U.S. Politics megathread (merged)

[westbow]

14 minutes ago, luckydug said:

When did the YES campaign refuse to accept the validity of the vote ? 

Indyref 2 will be a separate election just as in the next general election. 

It's fine to campaign for something you believe in, threatening legal action when you lose is something else. 

https://www.theguardian.com/politics/2014/sep/22/scottish-referendum-vote-rigging-claims-recount-petitions

 

Ignored by the less excitable Yes voters though.

[gashauskis9]

23 minutes ago, Justin Z said:

Found alfa, he's been on Twitter

 

 

Any relation to Gary?

[Beni]

12 minutes ago, Justin Z said:

 

 

Thoughts and prayers with Brexiteers at this difficult time.

 

[Justin Z]

11 minutes ago, gashauskis9 said:

Any relation to Gary?

 

[kila]

33 minutes ago, Justin Z said:

 

 

 

 

[Bazzas right boot]

1 hour ago, Lone Striker said:

Quite likely, imo.  It's one of the reasons why he won't concede - better to fuel 4 years of simmering anger among his nutjob supporters at how Biden "stole" the election.    Eric or Donald Jnr  may well tap into that and go for the nomination in 2024, although you'd hope there must be some moderate voices within the Republican establishment who'll try hard to find a more traditional & acceptable candidate whose name isn't Trump or Kushner.

 

It would seem that the nutjobs enabling Trump's excesses aren't just confined to the political appointees though -

 

 

 

 

It's off the wall bat shit crazy. 

Cult mentality. 

 

[Justin Z]

 

A population of around 300,000 in a state of about 7 million is definitely going to make a noticeable impact, and this has absolutely been a contributing factor.

[Bazzas right boot]

1 hour ago, luckyBatistuta said:

It does indeed, folk not willing to accept a democratic vote, just like the Brexit, just like the Indyref and let’s not kid ourselves that had Trump won, they would have accepted that either. Every fekr wanting their own way nowadays and nothing else🤯

 

 

Nah, referendums aree a bit different, if you make promises and win you should deliver if not all at least some of what you promised. 

 

I think the losing sides in both referendums you mention are more angry about the winning side not delivering on almost anything they said they would, as opposed to losing. 

 

That's what annoys me the most and imo should annoy anyone who values democracy. 

 

Politicians in general talk shite but when you promise a, b and c in order to win a referendum that was in the balance they should deliver. 

 

The winning and losing side should hold them accountable, but it seems as you say winning is more important than actually delivering on the policies and/ or promises that got you the win. 

 

It's shite. 

 

 

[luckydug]

47 minutes ago, luckyBatistuta said:

I’m talking about the voters, folk taking to the street protesting and not willing to accept a democratic vote, claiming to be cheated etc. I voted Yes, I was gutted to lose, but I moved on as it was what the majority voted for. I’ve noticed plenty folk crying for the Yes voters to move on and accept it and yet then turn around and refuse to accept the result of the Brexit vote. Plenty of hypocrites on both sides of this vote too, who wouldn’t have accepted the outcome of this vote either.

Take your point but Trump is dangerous and stoking up unrest. 

We will all be safer without him imo. 

[Bazzas right boot]

1 hour ago, jonesy said:

Would be better off dividing the place into two, minus all the war shenanigans this time around.

 

That's a good plan for several countries  imo. 😉

[redjambo]

Just now, luckydug said:

Take your point but Trump is dangerous and stoking up unrest. 

We will all be safer without him imo. 

 

I can see him setting up his own party to challenge the Republicans.

[Justin Z]

 

 

[luckyBatistuta]

1 minute ago, luckydug said:

Take your point but Trump is dangerous and stoking up unrest. 

We will all be safer without him imo. 

Of course he is and we will. My point though is even being highlighted on this very thread, no names...

[Justin Z]

[luckyBatistuta]

3 minutes ago, Smith's right boot said:

 

 

Nah, referendums aree a bit different, if you make promises and win you should deliver if not all at least some of what you promised. 

 

I think the losing sides in both referendums you mention are more angry about the winning side not delivering on almost anything they said they would, as opposed to losing. 

 

That's what annoys me the most and imo should annoy anyone who values democracy. 

 

Politicians in general talk shite but when you promise a, b and c in order to win a referendum that was in the balance they should deliver. 

 

The winning and losing side should hold them accountable, but it seems as you say winning is more important than actually delivering on the policies and/ or promises that got you the win. 

 

It's shite. 

 

 

Not different as far as I’m concerned. The country voted, Yes lost, but plenty people wouldn’t and still won’t accept that vote. That’s no different to the Brexit vote, this US vote and whatever the next big one is.

[Cade]

Steve Bannon permanently banned from Twitter after calling for Fauci's head to be stuck on a railing spike outside the White House.

 

 

[gashauskis9]

12 minutes ago, Justin Z said:

 

 

Superb 👏👏👏

[Bazzas right boot]

4 minutes ago, luckyBatistuta said:

Not different as far as I’m concerned. The country voted, Yes lost, but plenty people wouldn’t and still won’t accept that vote. That’s no different to the Brexit vote, this US vote and whatever the next big one is.

 

 

Fair enough. 

I avoid shed discussions. 

 

My thoughts are that if you win a single issue vote by promising certain things, then you deliver. 

 

The winning side in particular should then deliver on said promises and be held accountable if they don't. 

 

I live in general with that moral code, as I think anything else is deceitful. 

 

 

 

[gashauskis9]

Glad Nevada isn’t going to be vital.  They’re feckin useless. 

[Justin Z]

3 minutes ago, Smith's right boot said:

 

My thoughts are that if you win a single issue vote by promising certain things, then you deliver.

 

 

No no, you can literally do the opposite, because once there's an election, the democratic process is over, permanently, and you can never complain because democracy happens one time and then ends.

 

The people who are wrong are those who think that's shan, and who exercise one of the most fundamental freedoms in a liberal democracy, the right to demonstrate, to express their feelings.

 

Edited November 6, 2020 by Justin Z

[Kalamazoo Jambo]

6 hours ago, Justin Z said:

I would just like to point out that Biden has won Michigan by ~20,000. Jo Jorgensen, the Libertarian candidate, got about 60,000 votes.

 

Biden is hanging on in Georgia, where Jorgensen has also received 60,000 votes to now.

 

You lot telling me if I didn't cast my ballot for Biden I'd be giving my vote to Trump? You all can, with the best spirited of intentions, ram it. A THIRD-PARTY VOTE WAS A VOTE FOR BIDEN.

I would like to point out Biden won Michigan by 145,000. And a vote for anyone other than Biden is not a vote for Biden. That seems... obvious.

[Jambo-Jimbo]

[Ray Gin]

19 minutes ago, Justin Z said:

 

 

 

 

 

[Bazzas right boot]

23 minutes ago, Justin Z said:

 

 

 

 

😂😂😂

 

Stop the steal... Stop coubting votes that I don't agree with. 

 

It's a brass neck. 

Edited November 6, 2020 by Smith's right boot

[luckyBatistuta]

9 minutes ago, Smith's right boot said:

 

 

Fair enough. 

I avoid shed discussions. 

 

My thoughts are that if you win a single issue vote by promising certain things, then you deliver. 

 

The winning side in particular should then deliver on said promises and be held accountable if they don't. 

 

I live in general with that moral code, as I think anything else is deceitful. 

 

 

 

As I said bud, I did vote Yes and was gutted to lose the vote, but on taking part in that said vote, I did accept that there was the possibility of losing, that’s how it works. None of the parties deliver on all the promises they make in every vote, just as Biden won’t and neither would Trump have. 

Edited November 6, 2020 by luckyBatistuta

[Justin Z]

7 minutes ago, Kalamazoo Jambo said:

I would like to point out Biden won Michigan by 145,000. And a vote for anyone other than Biden is not a vote for Biden. That seems... obvious.

 

Correct. It was Wisconsin, and Jorgensen got about 40,000. Sorry, you upper midwest weirdos all sound the same and I get confused

 

You never gave me grief for considering the idea that just maybe, voting for Joe Biden and upholding this system was bad, and that my vote for a third party would be "a vote for Trump". That post was definitely not directed at you.

 

Also edit to add: I shat it and voted for Biden anyway, for the avoidance of doubt

 

Edited November 6, 2020 by Justin Z

[Spellczech]

26 minutes ago, Smith's right boot said:

 

 

Nah, referendums aree a bit different, if you make promises and win you should deliver if not all at least some of what you promised. 

 

I think the losing sides in both referendums you mention are more angry about the winning side not delivering on almost anything they said they would, as opposed to losing. 

 

That's what annoys me the most and imo should annoy anyone who values democracy. 

 

Politicians in general talk shite but when you promise a, b and c in order to win a referendum that was in the balance they should deliver. 

 

The winning and losing side should hold them accountable, but it seems as you say winning is more important than actually delivering on the policies and/ or promises that got you the win. 

 

It's shite. 

 

 

Absolutely agree with everything here. You do sometimes wonder if universal suffrage is actually a good idea. Why are people who have no interest in what is actually happening in the country voting? What use is an uninformed opinion?

[Kalamazoo Jambo]

1 minute ago, Justin Z said:

 

Correct. It was Wisconsin, and Jorgensen got about 40,000. Sorry, you upper midwest weirdos all sound the same and I get confused

 

You never gave me grief for considering the idea that just maybe, voting for Joe Biden and upholding this system was bad, and that my vote for a third party would be "a vote for Trump". That post was definitely not directed at you.

 

Trust me, my accent would confuse anyone

[redjambo]

3 minutes ago, Justin Z said:

 

Correct. It was Wisconsin, and Jorgensen got about 40,000. Sorry, you upper midwest weirdos all sound the same and I get confused

 

You never gave me grief for considering the idea that just maybe, voting for Joe Biden and upholding this system was bad, and that my vote for a third party would be "a vote for Trump". That post was definitely not directed at you.

 

Also edit to add: I shat it and voted for Biden anyway, for the avoidance of doubt

 

 

Ha, knew you would!

 

Thanks for your contribution in shifting Donnie.

[redjambo]

3 minutes ago, Spellczech said:

Absolutely agree with everything here. You do sometimes wonder if universal suffrage is actually a good idea. Why are people who have no interest in what is actually happening in the country voting? What use is an uninformed opinion?

 

Benevolent oligarchy, FTW!

[Bazzas right boot]

1 minute ago, luckyBatistuta said:

As I said bud, I did vote Yes and was gutted to lose the vote, but on taking part in that said vote, I did accept that there was the possibility of losing, that’s how it works. None of the parties deliver on all the promises they make in every vote. 

 

 

Yeah, governments are slightly different as it's various policies and some may be delivered, sone amended and some dismissed 

 

IMO referendums, being far more focused and on a individual bases, when won-  the winning party should deliver. 

 

In regards to the yes vote, ironically if the promises from the no side were delivered  then the yes 2 movement would be far less inclusive , the fact it's pretty much been the complete opposite of what was promised by the no side has turned many in the centre who where no to yes. 

 

Interesting times. 

 

At least the trumpet has been removed, although it won't be a progressive America, a docile America is far more safer and friendlier than that complete joke. 

 

 

[Spellczech]

1 minute ago, redjambo said:

 

Benevolent oligarchy, FTW!

I'd have a test before voting - Every vote gets cast but only those who pass the test actually get counted.

[Bazzas right boot]

5 minutes ago, Spellczech said:

Absolutely agree with everything here. You do sometimes wonder if universal suffrage is actually a good idea. Why are people who have no interest in what is actually happening in the country voting? What use is an uninformed opinion?

 

 

Another discussion and I was thinking the same thing just today! 

[redjambo]

Just now, Spellczech said:

I'd have a test before voting - Every vote gets cast but only those who pass the test actually get counted.

 

What sort of test? Political knowledge? Wire loop game?

[Justin Z]

1 minute ago, Spellczech said:

I'd have a test before voting - Every vote gets cast but only those who pass the test actually get counted.

 

I know it's not meant this way on your part, but they used to do that shit in the American south in the Jim Crow era.

 

Here's a sample:

 

The moral is, you'd have to be extremely careful implementing something like this.

[Spellczech]

Let all the parties with MPs choose 2 questions each and anyone who gets more than 50% passes. Replace mail votes with online votes and get into the 21st century. 

[Bazzas right boot]

3 minutes ago, Spellczech said:

I'd have a test before voting - Every vote gets cast but only those who pass the test actually get counted.

 

I agree, but it's controversial and would be difficult be fair. 

 

Just argued with the wife, she didn't think swans could fly..... 

🤔😭😭😭

[Spellczech]

1 minute ago, Smith's right boot said:

 

I agree, but it's controversial and would be difficult be fair. 

 

Just argued with the wife, she didn't think swans could fly..... 

🤔😭😭😭

Well that is obviously the No1 question of the Tories...

[Kalamazoo Jambo]

15 minutes ago, Justin Z said:

 

Also edit to add: I shat it and voted for Biden anyway, for the avoidance of doubt

 

 

Thanks for that - I wasn't going to ask. I appreciate that wouldn't have been easy for you.

[RobboM]

6 minutes ago, redjambo said:

 

What sort of test? Political knowledge? Wire loop game?

 

 

[redjambo]

6 minutes ago, Justin Z said:

 

I know it's not meant this way on your part, but they used to do that shit in the American south in the Jim Crow era.

 

Here's a sample:

 

The moral is, you'd have to be extremely careful implementing something like this.

 

Bloody hell. That would be difficult for folk on the spectrum who think about things slightly differently. Numbers 6 and 12 are open to debate imo, for example.

Edited November 6, 2020 by redjambo

[Bazzas right boot]

4 minutes ago, Justin Z said:

 

I know it's not meant this way on your part, but they used to do that shit in the American south in the Jim Crow era.

 

Here's a sample:

 

The moral is, you'd have to be extremely careful implementing something like this.

 

 

Could be much simpler now, for the usa at least. 

 

Please answer yes or no to the 3 questions below. 

 

1.  In a democracy Do Postal votes count as much as a personal ballot? 

 

2. In a democracy, should all votes be counted or just the votes that match your own. 

 

3. Is social media a reliable fact checking service? 

 

You must get 100% to be eligible for voting. 

 

 

[Justin Z]

1 minute ago, redjambo said:

 

Bloody hell. That would be difficult for folk on the spectrum who think about things slightly differently. Numbers 6 and 12 are open to debate imo, for example.

 

And of course they'd figure out a way to say any Black person got one wrong, even if they didn't.

 

Let's just say there won't ever be a voting test again in the United States Other countries' mileage may vary

[redjambo]

5 minutes ago, Smith's right boot said:

 

I agree, but it's controversial and would be difficult be fair. 

 

Just argued with the wife, she didn't think swans could fly..... 

🤔😭😭😭

 

Having caught several swans, I can guarantee that they can fly. They just take a wee while to get the speed to get off the water. Gorgeous sound and view as they do though (I would be in a rigid inflatable right alongside them with a net as they were in take-off mode).

[RobboM]

Just now, Smith's right boot said:

 

 

Could be much simpler now, for the usa at least. 

 

Please answer yes or no to the 3 questions below. 

 

1.  In a democracy Do Postal votes count as much as a personal ballot? 

 

2. In a democracy, should all votes be counted or just the votes that match your own. 

 

3. Is social media a reliable fact checking service? 

 

You must get 100% to be eligible for voting. 

 

 

Fake news! How can you get 100% when there's only 3 questions! USA! USA!

[King prawn]

45 minutes ago, Justin Z said:

 

 

 

[redjambo]

1 minute ago, RobboM said:

Fake news! How can you get 100% when there's only 3 questions! USA! USA!

 

[Bazzas right boot]

1 minute ago, RobboM said:

Fake news! How can you get 100% when there's only 3 questions! USA! USA!

 

😂😂

 

Ok

 

4th question. 

 

If you lose the election do you accept the result or put people's heads on spikes outside the Whitehouse? 

 

I'll make the pass rate fairer as well, 4 questions - 76% or above to pass, not 100%😜

[CavySlaveJambo]

Trump (or a saner member of his camp) has claimed the election has been rigged or the entire electoral system in the US is corrupt. 

Edited November 6, 2020 by CavySlaveJambo

[vegas-voss]

It's took him 4 years but he might finally drain the swamp if somehow Republicans lose the senate ( I'm not sure what happens if it is 50-50 )