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1971fozzy

I get paid on 25th May and will renew that day. 

 

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Enzo Chiefo
18 minutes ago, luckydug said:

Oh yes 'Tommy McLean'

A classic example of be careful what you wish for.

McLean was the 1990s version of Steve Clarke.  Got his Motherwell team up to 2nd in the league iirc.

Came to us and was an absolute disaster. First Derby he was in charge and Hibs ended 22 in a row,dire football and emptied out the cup by Airdrie in a shameful SF performance.

Indeed be careful what you wish for.

 

So we just settle for Craig Levein then? One thing admin has done is drain any ambition from an element of our support. Settle for bog standard Craig Levein who is the 2000s veraion of....Craig Levein. I tell you what, our new managet will eventually leave or be sacked, as will his successor and so it goes on...that's football, players leave and managers leave. But the idea that you stick with a dullard like Levein just in case the next manager is not a success is pretty much why we have scraped into the top 6 behind Hibs and Killie for the last 2 seasons.

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graygo
Posted (edited)
23 minutes ago, Section Q said:

After the poor run of form the fans need a boost of some kind to rekindle interest in season tickets. Hopefully the outcome of the final provides it.

I see Celtic have a victory parade organised through the city streets an hour or so after the game. Slight touch of arrogance methinks....!

https://thecelticstar.com/celtic-plan-historic-25-may-victory-parade-through-glasgow/

 

We will have done the same.

 

Edit: Obviously not an hour after the game, that would be silly but certainly for the next day.

Edited by graygo

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Gilbert’s Fridge
1 hour ago, Nookie Bear said:

 

I have two words for Levein...^_^

What....... Love You ??

 

;)

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Pasquale for King
3 hours ago, Heartsofgold said:

 

We're not disagreeing with it however it's the 'cut your nose off to spite your face' withholding of club revenue that we don't agree with.  Holding back the money they need to sign players is self-destructive and there are better ways of getting our displeasure noticed.

Which are?

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Pasquale for King
15 minutes ago, 1971fozzy said:

I get paid on 25th May and will renew that day. 

 

Is the TO open that day or can you do it online? I think most will renew after the final no matter how it goes.

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Jodami
Posted (edited)
23 minutes ago, graygo said:

 

Did you miss the start of the season where our fully fit squad was flying at the top of the league?

This has been discussed at length in other threads. Having been at all of those games we toughed out away wins at Fir Park and Rugby Park and were downright lucky at East End in the League Cup. At home we fought well against Celtic and took our chance, beat poor Hamilton at Douglas Park (shocking first half) and St Mirren teams and had a turgid draw against Livingston. The most exciting game in that period was the 4-2 win in the League Cup against Motherwell. We played well that night but still only scraped home in the end. We were never really flying, we had momentum and we turned draws into wins. Unfortunately that momentum ended when Naismith went off in the semi final. Since then it has been poor or worse (Livi away for instance). 

Edited by Jodami

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1971fozzy
Posted (edited)
Just now, Pasquale for King said:

Is the TO open that day or can you do it online? I think most will renew after the final no matter how it goes.

I’ll just do it online, and the outcome of the final won’t impact that , it just suits my personal budget better

Edited by 1971fozzy

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Pasquale for King
29 minutes ago, graygo said:

 

Did you miss the start of the season where our fully fit squad was flying at the top of the league?

We didn’t have a fully fit squad, Djoum was out until after Berra came back and Brandon/Godhino were out too.Teams rarely have them these days at any point. 

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graygo
11 minutes ago, Jodami said:

This has been discussed at length in other threads. Having been at all of those games we toughed out away wins at Fir Park and Rugby Park and were downright lucky at East End in the League Cup. At home we fought well against Celtic and took our chance, beat poor Hamilton at Douglas Park (shocking first half) and St Mirren teams and had a turgid draw against Livingston. The most exciting game in that period was the 4-2 win in the League Cup against Motherwell. We played well that night but still only scraped home in the end. We were never really flying, we had momentum and we turned draws into wins. Unfortunately that momentum ended when Naismith went off in the semi final. Since then it has been poor or worse (Livi away for instance). 

 

That is the very definition of flying. Were we not showing enough flair or something?

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graygo
Just now, Pasquale for King said:

We didn’t have a fully fit squad, Djoum was out until after Berra came back and Brandon/Godhino were out too.Teams rarely have them these days at any point. 

 

Fair point.

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Jodami
15 minutes ago, graygo said:

 

That is the very definition of flying. Were we not showing enough flair or something?

The Burley team start to the season is the very definition of flying. Fantastic football and results. 

The whole season always tells the story though. 

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graygo
7 minutes ago, Jodami said:

The Burley team start to the season is the very definition of flying. Fantastic football and results. 

The whole season always tells the story though. 

So it is the lack of flair then? Must be because the results under Burley were pretty much the same as the start of this season.

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mitch41
1 hour ago, i wish jj was my dad said:

Tommy ****ing McLean was approached while big Sandy was in a job, Mr Jim was approached while Csaba was in a job and Mr Sergio was approached while Mr Jim was in a job. 

 

I suspect Levein will go after the final and if he does I hope the club have already sounded out his replacement. 

Oh yes scumbag owners do underhand things but we aren’t scum are we ?

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Enzo Chiefo
8 minutes ago, graygo said:

So it is the lack of flair then? Must be because the results under Burley were pretty much the same as the start of this season.

The results weren't the same, that's the point. Burley's vintage blew teams away in the first 20mins and often won comfortably, scoring goals in the process. Several of our early season victories were won by fine margins and could easily have gone the other way, as indeed they did, in the following round of fixtures. It was a great start to the season but our first big test as leaders,  before the injuries hit, was at Ibrox. We were 3 down within 20mins and the game was gone. 

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kimosavi

Mmmmm i was a definite non renewal but after speaking to craig on Sunday night, and he wins the cup i may just renew we'll see 

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mitch41

Ann Budge said Levein wasn’t fire-proof when she appointed him Manager while keeping him as Director of Football. After the Scottish Cup Final win or lose we’ll know if she meant it.

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Saughton Jambo
5 hours ago, Heartsofgold said:

 

Mate, I just parted with £1700+ for our 5 so I can sympathise.  It's hard but then watching the club being relegated and nearly going out of business was harder.  I sometimes think we expect too much of the club.  Things will always be up and down at our club but we need to keep buying the tickets or we truly will end up a bottom 6 club.

Hopefully I’m exempt from your criticism. I must have been the first to renew my ST’s as I renewed all mine (3) last year when I paid a full year in advance for season 2019/20. The club were badly needing funds and for the record, they will always badly need funds, or at least until the stand is paid for. Being in two semis and a final should’ve helped us considerably this year.

 

Yes the football is dire to watch at times and the manager may be bereft of ideas on occasion but it’s no excuse to not to renew. It’s a double edged sword, without funds we can’t sign better quality than we have. Most of the gripe is that money has been needlessly p155ed away down the drain on below average players who were given 2-3 year deals. For some who are struggling to pay for an ST then I can see their POV. Those who can afford it will renew I’ve no doubt. I still think we’ll have between 13k-14k this year. A cup final win may even push us over that figure. 

HHGH

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Lightbulb

Renewed last week... Mon the hearts😊

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Johnny Sandiego

A few posters are saying they think numbers will increase if Levein leaves, yet in the same post saying they have already renewed themselves. The vast majority of posters appear to have already renewed too, myself included.

 

Sounds like the speculation on other threads about thousands not renewing may be wide of the mark. 

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JamboGraham
Posted (edited)
29 minutes ago, Enzo Chiefo said:

The results weren't the same, that's the point. Burley's vintage blew teams away in the first 20mins and often won comfortably, scoring goals in the process. Several of our early season victories were won by fine margins and could easily have gone the other way, as indeed they did, in the following round of fixtures. It was a great start to the season but our first big test as leaders,  before the injuries hit, was at Ibrox. We were 3 down within 20mins and the game was gone. 

 

Hmmm...the opening round under Burley was W9 D2 L0, this year was W8, D2, L1. Burley was 26 goals, this year 19 goals. Burley was conceded 7, this year 7.

 

By any measure both are remarkable openings to a season, not just by our own historical standards but by any top tier side. By refusing to acknowledge that just seems rather desperate. Ironically by acknowledging the outstanding start and then contrasting it to results and displays in the 6.5 months since actually adds weight to your assessment that the manager should be dismissed. It is only the outstanding start and the points won in that period that allows any positive to be found in our overall league campaign.

 

Surely any credible argument is over the failure to build and capitalise on the first round of fixtures rather than bizarrely attempting to somehow discredit the start by arguing that it wasn't as good as Burley's?

Edited by JamboGraham
Updated goals scored, original was goal diff.

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graygo
34 minutes ago, Enzo Chiefo said:

The results weren't the same, that's the point. Burley's vintage blew teams away in the first 20mins and often won comfortably, scoring goals in the process. Several of our early season victories were won by fine margins and could easily have gone the other way, as indeed they did, in the following round of fixtures. It was a great start to the season but our first big test as leaders,  before the injuries hit, was at Ibrox. We were 3 down within 20mins and the game was gone. 

 

The results as in win, lose or draw were very similar.

I'm not arguing that the football (flair) wasn't better under Burley, just trying to clarify that that was the only difference.

By the way our first big test was against Celtic and we passed that test.

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Artful Dodger
Posted (edited)

A Hearts supporter not renewing for reasons that are not attached to finances and circumstances isn't a Hearts supporter.

I whole heartedly apologize for feeling that way but its how I feel.

 

Am I bad ?

Edited by Artful Dodger

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portobellojambo1
2 minutes ago, Artful Dodger said:

A Hearts supporter not renewing for reasons attached to finances and circumstances isn't a Hearts supporter.

I whole heartedly apologize for feeling that way but its how I feel.

 

Am I bad ?

 

I've not read through the thread but I don't know if I'm misunderstanding what you are saying above. I'm guessing that there are a few HMFC fans who have said their personal circumstances have changed and finances now available to them mean they have been unable to renew. But you are saying such people aren't really HMFC fans anyway. Is that about the gist of it, i.e. that if someone simply cannot afford to renew this season they were never an HMFC fan anyway.

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Whatever

Renewed at the weekend. 🇱🇻🇱🇻🇱🇻

 

Simply because supporting the club is in my blood. If I had chosen not to renew every time I wasn’t particularly happy with what was happening on the park, I wouldn’t have seen much of Hearts since I first started following the club in 1983.

 

One thing I do know following this club is good things often happen when they are least expected and we’re often terrible when I think we’re set up to do well.

 

Can’t wait for the cup final, a long Summer celebrating or relaxing and then come the end of July being ready to go again.

 

In a years time we’ll be ready to hand over to FOH, the stand rebuild will be complete, turnover will be up and we’ll be in a fantastic place.

 

Before that happens, in typical Hearts fashion, we may just surprise a few people.

 

Hearts, Hearts, glorious Hearts.

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Enzo Chiefo
12 minutes ago, graygo said:

 

The results as in win, lose or draw were very similar.

I'm not arguing that the football (flair) wasn't better under Burley, just trying to clarify that that was the only difference.

By the way our first big test was against Celtic and we passed that test.

Yes, fair point. I was going to mention the Celtic game but I was meaning the first test of our title challenge,  as it was described at the time. But, yes, of course the Celtic game was our first test which we did well to pass.

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Jodami
8 minutes ago, Artful Dodger said:

A Hearts supporter not renewing for reasons attached to finances and circumstances isn't a Hearts supporter.

I whole heartedly apologize for feeling that way but its how I feel.

 

Am I bad ?

You're always bad, that's your shtick! 

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innerjambo
44 minutes ago, kimosavi said:

Mmmmm i was a definite non renewal but after speaking to craig on Sunday night, and he wins the cup i may just renew we'll see 

 

Why, did he say something that impressed you? 

Like, he realises we're crap.

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soonbe110
4 hours ago, JamboGraham said:

I often wonder if many of us, especially me, read too much into season tickets? Of course they are vitally important but they seem to have taken on a new meaning in recent seasons. First they were generally a badge of honour and now increasingly they are being billed as a personal referendum between individual supporter and the club.

 

Ultimately though a season ticket is simply a way of buying discounted entry to Tynecastle by paying up front. This season many will renew and many won't renew, some will purchase for the first time and others will have purchased for the last time. So far so same as every other season.

 

The question as ever comes down to the what type of sales are expected, hoped for, budgeted, etc. (all of these can be very different figures). We simply don't know how the board will react to variations.

 

I'm not for a moment saying that I don't believe the rumours of low sales, quite the opposite in fact. I can include myself in the group that has yet to renew. Why would I pay early for something that I don't need until August when there is no downside to doing so? Why would I pay all upfront when I have no idea of what type of finance offer might be available? I also discussed in great detail with the person that I attend matches with about sharing a ticket as between us we miss a number of matches each season; buy one between us and spot buy for matches when we are both going? Only half of our ST matches this year were Saturday afternoon matches and with the extra capacity the risk of missing out is minimal?

 

In the recent seasons we have moved up and down between 13k and 14k ST holders. Movement of about 7-8%. Right now we are just over 13k. So 7-8% movement isn't unprecedented.

 

I suppose what I am saying is 'renew' or 'don't renew', 'buy' or 'don't buy'. It's a personal choice for all us for many different reasons, it's certainly not a cause or a movement. Reduced season ticket holder numbers is not a guarantee of change or improvement, nor is increased season ticket holders a guarantee of change or improvement. We all make the choice that is right for us, if you feel uncomfortable with your choice then perhaps you are making the wrong one?

Correct, season ticket income is purely a cash flow benefit for clubs to cover the summer months as well as giving a guaranteed income level with walkups the extra on top. In our case with the new stand we sell the Roseburn to the away team for cat A games so that income is ‘ guaranteed’. We have roughly 15.5-16k of seats available for home fans at Cat A games and about 1-1.5k more for non cat A games. If we assume a continuation (some will argue a big assumption but it’s not unrealistic) of sell outs for cat A games, and 16k for the other home games then our income is going to be largely driven by walkups rather than season tickets. Season ticket discount is something like 25-30% so in reality the club makes significantly more money with 10k season tickets and 5k walkups than it does with 14k season tickets and 1k walk-ups. The new stand has made the former a much more likely scenario going forward. Total season tickets sold isn’t really a good indicator of anything other than an indication of those who want to keep their seats, always go to Hearts games etc. 

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soonbe110
4 hours ago, mitch41 said:

you can't approach another manager while Levein is still Hearts manager silly.

You can have an idea of who you want but after you see the high calibre of 

candidates who would want the Hearts job it would change when there is 

a vacancy.

What world do you live in? Of course you can, happens all the time. Sometimes there’s less than 24 hours between a manger being sacked and the next one hired. Agents do all the work these days. 

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i wish jj was my dad
56 minutes ago, mitch41 said:

Oh yes scumbag owners do underhand things but we aren’t scum are we ?

No we are not. But you don't need to be underhand to approach people.  

 

Not that being ethical has won AB much credit from this board or the media. 

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soonbe110
3 hours ago, jambonian said:

And this is another problem. Levein wouldn't take anyone on as manager unless they were willing to go along with his system, not many would as they would want their own coaches and training methods, not his. And why should they? It's not been working.

Did Craig  tell you that? 

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soonbe110
3 hours ago, jambonian said:

Cathro was untried. He was a mistake right from the off. When Neilson left, that was the time to bring in an experienced manager. There are, and will be plenty managers out there looking for a club. We need to find the right one, just like Killie did when they got rid of Lee McCulloch or even Hibs, when they knew the Lennon tenure was getting stale. My problem in finding the right one is that if Levein stays on as DoF then he will only want someone who is willing to work under his system, a system that hasn't worked since 2016. And what manager in his right mind would want that hanging over him? If it is the case that Levein would be the one searching then we'd be as well just to stay as we are and carry on in mid-table obscurity.

80%ish on here were happy with his appointment at the time. If you were one of the 20% I congratulate you  on your foresight. 

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Enzo Chiefo
36 minutes ago, JamboGraham said:

 

Hmmm...the opening round under Burley was W9 D2 L0, this year was W8, D2, L1. Burley was 26 goals, this year 19 goals. Burley was conceded 7, this year 7.

 

By any measure both are remarkable openings to a season, not just by our own historical standards but by any top tier side. By refusing to acknowledge that just seems rather desperate. Ironically by acknowledging the outstanding start and then contrasting it to results and displays in the 6.5 months since actually adds weight to your assessment that the manager should be dismissed. It is only the outstanding start and the points won in that period that allows any positive to be found in our overall league campaign.

 

Surely any credible argument is over the failure to build and capitalise on the first round of fixtures rather than bizarrely attempting to somehow discredit the start by arguing that it wasn't as good as Burley's?

Tbh Graham, I didn't realise we had scored 19 goals, obviously nearly one a game less than Burley's team, but still impressive. So, yes, I accept your point that both were great starts to the season. As you say, the results since are , for me, justification to dismiss the manager. 22 goals in the following 28 games is abysmal. 

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soonbe110
2 hours ago, luckydug said:

Oh yes 'Tommy McLean'

A classic example of be careful what you wish for.

McLean was the 1990s version of Steve Clarke.  Got his Motherwell team up to 2nd in the league iirc.

Came to us and was an absolute disaster. First Derby he was in charge and Hibs ended 22 in a row,dire football and emptied out the cup by Airdrie in a shameful SF performance.

Indeed be careful what you wish for.

 

Yes, and we hired an up and coming manager from England that eventually went pear -shaped as well. Think his name was Jordan. 

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soonbe110
2 hours ago, Cruyff Turn said:

No one is saying boycott Tynie but I think it’s fair not to renew if you don’t like what’s happening. Those who don’t renew i’d imagine will just pick and choose games, they are still attending, still supporting the club but at the same time are sending a message to the board that change is needed. Can’t see anything wrong with that and it certainly isn’t going to harm the club. 

Agreed. Everybody makes their own call.  I stopped in the early 80’s due to young family and Forfar. Three years later I was back with my son and it’s still going today. 

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soonbe110
1 hour ago, Jodami said:

The Burley team start to the season is the very definition of flying. Fantastic football and results. 

The whole season always tells the story though. 

Where  did Burnley’s team finish? 

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soonbe110
48 minutes ago, JamboGraham said:

 

Hmmm...the opening round under Burley was W9 D2 L0, this year was W8, D2, L1. Burley was 26 goals, this year 19 goals. Burley was conceded 7, this year 7.

 

By any measure both are remarkable openings to a season, not just by our own historical standards but by any top tier side. By refusing to acknowledge that just seems rather desperate. Ironically by acknowledging the outstanding start and then contrasting it to results and displays in the 6.5 months since actually adds weight to your assessment that the manager should be dismissed. It is only the outstanding start and the points won in that period that allows any positive to be found in our overall league campaign.

 

Surely any credible argument is over the failure to build and capitalise on the first round of fixtures rather than bizarrely attempting to somehow discredit the start by arguing that it wasn't as good as Burley's?

Add in that Burleys team had Champions League and Euro winners playing for it. 

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Jodami
2 minutes ago, soonbe110 said:

Where  did Burnley’s team finish? 

Second and we won the cup. 

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luckydug
26 minutes ago, Artful Dodger said:

A Hearts supporter not renewing for reasons that are not attached to finances and circumstances isn't a Hearts supporter.

I whole heartedly apologize for feeling that way but its how I feel.

 

Am I bad ?

No you are not.

It's how I feel as well.

Never mind season tickets there are actually posters on here who refuse to attend the cup final because they think we will get beat.

Shouldn't even have the right to post on a Hearts fans forum feckin interlopers.

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soonbe110
23 minutes ago, Enzo Chiefo said:

Yes, fair point. I was going to mention the Celtic game but I was meaning the first test of our title challenge,  as it was described at the time. But, yes, of course the Celtic game was our first test which we did well to pass.

And Burleys  team didn’t and the rot set in to the Burley/Vlad relationship. 

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Enzo Chiefo
2 minutes ago, soonbe110 said:

And Burleys  team didn’t and the rot set in to the Burley/Vlad relationship. 

Wouldn't Craig Levein love to be able to go to Parkhead and "only" get a point.

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soonbe110
3 minutes ago, Jodami said:

Second and we won the cup. 

I can’t find Burleys name on the roll of honour for Hearts cup-winning managers. 

My point was really getting at you can’t really really use a 9 game management cameo as a comparison for anything especially given we were illegally signing players that were the best quality we have had in last 30-40 years. 

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luckydug
9 minutes ago, soonbe110 said:

Yes, and we hired an up and coming manager from England that eventually went pear -shaped as well. Think his name was Jordan. 

Just goes to show there are no garauntees.  

Changing manager is a risky business not to be done lightly.

In our case it's likely to mean a complete overhaul of our coaching staff with the obvious cost implications which would affect our budget greatly.

Who would oversee this revolution ?

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i wish jj was my dad
6 minutes ago, soonbe110 said:

Yes, and we hired an up and coming manager from England that eventually went pear -shaped as well. Think his name was Jordan. 

The next big thing at the time as well. TBF his middle season started like a train but the wheels came off a bit when we had a few injuries,  his final season rivalled Alex Miller for negativity and the players hated him by all accounts.

 

While I think Levein will go in the summer any appointment is a risk so we need to mske the right call. 

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i wish jj was my dad
2 minutes ago, Enzo Chiefo said:

Wouldn't Craig Levein love to be able to go to Parkhead and "only" get a point.

He'd also love to have Burley's budget too. 

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soonbe110
8 minutes ago, Jodami said:

Second and we won the cup. 

Valdas was the manager that won the cup in 2006 with Vlads fraudulently purchased squad. 

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soonbe110
4 minutes ago, Enzo Chiefo said:

Wouldn't Craig Levein love to be able to go to Parkhead and "only" get a point.

Not the point really.  You were comparing the two eras. This seasons team passed their first real test, Burleys didn’t. Could/should have blown Celtic away in 2005. 

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Enzo Chiefo
2 minutes ago, i wish jj was my dad said:

He'd also love to have Burley's budget too. 

And his tactical nous and man management skills presumably 

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Enzo Chiefo
Just now, soonbe110 said:

Not the point really.  You were comparing the two eras. This seasons team passed their first real test, Burleys didn’t. Could/should have blown Celtic away in 2005. 

You are comparing one single game  not an era. 71 goals scored, 31 conceded, GD +40, 2nd place and a Scottish Cup. Best leave it there I tbink.

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