga the Swinga said:

It's what modellers do. Quote really low for best case figure and impossibly high for worst case. That way, anywhere in between proves them right, they become 'experts in the field' and get air time.

They never, never ever, quote a single figure.

They also never reveal their modelling algorithms or techniques as these are patented and their livelihood. Also means they can't be questioned.

These experts will also be work colleagues of Sage advisers, either in universities or other committees. 

Amazing how those who criticise the government, rightly so, for handing out contracts to their associates, have no problem accepting scientists doing the exact same.

it would not be appropriate to quote a single figure - if at the start of the season we were asked to predict the number of points Hmfc would end up with any exact guess would just be random if we got it right but some could probably have a good stab at modelling the number of points to a range with a reasonable confidence

 

Any modeller just quoting a really low figure and really high figure to be right somewhere in between would get torn a new one at a proper peer review - they will also provide a commentary albeit not a full breakdown of every x & y - so I’d have to disagree with a lot of ur post

 

the odd result with a massive range is basically a statement saying that they don’t know the number

 

the figures quoted during the pandemic have been politically driven not statistically - some will argue for good reason to scare folk into compliance for the greater good etc - that’s not to absolve some of the models from their part in the selective reporting

 

 

 

 

[Lone Striker]

25 minutes ago, Malinga the Swinga said:

I'd aim for Qatar, Dubai, Abu Dhabi or any of the Emirates. They're the only ones from region I have seen. Singapore is supposed to be pretty good as well.

I'm not in any way expert though, it may be someone from elsewhere would be best.

Just the usual new I mentioned are pretty new and they will have gone for best money can buy.

 

From what I can find, these ME  countries have modest populations (2m or 3m) - so decades of high oil revenues  has enabled them to build infrastructure and train doctors/surgeons to cope with that number.   It looks like Qatar has some kind of 2-tier system (free public, and  fee-paying private) - just like we do.     They've got plenty dessert to expand into.  It may well be more efficient than ours - and in fancy modern buildings -  but I suspect ours offers a wider range of services than theirs. And ours has to cater for 60-odd million people.

 

To be fair to us, the Scottish Government has funded quite a few new hospitals and medical centres  in the last 10 years - but the majority are probably still situated in old buildings (like the Sick Kids was before it moved out).  

[Footballfirst]

23 minutes ago, Malinga the Swinga said:

I'm afraid that would need to be coming from someone way higher than me. I would be crushed before it got anywhere.

I need my job, and am not ashamed to say learning when to talk and when to keep quiet is a pre requisite for a long career.

They know it happens, they just put up with it. I'm sure you know that though.

Sorry I didn't mean to take aim at you personally in my previous post.

 

I've had plenty experience of major cost cutting exercises and external consultants in my career.

 

In most cases the initiative comes from a very senior manager (e.g. a divisional head) within the organisation who is incentivised to make savings (increase the profit margin/or reduce a cost base).  When that initiative is filtered down to low level managers and shop floor workers, you find that it means cancelling training, reducing travel expenses, delaying replacement of equipment and upgrades to systems, vacancies not filled.  The result is that you show sufficient savings over the year that the senior manager meets his target, gets his bonus and share options.  The following year all the delayed training, replacements and upgrades are now essential, so are approved.

 

As for consultants, they just take the best ideas of everyone they speak to, then present them as their own ideas and recommendations, despite everything having come from in-house (all for a large fee of course). 

 

 

Edited December 18, 2021 by Footballfirst

[Taffin]

2 minutes ago, Lone Striker said:

From what I can find, these ME  countries have modest populations (2m or 3m) - so decades of high oil revenues  has enabled them to build infrastructure and train doctors/surgeons to cope with that number.   It looks like Qatar has some kind of 2-tier system (free public, and  fee-paying private) - just like we do.     They've got plenty dessert to expand into.  It may well be more efficient than ours - and in fancy modern buildings -  but I suspect ours offers a wider range of services than theirs. And ours has to cater for 60-odd million people.

 

To be fair to us, the Scottish Government has funded quite a few new hospitals and medical centres  in the last 10 years - but the majority are probably still situated in old buildings (like the Sick Kids was before it moved out).  

 

 

So have we, it's part of the problem 😂

[Costanza]

20 minutes ago, jonesy said:

And now over to our Hamilton correspondent who, like a Poundland Ros Atkinson, will entertain us with a series of infographics showing the efficacy of trousers in retaining flatulent dispersions.

I'd like to see that happen. It's what Lord Reith would have wanted.

[MoncurMacdonaldMercer]

fat unvaccinated consultants

 

 

 

[Malinga the Swinga]

7 minutes ago, Lone Striker said:

From what I can find, these ME  countries have modest populations (2m or 3m) - so decades of high oil revenues  has enabled them to build infrastructure and train doctors/surgeons to cope with that number.   It looks like Qatar has some kind of 2-tier system (free public, and  fee-paying private) - just like we do.     They've got plenty dessert to expand into.  It may well be more efficient than ours - and in fancy modern buildings -  but I suspect ours offers a wider range of services than theirs. And ours has to cater for 60-odd million people.

 

To be fair to us, the Scottish Government has funded quite a few new hospitals and medical centres  in the last 10 years - but the majority are probably still situated in old buildings (like the Sick Kids was before it moved out).  

We have built new hospital recently. It was a disaster. It cost millions to build and millions more to fix. There's your waste, right there in front of you.