Coronavirus Super Thread ( merged )

[Ray Gin]

1 hour ago, JamesM48 said:

Well if people are not becoming Ill from it and don’t need hospital care what’s the issue ? Let it rip through 

 

https://www.dailymail.co.uk/news/article-10297895/South-Africas-Covid-hospitalisations-soar-81-week.html

 

Covid-19 hospitalisations up by 81% in the past week in South Africa. 

 

[JudyJudyJudy]

😄

[JudyJudyJudy]

14 minutes ago, Japan Jambo said:

 

We will only get past this when we get to that point. Unfortunately while we have an NHS that is  unable to cope we won't get there. We are just about to tip massive amounts of cash in it's direction - I suspect all that will do is paper over the cracks and put off the reform that is needed. 2 years into this and I hear no plans to address the shortage of doctors or nurses.

It needs reviewed from top to bottom.   It will be in even worse nick once they sack " the unvaccinated" staff by April 2022 .

4 minutes ago, Ray Gin said:

 

https://www.dailymail.co.uk/news/article-10297895/South-Africas-Covid-hospitalisations-soar-81-week.html

 

Covid-19 hospitalisations up by 81% in the past week in South Africa. 

 

We dont live in South Africa.  Apparently they also have  lot less of their pop vaccinated. 

[Victorian]

18 minutes ago, Nucky Thompson said:

That's what happened with colds, flus and  other Winter diseases before covid came along

 

And hopefully will be again.  It looks like we're going to be forced into a shit-or-bust real world trial of how it's going to play out.  The consequences will be what they will be.

 

After it's over,  I strongly suggest that nobody has any complaints about the consequences of hospital and care home acquired infections.  If it's let it rip time then there's nothing the governments can do to keep it out of those settings.

[Ray Gin]

3 minutes ago, JamesM48 said:

It needs reviewed from top to bottom.   It will be in even worse nick once they sack " the unvaccinated" staff by April 2022 .

We dont live in South Africa.  Apparently they also have  lot less of their pop vaccinated. 

 

2 doses of Az and Pfizer seemingly as much use as a chocolate teapot against omicron so we only really have 38% of the population vaccinated.

[Japan Jambo]

Oh goodie 'the dentist' has a slot on Off The Ball, let's hear what that grandstanding little prick has to say for himself - loads I'll wager.

[pablo]

7 minutes ago, Ray Gin said:

 

https://www.dailymail.co.uk/news/article-10297895/South-Africas-Covid-hospitalisations-soar-81-week.html

 

Covid-19 hospitalisations up by 81% in the past week in South Africa. 

 

 

The UK has delivered 120m vaccines in the past 12 months, including 21m boosters in the last 2 months. I'm sure I read that the region of SA at the centre of the outbreak had around 23% of the population vaccinated, with zero boosters given. Just for comparison. 

[Alex Kintner]

2 hours ago, JamesM48 said:

Yep and it worked . It’s terrorist language really 

[JudyJudyJudy]

4 minutes ago, Victorian said:

 

And hopefully will be again.  It looks like we're going to be forced into a shit-or-bust real world trial of how it's going to play out.  The consequences will be what they will be.

 

After it's over,  I strongly suggest that nobody has any complaints about the consequences of hospital and care home acquired infections.  If it's let it rip time then there's nothing the governments can do to keep it out of those settings.

its a virus therefore it will always be around until it dies off. We just need to accept that or turn the whole thing upside down and say to the old and vulnerable to self isolate until the crisis is over.  However long that may be. We have to balance that out with the tsunami of physical,  social and mental health issues which lockdowns have caused. Its just the tip of the iceberg with all that.

[pablo]

2 minutes ago, Ray Gin said:

 

2 doses of Az and Pfizer seemingly as much use as a chocolate teapot against omicron so we only really have 38% of the population vaccinated.

 

That's not what I've seen. 2 x AZ & a Pfizer booster =70%.

 

What's your source?

[JudyJudyJudy]

3 minutes ago, Ray Gin said:

 

2 doses of Az and Pfizer seemingly as much use as a chocolate teapot against omicron so we only really have 38% of the population vaccinated.

yes the rest don't need vaccinated as they are probably healthy or children. I assume that's what you are meaning regarding the 62% ? 

[JudyJudyJudy]

4 minutes ago, Alex Kintner said:

"There is no single definition of terrorism since it encompasses a range of activity all designed to intimidate and instill fear." 

[pablo]

2 minutes ago, JamesM48 said:

yes the rest don't need vaccinated as they are probably healthy or children. I assume that's what you are meaning regarding the 62% ? 

 

The 2 shots of AZ with a Pfizer booster being as much use as a chocolate teapot is a false claim. Why make it? 

[Victorian]

5 minutes ago, JamesM48 said:

its a virus therefore it will always be around until it dies off. We just need to accept that or turn the whole thing upside down and say to the old and vulnerable to self isolate until the crisis is over.  However long that may be. We have to balance that out with the tsunami of physical,  social and mental health issues which lockdowns have caused. Its just the tip of the iceberg with all that.

 

Oh.  Oh.  I didn't realise this James.  We'll tell all the old and vulnerable in hospital and care homes to self isolate.  We don't need anyone to come into contact with them.  Did not realise they are self sufficient.

 

 

[JudyJudyJudy]

7 minutes ago, pablo said:

 

The 2 shots of AZ with a Pfizer booster being as much use as a chocolate teapot is a false claim. Why make it? 

I didn't say that it was another poster. 

[Victorian]

The truth is that we'll just need to deal with whatever happens in care homes.  There is no self isolation for these people.  It's either that or there's going to be a grossly insufficient number of carers looking after them day to day until it abates.

 

Not a great time to be a care home resident.  

 

Hopefully nobody raging like a maniac at the government for murdering people in care homes though.

[pablo]

Just now, JamesM48 said:

I didn't say that it was another poster. 

 

Apologies

 

 

[JudyJudyJudy]

5 minutes ago, Victorian said:

 

Oh.  Oh.  I didn't realise this James.  We'll tell all the old and vulnerable in hospital and care homes to self isolate.  We don't need anyone to come into contact with them.  Did not realise they are self sufficient.

 

 

PCR tests etc. Come on. You really want just full lockdown's as such. Any restrictions or lockdowns only delay the inevitable

[JudyJudyJudy]

1 minute ago, pablo said:

 

Apologies

 

 

Nae bother

[Ray Gin]

14 minutes ago, pablo said:

 

That's not what I've seen. 2 x AZ & a Pfizer booster =70%.

 

What's your source?

 

I mean 2 doses of AZ on their own or 2 doses of Pfizer on their own

 

The 38% I mentioned is the percentage of the population who have had a booster dose.

[Victorian]

Just now, JamesM48 said:

PCR tests etc. Come on. You really want just full lockdown's as such. Any restrictions or lockdowns only delay the inevitable

 

I've never once suggested a lockdown.  You've just made that up.  It really is quite unhelpful to make things up James.  

 

PCR tests?  Aye.  Trouble is James,  they'll start to be positive.  It's either allow the virus into care homes or fundamental shortages of carers.

[Ray Gin]

17 minutes ago, JamesM48 said:

yes the rest don't need vaccinated as they are probably healthy or children. I assume that's what you are meaning regarding the 62% ? 

 

The age being hospitalised in South Africa are mostly under 50.

[JudyJudyJudy]

2 minutes ago, Ray Gin said:

 

I mean 2 doses of AZ on their own or 2 doses of Pfizer on their own

 

The 38% I mentioned is the percentage of the population who have had a booster dose.

That's your Chris Whitty moment  

[pablo]

1 minute ago, Ray Gin said:

 

I mean 2 doses of AZ on their own or 2 doses of Pfizer on their own

 

The 38% I mentioned is the percentage of the population who have had a booster dose.

 

Sorry, picked you up wrong there. Yes, that's what I've seen. Hoping the boosters are the way forward!

 

 

[Japan Jambo]

27 minutes ago, Japan Jambo said:

Oh goodie 'the dentist' has a slot on Off The Ball, let's hear what that grandstanding little prick has to say for himself - loads I'll wager.

 

Telling Corona jokes now, what a narcissistic embarrassment this twat is.

[JudyJudyJudy]

6 minutes ago, Victorian said:

 

I've never once suggested a lockdown.  You've just made that up.  It really is quite unhelpful to make things up James.  

 

PCR tests?  Aye.  Trouble is James,  they'll start to be positive.  It's either allow the virus into care homes or fundamental shortages of carers.

Yes apologies re the lockdown comment.   It was fake news from me of all people.   It seems to be Hobsons choice now with this new variant really. 

[Victorian]

Just now, JamesM48 said:

Yes apologies re the lockdown comment.   It was fake news from me of all people.   It seems to be Hobsons choice now with this new variant really. 

 

Indeedy James.  It seems that way.

[Savage Vince]

14 minutes ago, Japan Jambo said:

 narcissistic embarrassment 

 

Quoting your own posts. 😁

[Alex Kintner]

Is there anything to back up the claim that Omicron gives just a mild cold or the sniffles? I know there’s not been a single death attributed to it yet but haven’t hospitalisations in South Africa increased massively. 

[Nucky Thompson]

57 minutes ago, Ray Gin said:

 

https://www.dailymail.co.uk/news/article-10297895/South-Africas-Covid-hospitalisations-soar-81-week.html

 

Covid-19 hospitalisations up by 81% in the past week in South Africa. 

 

When you get past the headlines, that's a fairly positive article.

 

They reckon Omicron has peaked already in South Africa

[JudyJudyJudy]

Just been on the phone with one of my neices and we had arranged a good night out at a hotel next Saturday night. There are a few of us going. However we are know wondering if it will actually be cancelled or there will be hardly any people there due to all this malarkey.  Its a catch 22 situation now for business are people may still want to go out for Xmas nights out but think their chosen places might not be that busy due to cancellations. Her partner is off to  staff night doo the night. Its no stopping him. In fact we would still go but only if it is busy as the tickets are quite expensive but  i also feel rotten if we cancel and the hotel has lost more revenue. 

[Nucky Thompson]

1 minute ago, Alex Kintner said:

Is there anything to back up the claim that Omicron gives just a mild cold or the sniffles? I know there’s not been a single death attributed to it yet but haven’t hospitalisations in South Africa increased massively. 

The data coming out of South Africa.

It seems to be a lot of young people who they are taking into hospital 'just in case'

The average length of time in hospital has dropped from 6 days in the last wave to 2 days in this wave

[Alex Kintner]

3 minutes ago, JamesM48 said:

Just been on the phone with one of my neices and we had arranged a good night out at a hotel next Saturday night. There are a few of us going. However we are know wondering if it will actually be cancelled or there will be hardly any people there due to all this malarkey.  Its a catch 22 situation now for business are people may still want to go out for Xmas nights out but think their chosen places might not be that busy due to cancellations. Her partner is off to  staff night doo the night. Its no stopping him. In fact we would still go but only if it is busy as the tickets are quite expensive but  i also feel rotten if we cancel and the hotel has lost more revenue. 

[JudyJudyJudy]

Just now, Alex Kintner said:

 

[Alex Kintner]

Just now, Nucky Thompson said:

The data coming out of South Africa.

It seems to be a lot of young people who they are taking into hospital 'just in case'

The average length of time in hospital has dropped from 6 days in the last wave to 2 days in this wave

That sounds promising. What I’m getting at is you don’t end up in hospital at all when you have a mild cold or sniffles. Some seem to have jumped on this and stating it as fact.

[Victorian]

4 minutes ago, Alex Kintner said:

Is there anything to back up the claim that Omicron gives just a mild cold or the sniffles? I know there’s not been a single death attributed to it yet but haven’t hospitalisations in South Africa increased massively. 

 

Not really.  The South Africa situation is not comparable because the large majority have been in younger people,  albeit with less vaccinations.  Almost all of the UK cases are in young people.  There is a new study in the news and it's prediction is 25,000 omicron deaths by April under best case conditions,  albeit caveated by uncertainty about pathogenicity.

 

Viruses simply don't change their virulence in such a swift and radical way being suggested.  That has probably formed the basis of the best case scenario of deaths.  It probably will still cause acute illness in the older groups.  Sniffles for the younger people.  The best case scenario was predicted WITH the assumption of a less severe virus.

 

20m infections in the best case.  35m in the worst case.  

[Herbert.]

10 minutes ago, JamesM48 said:

Just been on the phone with one of my neices and we had arranged a good business meeting at a hotel next Saturday night. There are a few of us going. However we are know wondering if it will actually be cancelled or there will be hardly any people there due to all this malarkey.  Its a catch 22 situation now for business are people may still want to go out for Xmas business meetings but think their chosen places might not be that busy due to cancellations. Her partner is off to  staff night doo the night. Its no stopping him. In fact we would still go but only if it is busy as the tickets are quite expensive but  i also feel rotten if we cancel and the hotel has lost more revenue. 

 

 

Fixed it for you.

[JudyJudyJudy]

1 minute ago, Victorian said:

It probably will still cause acute illness in the older groups.  Sniffles for the younger people. 

Like the flu does 

[JudyJudyJudy]

1 minute ago, Herbert said:

 

 

Fixed it for you.

eh? 

[Enzo Chiefo]

7 minutes ago, Alex Kintner said:

Is there anything to back up the claim that Omicron gives just a mild cold or the sniffles? I know there’s not been a single death attributed to it yet but haven’t hospitalisations in South Africa increased massively. 

In many cases, hospitalisations in SA are for other reasons, with Covid being "an incidental finding". In any case,  the average hospital stay is 3 or 4 days, compared with 9 or 10 previously.  Very few require oxygen.

Everything seems to point to it being milder than previous variants.

Every time there are outbreaks of colds or flus, there are always people who need hospital treatment,  for one thing or another.

 

At any rate, hospital capacity issues are for Govts and the NHS to sort out. The overwhelming healthy majority should not ve stripped of their liberties, businesses or education just to "protect the NHS"

[JudyJudyJudy]

1 minute ago, Enzo Chiefo said:

In many cases, hospitalisations in SA are for other reasons, with Covid being "an incidental finding". In any case,  the average hospital stay is 3 or 4 days, compared with 9 or 10 previously.  Very few require oxygen.

Everything seems to point to it being milder than previous variants.

Every time there are outbreaks of colds or flus, there are always people who need hospital treatment,  for one thing or another.

 

At any rate, hospital capacity issues are for Govts and the NHS to sort out. The overwhelming healthy majority should not ve stripped of their liberties, businesses or education just to "protect the NHS"

Correct. 

[GBJambo]

44 minutes ago, Ray Gin said:

 

The age being hospitalised in South Africa are mostly under 50.

They are mostly unvaccinated though 

[Victorian]

1 minute ago, JamesM48 said:

Like the flu does 

 

Like flu?  Sort of.  Flu (real case of influenza) is often conflated with a really heavy cold or virus.  Actual flu can be quite nasty for anyone.

 

The sensible precaution on information is to wait a little while yet before declaring it as little more than mild symptoms and sniffles.  How many need to be hospilalised is still unclear.  But it would be incredibly foolish to assume it will be negligible.

[JudyJudyJudy]

4 minutes ago, Victorian said:

 

Like flu?  Sort of.  Flu (real case of influenza) is often conflated with a really heavy cold or virus.  Actual flu can be quite nasty for anyone.

 

The sensible precaution on information is to wait a little while yet before declaring it as little more than mild symptoms and sniffles.  How many need to be hospilalised is still unclear.  But it would be incredibly foolish to assume it will be negligible.

ok

 

Edited December 11, 2021 by JamesM48

[Victorian]

Just now, JamesM48 said:

Flu on average kills over 30.000 in the UK each winter.

 

 

Yeah.  Flu can be nasty and that's despite many,  many years of the building up of innate population immunity memory.  Flu is very stable as well.  When it mutates it does so slowly and with very limited changes.  

[redjambo]

The figure of 30,000 killed in the UK by flu each winter is wrong. That figure is annual and for both flu and pneumonia.

 

https://www.ons.gov.uk/aboutus/transparencyandgovernance/freedomofinformationfoi/influenzadeathsin20182019and2020

 

For England and Wales, 2018 saw a total of 1,598 flu deaths, while 2019 saw 1,223.

[manaliveits105]

1 hour ago, pablo said:

 

That's not what I've seen. 2 x AZ & a Pfizer booster =70%.

 

What's your source?

Sue Mammy 

[JudyJudyJudy]

2 minutes ago, redjambo said:

The figure of 30,000 killed in the UK by flu each winter is wrong. That figure is annual and for both flu and pneumonia.

 

https://www.ons.gov.uk/aboutus/transparencyandgovernance/freedomofinformationfoi/influenzadeathsin20182019and2020

 

For England and Wales, 2018 saw a total of 1,598 flu deaths, while 2019 saw 1,223.

Influenza deaths in 2018, 2019 and 2020 - Office for National Statistics (ons.gov.uk)   Yes flu and pneumonia 29,000 plus in 2018 and 26,000 plus the next year 

Edited December 11, 2021 by JamesM48

[Victorian]

Flu is quite predictable and much easier to prevent an epidemic.  It's transmissibility is low compared to omicron.  Somewhere under r0 value of 2.0.  It's effects are naturally limited and have become assimilated into the range of illnesses that can be dealt with on an ongoing basis.

 

Yeah folks,  still not comparable I'm afraid.

[redjambo]

1 minute ago, JamesM48 said:

Influenza deaths in 2018, 2019 and 2020 - Office for National Statistics (ons.gov.uk)   Yes flu and pneumonia 29,000 plus in 2018 and 26,000 plus the next year 

 

Yes, but the vast majority of those deaths are from pneumonia. The original statement about the extent of flu deaths was incorrect.