U.S. Politics megathread (merged)

[jake]

We are simple people!

 

Its a opinion that is researched .

Its an alternate view.

And you pick one sentence with a wee stick man as a comeback.

 

Try harder wee man .

Mockery from you is feeble.

[jake]

Do folk seriously see hereditary multi billionaire Trump as some sort of anti establishment figure?

 

I think they do.

But then a lot saw and still cling onto that Obama was/is.

 

So i guess theres lots of dafties out there.

[JamboX2]

Have you any idea what those trade deals meant for democracy ?

 

No what was it? Do you think bilateral trade with America First America will be good for the UK? Afterall, Trump today stated he wanted a border tax meaning US companies making products in the UK will face punitive costs selling to the American market. Equally, he wants high tariffs. What good for Land Rover, Jaguar, BAE, Nissan and the like of selling to an American market if their products are hit by sky high tariffs making it costly to sell.

 

Deary me the trade union movement everywhere is against it.

The left everywhere are against it .

It was a charter for multu national companies to be able to sue elected governments at the taxpayers expense if their profit was affected by legislation.

 

And American firms given free trade to the UK won't want to do that here?

 

One example of a widely opposed deal especially amongst the poorest nations.

 

Of course you have already stated that their lot in life should be to make your jeans cheaper.

Don't put words in my mouth.

 

Do you believe trade will benefit or hinder developing nations? Do you think us investing in the third world by trade will be good or bad in the long run?

 

As for your cheap jeans remark... your earlier post was about UK workers. That's scandalous. But that is the fault of the UK authorities not enforcing the rules on the minimum wage. Not immigration. Not the EU.

[Malinga the Swinga]

By the look of his cabinet appointments, he is really trying to establish a link with the common men and women from the USA, by establishing the richest group of politicians ever to exist. Some of them have so much cash, even Trump is poorer than them.

[Notts1874]

I said it was an opinion piece.

Did you actually read it?

It provided sources to show who was financially and politically organising it.

 

Of course i accept that trump is not a president i would want never mind the many groups that protested.

But the hypocrisy is unbelievable.

 

But then im cynical about everything notts.

I believe it doesnt matter who is president really as was proved by Obamas terms.

This view is based on what actually happened under his leadership as opposed to what might happen.

Yes I read it and gave you my opinion on it.

[Craig Gordons Gloves]

I said it was an opinion piece.

Did you actually read it?

It provided sources to show who was financially and politically organising it.

 

Of course i accept that trump is not a president i would want never mind the many groups that protested.

But the hypocrisy is unbelievable.

 

But then im cynical about everything notts.

I believe it doesnt matter who is president really as was proved by Obamas terms.

This view is based on what actually happened under his leadership as opposed to what might happen.

 

Jake - i read it - thanks for providing a link. 

 

Here's my take on it.  Some of the groups that are key organizers have received money from George Soros.  I don't know enough about Soros (every time i see his name i assume it's going to be about some conspiracy about how he is taking over the world) but what I would say is echos what Notts said - the marches were organized, but the projections for attendance seemed to be quite off.  The local march here in St Paul was expected to be attended by up to 20,000 people.  In the end, officials (that's city officials) estimate that number to be between 90k and 100k.  That's quite a number of people that seem to care enough to want to be seen.  I doubt that the vast majority of people were paid to be there or were coerced into being there.

 

We disagree on Obama - i believe he's been good in the main for the US but we've had that conversation and i know we won't see things the same way. I'm glad you wouldn't like to have Trump as president - the problem that I see is that he now is the president and his loose cannon, scatter gun, narcissistic approach to everything is going to be bad for people the world over and as such, i'm pleased that many sought their democratic right to voice their opinion in marches.  

[Martin_T]

By the look of his cabinet appointments, he is really trying to establish a link with the common men and women from the USA, by establishing the richest group of politicians ever to exist. Some of them have so much cash, even Trump is poorer than them.

....and a policy agenda that is so hilariously right wing it may as well have been written in the blood of the'common man'.

 

Possibly the most 'establishment' government ever put into power. Just as well protectionism when it was last tried didn't lead to the great depression eh?

[Craig Gordons Gloves]

....and a policy agenda that is so hilariously right wing it may as well have been written in the blood of the'common man'.

 

Possibly the most 'establishment' government ever put into power. Just as well protectionism when it was last tried didn't lead to the great depression eh?

 

I'm a huge fan of his nominee for Education - in that i think she's a total fruit loop that has ersed up the Michigan education system and could very well do the same for the country. I'm hoping that if any of the nominations can be blocked, that it's hers. 

[jake]

No what was it? Do you think bilateral trade with America First America will be good for the UK? Afterall, Trump today stated he wanted a border tax meaning US companies making products in the UK will face punitive costs selling to the American market. Equally, he wants high tariffs. What good for Land Rover, Jaguar, BAE, Nissan and the like of selling to an American market if their products are hit by sky high tariffs making it costly to sell.

 

 

And American firms given free trade to the UK won't want to do that here?

 

 

Don't put words in my mouth.

 

Do you believe trade will benefit or hinder developing nations? Do you think us investing in the third world by trade will be good or bad in the long run?

 

As for your cheap jeans remark... your earlier post was about UK workers. That's scandalous. But that is the fault of the UK authorities not enforcing the rules on the minimum wage. Not immigration. Not the EU.

 

Eh?

I addressed all those points in the post you're responding to.

 

If for example the UK set ommissions higher than another country also signed up to TTIP then a multinational could sue westminster with our tax money footing the companies legal bill i might add if that law affected their profits.

 

They could in theory have that law over ruled because this treaty in effect would supercede it.

Pretty much like EU law.

 

As for our record of investment in the third world through TTIP.

 

My goodness jambox2.

Is the EU good for anyone outside the EU.

 

I mean it cant be as you predict carnage.

Id love if the poor of the world were really allowed to play by the rules.

They are not.

They are cheated and robbed .

 

And the concentration of wealth has gotten that bad that you see some sense in immigrants being shipped in to make jeans on half sorry less than half the minium rate.

Did you notice which countries these people came from.

 

Freedom of movement as some kind of basic humanitarian banner for the EU is a red herring.

It was made for poor people to help big business .

 

Imo of course.

[jake]

....and a policy agenda that is so hilariously right wing it may as well have been written in the blood of the'common man'.

 

Possibly the most 'establishment' government ever put into power. Just as well protectionism when it was last tried didn't lead to the great depression eh?

 

Wonder if he will go as far right as the last 8 years.

[jake]

I'm a huge fan of his nominee for Education - in that i think she's a total fruit loop that has ersed up the Michigan education system and could very well do the same for the country. I'm hoping that if any of the nominations can be blocked, that it's hers.

 

Well stranger things have happened.

The president who broke the record for war mongering won a nobel peace prize.

[Notts1874]

Jake this is a thread about Trump not your hatred of Obama.

[jake]

Jake this is a thread about Trump not your hatred of Obama.

 

Who said i hated Obama?

Posters are quite rightly concerned about trumps right wing government yet either big up obama or ignore the right wing policies of the last 8 years.

[jake]

Yes I read it and gave you my opinion on it.

 

Its my ball and im no playing type post.

[Notts1874]

Jake I gave you my opinion on the article and marches. Just because you don't like that opinion doesn't make it invalid.

 

For you to claim you don't hate Obama is frankly laughable after reading your posts. You are the one that keeps attempting to pull the conversation back that way.

[elvoys]

I don't recall any outrage in my post. Nor do i recall any support for Hillary in it.

 

Who are the partners Jake? Who financed it?

 

The point I was making was that if 3 million (apologies to ATIS for the number, I am simple and take what i read from experts in crowds as relatively close to the facts) is that those that showed up to march did so to make a point that legislators shouldn't forget that there is a large group that need to be considered when decisions are made that affect this group and they aren't going to just take it.

 

I trust this clarifies matters etc.

Soros actually is all over this this time. And I urge you to follow the mess that is this Linda sarsour debacle. A march that could have been a memorable statement if there was some coherence of message and priciples has basically become a microcausm of how the american left has devoured itself through identity politics. She is literally a pro Sharia, Saudi advocating, married to a Hamas fundraiser. Alex jones coyldnt habe written this. But all the usual suspects who sold their soul ages ago (SPLC etc) are doubling down with not a single argument to save face.

[John Findlay]

I'm a huge fan of his nominee for Education - in that i think she's a total fruit loop that has ersed up the Michigan education system and could very well do the same for the country. I'm hoping that if any of the nominations can be blocked, that it's hers.

The USA has an education system? News to me.

[jake]

Jake I gave you my opinion on the article and marches. Just because you don't like that opinion doesn't make it invalid.

 

For you to claim you don't hate Obama is frankly laughable after reading your posts. You are the one that keeps attempting to pull the conversation back that way.

 

Actually im trying to point out that for all the hoo ha about trump it will be no worse than obamas terms.

 

And that what might happen seems to bother you more than what has actually happened.

 

Now thats laughable .

And worrying.

Because it tells me people care less about the truth than they do political dogma.

 

And in effect means that someone like Obama cant change things because politic is trapped in a narrow choice and the fight between left and right is a fight for a bald mans comb.

[i8hibsh]

Has the world ended yet?

[jake]

Soros actually is all over this this time. And I urge you to follow the mess that is this Linda sarsour debacle. A march that could have been a memorable statement if there was some coherence of message and priciples has basically become a microcausm of how the american left has devoured itself through identity politics. She is literally a pro Sharia, Saudi advocating, married to a Hamas fundraiser. Alex jones coyldnt habe written this. But all the usual suspects who sold their soul ages ago (SPLC etc) are doubling down with not a single argument to save face.

 

Its so blatantly obvious i cant get my head round as to how people dont see it.

[Notts1874]

Actually im trying to point out that for all the hoo ha about trump it will be no worse than obamas terms.

 

And that what might happen seems to bother you more than what has actually happened.

 

Now thats laughable .

And worrying.

Because it tells me people care less about the truth than they do political dogma.

 

And in effect means that someone like Obama cant change things because politic is trapped in a narrow choice and the fight between left and right is a fight for a bald mans comb.

Edit. Can't be arsed.

Edited January 23, 2017 by Notts1874

[Norm]

The way I see it, regardless of what his policies are, is that as head of state he'll be involved in diplomacy. He doesn't strike me as someone who's capable of being diplomatic. Whilst being bullish and speaking your mind might be a great asset for a business man, I'm not sure it's a fine attribute for a president.

[niblick1874]

No what was it? Do you think bilateral trade with America First America will be good for the UK? Afterall, Trump today stated he wanted a border tax meaning US companies making products in the UK will face punitive costs selling to the American market. Equally, he wants high tariffs. What good for Land Rover, Jaguar, BAE, Nissan and the like of selling to an American market if their products are hit by sky high tariffs making it costly to sell.

 

 

And American firms given free trade to the UK won't want to do that here?

 

 

Don't put words in my mouth.

 

Do you believe trade will benefit or hinder developing nations? Do you think us investing in the third world by trade will be good or bad in the long run?

 

As for your cheap jeans remark... your earlier post was about UK workers. That's scandalous. But that is the fault of the UK authorities not enforcing the rules on the minimum wage. Not immigration. Not the EU.

Are you telling us the TPP is a good idea? 

Edited January 24, 2017 by niblick1874

[niblick1874]

Soros actually is all over this this time. And I urge you to follow the mess that is this Linda sarsour debacle. A march that could have been a memorable statement if there was some coherence of message and priciples has basically become a microcausm of how the american left has devoured itself through identity politics. She is literally a pro Sharia, Saudi advocating, married to a Hamas fundraiser. Alex jones coyldnt habe written this. But all the usual suspects who sold their soul ages ago (SPLC etc) are doubling down with not a single argument to save face.

When you asked them to google it I waited for those that came across the 60 minutes interview from the 60's with her telling everyone about the CIA involvement. O well.

 

Edit, It was the Russians. Fact.

Edited January 24, 2017 by niblick1874

[jamboz]

 

Who said i hated Obama?

Posters are quite rightly concerned about trumps right wing government yet either big up obama or ignore the right wing policies of the last 8 years.

 

 

Obamacare right wing??

[Craig Gordons Gloves]

The USA has an education system? News to me.

Very droll JF. It's actually not bad in some respects and bloody awful in others. Teachers are massively underpaid and unless they're tenured they generally have to reapply for their job each year which is ridiculous. We've got teachers working part time for us as well as teaching full time to make ends meet. That being said, my kids teachers over the past 4 years from kindergarten have been excellent. Sadly, the school is closing down and we live in a relatively well funded area. I imagine in some less well funded areas it's awful. Betsy DeVos will be a disaster for education.

[Craig Gordons Gloves]

Who said i hated Obama?

Posters are quite rightly concerned about trumps right wing government yet either big up obama or ignore the right wing policies of the last 8 years.

What right wing policies? The affordable care act, marriage equality act, investing in the infrastructure, bailing out the car industry etc are hardly the policies of a right wing politician.

[Watt-Zeefuik]

Actually im trying to point out that for all the hoo ha about trump it will be no worse than obamas terms.

 

And that what might happen seems to bother you more than what has actually happened.

 

Now thats laughable .

And worrying.

Because it tells me people care less about the truth than they do political dogma.

 

And in effect means that someone like Obama cant change things because politic is trapped in a narrow choice and the fight between left and right is a fight for a bald mans comb.

 

Jake, if you're going to continue with this nonsense at a rate of 30 posts a day, have the decency to respond to one of my many attempts to respond to you on it.  To wit -- that by any metric, Obama as President promoted the least state-sponsored violence of any President since Carter, and that the level of violence he perpetuated dropped precipitously compared to his predecessor. 

 

Further, activists across the US spent years protesting various aspects of Obama's foreign policy, including drone strikes and the handling of Libya.  The fact that you did not hear of it is not their fault.  I don't even agree with all of them, but your repeated line about this is patently nonsense and it's doing my head in.

 

You have one narrative in your head which has only the slightest thread of a connection to anything resembling truth, and you have refused to substantiate it beyond simply repeating a few memorized numbers.  FFS, stop it.

 

Now, as to whether the Women's March was somehow orchestrated by George Soros.  For those with still functioning critical thinking skills, try to figure out how Soros got 4 million people into the streets across the country.  My 72-year old parents were not paid by Soros -- they stayed with us in Richmond then took the train in to DC to meet friends from Peace Corps.  My sister-in-law was not paid by Soros -- she drove up as a break from law school.  My college friends were not paid by Soros to be there -- some of them walked down from their houses.  Many of the people they met there had chartered their own buses to get there.  FFS if Soros could mastermind one of the biggest street protests in the history of the country, don't you think he'd have done it before now?

 

The attacks on Linda Sarsour are as predictable as they are despicable. 

[hughesie27]

Think the guy's a narrcissistic bully but he was democratically elected......unlike May.

 

Call an election, ya poor Thatcher tribute act !

Can you tell me a Prime Minister who has been democratically elected?

[elvoys]

Jake, if you're going to continue with this nonsense at a rate of 30 posts a day, have the decency to respond to one of my many attempts to respond to you on it. To wit -- that by any metric, Obama as President promoted the least state-sponsored violence of any President since Carter, and that the level of violence he perpetuated dropped precipitously compared to his predecessor.

 

Further, activists across the US spent years protesting various aspects of Obama's foreign policy, including drone strikes and the handling of Libya. The fact that you did not hear of it is not their fault. I don't even agree with all of them, but your repeated line about this is patently nonsense and it's doing my head in.

 

You have one narrative in your head which has only the slightest thread of a connection to anything resembling truth, and you have refused to substantiate it beyond simply repeating a few memorized numbers. FFS, stop it.

 

Now, as to whether the Women's March was somehow orchestrated by George Soros. For those with still functioning critical thinking skills, try to figure out how Soros got 4 million people into the streets across the country. My 72-year old parents were not paid by Soros -- they stayed with us in Richmond then took the train in to DC to meet friends from Peace Corps. My sister-in-law was not paid by Soros -- she drove up as a break from law school. My college friends were not paid by Soros to be there -- some of them walked down from their houses. Many of the people they met there had chartered their own buses to get there. FFS if Soros could mastermind one of the biggest street protests in the history of the country, don't you think he'd have done it before now?

 

The attacks on Linda Sarsour are as predictable as they are despicable.

Please tell me that wasn't your closing statement? Pointing out how utterly insane the leftist scope has become is attacking her? Am I 'attacking' the Kkk by pointing out their followers' beliefs?

 

Damn right its predictable though cos some people are awake to outrageous hypocrisy. What part of sharia do the pink hat wearers find exactly so cosy? Is it death for apostates or the variation in stone size or being imprisoned / killed cos u can't prove rape? An utter travesty to defend this woman.

Edited January 24, 2017 by elvoys

[JamboX2]

Are you telling us the TPP is a good idea?

To a degree, yes.

[John Findlay]

Very droll JF. It's actually not bad in some respects and bloody awful in others. Teachers are massively underpaid and unless they're tenured they generally have to reapply for their job each year which is ridiculous. We've got teachers working part time for us as well as teaching full time to make ends meet. That being said, my kids teachers over the past 4 years from kindergarten have been excellent. Sadly, the school is closing down and we live in a relatively well funded area. I imagine in some less well funded areas it's awful. Betsy DeVos will be a disaster for education.

Like most of the USA(the country was set up this way from the very start) if you have the money all well and good. If you don't then tough shit. As a country they have no intention of giving all their population a half decent education and to me that has been their great shame.

[Unknown user]

Like most of the USA(the country was set up this way from the very start) if you have the money all well and good. If you don't then tough shit. As a country they have no intention of giving all their population a half decent education and to me that has been their great shame.

New York was certainly set up that way, and Trump is definitely a son of new York!

 

I've been watching a documentary series about the place, really interesting. While most places in the new world were settled by people with beliefs who wanted to practice them in peace, New York was founded as New Amsterdam by the Dutch who were only interested in making money from the fur trade. It was unique in that it took 17 years before they got round to building the first church - money was God and the pursuit of riches and self serving was, and stil is, the driving force behind new York.

Trump and his presidency will be a reflection of that - you have opportunity, don't expect help as well

[Francis Albert]

The way I see it, regardless of what his policies are, is that as head of state he'll be involved in diplomacy. He doesn't strike me as someone who's capable of being diplomatic. Whilst being bullish and speaking your mind might be a great asset for a business man, I'm not sure it's a fine attribute for a president.

"Being diplomatic" is not a strong attribute of Putin or most of the other major players he has to deal with.

[Jamboelite]

"Being diplomatic" is not a strong attribute of Putin or most of the other major players he has to deal with.

And someone who cant stop his twitter feed if he gets the slightest criticism even from an actress isnt someone you want to be going into a political discussion with a hardened, politically savvy leader.

 

I would rather someone was street smart than business bully in these circumstances and that should worry people alongside his inability to focus on major policy without scattering his views and attention all over the place.

Edited January 24, 2017 by Jamboelite

[Maple Leaf]

The immortal words of Robert Burns:

 

O my Luve's like a red, red rose
That?s newly sprung in June;
O my Luve's like the melodie
That?s sweetly play'd in tune.
As fair art thou, my bonnie lass,
So deep in luve am I:

 

And I will luve thee still, my dear,
Till a? the seas gang dry:

 

And the immortal words of Donald Trump:

 

?I moved on her, and I failed. I?ll admit it.  I did try and f--- her. She was married, and I moved on her very heavily.  I moved on her like a bitch, but I couldn?t get there. And she was married. Then all of a sudden I see her, she?s now got the big phony tits and everything. She?s totally changed her look.  You know I?m automatically attracted to beautiful ? I just start kissing them. It?s like a magnet. Just kiss. I don?t even wait.  And when you?re a star, they let you do it.  You can do anything.  Grab them by the p---y. You can do anything.?

 

And some people are proud that he?s their President.  I?m guessing that those people don?t have a wife or a daughter.

[Francis Albert]

 

The immortal words of Robert Burns:

 

O my Luve's like a red, red rose

That?s newly sprung in June;

O my Luve's like the melodie

That?s sweetly play'd in tune.

As fair art thou, my bonnie lass,

So deep in luve am I:

 

And I will luve thee still, my dear,

Till a? the seas gang dry:

 

And the immortal words of Donald Trump:

 

?I moved on her, and I failed. I?ll admit it.  I did try and f--- her. She was married, and I moved on her very heavily.  I moved on her like a bitch, but I couldn?t get there. And she was married. Then all of a sudden I see her, she?s now got the big phony tits and everything. She?s totally changed her look.  You know I?m automatically attracted to beautiful ? I just start kissing them. It?s like a magnet. Just kiss. I don?t even wait.  And when you?re a star, they let you do it.  You can do anything.  Grab them by the p---y. You can do anything.?

 

And some people are proud that he?s their President.  I?m guessing that those people don?t have a wife or a daughter.

 

A lot of wives and daughters voted for him however, despite those words.

 

And is this Robert Burns related to the famous womaniser whose first child was by his mother's servant?

[jake]

A lot of wives and daughters voted for him however, despite those words.

 

And is this Robert Burns related to the famous womaniser whose first child was by his mother's servant?

 

Quality

[Maple Leaf]

A lot of wives and daughters voted for him however, despite those words.

 

And is this Robert Burns related to the famous womaniser whose first child was by his mother's servant?

With Burns it was consensual.

 

With Trump it was sexual assault.

 

Please tell me that you're not trying to rationalise Trump's behaviour.

[Francis Albert]

With Burns it was consensual.

 

With Trump it was sexual assault.

 

Please tell me that you're not trying to rationalise Trump's behaviour.

Burns impregnated quite a string of women, specialising in servants who, especially after he became rich and famous, while they may have consented, were hardly doing so on equal terms. Unfortunately servants who fell pregnant often lost their jobs and became destitute and this included some of Burns "consensual" partners. I am not rationalising Trump's behaviour just pointing out the hypocrisy surrounding Trump. I am pretty sure Burns damaged more womens' lives than Trump has done, however fine his words were.

Edited January 24, 2017 by Francis Albert

[Unknown user]

Quality

Diverting from the point being made by going "whatabout Burns' sexual proclivities" is quality now?

 

Thank God you don't do quality control where I work!

[jake]

Jake, if you're going to continue with this nonsense at a rate of 30 posts a day, have the decency to respond to one of my many attempts to respond to you on it. To wit -- that by any metric, Obama as President promoted the least state-sponsored violence of any President since Carter, and that the level of violence he perpetuated dropped precipitously compared to his predecessor.

 

Further, activists across the US spent years protesting various aspects of Obama's foreign policy, including drone strikes and the handling of Libya. The fact that you did not hear of it is not their fault. I don't even agree with all of them, but your repeated line about this is patently nonsense and it's doing my head in.

 

You have one narrative in your head which has only the slightest thread of a connection to anything resembling truth, and you have refused to substantiate it beyond simply repeating a few memorized numbers. FFS, stop it.

 

Now, as to whether the Women's March was somehow orchestrated by George Soros. For those with still functioning critical thinking skills, try to figure out how Soros got 4 million people into the streets across the country. My 72-year old parents were not paid by Soros -- they stayed with us in Richmond then took the train in to DC to meet friends from Peace Corps. My sister-in-law was not paid by Soros -- she drove up as a break from law school. My college friends were not paid by Soros to be there -- some of them walked down from their houses. Many of the people they met there had chartered their own buses to get there. FFS if Soros could mastermind one of the biggest street protests in the history of the country, don't you think he'd have done it before now?

 

The attacks on Linda Sarsour are as predictable as they are despicable.

 

I apologise for the number of posts.

 

I didnt realise i had missed previous questions from you .

 

Yes it would seem on the surface that US foreign policy has resulted in fewer deaths.

That direct US involvement in scale is down.

Although in more countries.

 

I could though go through most conflicts in Africa over the last 8 years and discuss with you who was agitating who.

 

Whilst agree that China is also in Africa they go about it in a way that Obama alluded to in his early statements of intent.

These countries have raw materials.

 

These countries along with others have had civil wars to curl your toes.

 

Who is behind these wars?

 

Then there is the theatre of war you talk about.

It hasnt stopped and yes the level of killing has come down from direct US involvement.

And left behind is sectarian wars where bombings and extreme violence is a daily occurence.Sectarian war now wheres the lessons to be learned why they occur?

Now i ask myself what are the reasons for these wars?

Who started them?

Who is on what side?

 

And the most important question.

Who benefits?

 

Im unaware of demonstrations against the drone strikes etc.

Im unaware of actors and actresses using their position to be critical of these things.

But i applaud the people who did.

 

Trump or Obama is the UK version of tory or tory max.

So i have been attacking the last 8 years for a massive fail.

Frankly its no argument to say he was less worse than others and im guessing he will be less worse than i imagine the next guy.

 

As for soros etc .

 

If you believe that with all the organisations involved and the power of politically driven media cannot have an effect on people then thats up to you.

I must add UA that i do respect your opinion and the way you view things and i will try to lessen my posts.

Although ive said the same about alcohol.

[Francis Albert]

Diverting from the point being made by going "whatabout Burns' sexual proclivities" is quality now?

 

Thank God you don't do quality control where I work!

It was hardly a diversion. I was responding to someone else's (IMO hypocritical) comparison of Burns and Trump.

[Jamboelite]

Burns impregnated quite a string of women, specialising in servants who, especially after he became rich and famous, while they may have consented, were hardly doing so on equal terms. Unfortunately servants who fell pregnant often lost their jobs and became destitute and this included some of Burns "consensual" partners. I am not rationalising Trump's behaviour just pointing out the hypocrisy surrounding Trump. I am pretty sure Burns damaged more womens' lives than Trump has done, however fine his words were.

Burns was born in 1759 perhaps comparing in any form is just ****ing stupid including ridiculous comments of "im pretty sure Burns damaged more lives than Trump" like that is even a comparable discussion.

[Francis Albert]

Burns was born in 1759 perhaps comparing in any form is just ******* stupid including ridiculous comments of "im pretty sure Burns damaged more lives than Trump" like that is even a comparable discussion.

Someone quoted Burns and Trump and started the comparison, expressing astonishment that anyone could be proud that Trump is their President. Yet a lot of us will be proudly celebrating Burns Day tomorrow without regard to his morality or personal behaviour. Just as Burns is celebrated for his poetry, maybe we should see how Trump performs as President before judging him in that capacity.

Edited January 24, 2017 by Francis Albert

[jake]

Diverting from the point being made by going "whatabout Burns' sexual proclivities" is quality now?

 

Thank God you don't do quality control where I work!

 

Aye ok .

If the original point was relevant then so was the reply

Cant have it both ways .

[Space Mackerel]

Someone quoted Burns and Trump and started the comparison, expressing astonishment that anyone could be proud that Trump is their President. Yet a lot of us will be proudly celebrating Burns Day tomorrow without regard to his morality or personal behaviour. Just as Burns is celebrated for his poetry, maybe we should see how Trump performs as President before judging him in that capacity.

Francis A, do just argue on here for the sake of it? You've already admitted to being a left wing Remainer but you argue for leaving the EU and ultra Conservative Donald Trumpet.

 

What is it you actually believe in? You're all over the joint.

[Francis Albert]

Francis A, do just argue on here for the sake of it? You've already admitted to being a left wing Remainer but you argue for leaving the EU and ultra Conservative Donald Trumpet.

 

What is it you actually believe in? You're all over the joint.

I believe in not being hypocritical, and in accepting democratic decisions that go against my own position.

Edited January 24, 2017 by Francis Albert

[Maple Leaf]

Burns impregnated quite a string of women, specialising in servants who, especially after he became rich and famous, while they may have consented, were hardly doing so on equal terms. Unfortunately servants who fell pregnant often lost their jobs and became destitute and this included some of Burns "consensual" partners. I am not rationalising Trump's behaviour just pointing out the hypocrisy surrounding Trump. I am pretty sure Burns damaged more womens' lives than Trump has done, however fine his words were.

There is no hypocrisy from me surrounding Trump.  He is a self-confessed sexual predator and a despicable human being because of that.

 

Your assertion that Burns was worse is absurd.  

[Space Mackerel]

I believe in not being hypocritical, and in accepting democratic decisions that go against your own position.

Ah, you just roll over and like your belly being tickled then whatever. Nice one.

 

I've accepted the EU referendum, however, as has been proved in court today, the Government are not always correct and it's taking 2 memebers of the public to draw this out with their own cash.