Inch Hearts Posted June 10, 2019 Share Posted June 10, 2019 3 hours ago, Olly Lee's left boot said: I'd agree, we have been too one dimensional this season. However, My point was that the long ball thing is a myth created by Hibs, taken on by the media and championed as fact by some posters on here. We are no more a long ball team than anyone else. In fact we are one of the teams that play less "hoof ball". Tbh, having watched Aberdeen, Killie and Hibs that was quite clear and obvious. In regards to the league comment by another poster I cba arsed, if we are expected to play similar football to the Spanish, Dutch, Germany leagues etc than folk need to lay down the glue or at least change to a weaker brand. The stats were/ are relative to our league. That was implied if not stated. I don’t pay money to watch any other sides though and couldn’t care how Aberdeen made Europe or Killie 3rd. Fact of the matter is the team played with lack of ideas pass pass pass back to Berra to launch. That’s not a fragment of my imagination, that’s what the last six months (at least) of the season entailed and it wasn’t even successful. It was also anything but a myth, it was torture and predictable. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Bazzas right boot Posted June 10, 2019 Share Posted June 10, 2019 16 minutes ago, Inch Hearts said: I don’t pay money to watch any other sides though and couldn’t care how Aberdeen made Europe or Killie 3rd. Fact of the matter is the team played with lack of ideas pass pass pass back to Berra to launch. That’s not a fragment of my imagination, that’s what the last six months (at least) of the season entailed and it wasn’t even successful. It was also anything but a myth, it was torture and predictable. It is a myth, we don't play hoofball. We might not be good enough, creative enough etc but the hoof ball tag line is a complete pack of lies. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Bazzas right boot Posted June 10, 2019 Share Posted June 10, 2019 2 hours ago, BigAlim said: Halkett Randall White Bryson Cadden Magennis Naismith Just based on rumours would folk consider this a decent window? If this is the group we're looking at then I'd hope these are just replacements for guys like Godhino, Djoum and Vanecek and we'd still be looking at more quality like Liam Kelly or Boyce All have the potential to improve us apart from Randall. Would be a good window, but I'd like another midfield option if Djoum leaves and over Bozanic and maybe even Lee. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Captain Sausage Posted June 10, 2019 Share Posted June 10, 2019 (edited) 16 hours ago, Taffin said: Out of curiosity were those stats referring to passes or attempted passes or both combined? I read it at the time but can't remember. It's also worth pointing out that we were 3rd 'best' in a league with the most long passes in Europe so it's likely to say we could still be considered a long ball team in absolute terms. It was for passes attempted. I think it’s all relative when you consider Scottish football in the wider picture. Are we agricultural in comparison with an equivalent side in France? Definitely. But against directly comparable teams who play in our league, against the same opposition, we are not long ball merchants. That agricultural myth we seem to have attracted is what I’m looking to dispel. There is clear evidence that, in the context of other teams in the Scottish Premiership, it is a falsehood. Edited June 10, 2019 by Captain Sausage Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Jambof3tornado Posted June 10, 2019 Share Posted June 10, 2019 3 hours ago, Sir Gio said: That's the one Actually had the pleasure and it was anything but magic I just never gave way to anyone on it!!! He who hesitates cometh last!!! Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Jambo92 Posted June 10, 2019 Share Posted June 10, 2019 It wouldn't be a popular decision by many on here but I would be trying to get Glenn Middleton on loan from Rangers for the season. Direct and creative player. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Mr Elwood P Posted June 10, 2019 Share Posted June 10, 2019 26 minutes ago, Inch Hearts said: I don’t pay money to watch any other sides though and couldn’t care how Aberdeen made Europe or Killie 3rd. Fact of the matter is the team played with lack of ideas pass pass pass back to Berra to launch. That’s not a fragment of my imagination, that’s what the last six months (at least) of the season entailed and it wasn’t even successful. It was also anything but a myth, it was torture and predictable. Is that anything like a damp squid? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Inch Hearts Posted June 10, 2019 Share Posted June 10, 2019 19 minutes ago, Olly Lee's left boot said: It is a myth, we don't play hoofball. We might not be good enough, creative enough etc but the hoof ball tag line is a complete pack of lies. So the second part of the season never consisted of passing around the defence, back to the goalie back to Souttar to Berra to erm hoof it forward? Usually down the line to try and win a foul or a Michael Smith special? Is it tippy tappy hoofball or something then? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Inch Hearts Posted June 10, 2019 Share Posted June 10, 2019 18 minutes ago, Captain Sausage said: It was for passes attempted. I think it’s all relative when you consider Scottish football in the wider picture. Are we agricultural in comparison with an equivalent side in France? Definitely. But against directly comparable teams who play in our league, against the same opposition, we are not long ball merchants. That agricultural myth we seem to have attracted is what I’m looking to dispel. There is clear evidence that, in the context of other teams in the Scottish Premiership, it is a falsehood. Wasnt it more to do with the other sides launch it forward faster than we do? It’s pass around then punt, still the same eye bleeding predictable outcome. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
GorgieFifeLife Posted June 10, 2019 Share Posted June 10, 2019 On 05/06/2019 at 14:01, TheOak88 said: Olly Lee considering leaving. Unhappy with the lack of first team football. It's been a while since we have had a close season where we have had so little player movement or potential incoming players as this one. Window has only just opened but we haven't started off quickly like Hibs or Aberdeen. This probably indicates there will be very few players coming in. Would like to see a few more of the squad players moved on though. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Bellion Posted June 10, 2019 Share Posted June 10, 2019 The hoofball debate is the wrong one to be having. The number and % of short passes is basically irrelevant. As has already been correctly pointed out, lot of the time, we go pass-pass-pass-pass-pass-pass-pass-hoof. All those passes are knocking the ball around in our own half, defence to keeper to holding mid and back again. That is what we do a lot of the time. To be fair, I actually think it shows that the manager would like us to play football on the deck. But quite to a lot of other teams in our league play counter-attacking stuff. Fewer passes involved, but just as focused & possibly more likely to create from open play. From what I saw last season, I’d say the likes of Killie & Hibs looked more of a threat more often. So who’s ultimately playing hoofball? The team that flail around in their own half for longer then give up and punt it, or the team that employ different tactics involving fewer short passes in their own half? The fundamental problem is that some people are assuming that long passes = hoofs, which is not true. Teams who play fewer short passes are not necessarily lobbing it down the channels and hoping (some are, it’s Scottish football). Whether you you want to label it hoofball or not, a lot of what we have been doing of late is pretty clueless. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Bazzas right boot Posted June 10, 2019 Share Posted June 10, 2019 2 hours ago, Taffin said: FTFY No Suprise at all tbh. I'm sure Belgium, Swiss, Danish, Sweden etc are below us as well in the long ball stakes. Still irrelevant to us being rated 8th in Our league. My point still stands, we are no more a long ball than our rivals, some of which are reported to have taught the Brazalians. ? The debate on the quality of our football in general is another debate and a much wider one. Probably another thread. If you expect Hearts to buck the national trend my point regarding expectations stands. The survey was in the context of the Scottish league, not Europe. Not 100%, but I'm pretty sure even theses types of leagues piss over us financial wise. Norway and Sweden were mentioned on here before iirc, thier TV deals are far bigger than ours. Generally, Where there is more money, there is better quality. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Bazzas right boot Posted June 10, 2019 Share Posted June 10, 2019 (edited) 27 minutes ago, Inch Hearts said: So the second part of the season never consisted of passing around the defence, back to the goalie back to Souttar to Berra to erm hoof it forward? Usually down the line to try and win a foul or a Michael Smith special? Is it tippy tappy hoofball or something then? Our results weren't good enough for various reasons exhausted on here.- Hoofball wasn't one of them. For example, 3 Teams that played more hoofball finished above us. Style is irrelevant, effectiveness and results are what's important. We need to improve on that. We all agree? My point regarding hoofball stands- it is a myth, a hibs one at that. Same old jokers play it out tho, to make a point that I'm sure they've even forgotten by now. Edited June 10, 2019 by Olly Lee's left boot Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Inch Hearts Posted June 10, 2019 Share Posted June 10, 2019 (edited) 4 minutes ago, Olly Lee's left boot said: Our results weren't good enough for various reasons exhausted on here.- Hoofball wasn't one of them. For example, 3 Teams that played more hoofball finished above us. Style is irrelevant, effectiveness and results are what's important. We need to improve on that. We all agree? My point regarding hoofball stands- it is a myth, a hibs one at that. Same old jokers play it out tho, to make a point that I'm sure they've even forgotten by now. So we didn’t pass along the back a lot before hoofing it forward? Is that seriously what you’re trying to say? There was zero creativity at all at times. Hoofing the ball from one side of the pitch to the other bypassing yards and yards is hoofball my friend and I care not a lot that our predictable brand of it included passing it around to players either who shat themselves to make a pass or just couldn’t do so. Anyway who cares it’s last season. Edited June 10, 2019 by Inch Hearts Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Lord Beni of Gorgie Posted June 10, 2019 Share Posted June 10, 2019 2 hours ago, HMFC86 said: Jamie Walker ? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Lord Beni of Gorgie Posted June 10, 2019 Share Posted June 10, 2019 1 hour ago, Jambof3tornado said: I just never gave way to anyone on it!!! He who hesitates cometh last!!! Eyes closed, foot down, GO! Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Taffin Posted June 10, 2019 Share Posted June 10, 2019 (edited) 1 hour ago, Olly Lee's left boot said: No Suprise at all tbh. I'm sure Belgium, Swiss, Danish, Sweden etc are below us as well in the long ball stakes. Still irrelevant to us being rated 8th in Our league. My point still stands, we are no more a long ball than our rivals, some of which are reported to have taught the Brazalians. ? The debate on the quality of our football in general is another debate and a much wider one. Probably another thread. If you expect Hearts to buck the national trend my point regarding expectations stands. The survey was in the context of the Scottish league, not Europe. Not 100%, but I'm pretty sure even theses types of leagues piss over us financial wise. Norway and Sweden were mentioned on here before iirc, thier TV deals are far bigger than ours. Generally, Where there is more money, there is better quality. In not disputing anything just giving a wider picture than just looking at our league. We're a long ball team in a macro sense so some people with a less narrow interest in football will view us that way and then in a micro sense we aren't (though still nobody has clarified what that report was showing regards what the way including as a 'long ball) I'm on neither side of the fence, just highlighting that reeling off a single report with no definitions can make stats show anything especially when there is one showing the opposite if you open it up to a wider context. Edited June 10, 2019 by Taffin Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Taffin Posted June 10, 2019 Share Posted June 10, 2019 1 hour ago, Captain Sausage said: It was for passes attempted. I think it’s all relative when you consider Scottish football in the wider picture. Are we agricultural in comparison with an equivalent side in France? Definitely. But against directly comparable teams who play in our league, against the same opposition, we are not long ball merchants. That agricultural myth we seem to have attracted is what I’m looking to dispel. There is clear evidence that, in the context of other teams in the Scottish Premiership, it is a falsehood. Thanks. I'm not disputing what you've written btw just highlighting that those saying we aren't a long ball team aren't necessarily bashing the club but instead taken into account a larger viewpoint. Equally they might just be bashing the club. Personally, I don't think long ba is our issue, I think we try to pass it around but lack of movement and speed of thought are what prevent it working Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Beast Boy Posted June 10, 2019 Share Posted June 10, 2019 52 minutes ago, Inch Hearts said: So we didn’t pass along the back a lot before hoofing it forward? Is that seriously what you’re trying to say? There was zero creativity at all at times. Hoofing the ball from one side of the pitch to the other bypassing yards and yards is hoofball my friend and I care not a lot that our predictable brand of it included passing it around to players either who shat themselves to make a pass or just couldn’t do so. Anyway who cares it’s last season. Of course we did on occasion. In other occasions we played more progressive patient build up play. You clearly focus solely on the occasions where we did do that and ignore the ample occasions where we did not. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Absolute Scenes Posted June 10, 2019 Author Share Posted June 10, 2019 TRANSFERS Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Captain Sausage Posted June 10, 2019 Share Posted June 10, 2019 32 minutes ago, Taffin said: Thanks. I'm not disputing what you've written btw just highlighting that those saying we aren't a long ball team aren't necessarily bashing the club but instead taken into account a larger viewpoint. Equally they might just be bashing the club. Personally, I don't think long ba is our issue, I think we try to pass it around but lack of movement and speed of thought are what prevent it working Agree with you completely. Look at how differently we play with Naismith in the team as he can coordinate that movement and link the play. Hopefully recruiting a winger and striker, as well as retaining Naismith and Djoum will see us have the ability to play that style of football more effectively this season coming. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
JamboAl Posted June 10, 2019 Share Posted June 10, 2019 21 minutes ago, Absolute Scenes said: TRANSFERS I think you may have to start a separate thread although I've no doubt the CL haters will divert and pollute that as well/ Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Leveins Battalion Posted June 10, 2019 Share Posted June 10, 2019 Jamie Devitt ? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Newton51 Posted June 10, 2019 Share Posted June 10, 2019 3 minutes ago, Leveins Battalion said: Jamie Devitt ? Turned down a new contract at carlisle. Another midfielder tho don’t know much about him. 28. Any good? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Lord Beni of Gorgie Posted June 10, 2019 Share Posted June 10, 2019 2 minutes ago, Leveins Battalion said: Jamie Devitt ? Never seen the guy in my puff, but I would probably start from a level of low expectation. As I say with any name, and quite a few replies I got on Djoum were bang on, its how much of your budget you spend versus payback. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Leveins Battalion Posted June 10, 2019 Share Posted June 10, 2019 8 minutes ago, Sir Gio said: Never seen the guy in my puff, but I would probably start from a level of low expectation. As I say with any name, and quite a few replies I got on Djoum were bang on, its how much of your budget you spend versus payback. Never seen him but sure someone linked him with us a few months ago. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Absolute Scenes Posted June 10, 2019 Author Share Posted June 10, 2019 28 minutes ago, JamboAl said: I think you may have to start a separate thread although I've no doubt the CL haters will divert and pollute that as well/ its looking that way Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
TheOak88 Posted June 10, 2019 Share Posted June 10, 2019 Currently in talks with Leeds about getting Jay-Roy Grot on loan for next season. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Beast Boy Posted June 10, 2019 Share Posted June 10, 2019 2 minutes ago, TheOak88 said: Currently in talks with Leeds about getting Jay-Roy Grot on loan for next season. Dutch Surinamese striker? ? Last one of those we had did okay. ? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
TheOak88 Posted June 10, 2019 Share Posted June 10, 2019 1 minute ago, Icon of Symmetry said: Dutch Surinamese striker? ? Last one of those we had did okay. ? The guy that told me about it described him as a winger. But could be a striker as well, I had never heard of him until last week. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Bazzas right boot Posted June 10, 2019 Share Posted June 10, 2019 5 minutes ago, TheOak88 said: Currently in talks with Leeds about getting Jay-Roy Grot on loan for next season. Whatever happens, the names are going to be quality. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Beast Boy Posted June 10, 2019 Share Posted June 10, 2019 1 minute ago, TheOak88 said: The guy that told me about it described him as a winger. But could be a striker as well, I had never heard of him until last week. Don’t know much about him either mate. Looked him up after your posts. MDV must have been on the blower to his old gaffer. ? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Manny1874 Posted June 10, 2019 Share Posted June 10, 2019 6 minutes ago, TheOak88 said: The guy that told me about it described him as a winger. But could be a striker as well, I had never heard of him until last week. Wikipedia has him listed as a striker / right winger. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Mikey1874 Posted June 10, 2019 Share Posted June 10, 2019 15 minutes ago, TheOak88 said: Currently in talks with Leeds about getting Jay-Roy Grot on loan for next season. Reports on his performance are not good. Still maybe SPL is his level. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
TheOak88 Posted June 10, 2019 Share Posted June 10, 2019 3 minutes ago, Mikey1874 said: Reports on his performance are not good. Still maybe SPL is his level. Think he is still young and must have done something to get a fee and a 4 year deal at Leeds. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Leveins Battalion Posted June 10, 2019 Share Posted June 10, 2019 Afriye Acqua ? ...surely one of these is right. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
TheOak88 Posted June 10, 2019 Share Posted June 10, 2019 8 minutes ago, Manny1874 said: Wikipedia has him listed as a striker / right winger. Would be interesting to see which position he has predominantly played in. Might try and look up Leeds forum later when have time, to see what they think of him. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Bozi Posted June 10, 2019 Share Posted June 10, 2019 33 minutes ago, TheOak88 said: Currently in talks with Leeds about getting Jay-Roy Grot on loan for next season. I am groot Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Jammy T Posted June 10, 2019 Share Posted June 10, 2019 How do you play counter attack football if you have the ball in defence and all the outfield players are in front of you? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Bazzas right boot Posted June 10, 2019 Share Posted June 10, 2019 1 hour ago, Jammy T said: How do you play counter attack football if you have the ball in defence and all the outfield players are in front of you? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
HillmanHearts Posted June 10, 2019 Share Posted June 10, 2019 3 hours ago, TheOak88 said: Currently in talks with Leeds about getting Jay-Roy Grot on loan for next season. From the Wiki blurb, it sounds like he's had a rough time at Leeds but a decent loan spell last year back in Holland. Big athletic lad who can play through the middle or out wide. Dare I say : " would be a bit of a punt " Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
The Future's Maroon Posted June 10, 2019 Share Posted June 10, 2019 3 hours ago, Barack said: Sounds like an STD. ??? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Gershwin Posted June 10, 2019 Share Posted June 10, 2019 6 hours ago, Leveins Battalion said: Jamie Devitt ? Surely not? He looks like a Hibs' fan. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Vit1874 Posted June 10, 2019 Share Posted June 10, 2019 1 hour ago, Gershwin said: Surely not? He looks like a Hibs' fan. Just googled after reading this and Jesus ****ing Christ, you aren't wrong Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Franksluckypants Posted June 10, 2019 Share Posted June 10, 2019 14 minutes ago, Vit1874 said: Just googled after reading this and Jesus ****ing Christ, you aren't wrong If we were to sign him, the financial drop in 2020 calendar sales would need to be factored in...wonder what his burd looks like compared to Mrs Lafferty? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
jamboinglasgow Posted June 10, 2019 Share Posted June 10, 2019 https://footballleagueworld.co.uk/noel-whelan-issues-brutally-honest-verdict-on-leeds-united-player/ Noel Whelan saying that Leeds should just get rid of Jay-Roy Got as they need someone who will make an impact now. Also says Bielsa is going to give him a chance over the summer to prove himself. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
rudi must stay Posted June 10, 2019 Share Posted June 10, 2019 Grot looks fine to me. A handful and a physically imposing striker Hope it's true ? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Pasquale for King Posted June 11, 2019 Share Posted June 11, 2019 1 hour ago, Vit1874 said: Just googled after reading this and Jesus ****ing Christ, you aren't wrong Maybe it’s just his bad side? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Leveins Battalion Posted June 11, 2019 Share Posted June 11, 2019 5 hours ago, Pasquale for King said: Maybe it’s just his bad side? Ken Dodds long lost son? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Haken Posted June 11, 2019 Share Posted June 11, 2019 52 minutes ago, Leveins Battalion said: Ken Dodds long lost son? Can't see his tickling stick in that photo. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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