Where is the line?

[jack D and coke]

1 minute ago, Gizmo said:

We've been systematically destroyed by injury and then game after game refereeing decisions, which have contributed massively and eroded the confidence from the start of the season.

 

The second yellow card last night for Djoum, after the referee betrayed his agenda by trying to send off Zlamal for a single yellow, is transparent. He had every intention of sending someone off. These decisions week in week out have altered our season, no question. 

That in no way exonerates the team's performance yesterday, even if we were unjustifiably reduced to 10 men. In those circumstances, you roll up the ****ing sleeves and adopt a belligerent attitude. Many times 10 man sides take umbrage at their misfortune and go on to win or defy the opposition. 

Us? Rolled over to be tickled, against ****ing Ferranti Thistle on a rubber carpet in a joke named stadium. 

 

The line, I'd suggest, is if Levein fails to rectify this situation. Simple as that. 

 

Only Hearts could give what’s basically a junior outfit from a town famous for roundabouts their biggest win at the Tony ****ing Macaroni stadium. 

Its actually hilarious. 

[Jason Dufner]

The line was crossed last night.

 

Injuries or not that was an absolute embarrassment that can’t be accepted at a club like Hearts.

[bringonthesevco]

4 minutes ago, Gizmo said:

We've been systematically destroyed by injury and then game after game refereeing decisions, which have contributed massively and eroded the confidence from the start of the season.

 

The second yellow card last night for Djoum, after the referee betrayed his agenda by trying to send off Zlamal for a single yellow, is transparent. He had every intention of sending someone off. These decisions week in week out have altered our season, no question. 

That in no way exonerates the team's performance yesterday, even if we were unjustifiably reduced to 10 men. In those circumstances, you roll up the ****ing sleeves and adopt a belligerent attitude. Many times 10 man sides take umbrage at their misfortune and go on to win or defy the opposition. 

Us? Rolled over to be tickled, against ****ing Ferranti Thistle on a rubber carpet in a joke named stadium. 

 

The line, I'd suggest, is if Levein fails to rectify this situation. Simple as that. 

 

Destroyed by injury isn’t entirely true though is it - Levein has signed 9 midfield/wide players (all currently fit) - yet for the last 10 ish  games we’ve been unable to string 2 passes together .  That’s not down to injuries or poor referees that’s down to appalling signings ...

[jack D and coke]

1 minute ago, bringonthesevco said:

Destroyed by injury isn’t entirely true though is it - Levein has signed 9 midfield/wide players (all currently fit) - yet for the last 10 ish  games we’ve been unable to string 2 passes together .  That’s not down to injuries or poor referees that’s down to appalling signings ...

We actually make passing look really difficult. It must be hard trying to work out just what kind of pass Steven MacLean needs though. 

[Lord Beni of Gorgie]

1 hour ago, WeeChuck'sHeed said:

 

 

Nah, if we had DV and ulche but no Naismith we'd be better. 

 

It's a cumulative effect, ulche, then Naismith, Lafferty leaving no DV until Jan. 

 

Then Berra, followed by Souttar, followed by Dunne, then yesterday followed by Dikamona. 

 

This on top of Djoum missing the first part and Haring carrying a hernia. 

Not too mention the replacements Wighton and Clare being out for a year and a half between them. 

 

The injuries, at the same time have been horrible and derailed the season for a while. 

 

With Naismith, in about 1st if celtic continued their form. 

 

Without him but with some others 2nd-4th.

 

We wouldn't be in a relegation battle with this team minus Naismith. 

We also wouldn't have been top, tho. 

You have no idea at all how Vanecek will be. Which dilutes your input a good bit. Pure guesswork 

[bringonthesevco]

1 minute ago, jack D and coke said:

We actually make passing look really difficult. It must be hard trying to work out just what kind of pass Steven MacLean needs though. 

Agreed - but they could still just pass it to each other ?

[jack D and coke]

Just now, bringonthesevco said:

Agreed - but they could still just pass it to each other ?

 We can normally do 2 or 3 passes in a row if it’s going sideways or backwards before it’s hoofed in the general direction of empty shirt MacLean. 

[Bazzas right boot]

3 minutes ago, Sir Gio said:

You have no idea at all how Vanecek will be. Which dilutes your input a good bit. Pure guesswork 

 

Just another striking option will help, imo. 

 

Even if you think that, the rest of the posts stands. 

 

He could be shite, tho, you are correct on that. 

[bobskeldon]

Whilst agreeing that one or two decisions have cost us points against Rangers and St Johnstone, surely nobody (other than CL who must watch games with a bag over his head) is saying we deserved anything out of these games as a result of a good performance? We were terrible for 70 mins against Rangers and even worse at Perth! Time is up for CL and his cast of ‘coaches’!

[jbee647]

1 hour ago, WeeChuck'sHeed said:

 

 

The result effectively knock us out. 

 

My point still stands, it was still more embarrassing than last night. 

 

Infact, maybe add the 2-2 v Dunfermline on my list as well as another result worse than last nights ?. 

 

So there's two results from last season alone., cheers. 

But it didn’t knock us out.. as I said had we beat Dunfermline we would have won the section 

Look I get it you are a Hearts fan and you want to defend the club, I understand that, I will defend Hearts to the hilt against opposition fans every time

 However this is a Hearts fans forum full of fellow Jambos, we all see the same thing, at the moment we are a very poor team with very average players, arguing the case on here with fellow Hearts fans just looks like you are in total denial of the facts

[Brighton Jambo]

So many pant wetters on here.  Pathetic.  

 

At the start of the season we were playing some fantastic football, scoring goals and we were all delighted.  We then lose our two best attacking players, our captain and our best young defender.  And what happens, yes you guessed it, results and performances dropped off.  

 

What did people expect to happen?????

 

i honestly believe some people on here didn’t enjoy us winning and couldn’t wait for some bad results to get back to their anti - Levein patter.

 

last night was 15 minutes of unacceptable madness, nothing more and we will never see that happen again.  

[Bazzas right boot]

4 minutes ago, jbee647 said:

But it didn’t knock us out.. as I said had we beat Dunfermline we would have won the section 

Look I get it you are a Hearts fan and you want to defend the club, I understand that, I will defend Hearts to the hilt against opposition fans every time

 However this is a Hearts fans forum full of fellow Jambos, we all see the same thing, at the moment we are a very poor team with very average players, arguing the case on here with fellow Hearts fans just looks like you are in total denial of the facts

 

 

The facts? 

 

Last nights result is open to opinion whether it's the worst, up with the worst ever/ in recent memory etc. 

 

If sticking to the facts - 

 

We are doing better than this time v last year v both the lc and league performance. 

 

We have had injuries to key players at the same time. These injuries have coincided with our downturn in form. 

 

 

Very poor team? Compared to To who?

 

Celtic, rangers, st Johnstone, Killie Aberdeen, Livi, hibs, Hamilton, Barcelona?

 

The league table would suggest we are on par or better than most to date? 

 

 

[amadjambo]

2 hours ago, jambogaza said:

As I have said already, defeat to Aberdeen and hibs would be unacceptable and worthy of a sacking.

Many will feel the same. For me the performance in the Derby is the important thing. We need to go there and play with passion. If we play great and get suckered on the break, the vast majority would accept that. These things can happen. But a repeat of last nights performance, or the performance at St Mirren, and Levein can say goodbye. 

[bringonthesevco]

4 minutes ago, Brighton Jambo said:

So many pant wetters on here.  Pathetic.  

 

At the start of the season we were playing some fantastic football, scoring goals and we were all delighted.  We then lose our two best attacking players, our captain and our best young defender.  And what happens, yes you guessed it, results and performances dropped off.  

 

What did people expect to happen?????

 

i honestly believe some people on here didn’t enjoy us winning and couldn’t wait for some bad results to get back to their anti - Levein patter.

 

last night was 15 minutes of unacceptable madness, nothing more and we will never see that happen again.  

How long do you think that calling people  “pantwetters” is acceptable before you accept something is wrong ..  levein signed 8 of the starting 11 and 5 of the subs who produced one of the most spineless displays in a long long time .

 

He also signed 8/9 midfield / wide players - all fit , yet not one of them offers anything decent going forward ..

 

if all that and 1 win in 10 makes me a pantwetter in your mature opinion then so be it ..

[bringonthesevco]

6 minutes ago, WeeChuck'sHeed said:

 

 

The facts? 

 

Last nights result is open to opinion whether it's the worst, up with the worst ever/ in recent memory etc. 

 

If sticking to the facts - 

 

We are doing better than this time v last year v both the lc and league performance. 

 

We have had injuries to key players at the same time. These injuries have coincided with our downturn in form. 

 

 

Very poor team? Compared to To who?

 

Celtic, rangers, st Johnstone, Killie Aberdeen, Livi, hibs, Hamilton, Barcelona?

 

The league table would suggest we are on par or better than most to date? 

 

 

Not a single injured midfielder and  not an ounce of inspiration going forward....

[smiler]

7 minutes ago, WeeChuck'sHeed said:

 

 

The facts? 

 

Last nights result is open to opinion whether it's the worst, up with the worst ever/ in recent memory etc. 

 

If sticking to the facts - 

 

We are doing better than this time v last year v both the lc and league performance. 

 

We have had injuries to key players at the same time. These injuries have coincided with our downturn in form. 

 

 

Very poor team? Compared to To who?

 

Celtic, rangers, st Johnstone, Killie Aberdeen, Livi, hibs, Hamilton, Barcelona?

 

The league table would suggest we are on par or better than most to date? 

 

 

Do you not get tired of trotting out the same old shite? 

[graygo]

14 minutes ago, Brighton Jambo said:

So many pant wetters on here.  Pathetic.  

 

At the start of the season we were playing some fantastic football, scoring goals and we were all delighted.  We then lose our two best attacking players, our captain and our best young defender.  And what happens, yes you guessed it, results and performances dropped off.  

 

What did people expect to happen?????

 

i honestly believe some people on here didn’t enjoy us winning and couldn’t wait for some bad results to get back to their anti - Levein patter.

 

last night was 15 minutes of unacceptable madness, nothing more and we will never see that happen again.  

 

Everything you say is correct but the part highlighted is doubly so.

[Mr Elwood P]

https://www.bbc.co.uk/sport/football/38545988

 

Watching Man City v Everton just now, they mentioned that game. I wonder how many City fans wanted Pep Guardiola sacked after that defeat?

[Bazzas right boot]

20 minutes ago, Brighton Jambo said:

So many pant wetters on here.  Pathetic.  

 

At the start of the season we were playing some fantastic football, scoring goals and we were all delighted.  We then lose our two best attacking players, our captain and our best young defender.  And what happens, yes you guessed it, results and performances dropped off.  

 

What did people expect to happen?????

 

i honestly believe some people on here didn’t enjoy us winning and couldn’t wait for some bad results to get back to their anti - Levein patter.

 

last night was 15 minutes of unacceptable madness, nothing more and we will never see that happen again.  

 

100%

 

The eagerness to blame, moan and slaver rather than get behind the team is baffling. 

 

The complaints about lack of fight, metal, courage and spirit from the team by said posters tips the irony meter of the scale. 

 

 

 

 

Edited December 15, 2018 by WeeChuck'sHeed

[eyesandears]

Craig never wanted the job in the first place. He has since then had a heart attack and has admitted himself about calming down for his health. He would gladly step aside I'm sure if there was a suitable manager available.

Although I also heard Ann has already identified CL's replacement but we need to wait for him to finish the Main Stand construction ?

[Debut 4]

4 hours ago, Phil Dunphy said:

I'm gonna start this thread by saying this isn't a 'Levein Out' thread. I'm just curious to know where people believe the line is before it's a genuine concern for the club.

 

We're now on a run of one win in 10 games. Having scored two goals in those games (albeit we had about 3 wrongfully chalked off) and we're just off the back of a 5-0 hiding by a team that's just come up. We've conceded 20 goals since winning 3-0 away at Dundee and we're now in danger of slipping into the bottom 6 by the end of the first half of the season (after having been top for 3 months). The players aren't performing, they look completely bereft of confidence and some look dreadfully out of their depth.

 

So, where is the line? Where is the point where we look to bring in a new manager? There's a hell of a lot of clubs who'd have pulled the trigger on a manager with that recent run of results out there.

Depends what support , or lack of, the fans give the manager. 

 

Jim Jefferies ,in his second spell, was sacked after a draw and a defeat in 11/12.

 

But despite providing a largely fine season previously, the last dozen games of the 10/11 season were held against him...and by sections of the support, not just the board.  

 

6 draws, 6 defeats but it had been a great season until that spell. We walked to a top 3 spot. 

[magicTs]

12 minutes ago, Mr Elwood P said:

https://www.bbc.co.uk/sport/football/38545988

 

Watching Man City v Everton just now, they mentioned that game. I wonder how many City fans wanted Pep Guardiola sacked after that defeat?

 

 

Yep definitely comparable. Pep Guardiola and Craig Levein. Jesus wept. 

[Mr Elwood P]

1 minute ago, magicTs said:

 

 

Yep definitely comparable. Pep Guardiola and Craig Levein. Jesus wept. 

 

So Pep isn't open to criticism for losing a game 4-0 but Levein is for losing 5-0? Think you have missed my point.

[magicTs]

Just now, Mr Elwood P said:

 

So Pep isn't open to criticism for losing a game 4-0 but Levein is for losing 5-0? Think you have missed my point.

 

I don’t think you have a point. A one off defeat such as that for Pep and Man City is a mere blip. Where as a catalogue of constant failure, underachievement and a history of falling short defines Levein and his dismal side. 

[Top Corner]

2 hours ago, graygo said:

 

I don't need a pat on the back, it was an easy question to answer.

 

That you got wrong. 

[Mr Elwood P]

1 minute ago, magicTs said:

 

I don’t think you have a point. A one off defeat such as that for Pep and Man City is a mere blip. Where as a catalogue of constant failure, underachievement and a history of falling short defines Levein and his dismal side. 

 

We're 4th. We have the 4th biggest budget.We've spent more time top of the league than any other team this season. We reached our first cup semi final since admin. Your description of events and the reality of the situation are in different postcodes from one another.

[magicTs]

1 minute ago, Mr Elwood P said:

 

We're 4th. We have the 4th biggest budget.We've spent more time top of the league than any other team this season. We reached our first cup semi final since admin. Your description of events and the reality of the situation are in different postcodes from one another.

 

Delusional. Keep banging the drum for the serial failure. I’m sure he’ll beat Hamilton to keep you and the dwindling number of happy clappers content for another week. 

[Mr Elwood P]

Just now, magicTs said:

 

Delusional. Keep banging the drum for the serial failure. I’m sure he’ll beat Hamilton to keep you and the dwindling number of happy clappers content for another week. 

 

delusional

/dɪˈluːʒ(ə)n(ə)l/

adjective

 

1. characterized by or holding idiosyncratic beliefs or impressions that are contradicted by reality or rational argument, typically as a symptom of mental disorder.

   "hospitalization for schizophrenia and delusional paranoia"

   • based on or having faulty judgement; mistaken.

     "their delusional belief in the project's merits never wavers"

[151]

4 hours ago, Jambof3tornado said:

He will get the whole season. Lets see what happens when we get the key players back and dont have to rely on bench warmers as starters. When we lost Uche then naismith I knew we'd struggle but just had to somehow cling on. 

 

That said, the line will be crossed if the players perform like they did last night in the derby match. There will be no coming back.

 

I don't really want to give them an opportunity to do so in the derby. That would be a disgrace and would ruin everything Levein has done well at the club forever. 

 

 

[amadjambo]

What has happened to Hearts fans???

 

When did complaining about getting humiliated by teams like Livi 5-0 mean we were pant wetters???

 

Utterly bizarre.

 

Can only draw the conclusion that those not hurting badly are armchair fans, or at best those that never watch the team away from Tynie. 

[Inch Hearts]

2 hours ago, WeeChuck'sHeed said:

 

 

It put us out the cup, v a lower league team, at home. 

 

Much worse than a league defeat, one with ten men. 

League defeats happen, some worse than others. 3 points lost, mice on. 

 

Out the cup, ****ed til next year. V a lower league team, at home - embarrassing. 

 

No, in terms of performance it was one of the worst I’ve ever seen.  Live on tv too. Complete and utter embarrassment. 

[Bazzas right boot]

Just now, Inch Hearts said:

 

No, in terms of performance it was one of the worst I’ve ever seen.  Live on tv too. Complete and utter embarrassment. 

 

Not imo, but as above, best concentrate on the facts. 

[John mcCartney]

all you lot on here circling the wagons,read below

`one win in ten games`

dont matter how much you dress it up,there is no leadership coming from anyone at hmfc apart from steven naismith.
that in itself is shocking ,never mind results the sfa or a fat salary at our expense.

[Unknown user]

21 minutes ago, Inch Hearts said:

 

No, in terms of performance it was one of the worst I’ve ever seen.  Live on tv too. Complete and utter embarrassment. 

 

Unless you've only started watching recently, that can't be true. 

 

At 70 minutes we were in the game. Livi had played better but at that point no rational Hearts man would have called it one of the worst performances  they'd seen.

The following 20 minutes was terrible, really bad, but it wasn't representative of the previous 70, it just wasn't 

[Jodami]

Being rational, and I realise that's quite tricky after last night's disgrace, there is no line unless things go catastrophically wrong ie. relegation trouble. Sacking and bringing in a new manager is very expensive and we don't have the money. Last night was appalling but if we respond in the next 2 months it will be dismissed as an aberration. If we are disappointing in the second half of the season then there is a reasonable case to replace the manager for the new season. 

[Bazzas right boot]

1 hour ago, smiler said:

Do you not get tired of trotting out the same old shite? 

 

 

Good point, as usual from you. 

 

Do you not get tired of  contributing  he haw to any discussion? 

[Bazzas right boot]

1 hour ago, bringonthesevco said:

Not a single injured midfielder and  not an ounce of inspiration going forward....

 

 

Mmm, so injuries in defence and attack don't count. 

 

If discussing midfield, you might have noticed our collapse coincided with one of our midfielders being sent off. 

 

 

[El Diez]

56 minutes ago, amadjambo said:

 

 

Can only draw the conclusion that those not hurting badly are armchair fans, or at best those that never watch the team away from Tynie. 

 

Look no further than Chuck.

 

Never sets foot inside a stadium other than Tynecastle by his own admission but he’s quite happy to have a pop on here at those who travel all over the country, spending a lot of money watching us get leathered.

 

 

 

 

[graygo]

58 minutes ago, amadjambo said:

What has happened to Hearts fans???

 

When did complaining about getting humiliated by teams like Livi 5-0 mean we were pant wetters???

 

Utterly bizarre.

 

Can only draw the conclusion that those not hurting badly are armchair fans, or at best those that never watch the team away from Tynie. 

 

 

What has happened to Hearts fans???

 

When did supporting the club through thick and thin mean you are a happy clapper?

 

Utterly bizzare

 

Signed: A season ticket holder of many years who also has watched the team away from home.

[Bazzas right boot]

21 minutes ago, John mcCartney said:

all you lot on here circling the wagons,read below

`one win in ten games`

dont matter how much you dress it up,there is no leadership coming from anyone at hmfc apart from steven naismith.
that in itself is shocking ,never mind results the sfa or a fat salary at our expense.

 

 

Lack of leadership in the last ten games... 

 

What with 3 captains being sidelined for long periods... Who would have funk it, all the captains and leaders get injured and we lose some leadership and Influence on the pitch. 

 

Shocked, I am. 

 

Throw in Dunne as well being out. 

 

Folk aren't joining the dots too well with our injuries to our best and most influential players and the poor form that has followed. 

 

 

[El Diez]

22 minutes ago, Smithee said:

 

Unless you've only started watching recently, that can't be true. 

 

At 70 minutes we were in the game. Livi had played better but at that point no rational Hearts man would have called it one of the worst performances  they'd seen.

The following 20 minutes was terrible, really bad, but it wasn't representative of the previous 70, it just wasn't 

 

I think the first 70 minutes were what would be described as a typical away from home Hearts performance. 

 

That isn’t a compliment.

 

In fact I can understand why that would add weight to the fury when talking about the game as a whole.

Edited December 15, 2018 by El Diez

[amadjambo]

2 minutes ago, graygo said:

 

 

What has happened to Hearts fans???

 

When did supporting the club through thick and thin mean you are a happy clapper?

 

Utterly bizzare

 

Signed: A season ticket holder of many years who also has watched the team away from home.

I support the team through thick and thin. Been going home and away every week for 39 years now. That doesn’t stop me being honest in my assessment of the team, and I’ve seen plenty honking teams over those years. And never have Hearts fans been so accepting about getting horsed 5-0 by teams like Livi. Never.

[Bazzas right boot]

2 minutes ago, El Diez said:

 

Look no further than Chuck.

 

Never sets foot inside a stadium other than Tynecastle by his own admission but he’s quite happy to have a pop on here at those who travel all over the country, spending a lot of money watching us get leathered.

 

 

 

 

 

 

Aww, I'm a bigger Hearts fan than you because I go to the away games. 

 

The trumph card of I can't debate logically so I'll go down that road. 

 

Classy stuff, and ofc valadates your opinion as 100% correct. 

 

 

[graygo]

2 minutes ago, amadjambo said:

I support the team through thick and thin. Been going home and away every week for 39 years now. That doesn’t stop me being honest in my assessment of the team, and I’ve seen plenty honking teams over those years. And never have Hearts fans been so accepting about getting horsed 5-0 by teams like Livi. Never.

 

Can't disagree with that.

 

Edit: Sorry, misread your post. Which Hearts fans have accepted it?

 

I thought you meant the players..

Edited December 15, 2018 by graygo

[Smith&Weston]

Let’s not underestimate the role of a Manager at a club.  We don’t have the best squad but they should be doing better than they have done in last 10 games.  We had a great start but any team losing Souttar, Berra, Naismith & Uche all at same time would struggle.  However, to roll out that excuse every week against teams like St Mirren, St Johnstone and Livingston are simply not good enough.

 

Bobby needs to go.  He is not good enough.  Left back still seems to be an issue.  We should pick who the LB is going to be and stick with it.  The midfield is too industrious with no creativity or pace.  Need to find a mix and then pick on form rather than try and fit them all in.  Wide is a problem that needs fixed and obviously up top has been a problem.

 

how football can change in 2 months.

 

.

 

 

[El Diez]

3 minutes ago, WeeChuck'sHeed said:

 

 

Aww, I'm a bigger Hearts fan than you because I go to the away games. 

 

The trumph card of I can't debate logically so I'll go down that road. 

 

Classy stuff, and ofc valadates your opinion as 100% correct. 

 

 

 

No but I can understand that those that were there last night, giving up their time and hard earned in the process are more likely to be upset than the likes of you who appear happy to gibber shite about ‘backing the team’ on a message board.

 

 

[amadjambo]

A really tough game next week, but at a venue that we tend to do well at, even when we are struggling. Need a performance quickly, especially with a couple of right battles against Hamilton and Hibs to come. Big big 3 games for our season, for the players, and for Levein.

[Bazzas right boot]

6 minutes ago, El Diez said:

 

No but I can understand that those that were there last night, giving up their time and hard earned in the process are more likely to be upset than the likes of you who appear happy to gibber shite about ‘backing the team’ on a message board.

 

 

 

 

Upset........  **** me, and I get called a snowflake. 

 

Aye, well folk can be upset, I'll bring balance and a sound mind  to the table. 

 

Hopefully, the players are "upset" as well and we get a response. 

 

CL looked and sounded upset as well, if that helps folk feel any better. 

 

 

[jb66]

I will judge him on a full strength squad

[El Diez]

Just now, WeeChuck'sHeed said:

 

 

Aye, well folk can be upset, I'll bring balance and a sound mind  to the table. 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

If a ‘sound mind’ is wanting Hibs to win the cup, I’ll happily book my appointment at the docs every day of the week.