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Toxteth O'Grady
10 minutes ago, Newton51 said:


under 12s only allowed for non contact training. No adults are allowed to watch

Ah that’s Ok - they were young and the parents sat in their cars and could watch from there

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Nucky Thompson
17 minutes ago, Footballfirst said:

I don't see any difference with kitchens, bathrooms etc. If it came to the crunch you just claim that doors were falling off or the shower or bath was leaking or faulty, carpet was worn and therefore a trip risk.  Whether you replace a carpet with a wood flooring would be your choice, but it is maintenance or upkeep all the same. 

 

I've seen double glazing installed in my own street within the last week or so.

You could just about get away with making a case for any inside work as essential.

The police aren't even checking up on tradesmen, that's how much of a grey area it is

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Tambo_The_Jambo
2 minutes ago, Nucky Thompson said:

You could just about get away with making a case for any inside work as essential.

The police aren't even checking up on tradesmen, that's how much of a grey area it is

They are here Nucky, I personally know 6 who have been fined and heard of a good few more. I want to go out but can’t afford a grand x 3 men....it’s a no win for some of us. 

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Governor Tarkin
33 minutes ago, Enzo Chiefo said:

Who mentioned Wetherspoons?. The power crazy wee s**te would love to control how and when we drink alcohol.

 

He's a good Tory though, Enzo. Know's how to make a few quid and how to keep a hold of it. 👍

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Governor Tarkin
2 minutes ago, Tambo_The_Jambo said:

They are here Nucky, I personally know 6 who have been fined and heard of a good few more. I want to go out but can’t afford a grand x 3 men....it’s a no win for some of us. 

 

That's a really shitey situation, Tambo, I feel for you, mate.

Do you work for some other ****er or run your own mob?

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Nucky Thompson
3 minutes ago, Tambo_The_Jambo said:

They are here Nucky, I personally know 6 who have been fined and heard of a good few more. I want to go out but can’t afford a grand x 3 men....it’s a no win for some of us. 

Do you stay in a small town Tambo?

I can imagine it would be harder to work in a place where everybody knows each other

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36 minutes ago, Enzo Chiefo said:

Who mentioned Wetherspoons?. The power crazy wee s**te would love to control how and when we drink alcohol. Don't delude yourself otherwise. 


You mean, like licensing laws and the like that public houses already operate under? So it always has been controlled - and at times, far more controlled than it is now.

Maybe it should be tighter controlled though, as the pish you're coming out with surely doesn't emanate from someone sober. :P

 

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41 minutes ago, Enzo Chiefo said:

Who mentioned Wetherspoons?. The power crazy wee s**te would love to control how and when we drink alcohol. Don't delude yourself otherwise. 

You can’t honestly believe that. 

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3 minutes ago, Governor Tarkin said:

 

He's a good Tory though, Enzo. Know's how to make a few quid and how to keep a hold of it. 👍

Spot on Guv'nr.  Got to admire anyone who can steer their hard-earned through the choppy waters of State tax grabs. 👍

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God to see the FM has not changed a bit

 

 

Still has to be different for no medical reasons but just to show her 'leadership qualities'

 

 

Truly as it stands (and no one knows how the next few weeks will go) she is simply holding up progress on the road to recovery

 

Never thought I'd say this but I'd rather live in Boris's world than live in hers...dour, depressing and with a total lack of detail contained within her proposals

The good news is she'll lead her party to a less than successful election outcome in May....lets be honest all she wants is all to be clear by then so she can continue to make false promises of recovery to the electorate at the time of the vote

 

Still she's managed to kiss the backside of the teaching unions and leave Scottish pupils up to a month behind some of those down south...well done FM....OH AND WE'VE ALREADY FORGOTTEN ABOUT YOUR LEVELS NONSENSE

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2 minutes ago, Brian Dundas said:

You can’t honestly believe that. 

If you're asking whether I think Sturgeon would like to see the demise of the traditional pub then yes, I think she probably would. Just look at all the flawed, amateurish,  legislation covering everything from football songs, to named persons to bills on "hate" speech, all of which ended up being removed. Look at her treatment of hospitality,  alcohol in particular. Seriously, do you not have concerns she may be a control freak??

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11 minutes ago, Gizmo said:


You mean, like licensing laws and the like that public houses already operate under? So it always has been controlled - and at times, far more controlled than it is now.

Maybe it should be tighter controlled though, as the pish you're coming out with surely doesn't emanate from someone sober. :P

 

I know it's been controlled, you're stating the bleeding obvious.  I'm talking about more control. She's a wee  feckin tyrant.

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Tambo_The_Jambo
18 minutes ago, Governor Tarkin said:

 

That's a really shitey situation, Tambo, I feel for you, mate.

Do you work for some other ****er or run your own mob?

My own company mate, it’s horrendous for the mental health too.....at least I’ll know how to do the dishes and hoover when I get back to it lol. 

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3 minutes ago, Enzo Chiefo said:

If you're asking whether I think Sturgeon would like to see the demise of the traditional pub then yes, I think she probably would. Just look at all the flawed, amateurish,  legislation covering everything from football songs, to named persons to bills on "hate" speech, all of which ended up being removed. Look at her treatment of hospitality,  alcohol in particular. Seriously, do you not have concerns she may be a control freak??

👍

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Tambo_The_Jambo
18 minutes ago, Nucky Thompson said:

Do you stay in a small town Tambo?

I can imagine it would be harder to work in a place where everybody knows each other

Sort of mate but some folk are just nosey basas and will grass you in just for the banter. 

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4 minutes ago, Tambo_The_Jambo said:

Sort of mate but some folk are just nosey basas and will grass you in just for the banter. 

Yes we have turned into a nation of " grasses" sorry " People doing their civic duty" ..

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21 minutes ago, Enzo Chiefo said:

If you're asking whether I think Sturgeon would like to see the demise of the traditional pub then yes, I think she probably would. Just look at all the flawed, amateurish,  legislation covering everything from football songs, to named persons to bills on "hate" speech, all of which ended up being removed. Look at her treatment of hospitality,  alcohol in particular. Seriously, do you not have concerns she may be a control freak??

My concerns with Nicola sturgeon and her husband is that they are more interested in the SNP being in government than they are about the cause of independence.  Travelling along the path to independence they have become obsessed with party politics and winning elections. Many unionist see the failings of the Scottish Government down to its obsession with independence but in my view it is about retaining power, just the same as effects long term governing parties at Westminster.  

 

So I am not a fan if NS, I do still vote SNP and am a party member, but one that wants independence more than control of a devolved parliament.

 

What has this to do with a Covid thread? Well plenty on here think that the independence issue forms her views and policy on COVID, but I don’t think it forms any of her policies.  

 

So I think she is a power freak, her husband is a control freak within the party, but I don’t think they have any real desire to control everyday lives of people. If they wanted to alter the licensing laws for example they could easily have done it by now.

Edited by Brian Dundas
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Weakened Offender
40 minutes ago, jonesy said:

Yes, you're right. I apologise. 

 

Now it's your turn. 😉

 

I think they've done OK with the schools to be honest. I think there should be some serious discussion with the teachers unions with a view to shortening the Easter and Summer holidays this year, maybe offering a financial incentive or more holidays over an extended period, say 2-3 years. Wont happen though. 

 

Theyve got the wee ones back pretty quickly, have a plan for the upper primaries and a date for the high school kids. The online stuff second time around has been better than the first lockdown. 

 

The keyworker/vulnerable services have operated throughout too. Far from perfect but definitely OK. 

 

Theyve fed the wee buggers too. 😉

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Weakened Offender
50 minutes ago, Gizmo said:


You mean, like licensing laws and the like that public houses already operate under? So it always has been controlled - and at times, far more controlled than it is now.

Maybe it should be tighter controlled though, as the pish you're coming out with surely doesn't emanate from someone sober. :P

 

 

😁

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15 minutes ago, Brian Dundas said:

My concerns with Nicola sturgeon and her husband is that they are more interested in the SNP being in government than they are about the cause of independence.  Travelling along the path to independence they have become obsessed with party politics and winning elections. Many unionist see the failings of the Scottish Government down to its obsession with independence but in my view it is about retaining power, just the same as effects long term governing parties at Westminster.  

 

So I am not a fan if NS, I do still vote SNP and am a party member, but one that wants independence more than control of a devolved parliament.

 

What has this to do with a Covid thread? Well plenty on here think that the independence issue forms her views and policy on COVID, but I don’t think it forms any of her policies.  

 

So I think she is a power freak, her husband is a control freak within the party, but I don’t think they have any real desire to control everyday lives of people. If they wanted to alter the licensing laws for example they could easily have done it by now.

That's an interesting point Brian. Yes, in common with other Unionists,  I have always thought of her being obsessed with Independence rather than governing. But you may well be right, you will have a different perspective, being a supporter. 

What is playing out with the Salmond situation is extremely unhealthy and doesn't paint our democratic institutions in a good light. The way people like Salmond and Joanne Cherry have been treated does point to a power hungry cabal led by the Murrells.  

Yes, I agree, she could change the licensing laws but, imo, she would prefer to do it by stealth, changing cultures and attitudes, under the guise of Covid and keeping us "safe". As I say though, good to read your perspective on it.

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Governor Tarkin
4 minutes ago, Enzo Chiefo said:

 

Yes, I agree, she could change the licensing laws but, imo, she would prefer to do it by stealth, changing cultures and attitudes, under the guise of Covid and keeping us "safe". As I say though, good to read your perspective on it.

 

To be fair, Enzo, there's a few cultures and attitudes that could do with a spot of changing. 

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Just now, Enzo Chiefo said:

That's an interesting point Brian. Yes, in common with other Unionists,  I have always thought of her being obsessed with Independence rather than governing. But you may well be right, you will have a different perspective, being a supporter. 

What is playing out with the Salmond situation is extremely unhealthy and doesn't paint our democratic institutions in a good light. The way people like Salmond and Joanne Cherry have been treated does point to a power hungry cabal led by the Murrells.  

Yes, I agree, she could change the licensing laws but, imo, she would prefer to do it by stealth, changing cultures and attitudes, under the guise of Covid and keeping us "safe". As I say though, good to read your perspective on it.

Thanks.

 

I don’t deny there is a desire to change some of the culture around alcohol in Scotland, but there are many health issues which we could do with getting better.  

 

I should have also said I think she is a competent FM, probably the best option we have, I think she suffers from, unlike Alex Salmond, not have a Nicola Sturgeon as her deputy. 

 

The Salmond situation is a distraction we should have been left until after this Covid crisis, and the election pushed out another year as well, but politicians don’t want that, we have to put our lives on hold but they still get to play their stupid games.

 

Maybe now you will see that my views on Covid are just based on my views on Covid, not some devotion to NS or the SNP. I think there has been far too much decision in the devolved nations, nobody wanted to be seen to be under the control of one of the other leaders, which has resulted in some bad decisions on all sides unfortunately.

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2 minutes ago, Governor Tarkin said:

 

To be fair, Enzo, there's a few cultures and attitudes that could do with a spot of changing. 

We need more changing cultures and attitudes imo.

 

(Am I doing this right?)

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Governor Tarkin
47 minutes ago, Tambo_The_Jambo said:

My own company mate, it’s horrendous for the mental health too.....at least I’ll know how to do the dishes and hoover when I get back to it lol. 

 

Chuck your men shovels and tell them they're now in the driveway game.

 

Seriously though, you probably feel responsible for your employees too, and that's a lot to have on your mind. If you need to bend the rules to get through it, then bend the rules to get through it - but don't beat yourself up about it.

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Governor Tarkin
8 minutes ago, Brian Dundas said:

 

(Am I doing this right?)

 

:spoton:

 

And your previous post was a good one too. 👍

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51 minutes ago, Weakened Offender said:

 

I think they've done OK with the schools to be honest. I think there should be some serious discussion with the teachers unions with a view to shortening the Easter and Summer holidays this year, maybe offering a financial incentive or more holidays over an extended period, say 2-3 years. Wont happen though. 

 

Theyve got the wee ones back pretty quickly, have a plan for the upper primaries and a date for the high school kids. The online stuff second time around has been better than the first lockdown. 

 

The keyworker/vulnerable services have operated throughout too. Far from perfect but definitely OK. 

 

Theyve fed the wee buggers too. 😉

Your first paragraph highlights that too many actors have interests beyond the fundamental one of teaching the nation's future. Instead, we've got the teachers' unions and their tantrum-esque demands, while the government just cave for fear of losing votes. 

 

I disagree that they have got them back quickly. It's almost two months since they were in school.

 

And while the online stuff has been better, it is still very much a poor excuse for the excellent work that goes on in classrooms, face to face. The provision has resulted in many teachers being nothing more than materials compilers, tech support lackies and emoticon distributors. That's not what they're trained to do, and not what kids need.

 

Meh.

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5 minutes ago, jonesy said:

Your first paragraph highlights that too many actors have interests beyond the fundamental one of teaching the nation's future. Instead, we've got the teachers' unions and their tantrum-esque demands, while the government just cave for fear of losing votes. 

 

I disagree that they have got them back quickly. It's almost two months since they were in school.

 

And while the online stuff has been better, it is still very much a poor excuse for the excellent work that goes on in classrooms, face to face. The provision has resulted in many teachers being nothing more than materials compilers, tech support lackies and emoticon distributors. That's not what they're trained to do, and not what kids need.

 

Meh.

I  suspect teachers and their Union will, like on here, have very varied and differing views on Covid, lockdown and home schooling.  As do parents about sending kids to school.

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She seems afraid to treat Glasgow differently to the rest of the country so everyone else has to suffer accordingly.

Purely political imo.

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Weakened Offender
18 minutes ago, jonesy said:

Your first paragraph highlights that too many actors have interests beyond the fundamental one of teaching the nation's future. Instead, we've got the teachers' unions and their tantrum-esque demands, while the government just cave for fear of losing votes. 

 

I disagree that they have got them back quickly. It's almost two months since they were in school.

 

And while the online stuff has been better, it is still very much a poor excuse for the excellent work that goes on in classrooms, face to face. The provision has resulted in many teachers being nothing more than materials compilers, tech support lackies and emoticon distributors. That's not what they're trained to do, and not what kids need.

 

Meh.

 

So we're agreed that it's been OK but not perfect. 👍

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Footballfirst
20 minutes ago, jonesy said:

I disagree that they have got them back quickly. It's almost two months since they were in school.

It was nearly five months last time round

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Nucky Thompson
20 minutes ago, Geoff Kilpatrick said:

Is Sturgeon's best mate Devi still comparing Covid to measles? :laugh:

Sturgeon mentioned measles today. Now I know where it's coming from :biggrin2:

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45 minutes ago, Brian Dundas said:

I  suspect teachers and their Union will, like on here, have very varied and differing views on Covid, lockdown and home schooling.  As do parents about sending kids to school.

 

Our old friend Devi would have schools back tomorrow, if she had her way.

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The Real Maroonblood
48 minutes ago, glynnlondon said:

She seems afraid to treat Glasgow differently to the rest of the country so everyone else has to suffer accordingly.

Purely political imo.

:rofl:

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Fxxx the SPFL
40 minutes ago, Geoff Kilpatrick said:

Is Sturgeon's best mate Devi still comparing Covid to measles? :laugh:

can't believe she used that as analogy to compare with what BJ stated bout treating Covid going forward as the if it was the same as the flu i.e. deaths hospitalisations etc Jesus Christ how many folk die from measles or end up in hospital what a ***** of a statement. 

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It’s 20 weeks since the 16 day circuit breaker happened. Today’s announcement was lacking in details but gives the impression for more of a Big Bang from end of April by using furlough and week before the election so can say we are on the road to recovery 

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Toxteth O'Grady

See this levels shit.

 

We need to guard the borders of Edinburgh with pitchforks to keep out virus importations or we will never be allowed out again. 

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Analogy of the day from Donald Macleod on STV just now talking about today’s road map. 
 

 

”Listening to Sturgeon today was like driving along a pot holed road into a brick wall!” 

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5 hours ago, Carl Fredrickson said:

 

I think that under 12s are allowed to do non-contact training. My daughter is 5 and  is still attending a Saturday morning class. The classes are shorter, less coaches and is non contact training. 

Correct.

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MoncurMacdonaldMercer
4 hours ago, Footballfirst said:

Here is the Imperial College modelling that helped inform the BoJo plans.

 

If I've read it correctly, England will be looking at another 55,000 deaths.

 

https://assets.publishing.service.gov.uk/government/uploads/system/uploads/attachment_data/file/963440/S1129__Unlocking__Roadmap_Scenarios_for_England_.pdf

 

if the modelling for Scotland comes up with similar numbers in relation to now and then it shouldn’t be a surprise if many on here voluntary stay in lockdown or campaign for a different approach

 

I think when the approximate uk numbers hit 80k deaths there were posts like “ ... make it stop ...” and any attempt to have an adult discussion about an ‘acceptable’ number of deaths was shouted down like only selfishness on a mental health impairment scale could envisage such - think the Tory woman who used to narrate shopping city got a pile of stick around that time too

 

to add to the confusion the 50k excess deaths a few years ago didn’t seem to cause too much of a stir

 

people worried about restrictions being imposed - I can’t see a good few on here reclaiming their lives in the knowledge of big numbers still dying

 

any chance you’ve misread it or is there a scenario with considerably lower deaths?

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7 hours ago, Footballfirst said:

Here is the Imperial College modelling that helped inform the BoJo plans.

 

If I've read it correctly, England will be looking at another 55,000 deaths.

 

https://assets.publishing.service.gov.uk/government/uploads/system/uploads/attachment_data/file/963440/S1129__Unlocking__Roadmap_Scenarios_for_England_.pdf

That scenario involved unlocking at various stages, including right now iirc. Following Boris's roadmap was not expected to lead to 80k deaths .Chris Whitty was talking in the region of normal annual flu/other respiratory death levels. 

I think, in general though, that the public are now conditioned in to hearing big numbers of deaths , without any context whatsoever.  That was a deliberate tactic in order to frighten people in to complying with the restrictions.  Going forward, it needs to be explained to the public that there are thousands of deaths each winter, from various flus,  pneumonia and other respiratory illnesses. We don't "lockdown" in a normal year and we won't be in future. The NHS is there to protect the public,  not the other way round.

 

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45 minutes ago, Enzo Chiefo said:

That scenario involved unlocking at various stages, including right now iirc. Following Boris's roadmap was not expected to lead to 80k deaths .Chris Whitty was talking in the region of normal annual flu/other respiratory death levels. 

I think, in general though, that the public are now conditioned in to hearing big numbers of deaths , without any context whatsoever.  That was a deliberate tactic in order to frighten people in to complying with the restrictions.  Going forward, it needs to be explained to the public that there are thousands of deaths each winter, from various flus,  pneumonia and other respiratory illnesses. We don't "lockdown" in a normal year and we won't be in future. The NHS is there to protect the public,  not the other way round.

 

Scenario 1 was the earliest unlocking (26 April) which was that suggested by the CRG element of the Tories. The estimated deaths in that scenario was 91,000.

 

Scenarios 5a and 5b were closest to what BoJo has come up with, but even those are less ambitious than what is proposed with the full lifting of restrictions delayed until 16 July.

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Further to the modelling above, the 55,000 should be seen in the context of the number of deaths expected until June 2022. That is approximately 70 weeks away, so an average of 786 a week or 112 a day.  Given that England is currently averaging around 400 a day, a fair proportion of the deaths will occur in the next three months or so until the vaccine rollout covers all the adult population.  The modelling assumption is that the final take up of those eligible to receive the vaccine will be 79.1%. 

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It looks like vaccine passports/certificate are going to be utilised for foreign travel and certain activities in this country.

 

Dont like it but can understand the logic. 

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MoncurMacdonaldMercer
1 hour ago, Footballfirst said:

Further to the modelling above, the 55,000 should be seen in the context of the number of deaths expected until June 2022. That is approximately 70 weeks away, so an average of 786 a week or 112 a day.  Given that England is currently averaging around 400 a day, a fair proportion of the deaths will occur in the next three months or so until the vaccine rollout covers all the adult population.  The modelling assumption is that the final take up of those eligible to receive the vaccine will be 79.1%. 

 

i thought boris would have done this last year - opened up and ‘accepted’ a large number deaths - the upcoming winter and the expected carnage (acknowledged even by the anti - lockdown scientists) probably put paid to that but looks like the decision has been made that at some point we just have to open up

 

theres a lot of people who’s principals in protecting the elderly and vulnerable I don’t think will accept this trade off especially with successful vaccines still 55k deaths

 

possibly the reason sturgeon is holding fire as she probably realises too many of the Scottish people will not feel comfortable going back to their normal lives (albeit with face masks etc) while the equivalent of 55k deaths ‘accepted’ to happen in Scotland 

 

in such a complex situation there are no definitive right and wrong answers but going by what has been witnessed over the last year or so I can’t see a large proportion of the public just (in not the best language) shrugging that number of deaths off

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9 minutes ago, Lord BJ said:

It looks like vaccine passports/certificate are going to be utilised for foreign travel and certain activities in this country.

 

Dont like it but can understand the logic. 

Completely opposed to any type of vaccine passport - sends us down a slipperly slope as far as I'm concerned.....especially for those who can't legitimately get a a vaccine - we saying they can never travel again?

 

Base it on negative tests until the overall population in the world has been vaccinated - or a combination of vaccine proof and/or negative tests.

 

Even saw some nonsense about not being allowed into clubs if you can't prove you haven't had your vaccine....nonsense.

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