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Budgement day 2

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ToqueJambo
8 minutes ago, The Shed Floodlight said:

Neilson won the vermin the cup.  Short memories some of you lot have... the fact he won them the cup wouldn't bother budge with her cosy relationship with the vermin

 

It was a cracking header from that corner right enough.

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sadj
12 minutes ago, ToqueJambo said:

 

It was a cracking header from that corner right enough.

 

Almost up there with his other famous strike and that tackle....

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davemclaren
24 minutes ago, The Shed Floodlight said:

Neilson won the vermin the cup.  Short memories some of you lot have... the fact he won them the cup wouldn't bother budge with her cosy relationship with the vermin

😂😂😂🤷🏼‍♂️🤷🏼‍♂️

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ToqueJambo
38 minutes ago, sadj said:

 

Almost up there with his other famous strike and that tackle....

 

The way he jumped from his sofa right through the telly into the game to score for Hibs is one of my best ever Robbie Neilson memories.

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FruitJuice
36 minutes ago, davemclaren said:

😂😂😂🤷🏼‍♂️🤷🏼‍♂️

You're not blaming him for the second half in the first game or the approach we had in the replay? They wouldn't have won it if we had just kept going for them.  Patterson was trying to get forward in the replay and was told to stay back.  

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ToqueJambo
1 minute ago, FruitJuice said:

You're not blaming him for the second half in the first game or the approach we had in the replay? They wouldn't have won it if we had just kept going for them.  Patterson was trying to get forward in the replay and was told to stay back.  

 

Did Tony Mowbray win us the cup in 2006. Did he ****, we (including Robbie Neilson at two key moments funnily enough) did it ourselves.

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FruitJuice
1 minute ago, ToqueJambo said:

 

Did Tony Mowbray win us the cup in 2006. Did he ****, we (including Robbie Neilson at two key moments funnily enough) did it ourselves.

A more positive approach at 2-0 up and they were out.  In the replay we played the whole game like the second 45 minutes at home.  You dont blame his approach in both of these examples for not knocking them out?  In a way we are still like that.  Very rarely do we go ahead and then try and kill teams off.  

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Morgan
1 hour ago, The Shed Floodlight said:

Neilson won the vermin the cup.  Short memories some of you lot have... the fact he won them the cup wouldn't bother budge with her cosy relationship with the vermin

What nonsense.

 

What absolute nonsense.

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ToqueJambo
8 minutes ago, FruitJuice said:

A more positive approach at 2-0 up and they were out.  In the replay we played the whole game like the second 45 minutes at home.  You dont blame his approach in both of these examples for not knocking them out?  In a way we are still like that.  Very rarely do we go ahead and then try and kill teams off.  

 

We lost that first game because we had a team of walking wounded by the end, starting with when Stubbs told Bartley to knobble Djoum as soon as possible in the 2nd half, which he did. They also got to Nicolson - again deliberately - and put him out the game for a while. Pallardo also had a knock. We couldn't make all the subs we needed to do because of the enforced subs due to injuries earlier. There's also the small fact of losing our top scorer and best player on the eve of the game. Even then Hibs needed a very jammy goal to tie it. Ridiculous to judge Neilson on that game.

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shaun.lawson

Man Utd fans: "We hate Alex Ferguson! He won City the league by losing 6-1 to them, at home!"

 

Strange how that's not their view. I guess that's because they don't live in some teeny, tiny, parochial beyond belief world.

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FruitJuice
20 minutes ago, shaun.lawson said:

Man Utd fans: "We hate Alex Ferguson! He won City the league by losing 6-1 to them, at home!"

 

Strange how that's not their view. I guess that's because they don't live in some teeny, tiny, parochial beyond belief world.

Being pissed off with drawing and losing the way we did to hibs, and that having an influence on them getting something that had evaded them, isn't parochial in my eyes.  Isn't being parochial towards your rivals what it's about? Maybe it doesn't mean as much to you as it does to some of us.  Not a dig at not being phm, just seems you see our rivalry differently.  A league game is completely different to being 2-0 up in the cup at home to your rivals.  

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shaun.lawson
2 minutes ago, FruitJuice said:

Being pissed off with drawing and losing the way we did to hibs, and that having an influence on them getting something that had evaded them, isn't parochial in my eyes.  Isn't being parochial towards your rivals what it's about? Maybe it doesn't mean as much to you as it does to some of us.  Not a dig at not being phm, just seems you see our rivalry differently.  A league game is completely different to being 2-0 up in the cup at home to your rivals.  

 

Explain the attitude of Man Utd fans given what I mentioned above please. Ferguson lost 6-1 - at home! - to their city rivals, who hadn't won the league since 1968. They lost the title on goal difference because of that defeat... and choked an 8 point lead away late in the season, partly because of being doubled by City and playing incredibly defensively that night.

 

So why don't United fans hate him?

Edited by shaun.lawson

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davemclaren
52 minutes ago, FruitJuice said:

You're not blaming him for the second half in the first game or the approach we had in the replay? They wouldn't have won it if we had just kept going for them.  Patterson was trying to get forward in the replay and was told to stay back.  

He has to accept responsibility for losing that tie. Not for Hibs winning the cup though. Hibs had a far bigger part in it than us.  

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FruitJuice
Just now, shaun.lawson said:

 

Explain the attitude of Man Utd fans given what I mentioned above please. Ferguson lost 6-1 - at home! - to their city rivals, who hadn't won the league since 1968. They lost the title on goal difference because of that defeat.

 

So why don't United fans hate him?

Is blame the same as hate?  I never mentioned hating him.  What about the other goals United conceded that season?  They would've contributed to their goal difference.  No other goals apart from the three hibs scored mattered in knocking us out the cup. 

Completely different.  Your 

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FruitJuice
Just now, davemclaren said:

He has to accept responsibility for losing that tie. Not for Hibs winning the cup though. Hibs had a far bigger part in it than us.  

They wouldn't have had a part to play in it if he hadn't sat back.  They couldn't have won it if we had knocked them out by killing them off.  The fact that they went on to beat other teams in it is down to him.  

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ToqueJambo
1 minute ago, FruitJuice said:

Being pissed off with drawing and losing the way we did to hibs, and that having an influence on them getting something that had evaded them, isn't parochial in my eyes.  Isn't being parochial towards your rivals what it's about? Maybe it doesn't mean as much to you as it does to some of us.  Not a dig at not being phm, just seems you see our rivalry differently.  A league game is completely different to being 2-0 up in the cup at home to your rivals.  

 

This was the team on the pitch in that 2nd half. What would you have done differently to hang on for the win never mind go for a 3rd goal? Maybe Juanma and Zanatta could have changed the game? But we'd had to make our subs because of all the injuries.

 

Alexander

Paterson

Augustyn

Oshaniwa (enforced sub for Ozturk)

McGhee

Cowie (very early enforced sub for Bauben, not long back from injury himself I think)

Pallardo (carrying a knock he got in the game)

Reilly

Djoum (got a knock early in 2nd half, Bartley lucky not to get sent off, eventually subbed for Walker who I think wasn't fully fit as he hadn't played for a month or so with an injury)

Nicholson (carrying a knock he got in the game)

Dauda (debut as we lost Sow - would have won the game with Sow 100%)

 

Subs left:

 

Hamilton

Juanma

Souttar

Zanatta

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FruitJuice
6 minutes ago, shaun.lawson said:

 

Explain the attitude of Man Utd fans given what I mentioned above please. Ferguson lost 6-1 - at home! - to their city rivals, who hadn't won the league since 1968. They lost the title on goal difference because of that defeat.

 

So why don't United fans hate him?

What's with the constant hate accusations on here if someone criticises anyone at the club's mistakes?  Pish in the league for nearly three years and if you point it out you're accused of hating someone you've never met.  

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FruitJuice
3 minutes ago, ToqueJambo said:

 

This was the team on the pitch in that 2nd half. What would you have done differently to hang on for the win never mind go for a 3rd goal? Maybe Juanma and Zanatta could have changed the game? But we'd had to make our subs because of all the injuries.

 

Alexander

Paterson

Augustyn

Oshaniwa (enforced sub for Ozturk)

McGhee

Cowie (very early enforced sub for Bauben, not long back from injury himself I think)

Pallardo (carrying a knock he got in the game)

Reilly

Djoum (got a knock early in 2nd half, Bartley lucky not to get sent off, eventually subbed for Walker who I think wasn't fully fit as he hadn't played for a month or so with an injury)

Nicholson (carrying a knock he got in the game)

Dauda (debut as we lost Sow - would have won the game with Sow 100%)

 

Subs left:

 

Hamilton

Juanma

Souttar

Zanatta

Were all these enforced subs at the start of the second half?  We changed our approach as soon as the second half began while being 2-0 up.  What was the excuse in the replay for not letting Paterson go forward and do what he was good at?  

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ToqueJambo
Just now, FruitJuice said:

Were all these enforced subs at the start of the second half?  We changed our approach as soon as the second half began while being 2-0 up.  What was the excuse in the replay for not letting Paterson go forward and do what he was good at?  

 

I'm not talking about the replay. Hibs roared out of the traps second half intent on kicking our best players out of the game - Djoum and Nicolson specifically. They succeeded and we had to adapt to that. Ozturk had to go off 5 minutes into the second half so we had one sub left and a bunch of injured players. Subbing say Juanma for Dauda or Reilly would have been very risky as we could have ended up with 10 men.

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Nookie Bear
6 minutes ago, ToqueJambo said:

 

This was the team on the pitch in that 2nd half. What would you have done differently to hang on for the win never mind go for a 3rd goal? Maybe Juanma and Zanatta could have changed the game? But we'd had to make our subs because of all the injuries.

 

Alexander

Paterson

Augustyn

Oshaniwa (enforced sub for Ozturk)

McGhee

Cowie (very early enforced sub for Bauben, not long back from injury himself I think)

Pallardo (carrying a knock he got in the game)

Reilly

Djoum (got a knock early in 2nd half, Bartley lucky not to get sent off, eventually subbed for Walker who I think wasn't fully fit as he hadn't played for a month or so with an injury)

Nicholson (carrying a knock he got in the game)

Dauda (debut as we lost Sow - would have won the game with Sow 100%)

 

Subs left:

 

Hamilton

Juanma

Souttar

Zanatta

 

Stop it. We blew that game by sitting in and inviting hibs onto us - end of story. 

 

We still had a (money-spinning) replay to sort it but played crap and deserved what we got. 

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FruitJuice
14 minutes ago, shaun.lawson said:

 

Explain the attitude of Man Utd fans given what I mentioned above please. Ferguson lost 6-1 - at home! - to their city rivals, who hadn't won the league since 1968. They lost the title on goal difference because of that defeat... and choked an 8 point lead away late in the season, partly because of being doubled by City and playing incredibly defensively that night.

 

So why don't United fans hate him?

I don't hate him, but I do resent the fact that he held back when that against the ropes.  It helped them survive another season in the championship and contributed to record season ticket sales.  Beating them in that tie would've put them back at least five years.  With what we were building, it would've taken them nearly a decade to get anywhere near us.  It was a really costly approach.  Though I do hate his money spinner comment.  It obviously didn't matter to him as much as it did to us.

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Nookie Bear
2 minutes ago, ToqueJambo said:

 

I'm not talking about the replay. Hibs roared out of the traps second half intent on kicking our best players out of the game - Djoum and Nicolson specifically. They succeeded and we had to adapt to that. Ozturk had to go off 5 minutes into the second half so we had one sub left and a bunch of injured players. Subbing say Juanma for Dauda or Reilly would have been very risky as we could have ended up with 10 men.

 

And a proper Hearts team would have kicked them back harder 😁

 

Even at the game, people around me were saying how much we were inviting them onto us. It was a tactic and a very risky one. 

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FruitJuice
3 minutes ago, ToqueJambo said:

 

I'm not talking about the replay. Hibs roared out of the traps second half intent on kicking our best players out of the game - Djoum and Nicolson specifically. They succeeded and we had to adapt to that. Ozturk had to go off 5 minutes into the second half so we had one sub left and a bunch of injured players. Subbing say Juanma for Dauda or Reilly would have been very risky as we could have ended up with 10 men.

Didn't make that game and watched in the pub and it was us sitting back and nothing to do with them roaring out the traps un the second half.  Why didn't we roar out the traps before they did? Because we let them.  

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Smith's right boot

Wtf happened to this thread? 

 

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FruitJuice
8 minutes ago, Nookie Bear said:

 

And a proper Hearts team would have kicked them back harder 😁

 

Even at the game, people around me were saying how much we were inviting them onto us. It was a tactic and a very risky one. 

Risky and brutally costly.  Despise the approach we had against them after being two nil up.  After the admin carry on with their fans, it would've been poetic justice where they would've ended up 

Though there is the hope that Peruvian Ron can get them back in that position again.  There won't be a cup win this time and their fans have proven that they do feck off when its shite.

Edited by FruitJuice

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FruitJuice
1 minute ago, Smith's right boot said:

Wtf happened to this thread? 

 

A genuine discussion.  Let us get on with if it if your not interested in taking part.  

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ToqueJambo
10 minutes ago, Nookie Bear said:

 

Stop it. We blew that game by sitting in and inviting hibs onto us - end of story. 

 

We still had a (money-spinning) replay to sort it but played crap and deserved what we got. 

 

I'd have to rewatch but 5 mins into the 2nd half we had a defence of Paterson, Augustyn, McGhee and Oshaniwa. We had Reilly and Dauda up front. Midfield was 3 or 4 injured players. Of course we could have won the game and nearly did in the last minute despite everything, but let's not pretend that we had a team on the park capable of hurting a decent Hibs side that second half.

 

Neilson was pragmatic in the 2nd half of that season but we didn't have enough players to really hurt teams and he focused on getting enough points to make Europe that season, which he did. Sow was a massive loss. I thought we did well to finish fairly close to Aberdeen, largely thanks to Djoum and latterly Walker being excellent that season, plus Paterson.

Edited by ToqueJambo

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FruitJuice
2 minutes ago, ToqueJambo said:

 

I'd have to rewatch but 5 mins into the 2nd half we had a defence of Paterson, Augustyn, McGhee and Oshaniwa. We had Reilly and Dauda up front. Midfield was 3 or 4 injured players. Of course we could have won the game and nearly did in the last minute despite everything, but let's not pretend that we had a team on the park capable of hurting a decent Hibs side that second half.

They were a championship side that never win promotion.  Decent side? 

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Smith's right boot
3 minutes ago, FruitJuice said:

A genuine discussion.  Let us get on with if it if your not interested in taking part.  

 

**** all to do with budgement day tho. 

 

Carry on. 

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martoon
2 minutes ago, FruitJuice said:

Didn't make that game and watched in the pub and it was us sitting back and nothing to do with them roaring out the traps un the second half.  Why didn't we roar out the traps before they did? Because we let them.  

 

Why are they staunchly defending a Hearts failure in a derby? 

 

They're Hibs, bud.

 

Either that or punters who, inexplicably, must put Craig Levein and his coaches before Heart of Midlothian. 

 

Some of them, after the Hamilton embarrassment, have conceded that all is not well, but still fall back on the "But, let's give him until..." horseshite. 

 

It's never ending, exasperating, baffling and a feckin joke. 

 

I'm getting the HMFC they deserve. 

 

 

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FruitJuice
Just now, Smith's right boot said:

 

**** all to do with budgement day tho. 

 

Carry on. 

Aye, but it's a decent discussion.  What's the problem with that? Feck sake. Thanks for the permission to carry on. Nice of you.  Nothing personal, but just let us enjoy it.  

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ToqueJambo
4 minutes ago, FruitJuice said:

They were a championship side that never win promotion.  Decent side? 

 

They were on a roll in the cup, had a Premiership level team, probably with a bigger wage bill than us at that time.

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ToqueJambo
4 minutes ago, Smith's right boot said:

 

**** all to do with budgement day tho. 

 

Carry on. 

 

Talking about successors to levein, Neilson's name came up, someone said Neilson won the cup for Hibs, all kicked off.

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FruitJuice
Just now, ToqueJambo said:

 

Talking about successors to levein, Neilson's name came up, someone said Neilson won the cup for Hibs, all kicked off.

Folk get a decent discussion on the go giving valid reasons for what they think and he joins in with posting a picture of an elephant or something.  Is he like that in the pup? ' feck sake! The cairds are oot and you're still talking about hearts.' 

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Nookie Bear
1 minute ago, ToqueJambo said:

 

Talking about successors to levein, Neilson's name came up, someone said Neilson won the cup for Hibs, all kicked off.

 

Neilson cost us that tie but hibs had a lot to do before they won the cup so I can’t blame him for that. 

 

But it I think it was the game that brought to the fore two things that were simmering at the time: firstly, Robbie’s tendency to sit back and invite teams onto us and, secondly, the cheeky “money spinner” comment that seemed to exemplify our rather ‘soft’ approach to hibs games at the time. 

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PhoenixHearts
2 hours ago, The Shed Floodlight said:

Neilson won the vermin the cup.  Short memories some of you lot have... the fact he won them the cup wouldn't bother budge with her cosy relationship with the vermin

 

 

State. 

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davemclaren
47 minutes ago, FruitJuice said:

They wouldn't have had a part to play in it if he hadn't sat back.  They couldn't have won it if we had knocked them out by killing them off.  The fact that they went on to beat other teams in it is down to him.  

Ridiculous statement. 😄

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Smith's right boot
13 minutes ago, ToqueJambo said:

 

Talking about successors to levein, Neilson's name came up, someone said Neilson won the cup for Hibs, all kicked off.

 

 

Simon Gray will be gutted. 

Pictures of Robbie scoring the winner all over ER. 

Poor Gray gets no credit. 

 

Robbie won us the cup in 06 with the best tackle I've ever seen as well. 

 

He's done an Edinburgh double, anyone else in history done that, won the cup with Hearts and hibs? 

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FruitJuice
2 minutes ago, PhoenixHearts said:

 

 

State. 

She was at a football business conference in Edinburgh and probably making the point about strong Edinburgh clubs being good for the Scottish game.  Not want us fans want to hear but the context is completely ignored here.  What's she supposed to say in public? Though if she does actually want hibs to have a good season, she deserves it with both barrels.  I dont think she does.  Why would she want them to do well when they are our football a d business rivals.

She knows us doing well a d then doing shite would be better for us when it comes to sponsorship, hospitality etc.

She's not daft.

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FruitJuice
3 minutes ago, davemclaren said:

Ridiculous statement. 😄

I obviously disagree lol  

If they lost against us, they couldn't have went onto beat others...

Edited by FruitJuice

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farin
2 hours ago, Morgan said:

What nonsense.

 

What absolute nonsense.

 

Yep, hibs played Inverness caley twice then beat Dundee Utd on penalties before beating rangers in the final. That’s 4 games they played after beating us that they could have lost but sadly didn’t. Hibs still had a lot to do after beating us. 

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FruitJuice
1 minute ago, farin said:

 

Yep, hibs played Inverness caley twice then beat Dundee Utd on penalties before beating rangers in the final. That’s 4 games they played after beating us that they could have lost but sadly didn’t. Hibs still had a lot to do after beating us. 

But they wouldn't have got the chance to do that if our approach had been different after being two nil up. 

You can't say he doesn't take any blame for us not beating them due to sitting back.   Is it true that Patterson wanted to get forward in the replay and was told not to?  Hibs were a lower league side that failed to come up that season. 

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farin
26 minutes ago, FruitJuice said:

But they wouldn't have got the chance to do that if our approach had been different after being two nil up. 

You can't say he doesn't take any blame for us not beating them due to sitting back.   Is it true that Patterson wanted to get forward in the replay and was told not to?  Hibs were a lower league side that failed to come up that season. 

 

Thats not what I’m saying though, of course neilson fecked up badly tactically. But hibs played 4 games after beating us, neilson wasn’t responsible for them winning the cup. That honour goes to rangers. 

Edited by farin

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FruitJuice
14 minutes ago, farin said:

 

Thats not what I’m saying though, of course neilson fecked up badly tactically. But hibs played 4 games after beating us, neilson wasn’t responsible for them winning the cup. That honour goes to rangers. 

He was to blame for them getting the chance to beat them. He needs to take some blame for them not being miles behind us for years.  

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ToqueJambo
2 hours ago, Nookie Bear said:

 

Neilson cost us that tie but hibs had a lot to do before they won the cup so I can’t blame him for that. 

 

But it I think it was the game that brought to the fore two things that were simmering at the time: firstly, Robbie’s tendency to sit back and invite teams onto us and, secondly, the cheeky “money spinner” comment that seemed to exemplify our rather ‘soft’ approach to hibs games at the time. 

 

Fair enough if that's your view (personally I thought Robbie liked to attack and we scored a lot of goals under him) but he'd been a manager for all of what a season and a half? It's like no-one at Hearts is allowed to make mistakes anymore or say anything wrong. It's weird and unnatural the obsession some of our so-called fans have for dissecting every tiny thing they think is wrong and using it against people working hard for Hearts.

Edited by ToqueJambo

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ToqueJambo
1 hour ago, FruitJuice said:

He was to blame for them getting the chance to beat them. He needs to take some blame for them not being miles behind us for years.  

 

Laughable. He was directly responsible for them being down there for 3 years instead of our one!

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FruitJuice
34 minutes ago, ToqueJambo said:

 

Laughable. He was directly responsible for them being down there for 3 years instead of our one!

So he's getting the credit for all the other games that they lost in the championship but isn't getting the blame for them getting to go on and beat other teams to win the cup?  

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DarioHMFC

Someone better tell David Gray it was actually Robbie Neilson who won Hibs the Scottish cup. 

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ToqueJambo
2 hours ago, FruitJuice said:

So he's getting the credit for all the other games that they lost in the championship but isn't getting the blame for them getting to go on and beat other teams to win the cup?  

 

No he gets the blame for losing to Hibs in one tie. Not for them winning the bloody thing.

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HMFC 86
6 hours ago, ToqueJambo said:

 

They were on a roll in the cup, had a Premiership level team, probably with a bigger wage bill than us at that time.

 

They were only “on a roll in the cup” after they put us out, because they got so much confidence from coming back in the first game when they should have had no chance.

 

They weren’t a Premiership team, they were a championship team, failing to come up at the end of the season. Really doubt that their wage bill was higher than us at that point.

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