Rallying call from Stendel. Need the fans help.

[Getintaethem]

 People can argue all they want about the atmosphere at the ground, but the bottom line is it won't improve until the team does.  Thought we opened the game v st Johnstone fairly well and the crowd were responding to the players efforts in the early stages.  However, after the first few minutes the team started reverting to the way they've played over the last year.  No one was willing to carry the ball into space, the full back were constantly having to check back to keep possesion.  We started shelling it long as bozanic was hiding in midfield, Clare was giving little and apart from one run Walker wasn't making an impact.  The long balls were bouncing off Keena like he was made of rubber and even when Maclean on occasion did hold the ball up, there were no midfielder willing to make the forward runs to support him.  Add to that Bobby ****ing about at the back, the crowd started to get edgy.

 

  Even so, I thought the crowd stayed behind the team for the first hour.  Granted, not very vocal, but they had been given the square root of nowt to be positive about.   After the first hour people got frustrated and that's when the majority of the negative comments started.

 

  Over 16,000 turned up, yes maybe they could have been more vocal in their support, but FFS give them a reason to cheer.

[Phil Dunphy]

Has anyone been able to tell us the proposed positive impact that getting on the players will have yet?

[pettigrewsstylist]

17 hours ago, jambopilms said:

No point booing the players that we want to save us from relegation

Unless its designed to perduade the club to get them off the pitch and put on some who want to fight the good fight.

Dont think emails are as effective IMO.

[jambopilms]

4 minutes ago, pettigrewsstylist said:

Unless its designed to perduade the club to get them off the pitch and put on some who want to fight the good fight.

Dont think emails are as effective IMO.

Ah, so just replace the whole squad then. Easy why didn't they think of that already.

[Prof]

Supporter means supporting and encouraging the team, only a complete moron would think shouting abuse at players encourages them. 

[JFK-1]

1 hour ago, jambopilms said:

Ah, so just replace the whole squad then. Easy why didn't they think of that already.

 

Exactly, the mind is boggled by these ludicrous and widespread calls to 'get rid of em all'

As if that's even a possibility. It may in reality take a minimum of 2 years to entirely overhaul this squad.

[GinRummy]

8 minutes ago, Prof said:

Supporter means supporting and encouraging the team, only a complete moron would think shouting abuse at players encourages them. 

If any support in the world gets the idea the players are not putting in the effort their vocal ‘support’ will become something quite different. Why people are determined to criticise hearts fans, many of whom helped save the club and are continuing going to watch utter shite, is quite beyond me. 

[JFK-1]

8 minutes ago, GinRummy said:

If any support in the world gets the idea the players are not putting in the effort their vocal ‘support’ will become something quite different. Why people are determined to criticise hearts fans, many of whom helped save the club and are continuing going to watch utter shite, is quite beyond me. 

 

And booing them helps what? It hasn't already been made clear the support don't like the current situation? A situation which is not going be changed by anything but time and not any amount of booing will assist it but could hinder it.

[GinRummy]

2 minutes ago, JFK-1 said:

 

And booing them helps what? It hasn't already been made clear the support don't like the current situation? A situation which is not going be changed by anything but time and not any amount of booing will assist it but could hinder it.

I never said booing helped anything so why the question. Trying to re-write the way football fans react to underperforming players who frankly look like they can’t be arsed is just unrealistic. As long as the players out in less than maximum effort they’ll be getting booed. Not by me I might add, I rarely get vocal at games now. 

[leginten]

Just now, GinRummy said:

If any support in the world gets the idea the players are not putting in the effort their vocal ‘support’ will become something quite different. Why people are determined to criticise hearts fans, many of whom helped save the club and are continuing going to watch utter shite, is quite beyond me. 

 

It is quite staggering.

 

Being a supportive, meek, patient set of fans up until the relatively mild recent expressions of discontent certainly got the players working hard and fighting for the jersey, didn’t it?

 

I’m now wishing that at some stage last season the entire crowd had got up and booed for five minutes at the end of one of the countless unacceptable performances. The message might just have got through that he wasn’t “doing a good job”. It’ll never happen at Tynecastle, though, no matter how bad things get. We just suck it up.

[jambopilms]

Everybody on here has heard a manager say keep it tight for 20mins and the crowd will turn. That's what every away manager is saying now, even though it probably takes 5 mins with us.

And when CL said last season that you need a strong mindset to play at Tynecastle, it wasn't a compliment.

Edited December 17, 2019 by jambopilms

[JFK-1]

1 minute ago, GinRummy said:

I never said booing helped anything so why the question. Trying to re-write the way football fans react to underperforming players who frankly look like they can’t be arsed is just unrealistic. As long as the players out in less than maximum effort they’ll be getting booed. Not by me I might add, I rarely get vocal at games now. 

 

My apologies if you're not advocating booing, I didn't read the whole thread. But it still stands that booing helps nothing and is in fact counter productive.

Personally I feel it's unrealistic for laymen in the stands to judge what qualifies as maximum effort in the professional game. That's up to the manager to decide and deal with.

And consider a scenario where this manager decided he sees something in a boy who hasn't had much or any game time who may actually be or potentially be very good. But since he's just one boy he can't change the results alone but is playing to boos. That's not going to help his development in any way.

There is a new manager in place and he has to be given time to change things. One of his jobs is to raise morale and belief levels which again aren't helped by booing from people the vast majority of whom have no understanding of the realities of being a professional footballer.

[GinRummy]

2 minutes ago, leginten said:

 

It is quite staggering.

 

Being a supportive, meek, patient set of fans up until the relatively mild recent expressions of discontent certainly got the players working hard and fighting for the jersey, didn’t it?

 

I’m now wishing that at some stage last season the entire crowd had got up and booed for five minutes at the end of one of the countless unacceptable performances. The message might just have got through that he wasn’t “doing a good job”. It’ll never happen at Tynecastle, though, no matter how bad things get. We just suck it up.

I hear you mate. I actually don’t disagree with some of the comments they are making but it’s just completely unrealistic. Nobody is saying booing the team is productive but in the real world when you’re 3-0 down and there is a forward pass to a player in space and player x turns round and passes it back to player y who passes it back to the keeper there is going to be boos. Similarly when we’re defending a corner and defender x and the goalkeeper go for the same ball and crash into each other leaving an easy tap in for the opposition player there are going to be boos.

 

On the flip side if punters can see the team is desperate to put pressure on opponents, risking injury going for those 50/50 balls and looking for the killer pass to outfox opposition defences the fans will get behind the side. 

[GinRummy]

3 minutes ago, JFK-1 said:

 

My apologies if you're not advocating booing, I didn't read the whole thread. But it still stands that booing helps nothing and is in fact counter productive.

Personally I feel it's unrealistic for laymen in the stands to judge what qualifies as maximum effort in the professional game. That's up to the manager to decide and deal with.

And consider a scenario where this manager decided he sees something in a boy who hasn't had much or any game time who may actually be or potentially be very good. But since he's just one boy he can't change the results alone but is playing to boos. That's not going to help his development in any way.

There is a new manager in place and he has to be given time to change things. One of his jobs is to raise morale and belief levels which again aren't helped by booing from people the vast majority of whom have no understanding of the realities of being a professional footballer.

I agree with most of what you say. If you see my answer to leginten I’ve went into a bit of detail. As for laymen judging players effort  from the stands? Rightly or wrongly that’s just what happens with every football club in the whole world. 

[leginten]

Just now, GinRummy said:

I hear you mate. I actually don’t disagree with some of the comments they are making but it’s just completely unrealistic. Nobody is saying booing the team is productive but in the real world when you’re 3-0 down and there is a forward pass to a player in space and player x turns round and passes it back to player y who passes it back to the keeper there is going to be boos. Similarly when we’re defending a corner and defender x and the goalkeeper go for the same ball and crash into each other leaving an easy tap in for the opposition player there are going to be boos.

 

On the flip side if punters can see the team is desperate to put pressure on opponents, risking injury going for those 50/50 balls and looking for the killer pass to outfox opposition defences the fans will get behind the side. 

 

I’ve said before on this thread: some people either haven’t been going to football very long or they don’t understand how football crowds function. My view is that the Hearts fans have been incredibly supportive in the face of a shitstorm. I think there would just about have been lynchings at other grounds.

 

Aberdeen - that’s Aberdeen who are in third place and 20 points above us - were apparently booed off at half-time on Saturday. Who’s to say their fans were wrong?

[pettigrewsstylist]

13 minutes ago, leginten said:

 

It is quite staggering.

 

Being a supportive, meek, patient set of fans up until the relatively mild recent expressions of discontent certainly got the players working hard and fighting for the jersey, didn’t it?

 

I’m now wishing that at some stage last season the entire crowd had got up and booed for five minutes at the end of one of the countless unacceptable performances. The message might just have got through that he wasn’t “doing a good job”. It’ll never happen at Tynecastle, though, no matter how bad things get. We just suck it up.

 

9 minutes ago, JFK-1 said:

 

My apologies if you're not advocating booing, I didn't read the whole thread. But it still stands that booing helps nothing and is in fact counter productive.

Personally I feel it's unrealistic for laymen in the stands to judge what qualifies as maximum effort in the professional game. That's up to the manager to decide and deal with.

And consider a scenario where this manager decided he sees something in a boy who hasn't had much or any game time who may actually be or potentially be very good. But since he's just one boy he can't change the results alone but is playing to boos. That's not going to help his development in any way.

There is a new manager in place and he has to be given time to change things. One of his jobs is to raise morale and belief levels which again aren't helped by booing from people the vast majority of whom have no understanding of the realities of being a professional footballer.

Wow. I'm out.

[GinRummy]

3 minutes ago, leginten said:

 

I’ve said before on this thread: some people either haven’t been going to football very long or they don’t understand how football crowds function. My view is that the Hearts fans have been incredibly supportive in the face of a shitstorm. I think there would just about have been lynchings at other grounds.

 

Aberdeen - that’s Aberdeen who are in third place and 20 points above us - were apparently booed off at half-time on Saturday. Who’s to say their fans were wrong?

I think you make very good points. There are way too many posts criticising the support. 

[Pasquale for King]

34 minutes ago, leginten said:

 

I’ve said before on this thread: some people either haven’t been going to football very long or they don’t understand how football crowds function. My view is that the Hearts fans have been incredibly supportive in the face of a shitstorm. I think there would just about have been lynchings at other grounds.

 

Aberdeen - that’s Aberdeen who are in third place and 20 points above us - were apparently booed off at half-time on Saturday. Who’s to say their fans were wrong?

I think the Aberdeen fans were booing the team at Livi in a game they won. They want much better from their extensively assembled team and £900k a year manager, can anyone blame them?
I’m not really sure how else the fans are supposed to react if the team is playing poorly and not trying, sit there smiling happily clapping away? In today’s society if you're not doing your job well you will hear about it, that’s life.

[Rods]

36 minutes ago, leginten said:

 

I’ve said before on this thread: some people either haven’t been going to football very long or they don’t understand how football crowds function. My view is that the Hearts fans have been incredibly supportive in the face of a shitstorm. I think there would just about have been lynchings at other grounds.

 

Aberdeen - that’s Aberdeen who are in third place and 20 points above us - were apparently booed off at half-time on Saturday. Who’s to say their fans were wrong?

 

Hearts have had worst teams and worst players and they were never booed off. We get behind the team and trust the managers judgement. The manager has been removed so lets get behind the new manager and the team( I am not saying they are brilliant players) I am just saying you would hope Hearts fans who have gave so much would get behind the team in times of trouble.

 

I also apologies if I seemed to be taking my frustrations out on you in previous posts.

 

 

 

[leginten]

1 minute ago, Rods said:

 

Hearts have had worst teams and worst players and they were never booed off. We get behind the team and trust the managers judgement. The manager has been removed so lets get behind the new manager and the team( I am not saying they are brilliant players) I am just saying you would hope Hearts fans who have gave so much would get behind the team in times of trouble.

 

I also apologies if I seemed to be taking my frustrations out on you in previous posts.

 

 

 

 

No problems. I can be a niggly bugger.

 

I started going to Tynecastle in 1970. I’m pretty sure there was always booing. Not necessarily when the team lost, but when supporters reckoned the effort and commitment hadn’t been there.

 

I can see the point that booing will not help players’ confidence. But it’s a fact of life that booing happens at football matches. I hear other supporters booing their team too, and I understand exactly why they’re doing it. I don’t find it puzzling. No-one’s going to change it. I don’t accept that the very belated reaction we’re now seeing at Tynecastle is at all unusual and unacceptable. As I said above, I wonder if things might be better than they are now if we as a support had been a bit more vocal with our dissatisfaction last season. Put it this way - a culture of complacency has been allowed to thrive at Tynecastle.

 

I absolutely accept the need to get right behind the team and the new man, and that’s what I’ll be doing.

[Bazzas right boot]

5 hours ago, Phil Dunphy said:

Has anyone been able to tell us the proposed positive impact that getting on the players will have yet?

 

 

I don't think we are booing loud enough tbh. 

 

Booing really loudly will help. 

[Rods]

2 minutes ago, leginten said:

 

No problems. I can be a niggly bugger.

 

I started going to Tynecastle in 1970. I’m pretty sure there was always booing. Not necessarily when the team lost, but when supporters reckoned the effort and commitment hadn’t been there.

 

I can see the point that booing will not help players’ confidence. But it’s a fact of life that booing happens at football matches. I hear other supporters booing their team too, and I understand exactly why they’re doing it. I don’t find it puzzling. No-one’s going to change it. I don’t accept that the very belated reaction we’re now seeing at Tynecastle is at all unusual and unacceptable. As I said above, I wonder if things might be better than they are now if we as a support had been a bit more vocal with our dissatisfaction last season. Put it this way - a culture of complacency has been allowed to thrive at Tynecastle.

 

I absolutely accept the need to get right behind the team and the new man, and that’s what I’ll be doing.

 

You are right on the booing but it was usually after the game was finished and the fans had given there 100% backing during the match. The current booing getting on players back seems to be from minute one at Tynecastle these days and I would hope we are better than that as fans.

[jambopilms]

Fact is that DS says we need to be more patient and more positive from the stands as it would help the team who are suffering from a lack of confidence. Why that's not good enough for some I don't know. New manager says it would help, **** him what does he know

[leginten]

Just now, Rods said:

 

You are right on the booing but it was usually after the game was finished and the fans had given there 100% backing during the match. The current booing getting on players back seems to be from minute one at Tynecastle these days and I would hope we are better than that as fans.

 

We are in an extreme position, both in terms of the league and of fans turning up continually to watch players who, frankly, have contributed more or less zero during their time at Tynecastle. Over many, many performances. They aren’t and never will be good enough. It’s not their fault they’re being picked. It’s the management’s. So the dilemma for the football fan once your patience finally snaps is: how do I communicate this dissatisfaction simply and effectively? And the answer is always the same. We are better than most other sets of fans, I think - we have been incredibly patient. But things are at crisis point now. Emotions are raw. And if you’re looking for culprits, don’t blame the fans.

[JFK-1]

31 minutes ago, Rods said:

 

Hearts have had worst teams and worst players and they were never booed off. We get behind the team and trust the managers judgement. The manager has been removed so lets get behind the new manager and the team( I am not saying they are brilliant players) I am just saying you would hope Hearts fans who have gave so much would get behind the team in times of trouble.

 

See for me this is it, booing a team the manager has chosen and thinking you have the in depth knowledge to say they're not even trying? To me that's absurd.

 

If you say that you may as well start screaming to kick this managers arse out too because he is selecting that team and he is the one who has the knowledge to know if they're not even trying.

Which considering they're professional footballers and doing something they actually like doing is absurd to say. Currently they're simply either not good enough or don't have the tactical nous to deal with this surprisingly closely matched league.

[jambopilms]

7 minutes ago, leginten said:

 

We are in an extreme position, both in terms of the league and of fans turning up continually to watch players who, frankly, have contributed more or less zero during their time at Tynecastle. Over many, many performances. They aren’t and never will be good enough. It’s not their fault they’re being picked. It’s the management’s. So the dilemma for the football fan once your patience finally snaps is: how do I communicate this dissatisfaction simply and effectively? And the answer is always the same. We are better than most other sets of fans, I think - we have been incredibly patient. But things are at crisis point now. Emotions are raw. And if you’re looking for culprits, don’t blame the fans.

But the fans have got what they want in a new manager. No point booing because levein was shit now. New manager wants a bit more backing and patience as it might help get a tune out of the players. Everyone's frustraited, nobody is blaming the fans for the shit run of form but the fans can either help or hinder the recovery.

[leginten]

Just now, jambopilms said:

But the fans have got what they want in a new manager. No point booing because levein was shit now. New manager wants a bit more backing and patience as it might help get a tune out of the players. Everyone's frustraited, nobody is blaming the fans for the shit run of form but the fans can either help or hinder the recovery.

 

I accepted the need to get behind the team and the new man in a post above.

 

But I also accept that not everyone who goes to football is going to shackle their emotions and feelings. People are going to vent and get angry if things aren’t right for the fourteenth month in a row. Who am I to tell them how to react? 

[JFK-1]

Just now, leginten said:

Who am I to tell them how to react? 

 

A supporter who grasps that they're not helping and probably even hindering the new manager and his team?

[jambopilms]

2 minutes ago, leginten said:

 

I accepted the need to get behind the team and the new man in a post above.

 

But I also accept that not everyone who goes to football is going to shackle their emotions and feelings. People are going to vent and get angry if things aren’t right for the fourteenth month in a row. Who am I to tell them how to react? 

Well DS has asked for them to react in a specific way to help the team, how anyone can argue with that I don't know.

[GinRummy]

49 minutes ago, Rods said:

 

Hearts have had worst teams and worst players and they were never booed off. We get behind the team and trust the managers judgement. The manager has been removed so lets get behind the new manager and the team( I am not saying they are brilliant players) I am just saying you would hope Hearts fans who have gave so much would get behind the team in times of trouble.

 

I also apologies if I seemed to be taking my frustrations out on you in previous posts.

 

 

 

The perception from the stands is the players can not be arsed and are not putting in the effort the fans deserve. Until that changes people will boo. Might be a catch 22 but nobody will change that. Not jkb, not Stendel, not budge. It’s just how it is and how it will always be.

[leginten]

Just now, jambopilms said:

Well DS has asked for them to react in a specific way to help the team, how anyone can argue with that I don't know.

 

I’m not arguing with it.

 

I’m just suggesting that you don’t live in the real world if you expect a football crowd anywhere to behave in a completely rational way. Most of us are meek, mild and permanently supportive. Others let players and management know in no uncertain terms when things aren’t right. It’s a broad church.

[Ells1986]

Tomorrow is the perfect time to give the manager and the players what they want.  16k Hearts fans being positive and intimidating for the Celtic squad.  In return, we ask for 110% effort and if it’s not good enough then it’s because they are simply better than us.  We need to lift the gloom quickly and if it’s not tomorrow night then 9 points are very much up for grabs in the following 10 days which would make a big difference.  

[ramrod]

2 hours ago, jambopilms said:

Everybody on here has heard a manager say keep it tight for 20mins and the crowd will turn. That's what every away manager is saying now, even though it probably takes 5 mins with us.

And when CL said last season that you need a strong mindset to play at Tynecastle, it wasn't a compliment.

Or alternatively, get wired right into these pussys . They don't fancy it . Get in their faces and their bottle will crash . 

[gashauskis9]

Won’t have to worry about the atmosphere tomorrow night, it’ll be bouncing at KO.  Get stuck in early doors with high pressing and a couple of hard challenges and it will stay like that.

[Pasquale for King]

2 hours ago, jambopilms said:

Everybody on here has heard a manager say keep it tight for 20mins and the crowd will turn. That's what every away manager is saying now, even though it probably takes 5 mins with us.

And when CL said last season that you need a strong mindset to play at Tynecastle, it wasn't a compliment.

It’s a pity he didn’t sign players that had a strong mindset then.
I think the fans will be well up for the next three home games and this will in turn help the players play the way Stendel wants to. Do the basics and the fans will back them, we’ve had some average players over the years who’ve been fan favourites due to their effort and heart.

[Pasquale for King]

5 minutes ago, Gashauskis9 said:

Won’t have to worry about the atmosphere tomorrow night, it’ll be bouncing at KO.  Get stuck in early doors with high pressing and a couple of hard challenges and it will stay like that.

I’m really looking forward to it, will help us all keep warm too 🤬👿😡😈.

[Prof]

2 hours ago, jambopilms said:

Fact is that DS says we need to be more patient and more positive from the stands as it would help the team who are suffering from a lack of confidence. Why that's not good enough for some I don't know.

Because they are fair weather supporters or fail to understand the impact abuse/booing has on players confidence. 

[AlphonseCapone]

2 hours ago, Gashauskis9 said:

Won’t have to worry about the atmosphere tomorrow night, it’ll be bouncing at KO.  Get stuck in early doors with high pressing and a couple of hard challenges and it will stay like that.

 

Yup. 

 

I actually thought the fans weren't too bad the first 5-10 minutes on Saturday, not great obviously but considering, then the Bobby incident happened and both the players and fans reverted to type.

 

The difference for Stendel is he hasn't been watching this for the last couple of years so it probably seems strange to experience fresh. But for both supporters and players it's a broken spirit thing.

 

I'm not sure this current squad will ever be able to re-build it's relationship with the fans, or whether the fans will ever be open to. I think there will be an uneasy atmosphere that will persist until next summer when an inevitable clear out happens.

[Tom Hardy’s Dug]

7 hours ago, Pasquale for King said:

It’s a pity he didn’t sign players that had a strong mindset then.
I think the fans will be well up for the next three home games and this will in turn help the players play the way Stendel wants to. Do the basics and the fans will back them, we’ve had some average players over the years who’ve been fan favourites due to their effort and heart.

You’d have thought Berra and Whelan for example would have a strong mindset? That they don’t is a big surprise to me.

[Pasquale for King]

8 hours ago, Tom Hardy’s Dug said:

You’d have thought Berra and Whelan for example would have a strong mindset? That they don’t is a big surprise to me.

We really need Naismith back ASAP as he’s the only one that really has a strong mindset it appears.