Tasavallan Posted May 19, 2019 Share Posted May 19, 2019 16 hours ago, mitch41 said: Remember all the help Gretna got like playing their home games at Motherwell yet Bonnyrigg Rose get treated like crap because it’s teams like Berwick Rangers that run the SFA and it’s all about self preservation. I am angry that Bonnyrigg were not given dispensation by the SFA. Whitehill Welfare are a poor side and should have been relegated. Welfare's Ferguson Park does not Have floodlights, neither does Civil Service Stroller and Vale of Leithen. As I said previously, this is snobbism by the SFA against a former Junior club. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Tasavallan Posted May 19, 2019 Share Posted May 19, 2019 3 minutes ago, Tasavallan said: I am angry that Bonnyrigg were not given dispensation by the SFA. Whitehill Welfare are a poor side and should have been relegated. Welfare's Ferguson Park does not Have floodlights, neither does Civil Service Stroller and Vale of Leithen. Bonnyrigg should have proposed sharing New Victoria Park with Nitten for a season while floodlights are erected at New Dundas Park. As I said previously, this is snobbism by the SFA against a former Junior club. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
systemx Posted May 19, 2019 Share Posted May 19, 2019 16 hours ago, mitch41 said: Pogo Smith what a legend. was with him and Moyes in the Gorgie Suite couple of weeks ago Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
mitch41 Posted May 19, 2019 Share Posted May 19, 2019 1 hour ago, systemx said: was with him and Moyes in the Gorgie Suite couple of weeks ago It would of been a freeby lol. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Tommy Brown Posted May 20, 2019 Share Posted May 20, 2019 Berwick Rangers' demotion from the Scottish Professional Football League has been "years" in the making, says incoming chairman John Bell. "It's not something that's happened over recent months - it's happened over recent years," Bell said. "People that have supported us for years are extremely angry with how we've got in this position. "Our challenge is to change that energy, make it really positive, and put the resources in place that we haven't been able to do. "Maybe we have to take that step backwards to go forwards. If we regroup and come out of this a better club, regardless of what league we're in, maybe the short-term pain will have been worth it." good luck Berwick https://www.bbc.co.uk/sport/football/48328203 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
ri Alban Posted May 20, 2019 Share Posted May 20, 2019 Feck Berwick! Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Tasavallan Posted May 20, 2019 Share Posted May 20, 2019 Berwick have languished in the bottom 3 of League 2 for many a season. No ambition, no support, no funds. With East Stirlingshire gone it generally left Albion Rovers and Cowdenbeath to compete against for the drop (and even they have managed a spell in League 1). Even Edinburgh City have moved into the play-offs. It is easy to see where the problem lied: 35 goals scored last season and only 27 scored this season (Couldn't even score in the play-off games.) Couple that with conceding 91 goals and with the pyramid now in place, it is goodbye Berwick. I doubt we will see them in the SPFL again, so the Cross of St George can get removed from the reference sites. WELCOME COVE RANGERS. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Martin_T Posted May 20, 2019 Share Posted May 20, 2019 I think it's underestimated just how big an achievement Cowdenbeath staying up for 3 consecutive seasons in the Championship was. Quite possibly one of the greatest achievements in Scottish football history. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Stanley_ Posted May 20, 2019 Share Posted May 20, 2019 (edited) I have some sympathy for clubs like Berwick getting relegated but lots of these clubs have spent most years in the bottom tier and have only survived in the league for such a long time because there was no possible relegation. About time we had some new and ambitious clubs in the league and the existing league clubs actually have to fight to stay in the league on merit rather than because it's a closed shop. Edited May 20, 2019 by Stanley_ Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
i8hibsh Posted May 20, 2019 Share Posted May 20, 2019 People hating Berwick and wanting shot of them as they dare to not be 100% pure Scottish. I notice a few of them are those that regularly try to shut down opposing opinion and want every hurdle in their way to world domination banned. It is a sad day for SCOTTISH football to lose Berwick from the league. I feel for the fans. A completely harmless and inoffensive football club. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
i8hibsh Posted May 20, 2019 Share Posted May 20, 2019 26 minutes ago, Martin_T said: I think it's underestimated just how big an achievement Cowdenbeath staying up for 3 consecutive seasons in the Championship was. Quite possibly one of the greatest achievements in Scottish football history. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
davemclaren Posted May 20, 2019 Share Posted May 20, 2019 3 minutes ago, i8hibsh said: People hating Berwick and wanting shot of them as they dare to not be 100% pure Scottish. I notice a few of them are those that regularly try to shut down opposing opinion and want every hurdle in their way to world domination banned. It is a sad day for SCOTTISH football to lose Berwick from the league. I feel for the fans. A completely harmless and inoffensive football club. It us sad but change is good and the new clubs that have joined the league have generally been shown to be more dynamic than the clubs they replaced. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
The Treasurer Posted May 20, 2019 Share Posted May 20, 2019 The pyramid system is one of the few things that the SPFL have actually got right. Too many teams have, for years, been happy to shuffle along near the bottom of the ladder, safe in the knowledge they will still be there the following season. Now there is scope for ambitious clubs to join the league set up, while at the same time, force other clubs to either up their ambitions or face dropping out the league. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Lord Beni of Gorgie Posted May 20, 2019 Share Posted May 20, 2019 1 hour ago, Tasavallan said: Berwick have languished in the bottom 3 of League 2 for many a season. No ambition, no support, no funds. With East Stirlingshire gone it generally left Albion Rovers and Cowdenbeath to compete against for the drop (and even they have managed a spell in League 1). Even Edinburgh City have moved into the play-offs. It is easy to see where the problem lied: 35 goals scored last season and only 27 scored this season (Couldn't even score in the play-off games.) Couple that with conceding 91 goals and with the pyramid now in place, it is goodbye Berwick. I doubt we will see them in the SPFL again, so the Cross of St George can get removed from the reference sites. WELCOME COVE RANGERS. Totally agree, don't have much time for Cove myself, but too long these teams in the 4th tier, or 3rd in the older system have done nothing to improve. I would shake the system up further that beyond the top 24 teams, the next 4 leagues are regionalised further with much greater access to becoming a top 24 club, if you show ambition, and train young footballers. Antiquated systems tolerating antiquated clubs, surely must have been to the detriment of Scottish football for quite some time. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Lord Beni of Gorgie Posted May 20, 2019 Share Posted May 20, 2019 23 minutes ago, i8hibsh said: People hating Berwick and wanting shot of them as they dare to not be 100% pure Scottish. I notice a few of them are those that regularly try to shut down opposing opinion and want every hurdle in their way to world domination banned. It is a sad day for SCOTTISH football to lose Berwick from the league. I feel for the fans. A completely harmless and inoffensive football club. Not like you to be contrary eh. As Dave says, clubs coming in are far more dynamic. Peterhead a very good example of a club and a town that have moved forwards. Ross County and ICT for years were denied access simply on geography. Scotland extends around 250 miles 300 north from Berwick, thankfully people know that now. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
letsalldothebeattie Posted May 20, 2019 Share Posted May 20, 2019 I get it’s nice to see new clubs like Edinburgh City & Cove coming into the league set up that’s why the play off system was set up but I’m baffled by some people’s sheer delight at clubs suffering relegation out of the senior set up. Relegation out of the senior set up for some clubs could be the end for them. Berwick have said they can make a right go of it next season because of guaranteed payments but after that it’s anyones guess & with junior sides being added it’s going to make it very difficult for sides being relegated to go straight back up or even say getting up after a second season as well. Just look at Kelty they’ve just added a raft of players from SPFL including Nathan Austin from Inverness to the squad next season. Now when a club in the Lowland has that kind of pull to get a boy from Championship Inverness what hope do others have. I like the new pyramid set up and I’m looking forward to seeing how the SPFL is going to shape up in the next 5-10 years but unlike some on here I don’t want to see that change come at a cost of closure to some clubs which may well happen to clubs like Berwick who aren’t funded as well as others in the Lowland are. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Martin_T Posted May 20, 2019 Share Posted May 20, 2019 (edited) 1 hour ago, i8hibsh said: For a club with an average home crowd of a couple of hundred fans, to stay in a professional league for 3 seasons is a remarkable achievement which is unlikely to ever be repeated. Edited May 20, 2019 by Martin_T Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
davemclaren Posted May 20, 2019 Share Posted May 20, 2019 1 hour ago, letsalldothebeattie said: I get it’s nice to see new clubs like Edinburgh City & Cove coming into the league set up that’s why the play off system was set up but I’m baffled by some people’s sheer delight at clubs suffering relegation out of the senior set up. Relegation out of the senior set up for some clubs could be the end for them. Berwick have said they can make a right go of it next season because of guaranteed payments but after that it’s anyones guess & with junior sides being added it’s going to make it very difficult for sides being relegated to go straight back up or even say getting up after a second season as well. Just look at Kelty they’ve just added a raft of players from SPFL including Nathan Austin from Inverness to the squad next season. Now when a club in the Lowland has that kind of pull to get a boy from Championship Inverness what hope do others have. I like the new pyramid set up and I’m looking forward to seeing how the SPFL is going to shape up in the next 5-10 years but unlike some on here I don’t want to see that change come at a cost of closure to some clubs which may well happen to clubs like Berwick who aren’t funded as well as others in the Lowland are. So the less well funded teams should be subsidised to survive? I agree that there should be parachute payments but fresh blood in the spfl is generally a good thing imo. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
letsalldothebeattie Posted May 20, 2019 Share Posted May 20, 2019 Just now, davemclaren said: So the less well funded teams should be subsidised to survive? I agree that there should be parachute payments but fresh blood in the spfl is generally a good thing imo. I’m not saying they should be subsidised to survive. I’m saying when a club like Berwick get relegated and aren’t the best funded club are going into a league where Kelty are able to sign about 5 new players from the championship and league 1 it’s going to make it difficult for them to get back into the league. They can’t just throw money at players like that. I agree the fresh blood into the SPFL is great but I just don’t like how some on here are enjoying seeing a club, who may go out of business in a year if they don’t get back up at first time, going out the league. Consider this could’ve been up 6/7 years ago with a club facing a very uncertain future Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Maroon Sailor Posted May 20, 2019 Share Posted May 20, 2019 I agree with the above. Can't understand a football fan having any delight in the demise of a club that has been part of the Scottish game for years. I never seen Third Lanark but they are well talked about to this day. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Shanks Posted May 20, 2019 Share Posted May 20, 2019 Folk are taking delight because they have been relegated. It's a bit different than celebrating a club going out of business! Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
kirkierobroy Posted May 20, 2019 Share Posted May 20, 2019 Given that they are based in England I wonder if they'll think about applying for the Northern League. And play against great names like Billington Synthonia and Bedlington Terriers. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Meadows Posted May 20, 2019 Share Posted May 20, 2019 They did look into it, but I believe the parachute payment is conditional on playing in the lowland league. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
sadj Posted May 20, 2019 Share Posted May 20, 2019 On 18/05/2019 at 18:36, Footballfirst said: Cove had already hit the post before that. The ref got the red card right and after that Berwick barely had any possession. Berwick were very poor throughout and will have to up their game considerably if they are going to anywhere near the top four in the Lowland League. Highland League clubs are delighted they feel now Cove are gone they can all start to progress and look to move out and up into the leagues above. Formartine are throwing money at their team aswell just now. They will be hoping to get up and challenge for promotion as favourites now Cove are away. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Maroon Sailor Posted May 20, 2019 Share Posted May 20, 2019 26 minutes ago, Longshanks said: Folk are taking delight because they have been relegated. It's a bit different than celebrating a club going out of business! Rangers went out of business ...... Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Maroon Sailor Posted May 20, 2019 Share Posted May 20, 2019 3 minutes ago, sadj said: Highland League clubs are delighted they feel now Cove are gone they can all start to progress and look to move out and up into the leagues above. Formartine are throwing money at their team aswell just now. They will be hoping to get up and challenge for promotion as favourites now Cove are away. Who takes Cove's place ? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
sadj Posted May 20, 2019 Share Posted May 20, 2019 1 minute ago, Maroon Sailor said: Who takes Cove's place ? Not sure I didn’t ask that , i’ll go send a message or two see if i can find out. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Footballfirst Posted May 20, 2019 Share Posted May 20, 2019 (edited) 5 minutes ago, Maroon Sailor said: Who takes Cove's place ? No-one The Highland League is stand-alone with no lower feeder leagues. The North Region Juniors and North Caledonian League decided not to join the pyramid at this time. Edited May 20, 2019 by Footballfirst Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Maroon Sailor Posted May 20, 2019 Share Posted May 20, 2019 1 minute ago, Footballfirst said: No-one The Highland League is stand-alone with no lower feeder leagues. The North Region Juniors and North Caledonian League decided not to join the pyramid at this time. O.K Odd number of teams then Fort William will be happy for a free week ! Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
sadj Posted May 20, 2019 Share Posted May 20, 2019 (edited) 3 minutes ago, Footballfirst said: No-one The Highland League is stand-alone with no lower feeder leagues. The North Region Juniors and North Caledonian League decided not to join the pyramid at this time. Iv messaged a couple of chairmen to ask but i’d imagine that is correct but the loss of income may hurt some. Coves home attendance is only around 200 , but the short trip for a lot in comparison to say Fort William make things easier on finances Cove’s promotion may have a knock on effect to Peterhead and Elgin player wise Edited May 20, 2019 by sadj Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Footballfirst Posted May 20, 2019 Share Posted May 20, 2019 1 minute ago, Maroon Sailor said: O.K Odd number of teams then Fort William will be happy for a free week ! Yes. It should be 17 next season unless they get an application from the likes of Banks o' Dee, Culter or other junior side. As the HL is at tier 5 in the pyramid, then any new applicant would have to be licensed. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
kirkierobroy Posted May 20, 2019 Share Posted May 20, 2019 31 minutes ago, Meadows said: They did look into it, but I believe the parachute payment is conditional on playing in the lowland league. Cheers - thanks for that. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
sadj Posted May 20, 2019 Share Posted May 20, 2019 26 minutes ago, Footballfirst said: Yes. It should be 17 next season unless they get an application from the likes of Banks o' Dee, Culter or other junior side. As the HL is at tier 5 in the pyramid, then any new applicant would have to be licensed. Applications will be asked for but only one team ready with club licensing and that’s banks of Dee But they don’t want to come in so might just run with 17 teams Straight from a Chairmans mouth Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
BelgeJambo Posted May 20, 2019 Share Posted May 20, 2019 Can't help thinking, why don't the SFA regionalise the two bottom leagues? Berwick and the likes of Stranraer and Annan having to make journeys to the likes of Elgin and Peterhead and vice versa must be financially difficult for a semi pro club. Add in Montrose, Forfar, Arbroath and Brechin, then that is a fair bit of travelling for all concerned clubs. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
davemclaren Posted May 20, 2019 Share Posted May 20, 2019 7 minutes ago, BelgeJambo said: Can't help thinking, why don't the SFA regionalise the two bottom leagues? Berwick and the likes of Stranraer and Annan having to make journeys to the likes of Elgin and Peterhead and vice versa must be financially difficult for a semi pro club. Add in Montrose, Forfar, Arbroath and Brechin, then that is a fair bit of travelling for all concerned clubs. Quite hard to regionalise in Scotland as most clubs are in the central belt. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
EIEIO Posted May 20, 2019 Share Posted May 20, 2019 2 hours ago, Martin_T said: For a club with an average home crowd of a couple of hundred fans, to stay in a professional league for 3 seasons is a remarkable achievement which is unlikely to ever be repeated. Alloa must be close to equally this record? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
BelgeJambo Posted May 20, 2019 Share Posted May 20, 2019 45 minutes ago, davemclaren said: Quite hard to regionalise in Scotland as most clubs are in the central belt. North Peterhead Elgin Cove Arbroath Forfar Montrose Brechin Raith Rovers East Fife Cowdenbeath South Clyde Edinburgh City Annan Stirling Queens Park Albion Airdrie Stenhousemuir Stranraer Dumbarton No worse that the way they decide the league cup regionals But, your probably right Dave - never make everybody happy whatever they produced. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
davemclaren Posted May 20, 2019 Share Posted May 20, 2019 1 minute ago, BelgeJambo said: North Peterhead Elgin Cove Arbroath Forfar Montrose Brechin Raith Rovers East Fife Cowdenbeath South Clyde Edinburgh City Annan Stirling Queens Park Albion Airdrie Stenhousemuir Stranraer Dumbarton No worse that the way they decide the league cup regionals But, your probably right Dave - never make everybody happy whatever they produced. Decent effort actually. ? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Allowayjambo1874 Posted May 20, 2019 Share Posted May 20, 2019 40 minutes ago, BelgeJambo said: North Peterhead Elgin Cove Arbroath Forfar Montrose Brechin Raith Rovers East Fife Cowdenbeath South Clyde Edinburgh City Annan Stirling Queens Park Albion Airdrie Stenhousemuir Stranraer Dumbarton No worse that the way they decide the league cup regionals But, your probably right Dave - never make everybody happy whatever they produced. That split makes an awful lot of sense, reduced costs and increase in income from more local derbies. Promotion to them could could from playoff with one lowland league v bottom of south and one HL v bottom of north. I’m guessing maybe in a couple of seasons you might end up with lop sided leagues through relegation/promotion from higher leagues. still be worth a shout Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Randy Marsh Posted May 20, 2019 Share Posted May 20, 2019 5 hours ago, Martin_T said: For a club with an average home crowd of a couple of hundred fans, to stay in a professional league for 3 seasons is a remarkable achievement which is unlikely to ever be repeated. You could argue Alloa have done similar this season. Both good achievements though. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
letsalldothebeattie Posted May 20, 2019 Share Posted May 20, 2019 4 hours ago, kirkierobroy said: Given that they are based in England I wonder if they'll think about applying for the Northern League. And play against great names like Billington Synthonia and Bedlington Terriers. The vice chairman spoke about that on Sky on Friday. Says that if they were to do that and apply and get accepted it would put the club back 100 years. He said the league they would go into would see them travel down as far as like Manchester or Birmingham so would be doing same if not more travelling than what they do currently in league 2. Now they are in Lowland for next season furthest north they travel would be Kelty and furthest west would be East Kilbride Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Footballfirst Posted May 20, 2019 Share Posted May 20, 2019 2 hours ago, BelgeJambo said: North Peterhead Elgin Cove Arbroath Forfar Montrose Brechin Raith Rovers East Fife Cowdenbeath South Clyde Edinburgh City Annan Stirling Queens Park Albion Airdrie Stenhousemuir Stranraer Dumbarton No worse that the way they decide the league cup regionals But, your probably right Dave - never make everybody happy whatever they produced. I could go with that sort of set up. The top two leagues would be national leagues and predominately full time, with sufficient funding to help make that a reality. Regionalise at tier 3 as suggested above with most clubs operating on a part time basis. Tier 4 could be regionalised further with the Highland League, a Lowland League East and a Lowland League West (once the West juniors get their act together), then tier 5 with the remaining top EOS, ERJFA, WRJFA, NRJFA and SoS sides with feeder leagues below that. Any imbalance with promotions/relegations to a particular region can easily be resolved, but is does mean that some clubs, say Stirling Albion, could be South one season and North the next. The English pyramid does switch teams between conferences for that reason. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Randy Marsh Posted May 20, 2019 Share Posted May 20, 2019 2 hours ago, BelgeJambo said: North Peterhead Elgin Cove Arbroath Forfar Montrose Brechin Raith Rovers East Fife Cowdenbeath South Clyde Edinburgh City Annan Stirling Queens Park Albion Airdrie Stenhousemuir Stranraer Dumbarton No worse that the way they decide the league cup regionals But, your probably right Dave - never make everybody happy whatever they produced. This is far too much common sense for the SFA/SFL come up with. I would like to see the SPL and Championship with either 16/18 teams with a regional pyramid system below that. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Mikey1874 Posted May 20, 2019 Share Posted May 20, 2019 A lot of people in the game support regional leagues. Below the Championship with revised play off would work. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
systemx Posted May 20, 2019 Share Posted May 20, 2019 (edited) 7 hours ago, The Treasurer said: The pyramid system is one of the few things that the SPFL have actually got right. Too many teams have, for years, been happy to shuffle along near the bottom of the ladder, safe in the knowledge they will still be there the following season. Now there is scope for ambitious clubs to join the league set up, while at the same time, force other clubs to either up their ambitions or face dropping out the league. Ambitious clubs from the East Juniors did join and have been shat on by the sfa who changed the rules for them with hours to go before they were audited.A great system if applied fairly, ask Bonnyrigg Rose Edited May 20, 2019 by systemx Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
jambosdad Posted May 20, 2019 Share Posted May 20, 2019 9 hours ago, Sir Gio said: Not like you to be contrary eh. As Dave says, clubs coming in are far more dynamic. Peterhead a very good example of a club and a town that have moved forwards. Ross County and ICT for years were denied access simply on geography. Scotland extends around 250 miles 300 north from Berwick, thankfully people know that now. Going back further Gala Fairydean were always refused entry due to travel. All these northern teams are a much further trek. Had Gala been allowed then the likes of John Collins could have joined us as there was a good connection with them. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Maroon Sailor Posted May 20, 2019 Share Posted May 20, 2019 (edited) 49 minutes ago, jambosdad said: Going back further Gala Fairydean were always refused entry due to travel. All these northern teams are a much further trek. Had Gala been allowed then the likes of John Collins could have joined us as there was a good connection with them. If there was a good connection what does it matter if Gala were in the league or not ? Edited May 20, 2019 by Maroon Sailor Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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