Season Ticket Sales - Half seasons on sale (title updated)

[JamboGraham]

Interesting to read opinions and insight from people directly involved in the construction industry.

 

That said if I had chosen the correct 6 numbers during the Vlad era I could possibly have been our Ann Budge. Given that I would have brought no relevant experience I would probably have done exactly the same thing...

 

Hired the same architect that delivered the rest of the ground, utilised a family member who works in construction and probably hired someone who knows about football to take care of that for me as well...

 

Perhaps not the best choices in hindsight but entirely understandable.

[Jambo-Fox]

Needed people that had been to many stadiums ... then they would have asked the correct questions; toilets, directors box, lounges, access to & from etc

 

There are some basic things missing in the new stand that any real football regular traveller & attender would have spotted!

 

Anyway it’s done now. I’m sure it will evolve into a fantastic asset over the next few years!

[portobellojambo1]

1 hour ago, JamboGraham said:

Interesting to read opinions and insight from people directly involved in the construction industry.

 

That said if I had chosen the correct 6 numbers during the Vlad era I could possibly have been our Ann Budge. Given that I would have brought no relevant experience I would probably have done exactly the same thing...

 

Hired the same architect that delivered the rest of the ground, utilised a family member who works in construction and probably hired someone who knows about football to take care of that for me as well...

 

Perhaps not the best choices in hindsight but entirely understandable.

 

The part I've always struggled with was the removal of Clydesdale, or at least the reasons why he was removed. He, or his company, was/were the architects and one can only assume I guess that they put together a construction based on the instructions given to them. Although it is in the past now I'd always wondered why they were dismissed if he/they built what they were asked to do yet nobody ever stood up and said they gave them the wrong instructions from outset.

 

EDIT - I don't know if the subsequent post by Jambo Fox covers what my thoughts were when posting. It suggest that if I, for example, wanted architects to design a house for me, I could then dismiss them and possibly ask for compensation if on completion of their build I then said I didn't like it, even if it reflected what I'd told them to build

.

Edited May 18, 2019 by portobellojambo1

[Lfhearts]

Fag packet plans quite rightly did not appeal to the queen of hearts.

[Forever Hearts]

4 minutes ago, Lfhearts said:

Fag packet plans quite rightly did not appeal to the queen of hearts.

Going by the looks of it they certainly did appeal to her. 

[Unknown user]

7 minutes ago, portobellojambo1 said:

 

The part I've always struggled with was the removal of Clydesdale, or at least the reasons why he was removed. He, or his company, was/were the architects and one can only assume I guess that they put together a construction based on the instructions given to them. Although it is in the past now I'd always wondered why they were dismissed if he/they built what they were asked to do yet nobody ever stood up and said they gave them the wrong instructions from outset.

 

EDIT - I don't know if the subsequent post by Jambo Fox covers what my thoughts were when posting. It suggest that if I, for example, wanted architects to design a house for me, I could then dismiss them and possibly ask for compensation if on completion of their build I then said I didn't like it, even if it reflected what I'd told them to build

.

 

This bothers me too, there must have been some substantial issue to justify replacing the architect mid-build, I'd love to know what it was.

[davemclaren]

17 minutes ago, portobellojambo1 said:

 

The part I've always struggled with was the removal of Clydesdale, or at least the reasons why he was removed. He, or his company, was/were the architects and one can only assume I guess that they put together a construction based on the instructions given to them. Although it is in the past now I'd always wondered why they were dismissed if he/they built what they were asked to do yet nobody ever stood up and said they gave them the wrong instructions from outset.

 

EDIT - I don't know if the subsequent post by Jambo Fox covers what my thoughts were when posting. It suggest that if I, for example, wanted architects to design a house for me, I could then dismiss them and possibly ask for compensation if on completion of their build I then said I didn't like it, even if it reflected what I'd told them to build

.

Depending on the contract I imagine you could dismiss them at any point. I’ve no idea what the architect’s role was during the actual construction phase. 

[portobellojambo1]

32 minutes ago, Smithee said:

 

This bothers me too, there must have been some substantial issue to justify replacing the architect mid-build, I'd love to know what it was.

 

Given what the original cost was estimated at/deemed to be (whichever is nearest the truth) the only thing that crossed my mind was that Clydesdale were asked to put together something where corners were being cut, presumably on instruction, to make sure the initial estimate/price was achieved, and as things went on it became apparent  there would be problems. The only thing I'd ever really heard discussed, mainly on here, was that there were toilets which were in the wrong place, it had to be more substantial than that.

[Jambo-Fox]

47 minutes ago, Smithee said:

 

This bothers me too, there must have been some substantial issue to justify replacing the architect mid-build, I'd love to know what it was.

My guess is that the brief was;

 

1. Design a stand that matches the other three already built.

 

And

 

2. Design a facility that has lounges and a restaurant, dressing rooms, bar, club

shop & ticket office etc.

 

.... and

 

....... the assumption was that they would be compatible and fully connected & integrated but ..... that was not stated so the architect took the brief but never questioned it ...

 

....... and the stand was was built and the ‘office block’ immediately behind it was built but they were not seamlessly connected!

 

But in time it will be sorted and become a fantastic facility that will generate income that will be invested to make Hearts the greatest team they Scotland has ever seen!! 

[Bull's-eye]

Micro managers on the internet that in most cases couldn't organise a piss up in a brewery hypothetically criticising the club they deem to support a week before a massive game.

 

Ffs. 

[Forever Hearts]

10 minutes ago, Artful Dodger said:

Micro managers on the internet that in most cases couldn't organise a piss up in a brewery hypothetically criticising the club they deem to support a week before a massive game.

 

Ffs. 

Just you keep happy clapping. ?

[Bull's-eye]

1 minute ago, Forever Hearts said:

Just you keep happy clapping. ?

 

You keep howling at the moon.

[Unknown user]

12 minutes ago, Artful Dodger said:

Micro managers on the internet that in most cases couldn't organise a piss up in a brewery hypothetically criticising the club they deem to support a week before a massive game.

 

Ffs. 

Bit snidey, you don't need to agree but no need for that. 

 

I'm an Ann fan, but she came in promising transparency and that simply hasn't happened with this build which is currently 50% over budget and with an unknown amount still to be spent. 

Given our financial history I think it'd be crazy if people weren't questioning it.

[Enzo Chiefo]

26 minutes ago, Artful Dodger said:

Micro managers on the internet that in most cases couldn't organise a piss up in a brewery hypothetically criticising the club they deem to support a week before a massive game.

 

Ffs. 

Do you deliberately refuse to acknowledge, recognise or accept that "the club" can ever be at fault with anything on or off field? Or are you just being obtuse?  Holding back fans in order to allow directors to leave the building is a severe design fault, as is expecting corporate guests , opposition managers etc to cross the concourse and the proletariat,  in order to reach their seats. 

[Bull's-eye]

7 minutes ago, Smithee said:

Bit snidey, you don't need to agree but no need for that. 

 

I'm an Ann fan, but she came in promising transparency and that simply hasn't happened with this build which is currently 50% over budget and with an unknown amount still to be spent. 

Given our financial history I think it'd be crazy if people weren't questioning it.

 

I think the issues with the build have in the main been highlighted and explained. 

If not then a strategic method has been inforced when dealing with the media. 

All acceptable imo.

 

Won't stop the internet micromanagement lunatics either way, nothing will.

[Bull's-eye]

2 minutes ago, Enzo Chiefo said:

Do you deliberately refuse to acknowledge, recognise or accept that "the club" can ever be at fault with anything on or off field? Or are you just being obtuse?  Holding back fans in order to allow directors to leave the building is a severe design fault, as is expecting corporate guests , opposition managers etc to cross the concourse and the proletariat,  in order to reach their 

 

My seat it is in the PR section so I see the bottleneck situation every game, it doesn't bother me. 

Tynecastle is easy to get in and out off. 

[Enzo Chiefo]

Just now, Artful Dodger said:

 

My seat it is in the PR section so I see the bottleneck situation every game, it doesn't bother me. 

Tynecastle is easy to get in and out off. 

Easier just to stay away completely.  I find that works better for me.

[Bull's-eye]

Just now, Enzo Chiefo said:

Easier just to stay away completely.  I find that works better for me.

 

Quite agree and I sincerely hope it continues.

 

 

[Enzo Chiefo]

Just now, Artful Dodger said:

 

Quite agree and I sincerely hope it continues.

 

 

It will do, if AB's comments today are anything to go by. Still, she loses, not me.

[portobellojambo1]

40 minutes ago, Artful Dodger said:

Micro managers on the internet that in most cases couldn't organise a piss up in a brewery hypothetically criticising the club they deem to support a week before a massive game.

 

Ffs. 

 

 

What impact do you think a couple of thoughts/questions on why the original architects may have been changed mid build could possibly have on the build up to a game next week.

[Bull's-eye]

3 minutes ago, Enzo Chiefo said:

It will do, if AB's comments today are anything to go by. Still, she loses, not me.

 

You're so right Enzo.

 

Sleep well pal.

[Forever Hearts]

Just now, portobellojambo1 said:

 

 

What impact do you think a couple of thoughts/questions on why the original architects may have been changed mid build could possibly have on the build up to a game next week.

Zero. He's just playing up to his happy clapping image. 

[Bull's-eye]

1 minute ago, portobellojambo1 said:

 

 

What impact do you think a couple of thoughts/questions on why the original architects may have been changed mid build could possibly have on the build up to a game next week.

 

Negativity breeds negativity. 

 

Question what you like in 7 days time.

[RENE]

And here's me thinking this thread was about season tickets or is that under a thread about the main stand?

[Unknown user]

11 minutes ago, Artful Dodger said:

 

I think the issues with the build have in the main been highlighted and explained. 

If not then a strategic method has been inforced when dealing with the media. 

All acceptable imo.

 

Won't stop the internet micromanagement lunatics either way, nothing will.

 

So why was Clydesdale replaced? Why are we 50% over budget and counting? Why is the quality of finish lacking? How much will the final total be and when will it be finished?

 

These are reasonable questions that all hearts fans should be asking, or at least respecting, and it does my head in that people get pissy about it.

[portobellojambo1]

Just now, Artful Dodger said:

 

Negativity breeds negativity. 

 

Question what you like in 7 days time.

 

Stop talking pish, where from a question such as was it ever made clear why we changed architects do you somehow manage to derive negativity.

[Bull's-eye]

2 minutes ago, Smithee said:

 

So why was Clydesdale replaced? Why are we 50% over budget and counting? Why is the quality of finish lacking? How much will the final total be and when will it be finished?

 

These are reasonable questions that all hearts fans should be asking, or at least respecting, and it does my head in that people get pissy about it.

 

Perhaps because you want to micromanage from your sofa, I'm not going to speculate but it's rather obvious the supporters like and trust Mrs Budge to do the right thing for the club. 

And will of course continue to do so.

[jamtartan74]

7 minutes ago, RENE said:

And here's me thinking this thread was about season tickets or is that under a thread about the main stand?

? I genuinely forgot what thread it was I was on after reading the last couple of pages until you mentioned season tickets ? good old kickback ?

[Bull's-eye]

5 minutes ago, portobellojambo1 said:

 

Stop talking pish, where from a question such as was it ever made clear why we changed architects do you somehow manage to derive negativity.

 

Because your being negative and without any knowledge of the facts see it as such. 

You always point out the negatives, its just the way you are. 

 

No biggy.

[Enzo Chiefo]

3 minutes ago, Artful Dodger said:

 

Because your being negative and without any knowledge of the facts see it as such. 

You always point out the negatives, its just the way you are. 

 

No biggy.

On the contrary,  I was going to say that I have never, ever seen PJ1 post anything negative. I know him personally and, as someone, he not me, that goes home and away every week, and has done for years, perhaps you should respect his opinion instead of slavering club sponsored pish. 

[Unknown user]

2 minutes ago, Artful Dodger said:

 

Perhaps because you want to micromanage from your sofa, I'm not going to speculate but it's rather obvious the supporters like and trust Mrs Budge to do the right thing for the club. 

And will of course continue to do so.

 

Micromanage : to manage especially with excessive control or attention to details.

 

I didn't manage the project, micro or otherwise, no interest in doing so either. But I do want to know what's happened on a number of issues. If you don't, that's fine, but I won't apologise for wanting to know why we're millions over budget and counting, not to mention all the other stuff. 

 

I trust Budge to mean well but that's a million miles away from blind trust.

 

 

[luckydug]

33 minutes ago, Enzo Chiefo said:

Easier just to stay away completely.  I find that works better for me.

If thats the case why are you bothered ?

Why do you spend your time talking about a team and a stadium you prefer not to attend ?

[portobellojambo1]

2 minutes ago, Artful Dodger said:

 

Because your being negative and without any knowledge of the facts see it as such. 

You always point out the negatives, its just the way you are. 

 

No biggy.

 

I'll ask again, as it seems English may not be your mother tongue. Where in a question "was it ever made clear why the club changed architects" are you interpreting that as negativity. It is a question which has one of two answers, those being no it wasn't ever announced or yes it was and the reason was ....... It was actually a very simple point I raised as part of what has been getting discussed recently on this thread (although I admit, as someone only recently pointed out, it is another line of discussion which in reality is light years away from the actual thread title).

 

I have no knowledge of why the architects were changed and to say so doesn't represent negativity, it represents a fact. And in normal circumstances posing such questions often leads to someone who does know then providing an appropriate answer.

[SMJ_1874]

4 minutes ago, Enzo Chiefo said:

On the contrary,  I was going to say that I have never, ever seen PJ1 post anything negative. I know him personally and, as someone, he not me, that goes home and away every week, and has done for years, perhaps you should respect his opinion instead of slavering club sponsored pish. 

PJ1 always talks sense imo. After the mis management of the club and it’s funds, right back to the piemans days then I think we as supporters, foh subscribers, sponsors, benefactors and genuine fans should be asking why the stand has gone so horribly over budget? This impacts our playing squad and £7M could give us a strong squad for years to come. It’s half our annual turnover ffs. Questioning why should have no impact on the final in 7 days time. The happy clapper could well be  the clubs spin doctor for all we know. If anyone thinks there’s nothing wrong with the overspend then maybe their lack of concern says it all really.

[Enzo Chiefo]

9 minutes ago, luckydug said:

If thats the case why are you bothered ?

Why do you spend your time talking about a team and a stadium you prefer not to attend ?

Because I've been a supporter for 41 years. The late Willie Bauld and Jim Cruikshank didn't return to Tynecastle because of disagreements with the club, so don't fall into the trap of thinking that only those who turn up every week matter.

[SMJ_1874]

4 minutes ago, portobellojambo1 said:

 

I'll ask again, as it seems English may not be your mother tongue. Where in a question "was it ever made clear why the club changed architects" are you interpreting that as negativity. It is a question which has one of two answers, those being no it wasn't ever announced or yes it was and the reason was ....... It was actually a very simple point I raised as part of what has been getting discussed recently on this thread (although I admit, as someone only recently pointed out, it is another line of discussion which in reality is light years away from the actual thread title).

 

I have no knowledge of why the architects were changed and to say so doesn't represent negativity, it represents a fact. And in normal circumstances posing such questions often leads to someone who does know then providing an appropriate answer.

He was sacked when it became apparent that too many of the things that were in the initial plans weren’t going to work. Lack of female toilets, concourse issues, and the final straw was the castle view restaurant that was never going to work.  No one ever questioned JC’s plans as the presentation was given to people without basic construction knowledge. It was a case of, yup we are happy with this and as it all made sense on paper then the start button was pushed.

 

Why in this day and age of 3D imagery, was this never pursued as it would’ve highlighted the basic flaws? Never mind the technical feck ups along the way. We should’ve waited a year and with more funding in place before we started, then and a more competent architect would’ve delivered a better product. We jumped in with both feet far too early. A bit like some of our Cathro signings on 3 year deals I suspect 

[Enzo Chiefo]

8 minutes ago, Saughton Jambo said:

PJ1 always talks sense imo. After the mis management of the club and it’s funds, right back to the piemans days then I think we as supporters, foh subscribers, sponsors, benefactors and genuine fans should be asking why the stand has gone so horribly over budget? This impacts our playing squad and £7M could give us a strong squad for years to come. It’s half our annual turnover ffs. Questioning why should have no impact on the final in 7 days time. The happy clapper could well be  the clubs spin doctor for all we know. If anyone thinks there’s nothing wrong with the overspend then maybe their lack of concern says it all really.

Well said Saughton. Although AB is personally picking up the tab for the severe overspend,  questions are entitled to be asked.

[jamtartan74]

4 minutes ago, Saughton Jambo said:

He was sacked when it became apparent that too many of the things that were in the initial plans weren’t going to work. Lack of female toilets, concourse issues, and the final straw was the castle view restaurant that was never going to work.  No one ever questioned JC’s plans as the presentation was given to people without basic construction knowledge. It was a case of, yup we are happy with this and as it all made sense on paper then the start button was pushed.

 

Why in this day and age of 3D imagery, was this never pursued as it would’ve highlighted the basic flaws? Never mind the technical feck ups along the way. We should’ve waited a year and with more funding in place before we started, then and a more competent architect would’ve delivered a better product. We jumped in with both feet far too early. A bit like some of our Cathro signings on 3 year deals I suspect 

We were forced to act quickly due to the council building the nursery or something were we not? We had to do it when we did or not at all

if I remember correctly ?

[portobellojambo1]

1 minute ago, Saughton Jambo said:

He was sacked when it became apparent that too many of the things that were in the initial plans weren’t going to work. Lack of female toilets, concourse issues, and the final straw was the castle view restaurant that was never going to work.  No one ever questioned JC’s plans as the presentation was given to people without basic construction knowledge. It was a case of, yup we are happy with this and as it all made sense on paper then the start button was pushed.

 

Why in this day and age of 3D imagery, was this never pursued as it would’ve highlighted the basic flaws? Never mind the technical feck ups along the way. We should’ve waited a year and with more funding in place before we started, then and a more competent architect would’ve delivered a better product. We jumped in with both feet far too early. A bit like some of our Cathro signings on 3 year deals I suspect 

 

Thank you for your reply, was information I was unaware of, hence my question/input a number of posts back (which I thought might generate a reply from someone who did know). Do I have any plans to now use the information, no, it was a simple question on a fecking football forum which caused one member to lose their shit a bit. Time for bed me thinks, got to get up early and head off to Parkhead tomorrow.

[Unknown user]

3 minutes ago, Saughton Jambo said:

PJ1 always talks sense imo. After the mis management of the club and it’s funds, right back to the piemans days then I think we as supporters, foh subscribers, sponsors, benefactors and genuine fans should be asking why the stand has gone so horribly over budget? This impacts our playing squad and £7M could give us a strong squad for years to come. It’s half our annual turnover ffs. Questioning why should have no impact on the final in 7 days time. The happy clapper could well be  the clubs spin doctor for all we know. If anyone thinks there’s nothing wrong with the overspend then maybe their lack of concern says it all really.

 

If I've learned one thing from our travails it's that we're the last line of defence. It's not so much that we have the right to ask, the way I see it we have an obligation to question what's going on, especially financially.

How much over budget does it need to get before we stop dismissing it and stop assuming nothing can go wrong because we have a good egg in charge?

 

1 minute ago, Enzo Chiefo said:

Well said Saughton. Although AB is personally picking up the tab for the severe overspend,  questions are entitled to be asked.

 

I've had PMs from more than one poster that I'd trust saying that the overspend is being covered, either by budge or by the STC donator. 

A PM'd rumour doesn't cut it though (no offence to those guys), Budge promised transparency, and without it I'm nervous as hell about the situation.

[Jambo-Fox]

10 minutes ago, Enzo Chiefo said:

Well said Saughton. Although AB is personally picking up the tab for the severe overspend,  questions are entitled to be asked.

Ann Budge what a HEARTS LEGEND - she saved the club, she makes good on her mistakes, she does her best .... one of the best football club owners in Britain - we MUST never forget ...

[Unknown user]

Just now, Jambo-Fox said:

Ann Budge what a HEARTS LEGEND - she saved the club, she makes good on her mistakes, she does her best .... one of the best football club owners in Britain - we MUST never forget ...

 

No one doubts she's well intentioned but blind faith is ******* stupid given our history. 

[Bull's-eye]

2 minutes ago, Smithee said:

 

No one doubts she's well intentioned but blind faith is ******* stupid given our history. 

 

Our history of financial mismanagement and lunacy vs the opposite ?

 

Well intentioned ?

 

Ffs. 

[Bull's-eye]

2 minutes ago, Smithee said:

 

No one doubts she's well intentioned but blind faith is ******* stupid given our history. 

 

Our history of financial mismanagement and lunacy vs the opposite ?

 

Well intentioned ?

 

Ffs. 

[Jambo-Fox]

3 minutes ago, Smithee said:

 

No one doubts she's well intentioned but blind faith is ******* stupid given our history. 

Back to back cup wins 2019 & 2020 will do me ..........

[Jambo-Fox]

Just now, Artful Dodger said:

 

Our history of financial mismanagement and lunacy vs the opposite ?

 

Well intentioned ?

 

Ffs. 

What comes first .... get it right off the pitch or on the pitch??

 

 

 I’d suggest the former is a prerequisite for the latter!

 

In Ann I totally trust 100%+ (and more)!

[Unknown user]

 

2 minutes ago, Jambo-Fox said:

Back to back cup wins 2019 & 2020 will do me ..........

 

I'll certainly drink to that

[Jambo-Fox]

5 minutes ago, Artful Dodger said:

 

Our history of financial mismanagement and lunacy vs the opposite ?

 

Well intentioned ?

 

Ffs. 

Would Smithee like a ‘Bolton type’ owner??

 

There are loads of bad owners around but very few decent and honourable ones - we have one - celebrate ......

Edited May 18, 2019 by Jambo-Fox

[Unknown user]

9 minutes ago, Jambo-Fox said:

Would Smithee like a ‘Bolton type’ owner??

 

There are loads of bad owners around but very few decent and honourable ones - we have one - celebrate ......

 

What are you on about?

We've got millions of pounds to find. If someone is truly covering it then magic, but until that's been officially announced my arse is 5p 50p.

[jambocub]

5 hours ago, Artful Dodger said:

 

Negativity breeds negativity. 

 

Question what you like in 7 days time.

Your right about the negativity and the biggest negative right now comes from the manager and the way he tries to play football