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jake

Scientific fact and not religious far right extremists such as those in the Christian belt of the US or the neo nazi muslims of the middle east show the suffering of aborted children.

 

Scientifically proven fact.

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Maple Leaf
4 minutes ago, jake said:

So if those who agree with abortion agree on scientific findings.

Do they agree with the death penalty?

 

There is no validation for killing a human being except for self defence.

And maybe retribution.

 

Because if you abort you kill.

 

There are at least two logical fallacies in that post, so you'll understand why I won't attempt to give you a reasoned response.

 

I'm sure you know what those fallacies are.

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Maple Leaf
5 minutes ago, jake said:

Scientific fact and not religious far right extremists such as those in the Christian belt of the US or the neo nazi muslims of the middle east show the suffering of aborted children.

 

Scientifically proven fact.

 

I don't understand your point, but if it's a scientifically proven fact, it should be easy for you to provide the evidence for your claim.

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jake
5 minutes ago, Maple Leaf said:

 

There are at least two logical fallacies in that post, so you'll understand why I won't attempt to give you a reasoned response.

 

I'm sure you know what those fallacies are.

Do you agree with killing someone in self defence?

Do you agree with killing someone for revenge?

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jake
4 minutes ago, Maple Leaf said:

 

I don't understand your point, but if it's a scientifically proven fact, it should be easy for you to provide the evidence for your claim.

Scientific fact proves the formation of many things in the foetus.

Its beyond me in these times how anyone can advocate abortion.

 

Can you show me which age a human being stops receiving human rights?

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Maple Leaf
2 minutes ago, jake said:

Do you agree with killing someone in self defence?

Do you agree with killing someone for revenge?

I don't agree with killing someone in self-defence, but I agree that it's acceptable for a person to defend himself.

 

Second question, No.

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jake
1 minute ago, Maple Leaf said:

I don't agree with killing someone in self-defence, but I agree that it's acceptable for a person to defend himself.

 

Second question, No.

Do you agree with killing someone because its convenient?

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Maple Leaf
2 minutes ago, jake said:

Scientific fact proves the formation of many things in the foetus.

Its beyond me in these times how anyone can advocate abortion.

 

Can you show me which age a human being stops receiving human rights?

 

This is the part of your post I don't understand, and your reply doesn't make it clearer:

 

" ... religious far right extremists such as those in the Christian belt of the US or the neo nazi muslims of the middle east show the suffering of aborted children."

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jake
2 minutes ago, Maple Leaf said:

 

This is the part of your post I don't understand, and your reply doesn't make it clearer:

 

" ... religious far right extremists such as those in the Christian belt of the US or the neo nazi muslims of the middle east show the suffering of aborted children."

Both neo fascist religions do have points.

Regardless of our own prejudice (mines I suppose being perceived as anti Muslim).

Religion imo can offer a view that is legitimate.

 

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Maple Leaf
2 minutes ago, jake said:

Do you agree with killing someone because its convenient?

No.

 

I know where you're going with this series of questions, and I can tell you that you're leading yourself into a logical dead-end. It's the tired argument of people who have an inflexible position on the subject.

 

You've mentioned the phrase 'scientific fact' a couple of times. Do you wish to discuss the scientific fact of a zygote? 

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jake
12 minutes ago, Maple Leaf said:

No.

 

I know where you're going with this series of questions, and I can tell you that you're leading yourself into a logical dead-end. It's the tired argument of people who have an inflexible position on the subject.

 

You've mentioned the phrase 'scientific fact' a couple of times. Do you wish to discuss the scientific fact of a zygote? 

Yes .

Do you wish to discuss the feelings of a foetus?

 

I am not religious.

I think I'm as feminist as any man can be.

But it's a bit of a fek up when killing children is viewed as liberal.

No?

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redjambo

Perhaps Jake might like to start a new thread on this subject rather than continue it here in the Trump thread.

 

It is certainly a topic that's ripe for debate and a dedicated thread will do it more justice.

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jake
2 minutes ago, redjambo said:

Perhaps Jake might like to start a new thread on this subject rather than continue it here in the Trump thread.

 

It is certainly a topic that's ripe for debate and a dedicated thread will do it more justice.

True.

But I think best not.

Although to be fair it was used by others first to make political points so maybe ask them.

 

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jake

And not surprisingly the question is not asked.

 

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redjambo
17 minutes ago, jake said:

And not surprisingly the question is not asked.

 

 

Are you talking to me?

 

I think it was obvious when I made the suggestion, and then you mentioned other posters, that the idea of creating a new thread also extended to them. What did you want me to do, actually pose another question and say pretty please?

 

Christ man, I wasn't referring to you in particular to have a go at you or anything. I just thought that you were quite keen to debate the topic and thought that you could get a much better debate with folk about the subject if it were in a thread of its own. Which you would. It could be a very interesting debate.

 

 

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Maple Leaf
34 minutes ago, jake said:

Yes .

Do you wish to discuss the feelings of a foetus?

 

I am not religious.

I think I'm as feminist as any man can be.

But it's a bit of a fek up when killing children is viewed as liberal.

No?

 

If you're anti-abortion then that is impossible.

 

When did 'feelings' come into the discussion? And I'll be happy to learn about the feelings of a foetus when you are willing to discuss the feelings of a zygote, or a blastocyst or an embryo. 

 

Whether you agree or not, this is a not a discussion about Donald Trump, so we're off-topic.  Please feel free to start a thread on abortion.

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bobsharp
6 hours ago, jake said:

The motivations of men or women seem to outweigh the rights of children in your view Bob.

 

I'm unsure on the whole.

But it's not black and white.

 

Abortion.

It's the putting to death of a human being.

 

Does anyone disagree with that?

 

I have just got home after a lovely day in my old hometown of Osoyoos, I went there to meet a former Scots Guardsman whom I have never met but in the spirit of guardsmanship brought me from Scotland a Scots Guards Veteran ball cap. And this is the type of thing that I have experienced in my life great pleasure, and also the tragedy such as abortion on life. I think you are judging me on less than full facts, from my first sudden death as a police officer and the many that followed I have always had a respect for all life before birth or after. I am not as you suggest swayed one way or the other by the motivations of men and women, but I do know that they will be motivated by doing what they believe is best for them, and to this I refer to my original post, if it has to be done have it done clinically, not in a bedroom with some old crone sticking a foreign object into the victim and possibly killing her and the human to be. ts

 

Abortion is not simple, it is cruel to the potential mother and the unborn child, however in life there are decisions that have to be made, and the simplest one in the equation is am I ready to be a mother, if the answer is no then something has to be done, I have seen babies abandoned after birth, some adopted, but way more and way to many who were brought into the world and treated for their whole life like effluent, to be honest death may have been a mercy, harsh but true.                                                                                              

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The Real Maroonblood

What’s Trump up to these days?

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Governor Tarkin
12 minutes ago, The Real Maroonblood said:

What’s Trump up to these days?

 

Opening a chain of backstreet abortion clinics.

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The Real Maroonblood
14 minutes ago, Governor Tarkin said:

 

Opening a chain of backstreet abortion clinics.

:rofl:

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milky_26
1 hour ago, The Real Maroonblood said:

What’s Trump up to these days?

Pardoning Conrad Black

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Joey J J Jr Shabadoo
Posted (edited)
17 minutes ago, milky_26 said:

Pardoning Conrad Black

Horrible people these right wingers. Priorities have gone to pot. 

 

ETA https://www.google.com/url?sa=t&source=web&rct=j&url=https://amp.theguardian.com/business/2018/jul/18/conrad-black-trump-book-support-pardon&ved=2ahUKEwi89v3txZ_iAhVzs3EKHfYRClwQFjAAegQIARAB&usg=AOvVaw3YZc2it3QOSlQ6LY-aHarY&ampcf=1

Black's brown nosing seems to have worked. 

Edited by Joey J J Jr Shabadoo

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Stokesy
39 minutes ago, milky_26 said:

Pardoning Conrad Black

 

My favourite Have I Got News For You clip

 

 

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Smithee
10 hours ago, jake said:

And the desperation of this thread is astounding.

It's like double speak.

Liberals arguing that the most vulnerable have the least rights.

You know Jake, your surly guerrilla superiority thing is turning you into a right bore 

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Maple Leaf
5 hours ago, Joey J J Jr Shabadoo said:

 

Yes, it was predictable. Trump and Black have been pals for years, and when Black's flattering book about Trump was published last year, the pardon was only a matter of time. Both are a couple of egomaniacs.

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bobsharp

Jake, what is your view on the Donald Trump administration having a policy where in the processing of illegal immigrants and asylum seekers they remove from their parents living, breathing, functioning childen, and it is admitted that  some of these children because of inadequate record keeping may never be reunited again. This again is all part of the old Build That Wall election promise that Trump made to the same people who are so set for the other discussion. They are what is referred to as Trumps base. Trumps basic motivation is to satisfy his inflated ego, his narcissism, and his desire for power.

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jake
9 hours ago, Smithee said:

You know Jake, your surly guerrilla superiority thing is turning you into a right bore 

?

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jake
3 hours ago, bobsharp said:

Jake, what is your view on the Donald Trump administration having a policy where in the processing of illegal immigrants and asylum seekers they remove from their parents living, breathing, functioning childen, and it is admitted that  some of these children because of inadequate record keeping may never be reunited again. This again is all part of the old Build That Wall election promise that Trump made to the same people who are so set for the other discussion. They are what is referred to as Trumps base. Trumps basic motivation is to satisfy his inflated ego, his narcissism, and his desire for power.

I dont like Trump Bob or his policies.

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bobsharp
1 hour ago, jake said:

?

 

I respect your right Jake to air your opinions, but I am a bit confused, You find it abhorrent to remove an unborn child from its mother, but if I read you correctly you are against Trumps policy and he personally is the instigator of removing living children from their parents. Is it the method of one practise to wit the surgical aspect of abortion, with what could be perceived as the less physical action of the family seperation. Both are Trump policies, and even worse he has made a practise of selecting similarly opined judges to side with him when the policies are legally challenged.

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alfajambo
20 hours ago, jake said:

Scientific fact and not religious far right extremists such as those in the Christian belt of the US or the neo nazi muslims of the middle east show the suffering of aborted children.

 

Scientifically proven fact.

Proponents on across the political spectrum, abortion debate Et.al, recognise that scientific advancement has revealed many amazing understandings about human life. However, science alone is unable to determine the ultimate questions about the sanctity of life and death.

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Governor Tarkin
1 hour ago, alfajambo said:

Proponents on across the political spectrum, abortion debate Et.al, recognise that scientific advancement has revealed many amazing understandings about human life. However, science alone is unable to determine the ultimate questions about the sanctity of life and death.

 

I think our views on abortion will be miles apart in a practical sense, but ethically, I agree completely with this particular point.

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Justin Z

bUt We NeEd To PrOtEcT tHe MoSt VuLnErAbLe

 

I'm From Alabama And Gave Birth to My Rapist's Child Because I Couldn't Get an Abortion

 

I was 17 when I was raped by a classmate. He was someone I knew, someone I trusted, but in the end, none of that mattered. I would not find out until eight months later that I was pregnant as a result of the assault. My daughter, Zoe, would grow inside of me with a fatal congenital birth defect that took away her ability to think, or emote, or connect to the world in all the fundamental ways that make a life worth living.

 

aLaBaMa'S aBoRtIoN lAw Is PrO-fEmInIsM

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Maple Leaf

Trump has removed his tariffs on steel and aluminum from Canada and Mexico.

 

His new-NAFTA would never have been ratified while those tariffs were in place.

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Ugly American

54% of respondants say they "definitely will not vote" for Trump in 2020.

 

Hard to say never, but even with a warped electoral college result that's basically impossible to overcome in an honest vote. And I don't see those numbers changing all that much.

 

Which is why voter suppression and election meddling will be at rates we haven't seen since the Voting Rights Act was passed in 2020.

 

https://talkingpointsmemo.com/edblog/numbers-from-new-q-poll

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bobsharp

Watched this mornings no show Hearing with Congress. Nadler I thought made an excellent presentation, the Republican reply was more of the same denial, denial, denial, and all the bad people are out to get Donald Trump.  I hope they realise they are complicit in this mans illegal, manipulative and dishonest behaviour, it may not happen today, or even in my time on this earth, but at some stage there will be answering to do as to why they allowed him to do the things he does.

I wish they would sit and look at some of the film of the late thirties, and the similarity in rethoric, the promises, and the victims, and most importantly the complete denial of the complicity in the happenings of that era. What goes around comes around.

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Maple Leaf
1 hour ago, Ugly American said:

54% of respondants say they "definitely will not vote" for Trump in 2020.

 

Hard to say never, but even with a warped electoral college result that's basically impossible to overcome in an honest vote. And I don't see those numbers changing all that much.

 

Which is why voter suppression and election meddling will be at rates we haven't seen since the Voting Rights Act was passed in 2020.

 

https://talkingpointsmemo.com/edblog/numbers-from-new-q-poll

 

I'm surprised, but pleased, that it's that high.

 

I would have guessed at 35-40% definitely against, a similar range definitely for, with the election being decided by the remaining 20-30%.  And who the undecideds will vote for will depend on who the Democratic candidate is.

 

With 18 months to go, much too soon to call, imo.

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Justin Z

Respectable Republican politicians do exist--they're not just the stuff of fairy tales.

 

 

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Maple Leaf
6 hours ago, Justin Z said:

Respectable Republican politicians do exist--they're not just the stuff of fairy tales.

 

 

 

OK, that's one!!

 

There are 53 Republican Senators, and a further 199 Republicans in the House. Let's see how many of those side with Amash.  If I was a betting man, I'd say none.

 

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bobsharp

Trump walks out of scheduled talks with Pelosi and  Schumer regarding infrastructure.  Apparently was extremely angry about being accused of doing a cover up,says he doesn't do cover ups. Absolutely true, he pays likes of his faithful trusted friend and lawyer Cohen to do it for him. Tries to get people like McGahn to fire investigators, fires people like Sessions who won't. I am satisfied he got explosively angry, one of the first signs of a potential serious mental breakdown. He will leave the Oval office at some point not televised, under escort.

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Cade

New York state refuses Trump's attempts to block the subpoenas.

:jjyay:

 

A lawyer for the Congressional committees argued that the subpoenas were misconstrued as solely targeting the president and his family, saying they’re part of a “complex investigation across a whole industry, not just Mr Trump.”

He also hit back against claims from Trump that it’s an overreach to subpoena his family members.The lawyer said people use family members to hide assets.

“They put them in the names of their grandchildren,” he said, providing a general example of how people conceal assets.

“This is what people committing financial fraud do,” he also said generally of hiding assets.

 

:jjyay:  :jjyay:

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Maple Leaf
4 hours ago, Cade said:

New York state refuses Trump's attempts to block the subpoenas.

:jjyay:

 

A lawyer for the Congressional committees argued that the subpoenas were misconstrued as solely targeting the president and his family, saying they’re part of a “complex investigation across a whole industry, not just Mr Trump.”

He also hit back against claims from Trump that it’s an overreach to subpoena his family members.The lawyer said people use family members to hide assets.

“They put them in the names of their grandchildren,” he said, providing a general example of how people conceal assets.

“This is what people committing financial fraud do,” he also said generally of hiding assets.

 

:jjyay:  :jjyay:

 

It's a witch hunt!!

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JackLadd

Dump must sense jail time if he loses 2020. Criminal exposure.

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redjambo
20 minutes ago, JackLadd said:

Dump must sense jail time if he loses 2020. Criminal exposure.

 

His best bet is to come clean, plead guilty and then pardon himself while he's still President. ;)

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JackLadd
1 hour ago, redjambo said:

 

His best bet is to come clean, plead guilty and then pardon himself while he's still President. ;)

 

The crook will try it if he can't block the truth.

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ri Alban
Posted (edited)

Trump should have stayed away from Politics. Arrogance and greed, the  twins of destiny for most would be dictators.

Suicide or handcuffs are in the terminal waiting room at destination Karma.

Edited by ri Alban

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Maple Leaf
8 hours ago, ri Alban said:

Trump should have stayed away from Politics. Arrogance and greed, the  twins of destiny for most would be dictators.

Suicide or handcuffs are in the terminal waiting room at destination Karma.

 

Sorta sums him up, doesn't it.

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bobsharp

Just watched Nancy Pelosi giving a talk and answering questions. She has never been high in my estimation, but this morning she changed that. She again asked for prayers for the president, she stated again that he is involved in a cover up, she stated that his behaviour yesterday was not what one should expect from the President. She then stated quite clearly that the Presidents family and aides should conduct some form of intervention for him as he needs help.

She is pretty smart she knows he wants an Impeachment investigation to garner more sympathy. Despite many in her party wanting this I feel she wants to continue the what I would in some cases call the harrassment about all his weaknesses, finances, income tax, obstruction etc. they are having affects on his actions and most obviously on his mental health.

In a life of dealing with people I have met many bad bad men, cruel, nasty vindictive, and have dealt with them without concern, but I can honstly say I have also met fewer women with these attributes, but have no shame iin admitting they scaredthe bejesus out of me. Donald cup your head in your hands and run like a scalded cat, because hell approaches, and its wearing a skirt.

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jake
16 hours ago, ri Alban said:

Trump should have stayed away from Politics. Arrogance and greed, the  twins of destiny for most would be dictators.

Suicide or handcuffs are in the terminal waiting room at destination Karma.

Outdone yourself there .

In the shite post game.

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